News Article

Nintendo President Satoru Iwata "Has Earned The Right To Fail", Says David Jaffe

Posted by Damien McFerran

Nintendo's "ups and downs" are what make the company great

Yesterday, Nintendo revealed that it was slashing its hardware projections for this financial year and that it expects to make a loss — not the kind of news that under-fire president Satoru Iwata will have wanted to impart to investors and shareholders, we're sure.

Iwata himself has insisted that he won't be stepping down and that the quick fix being touted by many industry experts isn't viable. His beleaguered position has been supported somewhat from an unlikely source — famed developer David Jaffe, who, not so long ago, made public his belief that Disney should buy Nintendo in the same way it snapped up Star Wars studio Lucasfilm.

Speaking on Twitter, Jaffe said:

Calling for Iwata to step down [misses] sight of what makes Nintendo great. You'd never get the Wii-type successes if you don't allow a guy like Iwata to fail hard as well.

...that failure can be a sign that a person has lost 'it' and needs to go OR a sign that a person is still very much relevant and has tons of great work left in them but is taking the same sorts of chances that — in the past — have lead to great successes but are now — temporarily — leading to some failures. You MUST fail if you want to grow and have new successes.

My point is, you WANT a person who fails for these latter reasons and you want to lose one who fails for the initial reasons. I feel Iwata is the [latter] and he's certainly earned the right to fail more than he has to this point. And that's from a gamer AND stockholder perspective. If you [want] make money, back the folks who fail properly. Failure isn't just an option, it's desired if the goal is big success. And investors who don't value failure are idiots.

Many thought Wii 1 was a bad move at first as well. Point is, so what it's a bad move? Investors need to be thinking BIG PICTURE and LONG GAME with a company like Nintendo...companies that I admire are the ones that don't only play for the short term win. you can look at the up and down history of the company and see that if you want to invest in a company like Nintendo, those ups and downs are part of what makes them great.

Imagine throwing out ALL of that wonderful knowledge and understanding and HARD lessons learned by cleaning house at Sony [because] the PS3 did not perform as well as investors would have liked. Yes, sometimes the [solution] is to clean house, sometimes it's to clean a bit of the house, but damn, I think people are losing sight of the value of failure.

Jaffe certainly has a point — you can't win all of the time, and just because Iwata and Nintendo's strategy isn't working now doesn't mean that they can't come up with something revolutionary again in the near future — and the incredible successes of the DS, Wii and 3DS prove that the current management team can post big results when it needs to.

Are you surprised to hear such words of support from Jaffe, or do you think he's missing the point? Share your feelings with a comment.


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User Comments (159)



Artwark said:

Though the part where Disney should buy Nintendo is just plain dumb because its obvious who's richer and who isn't between the two and its also obvious who is better between the two, He has a valid point here.

And that's what I've been saying for a looooooooooonnnnnnnnnngggggggggggg time. Iwata isn't as bad as people claim him to be seeing that he was responsible for the DS, Wii and 3DS sales. Even then Iwata's role isn't much when in terms of role although I could be wrong there.



DualWielding said:

Iwata needs to go. and people should stop citing the Wii's success to defend Iwata. The Wii was a fluke, that's one if Iwata's main problem he confuses the dumb luck that helped the Wii with a sound business strategy



mikeymaster2001 said:

I think this whole financial kerfuffle (great word, right) is just a bump on the road. As NL and other sites have pointed out, Nintendo is sitting on a mountain of cash. They can afford this. It's not the end of Nintendo at all. Honestly I think that Iwata is great. How many other companies in the world have a CEO that so affable and fun. Just look at that Nintendo Direct video with Luigi's Mansion 2 and Miyamoto, or at the various Iwata asks. This guy seems to have a great rapport with the developers in his company. (Yes, this makes me sound like a total armchair analyst, but that's my impression of the guy) I think these various calls of getting him fired are ridiculous. A bump in the road shouldn't automatically be getting us thinking of firing people. It is how it is, I really don't see the need to make Iwata a scapegoat.



Taggsta said:

I own both N machines, I've been a console gamer from the start so I'm a regular gaming customer. There are some gaps that N need to fix with WiiU ....they still need a game that sells the Gamepad to the masses like Wii Sports if they want success like the Wii and 10 mill sales in a financial year.
They need cheaper eShop VC and retail games, I won't push (or find it hard to push) the Purchase button on there eShop in Aus...I'm sure many more are the same.
I don't think some of the general public know what the console has to offer with the Gamepad still. Little integration between 3DS and WiiU, 3DS doesn't have SNES/SFC OR N64 games in VC.
Games released to the VC are done in a dumb way...why release a series of a game over several weeks e.g Megaman, if someone doesn't like Megaman they go several weeks without any interest in the eShop.
On a positive note the 3DS is a cracking!



BakaKnight said:

I disagree with his opinion about disney buying Nintendo as much as this time I have to totally agree with him XP
Nintendo till now survived in the gaming market by taking risks, a way that unavoidably is always a bet between failing or revolutionize the industry. Iwata was in charge of the risks Nintendo took in the last 10-something years and he proved that he knew more than once where to risk. Thinking to ask him to step back cause of a "stormy" period is really a rushed thought investors should know to avoid.



SeVok said:

If failure is not an option, companies will take less and less risks in already an industry that is known today for playing safe and endless iterations of what works. Nintendo's ideas and policies are not always wonderful, but they do take risks and really innovate (motions controls on the Wii, auto-stereoscopy and the concept of streetpass on the 3DS, touch and dual screen on the DS, Gamepad and streaming on the WiiU, etc).



RaymanFan2 said:

I agree. Nintendo has 'earned the right to fail' once or twice.
Sure, it sucks, but the great experiences outweigh the bad ten to one. Also as long as we keep getting stuff like SM3DW, it doesn't matter if they're in the s*** or not.



MAB said:

It's good to have a different system that isn't just a straight carbon copy spec & tech wise like the competition... I don't see a reason to own the PSBOX41 for at least another couple of years



Peach64 said:

I agree with his point that you need to learn from your mistakes to be a successful business. Sony royally screwed up the PS3 but have now gone back and fixed every single issue with it for the PS4 and are deservingly getting praise for it.

I think people have concerns over Iwata because he hasn't shown any sign of learning from mistakes. The comments he comes out with (prior to yesterday) continue to sound like he thinks everything will turn out fine if they continue doing what they are doing now. They certainly didn't seem to learn from the 3DS. People got confused by that. The name, adding a number/letter onto DS made a lot of people think it was another iteration, like the DSi or DSi XL, rather than a new machine. It had no good launch games. It was too expensive. It flopped and they promised they'd learn from it, but then did the same things again. Confusing name, no games and too expensive. Why give yourself such a mountain to climb right at the start?



edhe said:

If it kicks Nintendo into gear, it can only be a good thing.

No one [who's a real fan of Nintendo] wants them to start putting their games on rival systems, but we're crying out for must have games. If only Nintendo had something like Smash Bros. at launch (and bless Sakurai's socks for working so hard on that game - to be fair, he couldn't get it out of the gates any sooner), the Wii U would be in a better place than it is now.

Mario's nice (I'm not a fan myself), and so's Pikmin, but we need another big Nintendo franchise release, and I'm not talking about Wii Fit or Wii Sports. Mario Kart is likely to do as well as Super Mario 3D World, as is Donkey Kong, so we need a Zelda, Metroid, F-Zero or Starfox game to really bring in the sales.

But of course, those games are far, far off.

A greater focus on Virtual Console across both platforms would be nice too.



Paperluigi said:

I'd like Nintendo to build their digital catalogue on WiiU and 3DS so it has as many of their titles as possible from all past consoles. Link it up to an account based system like everyone has said in the past and make virtual console games bought on 3DS play on WiiU and vice versa. Then the next console Nintendo release should carry the same eshop content so they dont have to start from scratch. You would load up your new console or handheld 5 years from now and 'boom'! there would the entire Nintendo games catalogue staring at you. WiiU is sufferring because the digital content isnt there. Having said that I love my WiiU.



Extreeeme said:

If Disney buys Nintendo... can you guys imagine all the silly movies starring Mario that would follow?



Azooooz said:

They say "Failure is the mother of success". You won't experience the true feeling of success if you don't fail once.

The only thing I would disagree with David Jaffe is Disney buying Nintendo.



AlexSora89 said:

I think I can imagine Miyamoto-directed Disney games, which is a lot better as a mental image. Too bad it would lead to such games getting top priority over Nintendo's IPs, so... no. Just no.



DreamOn said:

People are always going to compare implements and strategies between nintendo and the rest of the tech world because that's how the tech world thrives to many and especially socially. some of those people will always be calling for drastic action no matter what because that's how the technology sector works in some ways, things can change and shift rapidly and so should leadership of those companies at times, many feel. Iwata seems to go against the grain in certain ways in that respect. He says he's he's working to keep Nintendo alive in 20 years. For some people that's too far in the future when you're talking about selling tech toys today.



Nestalgic said:

The problem is that sites like this one are all in the echo chamber where everything looks like it's going well. Nobody wants to admit it, but tablets and phones are the future of gaming. This generation has moved on from traditional consoles. It's not that the WiiU is a bad product — it's that the traditional way of marketing consoles just doesn't work any more. Look at the PS4 and XBox One. Those aren't really doing any better. So you can't blame Nintendo, you need to blame the entire industry for not reading the tea leaves. Square Enix has moved on and embraced the new platforms. I bet we see Mario on there soon enough.



Clayfrd said:

Wow, I bet Disney owning Nintendo would work about as well as them owning LucasArts.



ECMIM said:

@ferthepoet If the Wii was a fluke, then how do you explain the DS which sold 50% more units than the "fluke"? How about the 3DS? I wager you have no reasonable answer for this because your opinion isn't based on reason--it's based on the lunatic, over-emotional, notion that you should hit a homerun every at-bat or score a touchdown every time you get the ball.

(By your 'logic' Sony should have folded up shop already since they've been teetering on implosion for a decade--and that's corp-wide, not merely the PlayStation brand. And MS? The XBOX biz is such a terrible unit--profit-wise--that potential candidates for prez of the co. are open to getting rid of it.)



AdanVC said:

I'm actually looking forward to know the new Nintendo strategy by the end of January. It's supposed to benefit everyone in order to improve the Wii U sales, it's not like they are going to discuntinue the console or something that would be suicidal, but rather a revision of the Wii U like it was for the 3DS and then it's revision, the 3DS XL.



jrob23 said:

I get what the author is saying but Iwata has proven to me that he is ill prepared to lead Nintendo into the next era of gaming. Nintendo wasn't ready for HD, they weren't ready for online gaming, they failed to learn from the poor 3DS launch, they still haven't figured out how to monetize their vast catalog of games (think a Nintendo version of PS Plus or Xbox Live), they keep pushing local coop play over what the west multiplayer. The list is long. Iwata lucked out with the Wii. It became a fad and sold like gangbusters. He is pretty solid with handhelds but even there the 2DS is a bust. The stock price over the last three years has dropped from $38 to $15. C'mon people, that is as bad as it can get. Stop making excuses for him. Many companies have had moments of brilliance and then they went bankrupt. Sega being one of them. They need new leadership period



edhe said:

"'s not like they are going to discuntinue the console or something that would be suicidal..."

That's not what Michael Pachter and his crystal ball thinks.. Or maybe he does think it's suicidal - he is an analyst that short term stockholders look to for advice, after all.

Worryingly (and understandingly), Nintendo stock plummeted after the announcement that Nintendo have re-assessed their sales projections.

Untitled [Gawker]



SchamMan89 said:

Smart words from Jaffe. You can't function afraid of failure... or else you insist it'll happen.

We need out of the box thinkers like Iwata in positions of power to see continued change in the video game industry.



ScorpionMG said:

I have to say, Iwata resigning is a big mistake, He should stay where he is and do his job, there will always be up and downs and it will always come and go, Now we just need to wait, just like the 3DS & Wii



Fink-Nottle said:

The success of Wii was not luck, but they did not foresee smartphone gaming.

Honestly who did? It was a stupid fad, and it reached its momentum long time ago.

The failure of the Wii U is mostly due to bad timing, and to some extent its release titles.

The Nintendo strategy is to be thoughtful, ambitious & diligent. How is that not a good strategy in any business, in good times or bad?

You can translate that as being slow, ignorant & responsible, but in times like these for the future sake of Nintendo, is it better to be rash, selling out at lowest price & giving away all responsibilites to the next schmo?



Goginho said:

sigh** People love their drama. It's entertaining, right? I say just chill the flip out. Nintendo has this covered. They most likely have tons of backup plans up their sleeves. They know what their company stands for, and that it has a long tradition. They're not about to disgrace their integrity and let that all go, or even sell themsleves, I'm sure.

As for Iwata failing? umm-yea...sure. I guess the dude has a bit of a point here. I mean, Michael Jordan had to fail in order to make it, right?



electrolite77 said:

He has a good point. Let's hope the next machine is revolutionary because jumping on board the 3D bandwagon isn't, and neither is attempting to tack a second screen onto a home console especially when even Nintendo don't seem to know how to use it (despite having released dual screen consoles before).

It'd be good to see some improvement in the areas where the responsibility for failure is his i.e. every machine having a software drought despite him promising it won't, poor online infrastructure, long-term fans neglected by the absence of several franchises and dismal VC support.

But he's earned the right to try again. He's been here before in the Gamecube's later years so he knows how to come back strong. He has the good sense to resist the short-term fixes of going third-party or onto mobiles. He has three big successes under his belt. It's right that questions are being asked but he deserves to try and answer them.



Zombie_Barioth said:

I think that perhaps it was already too late to apply what they learned from the 3DS's launch to the Wii U. It was released about a year later, they wouldn't have had time to get more games ready by launch.

The price of the console wasn't too bad compared to past consoles, but being more than the Wii was at launch and having very little worth buying a $300-$350 console for really hurt it. The current consoles being cheaper, more wide-spread, and relatively close in power with 6-7 years worth of games out didn't exactly help either.

The name could have worked if it didn't look almost identical to the Wii. Nintendo wanted to make the slimmest, sleekest console they can so they stuck with the design, and picked a bad time to try and create a brand name for their consoles.



Goginho said:

@steamtrain I agree. It's tough times economy-wise and some unexpected competition arose, which I'm sure myself will end up being a fad more than anything. I mean, everything new that just comes out, people have to try it, right? Smartphone gaming came out, people have tried it (or are still in the process of) and are soon to realize ..meh, like most other things that come and go. But Nintendo have stuck with the media entertainment business long enough for people to easily revert back to them anytime they want, because they know Nintendo from before, they know what they're all about, so it could be as soon as the fad of phone gaming dies out for that instance (or is put in the background), and as soon as the economical situation gets better as well. Because let's face it, nobody expected cell phone technology to make that high of a jump so quick, and now that consumers got accustomed to it, it won't be something that sticks out and be put in the foreground anymore, in the long run. Whereas Nintendo have a cult following. Look at all the stuff there is on YouTube alone that people share. The best I can think of for phones is Angry Birds, that made a huge breakthrough.
Of course, something new and interesting may come out that will make a major, quick breakthrough from times to time. However, for Nintendo, this is an endurance race, not a sprint, and they always get back on their feet.

That being said, I do agree on Nintendo making a few minor mistakes here and there, like a rushed launch with not many bomb titles, and a slow marketing campaign, but many other (uncontrollable) factors play a major role in the Wii U having all this trouble, such as poor economy and unusual competition/newcomers...etc..
So it's just something they have to face, as well as other companies too, I can imagine. A turn-around is not unlikely at all, and is bound to happen in one form or another. It's just a matter of, "when?".



sadsack777 said:

@Goginho I like what u say its true to the point ..but if u look at the big picture and look at sony and xbox and Nintendo look at all the mistakes and tell me witch one come on top please



JtotheY said:

@MAB Me neither, wouldn't buy them until they really can't be ignored anymore. It's just a shame that all others don't think like that. They buy the PS4 like crazy, even without games. They buy the XBone like crazy, even when Microsoft tried to screw them over. It just isn't fair..



larry_koopa said:

People need to stop worrying about all of this. Are you happy with Mario 3D World and are you looking forward to Mario Kart and Smash Bros.? Then stop complaining and trying to find solutions and just enjoy the great games that Nintendo is giving you.



MrGawain said:

I totally AGREE with him. however I QUESTION his use of CAPITALISING certain WORDS.



Mellor2000 said:

Oh get over it already. Nintendo takes risks, sometimes they pay off sometimes they don't. Without risk takers we wouldn't get any innovative products would we. All I care about is I bought a cool system with some fantastic games. Even if they discontinued the wii u tomorrow I've still got my monies worth.



Goginho said:

@sadsack777 hmm..tbh, I don't really follow Sony and XB, so I don't really know what mistakes (or non-mistakes) they made. Personally, I couldn't care less which one would "come on top", I just want Nintendo to continue making the games I've gotten to know and love, and if that means that they come on top in order to do so, then I can only hope they do come on top.
It's hard to say, though, for the Wii U at the moment. Like I always say, it's tough times that Nintendo can't do much about. They may have directly made some minor hic-ups here and there, but indirectly is mainly why they're in the situation they're at, and it's something inevitable, something they couldn't have done anything about imo..
So who comes on top from the main gaming consoles? I'm gonna say Nintendo won't come out on top with the Wii U this time around, but like I said, all I want is that it has a healthy lifespan, meaning that plenty of games I want to play get released and that they put in that Nintendo quality and detail to attention they always do, everything else is up to the course of media progression and the nature of consumerism. For me personally, it's looking good, as a lot of games are on their way that I cannot wait to play, so I'm excited for that. Some people find they 'belong' to a certain company, and forget about the joys of the product themselves, thus getting lost in the rush of the race to the top and see themselves primarily finding joy when their console or w/e ends up selling more than the others, but for me, I don't pay attention to those numbers and never really have. Playing the actual games is what brought joy to me, not being able to gloat to others (even cowardly over the internet) about how 'my' console sold more than 'your' console. I find that people have a wrong way of thinking, in this regard. Maybe my paradigm is wrong? I dunno, maybe I should care less for playing the games and care more about the numbers and statistics :/

All in all, to answer your quiestion the Wii U probably won't come out on top, is what I'm predicting at the moment. I'm not expecting it to, and that being said, I don't really care if it does or doesn't ..I just want mah gamez son



Cipher said:

As I said yesterday, I really feel as though "if you wanna make money, back the folks who fail properly" is the best quote to come out of yesterday.

Iwata and everyone else at Nintendo is well aware things aren't right - that's why the forecast was changed so drastically. However, I truly dread a Nintendo with no Iwata, because unless someone like Miyamoto, Takeda, or Shibata takes over - which will probably never happen - Nintendo will never have another President who cares so much about the fans and their input. If not for Iwata, we wouldn't have Nintendo Direct or Iwata Asks, both of which have been vital additions to Nintendo's representation in recent times.



PrincessEevee9 said:

@Nestalgic Yeah no. In the market where tablet and mobile gaming as hit the scene the 3DS dominates all areas while they barely manage to break even. Comparing mobile to console gaming will get you nowhere as they function and serve two different purposes.



sadsack777 said:

like all of u said its a shame things are going like there are but Nintendo will still be here when iam gone to pass there games to the next gen in years to come and my point is its not the hardwear its all about the games



divinelite said:

As long as 3ds is keep strong I'm happy
Why would I buy wii u for 500$ in my local store anyway... We Asian has no Nintendo officials so don't blame us for slug sales... Even you won't buy wii u for 500$ right?

Oh and ps4 here is 600$



bmprsvz777 said:

I think David Jaffe is absolutely right. Would we as customers have something new and innovative if Nintendo just play it safe and won't take any risk? Would we like Nintendo console being just powerful copy of PS, PC or tablet without motion control, 3D or second screen? I don't think so. For me both Wii U and 3DS are cool products just because they offer different experience. I don't care that Nintendo hardware is not cutting edge science, it's still fun to play, I already have 30 nice games for WiiU and 40 for 3DS, plus some from eshop. For haters: I never said PS4 or XBOX ONE are bad products, just different.



element187 said:

@ferthepoet Iwata took on the risk of going with motion control gaming..... Leading up to the release of the Wii every news outlet and dudebro in country was bashing it nonstop.... Instead of tucking tail and backing away they went with what they believed was the next big thing. There were no guarantees, "core" gamers were a adamant on how terrible it would be. That gamble paid off.

The DS, was a run away success, once again gamers slammed the system before release. Two screen gaming was another gamble that paid off. 3DS went from dead to amazing in two short years.

So Iwata should resign because one home console hasn't found its balance between price and number of exclusives yet? You know how silly that sounds? The company literally printed money for a decade, they have more than enough cash to keep playing the home console game.

If you want to worry about a companies future, worry about Sony, they are in the worst shape of the three. Then you have Microsoft pondering out loud about spinning off the console business. There will be big moves in the console space this gen, but Nintendo is the only company you can say for certain will be here next gen no matter what, both $ony and Micro$oft may not.



element187 said:

Since Sony is even in worse shape, should Kaz resign? I think so, they are at their wits end selling buildings to even tread water.

Let's start cat calling for Kaz to go.



element187 said:

@bmprsvz777 what's funny is both PS4 and xBone aren't cutting edge either. Both are budget gaming systems with terrible CPU's, yet dudebro gamers are running around acting like its better than a medium specced PC

"OMG 8gb gDDR pwns" yup mated to a mobile Radeon 7850(if that) means the memory is being held back by bottle necked GPU and tablet CPU.



element187 said:

@RaymanFan2 I agree with your point 100%.... But somewhere down the line gamers turned the gaming hobby into a sales blood sport. They don't even play the games anymore, they sit on websites play console wars instead of experiencing the games themselves.

It's much easier to write a comment on an article about SMW3DW, sniping at Nintendo, and instead of finding out why its recieving so much praise. It's amazing the amount of negative comments from the dudebros on Eurogamer because the website chose SM3DW as its GOTY over GTA or TLOU.

Gamers rather rate a company on sales instead of its games. Strange times. In the 80's gamers didn't care about the sales, we even treated NeoGeo and TG16 as equals to Nintendo and Sega, because the games were still fun, and the graphics blew the NES out of the water nobody cared that the sales were abysmal



DilMan33 said:

I wonder which of the investors are more powerful: Microsoft investors calling them to spin off the Xbox division (which would mean all the big budget clout the Xbox brand has will be over - no more big losses of expensive hardware and an cut-down 1st party line up) or Nintendo's so called investors calling for software to be published outside an Nintendo system??



DualWielding said:


The DS and the 3DS are not flukes...... the DS had a gimmick and his gimmick caught on just like the Wii, but unlike the Wii the DS was not only a gimmick, it was also a solid gaming machine with solid third party support and a more powerful GBA..... the 3DS is doing well despite its 3D gimmick not catching on because it is still a solid gaming machine with solid third party support and basically a better DS.....

Now what was the problem that Iwata got into the mentality of "gimmick sale consoles" the 3DS was failing in the beginning because it was launched with no games and Iwata was expecting it to sale only on the 3D gimmick.. fortunately for the 3DS and us who love it the games eventually came and things were turned around.....

and Iwata, not learning from his mistakes did the same thing with the Wii U, launched it with no games thinking the gamepad gimmick was gonna sell the console on its own...... It thought all it needed it was Nintendo land.... He failed to identify that what happened with the Wii and Wii sports was a one time lighting in a bottle kinda thing and really thought a gimmick and a tech demo was all he needed to sell a console.... and he has been proven wrong



Jaz007 said:

@Nestalgic What do you mean PS4 and Xbox One aren't doing better? Have you even looked at the news regarding them? PS4 sold 4.2 million as of Dec. 28th and Xbone has sold 3 million. They are indeed showing signs of doing better than Wii U. It's likely that PS4 will outsell the Wii U in a much shorter time than a year too. It does have to do with Nintendo and Wii U. Tablet aren't taking over and the premium $60 procing model wouldn't work on tablets. It's simply not a viable market for triple A games.



Spoony_Tech said:

@Peach64 I like your comments and sometimes i seek out your comments. However the Wii U launch line up was one of if not the biggest in gaming history! The problem was it was too many ports and half hearted at a few of them! Sure many gamers had already experienced some of these games on other consoles but for me i didn't as well as i'm sure many other gamers had not. I for one didn't get a Wii U till a year later but i still wanted about 10-11 launch titles.

The problem was more with Nintendo admitting it takes much longer then they thought to produce hd games. If Pikmon and Rayman would've been launch games like we all thought they might just think how even more bleak the next 9 months would've been. Of course Nintendo also said they were holding back some games from 1st parties at launch to let some 3rd parties shine but we know that to be faults!



Fill-N said:

i agree. i need nintendo to keep taking risks. failure is something they should already count as a possibile outcome, so iwata being cut wouldnt make sense, specially after DS, 3DS and wii.

i still think theres got to be an answer in the success of the handhelds to these home consoles failures. they rule one side of the market. there are more then 30 million nintendo consumers out there on the portable market. wiiu and 3ds would make an incredible ecosystem. they could help each other to sell.



TruenoGT said:

Preach it man. I totally agree with this guy on this point. Some people just want the Nintendo version of the XB1 and PS4, but I say what's the point. Get one of those if you want it so bad. I for one want to see the crazy stuff Nintendo brings to the table, including the Wii U, one of the coolest consoles of all time.



MoonKnight7 said:

Given all the bad press Nintendo has been getting recently, this is surprisingly a very mature outlook.



Platypus101 said:

@edhe you site an YTD difference of only 8.5%?! ROFLMAO! that's nothing... I've worked for companies that consistently lost 15-30% on YTD, and not once, did they EVER try and remove top seat positions. In fact, they claimed it was standard business practice (no matter where I worked), for these types of swings in the market. Seriously, people should stop posting numbers if they don't know what they really translate to. This is not panic time at nintendo, it's stock buy back time at nintendo.



JaxonH said:

Finally, a bit of common sense. And some perspective for people to chew on.



Platypus101 said:

@element187 preach on brother! I agree 100%! When did game sales determine whether a game was good? It may have something to do with this new "monkey see, monkey do" generation.... As in "mommy, mommy! Give me what all the other kids have so I won't feel like a total loser!" Another example of this is the "doom and gloom" concerning nintendo. As you stated, stop whinin' and get back to playin'! (I know, I paraphrased)



JaxonH said:


Um, no. Your understanding of the situation is rather lacking.

I'm sorry, but Iwata is not God. Yes, he's the CEO but there are many decision makers and top brass at Nintendo. He does not solely dictate "this system will have gimmick, forget games. We sell based on gimmick". That's a ridiculous notion and contrary to how business works.

First of all, you can call it what you will, but most Nintendo hardware has one major INNOVATION, not gimmick. A gimmick is something of no value, tacked on for the sake of making a product a little bit more appealing. Nintendo hardware innovations are not, by any means, not even CLOSE to, being gimmicks. They are well thought out creations the entire ecosystem is built around. 3D wasn't just to make the handheld seem cool, it was to benefit certain games that needed depth judgement to truly shine. The second screen wasn't a gimmick on the DS, it was an evolution, which has since become the mainstay of ALL Nintendo consoles, up to and including the Wii U. Motion was meant to enhance the experience, and allow for new types of gameplay ideas. These are not gimmicks. Gimmicks is including an AR card if you call in the next 20 minutes. There's a HUGE difference.

Nintendo, and certainly not Iwata, did not want to, or try to, sell a console based on anything other than an investment for gaming. You're over-analysing the heck out this whole situation. ALL consoles have a drought after launch. That doesn't mean they "thought they could sell it based on gimmick alone". It just means it's a new system, and it takes time for the games to come, JUST LIKE the other consoles that have squat for games. JUST LIKE the PS4 that's been sitting on my floor for over 2 months and not played more than once.

Nobody WANTED a lack of games. Unfortunately, it takes time to build a library.



Stu13 said:

Just gotta get the soccer mom demographic back that they snagged with Wii Fit. Bring on Farmville U and watch those stock prices soar.



AugustusOxy said:

We live in a pretty odd world if selling 2 million of a console, at over 200 dollars a pop is considered a 'failure'.



Doma said:

Agreed with @jrob23. This outlook is just plain stupid.
Of course lessons can be learned from failure, but this should be done without Iwata at the helm and before the situation gets to a point where there's no coming back from it. He's already proven himself as incapable.



JaxonH said:


Right. So many people on this very sight that judge Nintendo because of sales. Whatever. I'm getting calloused against all of this senseless hate. Sony and MS can epic fail all day long, and it's just another day. No problem. The Vita can sit at 7 million sales in 2 years, but God forbid the Wii U sit at 5.3 million in one year. Sony can post losses year after year after year, but the minute Nintendo mentions any kind of loss, all hell breaks loose. Nobody calls for Jack Tretton to resign. But Iwata, oh, he's gotta GO, right? Pfft...



JaxonH said:


So, let's see. Since Iwata has taken the helm during the GC era, he personally oversaw the GBA, selling over 80 million units, a huge success.

He then went on to turn Nintendo around from the brink of disaster in home console sales, taking the company from 23 million to over 100 million with the Wii. He also personally oversaw the Nintendo DS, which is one of the highest selling gaming devices of all time, at over 150 million units. Only system to go toe to toe with the PS2.

But that's not all, oh no. It gets even better. Iwata THEN went on to personally oversee the turnaround of the 3DS, which was, at the time, the laughing stock of the gaming community (sound familiar?). Since, 3DS has gone on to become the fastest selling console to 30 million units, the number one selling gaming device in the world, and consistently outsells the PS4, Xbox One, and Vita.... COMBINED.

Yep, that's all Iwata right there.

So you're telling me, that after proven success after proven success after proven success after proven success, all it takes is one year of floundering Wii U sales to throw in the towel and call for his resignation? Really?



BossBattles said:

I was rooting for the GameCube when everyone was hating it. Now hipsters look back and give it credit.
Same with PS3...early on, trendy gamers didn't want to hear about it...I kept saying how it was a great system and the ignorant ones never jumped on board, or took 5 years to figure it out.

Wii U. Been saying its a great console all along with a slew of classic games already...but today's gamer is clueless and only follows what is "cool", without knowing why.

Why is ps4 suddenly accepted? No real reason. It just an updated ps3....but they sold it well. That's all this is...perception of Nintendo is screwed up because of constant media attacks for many years now.



Yorumi said:

@Platypus101 it really is sad when you read gaming forums. It seems like everyone thinks if it's not the best selling game of all time it sucks. There's just worship of the "majority" and a pretty hard wired herd mentality among a lot of gamers. So often I've seen suggestions shot down not because they're flawed in anyway but by just saying "it won't have mass appeal." I don't get why so many gamers want every company and every game to be exact carbon copies of each other.



AJ_Lethal said:

Jaffe is right. Iwata needed to taste defeat so he can grow. He's a human (as everyone else), he made mistakes, and so far he's identifying what going on around him.

Of course I won't expect overnight changes, but he might be quicker next time.



LztheQuack said:

Once again, the one and done (failure) mentality sweeps the world. I don't want to live on this planet anymore



Gerbwmu said:

What we are headed for is $149 games and $600 systems......or your gaming will be limited to smart phone / tablet trash with micro transactions and advertisements covering half the screen. It's the culture of the "Right Now" generation. We expect everything to be fixed right away (even if there is no real problem) and be exactly how we want it....and it needs to happen NOW. It's these type of day trading investors who are demanding that Nintendo change.....not for the benefit of Nintendo and it's employees in the long term.....but for the benefit of their pocketbooks in the short term.

I will not sit here and claim Iwata is a great CEO or that Nintendo wouldn't be better off with another CEO....because I don't know....but I do know that Nintendo becoming a 3rd party would destroy the company and the industry. Maybe Wii U fails........every good company has some failure. Lets see what happens over the course of 2014 first though cause as of now the only next gen console doing ok is PS4.....Xbox1 has as sad of numbers as Wii U thus far....of course its all too early to know for sure



jhohaness said:

@ferthepoet yes...totally with you on that one...but the worst part about calling the Wii a success is that though it sold huge real gamers were not the ones buying it...the big problem with the Wii U is that it was clearly designed with the casual crowd in mind and not much care for the core gamers, obviously the casual market is not into home consoles as the core gamers are so they are not buying the Wii U as Nintendo wanted,they are doing well playing on smartphones and stuff...Nintendo should just remarket the Wii U just for the core gamers,improve its online structure,get rid of all the family and kid friendly bullpoopoodoodiecacapoopledoople and release core game after core game,create new IPs with the Mature audience in mind,fill the screen with blood and maybe that way all those PS4 and XBOX ONE fans might consider the Wii U a console worth owning...
Please watch the profanity — TBD



JaxonH said:


A very insightful comment, and perhaps the best argument against him I've heard yet. However, many of the points jrob23 brings up are not slights against Iwata, but rather the culture of Nintendo,

Now, there ARE some issues that deserve criticism, don't get me wrong. He's right- Nintendo WASN'T ready for HD and online. However, the reason they weren't ready for HD was because they had never developed in HD before. That's just a learning curve that comes with experience. They seem to be doing ok now.

And as for online, I'm sorry but those accusations fall a bit short. Wii U has a pretty solid online experience. The ONLY thing that could be leveled against Nintendo for online is lack of a party chat feature, which will most likely come in time. BUT, their online is free so it's give and take. You have to understand that while yes, Nintendo is a bit slower coming around to some of the features seen on rival consoles, they're also ahead of the curve in other areas, such as providing a range of input devices (motion, dual screens, or traditional) for the gamer, online social integration (Miiverse), backwards compatibility, Streetpass, etc...

Nintendo shouldn't want to head in the direction of Sony/MS, because Nintendo doesn't cater to THAT audience. The audience that only cares about tech, specs, and graphics, rather than gameplay, innovation and fun.



umegames said:

@MAB exactly. alot of people keep saying nintendo needs to go 3rd party, but really they just want nintendo to be the ''all in one'' gaming monster, trumping sony and microsoft, but thats not nintendos style, and im alright with that.



Stu13 said:

The talk of getting Sony and MS fanboys on board is pure fantasy. They've dug their trenches and are happy in them (I use the term 'happy' very loosely). The market needed is the same one that bought the Wii. Putting out a mediocre PC in a console box and 'filling the screen with blood' is absolutely not the answer.



Gerbwmu said:

@jhohaness - gamers make up a small percentage of sales.....all of the consoles try for the mass market. PS2 & PS3 sold by the truck load because of the DVD player and Blu-ray which was as cheap as buying the stand alone players. And how many XBox 360's sold for guitar hero, rock band, and Just Dance.....Gamers will buy a Wii U as soon as there is a reason....maybe "X", maybe Bayonetta 2, Maybe smash or Zelda or all 4.....but the money is made by the casual.....which is why XBoxOne sales have stalled and PS4 with it's upcoming Japan release is the only console with legs thus far.....could be a slow generation for sales accross the board



JaxonH said:


Right. Nintendo doesn't need to do anything except carry on as usual. Wii U may not sell half as well as PS4/X1, but so what. SRPG's don't sell half as well as shooters. Doesn't mean they're any less worthy. Just means the audience is more niche.

Wii U's a great console. I don't give a **** how many units it's selling. People want Nintendo to be like Sony/MS? Forget all that. The day Nintendo starts catering to THAT audience is the day I stop gaming Nintendo.



Yorumi said:

@jhohaness so if I don't play the M rated, actually immature games I'm not a "real gamer"?

@Gerbwmu #76, in line with your point about failure happening, it's worth mentioning that nintendo has had a failed system before. The wiiU isn't going to be this bad but the virtual boy was an incredible failure. That didn't end nintendo's portable line. They learned from it and came back stronger than ever.

I think with the short term outlook so many people have that's the perspective that's lost.



Captain_Toad said:

You took the words outta my mouth. Why have success if it means following the tired-and-true trends and expecting a parade to follow you mins later?



TheRealThanos said:

@JaxonH Well, it seems to me you're doing just fine answering all the negativity and dumb comments with your own, well rounded arguments. Saves me a lot of trouble and sometimes it is just too tiresome to be polite against all the, well let's for politeness' sake just call them 'well informed' people that seem to think that Nintendo must go mobile, Nintendo must go out of the console business, Nintendo must fire Iwata and so on. And don't even get me started on the highly irritating 'gimmick' argument. That REALLY needs to be buried, and soon too.
Negativity truly is energy draining and these people also fail to see that they are looking at it with the wrong point of view, but since most of it is highly opinionated, they will more then likely stick to their flawed logic. And I agree with the original article and I am surprised that it came from David Jaffe. I guess he initially lost all credibility with his 'Disney should buy Nintendo' comment, but I have to give him some credit back for being someone with an objective view, in this case at least. AND he understand how businesses work, contrary to all the negative whiners on here, of which quite a few certainly appear to fall into the "Right Now" generation that @Gerbwmu mentioned and don't seem to wish anything but for their own selfish 'quick fix' wants, without looking at the long term picture for Nintendo at all.
Iwata has been there since the GameCube and has done WAY more good than bad, so any current mistakes should not erase all that credit, even though things MUST definitely change for the better, but the 'fire someone when it's going bad' solution reminds me very strongly of the current trend in sports, and specifically soccer/football: 'Oh no, the team performs really bad, let's fire the trainer!' Well, the team can have the best trainer in the world, but if the team doesn't execute the strategy that the trainer made like they should, then it is the fault of the team, NOT the trainer. When his strategy is planned, all he can do, besides adding some minor real-time directions, is sit in the dug-out and watch his team execute the strategy.
Of course that is a bit more nuanced because a team is the engine and you can't fire them instead, but I hope most of you will get the point of this comparison. The best way I can agree with the article is to cite a strong business quote that we (both me and the company where I currently work) live by and that emphasizes why Iwata should NOT go:

"The true measure of a man's success is not determined by how many times he fails, but by how many times he gets back up again."

You indeed need to know true failure to be able to acknowledge true success...



aaronsullivan said:

Iwata is brave and takes risks. Most of us could have predicted everything about the other consoles before they were released (I didn't see the easy game recording but I was out of touch with the whole "let's play" thing). Seriously, they are basically same but faster/improved. There's actually not much wrong with that and we need that in the industry as well, but let's not fire the brave ones who can move the industry beyond more of the same.

IMO the push for Wii U was actually getting pretty good there right in the middle of December. Marketing getting better, the value proposition: better. But middle of December is too late. There may be a month or two dip here as the Holiday debt gets filled up, but come tax return time (in the US) there will also be some Mario Kart right? Maybe there's some real momentum this time compared to the "first Wii U launch".

I'm hopeful, of course, because I own the system and have been loving it with the family for over a year now. Truly a new experience for us at least, just like the Wii was. Maybe we are just in the sweet spot of who would enjoy it, but I'm still hoping the system gains a bigger base.



aaronsullivan said:

As for Nintendo embracing the mobile space, look to Disney Infinity. The core game is tied to a console, but I'm editing and playing in the toy box using an iPad and/or PC and it works great (the PC port is pretty bad, but the iPad one is even better than the console for building). The key here is that the core "playing" component remains tied to the console hardware. Everything is shared with an account.

Nintendo is getting some interesting inroads in this area with Miiverse but it's time to spread out. Let's get a build-your-own Mario 3D World stage app, let's get the share on between friends and really open things up. Mario Kart track editor on mobile with limited play (one player and if AI is involved all the same looking Koopa or something). Mobile devices should be reminding everyone why Nintendo hardware is worth it on a daily basis with actual fun things to play with not just ads and throw away games or just a chatting service.

I hope that's the direction Iwata has in mind.



TheRealThanos said:

@aaronsullivan Some Interesting points there, although I still have very large doubts about putting true gameplay elements from Nintendo on mobile platforms. Miiverse, editors and other apps are fine by me, but games that need true control that you will only get with tactile peripherals should remain on the big screen in your house or on true dedicated handhelds, and should not be burdened with iffy touch screen controls.



DualWielding said:


O.k I don't know if its Iwata personally that its making the bad calls, but its clear that Nintendo problem is in the administration the people actually designing the hardware and games are doing their jobs fine enough...

Launching the 3DS and Wii U with no games hoping their gimmicks would be enough to sell them is an administrative decisions you can't blame engineers or game designers for that...

Both consoles suffered from being severely overpriced at launch, again setting the price is an administrative decision.....

I'm pretty sure we could have stuff like region free and account system the next day if Iwata ordered it...



aaronsullivan said:

I agree. If there was, say, a kart racing editor, I wonder if an AI racer to test it would be enough? Or maybe you could map a path for it to take (drag finger or place points) and then see how the AI does. Rudimentary control of a Mario Kart wouldn't be a total deal breaker on the devices. Mario would be tougher to figure out.

In Disney Infinity, the controls are all mapped to dragging your finger and a litter of buttons and a couple of abilities are slightly limited. (Helicopter flying is the most gimped) but it's all about getting to the real game to play. The graphics fidelity is high res but many effects are lacking or gone and there aren't as many polygons. But it's perfect for building stuff up quickly for a toy box and much faster than doing it in game (especially for some tasks like linking up creatitoys)

Anyway, that's just one way.



TheRealThanos said:

@ferthepoet Agreed on the region free and account system point. I really hate the excuse that they keep giving for that.
@OdnetninAges That wasn't relevant in this article. That was a thing he said a while back and they just referred to that to show the contrast.



TheRealThanos said:

@aaronsullivan I could really see the editor app working, setting up/preparing your level or gameplay settings with it and having your game ready to play when you arrive at home. All that is left to do is switch on your console...



worldstraveller said:

I do agree with him and true you learn more from your failures than successes, specially those fail hard out of stubbornness (I speak for me and specially my friend).
I do agree most with @JaxonH , I would add the story when we want a good story besides innovation, gameplay and fun.

now this of Disney buying Nintendo, just no, simply no. it's unnecessary,it won't happen either.



retro_player_22 said:

Every mistake can be resolve, running away from it won't do it any good which is why it's a good thing Iwata is not resigning. I don't think Disney buying Nintendo will make gaming any better though.



unrandomsam said:

@aaronsullivan Disney Infinity is a total rip off. Going to Disneyland is probably cheaper than getting a complete set of the powerdisks. (4 of each). Disneys practices of trying to keep things unavailable are failing as well. (High levels of Counterfeiting on e.g Ebay).



unrandomsam said:

@retro_player_22 I cannot see how they could do much better in terms of making stuff that sells pretty well than they did this year. Taking on loads more staff I don't think would work. If they do China right they might be ok. (But they sell games for crazy money in such as Brazil and Mexico so I don't think they will).



CoreyCannabis said:

Time to invest all of my money in Nintendo stock. You just know they're going to come up with something great right along here. Buy low, sell high!



GalacticMario28 said:

I think Jaffe has a really good point about failure, one which I would never thought of myself. Many successful companies have had some serious failures along the way; I see no reason to believe Nintendo will be much different.



sdcazares1980 said:

This is one of the many problems I have with motivational speakers/speeches: They tell you that you HAVE to fail in order to succeed. It's true that you do "need" to fail in some instances, but they make it sound like it's absolutely mandatory. I mean, who in their right mind WANTS to fail? There is a difference between preparing to fail and wanting to fail.

Having said all of that, does Iwata deserved to be fired? I don't know, but this is much bigger than Iwata. Nintendo is about to lose its third of the last four console races, yet I was also never that convinced of the Wii's success (yes, the numbers do back it up, but for very exceptional reasons). If Iwata really wants to keep his job, he better change his mind about not wanting to make major changes, because major failures actually do require major (yet thoughtful) changes.



TheRealThanos said:

@sdcazares1980 No of course it is not the aim to fail and nobody in their right mind would want to, but realistically, EVERY business takes failure into account, because there isn't a company on this earth that experiences an uninterrupted upwards sales line. Which is why they make sure they have buffers in case they fall upon hard times. There are always minor or major setbacks, internal and external, so there are lots of factors that are out of your control. As examples, just think about natural disasters such as occurred in Japan or the credit crunch happening all over the world. It is true though, that if you always win, whether in business, sports or even in life itself, you will NEVER truly appreciate it and you will start taking things for granted.
Oh, and Nintendo isn't losing any race, because they aren't and they will never be in the console race again. That stopped after Sega, but the media keeps that going so made that up as valid for the newer generations as well, but Nintendo never took the bait, and they shouldn't because they (want to) cater to an entirely different audience and they probably wouldn't be able to win anyway, because they would have to step on the other two's turf, so there's no point in it either.



SCAR said:

If Sony can lose 100s of millions upon 100s of millions for years on end, I'm pretty sure Nintendo can handle a loss every now and then.



sdcazares1980 said:

@TheRealThanos I'm sure you have to take failure into account, I just have a problem with his wording.

That is a fine sentiment you have about Nintendo, but they're also trying to make games that are in effect trying to draw you away from the PS4 and/or the Xbox One. If that's not a characteristic of a console race, then I don't know what is.



TheRealThanos said:

@jrob23 Perhaps he made the same mistake you made: thinking that the same rules, philosophies and points of view apply all over the world, but they don't. Iwata probably also got the wrong message from the rather unexpected success of the Wii but most people on here truly fail hard, VERY hard to even try for a second to embrace the Asian origins of Nintendo, to try and see where the hell they are coming from with some of these decisions and ways of thinking. The only people that do seem to understand in this thread are people that have lived in Japan or like me, has had a lot of involvement with Asians through their job. Their view on things is SO different, that you need to step out of your own frame of mind to even begin to understand, and if you're not willing to do that or are incapable of doing so for some reason, then you will always wonder. And Sony, for those of you that think so, is NOT similar, because as I have explained many times before, and like some bright mind somewhere up in this list of comments already mentioned, Sony is all but completely Westernized, what with all of their various departments and worldwide operations. Nintendo is a much more internal and traditional company, and even though they have European and American headquarters as well, you cannot compare that. Being a global brand is something entirely different to being a global company. So no, it is not baffling that Iwata stays on, this is (if memory serves me right, but I'm open to suggestions) only his second mistake or 'failure' if you will, so compared to his entire track record that isn't even a scratch.
And like @SCAR392 said, and I mentioned it too in some previous comment: how come other companies can lose huge amounts of cash, and WAY more than Nintendo, but they don't even get a percentage of the heat that Nintendo always gets, and they are always the one to be doomed. Fact of the matter is, that with their new console, Sony literally saved the entire company and gave it a financial boost that it needed VERY desperately because their losses in other departments are truly horrifying.
@sdcazares1980 a race would imply that you want to go for first place. Nintendo is convinced they have the best IP's money can buy (and, perhaps arguably, they do) and people that want to play these games will do so and hence they do not have to be drawn away. So, they do not feel the need to compete with Sony or Microsoft, it is their sentiment, not mine and it has been repeated over and over again in numerous interviews, so the console race point of view is either too black and white or, AGAIN, too Western. They might want to win some gamers back, because they left Nintendo because they 'dared' to disappoint them or in order to be able to play 'grown up' games, but winning back your original audience or winning a race are two different things altogether.



Nintend0ro said:

As much as 3DS and Wii were popular, I strongly wish those systems were more powerful. Iwata's "innovation rather than raw power" point of view is somewhat I would call risky these days. If Nintendo doesn't come up with latest in the market hardware, they will continue suffer I believe. I mean look at the XO and PS4 sales this gen



jrob23 said:

@TheRealThanos how again did I make that 'same mistake'. All I said was Iwata has failed to grasp the trends in western markets. He has even admitted so. But you disagree with him and me? hmmmm



DanMan82 said:

I didn't agree at all with him on the Disney buying Nintendo thing, but he really hit the nail on the head with this statement. See if the execs. at the big N can turn this thing around, and if not, then we can talk about getting rid of people. After all, if everything just came easy to us, would we be the same people we are today?

"I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed." - Michael Jordan



Fingeldor said:

Nobody hits a home run every single time. Failure is definitely part of the game and I admire Iwata for hanging tough to try and improve the company. Any coward can tuck tail and run away when the chips are down. Nintendo has always been in it for the long haul and the Wii U is an opportunity to improve and grow. Any mature, sane person knows this already. This guy is spelling it out succinctly.



TheRealThanos said:

@jrob23 And that is why I started that comment with 'perhaps'. Also because we all tend to view things from our principal perspective first, unless taught otherwise. Iwata thought he could do the same (Wii) trick again and thought that because Asia still likes them well enough, that the Western audience would once again eat it up like crazy too, but that obviously didn't happen. And your mistake is thinking that a CEO has to leave based on half a handful of bad decisions. On the other hand: if you run an entire company into the ground, then you need to fall upon your own sword, in Japan that used to be literally, by the way. Even up till the 60's/70's and may have even happened somewhere more recently. But that is not the case here, so I don't understand why people are screaming for the man's head when even Nintendo's board of directors and the shareholders (who know best and also know WAY more of what is actually going on inside the organization) don't feel that need at all. Just makes me wonder why all the fuss. Another face overnight will not change a company overnight, after all...
Things absolutely DO need to change, like I said before, but it does not necessarily mean that heads need to roll. At least for now. And I sort of have a feeling that even the damage done to the Wii U is going to be repaired to a certain degree. I'll call it failed after the coming financial year (march 2015) so a final verdict is way too soon for me...



SCAR said:

The difference is that some people take a statement too far. I realize that Nintendo is taking a loss, and need to change the way they run their business for the better, but none of that implies doom at all, which is why saying so is considered being negative.

You can't say the sun isn't shining, just because you're in the shade.



jrob23 said:

I understand needing to swing for the fences on occasion, think outside the box, fail in order to succeed. But what people are forgetting is Nintendo has been failing pretty hard for awhile. The whole transition to the Wii U was a failure. They pretty much stopped supporting the wii with games but kept selling it at low prices which when the Wii U launched, contribute to the lack of sales. Since people didn't understand the differences between the two..for two whole holiday seasons they might have chosen a wii. Either those wii's should have been taken off shelves immediately upon the Wii U release or they should have kept making top games for the Wii but they didn't do either. The Wii Mini is a stupid product and stupid decision. Who can argue with that? In the last couple of years of the wii's life they could have included the component cables (for 480p) but instead cheaped out and continued with just the composite. They stopped making the wii backwards compatible with the gamecube..why? The Virtual Console was a joke with the limited releases and lack of games. Having zero quality control as far as what games came out was a huge reason the wii became a dust collector for millions. There was just too much cheap shovelware that was on shelves instead of the great 1st party games and the numerous top shelf 3rd party. Way too many people opted for the cheapest bad game and because their experience sucked they stopped playing the console. That really helped promote the perception that the wii had no games and was a fad. When in fact, there are so many great titles that were lost in the sea of shovelware.

When the Wii U came out they could have just sold the console without the gamepad for $199. This would have allowed everyone a chance to still play HD Nintendo games, Mii Verse etc. They could have sold the gamepad as a separate controller for $150. It isn't like the gamepad is being used all that much even after a full year. It's almost like an added plus, like the Kinect.

The name Wii U is horrible. Another major mistake by Iwata. Trying to ride the Wiis coattails. Most everyone can agree on that. Seeing how poorly the 3DS launched due to lack of games and proper marketing, he came out and said he had learned his lesson, yet the exact same thing has happened with the Wii U. Except a major difference, there still is a lack of games. There are some great titles but for a struggling console there needs to be back to back to back releases of top notch games with advertising.

So folks, for those saying let's give him a couple more years, you are missing the point. He has already proven to be lacking in foresight and understanding western and global trends. If the they are working behind the scenes on their next handhelds and consoles do you want this guy to be spearheading that effort? If so, why? Because he hit on a fad in the Wii?

People are capable of changing and he may turn things around. But I have my doubts and I'd rather not take the chance that he screws up another generation. Maybe give him through 2014 to try and turn things around but if he can't then I'd rather get someone in there with enough time to have input on the next gen before Iwata screws that up too.

So this isn't about the Wii U as a failure for why Iwata needs to go, it goes way back.



Capt_N said:

I can't source my claim, but I will look/google, for future discussions. Anyway, I seem to recall the marketing hype/slogans on the website for the Wii, years ago were something along the lines of, "...for the people who used to game", "for the people who do game", "for the people who have never gamed". Not exactly verbatum, but wording very close to what I wrote. & this was back, before the Wii released; earlier that launch November 2006 I recall. Nintendo's marketting from that point, at least, was always aimed at those who had never played games before, as well as those who used to. I also recall the reasoning behind the "...used to" was that Nintendo had discovered that people had been put off to video games prior to the Wii, due to many-buttoned controllers. I seem to recall that thinking was also on the Wii webpage, prior to launch, with all the above marketting I mentioned. Again, I can't easily source it, if at all.
My point of the above (paragraph) is that it is debatable if the Wii was a "fluke", or if selling to non-, & ex-gamers alike was originally the intent.

& yeah, failures teach lessons, & in business they are inevitable, & valuable to all the employees/staff. I don't think Nintendo has reached the number of failures, where it is a good idea to pack-up, & go home. I think, at least part of the problem, lies with a 3-pronged console issue: the WU was originally Mr. Dink voice"very expensive"; still is actually, secondly for the price point it could be debated back&forth about the console's raw power, features, & ease to develop for vs. its contemporaries, or would you say competitors(?), the 3rd thing was that while Nintendo launched a year ahead (of) its 8th-gen opponents, Nintendo did not properly utilize that time to build an install base. Granted, it could be also argued that they made this mistake, due to honestly thinking they were prepared, or you could say that they may have released easrly due to dropping/abandoning the Wii a few years before they should have - I know that statement is slightly opinion-based, but still had to be said.

If you wanna add a 4th, & 5th prong, let's say a system-seller game that flaunts the Gamepad. The 5th would be decent 3rd-party support. A 5-pronged issue.

Now, as for Iwata, I don't know. All I'm going to add, is that he used to be more in the creation of games at Nintendo. before he became president.



SCAR said:

The way I see it, Nintendo cheaped out in exchange for financial stability. You may think that Sony and Microsoft had a better launch, but they sure as hell paid for it.

Sony sold 4.2 million consoles in 2 or so months, and hasn't made a dime of money. So unless money doesn't matter, then ya, Sony is doing fantastic, but money kind of does matter, because that's where these products derive from in the first place. THAT is where Nintendo is the most successful, besides having some of the best IPs in the industry.

As for the GamePad and Kinect, requirement guarantees support. Sony as a business will be hurting more than ever if Move and PS Eye are a wasted development that they've made, as a business. If I was Sony I would have thrown in PS Eye and Move for free. It would be better than no one having them.

At $300, the GamePad is basically free, so there's literally no way to suggest otherwise.



TheRealThanos said:

@jrob23 With all due respect, but the point is that your point is your OPINION, not a fact. And my point is my opinion too, same as any other commenters' too. But there are some facts to be found in each. And it is true that if you understand Asian companies and their way of doing business, or if you understand Asian culture that it is more easy to understand. I don't think that the mistake of 'the horrible name' that you credit Iwata with, will be seen as seriously as that by the people that are making the final decisions at Nintendo. In fact, they will more than likely not even think about it for a second. The name is only bad in the eyes of the people that don't like the name, same as with the Wii, because it reminds them of going to the toilet or whatever, while to Asian minds, it makes perfect sense. I already explained this at length in another comment, but it is based on phonetics, Japanese characters, iconography and philosophy. The two 'i's' indicate plural/multiplayer and look like two stick men in most commercials. I think the name is hardly as offensive or bad as many make it out to be, but in that sometimes people need to agree to disagree, otherwise it would be a very boring world indeed if we would all agree, all the time...
Do agree with your sentiments on the Wii Mini and the gimped revisions of the original Wii, though.



TheRealThanos said:

@everyone And here's a little management joke to lift the heavy mood from this topic and make fun of CEO's needing to leave as soon as things go bad. Let's find out if we can see parallels to any of the three console giants:

"The three envelopes

A fellow had just been hired as the new CEO of a large corporation. The current CEO was stepping down and met with the new hire privately in his office, where he handed him three numbered envelopes.
"Open these if you run up against a problem you don't think you can solve," the first CEO said.
Things went along pretty smoothly for the first six months, but then sales took a downturn and the new CEO began catching a lot of heat. He went to his drawer and took out the first envelope. The message read: "Blame your predecessor."
The new CEO called a press conference and tactfully laid the blame at the feet of the previous CEO. Sales began to pick up and the problem was soon behind him.
About a year later, the company was again experiencing a slight dip in sales, combined with serious product malfunctions. Having learned from his previous experience, the CEO opened the second envelope. The message read: "Reorganize." This he did, and the company quickly rebounded.
After several consecutive profitable quarters, the company once again fell on hard times. The CEO went to his office, closed the door and opened the third envelope.
The message read: "Prepare three envelopes"…



sdcazares1980 said:

@TheRealThanos I'm not sure if that kind of strategy or philosophy will be enough this time. I'm obviously still gaming with Nintendo (otherwise, I wouldn't be here), but it's not just about you, me, and the people on this forum. It's about everyone in the gaming community. The strategy of having two consoles, like what it did this past generation, is long gone. Many of the gamers from the NES and SNES days have either moved on from gaming altogether, moved on to more "mature" aspects of gaming like Sony or Microsoft (I have an Xbox 360, planning on getting the Xbox One), went to casual gaming on tablets and smartphones because they're cheaper and they don't require a lot of your attention, or have decided to stay like we have, but we're also become fewer and fewer.

You said that the console race is too black and white. You maybe right, but I have valid reasons for this. As I've mentioned, people pick their consoles for different reasons, but it is also very expensive and "demanding" hobby. It is not just something that people just will shell out a few hundred dollars for. And third party developers will go after the ones that will make them money. That is the nature of the video game business.

Sorry, but this is the cold reality that Nintendo has to face.



TheRealThanos said:

@sdcazares1980 it is not the race itself that is black and white, it is thinking that Nintendo is actively pursuing being in it, which they are not. And I do not agree with the point that having two (or even more) consoles is gone. I always have two myself plus a handheld (obviously a Nintendo) and most of my friends & family also have more than one. Two of my best friends even have ALL consoles from 8 bit up till now.



Shy_Guy said:

In the words of Alfred "Why do we fall sir? So that we can learn to pick ourselves up."



SCAR said:

I think that the Wii U has the ability to appeal to everyone, if that task is carried out correctly. The Wii remote and GamePad are arguably what the "casual" gamer wants, while still being able to adapt the "core" games, as well.

If Destiny came out on Wii U, it would probably be the only version of the game with Wii remote support, unless Sony convinces Activision/Bungie to utilize Move. If Wii U gets 3rd party support, you can bet that Smartglass and PS Vita dual screen use would be happen more often.

All those companion apps in games like the Division and CoD could easily be placed on the GamePad. Wii U has the capability to access a server and send that data to the GamePad, instead of your tablet or PS Vita. That's why having it is valuable, especially with other consoles in mind that have it as an option.

I'll say it again... For $300, you're basically getting the GamePad for free. I don't even think they sell basic models anymore, because they can't justify the price of anything less than $300. That's what some consumers are faling to understand, and it's only the ones who claim that they understand, ironically.



TheRealThanos said:

@sdcazares1980 Not if people chose to buy the other two instead of a Wii U and only one of the other two...
But seriously, of course I know that nowadays, most people can only afford to buy one console and they are expensive enough as is.



JusticeDragon said:

This guy when it came to the Disney should buy the big N was stupid but speaking of Iwata's failures he does make a point every body falls just to get back up again the gamecube era was bad for nintendo yes but they did not giveup



TheRealThanos said:

@DragonRider989 He made the Disney comment way back in October, so with this latest objective and genuinely decent comment, I think it is safe to say that we can forgive him for that previous oversight...



jrob23 said:

@TheRealThanos It's all and good that they understand the Japanese market. However, with America being their biggest market, it's time they take that audience into consideration a little more. It obviously isn't working what they are doing now. It's pretty universal that the Wii U name is bad. It's bad because it didn't differentiate itself from its predecessor and was too confusing. Many people still don't know it's a stand alone console, some still think it's a wii peripheral. Since I don't know who is ultimately responsible it might be unfair to blame Iwata for the name. I can blame Iwata for the lack of foresight to either name it something different (if he was responsible) or as CEO make sure those that were responsible understood what a bad idea it was.



Hale-Bopp said:

I don't get it. Are customers supposed to say, "It's ok if you fail, we'll be here for you when you sort this mess out."?

I don't think the consumer market works that way. I don't think their customers are sitting around waiting for them to get their act together. Many of them have already moved on and many of those who have stuck around continue to lose confidence in Nintendo.



SCAR said:

Depending on Nintendo's strategy, allowing their stocks and image to supposedly squander might be more viable than what the general consensus has in mind.

If they announced 5 1st party games and 15 high profile 3rd party games, in an upcoming Nintendo Direct, people would probably give up the "doom" opionion for at least another few months or so.

If Nintendo even has any sort of information like that, all this discussion of issues is technically in vein. We don't know what Nintendo knows, so from the the outside, things may seem "gloomier" than they really are.

Since we don't have enough information about what goes on inside of closed doors at Nintendo HQ, it's literally impossible to draw a conclusion. That's why it's dumbfounding that people continue to do just that.

There's not even that many games announced for beyond 2014, on any console. So people have apparently been thinking 1 year in advanced for Wii U, but not for the other consoles. It's called being shortsighted.

After 2014, Xbox One and PS4 are just as much in the dark, regarding future success, as of now.



Chris720 said:

He's got a good point. Nintendo takes a lot of risks by making a unique gameplay experience and this can either pay off or fail. And they've usually always turned a fail around... But I think Nintendo missed a trick this time round.



Marioman17 said:

What are people's opinions if Nintendo came up with another style (or gimmick; I don't like using the word gimmick, though) that allowed more 3DS and Wii U interaction? I mean, when I first heard about it I got really hyped up. I just wonder if anyone could come up with any other ideas. My only idea right now is maybe making the 3DS an optional controller for the Wii U--Kind of like the GamePad, but with more use. I dunno, though.



Marioman17 said:

@shigulicious To me, that is a great idea. I've come to really love Nintendo, Sega, and Atlus. I would like to see more Sonic and maybe even Persona games come to Nintendo consoles.



B3ND3R said:

Honestly, I'm not surprised Jaffe came out and said this... I mean, this happens all the time.



TheRealThanos said:

@jrob23 I find that odd, really. The Wii U name is no more than an emphasis of it's additional capabilities. It is still we that can play together, but it is also just for you, the core player, so Wii (and) U. Of course it is now safe to say that they didn't exactly do very well in achieving to get the message across concerning that second part, and are struggling to get the first part afloat...
But if a newer and improved Wii U follow up is so confusing, then the Super Nintendo could have been perceived as confusing too, because if we start thinking like that, then a Super Nintendo might as well have been an expansion kit to make my NES do even more than it already could, but no, it was clear that it was an entirely new console. As a seasoned Sales & Marketing professional myself it is very clear that only that exact part is wrong and is to blame for the confusion: lack of or bad marketing. Had they done more, then there would have been no confusion at all, and then the name could have been anything for that matter, because as long as you put a decent marketing campaign behind it, people will get to hear about a new product, regardless of name, shape or color of the item. Those factors are inherently all subservient to the message of a well oiled marketing campaign that should be the driving force behind your sales.
This is because a good marketing campaign entails you telling your target audience the item's USP's (Unique Selling Points): what your product offers or how it makes you feel, in other words, what's in it for you, aka the added value of owning said product. And it doesn't matter at all if the product is a lemon or a car or a console, for that matter. Because as a rule of thumb in marketing, you do NOT sell the product/item/service itself! A well known saying in marketing is 'sell the sizzle, not the steak'. If you get that, then you understand the basis of a good marketing campaign. And I should know: I've been doing that for well over 12 years now... A good sales professional should be able to sell a fridge to an Eskimo and should make chocolate pudding sound like the tastiest thing in the world to you, even if he doesn't like it himself. And that part incorporates another marketing term: UBR's (Unique Buying Reasons): why would or should I want to have/buy this product? Connect the dots between the USP's and the UBR's and you're on your way to a sale... (needless to say that Iwata, and arguably people like Reggie too, didn't connect the dots this time, especially for the American/European market)
@antipop621 Oh God, please no...
@B3ND3R Third parties speaking in favor of persons/platforms they don't even develop for? Can't remember the last time that happened, if ever...



jayclayx said:

Everybody is saying how bad nintendo marketing is but lets be honest, even with all the advertising nintendo could make with the ww u people are complaining about nintendo with things like a bad quality tablet controller, with a under power console, I know you guys don't care about technical stuff but most people do, I know many people who said why should I spend 300dll on wii u when a ps4 just cost 399, there is a cool factor, people don't want a cheap controller, don't want a under power console, why the wii sold like hell, it was because nintendo was able to make a casual market which most of them are now on tablets, while nintendo was busy making money with grandmas sony and microsoft took away what nintendo has in the snes and 64 era, the core gamer market.



Manaphy2007 said:

i do hope nintendo does actually do something to better the company and bring wii u sales up and the japs better start being less stubborn, though i admire their stubbornness, it might be their weakness.



mamp said:

The thing is Iwata has failed before he's been around since the GC days and he's messed up before. Lately it seems like he just keeps messing up and people just keep getting apologies from him. Sure he seems charming because of Nintendo Directs but come on in a business perspective he should have been gone a while ago.



kereke12 said:

I agree with this guy he has rights to fail, but the part where he wants Disney to buy Nintendo is just plain Stupid. But nobody is giving Nintendo a chance to shine. Nintendo and Mr. Iwata needs to step up there game and change the way do things and think. Change the Whole Nintendo.



Zombie_Barioth said:

Do they really? If most people really cared and understood specs and technical capabilities then why is it that companies use vague over exaggerations in marketing? Why would they say things like, say, PS4 is more powerful than high-end PCs if they knew most people knew better? Thats because most don't, not beyond simple things like more cores and higher numbers.

You could also look at the general history of the industry, where it was always the weakest console that did the best. Good software and marketing drives sales, not powerful hardware and specs.

Its the same reason why people buy Apple products, or Beats headphones, despite ther being (arguably) better, yet more affordable alternatives.



Kirk said:

I 100% agree with Jaffe on this one.

I do however think a lot of Nintendo's recent woes is actually because it's NOT been looking at the bigger long term picture properly with some of it's recent decisions and that's something it really needs to address. It's trying to get quick hits out of short lived gimmicks and fickle audiences rather than creating truly satisfying almost timeless experiences that create the kind of long term loyal fans that still stick by Nintendo so stubbornly to this day, no matter how many mistakes it makes.

I don't think Iwata needs to go but I do think Nintendo needs to stop thinking of gimmicky things as being the main selling point of their consoles and instead have those unique ideas ON TOP OF making machines that the larger majority of people will ALSO be genuinely excited about and interested in. Machines that are designed with the properly long term future in mind.

Gimmicks are not what made the likes of NES, SNES and even N64 such great consoles, that most owners have very fond memories of and still love playing to this day. R.O.B. isn't what made the NES special. No, it was the fact that these consoles were totally cutting edge for their time. The tech and graphics totally satisfying for the time. The first party games truly brilliant. The third party support was stellar (at least on NES and SNES). Even the controllers on all these consoles were brilliant; being both innovative and industry defining in many ways and yet still truly practical for playing all the popular games of their times. Etc...

Gimmicks, needless limitations and falling short in multiple important areas, relative to the times and consumer/gamer expectations, doesn't make satisfied customers across the board, even if there's some decent first party games. Making all-round truly satisfying consoles, games and experiences is what makes satisfied customers across the board. The kind of all round satisfied customers that become long term fans and loyal customers for generations to come.

Most of these newly picked up Wii customers didn't even stick around to the next generation, CLEARLY (hence the truly crap sales of Wii U). The truly all-round satisfied NES, SNES and even N64 fans stuck around for a long time however. In fact, many of them are still fighting in Nintendo's corner even now and it's most likely most of them who probably actually bought a Wii U too, so that it was even able to reach the relatively small/disappointing sales it's achieved thus far.

That's my take on it anyway.



aaronsullivan said:

@unrandomsam About Disney Infinity. (This is a side issue for any interested and my original point about Nintendo emulating it was about the online/mobile strategy NOT about the toy aspect at all anyway)

I'm not sure where you get your facts about it, but the latest news is that it was more successful than expected and I've noticed that critically, it has stood up very well against the cynicism of toy-based video gaming. The fact is that for this family Disney Infinity has been a bargain, giving far more enjoyment and playing time than even Nintendo's games since they've all been opened. It's far less refined and polished and nuanced in game play than Nintendo's offerings to be sure, but it does have a lot to offer.

It's far from perfect and there are some money-grab aspects but they don't preclude enjoyment of the game if you just ignore those aspects, you don't NEED any of them. (the power discs are fortunately very optional and for collector types you can buy ALL of the series 2 discs in one package including the "rare" ones).

Disney Infinity's real problems lay in the initial learning curve. They tried SO hard too with a brilliant opening intro and a focus on the toy box, but you have to invest a good deal of effort and time to understand how best to set things up and unlock enough in the toy box to have a blast with it. It also helps to have two players most of the time in the toy box and for the play set adventures. If you have kids or a buddy, you really need the sidekicks pack to go along with the base set (so you can play two-player in the play set adventures).

That does amp up the price a bit, but with sales and deals you can get the whole deal around $100 US and probably get an extra figurine to boot. That's $40 more than a regular game, but it comes with hardware (the base) and 6 (or 7) physical toys. We ignored power discs for a long time and just got a few for fun. I actually find them less fun since you don't earn/unlock them. I don't think I've bought a single item at full price alone — Target has had buy the set get a figure free, buy one get one 50% off, half off sales on the play sets, etc.

The thing is that the toy statue figurines are just really nice. They could have sold them without any game functionality just as they were from probably $8 just fine. I've seen worse for higher prices.

Anyway, your mileage may vary, but for a family of four with a couple of young kids it has been an experience they'll never forget with dozens of hours of laughing and playing in the toy box mode alone. It was a hugely ambitious game that has its shortcomings but is a great foundation for a franchise.

(They are even planning on making it backwards AND forwards compatible so you'll be able to play with new figurines in the toy box of the original game via patching. So, if later this year there is a new version 2 toy you are just dying to have but you don't want to buy the next game, you can do that.)



thanos316 said:

The wii u hasn't failed, its only year two. one hit and this system will be pushing out units. more marketing, more indie titles, and more word of mouth. Its always doom and gloom for nintendo. not everyone hits a homerun everytime up at bat. give the wii u some time.



yuwarite said:

Why don't we get quotes from developers who are actually making games for Nintendo, and not unemployed ex-game developers, who have nothing better to do than post on Twitter.



shingi_70 said:


We still haven't seen the results of the Lucas arts merger. The only things we know is the other expanded universe is done and marvel will be publishing star wars comics.

Rebels looks really good as well.



Luffy said:

exactly wise words. The most sucessful people in the world failed the most times...but got back up and did it better then anyone else on earth ever could or ever will.

I rather have iwata



jayclayx said:

@Zombie_Barioth you are right, specs may be not important at all, you state products like apple and consoles like psx, ps2 and wii but if you pay attention to all this products there is something in common between them and is the cool factor, everybody says how cool apple products are, the same thing happened with the psx, ps2 and wii, everybody were saying how cool games were on those consoles so people were willing to buying those devices, but right now nintendo were unable to make a cool factor for the wii U, sorry but the first year of the wii U was pathetic, ports from 360 and ps3 doesn't help at all because there was a feeling that wii U was more like current gen than the next one and games like pikmin and w101 lets be honest are not cool enough to make people want a console or even talk about them, Nintendo was aware of their modest hardware and for the same reason they should have realeased a brand new zelda, a smash brothers and a mario kart to have a strong lunch, that would be a so big cool factor for the wii u.



QuickSilver88 said:

@jrob23 i don't agree with everything you said, but I do agree about Wii having many good 3rd party games that were lost in the shovelwear blizzard. There are truly over 100 very good games for Wii but like 400 that are complete doggieoopsie. Games like No More Heroes, Red Steele2, Zak and Wki are all excellent 3rd party exclusives that likely sold poorly because of no recogznition. What happnened to the old Nintendo seal of quality.

Watch the language -Lz



Zombie_Barioth said:

Thats very true, and a big part of the cool factor is marketing. Its not enough to just look the part, you have to convince the consumer. I think we can all agree thats where Nintendo failed.

Nintendo could convince us that Wonderful 101 was the coolest thing since sliced bread if they worked at it, and they've all seen what they're capable of when they do. They even made the Wii a must have item for a while, even if it wasn't the console to own.

The last-gen consoles aren't helping any, between being cheaper and having a much larger library of games, you could put a pretty good game library together on the cheap. There isn't a huge gap power-wise either so your not missing much, and the Wii U doesn't fare any better against the next-gen ones either. Its kinda stuck in between the competition on both fronts.



Fink-Nottle said:


I completely agree.

It's not a bad idea though, but smartphone gaming lacks experience in being more than a fad for now, and it will never be anything close to playing ie. local coop on a console.

Local coop is awesome, people may forget that from time to time, but it will never vanish.

There were many unforeseen factors for the lack of success, because the Wii U is not a bad console at all. It's actually the most fun I've ever had on a console, and I got my first console the SNES in '92 or '93.

It was a twist of fate, and it does happen, no matter how badly some people does not want it to happen.

But hey, Nintendo will live on, and I've never been a fanboy, but they're a really great company despite all the criticism.

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