For anyone that's been following the game closely, it's no surprise to say that DOOM has some compromises in order to tick along on Nintendo's diminutive system. The fact it's there is impressive in its own right, but squeezing a current-gen game (originally released to critical acclaim in 2016) is no small feat.
Well, our chums at Digital Foundry have done their thing and provided a final analysis on the Switch version. It goes into resolution and framerate, and one core conclusion is that it's an impressive game on the portable, but not when playing docked on a TV.
Check it out below.
If you've picked up DOOM on the Nintendo Switch this week let us know what you think of it in the comments.
Comments 302
The big problem here is that it's not even 30fps but 20-30fps in spite of having a lot of understandable visual downgrades.
Great video! I was looking forward to this one.
Sometimes I think I'm a nerd but then I watch videos of people who literally count individual pixels on a screen and analyze milliseconds worth of frames and I feel better.
They also made a video comparing all console versions of Sonic Forces, if anyone is interested.
This is why Nintendo has to put out a Pro-Dock for the Switch like the PS4 Pro and XBO X. In a couple of years third parties will stop porting their games because it would be too much of a hassle to downscale them for the Switch. A Dock with actual processing power would solve that while playing on the TV (on the go can look as bad as they want, the screen size hides that most of the time).
@Devlind "In a couple of years third parties will stop porting their games because it would be too much of a hassle to downscale them for the Switch."
If the Switch manages to sell the 30 million they are rumored to be producing next year, companies will be happy to spend the time porting to reap the potential profits.
Anybody notice anything strange about the Doom Switch box art?
A lot of sacrifices had to be made to get it to run and it shows. It's great for a handheld game but otherwise, not so much. Not to mention much, much more expensive than on other platforms.
@JHDK Exactly, well said. This will happen, much like it happened with so many titles and even series on a certain other weak Nintendo console. COD Wii, anyone?
Not convinced Doom on the Switch isn’t equal to the game on a high end PC until I see another 17 million comparison videos on YouTube.
@JHDK The Wii sold way more than that and most of the big third party titles skipped the system. If you mean shovelware, then you may be right.
Talk about the definition of "first world problems" : complaining about the resolution on the Switch...my god people, you can now play Doom on a portable!
@Lone_Beagle Yeah, a lot of people seem to not understand that. I'm not worried about it, but I'm worried that this drives the developers away from the system.
It's going to be an ugly day (spoiler alert: next spring) when Switch sales fall off a cliff. Once anyone who wants one (around 30 million lifetime) gets a switch, Nintendo will be left scrambling once again.
Why do I say this here, in this article? Well, because as we all know, Nintendo cannot survive off of 1st party content alone. And if this is the level of quality that AAA 3rd party content brings to the NS, just imagine next year and the year after that.
Wii was uber successful due to price and Wii Sports being packed in.
Switch has been successful because of Breath of the Wild being a launch title and a strategic release schedule of Wii U ports mixed with indie offerings.
Gotta see the forest for the trees though. And a forest fire appears on the horizon.
@gatorboi352
[reads comment]
[bookmarks page for ready access in the future]
@Devlind I agree, what developer will want to devote blood, sweat, and tears to port a game, when everybody will just complain about your work?
Here, check this out:
http://nintendoeverything.com/doom-switch-dev-says-the-port-has-been-wicked-hard-wishes-gamers-didnt-focus-on-tech-specs-over-fun/
@BlueOcean Not just that but it's not running in 720p. It's running in 600p and less in handheld mode where the small screen in fairness hides it well.
Compromises? Of course there are! But it’s awesome!!! It’s doomed to succeed!!!!!!! Even in tv it’s bloody good for the tech it’s on. GTA anyone? Come on!!!
@Lone_Beagle gotta admire panic button. That was definitely not an easy port. They did a good job with the switch hardware.
It’s still fun as hell (pun intended) which is what really matters. I’m playing exclusively in handheld mode so the downgrades aren’t as noticeable. If I want to play it on the TV, I’ll do it on the new Xbox One X I just wasted my money on.
I'm really glad the publishers didn't survey the NintendoLife comments section before deciding to port Doom or not.
Q1: You can have Doom, possibly on the only console you own, but it won't look as good as other versions and the frame rate will be lower. It'll still play the same though. Should we?
A: Nah, don't bother. I'd rather not have it if it looks not quite as good as other versions. Cos I'm shallow and game play isn't as important as looks.
Did he say a soupy mess?? I'm not sure I'm seeing the same game as him as at least on my tv it looked fine.
Even on bad selling consoles, third parties spent time making ports. Black Ops 2 for Wii U?
I've said this a few times today but I've been playing this on the same 4K TV I platinumed the PS4 version on and was pleasantly surprised to see how well the game holds up. It feels fast and fluid and after the first 3 levels I can't say I've noticed any real framerate problems either. After a few hours with the game including mp I can honestly say I don't miss playing the PS4 version at all and I'm enjoying the game just as much as I did first time around. Also whilst it is noticeably blurrier than the other versions I still think it looks great on both its own screen and the TV and is up there with the best Switch games I own
Seems to be a rather messy port, with bad frame pacing etc. I was myself surprised by how close the release date were to the annauncement of the game. Bet the port-team didn't get too much money or time of Bethesda. Maybe its just a cheap port to test the Switch market for adult games. I hope Wolf2 gets a better port next year, cause Im planning of buying that one.
@Spoony_Tech I think sometimes they go a bit overboard especially now the new Xbox is out, I saw a video which showed it upscaling Fallout 3 and they compared it to the S saying it was "transformative" where as I could see absolutely no difference on a huge 4K TV
By porting they only considered the portable mode? Is there any difference between portable and docked at all?
@SLIGEACH_EIRE The low-res texture and downgraded visual effects are somehow understandable in a portable game and even the low-resolution (sub600p) rendering won't be that bad in handheld mode although it must look blurry on a 1080p/4K TV.
The sub-30 fps is the biggest issue here and something that hints at Switch not really being able to handle current-gen games properly, not even halving the frame rate and aggressively downgrading the visuals.
I find digital foundry to be too objective and manages to suck any joy out of a game leaving me limp. Then I load the game, run around like a fool ramming my fist through a demon's skull and suddenly I get gaming again. Love the fact that this game is on our small miracle of a console.
@yeayeanaynay Why does he have to own a Switch to comment on a youtube video here?
@PhantomSwitch The thing is they did so at the start and maybe for the first year of Wii U then gave up. 3rd parties will have to see some reward for their work. I'm sure they're not happy having to work hard only to make a lesser version of their vision on Switch.
@yeayeanaynay I don't own it YET but I do have first hand experience on the Switch.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE Then you get games like Mario rabbids which sells and I have to ask why you are still spreading Doom and gloom. The Switch seems to be doing fine and folks can't even use the 'not enough games' excuse anymore.
Digital Foundry : "Oh but look, this resolution, and these framerate dips here and something temporal antialiasing"
People not playing game ; "Look, look it's a disaster, resolution and stuff"
Person playing game : "What? Sorry, you'll have to speak up, I'm busy chainsawing demons. This chainsaw is loud, I can't hear you....600p? I could do with a pee actually, hey I'll just take it with me. This is great!"
@Kalmaro Mario + Rabbids is a great game, I haven't dissed it. That's a collaboration though and the Mario name would have helped its sales hugely. I don't think we've had figures for it but I'm sure it's sold well and remember it hasn't released in Japan yet, it doesn't do so until next year.
@gatorboi352 I have the same vision, early success, surpassing Wii U soon which was Nintendo's biggest failure ever (Virtual Boy was not even released in Europe) and then what?
They can't release a new Zelda or Mario game every year and even if they do that doesn't always work (New Super Mario Bros. U). Third-party games are not selling well enough except indie games because the eShop has a smaller collection of them available and only a few of them (the good ones) shine on all platforms.
I have the feeling that Switch sales will go down next year and probably up again for a while after a price reduction.
It's also interesting to see others who like me have played the game in higher resolution at a higher framerate, but are still really enjoying it on Switch. Maybe you have to have played this on another system to appreciate what an achievement this is. It's a AAA, high-end current-gen game from last year running and fully playable on a portable. Unheard of.
Also, I appreciate what DF do and how good at it they are, but I originally played this on XB1. I could have got it on PS4 which naturally runs it better. I knew there were people out there playing it (having paid less for it) on good PC's that ran it better. It was still brilliant fun on Xbox. Same applies here. It's still brilliant fun on Switch
@yeayeanaynay : Can you explain what are the differences in docked and portable mode for Doom?
@Chandlero The screen size, obviously. Are you teasing me again?
Ah bless, the same naysayers getting ever more desperate. 30 million when it falls off a cliff is it now lads? Best continue to be flexible with them numbers.
@BlueOcean: Sorry, wrong person mentioning. However, I never tease you?!
Nevertheless, the question remains: Is Doom in docked in higher resolution or with more effects than in portable mode?
@yeayeanaynay 20 year partnership with NVidia. We are in the NES days of this technology! The NES had some incredible titles and even had ports of coin ops that, ok, weren't as pretty, but the fact you could play it at home was amazing. It's such a similar game changing console.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE I beg to differ, the Mario brand actually hurt it at first because people hated on it almost unanimously. Very few people wanted a Mario game with rabbids in it.
It was only after people saw the gameplay that hype happened.
@Chandlero OK then. I think I got the wrong name too. No worries.
@gatorboi352 you wish Gator, you wish. Talk to you next Spring, can't wait.
@Chandlero DF says that the differences between handheld and docked mode are minimal but, obviously, the game looks much blurrier on TV. The resolution is around 600p, sometimes lower. The performance is bad on both modes regarding frame rate (reaching low 20s) and frame pacing. Bad frame pacing means that each frame last an irregular length of time, causing judder. This is quite bad in a fast-paced game.
@BlueOcean
"then what? They can't release a new Zelda or Mario game every year"
They don't need to. They can release some of their other massive IP like Pokémon, Animal Crossing, Smash Bros etc. Or their B-tier franchises like Fire Emblem, Donkey Kong, Metroid etc. Or spin-offs like Mario Maker, Mario Party etc. By the time we're done with them we'll be round to sequels to Mario, Mario Kart, Zelda.
"Third-party games are not selling well enough"
There are no guarantees for the future but that patently isn't true. Momentum is good and that narrative doesn't work anymore.
http://nintendoeverything.com/ubisoft-very-happy-with-switch-sales-more-games-on-the-way/
http://n4g.com/news/2121130/take-two-very-pleased-with-nba-2k18s-sales-on-switch-supportive-of-the-platform-corporately
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2017-11-07-bandai-namco-ramping-up-support-for-the-nintendo-switch
https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2017/11/capcom_to_bring_increased_support_and_ace_attorney_to_switch_in_2018
https://gamingbolt.com/square-enix-doubles-down-on-its-commitment-to-nintendo-switch-support
http://nintendoenthusiast.com/blog/2017/10/28/koei-tecmo-extremely-happy-switch-game-sales/
@Kalmaro Any initial negativity was long gone before its release.
@electrolite77 exactly, I think it looks great and as long as I have a shotgun and a chainsaw I'm happy 😃
I have really started to dislike Digital Foundry. They do what they do very well but all it does is give idiots with nothing better to do with the lives a reason to start arguments with other idiots about which of their toys is better (video games are toys people, deep down you know that and there is nothing wrong with that).
I have been playing Doom on Switch all day and it is great fun, well made, looks perfectly fine, even great at times, and its great to have as an option.
The obsession with technology rather than whether the games are actually fun is just a bit sad.
Man the haters out in force. Can read between the lines. They are desperate to see the switch fail. Desperate to see third parties come out and say they are disappointed with sales.
Where have you been for the last few days. Multiple third parties express they very happy with sales and others saying more games are coming.
@electrolite77 Not going to discuss all that with you because it could take ages and I know what you do and how long it takes and it's not worth it. Just going to say something about the IPs, OK? I love many Nintendo franchises but I am aware of how little Nintendo cares about them. They even said 2D Mario games sell much better than 3D Mario games so we are focusing on 2D Mario games. This was during the New Super Mario Bros. boom until New Super Mario Bros. U failed (according to them). They only care about the franchises and genres that make money. Where is F-Zero? Remember when they said that you don't need Wave Race because you have a mini game in Wii Sports Resort?
What's with all the talk of 3rd party sales on Switch, what have we had a couple of sports games? Mario and Rabbits is doing well oh and as for Doom it is currently 3rd on the eshop charts for both the UK and U.S. Now bearing in mind this is 2 weeks worth of sales for these charts and it's behind only Mario Odyssey and Stardew Valley (which is doing well by all accounts) and digitally at least it's off to a good start
The game is bloody brilliant and I'm playing it now while the Mrs watches crap-factor. I found that video a bit pointless tbh.
Playing it right now. It is better than I was expecting. Looks nice but there is a strange sound glitch I have gotten twice.
@SBandy couldn't agree more mate. Well said.
@MartyFlanMJFan He is just saying his opinion, not that he wishes that to happen. If you think of how fast Wii U was abandoned and even Wii, which was a massive success, was abandoned very early, it's not crazy to think that Nintendo could abandon Switch as well depending on the circumstances.
@RasandeRose it's much better then they are suggesting it is and I played it to death on PS4
@BlueOcean. Just be grateful that you can play it on the Switch at all.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE Unless you're referring to E3 when they showed footage, I don't see what you're talking about.
It wasn't until E3 that people got excited and that was after gameplay was shown. Which helps prove that just having Mario's face on the game did not help it.
@carlos82 Mario + Rabbids was a success but, in spite of the positive third-party PR talk, the others are Nintendo's.
http://www.vgchartz.com/gamedb/?name=&publisher=&platform=NS&genre=&minSales=0&results=200
There was an article on NL that said that only Mario + Rabbids sold more than 1 million (third-party games).
@Orangezap89 Yes, as I said, I think it's great as a portable game because the downgraded visuals are understandable, but the performance issues are serious. If you don't care about that then good news.
@MegaTen
As I said, they do what they do very well but they have had a hand in creating the total nosense that does go on in the comment sections of Youtube, Eurogamer, here and any number of game forums.
I believe they are genuinely interested in the technology but it is always a contest, never just admiration for whats achieved on each console/PC, and the muppets are waiting in the shadows with their pitchforks. If the game is fun and playable that is what matters to me and that should be the focus first and formost for all games!
Just my opinion!
@SBandy "it is always a contest, never just admiration for whats achieved"
In this video he repeats a few times that it's a great achievement as a portable game, then he explains one by one all the downgrades and issues.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE fantastic 😂
@electrolite77
Yeah, at first it was "The Switch will fail worse than the Wii U!!!" then the narrative changed to "sales will plummet when stock increases/artificial demand blah blah" and now it's "just you wait! The Switch sales will start falling when (insert timeframe here)"
It's really sad when we have so eager to see the Switch fail, like they'll get something out of it. And these same folks have the nerve to call themselves Nintendo fans. Crazy.
@PtM I wrote a bit here:
https://www.nintendolife.com/forums/nintendo-switch/doom?start=980#reply-992#reply-02
@PtM In short, 600p resolution in both modes (sometimes a bit lower), downgraded assets and visual effects, frame rate dips to the low 20s and bad frame pacing. Bad frame pacing means that each frame last an irregular length of time, causing judder.
@BlueOcean that's true but I'd also say that at the moment no major 3rd party games have been released and the reality is that lots of them haven't sold that well on consoles this year with much larger user bases.
Realistically what 3rd party games have we had? Fifa and NBA? Most people i know who play them do so with their friends online so were never going to change console for them, not to mention Fifa doesnt even let you play with your friends, something which EA put on Nintendo despite many games on Switch offering this and NBA wasn't even out physically to start with.
I agree it will have to prove itself for 3rd party sales but it can't do that until they come out in the first place, so the next few weeks will be interesting and for what it's worth Doom is already number 3 on the eshop charts on both side of the Atlantic
@kobashi100 Indeed. I also see the post-edit brigade is back in full force. First making a placeholder comment that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, then adding a picture and some additional text to reap some undeserved likes with a dumb@ss attempt at being funny.
@carlos82 We had a third-party game, Dragon Ball Xenoverse 2. The Nintendo Switch version debuted at number three on the Japanese sales charts, with 24,045 copies sold. It sold 70,000 units worldwide on Switch according to VGchartz. If somebody has better information please post it.
I agree about FIFA even though it's extremely popular in Europe and the Switch version has been a commercial failure in here, but considering your points I'll give you that.
Now we have two new games: Sonic Forces and Doom, but they have just been released so who knows.
It's nice talking with you, in between.
@BlueOcean
Yeh I appreciate that but their approach is all so clinical and cold and........mostly pointless because I have the game and can attest it is great fun and perfectly playable.
People are genuinely being put off games because their shadows aren't as sharp or the resolution is lower or doesn't use some kind of anti aliasing or something along those lines, and whether the game is actually fun and enjoyable doesn't count. I know Digital Foundry isn't there to review the games but I don't think anyone can deny their videos bring out the worst of fanyboyism (not that there is good fanboyism).
I will admit I am interested in games' framerates and in an ideal world all games would run at 60fps but a lot of the other stuff they go on about really doesn't matter. Plus as I said it's always a contest which brings out all the numptys.
Again all just my opinion.
@BlueOcean @carlos82 @subpopz @SBandy Many people have started being very pedantic about whether framerates are locked to 30 or 60fps since the Switch came out but you might be interested to find that MOST games on PS4 and Xbox One and especially those prior to 2017 were not locked to 30fps. Most of them try to target 30fps and most of them stutter from this as well. Ironic then that when a system which is clearly lower powered comes out that it's now that these people start to comment on whether it's good enough.
It just seems strange to me that you mention the 'main problem' is that it doesn't reach 30fps (I know the PS4 version of this game has 60fps), but here on Switch it really is dropping to something that many many other games drop to on other systems, and for those games, people have never seemed to have an issue until the Switch came out and people are rampantly stating 30/60 not good enough etc..
@subpopz Just one thing, performance affects controls, gameplay and thus enjoyment.
@SBandy Yes, since my first comment in here I said that I understand the downgraded visuals in a portable game but the performance issues are far more important, at least for me. I can still play Metroid Prime on my TV, I don't care about the textures, the game is smooth 60 fps.
In Doom (Switch) it's not a question of 30 or 60 but the dips and the bad frame pacing. The frame rate is not smooth and each frame last a different length of time. That is awful because it affects gameplay and enjoyment. This is not just my opinion but how this affects me as a gamer, but some people might be just fine with it.
@electrolite77
I have this on ps4 and now playing it on the same tv with my switch its obvious a lot of the negative posters here haven't. It still looks great.
@BlueOcean I'm curious have you actually played Doom on Switch? I've seen the DF video and I can't say it matches my own experience, yes the resolution means it's a bit fuzzy but I haven't noticed any frame pacing issues which bugged me on FFXV for example. So far 3 levels in its felt fast, smooth and responsive both on the TV and handheld and I previously played it on PS4 so have some form of comparison
@electrolite77 have played on my high end pc and still bought the switch version and I'm loving it
@BlueOcean who is going to be competing with it? The vita is dead and the 3ds is almost done. Has Sony announced a portable? Where exactly do you think portable users are going to go?
@BlueOcean "I love many Nintendo franchises but I am aware of how little Nintendo cares about them. They even said 2D Mario games sell much better than 3D Mario games so we are focusing on 2D Mario games. This was during the New Super Mario Bros. boom until New Super Mario Bros. U failed (according to them). They only care about the franchises that make money."
Isn't that a logical thing to do? They focus on making games that most people want. I don't think New Super Mario Bros. U is a failure. It sold 5.73 million copies. Do you have a source?
Also, Nintendo doesn't only care about their best-selling games. If that had been the case, Splatoon and Splatoon 2 wouldn't have existed, and Nintendo wouldn't have been making Metroid Prime 4.
@BlueOcean it is true the performance can effect gameplay but having played through the first two levels the 'bad' graphics and framerate have not kept me from killing demons and having a blast doing so. There have been two times the sound stopped working and that made it not feel well to move around and do things. Hopefully there is a patch for this soon.
I have only played docked so far.
@FTL Well, talking about myself, I've always complained about performance issues on any console since last generation. It's not because it's Switch. And it's not because it's 30fps, even though Doom is a fast-paced game that is best played at 60fps. If you watch the video you will see that when a few enemies appear on screen the frame rate goes down irregularly and not only that but the frame pace is irregular as well.
@BlueOcean having played the game I can say I've not noticed anything pointed out in that video regarding frame rate in docked and un.
@FTL I never said it was a problem, I've put many posts praising how well the game plays on Switch.
@BlueOcean do you believe most wiiu 3ds owners are going to give up on gaming entirely or move exclusively to Sony/ms/pc?
@KryptoKrunch you notice how they keep moving the goal posts every single time they see there bold predictions fall flat as a pancake.
@BlueOcean you seem to have a lot on your plate here tonight, I'll be back to discuss 3rd party sales next week 😉
@BlueOcean
I appreciate 'what I do' may be inconvenient to some, but accuracy is important. If, for example, quoting what CEOs are saying to their investors rather than the notoriously unreliable VGChartz puts a stop to a false narrative, good. That the false narratives seem to come from the same group of names over and over is a bonus.
As for their IPs, of course there are no guarantees Nintendo will handle them right. However the narrative you were chasing was that Nintendo may lose momentum because they can't put Mario and Zelda out every year. My point is they have a lot of big name IP (unfortunately for us F-Zero isn't a big seller) left to use and don't need to.
@BlueOcean @gatorboi352 Let's see how it turns out next year before making such predictions. It's true that 1st year performance is not indicative of long term outlook, but we need to get through the 2nd year before sales trends start becoming apparent.
That said, there is one trend that I predict will happen: Over half of all NS owners will continue to keep their systems at home most of the time instead of primarily using it in public, due to the combo of Nintendo's marketing/labeling strategy and Western culture. And it will continue to be a world wonder how so many people found out the system even exists, mostly through internet word of mouth.
Got the game last night and it realy dose look amazing, I couldn't count the pixels for anyone but thats not why we play games ...... is it?🤔
I do have one very big problem with the game and thats the controls, no gyo aming its like running with one leg I don't know how people can play like this
@BlueOcean That's a good point on the frame times. Lots of people talk about resolution and frame rates, but accurate recording and analysis of frame times is a relatively new metric to many. Having steady and consistent frame times is just as important as minimum frame rates up to 60FPS, and more important than maximum frame rates when going above 60FPS. (For example, the NS version of DOOM fails to absolutely stay locked at 30 FPS no matter what happens, meaning it's got worse frame time consistency during heavy action. Definitely bad news.)
@BlueOcean
That is fair enough, framerates are very important I agree there. I have put a good few hours into Doom today both docked and handheld and apart from a few minor drips in the framerate the game has been very nice to play and that is with the blur turned off.
I have always said game makers should start at 60fps and build their game around that. This is an instance where it isn't possible without stripping away too much of the game it already was but I am more than content with the game Panic Button have made here. Doom is great fun and I am happy with my purchase.
Digital Foundry, intentions noble as they may be, brings out the worst in the gaming community and that is why I won't be paying much attention to them in the future.
Happy gaming!
@kobashi100 @KryptoKrunch
"Can read between the lines. They are desperate to see the switch fail"
You don't even have to read between the lines. It's obvious they (and we all know who I mean) are desperate. Over-exaggerating any negativity, playing-down or ignoring anything that contradicts the failure narrative. They're fun though, it's like boxing with somebody who misses every punch.
@carlos82 Yeah LOL I'm overwhelmed and I have to go sleep with a smile...
Last comment for the day (for everybody):
Firstly, it is just my opinion that Switch sales will go down next year and up again for a while after a price reduction. I might be wrong, of course! That's why it's called opinion.
Secondly, Switch support and life. After Wii (didn't get games in the last years) and Wii U I don't really trust Nintendo to support a console for a long period of time. Makes sense, right? I was disappointed with Nintendo. I have the right to.
Secondly, about Doom, the performance issues is my only complaint, I have said the same thing since my first comment and I think I explained it quite decently. It is a great portable shooter? Yes. Do I care about downgraded visuals in a handheld? No (even though Switch is also for playing on TV). Do I care about repeated frame rate dips and bad frame pacing? Yes.
So good night and thanks to the nice people (you know who you are).
@SBandy
You've got the right idea with DF. If you're not interested, ignore it. It's funny to go on any DF article and see people in the comments complaining that they're overanalysing technical intricacies.
That's what they do.
I like their stuff but it's never changed my opinion on a game. I just find it interesting.
Oh and absolutely right, Panic Button have done a great job and deserve a lot of credit.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE so you finally stopped whining and bought a Switch!
Or are your comments still just theoretical and based on bitterness for the perceived personal slant Nintendo has against you?
If only there was a different forum for your comments. I know you’re a long-time gamer, but you’re now getting tiresome and it’s time to move on
@SBandy It might be just your opinion, but I reckon it's far too sensible for at least a small handful of the people currently burdening this site with their endless stream of negative, unfounded bile, annoying the people that actually come here to enjoy themselves talking about their hobby...
But good to see that there are still people that understand what playing games should REALLY be all about.
It's nice to hear the positive remarks from those who actually own the Switch version. Still waiting on Amazon to get my copy. I expect I'll have fun with Doom in spite of its technical flaws. It's unfortunate that so much focus is given to performance over fun with videogames. It never used to be an issue as long as the game was fun.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE That's a pretty interesting observation for the box art... Every other version just has a full body portrait of Doom Guy, looking straight at you, all badass and dominant, but the NS version's boxart makes him look like he's getting overwhelmed. (Kind of like what happens to the hardware when the NS is playing DOOM!)
That being said, I do like the NS version's box art a lot more. It's more interesting, since it depicts an intense struggle rather than simply appealing to a power fantasy, and it reminds me of 80's/90's era box art. When I look at the PC/PS4/XB1 box art, it makes me think, "What does this guy need my help for? He looks like he will be just fine without me!" When I look at the NS boxart, though, I think, "...I want to help DOOM Guy defeat his demons!"
They did a pretty good job with it but I'm hoping for a patch later on down the line that locks it at 30fps. If it never happens, I still applaud Bethesda for bringing the game over.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE That's how I feel about getting it on Switch, as much as I wanted to get it on Switch, I was looking on Amazon and found it for $40 cheaper on PS4 and am now tempted to get that version instead.
I own Doom on PC, and I'm happy to have it on Switch too. I keep experiencing issues with shadow quality slowing the game to a crawl on PC in lots of sections where a major environment change occurs. It requires minimizing and alt tabbing, and sometimes changes in shader settings to fix it.
The Switch version has an odd audio bug that causes audio to drop out. Of much rather have that issue.
As for resolution, the PS4 and Xbox One had dynamic resolution set and would frequently drop below 1080p there too. I honestly don't mind the performance of Doom on the Switch. The shadows can be pixelated and the textures have issues up close, but it still looks impressive. The frame rate is very solid and I am happy to be playing this on the Joycons. I don't understand what people are complaining about for controls for the game, although I do have a history of playing FPS games on older systems and running at 15 to 24 FPS, so maybe my experience in games is different.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE a lot of sacrifices to run the box art?
My analysis, based on Platinuming the game on PS4, and now having played half the campaign on Switch: it's stupid fun, and pixel counters and FPS snobs are missing the entire point.
@PlywoodStick The original box art was criticized. The version the Switch uses is the secondary cover for the game. I think I heard you can reverse the Xbox one and PS4 box art and you get the same design.
@daveh30 it reminds me of my memories playing the GBA versions of Doom 1 and 2 on GBA.
@ThanosReXXX
Cheers!
@ballistic90 Oh yeah, you're right!
Much better. I guess whoever came up with the bright idea to use the other, infinitely more bland box cover was listening too much to bad marketing advice.
@subpopz
Haha, man, whats your problem with Digital Foundry? You are wondering why they don't tell you if the game is fun to play, if the story is any good? Well, it's because DF is about analyze the tech in games and hardware, just as the name suggest. If you want to read the review of the game, you read Euro Gamers review. How hard can it be to understand that?
@gatorboi352
"It's going to be an ugly day (spoiler alert: next spring) when Switch sales fall off a cliff."
I can't wait to see this exact same comment in November 2018, in reference to Spring 2019.
I'll go even farther and say that I can't wait to see this exact same comment in November 2019, in reference to Spring 2020.
I really don't know what to think about this comment section. I would almost swear there are people that get off on wanting others to fail.
@BlueOcean Bandai Namco said that Dragon Ball Xenoverse 2 has shipped over 400000 copies.
gaming is not about fps and resolutions, it's about fun and interesting concepts, at least for me.
@BlueOcean
" They only care about the franchises and genres that make money. Where is F-Zero? Remember when they said that you don't need Wave Race because you have a mini game in Wii Sports Resort? They only care about the franchises and genres that make money. Where is F-Zero? Remember when they said that you don't need Wave Race because you have a mini game in Wii Sports Resort?"
Hahaha, thats a strange thing to write. Ofc they want games that makes money, I dont think they work for free in Japan either, lol.
For me personally doom on the switch is fine. I love it! Much rather have this doom than no doom! So much fun!!!
@BlueOcean Even though I don't completely agree with all you say, I can still appreciate the way you express your opinion and the time you take to at least explain why you think about things a certain way, which is a lot more commendable than just slapping down some mindless negative drivel in the comments section to fan the flames of discussion.
I also understand the whole performance thing, and of course there are certain things that games benefit from, smoothness and/or responsiveness being one of them, but although even back in the SNES days, 60fps was definitely a goal for some genres, it certainly wasn't as overwhelmingly demanded as it is now.
Like someone else already mentioned, games are now first and foremost judged on resolution and frame rate, instead of also on story, aesthetics and gameplay. The latter does overlap with frame rate somewhat, but overall, the two most predominant demands in modern day gaming are actually the two that should be additional demands, NOT the other way around.
And another thing is that if even the developers themselves go out of their way to explain how they have done everything they can to still make this game feel like actually playing Doom, regardless of that lower frame rate and resolution, I find it truly appalling that so many people can just continue to be critical of it, saying it had to look or perform better, while the developers did all they can with what they had at their disposal, which is actually something to applaud, NOT to criticize.
If you want something better, play another version, or buy a game PC. The Switch can't do better in it's current form and at it's current price rate. For it to reach even close to other console's graphics, you'd need hardware that's going to at the very least be 100 - 150 dollars/euros more expensive than the current iteration.
Taking into account that some people are already complaining about the current price of the Switch, I'd truly wonder if they would be willing to pay that much more to be able to get those better graphics that they so desperately seem to want.
And talking about cost, another unfounded criticism is that the Switch version is too expensive (obviously, because: old game, bad graphics, dòh) but that is so far off the mark, it isn't even funny anymore.
As a sales & marketing professional, I can tell you EXACTLY why that price is what it is, and some other smart people will even be able to come to the same conclusion without being in my line of business, but here goes:
The Switch version, for all intents and purposes, is a NEW release. The investments made to develop, manufacture and market are still to be earned back. Besides that, there's also the retailer's cut, since these people also need to make a profit to put bread on the table.
You cannot, and I repeat: cannot compare a version of the same game, that has already been on the market for well over a year, and which has already gone through that entire trajectory (thus already having made the necessary earnings and profits) with a version that is fresh off the conveyor belt, regardless of it being of a lower resolution and/or frame rate.
Those two things should never be included in any consideration of where the price point is concerned, but unfortunately, it is the standard excuse for not buying it, or criticizing it, which is deeply, deeply sad.
People always complained about third party support on the Wii and on the Wii U, and now that it seems to come in continuously growing amounts, it's STILL not good enough. Those same people will, with their sickening behavior, potentially be the very reason that third party support will once again tank on a Nintendo platform, and then all of us will have lost, in a sense.
The fact that these games are coming to the Switch (in this case from developers that haven't even touched a Nintendo platform in ages), and are even fun to play if you don't adhere to tunnel-visioned comparisons, is a miracle in itself, and should be widely supported, because developers will be watching the results.
In any case, it's up to all parties to guarantee success. So Nintendo needs to keep up momentum, and those third party titles going by keeping lines open with said parties. The third parties need to talk to Nintendo about bigger cartridges for the same price (sorry, pet peeve of mine, had to put that in) and we the consumers need to reward the efforts and not criticize every fart that blows through the ether, and for a lot of people the advise should also be: have your own voice instead of parroting what's "cool" or what you think you should say.
It's okay to like Nintendo, even though they definitely do have their faults, but their games are still massively entertaining, even at my age...
P.S.
Sorry for the wall of text, but I just HAD to touch upon all these points, so it was almost impossible to make it any shorter...
I’ll be passing just because I don’t like the game itself. Too much gore for me.
I wish there was a demo for me to check out before I decide to pick this up. I'm confident I'll like the game, but I want to see how it actually feels to play on the Switch.
Got the game yesterday. My thoughts:
They definitely had to make some compromises to get this game running. But it's still the exact same game and I'm having a ton of fun playing it. I played deathmatch with bots, and it was so fun I had a hard time putting it down and going to work. Thankfully the system is portable so I just took it with me and played more once I got there.
My only real complaint would be the resolution. It definitely takes a hit and there's no denying that. But it still looks pretty good, and looks fantastic on the handheld. When you're playing the game you're not thinking about anything else other than how much fun you're having. It runs smooth and it looks good and controls well.
I would say if you don't value portability you're probably better off getting one of the other versions. But if you want to play a good FPS on the go, there is no other hand held FPS that even remotely challenges DOOM on Switch. The best we had to date were those two horrible Resistance and CoD Vita games, that rickety old Borderlands 2 port, and the decent Killzone Mercenary. DOOM on Switch takes me back to the good old days of FPS on Vita, only this time it's arguably the best FPS game ever created, has all the buttons and far better analog joysticks... and it's most definitely the best handheld FPS to date.
DOOM on Switch is a blast, an absolute blast to play on Nintendo Switch. I set it up in table top mode and was playing at work on my desk and even passed the joy con to my coworkers and let them play for a bit. I couldn't get over the fact I was enjoying DOOM... at my work. I can't wait for Wolfenstein 2 now!
@justin233
I'm not really big on blood and gore myself but it's not nearly as grotesque when you're playing on the Switch handheld screen. Just the fact that the graphics are toned down a bit and it's a smaller screen, it seems much more palatable in my opinion.
@HyliasHero
I have the game on Xbox One X, and Switch. It's definitely toned down graphically but it still looks great. I mean compared to other Switch games it's right there at the top of the list as far as visuals are concerned. My one complaint is the resolution. It's not a dealbreaker it's just a minor criticism I guess. You can tell it's not as sharp as the other versions. But when you're playing on the handheld screen it's really hard to notice. Honestly it feels like you're playing the same game as on Xbox one in the palm of your hands. It plays great and it runs smooth and there's tons of sensitivity and control options for you to adjust to your liking, turn smoothing and all that.
@PlywoodStick
First year sales absolutely are indicative of the platform's outlook.
No platform has ever sold well in Year 1 (15+ million units) only for sales to completely collapse during Year 2 and beyond, to the point where lifetime sales are just double its Year 1 sales like what Gatoboi keeps predicting.
Doom on Switch is a decent but compromised experience, no doubt, but there aren't enough people who religiously follow Digital Foundry to care about its technical performance to a degree that hurts Bethesda/Nintendo's bottom line.
Hey at least its the same game. They didnt remove any levels or anything like that. Plus the issue with switch in my mind isn't its power, but the memory that the switch comes with. Just dismal.
@ballistic90 No the box art was a joke and the statement after was separate and about the game.
@BlueOcean
His "vision" was originally that Switch would "fail even harder than Wii U". Clearly that's not happening. Now the goalposts have moved. Please don't tell me you're this same type of person that's just going to predict doom and failure for the console, and then when you're proven wrong move the goalposts once again.
Third party games are all doing fantastic on Switch. Maybe you haven't kept up with the headlines but third-party games are all exceeding expectations. Capcom with Ultra Street Fighter II over 500,000 sold, and MHXX (a port of a 6 month old game that was already an expansion of a 2 year old game, on a system with just 2 million users) has now hit 350,000 and that's just physically. Bandai Namco have shipped over 400,000 copies of DB Xenoverse 2, exceeding sales of the Xbox One version on a platform with less than 8 million users. And a port at that. Marvelous happy with sales of Fate Extella. TakeTwo says they're happy with sales of NBA 2K18, Koei Tecmo and Square Enix also happy, and all of these developers are now ramping up Switch support going forward. Even indie games are consistently selling more on Switch than all other platforms combined.
And Switch will sell based on its concept, Zelda Breath of the Wild, Mario Odyssey, Mario Kart 8 and Splatoon 2 the rest of this generation. They could literally not release a single other headliner game and the Switch would continue to sell based on those things alone. But it's going to also have Pokémon. It's going to have Kirby. It's going to have Metroid Prime. It's going to have Fire Emblem. Dragon Quest. Yoshi. Wolfenstein. Monster Hunter (guaranteed, I'd be shocked if we didn't see at least two new portable entries on Switch). It will have Smash Bros. Xenoblade. SMT. It's going to get a 2D Mario (surely). It's going to get new IP (watch out for Retro Studios in 2018). It's going to get a significant influx of third-party games- and you'd be surprised but some of those smaller games fill genre gaps that people are looking for when buying a console. And they will surely continue to release Pokémon games every 2 years keeping momentum strong, they will surely port a Zelda game, release a second Mario, and ultimately even release a second Zelda game. There's going to be plenty of games keeping the momentum going. But even if it didn't, the Switch is selling based on it's year one library for years to come. The concept and core set of games are too appealing. Price drop a few years from now will also help keep momentum.
But more than that, why does this even need to get brought up? We are here to talk about DOOM. A game which a lot of people love and which a lot of people are happy to be playing on a handheld system now. You are free to your personal beliefs, but this isn't the time or place for "Switch will fail" conversation. It seems to me some people simply want Switch to fail. And will predict whatever aligns with that viewpoint. And, conveniently want to bring it up whenever they see another notch carved into Switch's belt. As if DOOM on Switch makes people feel insecure. But even if you were right though. So what? Its success is out of our hands, so can we just talk about enjoying it while it's here rather than constantly trying to remind everyone it's going to fail? Whatever happens happens. In the meantime, let's talk about some video games, shall we?
Great video. Almost picked this up yesterday. I feel they should have released it at a lower price point. I feel it would really boast the sales. It does have comprises, which on this hybrid portable system I overlook, but at full price I couldn't bring myself to pick it up.
@westman98 "First year sales absolutely are indicative of the platform's outlook."
Not necessarily. The first year on both the DS and 3DS weren't anything to write home about, but they took off into the stratosphere after their second year and beyond. The Dreamcast performed excellently for it's time during it's first year, but it couldn't save SEGA from their own upper management problems. On a smaller time frame scale, the first couple of months of the Wii U made it seem like it would be another smash hit, but it fell off a cliff immediately at the turn of 2013, recovered slightly in 2015, then died down again, with BotW being the last gasp. Fortunes can turn positive or negative for reasons that are not necessarily fully apparent during the first year. I can't recall how many times throughout the years I read the phrase "the first year is not indicative of the final result" back in the days of print magazines...
They've done a great job with doom. Hell looks nearly the same as last year
Everybody, I am letting you know, you don't have to listen to critics. Some critics are biased about some games they review. It all comes down about how you feel about the game. I played doom and thought it was terrific.
The way Digital Foundry bang on in this video, you'd think they were comparing the arcade version of Mortal Kombat II to the Game Boy version.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE You think the box art is a joke and the game is a statement?
@ThanosReXXX "In any case, it's up to all parties to guarantee success."
@JaxonH "It's success is out of our hands, so can we just talk about enjoying it while it's here rather than constantly trying to remind everyone it's going to fail?"
Ooh, now I'm imagining Action Jaxon Pikmin and Thanosaurus Rexes duking it out for some reason... Even though I know you two are on the same page!
@SLIGEACH_EIRE third parties only care about money. And if their game is gonna sell sell on Switch, they dont care how much work they have to do.
LOL at people using Vgchartz as evidence that "3rd party games on Switch aren't selling well."
@PlywoodStick
First month sales are not indicative of a platform's success. The Wii U and Dreamcast both performed respectably during their launch periods, but sales completely collapsed after the first month or so, and things never recovered. Both consoles sold poorly during their first year.
On the other hand, Both the DS and 3DS sold very well during their first year on the market (14+ million units). Obviously, the release of the DS Lite took the DS to the stratosphere in 2006 and beyond, but its sales in 2004/2005 were still very good.
The Switch is projected to sell nearly 17 million units by March 2018. There is no situation where Switch sales completely drop-off next year to the point where it only sells 30-40 million units lifetime. Doom's technical performance certainly won't be a catalyst for a change in sales trajectory.
@PlywoodStick
I thinks Thanos is speaking more to the contributing factors that ultimately determine a console's success or failure. Which, on a macro level, the consumers are a contributing factor. I think one of the things that hurt Wii U was consumers (as a whole) didn't support 3rd party games. And as a result the support stopped. Whereas on Switch, consumers actually are supporting those games. I think it comes down to the portability and 3 version in 1 nature of every game released- people actually have a reason to double dip, or choose Switch over other versions, but more so than that I think the core fanbase is finally being a little more cavalier with their purchasing dollars, as opposed to strictly sticking with 1st party games. I've noticed a "personal responsibility" mindset where fans want to support 3rd party games and do their part in seeing support continue, and thus far it's paid off.
I still say we duke it out though. Just for the epic showdown of Pikmin vs T-Rex 😆
@westman98 Oh, that's right! It was first month not being indicative, not first year! My bad. Thanks for reminding me, that was a pretty bad memory lapse on my part.
And yeah, vgchartz never tells you the whole story. I don't know why anyone links towards it as "evidence" to this day.
@JaxonH Oh... I see... But can your Pikmin... Do a barrel roll!?
Of course it needed compromises.
They brought us DOOM (or Doom 2016) on Switch, so hooray for compromises!
@PlywoodStick
I do wonder (in an alternative universe) what the narrative would be if Doom was a Nintendo exclusive (so it could only be compared to itself). I think then the resolution and frame rate issues would be more of an aside rather than such a focus.
Do XB1 and PS4 games that have run 900p (or below) with dips to 20 fps get more of a free pass (eg. in comparison to a 4K 60fps on PC version)?
I might try doom. I’ve never played it before, but playing on a handheld is a huge bonus, so that might actually make it worth my time.
I’ll still get it, getting it today in fact. Portable mode is all I really play anyway. I don’t have a PS4 so I won’t miss anything. If current gen games are too taxing, there are still plenty of last gen games that would look good remastered on the Switch. Still counting on GTA 5 to make an appearance.
@PlywoodStick Sorry to disappoint you there, buddy. JaxonH is probably the last one to be able to ruffle my feathers, even though I don't necessarily agree with everything he says, but that feeling is probably mutual.
@Devlind A "Pro-dock" is a horrible idea, because it means hurting what makes the Switch unique. You know, the whole ability to play it docked, play it handheld, and play it in tablet mode? Once you throw a "pro-dock" into the mix, you now have games that run only in docked mode, and that are literally non-functional if removed from the dock.
My only concern is playing on the joycons, I hear there is no gyro aiming and it’s better on a pro controller... I hope they add gyro aiming in a patch latter on.
Although I have a PS4 PRO I’m still considering getting this version. I want to support Bethesda and the other AAA developers as much as I can on Switch and I also feel like DOOM will be perfect for short play sessions on my commutes to and from work.
Jaysis, people. Chill. It actually runs fine. The frame dips are way overblown by most of the people here. There's a reason it's getting decent-to-good scores in all its critical reviews.
@JaxonH "But it still looks pretty good, and looks fantastic on the handheld. When you're playing the game you're not thinking about anything else other than how much fun you're having. It runs smooth and it looks good and controls well."
You hit the nail on the head and captured the essence. And that is the ONLY thing that should count and the only thing that is important. Is it fun to play? Yes, it is. Is it the only way to play Doom on the go? Yes it is.
Well then, here you go: the Switch version of Doom. Enjoy...
@DizzyDee81 : It plays surprisingly well considering the lack of gyro controls (and I too am bummed that it wasn't included). Aiming's obviously not the best simply due to the nature of the controls, but the difficulty (at least the easiest) is forgiving enough that you can afford to make a few blunders without experiencing an adverse consequences. My main issue is with the glory kills/melee attacks (which require pressing the right control stick) which occasionally causes the camera to point upward when I miss, which is quite disorienting and can possibly result in some cheap deaths as the difficulty ramps up later in the game.
@ThanosReXXX
I'd been craving a good handheld FPS for years. I bought and played all the Vita FPS games. Resistance, Call of Duty, Borderlands 2, Killzone Mercenary... until now that was the best there was. Which is pretty lame, if you ask me. Killzone was by far the best choice- The first two were just absolutely horrible games that were developed in just 6 months- they weren't ports either, they were entire games built from the ground up in 6 months. And Borderlands 2 had horrible pop-in, 15fps stuttering gameplay and lacked enough buttons so actions were mapped to zones on the rear touchpad and touchscreen. You had to purposely extend your fingers stiffly outwards so as to not accidentally make contact with the backside of the handheld as you played... ugh, it was so insanely aggravating. Constantly crouching or zooming your weapon on accident because your middle finger barely grazed the back of the handheld (you know, the thing you normally grip as you play). Killzone was the only one that offered a solid experience. It wasn't the best game, but it was the best there was. You still had actions mapped to the touchscreen and the Vita analogue sticks were still way too small to aim properly, and the game itself wasn't exceptional... but for what it was it was a solid experience.
But DOOM on Switch? This game is light years ahead of everything that's come before it in terms of handheld FPS. This is the pinnacle of portable first person shooters. I can't believe I'm having this kind of experience on the go. FPS is the one genre that you're really couldn't find an exceptional games for on a portable system. Aside from the one example of Killzone which, even that was mediocre. But now, that dream has finally become a reality. Switch carries the torch for Vita, and finally realizes what it set out to do all those years ago.
I am absolutely stoked for Wolfenstein 2 now. And I imagine that game will look and run even better since they already have a 7th gen version of the first game to build on. I'm not sure if they would have to remake assets but I'm sure they can use that to their advantage in some capacity when developing the game.
I bought it yesterday on Amazon US so I won’t be able to play for two or three weeks until it arrives (along with Skyrim) and I can say I’m desperate to get my hands on it as soon as possible.
I couldn’t care less about numbers. Resolution, frame rate... whatever, if the game plays well and it’s fun, that’s ALL I care about in a game and I’m sure this game it’s going to be awesome.
It’s very sad how people need to be told if they’re having fun by some pointless numbers.
The game isn’t fun but it’s 4K 60fps, oh my god it’s awesome!
The game is lot of fun but it’s only 30fps and with average graphics... how can people even play this piece of crap?
That two sentences above resume today’s gamers way of thinking.
Pretty sad.
@JaxonH There's something I've been pondering recently, and I'm curious to get a bit of feedback about it. This is just a bit of speculation, not intended to be an argument, but to be tested to see if it might become one.
I recently read somewhere, can't remember where, that the PS4 is surpassing historical trends by having an attach rate over its lifetime to date of about 7.5. That's consistent with other numbers I've generally heard, that most consoles have a lifetime attach rate of between five and six games. I've long argued that people who spend a large amount of time commenting on fan sites don't represent the average consumer, as these numbers would be proof of that; because if you know anything at all about statistical distributions, you know that for every person who owns 14 Switch games (me) or more (didn't you at last count own, like, all of them?) there are thousands upon thousands who own one, two, or three. Think of how many people bought a Wii and owned exactly one game, the one that came with it. Think of my friend who buys one game a year, the new Madden. These are the people Nintendo is trying to reach, and they're the ones who will determine how well it continues to sell.
So what am I getting at? Namely, that for as obvious as it might be that software sells hardware, it just might not be true, or at least not as true as it first seems. If you're going to buy a system but only get a game or two for it, you won't care whether or not there's a new AAA game every month, or a new indie every week, or a virtual console, or some critical mass of must-play titles. Something else must be behind your purchasing decision, and the appeal of the system itself has to be part of that. Switch's appeal has been demonstrated, and part of Nintendo keeping momentum will be to keep looking for those people who would like it and be content to buy Odyssey and MK8D or Splatoon 2, and selling to them, because not everyone one, believe it or not, even knows what the Switch is, or that Zelda launched with it, or that Odyssey is out. But a lot of people, once they know, will be more than happy to jump on board.
As I said, this is me pretty much just testing out some thoughts. Sorry if I wasted your time, but it seemed like you'd as receptive to these ideas and as able to critique them as anyone. And if you know of anyone else who might be interested or who needs their time wasted, feel free to tag them too.
I'm enjoying Doom on Nintendo Switch. I am looking forward to more AAA third party games on Switch.
It's going to sell well, and it's generated a heap of media for Nintendo, Bethesda, Doom and the Switch.
The port was done externally, which means it's a fairly simple dollars tradeoff.
Win win. While everyone sits here complaining about specs, everyone else is actually playing games and having fun.
Have fun 😀
@JaxonH Reading that comment reminds me of another thing that genuinely bothers me: how is it that only Nintendo gets slammed for sub-par frame rates and resolutions, but everyone else gets away with it, apparently due to uber-loyal or blind fan bases?
It annoys me to no end, and it's a continuing source of senseless discussion and debate, for whatever reason.
Even worse is that some people in those discussions aren't even in possession of these games or the hardware that it plays on, but still feel that, based upon online reviews and badly compressed YouTube videos, they are perfectly able to judge and condemn these games.
Now, if you knew me, then you'd know that I'm a VERY patient and social person, but things like this can really make my blood boil, because I simply can't stand injustice and stupidity.
You, on the other hand, compare from experience, which far as I'm concerned, is the only right way to make any comparison. And you elaborately describe what's what and in the end, the conclusion is clear and warranted, whichever side of the coin ends up on top.
I'll reserve my own judgment until I actually have my own Switch (hopefully around the holidays) and I'll actually be able to play it, but rest assured that I'll buy both Doom and Wolfenstein, if only to show my appreciation for Bethesda for making the considerable effort to bring these titles to the Switch.
@JaxonH I guess the thing is, in this case as well, many members of the tech press (including Digital Foundry) are good at digging for information, but they're not always very good at contextualizing that information and analyzing what it all means. Sometimes they even go overboard and overemphasize some issues at certain times, as others here have mentioned, since that draws more hits. By comparison, Digital Foundry previously made this video previewing DOOM on NS:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=74&v=cXxDKgqBWXA
If you didn't know it was made by someone at DF, who could tell it was even from the same outlet? The tone and focus is very different from the one linked in this article.
In that DF preview, they're showering praise and wondering how a portable version like this exists at all. Ultimately, a PC specced as closely as possible to an NS, with as similar settings as possible, simply cannot run DOOM as well as an NS. Technical wizardry techniques were used by Panic Button (the company Bethesda farmed development of the port out to) that aren't among the aspects typically recorded by benchmarking tools. To compound that, it's become an unfortunate trend in the tech press to have very incomplete (or sometimes even outright inaccurate) benchmarking criteria and variables.
A notorious recent example is the huge range of results among the tech press with testing the recently released Coffee Lake CPU lineup's performance, some of which were the result of honest mistakes, but none of which told the whole story: different motherboards and their settings can now end up yielding completely different performance results with the same CPU. Which also means a low- or mid- range motherboard can now be a performance bottleneck. Combined with what is essentially a paper launch, since almost no one can actually get their hands on Coffee Lake CPU's at the moment, it's a veritable con job. The tech press is supposed to be a check/balance when this happens, but that didn't happen in this case. Someone in the general public had to do detective work to figure out how and why this had happened, and inform the tech press members about it.
The moral of the story is, you can't rely on the tech press to give you all the details.
"Switch won't be able to play current gen ports", welp doom looks like it's playing just fine boys.. 2017 handheld doom. Maybe cause Im 32 and grew up with a brick to play super Mario 6 golden coins , no backlight , had to angle the game boy in the sun just to play , boo hoo frame rate dips , a few bugs or glitches never ruined my day in 95, 05, or 2017, current gen ports in handheld , yes please .
@PlywoodStick
I enjoy watching tech videos, just out of curiosity most of the time. But one thing I know is that you could have a laundry list of technical criticisms that sound absolutely unforgivable and egregious, but when you sit down and just play the game, it works. It's super fun and it looks good enough and it plays good enough and that big long laundry list of critiques just falls by the way side. So many people now will say "sub 60fps is absolutely unacceptable, no exceptions" and I just have to scratch my head because while there's no question it's better when I'm playing this game right now I'm loving it and having a blast. Think it even has some drops below 30 but the honest truth is I haven't really noticed anything. I do think too much focus has been put on the technical side, when at the end of the day if you simply put a Switch in somebody's hand with DOOM on it, they would be hard-pressed to not have a good time.
I also see this with comparisons between X1X and PS4 Pro. Both excellent consoles offering similar experiences. But Wolfenstein 2 runs at 2160p (4K) on X1X while only running 1440p on PS4. The comment section is like World War III. People claiming the pro is a waste of time and a joke, etc etc. and I'm thinking look, there's no question it looks better on the X, but if you put a controller in my hand for the PS4 version I wouldn't give a crap. It's still a fun game regardless of its shortcomings. People focus too much on the technical side of things. Ironically they then turned a blind eye when something happens on their console of choice. W2 drops to 50fps on both consoles. But you better believe had it only dropped to 50fps on one console and not the other, the fanboys of the other would have been all over it, like a shark smelling blood. DOOM on Xbox One dropped to 40fps, 45fps, 50fps, and everything in between. But that's apparently OK. But they'll turn around and criticize a game on PS4 or Switch for dropping 5 frames. It's crazy.
@ThanosReXXX
You don't have a Switch yet? Oh man, you're gonna love it. Really, you're going to love it. Don't get me wrong I love all my consoles. Xbox One X just arrived the other day. It's a fantastic piece of hardware that offers a superior experience for multiplat games. It's not perfect- there's really not many exclusives but, that's its strength- superior multiplats, and there's a lot of good multiplats. As for PS4 Pro, its exclusives and VR. It's not perfect- The multiplats are not as good as on X1 and the controller isn't that good, the VR Move don't have analogs, etc. but that's its strength- exclusives and VR. And finally I have Switch. It offers a fantastic hybrid experience- superior handheld gameplay and competent home console experience with terrific exclusives and handheld versions of multiplats. It's not perfect- multiplats are inferior on home console compared to Xbox and PS, and the voice chat is subpar, but that's its strength. Exclusives and portable/hybrid versions of multiplats.e
@JimmySpades
I'm not sure what the attach rates are, but I do know more than a little about statistical distributions. And yes, there's going to be the mean and the standard deviation aka spread. I'd be really interested to get some actual statistical data like that on not just Switch, but all consoles.
I think what you said has a lot of merit, and it kind of goes to my point of what I was saying earlier about these year one games selling the system for years to come. A lot of people do only by a system and get one or two games for it. A lot of those people make that decision not based on new releases, but on the appeal of the system itself and one or two games that appeals to them- no matter how long ago it released.
I do actually think Nintendo is trying to market to actual gamers this time though. Not necessarily the kind of gamers like you and me- obviously us too, but gamers who have maybe lapsed. Gamers who, maybe played video games as a kid but never really got into them after that. Many of the people I know who bought the system weren't the kind of gamer which visits fansites. One of them hadn't owned a console since the N64? Another one was a hard-core gamer but on Xbox One. Two were actually Xbox gamers. Another had a PS4 but gamed casually. So a lot of the people I see buying the system are actually core gamers and I don't really see them chasing that Wii crowd anymore. However, despite the fact I think they know those casuals have moved on to smartphones, I think they're going to pull in as many of them as they can with 1-2 Switch type software. And maybe it won't necessarily be Wii casuals, but rather females, technology fans, ya know, other subgroups and demographics. I was just watching a YouTube video from a woman who has a tech channel and she was doing a video on the Nintendo Switch, and mentioned playing 1-2 Switch. And that's when I realized the game might not be for me but there are technology nuts out there who it might appeal to.
In the end though, I think a lot of the install base is going to come from PlayStation and Xbox and PC gamers who are looking for something more to help sustain their gaming regimen. Gamers who maybe are growing a little bit tired of the same thing, gamers who maybe want something different and were looking for an excuse to buy into Nintendo but until now, simply couldn't find a reason. Gamers who maybe want to start enjoying their time with video games when they're not at home.
@ThanosReXXX Save your appreciation for Panic Button, they're the ones who did most of the hard work.
@PlywoodStick Well, I'll appreciate both of them then: Bethesda for making it happen and Panic Button for their wonderful conversion skills...
@JaxonH Yeah, as of the last two generations, I've been late to the party: I'm almost ashamed to tell that I never even had a Wii U until December last year, and I still have to buy SO many more titles for that, but personal circumstances (and lack of surplus finances) have completely taken over my life, so I wasn't able to do what I had planned this past year.
Still, if all goes well and as planned, that Switch will be sitting in this living room before the end of this year, and after that either the Xbox One S or the X will also follow. I haven't been collecting all those free "Games with Gold"' titles for nothing...
@JimmySpades @JaxonH If I had to guess, based on current sales, the current average attach rate is somewhere between 3 and 4 right now. Coupled with having several million/multi-million sellers already, that's very good for being at the 2/3 mark of the first year. It'll probably rise to between at least 4 and 5 during the holidays... unless people go ballistic slamming the stores and it rises to between 5 and 6, which wouldn't be surprising.
@Cathousemaster 👋 Haven’t seen you around in a while. Working on anything new?
I'm not a graphics whore. Playing it for the first time on the TV. Looks freaking awesome. Zero problems.
@ThanosReXXX
Honest opinion.
If going for the base level console, get a PS4. Seen a Black Friday deal for $199, and their list of amazing exclusives is unrivaled next to the Xbox. But if you're going to get the real deal, and have a 4KTV, I say go with the Xbox One X. You're going to get twice the performance. I mean, there's only one reason a person buys X/Pro, and that's for the added performance and 4K. So if you're going to do it you might as well get the console that actually outputs 4K most of the time, as opposed to the Pro which does a lot of 1440p upscaling.
@ThanosReXXX
@JaxonH Thanks for the opinion, do appreciate it, but as far as Sony goes: me and them have parted ways decades ago, due to them screwing me over multiple times, and since I adhere to the three strike rule, there's no coming back from that, as in NEVER.
And then there's of course all the Xbox games I've been collecting via the Games with Gold initiative, only half of which I'm able to play on my still hooked up Xbox 360, so it's definitely going to be an Xbox One S or X, and that TV is also coming, since my current one is probably on its last legs: it's a Panasonic Viera Full HD 42" plasma screen that's now over 6 years old, and various TV channel logos are now burnt-in and permanently visible as a light blue hue in both upper corners, and smears of that same light blue are present in the lower part and center of the screen at intervals, so I'll be lucky if it's going to last me another 4 to 5 months...
@carlos82 nice I really appreciate your feedback and comparison. Reviews as a whole across the web have been positive. DF are ultra techy pixel counters and what they have to compare it to will to them clearly be a huge difference. You can’t tell me they go from producing dozens of articles of why X performance is better than the Pro’s and that isn’t going to play slightly in to their judgement of this.
@JaxonH nice. Another in hand view on it. I’m going to order now. Plus I have the benefit of never playing past the demo level on any other platform.
@BlueOcean Nintendo has enough other big IPs, though, like Animal Crossing, Pokémon, Smash Bros, Luigi’s Mansion plus they are likely working on new IPs. Nintendo is also in a much different situation than with the WiiU. At the time, they had an unpopular console and were bleeding cash from the price drop on the 3ds. Now they can afford to pay for 3rd party project development or ports.
@PlywoodStick There's a snarky reply to that which I can't post here due to understandable site rules, so I'll just link you to it:
http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/000/610/253/184.jpg
P.S.
Obviously not directed at you, but at all those people that feel that their opinion should be taken as fact, which is of course never the case, but which does compel them to keep trying to force their beliefs upon others.
Here's another one that I actually CAN post here:
Bruh, Indies count as 3rd party developers too so...I'm not sure any of this makes sense when we're talking Switch easily being the IT machine when we're talking about Indie support.
@JaxonH Is the Digital Foundry's analysis accurate? I'm confused because they pointed out major frame rate and frame pacing issues, but you and other users who have played this game said that the frame rate was okay.
@jomo32 "For Nintendo consoles, do non-first party titles get price drops over time?"
Yes.
@NinNin
They're looking at things on a technical level. They're noticing whatever the computer tells them. Oh it dropped here and it dropped this much, according to the computer that's monitoring it. That's a completely different thing than actually just playing a video game and enjoying it. Take the difference between 60 frames and 30 frames, for example. On a technical analysis that's huge. Immense. In a "just playing the game and enjoying it" analysis, you won't even notice. Especially with the excellent motion blur which masks a lot of anomalies.
The game plays fine. As I was telling someone earlier, you could have a laundry list a mile long of technical imperfections and shortcomings but at the end of the day if you just sit down and play the game it looks fine and it plays fine and it feels smooth. Like I was saying earlier, you can definitely tell it's been toned it down and my only real complaint is the resolution- it's noticeably a bit lower than most other Switch games. But it's good enough. It works. When you're playing the game in handheld mode, you're going to be having so much fun you won't even think about stuff like that. And it legitimately looks good, especially compared to other Switch games.
Also take into account that they really only saw the dips in frame rate, for example, playing on the hardest difficulty when there are a lot more enemies on screen. I'm playing on the easiest difficulty. And I would recommend playing on an easier difficulty just because handheld FPS are a little harder than on console due to the smaller analogues and smaller screen. They also said it's better in handheld mode, and let's be honest if you buy this game on Switch, it's likely because you want to play it in handheld mode. There are better options if you intend to only play on the TV. Me personally, I have the game on Xbox One X, but still choose to play this version on the TV simply because my save game is transferred when I'm on the go. I really don't want to have a completely separate save file just to have better resolution on the TV. But that's just me.
@JaxonH Thanks for the detailed explanation. It's strange that both Digital Foundry and players are right when what they said seem to be opposite.
Did Digital Foundry use the hardest difficulty level in their analysis? He said that he used the Ultra-Violence difficulty level. That's just the hard mode, right?
Would love to be playing this game right now but Amazon messed up some how and saying that it was delivered to a "invalid address". Odd seeing how they sent me a dozen different things over the past month to that exact address. Grrr
@JaxonH my problem with your suggestion of playing it on easy is that the replaybility and end game of doom is playing it on a progression of harder difficulty on arcade mode. Right now im playing ultra violence and the slow down is very noticeable, like FPS on the teens level. What more on nightmare
My family owned two Switches and we're looking forward to a third on the next 2-3 months. We're really enjoying it. We're playing it way more than the PS4....except for maybe FIFA 18.
I'm probably picking up Doom.
@PlywoodStick
Einstein never said that.
http://freakonomics.com/2009/05/14/quotes-uncovered-the-universe-and-stupidity/
@NinNin im playing on Ultra violence on arcade mode right now. There is definitely a noticeable slowdown. Feels like the FPS is between 18-25 during heavy fights.
After reading the comments here, I miss the days where people talk about how cool and fun games are instead of the nonsense that I’m seeing now (FPS and Frame rate or whatever inside the console’s guts).
@diwdiws Thanks for the information. I suppose players who haven't noticed the issues have played the game on an easier difficulty level.
@westman98 @electrolite77 #46 Tell me about it, it was supposed to fall off a cliff in May this year once the fanboys bought it, and it was going to end up no better than Gamecube numbers, now it's 30 mil...I love moving goalposts.
@SBandy Tell me about it. The stuff they nitpick about on that channel is just tedious. The game can play like an absolute treat but they'll pull in on some twigs 300% and say there's obvious stepping on something the average player won't pay the blindest bit of attention to.
Didn't even bother finishing the video. They test my patience at the best of times, could have been worse, could have been that monotonous Dave guy analysing it, I would have switched the video off after 10 seconds.
@pattybean I keep putting it on the TV to see if I can see what they are but within seconds I forget all about it and spend the next couple of hours just shooting things and ripping their heads off or cutting them in half with a chainsaw, loving every second of it. Let us know how you get on with it if you do get it
@yeayeanaynay Goldeneye looked terrible even when it was new, yet how good was that game? The characters looked like they were made from cereal boxes, but it was so much fun...
@Kamalot
Picky, picky. You should just let Mr. Lincoln send us time traveling messages from his iPhone given to him by the aliens in peace.
@BlueOcean uh. Theres also inconsistent frame issues sprinkled around BotW, but its still rated possibly the best of all time. Sure itd be very nice if it didnt happen, but it doesnt take away from the experience. Thats the take away in all of this
Sales slowing down after the first year isnt exactly a ground breaking prediction. Pretty typical of any hardware release. But if it surpasses 14 million in one year, its a huge success.
@yeayeanaynay
Yeah but Goldeneye got rave reviews for its graphics at the time, the N64 was pretty cutting edge. it's just that cutting edge was about 20fps. It was a simpler time.... 😉
I bought Doom day 1 & it's been a blast. I have no Playstation, X Box, or Steam to compare it to but the graphics & frame rate work for me. The video here in this article is great. We can see that the PS4 version is better, but we all knew that already didn't we? Constructive criticisms, but still a good time on the Switch. If you're in my boat, buy it, you won't regret it. I mostly play it in docked mode, no issues for me yet.
Also remember, if we critique these games to death, to the point where some don't buy it due to overly negative critiques, these 3rd parties may not bring their new games to Switch if they don't think they'll sell well.
This game is a refreshing change of pace. One of the few adult games on Switch. One of the few first person shooters. Buy it. 😉
What’s the big deal with all this fidelity/frame rate nonsense? I think it’s a miracle this works on a handheld at all to be honest and it looks like a decent port to me. The occasional drop from 30fps won’t be enough to spoil my fun as i grew up in the N64 days with the likes of Perfect Dark (12fps anyone?) plus I’m sure they’ll improve things in a patch. I say well done!
@electrolite77 The game is that fun I dont notice amy of these issues. MEH, if people complain, go buy it on another system while I sit here and slay demons whilst the mrs watches awful tv 😊😊😊
@SLIGEACH_EIRE LOL your image reminds me of all those screens Kotaku used to show of what a PS3 game would look like on Wii.
@westman98 You got it wrong. Firstly, I am not here to prove anything. Secondly, it was Nintendo Life that wrote an article saying that only Mario + Rabbids is a "best-seller" on Switch this far (third-party games). Thirdly, I don't want the Switch to fail but there are people here (not you, mind you, you seem to be a nice person) that are paranoid and see demons in anyone that is critical of Nintendo and they can't stand opinions that are different than theirs but that's not my problem but theirs so I don't care.
I don't know and you don't know if other third-party games will be great sellers on Switch, but the positive talk some people are copying and pasting doesn't mean anything. Let's see how Sonic Forces and Doom sell compared to other versions. Sonic Forces would probably sell more on Switch.
@dknintendo 400,000 copies for the Switch version or for all versions?
@roboshort Yes, there are many Nintendo franchises. Nintendo has so many great franchises that I like but Nintendo ignored most of them on Wii U and even on Wii. Probably, as you said, this won't happen again. The fact that they are making Metroid Prime 4 is telling.
@RickRau5
Yes, the early sales of Switch are very positive. I am just wondering if they will be this high next year, that's all.
"Sales slowing down after the first year isnt exactly a ground breaking prediction".
Hm, so we agree.
@PlywoodStick
Yes, I agree about early sales not being that meaningful.
@ThanosReXXX
You must be thinking of somebody else, I haven't talked about the price of the Switch version of Doom.
"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain - and most fools do."
Scratching my head over some of these comments from people who haven't even played Doom on the Switch yet. I've been playing it undocked and it's been a blast. It looks great on the portable screen and I honestly haven't noticed any of these alleged frame rate drops.
@nomstar
"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain - and most fools do [...] I honestly haven't noticed any of these alleged frame rate drops".
So you are saying that DF are fools? A fool is a person that can't see and accept the reality.
Seeing so many gamers on here express how they are having fun with this title and not really caring about tech specs and such is starting to give me hope for the future of gaming.
@Nomad Yes, that's what matters, agreed, but the article is about the DF video so it makes sense to talk about their findings. I don't think that anyone has said that the game is bad, just one guy here said that he doesn't like it because it has too much gore and he has a point because it's true.
The doom slayer will come to all the bob believers ! The game is awesome and super fun !! And most of the ppl don’t give 2 flutes about the freakin resolution and fps
@yeayeanaynay
Same here. I'm not a huge FPS fan but really enjoying this because of the simplicity. It feels like Doom, but in 2016. If that makes sense. The only thing it misses is they should have had a level where the sound reduces to just a creepy crying baby as a tribute to the PS1 version. 😉
I've had fun playing online multiplayer as well as the campaign. I do strongly wish for a smoother framerate, but sometimes it doesn't bother me. The only thing that can suck is when I get into a busy firefight and the framerate dips and I start having trouble aiming and I die. Having a perfectly consistent 60 fps is very important in a first person shooter. I'd rather have 500p with less polygons in all the models and lower res texture maps if it would get me 60fps. If they can patch it to lock at 30 that would also be awesome. BotW got patched up to almost perfect 30, maybe they'll do it for Doom too...
@PlywoodStick
"It's true that 1st year performance is not indicative of long term outlook"
That depends. If a system struggles first year it usually means it will struggle for a long time, possibly forever. It's difficult to get momentum, which is everything for a games system. But I can't think of many examples of a system having a great first year then dropping away. I'm sure there must be some but I can't recall any?
I've been an arch-critic of Nintendo over the years. I'm no zealot, I think they mishandled almost everything from E3 2008 to January 2017, and I know they're well capable of blowing it. But there's almost no precedent for the Switch. To find another Nintendo machine that had all their games on and was their sole development target you have to back to the NES which was a very different market.
Man, I don't know what to say on that one....I mean 360p at 2017, Handheld or not, is disappointing and atrocious. If masterpiece meaning that it exposed the Switch for for being an heavily underpowered system then Sure. Shouldn't really be surprised the system was already being maxed with Rabbids. This is Exactly like Days of Wii and Wii U to an extent, if not worse....That showcase was abomination and disgrace and it hurts me to say that, especially as a Nintendo Die hard.
The Switch better go the way with the 3DS and Wii with Exclusives and Custom games otherwise it's downhill from the Switch. I definitely absolutely 100% don't want to Wolfenstein 2 on the Switch, expect 540p D O C K E D and 240p Dynamic to 144p on portable.
@RickRau5 I have played BotW on both Wii U and Switch, the frame rate is much better on Switch after the patches. For instance, the Wii U version has massive framerate dips in the villages that the Switch version doesn't have. I think that Nintendo was astute sending the Switch version to reviewers because it is smoother. Besides, 30 fps is fine in a Zelda game, the only problem is that the Wii U version seems to be poorly optimised, in spite of being the first/prime version.
@NabbitFan730 Stop talking rubbish, some of the stuff I read on here is astonishing, it’s cool to be edgy it seems....
I have the PC version, I play it at 4K, yet I still think the Switch version looks amazing, so I’m not sure what you have to cry about.
I think it looks damn incredible in handheld mode. I used to build pcs and always having to upgrade graphic cards....memory..etc.....just to play at the highest setting took its toll on me just trying to have fun playing games. I spent all my time tweaking this n that...so once I finally gave up my OCD....I would play all my PC games on lower settings...and the joy of gaming came back. I no longer care...... Gameplay is more impt than graphics. Yes I want it to look nice...but like myself... It doesn't have to be perfect. Enjoy the actual game. Lifes too short to do anything else.
@Kalmaro I have to disagree. Mario was the only reason many people gave it a chance. You say people didn't want a Mario game with Rabbids in it - and that's true. That's because Rabbids hurt the games initial impression, not Mario. The Mario name almost certainly helped carry the game, especially when word got out that it was actually pretty good.
@Devlind What you said doesn't make sense. Devs would still have to go through the hassle of downscaling for handheld mode. A boost dock would be great but it wouldn't affect your point at all.
I hardly see that one quick port of an 2016-game makes och breaks the Switch. I just think that Bethesda rushed the port, they want to be first on the ball to give Switch support of current-gen adult games. I hope that they fix some of the issues with DOOM soon, and that it sell well enouch either way. Me myself, I really want some of the big third party-games on an handheld powerfull device, so I do hope that DOOM, Wolf2, SKyrim and L.A. Noire is just the beginning. Switch don't need every high end tech-game that comes to PS4/One, I just hope it gets a good portion of it.
@carlos82 sure thing. That’s the type of feedback I value. Also ❤️ Iggy like the big sister I never had but didn’t know I needed.
Pass. While I expected some compromises including lower resolution and only 30 FPS but a stable frame rate is the most important factor for me. I'll stick with the PC version.
@BlueOcean No, that was me speaking in general. The first part was indeed intended for you, and during typing I decided to elaborate on what annoys me about a certain group of modern day gamers, who seem to find everything other than gameplay and fun the most important factor when deciding to buy certain titles or not.
It was in relation to the whole frame rate/resolution debate, so I made no mistake in who I addressed.
But taking into account my considerable wall of text, I could imagine you kind of getting a "what the hell am I supposed to do with this rant?" feeling...
EDIT:
So, just to be totally clear: the cost part was NOT about you, but about most of the complainers, and their weird reasoning. With that out of the way, I hope I haven't offended you. The comment actually started out as a compliment.
@Devlind Well if we're talking about a Pro-Dock, why not go the other way around and have a modular Switch, an idea I formulated a while ago (after the first solid line)?
It would have a stationary unit ('normal' graphical settings, 1080p) and a dockable portable unit ('low', 720p). If docked, the computing power of both modules will be combined for even better performance ('high', 1080p with more details, effects, FPS). And if that's not enough, you can buy an additional boost module ('ultra', 3K or 4K).
Both the stationary and the portable use cases would've benefitted from separate modules because they wouldn't have to make any compromises.
Plus the modular design would've allowed for other kinds of mods (video recording and streaming, voicechat, VR, music production, fitness, smartphone, Quality of Life), which of course could also be open to 3rd party producers.
@BlueOcean For the Nintendo Switch. I think they said about 3.3 milliom for all consoles together.
@BlueOcean Yeah. I don’t have much of an idea of what Nintendo has planned, but I just seriously doubt they are going to slow down much whether it’s through bringing new IPs or breathing new life into stale IPs... Their future is riding on the Switch.
It is funny to see people did not yet understand that switch is a PORTABLE DEVICE!!! There won't ever get the best version of any game and that is absolutely fine because it can do one simple thing the other versions cannot. Contrary to the majority (or all) of the people whining I am playing the game and it looks great on a 1080p TV. My only complain, and it goes the same for wolf, is the lack of gyroscope aiming (it is my first experience of a fps on a controller and it is bad without it)
This is already out of the top 40 at amazon just 3 days after release. I think people will come around to the fact the Switch is a portable. The real problem is the pricing for these old ports.
That said, I for one not trading the home experience of games I'm a fan of just to have it on the go regardless the price. 600p is unacceptable on a 47 inch TV.
Games like Tales, Ys and Cold Steel will not have these issues - and for 60 you will get a great home and portable experience. Those are the games I would like to see on Switch.
@Agramonte amazon UK no stock till 14th November.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B075ND55T3/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1510498322&sr=8-1&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_FMwebp_QL65&keywords=doom+switch&dpPl=1&dpID=51Jh%2BFA6nEL&ref=plSrch
Searched on Amazon USA and can't find it.
I'm just happy to be playing Doom on switch. The game is really fun. I myself played and never finished it on ps4 a year ago, but the lack of portability really made it fall off the radar because I can't constantly hog the TV in our household. This is just fantastic and I plan on getting wolfenstein 2 as well. I love that Bethesda is doing this push for games on the switch.
@kobashi100 #50 in the USA
@JaxonH
I whole-heartedly agree - I love that Doom is on Switch. I love that the Switch fits into my adult lifestyle and has given me time to game again because I am not tethered to a TV. If anyone wants the full-frame experience... then play it on PS4/XBOX/PC but you are stuck tethered to a wall/TV. If you want to play it on an awesome portable/TV combo, then pick up Switch.
I find people comparing Switch frames to PS4/Xbox really amusing. Have you seen how much SMALLER the Switch is than XBOX/PS4... of course it is not going to be same full frame experience. They are HUGE consoles with heat sinks/fans to handle all graphics.
Switch is perfect for being a console that fits into my lifestyle. I love it because it is portable. Cudos to developers for making Doom work .... it looks awesome.
Yea huh? Wolfenstein is going to be a more hardware demanding port?? Hmmm 🤔
GOODNESS, GRACIOUS, GREAT WALLS OF TEXT!
Seriously wow, so many of them. xD
@electrolite77 hahahaha. I agreed! Whats the problem here again? Oh people complaining about how ugly it looks like on the switch with 600p res oh no its running like 20 fps well you all can go suk your own 60fps with 1080p res while im playing doom while taking a dump. For me playing doom for the first time on switch, its incredible. I still dont believe I can play it by the screen just near infront of my eye.
Absolutely AWESOME version of Doom and is by a clear mile TGE best version released.
Visuals and Sound are absolutely mind blowing in docked and undocked.
Some visuals are below the comparable PS4...... however!!
If you take the locations I have played Doom on Switch: Home, University and Work - get a great 600-720p version of a huge awesome game with full online multiplayer deathwatch where I am!! MORE multiplayer games need to be on switch!!!
Now if I was playing Doom on PS4 the average visuals would be around 333p. At home it looks great! As soon as I’m playing at uni and work I get a nice solid 0p and 0MBps connection for death match and I have to wait till I get home.
Switch is THE format for online gaming. PS4/XBOX: Team battle, raids, any team based online game; you have to coordinate with your Friends when you all need to be home and online.
Switch: “hey dude, raid time on destiny? Team battle on Doom”
“Sure, I’ll just take my switch out my bag and tether to my mobile for half hour on my break!”
Job done!
In other words: If you want portable DOOM, it's fantastic and you don't have any choice anyway, and if you don't want portable DOOM, get it on another machine, basically the TL:DR for every multiplatform game is this, unless you want portable, get it on another machine that runs it better.
@UmniKnight
Pretty much. If you only play on TV, this is not the version to get if you have other options. If you play in portable mode, it's the best FPS we've ever seen on a handheld.
@HAL9000
Ya, I mean. I still have DOOM on Xbox One X. So it's not like this version is replacing that one or anything. It's just one additional option to enjoy.
It's really nice actually being able to play this game when I'm at work. It's the best looking FPS game on a handheld I've ever seen. So if you look at things through that lens- this is a serious step up from previous FPS on Vita, 3DS or PSP.
It's not perfect. Goodness knows it's not perfect. But it's the real, actual game of DOOM, and it plays well. The only time this has been done before was Borderlands 2 on Vita, and that was a disaster. 15fps, pop-in everywhere (even the game menu screen lol), actions mapped to zones on rear touchpad and touchscreen... it was rough. So as someone who was there for all the previous FPS, and now playing DOOM on Switch, i'm pretty giddy about it. Know if someone was hoping for a game without compromise... I think it's time to face the reality of the switch just isn't powerful enough to offer that. But it is powerful enough to at least get these games running so you can play them and enjoy them, and do so from anywhere. And a lot of less demanding games will be near perfect (like Disgaea 5 and LA Noire and Resident Evil Revelations 1/2 and Rocket League).
@Devlind
The Switch has no proper way of harnessing extra processing power from a "pro dock." If you perceive me to be wrong on this, though, I'd like to hear your thoughts.
If anything, as I see it, the existence of Doom on Switch, and the acknowledgement that there still is "room for improvement" is a reason for developers to try and compete for an even better product.
@BlueOcean
Pretty much every 3rd party company outside of EA who has released a game/games for Switch thus far has reported good sales.
From Electrolite:
http://nintendoeverything.com/ubisoft-very-happy-with-switch-sales-more-games-on-the-way/
http://n4g.com/news/2121130/take-two-very-pleased-with-nba-2k18s-sales-on-switch-supportive-of-the-platform-corporately
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2017-11-07-bandai-namco-ramping-up-support-for-the-nintendo-switch
https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2017/11/capcom_to_bring_increased_support_and_ace_attorney_to_switch_in_2018
https://gamingbolt.com/square-enix-doubles-down-on-its-commitment-to-nintendo-switch-support
http://nintendoenthusiast.com/blog/2017/10/28/koei-tecmo-extremely-happy-switch-game-sales/
BTW, DBX2 has sold 400,000 copies on the Switch alone.
@MsgBoardGame find it funny when people say it's just Nintendo die hards buying the switch.
Where were these same Nintendo die hards when the GC and Wii U was released. Did they just vanish and turn there back on nintendo hardware?
There is no doubt that switch is selling to both sets of gamers
@dknintendo That's why I asked for updated information, the one I checked was not up to date then. Thanks.
So "400,000 on Switch and 3.3 million for all consoles together", that makes Dragon Ball Xenoverse 2 a commercial success on all platforms including Switch, quite a difference with the sports games. We'll see about Doom and Sonic Forces. I expect the Switch version of Sonic Forces to sell the most but not sure about Doom.
@ThanosReXXX From what I've seen on NL, the biggest critics of Switch games are the people who don't have one.
@Reignmaker I have said it before. Some people caught caught up on that super metal Dave kool aid. They convinced themselves the switch was gonna be some PS4 beating home console and still haven't got over the fact they were duped massively.
Others are still riding that Wii U train ride and can't accept it's over!
@roboshort I'm not sure about the future of Nintendo as a hardware manufacturer but they are brilliant software developers so even if they stop making hardware in the future they won't stop developing and publishing games. They are doing this for phones and tablets, after all.
I agree with you, there are many franchises to be revived and they can always make something new, the future of Switch depends on it.
@ThanosReXXX "The first part was indeed intended for you"
At least the first past was kind.
I think it comes down to how you want to play.
It's genuinely impressive that the gameplay and game itself is virtually the same. There's always going to be some compromise to get AAAs portable and if, essentially, it's just a relatively small drop in visual quality that's going to be a fine price for most.
If you want DOOM at its best splash out on an all full-spec PC set up. If you just want to pick it up for some fun and only have a Switch or really want to play on the go, Ninetendo is your answer.
Honestly to me it seems to be like comparing dvd to bluray. It's the same thing with some fidelity compromise. I'm happy to pay that price for portability!
And if other AAAs can get on the Switch with a similar quality... I'm excited.
@MsgBoardGamer Arguably, yes, they could/should. But what the consoles of Xbox/PS have over the PC, is 1. Price and 2. parity, as in every game out for the system runs for the system.
The Switch is only mildly cheaper than PS4/Xbox One (and, in some cases, more expensive), and it is noticeably weaker. It offers portability as a trade-off for specs, graphics etc.
If you do not want a portable experience, then you will gain more by buying a version of say DOOM for PC/PS4/Xbox One, that is a fact.
Having only owned Nintendo consoles. No PlayStation or Xbox. Doom is a game I’ve looked forward to playing since it was announced and seeing the last Doom I played was Doom 64 I am thoroughly enjoying it.
Even though I’m struggling to get used to using the pro controller to shoot any moving target, from years of playing FPS with wiimote point and shoot, however the more I play the better I’m getting.
I don’t care if it not 60fps or 1080p if I wanted that I’d buy a PS pro or XBoneS but I don’t.
I’m not worried about the textures when I’m laughing at the Glory Kill I just dispatched on a demon.
For me it’s about the fun of playing the game.
Hats off to Panic Button, Bethesda and Id for going against the trend and bringing this to Switch.
I look forward to Wolfstien and any other game they bring.
@MsgBoardGamer But what stops these people from (and indeed that has been happening a really long time) buying the Switch as 2nd console to their PS4/Xbox One? So far I know there's quite a lot of people that have their "handheld" side Switch for the Nintendo games and some worthy of being portable.
The Switch does not offer enough as a home-console to warrant purchase of multiplats on it when you have another system. It's 1. probably more expensive and 2. worse in an objective way.
@BlueOcean Sonic Forces might sell the best on Switch. I expect Skyrim to sell more copies than Doom and since there doesn't seem to be any failures on the Switch so far I expect both Skyrim and Doom to meet Bethesda's expectations.
@roadrunner343 You say that, but it was not until folks saw the gameplay footage that we started to see people giving the game a chance.
@MsgBoardGamer True, but will it be enough to keep the third-parties? Nintendo would be wise to enforce their hybrid on it's home-console front. It holds up really well as a handheld, but it just doesn't offer enough as a home-console, and this can and hopefully will, be absolved.
This is a must buy for me but these Digital Foundry videos can be depressing. I love them though. Everyone should also check out the one they did for The Flame and The Flood PS4/Switch. That one also had a VERY noticable downgrade from PS4, and in that case it's a real shame because that game doesn't look too taxing...
I've been playing since release, have this game on both PS4 and Switch. Yes, you can see the obvious downgrade that's going to obviously happen for a console that can go portable at the drop of a hate.
The thing is, it really friggin' works. I love how the low-fi textures look, gives everything this retro-80's kind of look. Anyway, I'm having tons of fun and can't be more happy with how this turned out. Thank you Bethesda for making this real, I'm picking up Skyrim and Wolfenstein2 Day1
@MsgBoardGamer
Everything is relative to expectations. This is especially the case with NBA 2K18, which literally cannot be played on Switch without owning a 32 GB micro-SD card.
@Devlind
EXACTLY. Let me keep my Switch exactly the same, but pump up the power when it's in docked mode with replacement docks.
@MsgBoardGamer For now, yes, and I do hope that it continues, but that depends on what the future brings.
@MsgBoardGamer
No reasonable person expected the Switch to have "impressive" levels of 3rd party support (relative to PS4/XBO).
Still having a ridiculous amount of fun with this, I hope people who have never played the game aren't put off by such videos because they'll be missing out on a great game, easily in my top 3 Switch games.
Now if we can only get classic Doom and/or Doom 3 BFG edition and Doom 64 then I'll never put my Switch down 😃
@BlueOcean xenoverse sold 400k on switch
@Kalmaro that's kind of the point - I'm suggesting most still would not have given the game a chance, even after seeing it in action, had it not been for the Mario universe. Of course that's just my guess and I could be incorrect, but I think there is almost no chance of Mario harming the game, as you originally suggested. Without Mario, the game would have almost undoubtedly flopped.
@roadrunner343 I never suggested Mario harmed the game
I was pointing out that Mario 'said Dave does not garunteed sales and then went on to say how his inclusion did not help Mario + rabbids at all when it first was announced and, if anything, drew more negativity to the game because outsole didn't want Mario and rabbids together.
Not necessarily that Mario hurt the game, just him being with rabbids turned everyone off, until actual gameplay was shown. Then keeper warned up to it.
I think Mario's face topically does still games, just not all the time, and touristic his face in other games can be dicey at times.
@Reignmaker That appears to be the case, unfortunately. And still, I have some hope that there will also be more non-Switch owners like me, who would want to wait with condemning the system or its games until they've actually had enough hands-on experience with it themselves.
Far as I'm concerned, even one or two play sessions at a convention or a friend's house don't count: it needs to be in your own possession, in your own environment, and then you can judge how well it works for you, or not.
And only reading online reviews and watching YouTube videos definitely doesn't count. And yet, that is what the masses seem to do. Pitiful and VERY short-sighted, to say the least.
@BlueOcean As it was indeed intended. I already added an edit to the previous comment:
"So, just to be totally clear: the cost part was NOT about you, but about most of the complainers, and their weird reasoning. With that out of the way, I hope I haven't offended you. The comment actually started out as a compliment. "
None of the bad stuff was directed at you, that was just me ranting/letting of steam, because the whole frame rate thing brought up all the other annoyances, that keep coming back like a bad sore, as well.
@Devlind Why should need to buy the same system again... just for a bit more speed? this aren't no 32x with it's own games.
The PS4 Pro and Xbox Pro whatever is a waste of money when they could just make a new whole console.
as for the Switch, this isn't problem it's more then powerful enough to get games like this on the system (could be worse, look at the Doom ports on SNES and heck even the Saturn like 15 fps) plus it's installbase is getting bigger by the min.
@Kalmaro in post #46, that's exactly what you said. If that's not how you meant it, that's fine, I can move on. My point is simply that the Mario name in no way hurt that game - even if there were plenty of skeptics of the crossover on Nintendo fan sites, the Mario name alone will drive decent sales. We've seen some hot garbage sell pretty well solely off the name.
@samuelvictor I thoroughly enjoyed Doom on the 32x. It did used to chug on the higher difficulty settings but that didn't get in the way of the fun.
@roadrunner343 Yeah, my wording was bad. I didn't mean he was hurting things, just him and rabbids being put together was making problems.
In any case, we've also seen his face do absolutely nothing to help game sales, quite a few games with Mario in it sell poorly. I mentioned the latest Mario party games earlier. My point with rabbit ds was that gameplay is what caught people's attention positively, more than Mario being in it, since most negativity vanished when people discovered it was "Mario Xcom".
Looking at my post though I said "Mario Brand", not Mario specifically. Meaning just anything Mario a related wasn't helping the game initially. The feedback when that rabbid peach image was leaked was overwhelmingly negative.
@ThanosReXXX No problem, I had not read the edit.
@roadrunner343 I agree with you about Mario + Rabbids.
@Kalmaro I despise the rabbids, so I won't disagree with your statement on rabbid peach. She's just awful. However, I still think the Mario brand as a whole makes the game much, much better and likely drove much higher sales as a result. The inclusion of Mario characters and exploring the Mario universe is the only reason I even gave the game a shot.
3rd party support starts now
@Hughesy 😂 Stop talking rubbish? You Fanboys never learn.
Doom Runs 576p 20 at the lower than low setting that DF called it Soup, Not Welfare, Not even Homeless, S O U P . Enjoy Wasting $60 on Soup Lmao. Also Show specs and Steam ID of this Mythical PC you have or otherwise have that seat.
My comment will get lost here, but I will leave it here anyway:
I do not have the ability to play this on any other system, so as far as I am concerned, it is a great game on a great system, and I am enjoying the hell out of it. Couldn't care less about tech specs.
@GrailUK smart parallel .
300 comments. That's some going. The UK charts will be out in about 9 hours which should give us the first indication of how it's selling.
@roadrunner343 I wholeheartedly agree with you that Mario's inclusion made the game better in the long run. I think initially though it hurt things up until people saw gameplay and that the game would actually be fun.
It's definitely good to see the first great shooter on Switch. I am double dipping on Switch. Played a couple of matches yesterday with no online server issues. The game will be even better once it gets some performance patches for people concerned about frame rate.
I’ve only encountered two issues. Both had easy fixes. The motion blur hurt my eyes and there have been a couple sound glitches for me. I went to settings and turned off motion blur, and unplugged my headphones on the sound problem. [the sound problem was a bit serious tho, one time it was an ear-splitting low-end feedback buzz that almost deafened me - the other time there was next to zero sound in an entire multiplayer match]
Other than that I have been thoroughly enjoying myself!
@Kalmaro that's a fair viewpoint. I still disagree, but that's okay - at least we understand each other's position now. I think initially, Mario's inclusion likely ruffled the feathers of the super fan, but ultimately as you said, it was a huge boon to the game.
I have DOOM on PS4. This is the version I will play on the T.V. Is it good enough for me to double-dip and buy it on Switch? Yes. It all comes down to preference, but the trade-off does not bother me. Not one bit. And for people who only have a Switch, then there you are, they can now play DOOM. I see no downside.
@ThanosReXXX MW3 was pretty awesome on the Wii.
Wow, some of these comments....
Yes, we know the Switch version isn't quite up to par with the other versions.. I'm pretty sure every person who's either buying this for the first time(myself included) or double dipping knows that. Let's let that horse rest in piece, shall we?
It's funny because a lot of the same naysayers would've called you delusional if you told them the Switch could run the game before it was announced. Furthermore, these same folks will say how important 3rd party games are for the Switch(which is true), but we're not supposed to buy it because of the other versions..?
Going back to beating a dead horse, yes, if you own one of the other versions and you don't consider portability a big factor, this version isn't for you. Just like how the PS4/XB1 version of Zombi U isn't for people who are content with the Wii U version. Etc.etc.
/rant
@GEKGanon That's better than games skipping the system entirely because it cannot run them.
@Rogster Tell me that when we have Final Fantasy FXV, Monster Hunter World, COD WWII, The Witcher III, Dark Souls III, Nier Automata and Metal Gear Solid V (to name a few) on the Switch.
@Pod Well, I'm not sure if there's a way or not, I just said that (if it was possible) that would solve the problem with this visual intensive titles on the Switch.
@ClassSonicSatAm In the case for the Switch, to squeeze a little more processing power so third parties can bring their games as they intended instead of lesser ports?
For the record, I'm not saying that having a portable Doom is a small feat, but I'm worried that as the time passes we get less and less ports since the system can't keep up.
@Devlind totally agree.
So the DF video seems to say that Doom is a bad port that still looks good because of its art style. So if a bad port can look good enough then won't a good port look even better?
@gatorboi352 yay! nintendoomed!
@Koudai1979 Yes, it actually was. I also have it on the Xbox 360, so I could compare in my own home, and I was actually quite impressed at how they captured the essence of the game, even though it obviously didn't look as good. Much like what is the case with Doom right now.
And with Doom for Switch, just like with MW3 Wii, if you just start playing instead of comparing every minute detail, you might just find that you'll actually have some fun...
@samuelvictor Smart man.
I always really appreciate their honesty in these videos. Sounds like exactly what we had on the SNES. Basically, it shouldn't exist on the console, but alas, here it is. I have it, and I love it. If framerate and texture quality is important to you, then no, you shouldn't get it, but my wife was playing a game on the PS4, and I could play Doom, sitting right next to her. I mean, come on, that's so awesome. If it suits you for on the go, I can't stress enough that it's so great to have. I've played on normal mode, and I haven't noticed the frame drop too much. I agree that the small buttons are a little awkward, but I was able to get used to them. It's all just a matter of preference.
@KryptoKrunch
Preach my friend, preach. This is literally always a problem with Nintendo fans. They complain that they don't get 3rd party games, and yet, when one shows up, they give a million and one reasons why they elect not to buy it. That's your choice, but then you can't complain if Doom doesn't sell well, and Bethesda stops supporting the console.
Ya know, I get it. You can get Doom pretty cheap on Xbox or PS4, and it of course looks better, and plays better. It's also been out longer, so the cheaper price isn't as fair a comparison. But as DF showed us, the console really shines in handheld mode, so if you want the experience on the go, it's a near-perfect solution to scratch that itch.
All said and done, this game is so important for two reasons. One, it's a current gen game and not a port from 360 or PS3, and two, this is the first real effort from a third party studio to grace the Switch (other than Rabbids). I'd like to see more, and they only way to do that is to buy it, so that it was a worthwhile investment of their time. Nintendo fans are their own worst enemies sometimes.
@Devlind
That much is true. If they could beef up the power a few years from now through an optional add-on like a Pro-Dock, players that wanted the very best performance could splash out for that.
But it would also require developers to configure games for a third standard, outside of the usual docked and undocked, which is already one more than what's usual for consoles.
Thanks for sharing this. I'll sadly be passing on DOOM Switch, as sub-720p resolution and frequent sub-30fps framerate are not things I'm willing to accept in a full-priced game (or, to be honest, virtually any discounted game). I hope it does well to encourage more third party support, but I'll be eagerly awaiting Skyrim and confirmation that it runs/looks well on Switch.
The Wii U failed because the console did not engage the masses like the Wii did,Nintendo just expected lots of Wii owners to buy a Wii U,when they had in fact already jumped ship to tablet and smartphone devices.
It had nothing to do with Nintendo's games or lack of third party support,the Switch is proving this as big part of their games library are indie titles,and you have to look outside the hardcore games market mentality to see the consoles much broader appeal.
The Switch will be a huge success for Nintendo.
@Devlind I don't think that's a solution. I would prefer a more powerful model of the Switch.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE I have Doom on the PC leaves all systems for dead but I love Doom on the Switch. Its a work of art to be even on the Switch which tells me this is the birth of a lot of shooters coming our way.
I got Doom today and it looks incredible. I find the controls exceptionally difficult to get used to though. I’m not sure if I can preserve with it to be truthful.
@NinNin Well, that's subjetive. I prefer getting a new dock over getting a new Switch.
@Pod PC games have been doing that for ages now. I believe that once the developers have down the trick to port games to the Switch, adding that support would not be a problem
@shani That's a cool idea on paper, but if that hasn't yet taken off on the smartphone market, I can't see it actually being successful on the Switch.
Changing modules to get different functionalities is a promising idea, but you have to think in other variables. First off, piracy. This can make changing the firmware easier for hackers. Second, you have to think in the performance issues. Better graphics need better processing, and better processing needs more cooling. I don't know how much heat the Switch screen can resist (and other modules for that matter), but I guess not much. The dock can only provide so much cooling (and the Switch gets really hot at times). Besides that, there's the battery issue. Adding a bigger module would need space, and batteries take a lot of space. The same if you want a bigger battery.
As I said, it is a great idea, but it's hard to pull out.
@Devlind The problem with that approach is that it doesn't improve the performance in handheld mode, which is a key selling point of the Switch.
@NinNin In my opinion, it doesn't need to be improved at the moment. The Switch in handheld mode is already the most powerful dedicated portable console in the market. Where it needs improvement is in the docked mode.
@Devlind Have you never heard of the Moto Z (and Moto Z Play)?
It's a modular smartphone that's on the market since June 2016 and while it's not as widespread as Samsung's smartphones, there are more than a few people who use it.
Right now there's a JBL speaker mod, an Alexa speaker mod, four different battery mods, a camera lens (with optical zoom) mod, a 360 camera mod, a gamepad mod, a vehicle dock mod and - that's why I got the phone in the first place - an upcoming keyboard slider mod (will probably be shipped in January).
I use a Moto Z myself and I have to say, it's a really great device with good built quality and hardware (while not being that expensive). I already have the moto turbopower™ pack, a moto style shell (which came with the phone) and have pledged for the keyboard mod.
In my opinion, all phones should be like this. Tbh I don't get why other producers haven't started copying this concept, the mods are really easy to use and very practical.
The mobile unit (=the Switch as we know it now) would just be a module itself (and wouldn't need to change that much compared to the Switch), it doesn't have to be affected by the heat.
@shani I know about it and that's why I said taken off. One smartphone in the market isn't enough.
@Devlind I totally agree.
@ThanosReXXX Yup! I still don't have a Switch, but when I get one, I'm getting Doom.
I've never played a Doom game, but if it plays anything like Quake III Arena or Duke Nukem 3D ("Doom Rocks, but Duke Rules!" lol) then I'll be a happy gamer.
@Koudai1979 Well, in that case, you will be, because it does play pretty much the same like those games. And it's hilariously gory at times, which can be fun, if you're not against such imagery in a game...
@ThanosReXXX awesome!
@faint been around, but only posting occasionally. Working on getting Grimoire rolling on Steam, but nothing else. Ridiculously busy alas.
@Cathousemaster well I wish you luck. Flower Works was quite charming. It would be interesting to see what you could do with a team. I’ll keep an eye on steam.
@PlywoodStick I despise false information spread on the internet
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