I think this game works better as Zelda than Link.
Link has a defined formula so when it is not met there is criticism. This isn't a link game. It is a Zelda game.
Since first hearing about this game I often thought that maybe TOTK should have just been this game. And I wonder if during the production of TOTK they thought about that idea (they did hint at a playable Zelda at one point).
TOTK felt too much like a reskin but a playable Zelda and new story, in addition to the new mechanic, would have kept things fresh. Instead we look to be getting two versions of the same concept.
I think most hardened fans will get this regardless. How much we enjoy it and how much replay value there is, are questions soon to be answered.
People don't play and beat the game within the first minute of playing it. Even if the game wasn't leaked, if you take your time with things and play at a steady pace there will always be somebody ahead of you posting spoilers.
"I want to stay spoiler free so I'm going to read every review, study every article, watch every YouTube video, click every link. Then complain about it"
@SuperBro64 I think it's the same map but has the Suthorn region (south) and Faron (east). It also has the still world but these don't appear to be a full dark world version (like the Underground of TOTK), but more like "sky islands".
There are lots of videos on YouTube doing comparisons or trying to plot known footage onto the map.
I am not sure if its a true 1:1 ratio but I suspect it will be the same ratio as the GB links awakening and the switch version. It may feel a bit bigger but it probably wont take the player longer to traverse the same distance from one game to another.
I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo undersold the hardware again and gave us something that could barely handle the 1st gen games, and then struggle throughout the course of its life. Not to mention enough memory to store 1 or 2 games.
I'd like to see Nintendo create a new mature IP. Perhaps the Emio experiment might lead them to something like their own Resident Evil or Silent Hill. Particularly Silent Hill as the psychological horror market seems to have an opening. Hack and Slash horror games have been done to death.
@JohnnyMind These are all valid points but the difference is the progression arc.
In BOTW the player has the same physics system / framework to use at the start. The only difference is the intensity of ability. So they can play any of the divine beasts in any order. Or head straight to Ganon and try to beat him to death with a pot lid and a torch.
In ALTTP you couldn't get to death mountain without the glove. And it wasn't just barriers on the over world. But also dungeons. There were rooms you couldn't enter until you got the dungeon item which was integral to solving the dungeon itself. This made each of them unique. Where as with BOTW because there is no item progression everything can be resolved with the initial toolkit. And this was even more so with TOTK when ultra hand and fuse replaced everything.
When I was playing the Links Awakening Switch port I was reminded I was playing a game boy game. This is based on a SNES game.
To put it another way, think of how long it takes to walk from Links House to Kakariko village (or lost woods) in BOTW compared to ALTTP. Once you strip away the progression pathway and back tracking we see in Classic Zelda games (forced linear play through) I think this game will just be too short.
I'm looking forward to this one but the issue is A Link To The Past just wasn't a big world. So putting in a game breaking mechanic might be a bit of over kill.
With games like ALTTP the gradual upgrade and ability system with a more linear approach helped keep the game fresh and more purposeful. I just dont think this world will be big enough to handle a tool kit given from the get go designed for large open world games.
I'm thinking of Let's Go Pikachu where all Pokemon were pushed into the open and the game was 3D. But suddenly everything felt tiny and it went from a 40 hour game to a 10 hour game.
OK so I purchased this game and have buyers remorse. Imagine if Mario was just 1-1. You play it, think "hey wow, what a cool concept", but then wonder where is the rest of the game.
This had potential for walking around multiple areas, interacting with locals and having basic conversations. Instead there is a single deserted area where you take photos mainly of select inanimate objects. And the translations arent always useful.
There is a small dictionary of words and it does attempt to teach you hiragana / katakana. But nothing compared to what you can get in abundance online for free.
This is a demo and I can't see anybody playing it for more than 15 minutes. The biggest insult is they have already decided to add a paid DLC for additional camera filters when they haven't even made enough content to justify the cost of the initial offering.
How do you say "I want my money back" in Japanese?
Love the full Japnese voice acting and this is a concept I would like to see repeated.
However the interface and in game logic is completely flawed. I found that I could choose the same options time and time again and get different results. I struggled to even get through the game prologue which is essentially the tutorial. Just brute forcing options until I found a way through.
I think it could have worked better with a more traditional Shadow Gate / Broken Sword style. A bit of a click and point. The visual novel interface just didn't work IMO
@AstroTheGamosian Unfortunately language is intertwined with culture. I heard an expression that the Eskimos have over 30 words for ice. The more relevant something is, the more you need a framework to express it.
I believe the common Japanese expression "yoroshiku onegaishimasu" doesn't have an English equivalent.
I think anybody who is trying to "speak English" using Japanese words will struggle. I have a friend learning Japanese and that's his approach.
You have the right attitude. Watch bucket loads of anime and pick up words / meaning through context. You don't even have to translate it, just associate it. Thats how toddlers learn.
I use language learning resources just to get a broad understanding of the framework but most of all my learning comes through application / observation.
I am looking forward to this game though. Seems like a fun little run around to apply some of what I have learnt, and to tide me over until Zelda comes out.
@AstroTheGamosian
I have the Japanese Rosetta Stone also. I wouldn't use it as an absolute resource but to complement other learning.
My advice would be:
1/ Avoid Romanji at all costs
2/ Learn Hiragana (japanesepod101 on Youtube - learn Hiragana in 1 hour)
3/ Learn Kanji / Katakana
4/ Take the Youtube speed reading challenges (usually titled "can you read Hiragana in 3 seconds)
5/ Find an interest (TV, movie, music, sport) and indulge in raw Japanese media. Use your interest to form your vocabulary and expand from there
The old worms games, particularly the art work, was one of the things that made them such fun to play. Never liked the 3d versions or the newer art work.
If it's the classic version then I'm all for it. Would love to see Worm's World Party as that was the best worms game IMO
@FIS-PODCAST Agreed. I had no idea what I was doing. I tried every option and I was still stuck. Then I tried some of the same options again and I was able to progress.
If this is about using logic to solve a case then one would expect logic to be an integral part of the gameplay's flow.
I don't think it's a bad game. I think the interface and perhaps translation makes things unintuitive.
Police is telling me I can't leave until I answer a question but there is no prompt or button that allows me to do so.
I find myself clicking on the exact same option 5 or 6 times not knowing if I am at the end point of a chain getting a variation of dialogue, or getting new information each time.
At the start I tried every single menu option and could not proceed. But then after trying some options a second or third time I was able to proceed. I still have no idea what I did differently. It's like trying to brute force your way through the lost woods.
I get a sense this is a game where I have to check a bin 27 times before finding the key.
I didn't see a logical way through this game and all I did was play the pre-game. A hard no for me. A shame really as I loved the full Japanese voice acting and was looking forward to buying this one.
Mario Kart is a game that punishes you for coming first and not coming first at the same time. I do enjoy it but the SNES version seemed the most balanced. If you were good you could lap pretty much everybody.
Now there is an over reliance on items, drifting techniques and cheap AI. It has become more of a party game than a serious racer.
I'm looking forward to this game and definitely a day 1 purchase. I do wonder however if it will have the depth of a game like Ocarina of Time or if it will be the length of A Link to the Past. A quick run through of 8-10 hours and maybe a repeat play to unlock everything.
I'll drive to the local game store on launch day, ask if they have it, be told by a trainee that they haven't received their stock yet, drive home and download a digital version. Usual process.
@boxyguy it's always going to be a point of debate whether glitches are fair play or not.
I'm of the school of thought that when playing a game you can use every tool available in your tool kit. Sometimes you can cheese a level in an unintended way without it being seen as a glitch.
I think using computer inputs, memory manipulation or action replays codes shouldn't be allowed. But being able to find a quicker way to the finish line, even if unintended, is the fun of speed running.
I enjoyed this series. Was good to have a bash over a few weeks between the release of A titles.
Whether the event was a win or loss depended on the controls. Sometimes they would vary between lazy button mashing or illogical controls. Maybe something closer to guitar hero would have worked better (timing based) or random button press when prompted (reflex based).
Shame no Paris 2024 version. Seemed like a no brainer.
@HeadPirate Unless you worked on this particular project as a high up exec then everything you have to contribute to the motivations behind these decisions are as equally speculative as mine.
And if this is your project, then I'll revert what I said initially. Please, enlighten me to how the 500 dragon crystals were budgeted for and resourced as part of development to justify their in store cost.
Whether DLC is lazy and greedy is a valid debate with both sides being equal. No right or wrong. In some instances it is, in some instances it isn't. What we are both putting forward is a balanced view point. Not a finite or absolute one. Our view point is also circumstantial, and in many instances social / cultural.
At what point DLC is baked into a project varies from project to project. it isn't a science. You know this already.
How a budget is calculated, how DLC is factored into that budget and even resourced also varies from project to project. You know this already.
Whether DLC is paid for as part of the initial project. Or committed to and later resourced separately, again varies from project to project. You know this already.
How can I be universally wrong for something that is so varied, everything I have said would have been encapsulated in at least one project at least one time over history.
If you're educated in project management then naturally you already understand the diversity and complexity of it. If you're educated in game development or are part of the industry then obviously you understand commercial decisions or how to extend profit margins. Also differ from project to project.
Your entire premise only works if WB games are an honest studio and followed a conventional business model. You said so yourself. Type "are WB games honest" into Google and enlighten those people.
I don't have to post my credentials to justify having an opinion. We are both putting forth speculative balanced view points.
I'm not interested in learning "how things work" in this instance because we aren't talking about a fridge or a light bulb. We are talking about a diverse complex market with too many individual business practices realistically count. If you think you have THE answer. You are already wrong.
I don't believe I am spreading misinformation or unfounded information. I also don't believe I am awaiting for somebody to enlighten me. Or maybe that's what I can use my 500 dragon crystals to buy.
@HeadPirate I read your initial post and I don't agree. I actually think that if you, for my benefit, were to post a long post to "enlighten" me as to why I am wrong, it would come across as condescending.
This is a very complex and diverse subject matter and it feels like you're about to jump in with "the answer is A".
In this very specific instance, yes, this kind of DLC is a lazy cash grab. I would have thought the 500 dragon crystals would have been a give away that it is exactly based on the mobile gaming model.
By all means post your thoughts for the broader forum to enjoy but if you were to do so for my benefit, yes, you would be wasting both of our times.
I hope we can meet again in a different news article.
@Bikadovlt "Previous game and DLC sales" at some point becomes a paradox.
And yes, my point remains consistent. Game studios are cut throat profiteers which is why they wouldn't pre-plan DLC to cover costs without even seeing the size of the game base first. I have remained consistent in saying pre-planned DLC is already paid for as part of the existing game development life cycle.
I have also remained consistent in saying DLC is a cash grab, something cut throat profiteers would look for in favour of a simple x units for x $ model.
The game world is different. Maybe decades ago where the console market was for the console market the kind of honest system being proposed was the norm. But today companies have to compete head to head with the mobile market, the PC market is more serious, and even other forms of entertainment given a kid can get lost for hours on YouTube videos.
There are less $ available so companies have to find creative ways to extort more money. Again, oh wait, have I already made that point....
@HeadPirate
Sure why not. If a game has a 2 year planned production and then is pushed into a 3rd year it doesn't jump from $80 to $120 to justify the increased development time. Game studios don't have the same business model as a mums and dads bakery. It is arbitrary.
Some companies even release DLC for free. Some even games for free. There is no right or wrong model.
There is no logic in saying game execs will sit down and say "if we release x number of core units for $80, then x number of DLC for $40, then the time the graphic designer spent on the DLC can be proportionately paid for".
The mobile game market has a model. Release the game for free. Then use paid add ons for the 10% of obsessive gamers to get to profit. Sell them gold versions of what Koroks across the Zelda world were giving Zelda players for free.
DLC for consoles is largely an adaptation of this. Sell the games to people in chunks. Those who dont buy the DLC think they're getting the full game. Those who do think they're getting something extra. For planned DLC the development time is already paid for within the existing game budget. Not based on some projection for something nobody has the data for.
I'm sure those 500 dragon crystals that you can buy through the same premise would have taken the graphic designers proportionate development time.
I don't take people disagreeing with me to be aggressive. I'm not trying to get you to agree with me. I am stating what I believe to be the obvious and you're stating what you believe to be the obvious.
I'm not going to spend hours of my time posting links, videos, journals, blogs, articles to try to convince anybody anything.
The premise of what I am saying is that in most instances, for consoles, DLC is a lazy cash grab to dish out portions of the game in chunks. Distinguishable from updates / side quests. Distinguishable from unplanned DLC (which is a separate resourced project). You can take that how however you like
@HeadPirate It still comes back to the game development lifecycle.
The game framework and logic takes the longest to develop. I watched a video the other day where it said they spent an entire year just getting the mechanics of Ultra Hand right in Tears of the Kingdom.
Once the framework has been developed then art assets (which are what extra fighters are) become negligible. The skeleton models, fatality models, fighting models, game logic etc... has already been built. So it basically takes whatever time to design the actual art asset itself, and punch in the variables.
This is why data miners can find evidence of DLC characters at launch date, or even determine how many new fighters there are going to be. You already have everything. The only thing you are missing is the actual fighter asset data.
For DLC in fighting games its basically cost of licensing if they go for somebody like Terminator. And some graphic designer time. Probably a bit of director / producer time to work the character into the storyline.
Having (as an example since we're all on different currencies) $80 for core game, then two sets of $40 for 12 fighters is not proportionate. One took 3 years to make that would have tied up the best part of a development studio. The other was a few people in the garage for a few weeks (not wanting to undersell it but illustrate a point).
This is why unplanned DLC is honest. Its a small number of rusted on gamers that want to see extra life in their game. So they pay a higher margin to justify the development.
But planned DLC really is selling the game to players in chunks. It's a business model. There's no number crunching on trying to balance the costs of the graphic designers for the extra characters against the projected loyal fanbase who might be playing the game 6 months later. Nobody has that data.
That development time for DLC would have already been paid for during the development of the original game. In fact don't be surprised if the DLC characters were already finished before the game was released.
Make no mistake. DLC is a business model.
Games arent developed to break even. They are developed to make a profit. DLC is a more profitable model because you can continue to milk your loyal fanbase (some people call them Whales) for minimum cost. It's how the whole free to play mobile market can actually exist. And now the console market is trying to cash in.
@HeadPirate I get what you're saying. But its horses for courses.
Back in the days of arcade machines, companies had to stay fresh. Your arcade machine would be played for 2 or 3 months at most then sit in the corner gathering dust. To stay relevant the big competitors had to keep their games fresh. Turbo edition, championship edition, super mega edition. Hey kids get in line for our next brand new game!
Unfortunately for the console market it probably wasn't a concept that translated well, but the editions were still spaced apart nicely and would have warranted stand alone releases. We were willing to buy them too because it was about taking something new and exciting we saw at the arcade and having repeat plays in our own home.
It's not nostalgic fondness. I don't have any kind of buyers remorse.
DLC is different. You look at Mario Kart DLC and you have a community that is still playing a game several years after its release. So why not get a small team of graphic designers to pump in a few more character models, tracks, and reward the rusted on community? And somebody has to pay for it right? It is unplanned, reactive and relevant. It's honest work.
When a company includes DLC fighter packs as part of its development life cycle then that is nothing more than dishing out the game in chunks. It's not that the loyal fan base get more, it's that the unloyal fanbase get less. From a budget point of view the DLC is being built in production with the main game. There is no turning it off either because people from launch day have already pre-purchased it. Just like Pokemon Go, the game is fed to users in small chunks and they pay every metaphoric and literal step along the way.
There is nothing honest about this kind of DLC. Console developers have looked at models that worked in the mobile market and are looking how to apply that business model to their own line of work.
If DLC is announced as part of the games release that is enough for me to not buy it. I have fallen for these kind of gimmicks too many times.
One thing to also remember is that expansion packs (like the Sims) were a way of extending the game. So basically you could take the entirety of what you spent months building into a "new" game. For PC gaming this is important.
With a version 2 or version 3 you have to start over losing everything.
For games like Animal Crossing I'd say an expansion pack would be preferable to a new game. I've started from scratch so many times I'm not even looking forward to the next release.
DLC, especially planned DLC, is in many instances a lazy cash grab. And as you said it has become the norm.
@Roibeard64 @9CazSonOfCaz It was a different world back then as there was no DLC.
Game studios had to keep their IP relevant, and also it was the only way to implement quality of life mechanics. There may be 4 fighters different between the two but there were still additional moves and different balance.
MK is just a cycle of release core game, add 2 or whatever DLC packs, then announce a new core game. Rinse and repeat.
And what do you get for your DLC? You can't take it to the new game (unlike Pokemon).
It's not that Game Studios today have a problem with pumping out a new game every 6 months. They can't because game development today is much more involved. DLC becomes a way of charging people for phantom editions while they work on the sequel in the background.
I found Engage just played around with the mechanics too much. Three houses was about building a team the way you wanted where as engage was always going to be an over dependance of the engage mechanic making all other strategies void.
@Casco Agreed but the difference was they had to do enough to justify a new game or a warrant it being called an update. Nobody would splash out the price of a full game if it was the exact same thing they already had plus one or two extra fighters.
DLC (for the console market) started as a novel way for companies to expand their game across the core fanbase by offering unplanned add ons without having to develop or pay for a full game.
Now they are just lazy cash grabs and it's a way to dish out a game in tiny chunks. They might work for the mobile market that is largely free to play, but not for consoles. Particularly when the game announced DLC before it is even finished.
BOTW worked well by using the hardware limitations to its advantage. Having a largely empty post apocalyptic world with tough enemies that are better to avoid than take on worked. I got the sense of danger around every corner.
TOTK which was during the rebuild phase just felt empty. Lush green fields of nothing. Plus everything was just a re-skin of the previous game. Even the dungeons fans were calling out for were still a challenge of 5 like the divine beasts. The only real variety were the bosses (instead of 50 shades of Ganon).
I also found the powers like Revali's Gale and Mipha's Grace abilities more useful than a few sidekicks just to throw into your battle and not contribute much.
I'll play BOTW again. TOTK probably not. TOTK had bigger content, but BOTW knew how to use it.
I am going to buy Zelda day 1 without review. Pokemon Legends is also on my wish list. Mario & Luigi: Brothership looks too experimental for my liking.
It does feel like the Switch is winding down though.
I got back into Mortal Kombat about version 9 I think. I learnt back then that DLC is just a way to sell the game to users in chunks. As soon as I saw DLC announced for Mortal Kombat 1 before the game was even released I knew it would just be the same thing. And when they've milked it enough they'll add a 2 to the title and sell us the same game again with more DLC.
Every challenge should already have the rankings and ghost data that we saw from the 1st weekly challenge as an out of the box feature. There is no reason to have to wait 30 weeks to see how your times stack up against everybody else, and then another 30 weeks to see if you managed to make any improvement, as we get leaderboards partially dished out to us in small chunks.
Like the first poster, I gave up on this game after about 2 hours. I want to like it. I really do. But without leaderboards I have no benchmark for my times and nothing to strive for.
The lack of leaderboards for individual challenges has just killed this game for me. I'd like to see at least best time, and then "You are ranked xxth overall". Plus the ability to download ghost data for the record time.
Would also like it if the championships were one real attempt per challenge only. That way players have to choose between the 1/20 time saving strategy or the conservative approach. You know - a real championship.
And speaking of which, if you do a decathlon or a heptathlon the winner is determined by the combined scores of each event. This was just a lazy 5 individual challenge rankings with no overall score or even winner.
I think the developers wanted to cash in on a market without understanding it.
For what next, go back to NES remix please. That was fun at least.
I really enjoyed this game having played the original. But I think it fell apart towards the end once the "find bomb quest" began. The map system is terrible and trying to find places you visited days ago can be hard. It's easy to get lost. And towards the end the clues got a bit too hard to decipher and I found myself checking a play guide often.
There was also a sudden jump in difficulty at the end where I could pass everything comfortably, then suddenly things became too hard and I needed to take a step back.
Those small niggles aside it's a really really good game. I'll give it another playthrough at some point.
I was looking forward to this game having enjoyed the Wii version but I was bitterly disappointed.
In the Wii game there were specific areas to explore with a level of predictability where the marine life would appear. This made it ideal for any completionist to go through the game.
This current version just doesn't make any sense. You're thrown into a randomly generated ocean, only set marine life generated each time. the marine life can be anywhere, and a limited time to explore. It just doesn't work.
From a completionist point of view this game is a nightmare and hard to play. They should have stuck to the original formula.
@Ooyah I do agree but effectively that's the product they are selling. Some people are singles or dont have friend lists. There are ways to identify hacked times particularly if they have ghost replays like Mario Kart. I'd like to see permanent leaderboards for all challenges (global, region, friends, gender, age).
Also with the championships I'd like to see as many trial runs as you like, but one real run per challenge. Once you're ready to go you get one attempt (per challenge) and if you mess up / disconnect, bad luck.
Currently we have a speed running community without leaderboards, and a championship community without the cut throat pressure of competition. Seems like an odd choice to get behind a game like this but to not go the full way.
@Ironcore No leaderboards unfortunately which is a huge oversight. The literal purpose of a speed running game. Hopefully enough complaints to see it released in a future patch or update. I imagine there will be leaderboards for each weekly championship but they desperately need them for all challenges as well. Shame.
@shake_zula Agreed. I spent a good hour or so last night working through the Zelda challenges and managed to get an S for the first few. But I have no idea how that compares to the rest of the speed running community so I feel like I have just wasted my time. Mario Kart had leaderboards for world, region and friends. Even those Olympics games we used to see. No reason this can't have the same for every challenge (even if some of them do have 1000 or so in first place). Definitely an oversight and one I hope they address soon.
To me the biggest disappointment is the lack of leaderboards. The whole point of speed running is to try to be the best in the world. To not have leaderboards for the individual challenges just means spending weeks trying to shave seconds of your best times to see if you can be the best in your household. And for singles this sucks. (granted for some of the challenges there will be thousands who share the record time but at least it sets a benchmark).
I've preordered a digital copy and will give it a go for something between now and the new Zelda game. But don't think I'll play much. These games have been done to death from a speed run point of view to the point of being pixel perfect. They really should have done a new NES remix. Wasted opportunity IMO.
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Re: Zelda: Echoes Of Wisdom Was Built Around 'Being Mischievous'
I think this game works better as Zelda than Link.
Link has a defined formula so when it is not met there is criticism. This isn't a link game. It is a Zelda game.
Since first hearing about this game I often thought that maybe TOTK should have just been this game. And I wonder if during the production of TOTK they thought about that idea (they did hint at a playable Zelda at one point).
TOTK felt too much like a reskin but a playable Zelda and new story, in addition to the new mechanic, would have kept things fresh. Instead we look to be getting two versions of the same concept.
I think most hardened fans will get this regardless. How much we enjoy it and how much replay value there is, are questions soon to be answered.
Re: PSA: Zelda: Echoes Of Wisdom Has Reportedly Leaked Online In Full
People don't play and beat the game within the first minute of playing it. Even if the game wasn't leaked, if you take your time with things and play at a steady pace there will always be somebody ahead of you posting spoilers.
"I want to stay spoiler free so I'm going to read every review, study every article, watch every YouTube video, click every link. Then complain about it"
Re: Here's Another Look At The Legend Of Zelda: Echoes Of Wisdom World Map
@SuperBro64 I think it's the same map but has the Suthorn region (south) and Faron (east). It also has the still world but these don't appear to be a full dark world version (like the Underground of TOTK), but more like "sky islands".
There are lots of videos on YouTube doing comparisons or trying to plot known footage onto the map.
I am not sure if its a true 1:1 ratio but I suspect it will be the same ratio as the GB links awakening and the switch version. It may feel a bit bigger but it probably wont take the player longer to traverse the same distance from one game to another.
We shall find out soon enough.
Re: Round Up: The Previews Are In For Super Mario Party Jamboree
How friendly is this game for singles (for example: online play, or accommodating game modes / AI)?
Re: Talking Point: What Game Should Be 'Switch 2's 'Skyrim Moment'?
I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo undersold the hardware again and gave us something that could barely handle the 1st gen games, and then struggle throughout the course of its life. Not to mention enough memory to store 1 or 2 games.
I'd like to see Nintendo create a new mature IP. Perhaps the Emio experiment might lead them to something like their own Resident Evil or Silent Hill. Particularly Silent Hill as the psychological horror market seems to have an opening. Hack and Slash horror games have been done to death.
Re: Round Up: The Previews Are In For The Legend Of Zelda: Echoes Of Wisdom
@JohnnyMind
These are all valid points but the difference is the progression arc.
In BOTW the player has the same physics system / framework to use at the start. The only difference is the intensity of ability. So they can play any of the divine beasts in any order. Or head straight to Ganon and try to beat him to death with a pot lid and a torch.
In ALTTP you couldn't get to death mountain without the glove. And it wasn't just barriers on the over world. But also dungeons. There were rooms you couldn't enter until you got the dungeon item which was integral to solving the dungeon itself. This made each of them unique. Where as with BOTW because there is no item progression everything can be resolved with the initial toolkit. And this was even more so with TOTK when ultra hand and fuse replaced everything.
When I was playing the Links Awakening Switch port I was reminded I was playing a game boy game. This is based on a SNES game.
To put it another way, think of how long it takes to walk from Links House to Kakariko village (or lost woods) in BOTW compared to ALTTP. Once you strip away the progression pathway and back tracking we see in Classic Zelda games (forced linear play through) I think this game will just be too short.
Re: Round Up: The Previews Are In For The Legend Of Zelda: Echoes Of Wisdom
I'm looking forward to this one but the issue is A Link To The Past just wasn't a big world. So putting in a game breaking mechanic might be a bit of over kill.
With games like ALTTP the gradual upgrade and ability system with a more linear approach helped keep the game fresh and more purposeful. I just dont think this world will be big enough to handle a tool kit given from the get go designed for large open world games.
I'm thinking of Let's Go Pikachu where all Pokemon were pushed into the open and the game was 3D. But suddenly everything felt tiny and it went from a 40 hour game to a 10 hour game.
Re: Shashingo: Learn Japanese with Photography
OK so I purchased this game and have buyers remorse. Imagine if Mario was just 1-1. You play it, think "hey wow, what a cool concept", but then wonder where is the rest of the game.
This had potential for walking around multiple areas, interacting with locals and having basic conversations. Instead there is a single deserted area where you take photos mainly of select inanimate objects. And the translations arent always useful.
There is a small dictionary of words and it does attempt to teach you hiragana / katakana. But nothing compared to what you can get in abundance online for free.
This is a demo and I can't see anybody playing it for more than 15 minutes. The biggest insult is they have already decided to add a paid DLC for additional camera filters when they haven't even made enough content to justify the cost of the initial offering.
How do you say "I want my money back" in Japanese?
Re: Poll: What Review Score Would You Give Emio - The Smiling Man: Famicom Detective Club?
I gave it 3 out of 10
Love the full Japnese voice acting and this is a concept I would like to see repeated.
However the interface and in game logic is completely flawed. I found that I could choose the same options time and time again and get different results. I struggled to even get through the game prologue which is essentially the tutorial. Just brute forcing options until I found a way through.
I think it could have worked better with a more traditional Shadow Gate / Broken Sword style. A bit of a click and point. The visual novel interface just didn't work IMO
Re: 'Shashingo: Learn Japanese With Photography' Snaps Up September Release Date On Switch
@AstroTheGamosian
Unfortunately language is intertwined with culture. I heard an expression that the Eskimos have over 30 words for ice. The more relevant something is, the more you need a framework to express it.
I believe the common Japanese expression "yoroshiku onegaishimasu" doesn't have an English equivalent.
I think anybody who is trying to "speak English" using Japanese words will struggle. I have a friend learning Japanese and that's his approach.
You have the right attitude. Watch bucket loads of anime and pick up words / meaning through context. You don't even have to translate it, just associate it. Thats how toddlers learn.
I use language learning resources just to get a broad understanding of the framework but most of all my learning comes through application / observation.
I am looking forward to this game though. Seems like a fun little run around to apply some of what I have learnt, and to tide me over until Zelda comes out.
Re: 'Shashingo: Learn Japanese With Photography' Snaps Up September Release Date On Switch
@Maxz The caption below it says "sakura" however in the other image the caption says "inked"
So at a glance it looks like they have translated 花 as sakura but it is probably just a broad category, or something else.
Re: 'Shashingo: Learn Japanese With Photography' Snaps Up September Release Date On Switch
@AstroTheGamosian
I have the Japanese Rosetta Stone also. I wouldn't use it as an absolute resource but to complement other learning.
My advice would be:
1/ Avoid Romanji at all costs
2/ Learn Hiragana (japanesepod101 on Youtube - learn Hiragana in 1 hour)
3/ Learn Kanji / Katakana
4/ Take the Youtube speed reading challenges (usually titled "can you read Hiragana in 3 seconds)
5/ Find an interest (TV, movie, music, sport) and indulge in raw Japanese media. Use your interest to form your vocabulary and expand from there
Re: Worms Armageddon: Anniversary Edition Has Been Rated For Switch
@Pigeon agreed
The old worms games, particularly the art work, was one of the things that made them such fun to play. Never liked the 3d versions or the newer art work.
If it's the classic version then I'm all for it. Would love to see Worm's World Party as that was the best worms game IMO
Re: Emio - The Smiling Man: Famicom Detective Club Is Out Next Week, Will You Be Getting It?
@FIS-PODCAST
Agreed. I had no idea what I was doing. I tried every option and I was still stuck. Then I tried some of the same options again and I was able to progress.
If this is about using logic to solve a case then one would expect logic to be an integral part of the gameplay's flow.
I don't think it's a bad game. I think the interface and perhaps translation makes things unintuitive.
Re: Hands On: Emio - The Smiling Man: Famicom Detective Club - Rated M For 'Murder'
I played the demo and found it infuriating.
Police is telling me I can't leave until I answer a question but there is no prompt or button that allows me to do so.
I find myself clicking on the exact same option 5 or 6 times not knowing if I am at the end point of a chain getting a variation of dialogue, or getting new information each time.
At the start I tried every single menu option and could not proceed. But then after trying some options a second or third time I was able to proceed. I still have no idea what I did differently. It's like trying to brute force your way through the lost woods.
I get a sense this is a game where I have to check a bin 27 times before finding the key.
I didn't see a logical way through this game and all I did was play the pre-game. A hard no for me. A shame really as I loved the full Japanese voice acting and was looking forward to buying this one.
Re: Random: Is This The Harshest Mario Kart 8 Has Ever Been?
Mario Kart is a game that punishes you for coming first and not coming first at the same time. I do enjoy it but the SNES version seemed the most balanced. If you were good you could lap pretty much everybody.
Now there is an over reliance on items, drifting techniques and cheap AI. It has become more of a party game than a serious racer.
Re: New Zelda: Echoes Of Wisdom Trailer Highlights Smoothie Making, Horse Riding, And Waypoints
I'm looking forward to this game and definitely a day 1 purchase. I do wonder however if it will have the depth of a game like Ocarina of Time or if it will be the length of A Link to the Past. A quick run through of 8-10 hours and maybe a repeat play to unlock everything.
Re: Zelda: Echoes Of Wisdom GameStop Pre-Order Revealed (North America)
I'll drive to the local game store on launch day, ask if they have it, be told by a trainee that they haven't received their stock yet, drive home and download a digital version. Usual process.
Re: Nintendo World Championships: NES Edition Player Uses Glitch To Top Donkey Kong Leaderboard
@boxyguy it's always going to be a point of debate whether glitches are fair play or not.
I'm of the school of thought that when playing a game you can use every tool available in your tool kit. Sometimes you can cheese a level in an unintended way without it being seen as a glitch.
I think using computer inputs, memory manipulation or action replays codes shouldn't be allowed. But being able to find a quicker way to the finish line, even if unintended, is the fun of speed running.
Re: Rumour: Mario & Sonic At The Olympic Games "Finished"
I enjoyed this series. Was good to have a bash over a few weeks between the release of A titles.
Whether the event was a win or loss depended on the controls. Sometimes they would vary between lazy button mashing or illogical controls. Maybe something closer to guitar hero would have worked better (timing based) or random button press when prompted (reflex based).
Shame no Paris 2024 version. Seemed like a no brainer.
Re: Mortal Kombat 1: Khaos Reigns Announced - Story Expansion, New Fighters And "Big Surprises"
@HeadPirate Unless you worked on this particular project as a high up exec then everything you have to contribute to the motivations behind these decisions are as equally speculative as mine.
And if this is your project, then I'll revert what I said initially. Please, enlighten me to how the 500 dragon crystals were budgeted for and resourced as part of development to justify their in store cost.
Whether DLC is lazy and greedy is a valid debate with both sides being equal. No right or wrong. In some instances it is, in some instances it isn't. What we are both putting forward is a balanced view point. Not a finite or absolute one. Our view point is also circumstantial, and in many instances social / cultural.
At what point DLC is baked into a project varies from project to project. it isn't a science. You know this already.
How a budget is calculated, how DLC is factored into that budget and even resourced also varies from project to project. You know this already.
Whether DLC is paid for as part of the initial project. Or committed to and later resourced separately, again varies from project to project. You know this already.
How can I be universally wrong for something that is so varied, everything I have said would have been encapsulated in at least one project at least one time over history.
If you're educated in project management then naturally you already understand the diversity and complexity of it. If you're educated in game development or are part of the industry then obviously you understand commercial decisions or how to extend profit margins. Also differ from project to project.
Your entire premise only works if WB games are an honest studio and followed a conventional business model. You said so yourself. Type "are WB games honest" into Google and enlighten those people.
I don't have to post my credentials to justify having an opinion. We are both putting forth speculative balanced view points.
I'm not interested in learning "how things work" in this instance because we aren't talking about a fridge or a light bulb. We are talking about a diverse complex market with too many individual business practices realistically count. If you think you have THE answer. You are already wrong.
I don't believe I am spreading misinformation or unfounded information. I also don't believe I am awaiting for somebody to enlighten me. Or maybe that's what I can use my 500 dragon crystals to buy.
Re: Mortal Kombat 1: Khaos Reigns Announced - Story Expansion, New Fighters And "Big Surprises"
@HeadPirate I read your initial post and I don't agree. I actually think that if you, for my benefit, were to post a long post to "enlighten" me as to why I am wrong, it would come across as condescending.
This is a very complex and diverse subject matter and it feels like you're about to jump in with "the answer is A".
In this very specific instance, yes, this kind of DLC is a lazy cash grab. I would have thought the 500 dragon crystals would have been a give away that it is exactly based on the mobile gaming model.
By all means post your thoughts for the broader forum to enjoy but if you were to do so for my benefit, yes, you would be wasting both of our times.
I hope we can meet again in a different news article.
Re: Mortal Kombat 1: Khaos Reigns Announced - Story Expansion, New Fighters And "Big Surprises"
@Bikadovlt "Previous game and DLC sales" at some point becomes a paradox.
And yes, my point remains consistent. Game studios are cut throat profiteers which is why they wouldn't pre-plan DLC to cover costs without even seeing the size of the game base first. I have remained consistent in saying pre-planned DLC is already paid for as part of the existing game development life cycle.
I have also remained consistent in saying DLC is a cash grab, something cut throat profiteers would look for in favour of a simple x units for x $ model.
The game world is different. Maybe decades ago where the console market was for the console market the kind of honest system being proposed was the norm. But today companies have to compete head to head with the mobile market, the PC market is more serious, and even other forms of entertainment given a kid can get lost for hours on YouTube videos.
There are less $ available so companies have to find creative ways to extort more money. Again, oh wait, have I already made that point....
Re: Mortal Kombat 1: Khaos Reigns Announced - Story Expansion, New Fighters And "Big Surprises"
@HeadPirate
Sure why not. If a game has a 2 year planned production and then is pushed into a 3rd year it doesn't jump from $80 to $120 to justify the increased development time. Game studios don't have the same business model as a mums and dads bakery. It is arbitrary.
Some companies even release DLC for free. Some even games for free. There is no right or wrong model.
There is no logic in saying game execs will sit down and say "if we release x number of core units for $80, then x number of DLC for $40, then the time the graphic designer spent on the DLC can be proportionately paid for".
The mobile game market has a model. Release the game for free. Then use paid add ons for the 10% of obsessive gamers to get to profit. Sell them gold versions of what Koroks across the Zelda world were giving Zelda players for free.
DLC for consoles is largely an adaptation of this. Sell the games to people in chunks. Those who dont buy the DLC think they're getting the full game. Those who do think they're getting something extra. For planned DLC the development time is already paid for within the existing game budget. Not based on some projection for something nobody has the data for.
I'm sure those 500 dragon crystals that you can buy through the same premise would have taken the graphic designers proportionate development time.
I don't take people disagreeing with me to be aggressive. I'm not trying to get you to agree with me. I am stating what I believe to be the obvious and you're stating what you believe to be the obvious.
I'm not going to spend hours of my time posting links, videos, journals, blogs, articles to try to convince anybody anything.
The premise of what I am saying is that in most instances, for consoles, DLC is a lazy cash grab to dish out portions of the game in chunks. Distinguishable from updates / side quests. Distinguishable from unplanned DLC (which is a separate resourced project). You can take that how however you like
Re: Mortal Kombat 1: Khaos Reigns Announced - Story Expansion, New Fighters And "Big Surprises"
@HeadPirate It still comes back to the game development lifecycle.
The game framework and logic takes the longest to develop. I watched a video the other day where it said they spent an entire year just getting the mechanics of Ultra Hand right in Tears of the Kingdom.
Once the framework has been developed then art assets (which are what extra fighters are) become negligible. The skeleton models, fatality models, fighting models, game logic etc... has already been built. So it basically takes whatever time to design the actual art asset itself, and punch in the variables.
This is why data miners can find evidence of DLC characters at launch date, or even determine how many new fighters there are going to be. You already have everything. The only thing you are missing is the actual fighter asset data.
For DLC in fighting games its basically cost of licensing if they go for somebody like Terminator. And some graphic designer time. Probably a bit of director / producer time to work the character into the storyline.
Having (as an example since we're all on different currencies) $80 for core game, then two sets of $40 for 12 fighters is not proportionate. One took 3 years to make that would have tied up the best part of a development studio. The other was a few people in the garage for a few weeks (not wanting to undersell it but illustrate a point).
This is why unplanned DLC is honest. Its a small number of rusted on gamers that want to see extra life in their game. So they pay a higher margin to justify the development.
But planned DLC really is selling the game to players in chunks. It's a business model. There's no number crunching on trying to balance the costs of the graphic designers for the extra characters against the projected loyal fanbase who might be playing the game 6 months later. Nobody has that data.
That development time for DLC would have already been paid for during the development of the original game. In fact don't be surprised if the DLC characters were already finished before the game was released.
Make no mistake. DLC is a business model.
Games arent developed to break even. They are developed to make a profit. DLC is a more profitable model because you can continue to milk your loyal fanbase (some people call them Whales) for minimum cost. It's how the whole free to play mobile market can actually exist. And now the console market is trying to cash in.
Re: Mortal Kombat 1: Khaos Reigns Announced - Story Expansion, New Fighters And "Big Surprises"
@HeadPirate
I get what you're saying. But its horses for courses.
Back in the days of arcade machines, companies had to stay fresh. Your arcade machine would be played for 2 or 3 months at most then sit in the corner gathering dust. To stay relevant the big competitors had to keep their games fresh. Turbo edition, championship edition, super mega edition. Hey kids get in line for our next brand new game!
Unfortunately for the console market it probably wasn't a concept that translated well, but the editions were still spaced apart nicely and would have warranted stand alone releases. We were willing to buy them too because it was about taking something new and exciting we saw at the arcade and having repeat plays in our own home.
It's not nostalgic fondness. I don't have any kind of buyers remorse.
DLC is different. You look at Mario Kart DLC and you have a community that is still playing a game several years after its release. So why not get a small team of graphic designers to pump in a few more character models, tracks, and reward the rusted on community? And somebody has to pay for it right? It is unplanned, reactive and relevant. It's honest work.
When a company includes DLC fighter packs as part of its development life cycle then that is nothing more than dishing out the game in chunks. It's not that the loyal fan base get more, it's that the unloyal fanbase get less. From a budget point of view the DLC is being built in production with the main game. There is no turning it off either because people from launch day have already pre-purchased it. Just like Pokemon Go, the game is fed to users in small chunks and they pay every metaphoric and literal step along the way.
There is nothing honest about this kind of DLC. Console developers have looked at models that worked in the mobile market and are looking how to apply that business model to their own line of work.
If DLC is announced as part of the games release that is enough for me to not buy it. I have fallen for these kind of gimmicks too many times.
Re: Mortal Kombat 1 'Year 2' Panel Announced - Story Expansion, New Fighters And "Big Surprises"
@SillyG Agreed 100%
One thing to also remember is that expansion packs (like the Sims) were a way of extending the game. So basically you could take the entirety of what you spent months building into a "new" game. For PC gaming this is important.
With a version 2 or version 3 you have to start over losing everything.
For games like Animal Crossing I'd say an expansion pack would be preferable to a new game. I've started from scratch so many times I'm not even looking forward to the next release.
DLC, especially planned DLC, is in many instances a lazy cash grab. And as you said it has become the norm.
Re: Mortal Kombat 1 'Year 2' Panel Announced - Story Expansion, New Fighters And "Big Surprises"
@Roibeard64 @9CazSonOfCaz It was a different world back then as there was no DLC.
Game studios had to keep their IP relevant, and also it was the only way to implement quality of life mechanics. There may be 4 fighters different between the two but there were still additional moves and different balance.
MK is just a cycle of release core game, add 2 or whatever DLC packs, then announce a new core game. Rinse and repeat.
And what do you get for your DLC? You can't take it to the new game (unlike Pokemon).
It's not that Game Studios today have a problem with pumping out a new game every 6 months. They can't because game development today is much more involved. DLC becomes a way of charging people for phantom editions while they work on the sequel in the background.
Re: Poll: Do You Prefer Fire Emblem: Three Houses Or Engage?
Three houses was a master piece.
I found Engage just played around with the mechanics too much. Three houses was about building a team the way you wanted where as engage was always going to be an over dependance of the engage mechanic making all other strategies void.
Re: Mortal Kombat 1 'Year 2' Panel Announced - Story Expansion, New Fighters And "Big Surprises"
@Casco Agreed but the difference was they had to do enough to justify a new game or a warrant it being called an update. Nobody would splash out the price of a full game if it was the exact same thing they already had plus one or two extra fighters.
DLC (for the console market) started as a novel way for companies to expand their game across the core fanbase by offering unplanned add ons without having to develop or pay for a full game.
Now they are just lazy cash grabs and it's a way to dish out a game in tiny chunks. They might work for the mobile market that is largely free to play, but not for consoles. Particularly when the game announced DLC before it is even finished.
Some DLC is even the price of a full game.
Re: Review: The Star Named EOS (Switch) – A Sparkling Puzzler With A Sincere Story
Sounds good. Thanks for the recommendation.
Re: 50 Best Nintendo Switch Games To Play Right Now (2024)
I agree with BOTW over TOTK.
BOTW worked well by using the hardware limitations to its advantage. Having a largely empty post apocalyptic world with tough enemies that are better to avoid than take on worked. I got the sense of danger around every corner.
TOTK which was during the rebuild phase just felt empty. Lush green fields of nothing. Plus everything was just a re-skin of the previous game. Even the dungeons fans were calling out for were still a challenge of 5 like the divine beasts. The only real variety were the bosses (instead of 50 shades of Ganon).
I also found the powers like Revali's Gale and Mipha's Grace abilities more useful than a few sidekicks just to throw into your battle and not contribute much.
I'll play BOTW again. TOTK probably not. TOTK had bigger content, but BOTW knew how to use it.
Re: 35 Upcoming Nintendo Switch Games To Look Forward To In 2024
I am going to buy Zelda day 1 without review. Pokemon Legends is also on my wish list. Mario & Luigi: Brothership looks too experimental for my liking.
It does feel like the Switch is winding down though.
Re: Mortal Kombat 1 New DLC Fighter Update Out Now, Here Are The Full Patch Notes
I got back into Mortal Kombat about version 9 I think. I learnt back then that DLC is just a way to sell the game to users in chunks. As soon as I saw DLC announced for Mortal Kombat 1 before the game was even released I knew it would just be the same thing. And when they've milked it enough they'll add a 2 to the title and sell us the same game again with more DLC.
Re: Nintendo World Championships: NES Edition Weekly Challenges #2 Now Live
Every challenge should already have the rankings and ghost data that we saw from the 1st weekly challenge as an out of the box feature. There is no reason to have to wait 30 weeks to see how your times stack up against everybody else, and then another 30 weeks to see if you managed to make any improvement, as we get leaderboards partially dished out to us in small chunks.
Like the first poster, I gave up on this game after about 2 hours. I want to like it. I really do. But without leaderboards I have no benchmark for my times and nothing to strive for.
Re: Poll: What Review Score Would You Give Nintendo World Championships: NES Edition?
The lack of leaderboards for individual challenges has just killed this game for me. I'd like to see at least best time, and then "You are ranked xxth overall". Plus the ability to download ghost data for the record time.
Would also like it if the championships were one real attempt per challenge only. That way players have to choose between the 1/20 time saving strategy or the conservative approach. You know - a real championship.
And speaking of which, if you do a decathlon or a heptathlon the winner is determined by the combined scores of each event. This was just a lazy 5 individual challenge rankings with no overall score or even winner.
I think the developers wanted to cash in on a market without understanding it.
For what next, go back to NES remix please. That was fun at least.
Re: Review: Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door (Switch) - Still The King Of Mario RPGs
I really enjoyed this game having played the original. But I think it fell apart towards the end once the "find bomb quest" began. The map system is terrible and trying to find places you visited days ago can be hard. It's easy to get lost. And towards the end the clues got a bit too hard to decipher and I found myself checking a play guide often.
There was also a sudden jump in difficulty at the end where I could pass everything comfortably, then suddenly things became too hard and I needed to take a step back.
Those small niggles aside it's a really really good game. I'll give it another playthrough at some point.
Re: Review: Endless Ocean: Luminous (Switch) - A Meditative Marine Milieu, But Incredibly Shallow
I was looking forward to this game having enjoyed the Wii version but I was bitterly disappointed.
In the Wii game there were specific areas to explore with a level of predictability where the marine life would appear. This made it ideal for any completionist to go through the game.
This current version just doesn't make any sense. You're thrown into a randomly generated ocean, only set marine life generated each time. the marine life can be anywhere, and a limited time to explore. It just doesn't work.
From a completionist point of view this game is a nightmare and hard to play. They should have stuck to the original formula.
Re: Nintendo World Championships: NES Edition Hololive VTuber Tournament Announced
@Ooyah I do agree but effectively that's the product they are selling. Some people are singles or dont have friend lists. There are ways to identify hacked times particularly if they have ghost replays like Mario Kart. I'd like to see permanent leaderboards for all challenges (global, region, friends, gender, age).
Also with the championships I'd like to see as many trial runs as you like, but one real run per challenge. Once you're ready to go you get one attempt (per challenge) and if you mess up / disconnect, bad luck.
Currently we have a speed running community without leaderboards, and a championship community without the cut throat pressure of competition. Seems like an odd choice to get behind a game like this but to not go the full way.
Re: Nintendo World Championships: NES Edition Hololive VTuber Tournament Announced
@Ironcore No leaderboards unfortunately which is a huge oversight. The literal purpose of a speed running game. Hopefully enough complaints to see it released in a future patch or update. I imagine there will be leaderboards for each weekly championship but they desperately need them for all challenges as well. Shame.
Re: Nintendo World Championships: NES Edition Receives A Launch Update
@shake_zula Agreed. I spent a good hour or so last night working through the Zelda challenges and managed to get an S for the first few. But I have no idea how that compares to the rest of the speed running community so I feel like I have just wasted my time. Mario Kart had leaderboards for world, region and friends. Even those Olympics games we used to see. No reason this can't have the same for every challenge (even if some of them do have 1000 or so in first place). Definitely an oversight and one I hope they address soon.
Re: Nintendo World Championships: NES Edition Receives A Launch Update
The game desperately needs a leaderboard. Never thought I'd see a speed running community without a leaderboard. Madness.
Re: NES Remix's Dev Worked On Nintendo World Championships: NES Edition
To me the biggest disappointment is the lack of leaderboards. The whole point of speed running is to try to be the best in the world. To not have leaderboards for the individual challenges just means spending weeks trying to shave seconds of your best times to see if you can be the best in your household. And for singles this sucks. (granted for some of the challenges there will be thousands who share the record time but at least it sets a benchmark).
Re: NES Remix's Dev Worked On Nintendo World Championships: NES Edition
So why didnt they just make a new NES remix instead of a few lazy speedruns?
Re: Poll: So, Will You Be Getting Nintendo World Championships: NES Edition?
I've preordered a digital copy and will give it a go for something between now and the new Zelda game. But don't think I'll play much. These games have been done to death from a speed run point of view to the point of being pixel perfect.
They really should have done a new NES remix. Wasted opportunity IMO.