With the launch of the PS5 and Xbox Series X looming on the horizon, it's inevitable that we're going to see some posturing from the various platform holders as they try to convince consumers that their black box is the one you really need under your TV.
A few days ago, Nintendo's president Shuntaro Furukawa voiced the opinion that neither the PS5 or Xbox Series X would have any real impact on the fortunes of the Switch. Now, Xbox chief Phil Spencer has added his comments to what will no doubt be a real melting pot of soundbites as the year progresses, telling Protocol that Nintendo and Sony aren't the companies Microsoft is looking to beat in this upcoming war:
When you talk about Nintendo and Sony, we have a ton of respect for them, but we see Amazon and Google as the main competitors going forward… That’s not to disrespect Nintendo and Sony, but the traditional gaming companies are somewhat out of position. I guess they could try to re-create Azure, but we’ve invested tens of billions of dollars in cloud over the years.
Microsoft, more so than its traditional rivals, is heavily banking on cloud gaming in this next-gen war, with the Azure-powered Project xCloud promising to revolutionise the way Xbox fans access and enjoy their games. Sony, which purchased Gaikai back in 2012, also has an interest in cloud gaming, but Nintendo is yet to dip its toe into the technology (although it's worth noting that some third-parties, like Capcom and Ubisoft, have done so on Switch already).
Given Microsoft's focus on cloud gaming and its investment in its Azure platform, it's understandable that Amazon and Google would be seen as key rivals, despite the fact that neither company has made any real dent in the 'traditional' gaming space as yet. However, if cloud gaming takes off in the same way that music and movie streaming has done, then the battlefield of the future could look very different – but will Sony and Nintendo, with their market-leading first-party exclusives and massively-popular titles, really be out of the picture?
We're pretty sure that won't be the case.
[source pushsquare.com, via protocol.com]
Comments 129
Well, if they view their competition as Google and Amazon they should easily win then.
Cloud gaming may be the future, but I just don't believe people are ready to fully move into that future yet. I know I'm not.
Oh geez... just give me a physical game and leave me be ...
You’re already getting smashed by the Switch, and you think releasing an even more expensive console is gonna help?
Nintendo has it right, at this point in technology it’s about fun and accessibility more than graphical upgrades and performance (which to be honest you don’t even see great leaps and bounds anymore...).
And I was a huge Xbox fanboy for the longest time, but their focus is skewed and they don’t have the casual IPs that Nintendo does.
I think switch will stay strong through 2020 and 2021 no problem.
A simple Breath of the Wild 2 or Metroid will really hurt XBOX if strategically released in Oct/Nov.
That's a good thing. Perhaps we could get more games from them in the coming years if Nintendo isn't a threat. funny how they worry about Google as they're not doing good in the gaming space.
Wee woo wee woo ignorance alert
Nintendo always marches to their own beat
Sometimes this works ( DS Wii NX ) sometimes ...not so much. ( Virtual Boy Wii U )
But they always do what they want to do.
He is right on some points.
However I think Nintendo could learn a lot from both Sony and Microsoft, and considering Nintendo their position they can ignore stuff like Stadia for a while.
Heck Nintendo could even learn a lot of good stuff from themselves in the past.
No surprise. Microsoft, Sony, and Nintendo are all kind of doing different things at this point.
Sony is doing the traditional, generational, exclusive-driven home console thing.
Microsoft is going all-in on the Xbox-as-a-service thing. They still provide their own hardware, of course, but their ecosystem won't be limited to people who own Xbox consoles. Xcloud users and PC gamers with GamePass will also be fully vested in the Xbox ecosystem.
Nintendo, aside from having its own cultural and software bubble, is going all in on the hybrid design of the Switch. You can play Nintendo games at home or on the go, and the competition really has nothing to challenge that focus.
PS5 is gonna walk it anyway as the Xbox Brand is so confused and the no exclusives for the new system in the first couple of years is idiotic.
Are people forgetting that Nintendo pretty much said the exact same thing?
They aim for different target demographics, from their hardware to software and even the way they present their digital offerings. Of course there's some overlap, but its nowhere near big enough for any of these companies to call it competition when we live in a time where its common for people to buy multiple consoles anyway.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, cloud based gaming won't be the big all-end all that these companies are touting it as. Infrastructure isn't there yet. There's so many countries that don't have the high-speed internet that's required. Heck, Canada has some of the fastest internet in the world in our urban areas, but 95% of our landmass is northern, remote, and rural. Even America has crap internet speeds depending on which county you live in. Until there's some kind of universal coverage for the whole globe that is reasonably affordable, nothing will come close to the reliability of physical disc/cartridge media or digital downloads on a hard drive. Not to mention but when tornadoes and hurricanes and other global warming type events knock out the locations of these cloud servers, that means your super expensive cloud based gaming console is nothing more than an overpriced paper weight.
While I agree that Nintendo is not a competitor to Xbox (it is a complimentary product), I think Playstation is a competitor that is taking a slightly different approach (as consumers would hope for competitors) to get the consumer dollar. I think a powerful offline console can still compete with a powerful cloud, as it is all about the games at the end of the day. I haven’t seen any pure cloud games that can only run in the cloud (except the disaster known as crackdown 3)
Stadia is hardly a competitor at this point. And what's Amazon even doing? So ''beating'' them is a no-brainer. Nintendo, Sony, and even Steam reach a far bigger audience, so they are still very much competing with them for people's time and money.
Do people still actually play Xbox?
Whether we like it or not streaming will be the future of gaming as new generations grow up with streaming services as the norm. Microsoft more so than the others have essentially turned Xbox into the Gamepass subscription rather than a physical platform, so it makes sense for them to see others as rivals.
The reality is that Nintendo is successful because of their own games, so whatever the future holds, Nintendo should always be there
The console wars are seemingly over, in the traditional sense. They're all venturing into their own territory. Sony's sticking with the traditional model, Microsoft venturing into cloud and Nintendo going all portable/hybrid.
Sounds like it going to be more a choice of the actual experience and delivery of the games instead of just a spec thing.
Otherwise, I don't see how Google or Amazon are competitors here. Stadia is barely mentioned anywhere anymore and unless Google really start pushing it more, it's going to die out quick. Google seems to abandon anything they put out that isn't an immediate smash runaway success, and Stadia wasn't that. I figure it'll go the way of countless other Google launches.
And what is Amazon even doing?
For cloud gaming tho, Nintendo would be a big contender if they were going that way. I don't know about others, but if the hardware suddenly doesn't matter and I can stream games at max settings on anything.....I'd rather it be the console I can take anywhere easily.
@LegendOfStewart I'm not ready either for everything being cloud gaming, but there is a good case for it. These days there's just way too many games, many of which a lot of people will only play once or for a period of time, just like a TV show or a movie. Then each of those games get bigger in size each generation, and they all require expensive machines to get the best experience.
So while personally I will always want my Nintendo games physically in my devices because I know I'll want to be able to play them right away at any time (plus the nostalgia/collector aspect), I like the cloud gaming option for those games that I know I'll only play for a while, like Tomb Raider, the Arkham series, or any of the games I have enjoyed through GamePass for just a period of time, which is a really convenient way be able to keep up with new games. Specially now having tried the new Nvdia Now service which works really well.
They have impressed me with xCloud for sure.
Played all of HALO5 on my commute using it and it really performed great. Whatever they have in the background is pretty impressive.
That said. Sure, people who love top 3rd party games not looking at Nintendo. But you are competing with SONY and even PC for their dollar each month.
You don't really get to choose who your competitors are. The audience chooses that.
If I'm going to buy either a PS5 OR an Xbox Series X, then you are competitor with Sony.
Just like it's really dumb when Nintendo tries to say this, it's just as dumb that Microsoft is trying to do the same. Whether they wanna believe it or not, in the general population, it will probably always be Sony Vs Microsoft (and vs Nintendo, to a lesser extent)
When Nintendo says they aren't concerned about xbox series x the fanboys congratulate them for having bravado. When xbox says it doesn't feel like it's a competitor to Nintendo then surely Microsoft is arrogant and has their head in the sand.
I see subscription gaming as being like ebooks (Kindle etc). There maybe a place for it, but only taking its place alongside traditional gaming.
For example, I will read kindle books for convenience. But I’d much rather have a paper book I can hold in my hands.
In the same way, I download games I kind of like, but I buy a physical copy of my favourites.
But, I can see subscription gaming weeding out the chaff of physical media.
Nintendo says they aren't directly competing against Sony/Microsoft because their hardware and software are very different from what the other two companies offer.
Microsoft says that they aren't competing against Sony/Nintendo because those two companies are "unworthy" due to the "possible" rise in cloud gaming.
Big difference.
Microsoft's xCloud has a good chance on beat both Google and Amazon, especially Google and their awful business model for Stadia. Amazon, I don't know what they're doing, so I can't say anything about them.
Streaming as the future though? I hope to God that it isn't. Even though it's nice to play games without downloads and being able to play games at the highest resolutions with less powerful hardware, but being forced to be online at all times to play games is not appealing to me in the slightest. Plus the input lag, compressed image due to streaming, anything that goes wrong with your internet your gameplay suffers along with it, and just for the fact that if the servers shut down your games are gone for good.
I'm fine with having both streaming and consoles/pc hardware as long as I have a choice. Heck, a Netflix-like streaming service for games is great for consumers. But all I hope is that it doesn't turn into streaming-only in the future.
He's not wrong. They are working in their own spaces right now. However, as the article points out, if cloud gaming takes off like a Netflix or the like and Microsoft is at the forefront of that evolution, then that whole spiel about them not being competitors goes out the window and Nintendo and Sony obviously have to take notice and make some decisions
I mean, he's right.
I'm not at all interested in XBox. I'm a Nintendo and Sony gamer.
No surprise there, Microsoft has been losing against both Nintendo and Sony every Gen since they got into the market so no wonder they want to do something different.
They aren't being arrogant and they aren't wrong. If these companies want the future to be cloud gaming, the future will be cloud gaming. Microsoft hasn't done so well with traditional consoles, but this is still one of the biggest tech companies in the world, with total domination over the home PC software market, and they have plenty of money to burn on turning cloud gaming into reality. Which they are obviously going to do, precisely because they haven't done well with traditional consoles.
We're certainly not there yet, and yes, Stadia may have bombed, but when Google, Microsoft and Amazon are all actively trying to make something happen, it's going to happen.
Keep your personal feelings out of it and consider the reality. I'm personally extremely devoted to traditional consoles. I don't even like digital sales of games. I want physical for almost eveything. But what I want isn't what matters. Digital gaming is better for the publishers and manufacturers, and streaming is even better. They will make it happen, whether I want it or not.
I predict one more generation of traditional consoles, maybe two at the most, before gaming goes completely cloudbased.
As must as I despise all things xbox ( including that Phil Spencer prat) I think they are going the right way to future proof their company. I'm talking about 10-15 years down the line when kids who have yet to even pick up a controller are in the mix. They wont be thinking "I want to buy physical media" like we all do nowadays. The future will be streaming ( I hate to admit) as its evolution. Just look how much streaming has dominated with netflix etc
What does the use of the cloud or not have to do with creating good software people want to play? If cloud gaming is as good as they say it is, wouldn't players not even be able to tell the difference?
I get the sense Microsoft is slowly out manoeuvring Sony here. Nintendo are far too prolific an entertainment company to simply rely on traditional hardware. Whilst they are focused on gameplay and gaming ideas, it works to their advantage to create hardware that brings their ideas together. They don't produce generic gaming consoles as it is, not sure why anyone would think they are interested in even further generic hardware at the moment. As gaming platforms become more and more standardised, there is an increasing opportunity for Nintendo to create something unique (blimey, their very mission statement is quite future proof it seems!)
Sony is who I worry about. Companies wanting to create more and more graphics to sate that crowd are more prone to getting left behind with the march of technological advancement. They have kowtowed to third parties and let the tail wag the dog to a certain extent. I know it's popular to say Nintendo are doomed...but anyone with sense knows Sony could be the next SEGA. Probably reads more dramatical than I would want lol. The market has swelled enough over the last 2 decades to have enough room for everyone. I'm sure Sony are doing all right haha
This will be Microsoft’s downfall.
If by next gen he means after Xbox Series X/PS5, then sure, maybe. Cause it will be 10 or more years before cloud gaming becomes mainstream. If he meant otherwise, he’s sadly mistaken.
@LegendOfStewart
See, that's the thing. It may be the future of gaming, but how far into the future? 10, 20 , 30 years? Not anytime soon, and I'm sure it's not on Nintendo's radar. So, when Microsoft makes the premature jump into cloud gaming, Nintendo will be doing its own thing and succeed, because it has always ended up succeeding. I know I'll probably never make the jump to cloud gaming as long as I'm able not to.
Well the Sony comment was dumb but he's right about the switch.
Portables never really have competed against the home consoles. Even portables that have a tv out.
Microsoft is smart cause PC is gonna win the streaming war.
As a computer company, I don’t think Microsoft understands console gamers...
This is the most "haha" statement they've put forth yet.
Unless MS knows something about how soon the global low-orbit internet will be done that I don't (which is, let's be real though, pretty likely) he's full of crock.
Imagine positioning yourself as a direct rival to the gaming monolith that is Stadia. Very big pants move.
Cloud-based gaming can be convenient, but until the issues with input latency are solved, I don't see it taking over. Also, even though I almost always have internet access in my home, I don't want to have to rely on it to play my game's. I probably would not have bought an Xbox One if it had to be online just to play it.
Yeah streaming is the future. Shame they seem intent on selling it now when we don’t want it. Xbox did this last gen - put all their eggs in permanently connected to net basket and it lost them massively.
Why they making a similar mistake again...
No exclusives. Selling it as a service, running down Nintendo and telling us constantly what we want... check the sales figures.... you don’t know what we want...
I own an Xbox and have all three gens... I’m not a hater but Xbox either gets it Very right or very wrong.... and they tend to make very very bad decisions...
Let’s face it, MS have barely competed this gen either...
Pretty sure Microsoft knows they can't win the traditional console war. They have the potential to blow Google out of the water. The X Cloud beta already has a one-up on Stadia simply by having more games available. Game Pass and exclusives give them the upper hand. Hopefully the real thing will deliver once it's ready to be released.
@Kidfunkadelic83
The problem with this future, is that it's driven from the interests of businesses to make more money, NOT from the interests of the consumers, as streaming-everything mostly means that content will be limited and eventually completely lost, or under the control of companies that have total power over what you are and aren't allowed to watch, listen, read and play.
When everything will be transitionned to a "service", it will be the apex of savage capitalism. Because instead of making people pay for goods and products (that they own and can use again and again), you now make them pay and they own nothing.
This is like the difference between paying the rent for an appartment, and paying a house's mortgage. Basically, the industry is saying that everyone's future is to stop buying houses and rent appartments forever. Oh, and the landlord can kick you out for any reason he sees fit. And has complete control over your furniture, and what you can and can't put in your appartment.
From their perspective... it smells like a ton of money. No wonder they're all investing in this. Total control + forcing people to pay forever if they want to play whatever.
I just find it sad that the younger generations mostly aren't seeing it this way. We're raising generations of future techno slaves that won't have any money anymore, or own anything, because everything will be a freaking "service" they'll have to pay every month.
This is an awful headline that misrepresents what he actually said.
They're not competitors because they're BFFs.
@Realnoize I can definitely understand your perspective, but I feel like we are quite aways from an all cloud-based gaming future. Stadia just dropped a few months ago and it's not holding up well. And yes, it is sad to see physical copies of media slowly being phased out. It's just the way of commerce. New ideas cycle in that are more convenient than what was previously available. It's inevitable and I think we have to embrace the future at some point.
@Realnoize I totally agree with you and dont like the way its heading either. I always buy physical whenever I can but it's an unstoppable eventual force I think. I for one wont ever go totally digital on games.I will probarbly stop buying consoles when that happens and just play what will then be my retro ps4 and 5 😂
Amazon and Google is Microsoft's only gaming competitors the next years. Consoles will never generate as much money as a mass market sub which works on like any device.
Game subscription on a market with billions of people is where the money is. Not consoles anymore.
The console wars are dead - we've got Nintendo games on PS4, Xbox games on Switch - no need to compete now.
Hopefully this means Halo on PS4/5.
Xbox is going down an entirely different path right now, but I do think Phil's onto something. He shouldn't be dismissed as being 'ignorant' in any case, as some folks are saying.
@Noid but its not all games across the board is it? When your playing gears and Forza on a ps4 and The last of us and god of war on xbox and mario and zelda on both then it will be dead.
@Kidfunkadelic83 thing is we just stream things we dont care about. I pirate all of my music, and only buy the stuff I like. I think games have a more meaningful impact on people than streaming a tv show that's just alright.
@LegendOfStewart It isn't even just about cloud gaming it is about unifying their platform across all devices, xcloud also very soon will let you stream your own console over the internet to almost any device through their high speed servers.
@Trajan We are not sure yet, we do know Sony has reached out to MS about server usage for something.
What Microsoft needs is arrogance, at least if they want the same success as Sega with the Dreamcast
Says Microsoft, with its terrible sales figures.
Guy needs his head checked.
@gloom it’s called the long game. And Gamepass is basically the Netflix’s for games. That’s what MS is after not the hardware that they have to sell at a lost anyway. Nintendo is the only company that makes money on that.
@JasmineDragon claps
Do I think streaming is the future ? Yes Netflix won. There isn’t a doubt about it.
Is it tomorrow ? No.
Do I like it? No but it’s not for me.
Most of Us isn’t what this is about. Just like last time I checked xCloud is in Beta not Alpha and the series X is coming. The infrastructure isn’t there yet, and people are clouding their viewpoints with what is going on in their lives not what their kids lives will look like.
20 years ago my laptop weighed pounds and had a 3 gig hard drive. Today my cellphone weighs ounces and has 256g hard drive. That’s what this is about.
I can't understand the hate towards Microsoft like some people here are personally offended. Pretty pathetic.
@Kidfunkadelic83
I'm a bit in the same mindset. In fact, there is TONS of games available (and in my backlog too) that I haven't played yet. The problem with consoles is that most of them not being backward compatible means you can't really play all the game you want to play during a single generation (if you actually have a life and do other things in life, I mean). And when you buy the new one, this often means that all the games you haven't played on the previous generation, will stay unplayed forever, for the most part.
Well, to me, this means there are TONS of games I haven't played yet. I have a backlog so huge on PC alone, that it could last me MANY YEARS to go through it.
I don't even anticipate buying any of the new consoles when they get out, or maybe even during their relevant years. Sure, nicer graphics and faster load times are nice, but if it's only to play the new Super Call of Batlefield in Brown Space Turbo edition: The ultimate collector's edition, I'll pass... thank you. Not saying games like these aren't fun anymore, but... you know... I feel like aside from what you can sometimes find in the indie game circle, most of the gameing landscape has stalled a bit for some time already... Sure, things are prettier this generation than the last, but that's it. It's the same old, only prettier. For some people, that's all it takes. But I'm a bit tired.
I think when the cloud takes over, I'll start hunting for old NES and other systems carts, buy some hardware to dump the games myself (doing so is legal in many countries, but check local laws folks!) and have a blast playing my games on various devices.
I don't trust the cloud. There's nothing for me in there.
I love his constant reassuring to fans of their failures but the way he phrases it always makes it seem like he's successful. The fanboys eat up the failure as positivity and become delusional. Don't believe me? Go check out the Xbox One board on Gamefaqs. I've seen Facebook comments on gaming make more sense than those morons 😂.
In any case, MS doesn't see Nintendo and Sony as competition because they simply cannot compete. They're taking Xbox 3rd party, whereas Nintony are killing it in the 'traditional' realm, you know, what the gamers care about.
@Nintyfan Sorry I can't take you seriously talking about fanboys with that nickname.
Personally I think cloud based gaming will just become an addition to what we have now with discs and cards
In theory Microsoft, Amazon, Google, and Apple should of taken everyone in entertainment down 10 years ago with all the money they have. Yet for some reason people still buy Nintendo and Disney and Sony products. It’s as if people want a product to enjoy as opposed to platforms that struggle to produce their own content. Odd, isn’t it?
Let’s see if that changes in 10 years.
The next iteration of the xbox and playstation brands are going to be weird. How much more of a graphical upgrade are we going to see? And increased processing power will make games more populated and dense, I guess? And now google has joined the fray. I'm not sure if this will play out the way everyone expects.
Heck, with Nintendo partnering with Nvidia, they could possibly fill the cloud-gaming void on Nintendo platforms with Nvidia GeForce Now.
That's ok, Microsoft isn't a player in the current gen of gaming.
>chums up to Nintendo and often shares Xbox exclusives and supports Crossplay on Switch
>LOL They're not a main competitor. Stadia is!
Get ready to eat those words once Nintendo outsells Series X with Switch Pro.
Some weird reactions here. What he actually says is pretty sensible. They’re looking to encompass Console gaming, PC Gaming, subscriptions as well as buying games outright, and Streaming. Sony are going a slightly different way and Nintendo a very different way.
Apparently this is shocking to some people.
@Realnoize
That was a perfect comment (47) and took the words out of my mouth. As for comment (64), geez man, are you me???
I could drop out of society and dedicate the rest of my life to finishing all the games I have to play. And I will before I cloud anything.
Considering patches of the UK are still limited to around 3mb regular broadband (and spotty ones at that), and those that do have fibre are seeing slowdown on Stadia - run by one of the worlds foremost in internet technologies - I fail to see cloud gaming become a mainstream choice for many, many years.
Next-gen every console will do their own things so I could see why Microsoft say Nintendo isn't their competitor:
Nintendo Switch = All about handheld and home gaming
Sony PlayStation 5 = All about VR gaming
Microsoft Xbox Series X = All about cloud service gaming
Intellivision Amico = All about family friendly couch co-op gaming
PC = All about online gaming
Atari VCS = All about something that may or may not be gaming
@Xiovanni
I truly feel for ya. I'm a father of two, and I seriously don't know if my kids will ever have the means to actually buy a house. which is sad. Unless they move pretty far from the city where the prices are still manageable. We barely managed to buy one many years ago, when the market was starting to go up over here, so I consider ourselves lucky.
This is completely different type of problem, I know. But this also makes me somewhat mad when you see all these eco-warriors out there saying that suburbs are evil and contributing to climate change by way of forcing people to travel more and the like... Because people buy houses where they can afford them. It's quite legitimate for any human being to actually want to own the place they live in. Saying we should all live in the big cities is saying we should be a nation of renters and this will simply widen the gap between classes even more.
But... I have small hopes. The populations are getting older (at least in some societies) which means at some point, there will probably be a lot more homes to sell than there are buyers who can afford them, which will may drive prices down.
I hope that will be the case. For my kids.
Not worried about Amazon. Their apps are horrendous and having to wait a good 60 seconds before a film starts when streamed to Chromecast doesn't fill me with confidence about the performance of their cloud services.
I don't mind digital downloads, but streaming is another thing. I don't have the best internet connections but good enough to download games, and streaming is just not an option for me. Digital downloads: yes, but if it becomes all streaming then I probably will not buy future consoles.
Sorry Microsoft, I’ve never owned an Xbox and don’t plan on it. You get money from me every 5 years or so when I get a new pc, and since I purchased cuphead for my switch. Sony gets a small amount more, since I own a ps4 and my son pays for his ps+. But at the 3 games a year vs 75 on my switch already...I guess they need to step up their games if they want my money.
Cloud gaming will be the future when the future has 5g in every town, because I don’t see anyone having a great experience with what we have today in so many areas.
@Roto13 Gotta get those clicks somehow.
Interviewer: Are the two companies everybody else thinks of as your competitors — and who very clearly sell a lot more consoles than you — your main competitor?
Microsoft: Nope, definitely not, it's these two other guys who have barely entered the market. You should compare us to them — oh, wow, look how great we're doing! Geez, how fortuitous!
Considering that not everyone has access to internet fast enough to stream games properly at their house, let alone on the go, considering streaming to be the ‘future’ of the industry is a bit far-fetched. Aside from that, even with a sufficient internet connection, there are other reasons some may not want to exclusively stream their games, such as a lack of access to your games when there is an internet outage, the inability to have a physical copy of a streamed game, and potential subscription costs.
@JasmineDragon I have to disagree with you. They said the same for DVDs, CDs, books, etc. Yet they're still here. I honestly believe cloud gaming will just coexist with consoles and pc.
@KitsuneNight Nintendo marches to their own beat because they don't want to have to compete.
At this rate, Xbox Series X features (Cloud gaming, Almost no interesting 1st party games on Xbox machines like Nintendo have) will be a big joke.
He doesn’t see the greatest console ever made as competition?...... made by the biggest video game company in history?....... 😂.
To be fair he’s right. What Nintendo have done is taken the Gameboy and given it steroids whilst sat in a nuclear grow bag and given birth to single greatest piece of gaming hardware ever conceived.
You still “need” a hardwired home gaming unit, as if you look deep down and honestly, we are all graphics to some extent. But truth be told, everyone needs a Switch as that is the future of actual gaming.
@rdm22 Interviewer: Are the two companies everybody else thinks of as your competitors — and who very clearly sell a lot more consoles than you — your main competitor?
Microsoft: Nope, definitely not, it's these two other guys who have barely entered the market. You should compare us to them — oh, wow, look how great we're doing! Geez, how fortuitous!
It's ridiculous when Nintendo claims they are not competing with Sony and Microsoft too.
Microsoft probably plans to launch Game Pass and xCloud on the Switch and the benefit Microsoft would gain from that would likely be higher than having Xbox Series X exclusives.
News: Microsoft Exaggerates Phallic Measurements, Everyone Laughs.
@User199x It's true that those technologies are still around, but they are rapidly disappearing. I still buy everything I can in physical media, and it's harder and harder to find them. The kids who drive the market don't care about physical media anymore. Most of them are absolutely fine with "buying" e-books, MP3 music and streaming video.
In the printed world, there has been a massive shift towards e-publishing. DVD and Blu-Ray sales have plummeted in the last few years. And a lot of people in their teens and twenties don't own a single CD and see them as relics.
The old media are hanging in there longer than many people predicted, but it's impossible to deny that the writing's on the wall. Sooner or later, the world will move on.
@AnotherGoblin Pretty sure they already confirmed the cloud for that but my memory could be fuzzy.
@User199x do CDs really co-exist? When’s the last time you’ve been to a major box store. In fact If I recall correctly Best But phased them out of the physical stores.
Books are a slightly different story because of the physical low tech experience it provides.
Let me ask you something.
When’s the last time you’ve actually physical wrote a letter to someone?
How many kids use cursive?
He's not wrong, Nintendo Switch and Xbox Magenta Plus wont be direct competitors, but if either Nintendo or MS think their existence wont impact each other then they are both fooling themselves.
People only have so much time and money to devote to gaming. Of any type.
@mousieone CDs do still exist very much in Japan - where there are a lot of stores that sell them still and even used CD. I've bought a lot of them while I've been here. Many Japanese CDs still have absolutely gorgeous artwork on the discs. Especially game soundtracks.
Forget kids, I don't know anyone who regularly uses cursive and is under the age of 50.
Could someone explain cloud gaming to me?
@mousieone Responding to your questions:
1. From what I've seen, people still buy CDs each time I pass though the mall. Of course, not everyone but they still do.
2. I regulary send letters to my familiars. No matter if physical or digital. It also helps with my writing skills.
I honestly can't speak for cursive.
If Nintendo isn’t a threat, release Rare Replay on Switch.
@Karatecanine It's gaming on a device you don't own at a location you are not physically at. Like a data center.
If the cloud server has enough bandwidth and your connection is fast enough (low latency is actually more important than mbit/sec) then you could have a decent gaming experience.
Only there are a few BIG downsides:
1. WiFi / wireless (mobile) gameplay adds a LOT of latency.
2. You are almost always required to pay a high monthly fee.
3. Often you still have to buy the actual game licenses for FULL price (see Stadia)
4. You are required to have an internet connection, and a fast one.
5. You will always have more latency than playing locally (going from 5-10 ms for a good connection to 11-50ms for a wifi connection to 51-200ms for a bad connection.)
There are some upsides, though. You don't need expensive hardware in order to stream games. So you save in the initial purchase of expensive hardware.
I, for one, have Shadow Boost. Which basically is a Windows 10 gaming PC running in the cloud, you can download and install your games onto it and play them over the internet. The quality is comparable to an GTX 1080, and a 4 core CPU at 3.4Ghz and it has a 256GB SSD for € 15 / month. (There are more expensive tiers as well, with better hardware)
Shadow is really stable and runs with around 5-10ms latency if connected by cable. And it has the upside that if you chose to upgrade your own hardware you could simply go back to playing locally since you own all games on their own platforms (Steam, Origin, etc)
I am port begging, shamelessly for Halo: The Master Chief Collection and Rare Replay on Switch, plz, Microsoft!
@AnotherGoblin As long as one could download (and keep on their system forever-we’ll as long as that Console still functions and/or its still listed on the online shop servers), in addition to streaming the game.
@User199x Lucky you. You can’t buys CDs at any mall I’ve been to recently, and those are dying as well. (People drive thru grocery shop now ..: ) My car doesn’t even have a CD player in it for example and it’s a 2015. I know CDs exist but barely. Have you seen an 8 track lately?
Where Books and Records have made a comeback in recent years due to offering unique experiences CDs/DVDs are virtually dead. (DVDs not Blu-rays)
It’s nice that someone still writes but judging for the complaints from the postal community, you are slowly becoming the last.
@Heavyarms55 yeah that’s why I import ._. Been doing that for a long time. The funny thing is Records are actually making a comeback, and usually have goodies like that <.<
But it is strange time when Records have a larger footprint than a CD in a box store.
@Crono1973 Agreed. It only makes sense if you think everyone is thinking about owning multiple systems to suit their various needs. Would that we could all be so fortunate. For people who are in the market for a console and, as of right now, own none of the current gen consoles, I would venture to guess that the majority are not so flush that they can pony up for a Switch and whichever other console they want as their more powerful piece of stay-at-home hardware. So they have to pick — and when they pick, they're almost certainly picking between Switch / PS4 / Xbox One. I.e., they are each other's chief competitors.
How many times have we heard this?
Phil just can’t stop talking, and Nintendo had the best E3 last year. They have more quality games than MS. Nintendo isn’t perfect at all, but their decisions have been better. This is why people should own a Switch instead of an Xbox One.
@DarthFoxMcCloud
Yep, my ISP claims I get up to 100mb/s down and 10mb/s up, but it sure doesn’t feel that way. I can’t even get remote play options to work well with my internet when I’m the same house.
I was in Google’s streaming beta with AC:Odyssey, it was ok, but it was also a single player game. Once you throw in any kind of online component, performance will take a hit.
I’d be ok if streaming progressed to compliment traditional gaming, akin to buying a Blu-ray that comes with a digital copy. Gaming via streaming only? No thanks. I don’t care if it works flawlessly.
Let’s also remind everyone about that other little problem called data caps. Even if the service is capable, data caps will kill the streaming trend to mainstream audiences.
@User199x It's true that those technologies are still around, but they are rapidly disappearing. I still buy everything I can in physical media, and it's harder and harder to find them. The kids who drive the market don't care about physical media anymore. Most of them are absolutely fine with "buying" e-books, MP3 music and streaming video.
In the printed world, there has been a massive shift towards e-publishing. DVD and Blu-Ray sales have plummeted in the last few years. And a lot of people in their teens and twenties don't own a single CD and see them as relics.
The old media are hanging in there longer than many people predicted, but it's impossible to deny that the writing's on the wall. Sooner or later, the world will move on. And we won't have any choice in the matter, because they simply won't be making CD players and physical-based consoles anymore.
@Rodan2000 I play my Xbox One more than my PS4. Its a great system with tons of great games, and the BC with 360 and Xbox games helps as well.
Not interested in Microsoft or Sony except for PC's and TVs. I'm loyal to the big N and have been since the early 90s.
@mousieone Records have that retro/nostalgic vibe as opposed to CDs which probably still just feel obsolete to most people. I say give it another 10-15 years and there will be more people looking back fondly on CDs.
Funny because Nintendo sees their rivals as Apple and Google.
@Heavyarms55 perhaps but records also offer a sound quality experience than CDs can’t replicate
@mousieone I grew up listening to my father's record collection and I don't agree. Nothing against records at all, they can be very nice and certainly fun to collect and listen to, but there's nothing about the audio experience that I find particularly unique.
There is something about the mechanical nature of record players and being able to see the moving parts that CDs cannot replicate however.
@Heavyarms55 Yeah I’m sure. Also, I’m sure there some that can’t see physicality and low tech enjoyment out of book. I get it. Totally.
But whilst in 15 years people may try to hunt CDs down out of nostalgia , physical things like records and books have a found permanent place and new versions are actively being made. It’s different.
But at least there are countries like Japan still like physical media
@mousieone I feel like you are dismissing CDs the same way you seem to think people dismiss records. lol And CDs are hardly out of production, people absolutely do still make them.
On the topic of books, I agree and I too prefer a physical book in my hands but books are heavy and expensive to transport in large numbers so they're problematic for people who will have to move every few years, like myself.
While high speed internet may be more common, the US political system has ensured that the US is way behind other countries because of the same toxic approach to capitalism that allowed Microsoft to become to big in gaming.
The best thing that could happen for their cloud gaming strategy would be if somebody like Bernie got elected and demanded that the US's ISPs actually do their job and serve the people. Until then you'll at least need systems to be able to play games locally even if they're all download only.
I also think Microsoft is over estimating how important graphics are to people. A well crafted game in a nice art style is fantastic. And I think in terms of games as a service, Apple Arcade could start to seriously chew into the home and mobile gaming market.
@Heavyarms55 pfft my CD collection disagrees with you.
It’s not dismissive just a reality that I live with. Trying to buy a “New” CD is much harder than it used to be.
@mousieone That may depend on where you live and your willingness to order online.
@JasmineDragon yup, same point as I made earlier. Fast forward 15 years when our kids are teens or just old enough to pick up a controller and no one will care for physical media apart from us relics. Microsoft may not win the battle but I think they are future proofing the war. I mean how on earth are people going to buy physical media for a game machine where physical media isnt even produced. You've got 2 choices really. Stop gaming or buckle to the streaming trend.i fear people are not looking at the bigger picture here and are looking 5 years down the line when they should be looking 15-20. We will not be the target audience then. It will be all these kids, like you say who stream and digital buy without a thought for physical media. It's just so much easier and convenient to have Netflix, prime, spotify, YouTube etc and convenience will win the war. It will always win in the long run. Kids of today are alot lazier than than they were when I was a kid and I'm only 36 ( only 36 he says 😒) I even see it with my own kids. They dont want to go out and play because all of their mates are sitting behind a console gaming too.
@sanderev thanks for the info. I don't think i'd be a fan of cloud gaming, simply because I love owning physical copies of my games. And my internet sucks.
Microsoft, as long as your actual software has more in common with what Nintendo and Sony are offering compared to Apple and Google (HD graphics, real controllers, local multiplayer options, more complex experiences, etc.), they are still your primary competitions.
In fact, you may even be further polarizing the competition by making gamers decide if they prefer to stream their games or play from local data.
@Karatecanine Cloud gaming is a gaming service that required an internet connection to run. In order to play games on the cloud, you need to register an account through a cloud gaming service such as PS Now (formerly Gaikai and OnLive), xCloud, or Stadia. Once you had an account, access to a game is just as simple as accessing the app through login, then choose a game and play. In certain cloud gaming service you may be required to pay a monthly fee for additional contents or features, also in some cases you may be required to purchase certain games as if they were release for a console meaning paying full price for a game you probably may lose access to at any time.
On how cloud gaming works, it goes like this. You choose a game and that game will work on whatever device that cloud gaming service supported. The cloud gaming service will stream your selected game from a work station somewhere to your supported device, as long as you had a stable internet connection the stream should work as intended. Remember you're not downloading anything here, streaming a game through the cloud is similar to watching something direct and live such as a live broadcast or a live concert or something. For a better example think of cloud gaming as a telephone call or a video call of sort. Your connection is hamper by latency, the better your connection, the less the latency. If the cloud gaming service you use is located farther away from your home location or your internet is struggling, chances are your game stream will not run very well and could cause latency between game sessions.
Latency will delay control inputs, will cause graphics to tear or glitch at times which may not show up at the origin location but may pop up at your end, sounds or audio may be a few second pitch delay, it could also dip performance at times and eat up your data cap as well. Most people tend to think that cloud gaming is like Netflix but for games, no it's not. Cloud gaming is not like Netflix but for games. It's like Netflix if you actually do anything in there instead of watching movie and we all know how terrible that could be. Going through menu, moving cursor, and entering the search bar for anything on Netflix cause latency, those took times on Netflix. Just imagine doing that everyday on stream and that's what cloud gaming feels like.
The biggest shock here is that Amazon are still doing some sort of game thing. I have Prime and had no idea; I thought it ended with Pac Man and a couple of other games on my Fire stick. If they are one of the Xbox competitors then they must have low sales expectations
The best cloud gaming I’ve had to date was in Cloud Kingdom in Super Mario Odyssey and that won’t change for a long time!
On a serious note I can see cloud gaming making a splash in a number of years time (10-15) but it won’t change the tide completely. Some people here are suggesting that the big companies have all the power and if they want to force cloud gaming on us then there’s nothing we can do. I don’t subscribed to that. People will choose the best option for them in the free market and kids these days still like to collect and own things. Pokemon/Paw Patrol figures/Disney Princesses etc etc. I predict digital downloads and cloud gaming will exist side by side for many many years. Physical games unfortunately will probably disappear though which makes me sad.
@beazlen1 Yep, as long as cloud gaming doesn't get AAA exclusives there will be always be local gaming. I don't see cloud gaming replacing local gaming in 100 years. Since the issue, latency, will always be greater over internet than local.
@CaPPa Amazon owns Twitch. And Twitch is really big right now
@sanderev completely agree!
@Dezzy I agree with you there. I’ll be watching to see what the new consoles do and by 2021, make my selection. Certainly don’t need two boxes with 98% of the same game library under my television and I’m sure most consumers feel the same way.
I’m becoming less attached to physical media because I feel most games are one and done so as much as I like PS, Gamepass for 60 bucks a year is becoming more and more enticing.
It seems like people are forgetting about Geforce Now already running on Shield. While certainly not "flip a switch" easy, I think Nintendo could very quickly get into the game streaming space through their partnership with Nvidia. The Switch hardware being so similar to shield, it would only take software implementation from the two companies to make it happen.
Yeah sure phil. Sure
So it turns out the big 3 vonsole manufacturers and game developers are not competing with each other... right.. thats sone
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