Alshain01

@DefHalan Oh ok. It seems strange, but I guess it's a bit like the White/Black wii u.

@Hordak I'm not arguing that it isn't stronger than the Wii U. Only that it is too expensive for what it does if you don't count its ability to go mobile. It's still weaker than a PS4 and that is cheaper.

All I'm saying is if you don't want a mobile device, this thing isn't worth $300. The Wii U on the other hand was worth every penny because it had something unique that the PS4 didn't have that I cared about.

@Hordak Like I said, it doesn't need to have the dual screen play, but it shouldn't cost the same as one that does. The Switch is too expensive for a console, it's a good price for an extremely powerful mobile if you want a mobile.

@Anti-Matter Ok, you seem to be either intentionally or unintentionally throwing up straw man arguments that I am not interested in pursuing. Please stop putting words in my mouth.

Just curious, are all the retail units going to have the ugly red and blue joycons or will there be black ones like we have seen before?

I'm not buying one anyway, I'm just really curious why they would go away from the sleek design to the clown handheld.

@Tisteg80 I haven't seen a game I'm interested in yet, except BotW, which I can play on my Wii U. Plus it has no backward compatibility. So at launch it has less games than the Wii U did.

I don't expect everyone to have the same views as I do, but I do expect Nintendo to understand there are different audiences and they are abandoning a big one full of loyal customers.

(I am curious about Mario Odyssey but it remains to be seen whether I will actually be interested. 3D Mario games tend to be hit or miss for me.)

@Anti-Matter
$300 for Switch with no second screen functionality = not worthy
$300 for Wii U with second functionality = worthy

$150 for Switch with no second screen functionality = worthy.

It's all a matter of perspective. I don't give a flying flip that thing can go mobile.

Switch's ability to go mobile = no value for me

@Anti-Matter I'm not afraid of battery life, I wouldn't be using the battery at all. You didn't read my posts before replying. I'm not in the mobile market.

@Hordak No, I don't. I have a Straight Talk flip phone. It serves me well. What I'm saying is I won't buy a Switch because it is too expensive, and it wouldn't be too expensive if it were a console.

@CircuitWrangler3 Well I like the dual screen feature, but I don't need it. But the problem with the Switch is I am paying for the extra harware and still not getting it. With the Wii U I paid for the hardware and got to use it. I pay for a battery, I pay for a second screen, I pay for that technology when buying the Switch, and that is why it is $400 without a game. For me, it will never leave the dock. So why would I pay that for something I will never use?

If they made two offerings, same internal hardware, using the same software and same carts, one with a screen and battery, one without (and probably just packaged with a Pro controller instead of JoyCons) and required to be tethered to the TV but cheaper, then they could please both markets.

However Nintendo is too short sighted for that, so instead they shun loyal customers and chase them away. They may eventually choose to do this option several years from now, but I don't want to buy a console half way through its life span either so by neglecting it now, they pretty much ensured that I won't ever own one even if they do.

@CircuitWrangler3 I'm not saying it won't be used by other gamers, but comparing it to the Wii U is still a mistake, because those other gamers use 3DS as a mobile platform and will use Switch as a mobile platform. I didn't say the screen wouldn't ever get used, I said it wouldn't ever get used AS A CONSOLE. Nobody uses the Wii U as a mobile platform because it doesn't have that ability, and the Switch screen does not have the ability to be used as a console like the Wii U. So the comparison of the Wii U Gamepad vs the Switch mobile screen is faulty, what I said is correct. They have two different target audiences, I just happen to be in the Wii U audience which is why I won't be buying a mobile device like the Switch... make no mistake, the Switch is not a console, it is a mobile. It is pretty powerful for a mobile, and has a neat ability to attach to a TV, but it's still a mobile. It's the natural progression of the 3DS, but not the Wii U. If anything it has less abilities than the Wii U (features, not power).

A comparison of them is kind of irrelevant. The Wii U Gamepad gets used with the console, the Switch stays in its dock as a console and is never used.

It would be more relevant to compare the Switch screen with the 3DS.

That is my whole issue with this console and why I won't be buying it. I have no need for a mobile device and no desire to spend so much money on a bunch of technology that would literally never get used. At least with the Wii U the second screen got used.

I expect it to sell about as well as the Wii U.

That is one of my concerns on the switch alleviated, but not yet enough to make me buy a Switch.

It's "Number Two" feature... I see what you did there.

@DarkKirby Depends on what you mean "elaborate". There are limits to everything and people like to push them. KSP doesn't stop you from doing that but it will make any system crawl if you add enough parts. That said, you can add quite a bit, especially since Unity 5 was introduced.

The people that have the biggest issues are people who build space stations and ships of the science fiction sized variety, the game itself targets real world rocketry though. If you stick to realistic sizes or even slightly futuristic sizes you won't have much an issue on a decent PC. Just steer clear of the 1000 part monstrosities.

@SLIGEACH_EIRE The reason it is taking so long is they ran into issues with an... inexperienced... porting company when they hired Flying Tiger. Those of us who frequent the official community kind of predicted it. They have since dismissed that company and hired BlitWorks (responsible for ports of Bastion, Don't Starve, Rebel Galaxy, and several others) to fix the problems with the existing PS4/XBox ports and probably work on Wii U or the Switch if they decide to continue it.

I have the PC version, I'd really like to play it with the gamepad, but it's not going to make me change my mind on not buying the Switch and truth be told, it's going to be better on the PC no matter how good the console version is.

I think "doomed" is an over reaction, however Nintendo has thrown all it's console eggs into one basket by merging the handheld line, and if they have another failure they may end up a game developer like Sega.

I learned my lesson with the Wii U, I will wait to see if it fails before I buy. Of course, if everybody does that, it will fail. That however is not my concern.

@Nico07 But framerate changes do not account for the video. That was all color and lighting.

EDIT: Oh, you were referring to my earlier post. Well in that case, it's still not the same thing. The "framerate" and the "noticable performance" are two different things. Actual framerate is not likely the cause of sluggish behavior that the article mentions. It was likely unoptimized. So running at two framerates is irrelevant really.

@Jamotello That too is a comparison months apart in development. We don't know that they didn't simply make changes to the game to cause those minor differences. The Wii U version today could look just like the Switch version. Unless we can see a snapshot of both versions at the same time, it is an unfair comparison.

Comparing the framerate between two versions months later while the game is in development is a really dumb thing to do NintendoLife. Was the framerate better because it was on the switch, or because they began optimizing it?

I'd almost bet it's the latter. Optimization is the last phases of development. During development code gets very 'messy' and once cleaned up and optimized the game will always run better.

Everything I read about this screams "Stay Away". Paid online service? Really?

There is also the possibility that given the failure of the Wii U, retailers are sheepish to make large orders on another console that they may have ample stock of when nobody buys it.

It's going to have to last until Nintendo decides to stop screwing around with the Switch and make a real console.

I agree, I don't think specs matter, I think concept matters and I don't think this concept will sell any better than the Wii U.

I agree, I don't think specs matter, I think concept matters and I don't think this concept will sell any better than the Wii U.

I agree, I don't think specs matter, I think concept matters and I don't think this concept will sell any better than the Wii U.

I agree, I don't think specs matter, I think concept matters and I don't think this concept will sell any better than the Wii U.

I agree, I don't think specs matter, I think concept matters and I don't think this concept will sell any better than the Wii U.

I agree, I don't think specs matter, I think concept matters and I don't think this concept will sell any better than the Wii U.

I don't know, everything I hear about the Switch tells me it is not going to be a very successful product. Time will tell. I don't think Nintendo will be doomed, but I think the switch experiment will fare no better than the Wii U.

@Joeynator3000 You just described all of video gaming. It's all a waste of time, which is the whole point.

@bolt05 Oh I understand some people will like it, I'm just saying I don't think the majority will and that's why Sun has taken off. The fact you purchased moon so you didn't have to play at night actually confirms my statement.

As for the game, I have two of them (Y and AS) and quite frankly they are both the same game practically. I don't have a lot of money and there is no way I'm passing on BotW. Maybe if they go on a Nintendo Selects sale in a few years.

@Mr_Zurkon Well maybe I will just skip the generation entirely then. I hated playing Y in the dark, just as the sun started going down I'd be done with the game for the day.

I really need to be saving my money for Breath of the Wild anyway. Given the choice between the two, this game looks like pac man in comparison.

@Mr_Zurkon right, so if you keep normal hours, it's always dark when you are playing. I sleep at night and play during the day like a normal person.

I suppose people who work an altered (graveyard) shift might find Moon appealing but that is a minority.

I'm not surprised. I wouldn't want to be playing with it always dark. If I ever get the game I will get Sun just for that reason alone.

@westman98 You have given no facts. You have given opinion which you assume is fact.

@westman98 You can dream, here in reality it will be forgotten quick.

@cracka They were packaged differently in the U.S. Toon Link and Zelda came as a set.

@westman98 The retailers have absolutely no idea what the price will be. My guess is it will be closer to the $300 range (I have no idea either though). However, even $50 is a pretty big increase over the 3DS and most parents don't buy their kids the XL, which is the biggest demographic for the 3DS.

That's just another market they would be abandoning. So this device doesn't appeal to mobile only users, console only users, or families with multiple child households. The list is getting thin.

The difference between us here is you are looking at it from a perceived popularity standpoint while I am analyzing it from a market share and demographic standpoint. The problem is perceived popularity is irrelevant.

@westman98 Well, I disagree. Pokemon is not strong enough to ensure it is not a Wii U because Mario (a bigger, higher selling franchise) was not strong enough to ensure the Wii U was not a Wii U. Maybe the two combined can help, but I doubt it. The ultimate decider will be how people view the console as a whole, not its first party games.

If it doesn't start showing signs of success immediately based on it's own merits, 3rd party devs will abandon it and it will fail just like the Wii U. Ultimately it is the availability of 3rd party titles that can save it, but for that to happen it has to be interesting to the mass public and I just don't think it will be. It will be interesting only to those who want both mobile and console. Those that want only mobile and those that want only console will not buy it.

Without knowing the price I can tell you it will be too expensive for it's performance level due to the screen and battery that are completely useless to a console-only user. Unlike the Wii U, if this thing never comes out of the dock, that screen and battery are just superfluous expense. Likewise most portable-only gamers will either want a versatile tablet or a cheap 3DS (or a more portable 3DS, because this thing doesn't look all THAT portable in comparison). So going back to my very first comment, it's a jack of all trades and master of none. It's target audience is too small. I just don't see how it can succeed.

@westman98 Again, if the dozens Mario titles can't save the Wii U, one Pokemon game will not save the Switch.

It takes a game console to sell a game console, no single franchise is going to save it, and the switch is not going to sell itself.

@westman98 So you picked 3 games out of the entire Mario franchise and call that numbers. Sorry, I want all the numbers, not just 3 games. Franchise vs. Franchise.

@westman98 You are wrong. Period. Show me the numbers, I want proof. Numbers don't lie.

@westman98 Well I didn't say New Super Mario, I said the Mario Franchise. The whole thing. We see many games in the Mario franchise throughout the year, we see a pokemon game once every two years. Therefore, Pokemon isn't enough. I can think of 3 mario games released off the top of my head in 2016 alone, and the last remake of a pokemon game before Sun and Moon was two years ago, longer for a new one.

@westman98 In your mind maybe. Mario sells double what Pokemon does. That is not opinion, that is the numbers. It is fact.

@westman98 Again with the Pokemon, people think that is some console selling demon, but the Mario franchise is bigger and sells more and it didn't save the Wii U. One franchise isn't going to make this thing successful.

@Anti-Matter But that audience who want BOTH of them is a small subset of the other two. Not enough to make this console successful.

@Anti-Matter Go for it, just don't be upset and say you had no warning when it sells less than the Wii U and gets abandoned by Nintendo. I'm telling you, this thing has no clear audience.

People that desire consoles aren't going to waste their money on screens and batteries they won't ever use. People that desire mobile probably don't want something that big and expensive unless they want a true tablet. There are going to be very few that find this concept desirable.

@Anti-Matter Keep telling yourself that while the thing is flushed down the toilet faster than the Wii U.

.... and a master of none.