The Nintendo Switch is marketed as a home console first, even though the guts of the system are in the portable tablet. The dock which connects to the TV honestly not that great, though. Not only are there widespread complaints of poorly manufactured docks scratching the displays of Switch units, but they're also rather bulky considering the limited tech included in them.
Reddit user Jolimon recently took it upon themselves to upgrade the Switch dock a bit, and the results are rather impressive. After 3D printing a significantly smaller chassis, Jolimon removed the internal components of the dock and transplanted them into the new one. This new dock has a greatly reduced form factor and also allows one to have a longer USB cable so it can be stored easily behind a TV. While the design of it is still being worked out, Jolimon has said that they'll likely start taking orders once manufacturing is planned.
What do you think? Would you order one of these? How long do you think it'll take until Nintendo inevitably makes a revision to the Switch dock? Drop us a comment in the section below.
[source imgur.com, via reddit.com]
Comments 119
I'm looking at the photo and I don't understand it. Where does the console go?
Its cool and all but my thing is, it kinda defeats the purpose of the ease of docking the Switch and just picking it up and taking it with you. Now you have to get your plugs out and plug it in. I personally haven't had any trouble with my dock but I understand the somewhat reasonable complaints.
I think it's more like, "How long before Nintendo inevitably hands out a C&D to this fella?"
@OorWullie lays flat on top.. LOLLLLLL.. ugly ass solution to a nonexistent problem.. still kudos for the effort. Hopefully this can develop into a more elegant yet practical solution.
But Switch is portable.
Am I missing something?
It's like a left handed screwdriver​.
..if your gonna make one...
..why not make it cool looking like this..
..or maybe like a SNES?...
Hm...
After 2 million of Switch sold, Nintendo should redesign a bit the dock design to avoid easy scratch. Sell it with different color variation + 1 game inside, it will sold even more.
I don't really grok the design. If it works well and is a significantly cheaper alternative, though, I might have to order one.
@TheLobster You couldn't be more accurate. Nintendo would much rather shut down anyone doing a better job than they are than actually improve their own product. I'm much less inclined to buy a Switch after hearing about all its hardware defects.
EDIT: That said, I'm sure he needs to buy a dock to make these, or at least have people send him their dock, so Nintendo is making just as much money, if not more. I wouldn't worry too much about Nintendo sending him a C&D.
@OorWullie This is exactly what I am thinking. I am trying to figureout how exactly it would fit in or on that thing, and I am drawing a blank. A picture of it docked, in the dock, would probably be helpful.
@SH007ME I'd use that Donkey Kong cabinet if Nintendo released the arcade version of Donkey Kong as a standalone download rather than being strapped onto DK64 or being the not-as-good NES version.
"Not only are there widespread complaints of poorly manufactured docks scratching the displays of Switch units..."
No there aren't. A couple of videos making the rounds on the internet is more indicative of people's love of scandals than it is of the actual incident rate of Switch screens being scratched by the dock. I honestly think you would have to be trying very hard to actually have that happen.
Like the vast majority of people, I haven't had any scratching issues with my Switch, and I find it hard to believe there's a problem that doesn't involve people being unnecessarily rough with the system and/or dock. I could see perhaps a few defective docks being produced, sure, but all it takes is one or two videos put online and suddenly everyone thinks there's an epidemic.
This alternative solution looks ugly, clunky and awkward, so I'm not sure what the draw is supposed to be. To each his own, I guess.
@TheLobster @Kayfios As long as he doesn't sell it with the logo as seen in the picture, they can't. There is a ton of unlicensed Nintendo compatible gear out there. You just can't use their logos.
It looks like it has been cut by a laser cutter, not created with a 3D printer.
To be honest, I prefer the original dock way more over this one. The original has its cables neat and hidden and allows you to take it out with ease. I don't have any scratches or issues with the dock. Luckily it's easy and relatively cheap to improve (I would prefer a little bit softer sides in the dock). Remember those Wii Remote straps way back that got revised? It's exactly like that if you ask me.
It kind of looks like a few steps backward with plugs everywhere. If they can come up with a way of docking and un-docking as easily as the original dock does then maybe they'll be onto something. This thing with cords everywhere, having to plug stuff in and out is just horrible.
@thedevilsjester The Switch just lays flat on top of it and u have to plug the usb-c cable in manually (the short "u-shaped" cable on the right). Not a very clever or practical design...
@thedevilsjester Looking at it I'd say it's not actually a dock at all. Looks like an adaptor that you would plug your Switch into via a USB-C cable and then just lay it flat somewhere.
@Kayfios I think they may or may not. It's hard to tell. They shut down fan made stuff all the time.
@Alshain01 There is. I haven't had dock scratching problems either (@SmoochyTea) but there are already people capitalizing on the so called controversy with those covers that were mentioned in another article. I too have an Etsy shop and I think that's a brilliant idea so I bought one not because of scratching problems but because I thought it was cute! You can bet those won't get shut down because tons of people are making them and there are no logos involved.
@SH007ME That's an amazing idea. Have a SNES cartridge vinyl sticker on the back of the Switch and put it in the dock which looks like a SNES, with the back of the Switch facing forwards so the cartridge sticker faces the front.
Uhhh yeah this looks absolutely terrible.
One of those ipad tv adapters would be better.
I'm in love... That's the only point I don't understand on my side with my switch... Why this horrible huge and not well conceived dock ? WHY Nintendo ?
Having an opportunity to have a single plug coming out from the back of the TV would be so great (no screen scratching, more room and a real portable console which can be played on TV...).
Ready to order !
doesn't the dock have a vent to cool the switch while it's overclocked in dock-mode?
This is ugly. The beauty of the dock is the ability to slide it in and play without the faff of cables. Also I haven't had any scratching problems so I don't see the need for somethingike this. I can imagine a child or someone very careless scratching the screen though so perhaps Ninty should release a more child proof variation for concerned parents
I don't see how this is an improvement in any way. This takes the sleek solution of dropping the Switch into a waiting dock and turns it into the usual mess of cables involved in plugging portable devices/laptops into a TV.
You can make something like this WAY cheaper and easier yourself.
Simply take a USB-C cable, plug one end into the port on the bottom inside of the dock, the other end into the bottom of the Switch itself, and voila! You can put the dock somewhere out of sight and simply lay the system itself down wherever you like, with just a single thin cable running to it. This works.
This is awful.
@BAN I agree. There has been one main picture circulating of scratches on the Switch supposedly from the dock. There was no way the dock made those scratches. Unless you're completely careless or have something sharp stuck to the inside of your dock, you shouldn't have anything to worry about. Both my son and I each have a Switch and have had zero problems with them. Most of the people who comment on the "problems" don't even have a Switch.
From the guy's Reddit account:
"Seems there's some confusion here and on neogaf, this isn't supposed to be an at home dock replacement (although it does function as that...). This is meant for travel or to take with you."
So it's NOT a Switch dock replacement at all, it's an on-the-go hub.
This is how you're supposed to use it:
And it comes in three flavors:
Here's the Reddit thread, and underneath it the link to the entire gallery of images:
https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoSwitch/comments/5yvid9/final_version_of_my_dock_to_travel_dongle
https://imgur.com/gallery/zu3aY#tnKhB9T
And there are options for more colors as well...
I think people are missing the point. this is a travel dock. so you don't have to take your main dock round your mates. nice idea just needs a little tidying up
@ThanosReXXX Thanks for the pics, the explanation, and the links. This works out great for you, it's not a dock, just an adapter for TV out. Which kind of defeats the whole "aura" of the dock. Kind of like how the Wii "sensor bar" didn't actually sense anything, it was just 2 LEDs that could be replicated with a pair of candles. I have 2 windows around my TV which work during the late afternoon.
I wonder if this guy would need a disclaimer about the Switch overheating or not working well laying flat. Though the 4 nubs should give it enough clearance I suppose. You think Nintendo will start building in a sensor that requires the Switch to be upright?
I'm glad to see this being done, the dock is a big ugly unneccessary block. I was actually waiting for people to just start cutting off the front panel down to about 1/2" and melting it over, would be one way to avoid scratches. 3D printers are a better option though I suppose.
@rjejr You're welcome, and although I encourage efforts like these, regardless of whether I'd buy them or not, I do have to wonder about both the cooling and the overclocking (or more correctly: full clocking) of the Switch.
There must be a good reason that this "going full speed on TV only" requires the system's screen to be turned off, probably to save processing/gpu power so that it can all be used for TV display.
I don't really see an answer to that in that thread, and in several pictures where the connected Switch is displayed, the screen is on, so I suppose that would mean 720p on TV only if you use this contraption...
EDIT:
Hm, seems I have to correct myself there. There's only one picture with the screen displaying a game, and the USB-C connector isn't connected. So that would mean that there is either more to USB-C than we know, because normally, just that connector by itself isn't supposed to turn the screen off, seeing as there are also USB-C adapters available for playing with the switch in handheld mode and connected to a wall socket.
Wonder how he did that...
@Kayfios Nintendo sold 1.5 Million Switch consoles, the number of complaints are around 30-40. There are about 0.002% people complaining, which is fairly common with every new piece of tech
If a Switch gets fried in this, will it still be covered under warranty?
@rjejr
Nothing about the Switch is "big" though. The dock isn't big. The dock isn't clunky. It works surprisingly well at staying stable for being so small and plastic actually.
The scratch thing probably happens because the open space could allow for bending in the gap, but otherwise I've carried the Switch (in Sheikah Slate case), and all the accessories including dock cables and pro controller in the messenger bag I use for work. Had my iPad Pro in hard shell keyboard case in there as well.
Good discussion here about this (this article needs help) but, yeah, just nothing is big and clunky in relation to the Switch except maybe the game cases that hold the little cartridges and the prices here and there.
@rjejr P.S. It's done by laser cutting, it's not 3D-printed.
EDIT:
Went through the entire thread: he does use a 3D printer for the initial concepts, to see if they work in real life, and the final model is then made with a laser cutter. He also makes custom keyboards.
Looks awful to me
Cool idea! I think it would be better if it were designed around having an internal cooling fan, which would blow air upwards onto the bottom of the NS core, and have some air vents along the bottom, too... Although, perhaps a horizontal design would work even better for ventilation. Not a bad effort, though. Hope to see more ingenuity like this!
As for the reaction to this above... It never ceases to amaze me how resistant to modding efforts some of you people are. It's a prototype! Some of you are acting like you want this to fail, and only the "pure and righteous" original Nintendo product is legitimate. Even though it's just a couple chunks of hard plastic, and a small circuit board with Power and A/V ports with an attached USB-C connector... It's like seeing a congregation of Puritans shooting down something new because it doesn't fit their narrow world view.
Kind of dont see the point, might as well take the original dock out with you...
Totally unrelated, but this is gold as far as I'm concerned.
Nintendo should use that...
@stylon @Urameshi If thats the case, what kind of market is there for that? I think a more portable dock (one that actually connects to a TV) would be huge seller (I know I would buy one), but just a hunk of plastic that doesn't do anything useful? I'll pass.
@thedevilsjester It actually does connect to the TV and gives you full functionality of the dock, only in a much smaller form factor. It has all the internals of the dock, minus the big chunk of empty plastic that the official dock has.
@bolt05 The point is that it's almost 75% smaller than the official dock, but still has the same functionalities, so it's easier to take it with you while traveling and displaying it on a TV somewhere other than in your own home.
@PlywoodStick Exactly.
@ThanosReXXX Looking at the USB-C connector inside the NS, it looks like it's proprietary, so a regular USB-C cable won't fully emulate it. But yeah, the chunks of plastic comprising the official dock aren't doing any favors.
Apparently, according to an interview conducted by Digital Foundry with Shin'en Multimedia, there's a firmware design flaw in the current NS firmware version, which drains GPU resources unnecessarily:
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2017-fast-rmx-showcases-switches-power-over-wii-u
Once the next firmware revision is released, this should help maintain 1080p 60 FPS for Fast RMX, instead of readily switching between 900p and 1080p with frame drops. This may help with performance in other games, as well. In addition, there is a possibility that the recent possible WiFi frame drop issue in the recent NL article prompted by JunkRabbit will be related with this issue. I don't know if the proprietary (maybe) USB-connector is... connected, to the issue at all, though.
@PlywoodStick I just wonder how he managed to get full functionality out of it. In the pictures in the gallery, you can clearly see the extra connection points on either side of the USB-C port, and obviously, these aren't connecting to the Switch in his setup.
I previously thought that it was these connectors that were responsible for giving the Switch the signal to turn it's screen off and display on the TV, but apparently, that's all done via the USB-C port.
@ThanosReXXX "Make the Switch... From being single, to getting docked by a new partner." snap/click
@TheLobster He is using teh same parts contained on a dock, so he is like several SNES makers that use old parts of the original consoles. The only thing that Nintendo could balk at is the use of the logo and the name.
@ThanosReXXX You mean this?
@PlywoodStick No, I know it can display on the TV, but I was just interested in the HOW. In this picture here, you can clearly see the extra connectors on either side of the USB-C port that he is not using in his setup:
I always thought the whole purpose of the original dock was to hold the Switch, turn the screen off, and forward the signal to display on the TV, but I guess it works a bit different, otherwise this guy wouldn't have been able to make his contraption function correctly. (I also mentioned as much in comment #34 in this thread)
That's what I meant, and as such, I must conclude (for now) that the proprietary USB-C connection is apparently all that is needed to turn off the screen of the Switch when it's connected to the TV. The other two connectors are probably just charging connectors, then.
I'm just waiting for third-party docks that cost less than $90. It's unbelievable how overpriced they are, especially since they feel so hollow and flimsy.
The dock isn't "too bulky"...whatever it's design or QC issues, the "bulk" is more about a stable and secure holder" than about streamlining it to be pretty (unlike the PS Vita dock that I will ever, ever stop complaining about given how asinine the design is.)
But this thing....are we missing something in pictures? As far as I can tell this isn't actually a dock at all, it's just a USB-C Mini-DP to HDMI converter breakout box, or rather, a holder for the breakout box that's just removed from the OEM dock? The actual mechanical docking mechanisms for the USB-C port and the ability to hold the console appear to be entirely missing here?
@ThanosReXXX AFAIK there are no other connectors, those are just centering pins so you don't strip out the USB-C connector on docking. There's a centering groove/slot in the back too.
I also like how he has his XBone atop the vents of the AVR. Nothing like baking your console at 300F!
How unnecessary.
@NEStalgia To answer your question: read all my other comments on it, and the link to the original Reddit thread that I posted, that should make clear what you're missing, and also what my specific musings on the topic are...
And it's not supposed to "hold" the Switch. Just like the images I posted show, you simply place it on top, like an induction charger, and it will rest on the silicone nubs that are mounted on top of it.
He simply placed the original dock's insides in a smaller form factor, is all.
@PlywoodStick The repetitive motion of that gif makes it rather suggestive, especially in relation to that story...
I've not had any problems with either of the docks we got with the two Switch's we purchased we did put screen protectors on our two systems which because they are a tablet device I would think was only common sense to do so, we've not had any left con connection problems either on our systems on the docking issue I think alot of it is the way people are possibly handling the tablet when they dock it .
@ThanosReXXX @PlywoodStick That's the promo ad for the Milk eSports tournament.
@ThanosReXX So, yeah....it's NOT a dock at all. If it doesn't actually dock the component it's not a dock, and shouldn't be called a dock. @rjejr is correct, it's just a TV-Out breakout box.
As a result of that, it's actually not a very compact solution at all. I would think anyone interested in such a thing would be better off waiting for some unlicensed MadCatz plain old TV-out cable with an inline converter brick or something that no doubt will appear someday.
And I do fear the cooling is SIGNIFICANTLY compromised in this setup. That heat pipe runs vertical for a reason.
I doubt the guy making this took that into consideration considering, again, he also thinks it's a good idea to put a console atop an amp....
@NEStalgia I don't know where you got that I said it was a dock, since I EXPLICITLY said that it was not a dock in my initial comment. (I even quoted the guy's own argument from the Reddit forum where he explained that it isn't a dock)
I'd simply call it a travel-hub or a dongle, but I guess breakout box will suffice as well.
And it IS compact: it is 75% smaller than the dock and his reasoning for making it was for easier transport compared to the official dock.
Agreed on the cooling, though. That was one of the other things I was thinking about besides the "how is this setup going to deliver full power" thing.
@NEStalgia The dock is perfect for in home use. It could actually be a little heavier IMO, but its way too bulky for on-the-go.
@ThanosReXXX Thank you for the information, and the images that you posted make it clear what its purpose and design is.
@ThanosReXXX Oh I never said you said it was a dock. The article did I just tagged you in responding about the centering pins not being contacts!
It's smaller than the dock but not being a dock that needs to be stable, that makes sense....but waaaay too large for a breakout box. It can go far smaller than that. But yeah the dock was meant to be plopped next to the TV and left there forever. It was NoA that had to push to get them to sell second docks at all...they weren't going to. Who owns 2 TVs in Japan? But I imagine 3rd party breakouts smaller than this will exist (licensed or otherwise.)
Edit: But yeah...cooling...that's a serious concern. At full power the switch can get pretty toasty.
@thedevilsjester No problem, you're welcome.
@NEStalgia Well, apparently he wasn't able to make it any smaller yet. (have you even read the Reddit thread where he explains all? And most details are in the comments section as well, so not just in the points he makes at the top of that page)
Something to do with some components of the PCB or something.
And the initial reason I commented was actually to correct the article, but maybe I should have made that clear by tagging the author...
@ThanosReXXX I didn't read through the comments on the Reddit just the main section. And my point isn't necessarily about "how to better design something to fit odd components ripped out of the commercial dock that were designed to fit a different orientation" (though even in the dock the "pcb compartment" is quite small.)
My point is just that I imagine in short order a licensed/unlicensed commercial cable that's a lot smaller and cleaner than this due to using a PCB designed for it will almost certainly become available.
Unless there's some odd Nintendo proprietary encryption or HDCP on the video, of course.
@NEStalgia I have no idea and that would be yet another item to add to my list of questions about this contraption.
Wouldn't be good for him if he's going to get a lot of returns from angry customers, though. Even though it's only $35, that would potentially still be a big fallout if he hasn't thought of a couple of the things that we now discussed.
Maybe his enthusiasm got the better of him, but I certainly hope not, for his sake. He did mention looking into making a smaller dock that actually allows the Switch to slide in, so that is something that he might release in the future.
His keyboards are pretty cool, though. Link is in one of my previous comments.
@ThanosReXXX Most of the "cool" is just that it uses nice materials, but seriously this is a slightly beautified replacement for a black project box that you can get at Radio Shack for like $8 with huge holes cut in the side, not even specific port-sized cutouts, exposing the mounted PCB. The front panel is pretty, being acrylic makes it prettier than an ABS plastic project box, but the actual device is sort of a "BokoDock" (BotW reference if you're not in on the fun ) $35 seems a little high, considering it doesn't really even protect the PCB from large objects or particulate. Of course that means the cost of this is $115 since you need to buy the real dock to get the PCB to begin with.
Might be easier to just get the dock, grab a hacksaw and cut off the front flap and right side off the end of the USB-C. Voila, smaller, OEM, cheaper, and still protects the electronics better Won't help heat management though!
It's nice someone's interested in making a portable solution, but....it's seriously just a plastic box with gaping holes in it near the PCB. And it may or may not cause the console to overheat. (Strike that: A vertical heat pipe strained at max thermal capacity laid horizontal WILL cause the console to overheat if it isn't built with very forgiving tolerances. We'd need the guys with the IR pictures for that.)
When I pictured portable cables, I figured custom PCBs would be involved. (OTOH if there's proprietary encryption involved, than that will never happen if not licensed. Hori or PowerA/BD&A could do it. They're the usual OEM vendors anyway.
If he makes an actual dock though, that could be something a lot more interesting.
This ones a pretty casemod, even if it's a fingerprint magnet though!
@BAN Agreed. I simply can't understand how they managed to do that. The dock is plastic. It's softer than the glass. I don't believe they scratched it with the dock. They probably threw it in a bag with keys or something and are blaming it on the dock to not look culpable during the replacement process. Maybe not, but I still don't understand how they could manage those scratches with the dock.
@ThanosReXXX I don't think I gave it that much thought, I just assumed that since he took the innards out of the dock and put them in a smaller "device" that whatever chip was in the dock turning off the screen would then also still be there, hence turning off the screen when the Switch was attached.
Though that does raise another question, you can't use this "device" to charge you're Switch while playing it since it will auto-off the screen, and you would still need to bring another cable along for charging. At least I think you would.
Guess there's a simple solution, somebody w/ a Switch just needs to put the Switch in the dock while it's on, let the pic go to the TV and the screen turn off, then unplug the HDMI cable from the back on the dock, after opening the back of the dock, and see if that turns the screen back on. ie is the chip turning off the screen in the HDMI out section of the dock or the charging section of the dock? Really, NL has done a poor job of investigating reporting on how all this works if you ask me. Not that I'd be messing around w/ everything if I spent $300 on one, but surely they have 1 for the office to mess around w/ and see which cables do what when connected and disconnected. I didn't even know before this you could even connect an extension cable inside the dock to keep from "docking" the Switch. Have they even talked about the fan being on at all in portable mode when playing a game like Zelda? Surely someone could tell holding a console if a fan is on or not, it can't be that quiet.
@aaronsullivan "The scratch thing probably happens because the open space could allow for bending in the gap"
Yeah, I figured that. Too many people on here saying "It happened to me so it must happen to everybody" or "It never happened to me so it never happens to naybody". The toaster is a toaster. My toaster sometimes allows Pop-tarts (unfrosted strawberry) to slide down the side next to the bottom up-and-down thing so I have to dig them out. Probably not everybody's toaster does that though. I've assumed the inside edge of some of the docks just isn't sanded properly on some of them. All it would take is 1 little piece of plastic sticking out to scratch a screen. They made 2 million docks by underpaid suicidal workers in Foxcon, surely a small % are going to have defects. Upon getting my dock I'll probably sand it out w/ some steal wool or light sandpaper and then cover the inside w/ clear plastic shelving paper. Or just cut the front off. Or do what this guy did and make my own non-dock.
Do you actually pack up the dock and take it w/ you or just the cables? Sure, the dock may not be "large" but a teenager who spends a lot of time on the go at several different friends houses may find the idea of this compact little adapter preferable to carry around than the larger dock. And it looks cooler too. Not cooler as in less hot, cooler as in the ugly gray toaster is an ugly gray eyesore. PC Lan party gamers spend tons of money on case mods, I could see "dock modding" becoming a thing, if Ntinedo is lucky and Switch gets that popular.
@PlywoodStick "Even though it's just a couple chunks of hard plastic, and a small circuit board with Power and A/V ports with an attached USB-C connector... It's like seeing a congregation of Puritans shooting down something new because it doesn't fit their narrow world view."
Careful now, that high horse of yours is walking on stilettos
I think you're overlooking that this DIY project absorbs the resources that the Switch dock uses. It inherits the cost of Nintendo's dock in addition to the cost he will sell the shell for and it takes the 1-step practicality of the Switch dock as it is and completely removes it for the sole purpose of correcting the extremely rare, if existent "scratched screen" problem.
Would this be helpful if it was being sold as a complete dock alternative at a lower price than Nintendo's? Absolutely. Otherwise, is it helpful for anything other than avoiding the screen problem? Not really.
Also be careful with that "fanboy paranoia", just because someone isn't too keen on the design of a DIY project doesn't make them a devout Nintendo fanboy. Nintendo's design most certainly isn't perfect, but when it takes $$ to use an alternative constructive criticism is certainly deserved.
@ThanosReXXX 2 EDITS today, you must be rusty.
After posting this morning I was sitting next to my 2 Wii U Gamepad stands, the charger and the stand which I keep 8" apart, 1 for charging and 1 for, um, not charging, and I thought, why not just retrofit 1 of those for these connections, why reinvent the wheel? Basically make a smaller dock that's a simple charging stand, just lean it back a bit so it doesn't fall out. I've been using those 2 Gamepad stands for 4 years know, the big heavy clunky Gamepad hasn't fallen out once. I know the Switch is lighter, but surely a similar stand could keep it upright.
I suppose nto enough people want to break their $60 replaceable dock to figure something else out since the dock works just fine as is, but I did finally find something online.
http://www.3ders.org/articles/20170312-six-3d-printed-accessories-to-fix-common-nintendo-switch-problems.html
There's just so much empty space in the back of the dock, half of it seems unnecessary.
@NEStalgia "@rjejr is correct, it's just a TV-Out breakout box."
"That heat pipe runs vertical for a reason."
Wait, what heat pipe? There's a heat pipe in the dock? Or in the Switch? I still think just chopping the front and back panels off of the dock is the way to go.
"thinks it's a good idea to put a console atop an amp..."
I think that's to watch the Switch dance while you're playing.
@SH007ME Early days, you just know there's going to be a million of these soon enough.
@Urameshi This contraption isn't about the whole screen scratching thing, this is just about having a small portable TV-out that travels in a bag easier than the dock. I'm not going to say it's a good solution or worth the money, but that's what it's for.
@rjejr "Have they even talked about the fan being on at all in portable mode when playing a game like Zelda? Surely someone could tell holding a console if a fan is on or not, it can't be that qui"
The fan runs in handheld mode. It's SOOOO quiet I can't even hear it if I stick my ear against the slot...it's got to be spinning at like 30rpm or something. I could tell only by the scent of warm new electronics being actively pushed out of the slot and from there a very faint flow of air. But as a dust intake concern there could be concern (the intake vents have good screening over them but tiny dust certainly can get in.)
LOL, I told you guys when I introduced myself that I agree with you and thanos about 50/50....todays your day!
The heat pipe is the heat pipe in the Switch. Sitting the machine vertically like the dock is the only part that matters for the cooling solution. Its just that this thing expects you to lay it horizontally (and projecting all that heat up at the display! Eek!)
Yeah, you could chop the front panel off if that's your thing. You couldn't actively dock it if you chop it all though, there would be no front support and you'd be putting the entire unit weight on the USB pins. If you want to run a cable out of the port you could do that (but then you have the vertical/horizontal thing going.) You couldn't chop the back panel, at least on the left side, since that's where the PCB is mounted! Inside that little box next to K.K.
The empty space is just there for stability. The gamepad stand just uses flush contacts for charging, you probably wouldn't want to use that for HDMI out, and you certainly couldn't use that for the delicate pins of USB-C. They could have gone proprietary again, but everyone's been praising them for going with a bleeding edge standard USB-C I imagine the vertical orientation is actually important for cooling though (heat rises, and all that, and the heatpipe does more work than the fan for that, the fan just cools the pipe so it can draw more heat from the SOC like a car radiator.)
"I think that's to watch the Switch dance while you're playing."
No, no, the XBone there is acting as perfect insulation for the Switch. Maybe he's just trying to reflow the solder to prevent RRoDs. Silly modder, that's the wrong XBox for that!
@Spustatu The only ways the dock can scratch it that I can think of are if the internal "ribs" are not properly sanded or have jagged bits of plastic left over from manufacturing that stick out, OR if dirt that's harder than the screen got trapped on the silicone bumpers at the bottom of the dock, or the docks that are bent/warped and therefore are requring people to use "force" to insert them between two sides pressing the screen.
The location it contacts is still not over the viewing area of the screen but just the bezel unless you're wantonly reckless (still shouldn't be possible so -1 for design issues not taking children into account), however a "good" dock does leave smudges that can look like scratches that wipe off. That one picture that was highlighted with deep gouges seems very "off" to me, but a badly deformed dock and the use of force to circumvent it could maybe do that.
The scratching thing is definitely overstated, but some portion of them are very likely legit due to dock manufacturing issues (not design issues beyond that it's a design that lets careless people abuse it too easily, including children.)
@NEStalgia If they want the front and back of the dock for stability how a about simply making a folding device like a pop-up soccer net or laundry basket or kite? Keep the bottom of the dock as is, move that port box in the back into the bottom of the base, add 4 folding sticks, 2 in the front, 2 in the back, that hold the Switch in place.
Kind of like this, only the 4 upright brown pieces fold over towards each other like eye glasses. How annoying would it be to carry around sunglasses if you couldn't fold them up? That's what the Switch dock is, sunglasses that don't fold.
@Spustatu Yeah, I'm just not seeing how the dock-scratch theory is even remotely plausible.
@NEStalgia Man, I'm going to take a BIG step backwards out of this trench, because with the walls of text about how it should and what shouldn't you're throwing at me, I almost feel like I made the damn thing, instead of some anonymous Reddit guy...
As is almost always the case, I just wanted to comment in this thread to add a bit of info and/or explanation for the people that would like to know a bit more.
I am not going to buy one myself, nor am I a fan of case mods, although I do respect the people that make them, because I wouldn't be able to do it myself. I'm good at building PC's and soft-modding consoles, but that's about it. Other than that, I'm just good at talking about and selling IT related stuff, but that's just smoke and mirrors for the most part...
@ThanosReXXX I reject the premise that it being a bit smaller makes it more portable, clearly it really doesn't, its still a blocky peripheral accompanied by cables in you bag. My point is that its going to occupy similar space in your bag and therefore its a pointless waste of money. Bring the regular dock instead and save your rupees for games!
What would be better is a redesigned and more compact dock that is actually worth your while more like the 3ds charging cradle.
@rjejr That empty space is probably there for a reason. Could indeed be for stability, or it could even have to do with heat dissipation (air cushion, so to speak) or it could even be that the mold of the dock was designed in such a way that future, enhanced docks can have the exact same form factor, but still have more innards, so it could simply be future-proofing.
As for the investigating what's what: you can point a finger at NLife, but there are plenty of other sites/channels that could have done a bit more investigating, ESPECIALLY the ones that have already completely taken the Switch and its components apart.
As for that heat pipe thing: I have to agree with @NEStalgia's thoughts on the matter: the Switch needs to be in the upright position to optimize heat dissipation, so the lying flat thing on top of another surface will probably not be too beneficial
I always assumed it was passively cooled when in portable mode and that the fan would be "switched" on once the device is inserted in the dock, but apparently, it also runs in portable mode, albeit very softly.
I'm going to give you a 10/10 for imagination, though: first making a toaster out of the dock (although that was more of a mass hysteria type of thing, so I can't give you all the credit there) and now it's supposed to be a fancy napkin holder?
Looking at the picture, I can formulate that back to something Asian/Nintendo-like, though: napkins in a stylish, wooden holder is also something you might see in an Asian restaurant, and folding paper into something artsy, aka origami is also an invention from the land of the rising sun, so there...
P.S.
And then we move on to unfoldable sunglasses... Them be some fat glasses. Quite a bit bigger than anything in Elton John's collection...
@bolt05 You can reject it all you want, but the fact is that it is 75% smaller than the official dock, so how you can see it as taking up a similar space as the official dock, I don't know, since the only thing it has in common with the dock is having a rectangular form...
But having said that, I don't care either way what it is or how it is supposed to work, since it's not for me. The guy started to make this for a problem that he himself had, and to him it's a good solution, so I guess that's all that counts. And as it so happens, a lot of people seem to agree with him, seeing the "write me down for an order too" comments on that Reddit thread of his.
Me, I'll just stick with the official materials...
It does kind of make sense if you travel a lot. Most hotel rooms have TV's in them, back before the days of tablets when I traveled on business a lot, I would bring along a portable DVD player and hook it into those TV's. This is the same idea, just with a game device instead.
If all you want is to get rid of the dock, then im sure a usb c to hdmi converter cable would be far less bulky than this terribly designed crudheap of an idea.
@NEStalgia Oh God... Milk e-Sports tournament... Now I know why 1, 2, Milk is selling so well in Japan...
@bolt05 Would the NS core actually recognize a conversion setup and switch over to docked mode?
@PlywoodStick dont know but im going to find out if it understands a usb c to hdmi cable. Only a matterof time until a 3rd party makes one that definitely works anyway. Why should we even need a crappy plastic toaster. I dont dock my phones or tablets to charge them do i? And my tablet has hdmi out and i dont dock it into anything for that either.
@Urameshi
Dude. Just....... Dude. See that horse grinning at you? You're missing out. Why wouldn't you want to ride on a horse wearing high heels?
ahem
As for the "cost" of the dock... the only functional part of it is literally just a tiny circuit board with power/AV ports and the attached USB-C connector. The plastic shell is almost entirely hollow.
As far as I'm concerned, if someone wants to go through the expense of prototyping an interesting (and more useful) alternative, by 3D printing and laser cutting, more power to them. It's a good start towards third party redesigns. Who knows, maybe this will become a thing...
And of course, getting started is the hardest part. I would rather encourage an aspiring tech-related modding entrepreneur, instead of immediately shooting them down just for trying something different. I don't see my response to the negative comments as paranoia, so much as exasperation: If you're negative about an interesting third party idea, it's well liked. If you're negative about faults made by Nintendo themselves, you're ridiculed. See the double standard? Hell, the most liked comment here is the one of someone being clueless about one of the prototype versions, because they didn't do any investigation.
@bolt05 Only problem is that HDMI cannot handle power charging functions, only video and audio; while USB-C can handle power charging, video, and audio functions. So I suspect there might be unforeseen electrical issues if that's attempted.
@PlywoodStick
...That picture made my day o.o
For "inheriting the cost of the dock" though I meant that the only way to use the DIY shell is to cannibalize the circuit board and ports from the Switch dock, currently requiring one to own an official switch dock (the dock may be extremely overpriced and have practically nothing in it, but as of now there is only one way to get the parts needed and that's through Nintendo's official dock).
Having overlooked jolimon's 5th edit on his reddit page clarifying that the main purpose for his creation is to have a far more portable dock, it's existence seems to make a lot more sense now. I've noticed some people have mentioned that they haven't used their dock at all, so this may be a better way for them to put it to use. Also, it may be impractical now to turn the official dock into a useless hunk of plastic, but a 3rd party of some sort may create and sell the components needed to implement into DIY docks instead.
Also, my "fanboy paranoia" comment was basically just taking a jab at the " ...and only the 'pure and righteous' original Nintendo product is legitimate" part of your post. It just annoyed me that this statement was thrown in there as calling fault with the DIY project doesn't mean that someone holds Nintendo's design as some golden standard either - but I get where you're coming from.
You're right though, heck with how much effort, time, and enthusiasm it takes to get even a small project like this going, power to him if he can make it a success (as well as possibly inspire other projects).
@PlywoodStick The plug on the switch has to comply with hdmi right, so in in there are the right voltage pins to output A/V over hdmi right. So any cable converting from usb c to hdmi will perform the exact same function. There is likely a small circuit to amplify so of the voltage pins to provide charging capability in the dock, i doubt were looking at sophisticated proprietry hardware in that glorified plastic lump.
If Nintendo messed with the location of the pins on the USB c connector they probably would have made a proprietary plug socket instead. Given its compliant with usb c and any usb c port is capable of hdmi i see no reason why a usb-c to HDMI cable off of amazon won't output hdmi. Maybe it wont charge but I doubt it fails to output hdmi. The only issues is if theres some other form of detection in the switch to force using the nintendo brand dock before it outputs hdmi. Surely someone on reddit has already tried this so I will google to find out.
@bolt05 According to GameFAQ forums the switch outputs display port over usb c and the dock converts it to hdmi. This can be resolved the same way you can buy converters for apple pulling this same swift move.
@bolt05 Only if they are using the HDMI Alternate Mode for USB-C. One would hope this is the case, in which case a simple cable will work just fine. This is an actual standard of HDMI which would be universal.
However, they could be using some kind of conversion chip in the dock.
I actually don't know, just know there is the possibility. I know the dock does have a few chips in it but that may just be USB chips for creating the USB hub.
That isn't a dock
@rjejr If you thought screen scratching complaints were bad now, wait until people try out YOUR dock design!
From the Nintendo perspective, the dock isn't portable because the dock isn't SUPPOSED to be portable. It's supposed to be put next to your one and only TV once and never moved again. It's your home base for your console. NoA begged and pleaded for them to sell extra docks because Americans tend to have more than one household TV. That concept is as alien as a Porterhouse to anyone at NCL/NoJ who sees a TV as a single object in the main living area and nothing else. It's a culture thing. So they caved and sold extra docks (it's good when the Nintendo CEO is the former NoA CEO sometimes!)
But PORTABLE docks....why? Particularly from the Japan perspective, and even not, who needs that, the whole point of the console is that you can pick it up and take it with you handheld. The controllers detach and it's its own little TV if you want to share it with someone else outside home, that's the whole point. So the dock of all things surely wouldn't need portability!
To a degree they're right, and I'm sure a real portable dock (or cable with crippled cooling) will emerge for westerners, but you have to admit it seems a little silly to fuss over wanting to take your console from TV to other outside-your-home TV when the point of the console is it doesn't have to be on the TV when you're away from it. Especially when they already did the whole "small console you can take from TV to TV and play it at someone else's house" and it was widely ridiculed as the "little purple lunchbox", so then they make a console you DON'T need to put on another TV, and everyone wants the lunchbox back. For any permanent location your'e using it you'd buy a second dock. For temporary locations the thinking is: Why do you need it on the TV at all?
And for the people that do....well I still don't think this plastic box with holes in the side is a great product, but I'm sure something better (and commercially made) will exist.
@ThanosReXXX "Other than that, I'm just good at talking about and selling IT related stuff, but that's just smoke and mirrors for the most part... "
LOL....there's not anything I can even add to that to make it better. It's sheer beauty right there.
The space in the dock: MOST of it is probably about stability. A "brick" is still more stable than having little feet flaring out at the base. Some of it could be ventilation. That section gets a little warm after a few hours both from the switch emitting heat and from the HDMI converter emitting heat (and the charging unit.)
Yeah I assumed the fan wouldn't run portably too. Dust is kind of a concern with it running outdoors like that. Although positive air pressure at the vent maybe makes it less likely for water to get in if it happens to start raining or something. I'm guessing the fan is probably 1/4 of power drain. DC fans eat some power....
The machine does get fairly warm after running in a dock for hours on end, but still cooler than even WiiU exhaust.
@PlywoodStick There are so many memey things I could add and will not
About the dock: I think people tend to overlook easily the R&D that goes into a dock like that in terms of the actual mechanical interface. There are moving parts in there to mate with the console USB port (no, that's not a 1-2-S joke), just as there were in the 3DS docks, but fairly more complicated. And it operates smoothly with no resistance, both on insertion and removal without sticking to the console and lifting the dock, every time. It may be hollow and plastic, and the USB3/DP-HDMI/HDCP/Charging board may be the only electrical component, but you have to factor in the mechanical components in that "empty" shell too! I think everyone ignores that. Look how the moving parts work. It's not a feat of engineering, but it's a pretty slick piece of design that took a fair bit of effort and is invisible to almost everyone.
@NEStalgia Yeah well, if anything, I'm always honest. Sales & Marketing is full of tricks. Some good, some bad, but certainly not in an evil way (well, in my case anyway: always try to make the customer happy) but regardless, I never feel the need to make it any bigger than it really is.
As for the dock: I mulled over my own musings again and came to the conclusion that my idea about it possibly having a future-proof form factor might not even be such a bad idea at all...
Bring on dock 2.0 with more stuff in it. To hell with useless empty spaces!
Looks like I stumbled on an article about me lol
So i guess I can give some info on this whole thing. Yes its a breakout box/dongle/travel adapter, not an at home dock. Ive personally already ordered a spare OEM dock so I can have that at home.
In regards to a glorified plastic box.... absolutely true! I make custom keyboards and other commissioned acrylic cases for stuff and figured why not use my 3d printer and laser cutter to come up with something better than the radioshack plastic boxes. More than anything I wanted to post it so people could maybe realize that you can definitely remove the internals and transplant them into a different, smaller case. in terms of the whole laying down vs standing and heat etc. Truth is, I dont know how much the cooling is being affected. I dont have an IR thermometer to really measure but ive used it for various hours straight and havent run into any issues yet.
as for the screen shutting off and proprietary cables and wires etc.. I just ordered some $6 USB-C extensions from amazon. It seems like as if maybe through the USB connection there may be a keyboard input of some sort that triggers it to go to sleep. Wouldnt be that crazy considering you can plug in a keyboard and type, so getting a command from a USB type device thats built into the dock's electronics can definitely trigger the dock mode OCing. There were no sensors or anything in the dock. its actually a really simple design. I am trying to set up an online store but im interested in seeing what else people come up with, maybe some better designs than my own. I do plan on releasing 3d printer files and laser cutting files soon too!
not sure how notifications work on this site but feel free to ask me questions here or PM me on reddit!
@ThanosReXXX thanks for giving people info in my absence!
@jolimon You're welcome.
Seems most of it got lost to some people, though. So, I'll hand the stick to you, and you can continue to do the explaining instead of me...
As for the technical part of it, specifically about the overheating issue, I think @NEStalgia made a good point about the reason for the Switch being upright to maximize cooling and heat dissipation, so you might want to look into that before you start sending out bulk orders of your travel-box. You wouldn't want to see a lot of angry customers sending them back, methinks...
And notifications work by going to this page:
https://www.nintendolife.com/user/settings
and using the last tab called "Preferences" to check all options, or the options that you want, and you will get notifications in your inbox of choice or you'll see them pop up in the upper right corner of the screen next to your profile name/avatar.
@jolimon Always good to see the folks behind any given project actually participate here!
And I'm glad to see you're aware it's just a plastic box But my big point behind that is, looking at your pictures, in its current shape it offers waaaaay too little protection for the PCB. I wouldn't be comfortable traveling with my $80 worth of electronics in a bag with the ends totally exposed like that. The point of a plastic box should be to protect the contents, and I'm not sure the big oval cutouts are doing that. Is there any way the laser cutting can cut more pinpoint holes around the actual outputs? That would make it a lot more appealing if it was solid protection.
The bigger concern though is definitely heat. Like I said above, I'm sure one of the OEMs out there like MadCatz or whatever will produce a custom tiny PCB inline with a cable at some point (and I can guess what the level of quality will be ), and that will be even worse an issue, but if you look at the cooling solution in any of the teardown pictures of the console, you'll see a pretty sizable copper heatpipe running from the SoC, around the fan, to the exhaust sink. It's a vertical heat transfer relying on thermal convection and the fan to simply keep the convection cycling. There are two possibilities: Nintendo overbuilt the cooling solution so that even in full-clocked mode, it has tons of thermal headroom and never comes close to maxing the thermal capacity of the pipe (which would be Nintendo-ish), OR, Nintendo built the cooling solution to be precisely adequate to the maximum thermal envelope of the hardware (which would be nVidia-ish.) If it's the former, laying it horizontal probably won't have much detrimental effect. If it's the latter, heat would be building up in the chassis, and deflected at the LCD panel (there's no sink/reflector between the heatpipe and the panel.) It might not kill the console in a week, and it might not cause the system to constantly freeze until rebooted (or it might on a game pushing the hardware), but it would very likely reduce the overall lifespan of the system and the battery and increase the likelihood of premature failure. If there's any way to get that stand to (safely) stand vertically and hold the unit with it or even (safely) be able to lean the console against it it might save a lot of wear to keep that heatpipe vertical or at least mostly vertical.
My guess with "dock mode" is simply a USB device id in the dock at minimum, or an HDCP handshake at maximum if they're securing the video out (already needs hardware accelerated decryption for gamecards, so it's not out of the realm of possibility) that triggers dock mode. I don't think it has anything to do with pin configurations, I imagine it's an actual docking protocol somewhere on the hardware. The complexity of that protocol and ability to reverse engineer it will determine if commercial (unlicensed) custom PCBs in the form of "simple cable" solutions ever exist.
Well if Nintendo should one day do a revision of the dock, they should definitely make it so that you can still use the touchscreen (i.e. just connect the Switch to the TV via cable). That way, you could still hold the Switch in your hands and use it as a second screen, just like the Wii U Gamepad.
If Nintendo should do this I'd immediately buy a Switch.
@OorWullie On the top of it. It's for transportable matters only. Like, if you would like to play in 1080p on whatever screen you got with you. Maybe your iPad!
@ThanosReXXX I'm trying to catch up again, 292 unread emails this morning, down to 194 now, and as luck would have it I just wrote a reply to someone else that sort-of fits w/ your comment #82 about the dock. Comment #150 at the bottom.
https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2017/03/talking_point_nintendos_upgraded_confidence_in_switch_is_a_relief
Also, I think the article about the guy using the extension cable ties in well to this. The fact that you don't need the dock, just a cable, is great. So great that I wouldn't be surprised if in Switch 1.1 Nintneod builds in something to stop it. But if they don't, well in the US a lot of peopel keep their AV compenents in enclosed shelved "entertainment centers". B/c of docking the dock needs to be accessible AND have a lot of headroom. W/ an extension cable the dock could be placed inside a cabinet and just leave the cable near the TV for plugging in. There is the issue of the heat pipes needing to be facing up, but do they really? There's a lot less heat w/o the screen on, no? I'm sure once Switch becomes plentiful, and everyone is done playing Zelda, some website like Digital Foundry will try running Switch w the fan removed and laying down to see how long until it overheats. I think I prefer a "TV out" cable over a dock. A cable is a lot easier to travel with. USB could be an issue, but a smaller adaptor w/ just power and HDMI and USB-C is really all you need, that seems like it could be very small.
@NEStalgia " NoA begged and pleaded for them to sell extra docks ... "
Where did you read that, a Trump tweet?
My current belief is that they are selling the docks for the same reason New 3DS has faceplates, to sell more of them. (If you can tell me another reason for New 3DS to have faceplates, keeping in mind New 3DS XL doesn't, I'd love to hear it.) Not right now, and maybe not for $90, but watch, they will. If we dont' have branded docks in 2 years I'll be utterly shocked. Something like the Zelda WW HD Gamepad design.
Not like amiibo are all that useful either. Zelda BotW got 5 or 6 of them, hardly do anything all of the old Zelda amiibo don't do. But they made them and sold them b/c they can. Switch dock is marketing real estate, just wait.
"little purple lunchbox"
When the Gamecube was out 25" TVs were considered big. Now itg's hard to buy a TV less than 32". 8 years ago my 52" TV made me happy, now it seems everyone I know has 55" or larger. Yes, it's great that the Switch is portable and can be played 2 player at school or on the playground, but sitting on the floor at a friends house in front of a 60" TV that 6.2" screen looks kind of tiny. Especially when KNOWING the Switch does Tv out. And those 2 tiny speakers hardly measure up to 5.1 or 7.1 surround sound. So like you said, I think it's inevitable that a more portable "TV out" option than that dock gets sold.
When that is, I don't know, they need to make some more of the thing first. But Switch should be the gift that keeps on giving. Docks, Joycons, screen size, power, so much of it can be upgraded, it's an accessory bonanza. Just look at Nvidia Shield - portable, tablet, home. Switch isn't the end of years of work, it's the beginning of selling. Even 3DS had XL, 2DS, New and New XL, and that doesn't have TV out or Joycon. Just imagine what Nintneod has in store for the Switch over the next 5 or 6 years.
@rjejr I don't hoard links like you but it was even in an NL article in the past 2 weeks or so. Ok, they didn't say "begged and pleaded" but we know that's how it went down. They were diplomatic (I think it was Reggie) saying it was NoA that had originally wanted the extra docks and really pushed for it. Which makes sense. Where but the US has people with a bunch of TVs, and certainly not Japan. Japan definitely had no intention of selling docks at all until NoA convinced them (probably easily demonstratable) the market potential for it in the US. So "spare docks is" "expensive profit-engine toy for rich Americans" from NoJ's perspective
They sell faceplates because the Japanese consume that stuff like they're Pocky Sticks. They sell it on the small N3DS because the Japanese tended to like the small one where Americans tended to like the big one. However, in the end, the Japanese ended up liking the big one better too. Branded docks might happen, but I'm thinking we'll see branded Joycons earlier. You can't take the dock with you, but you always take your branded Joycons. Better marketing, you get to see /use it more, and Japan will care about it much more.
TV sizes, I still LOATHE the whole diagonal measurement thing. I hated it in the CRT days and I hate it now. 4:3 to 16:9 made the diagonal measurements explode in numbers while retaining roughly the same actual screen volume. Ugh. But yeah, TVs have still become bigger. Then again, I don't watch TV basically ever, and went front projector for those rare movie occasions,, so 100" or bust! (but you can only use it at night ) I don't game on that, though, I'm too nearsighted to enjoy using a TV to game most of the time, so I keep a 22" PC monitor rigged on a mounted arm for that. Throwing it on the projector is a treat for something like BotW though! 1080P @ 100" still looks smooth when you're nearsighted anyway
But yeah I do expect a "TV out cable" accessory at some point. Nintendo never lets go of old ideas and that's how they saw the GCN being used. Handle included.
My wallet is ready.
@NEStalgia "that had originally wanted the extra docks and really pushed for it."
hmm, I beleive you, as it sounds logical when you put it like that, but no, I never saw it. Before today I haven't been on here that much. If Reggie actually said the separate dock was his idea, well it's nice to see Reggie actually has an idea. Also shows how Nintendo HQ in Japan is too isolated for their own good, separate docks are a natural. Not only for big screen tvs, but how many families in the US have 3 or 4 tvs, 1 in each kids rooms. Cable companies, and satellite too, love charging $10 per monthly box rental, racks them up a lot of dough. Box is still the same when it was $5 per month, but it's $10 now, basically free money. I think w/ Nintneod HQ though it's less about marketing and making money, more about ego. "We say it's bundled w/ the dock, that's that." If they sell it separate it looks separate, as in, "Hey, if you can sell the dock separate, why not sell the Switch $50 cheaper w/o the dock for people who only want it as a portable?" So from an ego standpoint no separate dock, but from a money making standpoint, sell the dock. And the Switch w/o the dock once enough people own a few decorative and commemorative docks.
Like I said before, the gift that keeps on giving. I wonder how long before they sell just the tablet w/o the Joycon, Grip or the dock for people who only want to play VOEZ?
@rjejr This is one of those cases that Japan isn't the isolated one. The US is still the #1 TV buyer in the world. We're the weird ones with a TV in every room (I only have the one TV, but I have a game console in every room....is that better....or worse....? ) Not that nobody in any other country doesn't have any, even in Japan, but the idea that it's just the natural thought that everyone has a bunch of TVs is kind of uniquely an isolated American perspective, I think. At least that reality wasn't lost on Reggie...for once And at least Kimishima lived here for decades and actually understand such things and is thus convince-able
Ego, maybe. Mostly in a sense of them having a certain vision for the use case and dislike being told that the vision is different from reality...though in this case it really isn't, reality just builds on it.
Nintendo's always been great at selling accessories. The Wii was the most expensive 7th gen console once you got done with accessories.....Switch will be the same for the 9th! And is the only unique console for the 9th that's not just an upgraded 8th gen, so there's that, too
If they sell the tablet-only for VOEZ, who wants to wait for the NL thread about reports that the exposed joycon rails are a design flaw that can sever your finger if held incorrectly?
@NEStalgia "vision"
Yeah, OK, vision is a much nicer word than ego, you can have that one too. US might be unique in our TV obsession, but Switch sold 400k US, 360k Japan, so there's more of us buying more consoles, we should have gotten the dock w/o Reggie actually having to do something for a change. I'm still waiting for my 2nd Gamepad, Japan got that first.
When they sell the Switch tablet they can sell pairs of those $8 covers like the ones for the Joycon. 2-pack, only 1 needs the actual strap so Nintendo can save money on string. Or, you know, just put a pair of them in the SwitchPad box. (Apple is so going to love it when Nintendo starts selling SwitchPads. They could go w/ SwitchTabs but Samsung has that one as well.)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01N7RTJDM?tag=amz-mkt-chr-us-20&ascsubtag=1ba00-01000-org00-def00-other-nomod-us000-pcomp-feature-pcomp-wm-1
Switch being the only new concept this gen, and last gen
DS - 3DS
PS - PS2 - PS3 - PS4
Wii - Wii U
Xbox - 360 - 1
is what's going to make it sell. And once Switch 2 comes out and they've figured out how to milk the accessories for all they're worth I think it can be a great little system. Maybe even powerful enough w/ a higher res screen for good VR. People still need to buy it though, Nintnedo can't let up. All I currently see for May is them letting up and focusing too much on a 3 yr old port of MK8.
@rjejr Sort of fits with my dock comment? Because of the napkin holder/origami remark? That's a bit of a stretch...
But I actually agree with you and most people on the ridiculously high price of that dock, so I would still like to find out why the hell that is the case. By now, I think it's safe to say that there isn't more to the dock than meets the eye, although I do still like to keep options open on it having a certain form factor and apparent useless empty space to account for future-proofing, aka dock 2.0 that actually DOES contain more hardware.
As for that heat dissipation thing: no, it's not the screen that generates the most heat, that is probably the part that generates the least heat or only average heat. Most heat comes from the SoC/CPU&GPU, so these need to stay adequately cooled to be able to operate at maximum performance when connected to the TV, and since the heat vents are on top of the Switch, the upright position is the best and quickest way to get rid of that heat excess.
Cable-only solutions may come later on, or with Switch 2, that has somehow solved the chip-overheating problem, but until then, the only option to not let it overheat when only connected by a cable, is to not allow it to go full speed, so it will simply be portable mode on TV, so no higher than 720p, just like you would have when playing on the go.
And for the people that want their separate home experience from the Switch with all the benefits that this can offer, that probably isn't going to cut it, so it would ultimately be convenience vs performance for the various audiences that either care or don't care about these "dock-only" extras...
@rjejr P.S. Bought a couple of Wii U games again: Pikmin 3, Super Mario 3D World and Nintendo Land, the latter somewhat of a must-buy in my opinion, because of it being the Wii U's version of Wii Sports...
So, I'm up to twelve games now. I'm buying two or three each month, starting with the older titles, in hopes of getting most of the good ones before they're gone forever.
I'll probably double-dip for Breath of the Wild around the end of the year, because I'll probably buy the Switch then, and I want all good titles for the Wii U as well, so BotW will be at least one of the titles that I will buy double.
@ThanosReXXX In retrospect, I think I screwed up royally about the screen generating the most heat, I think I confused it with eating up the battery. No matter what I've always done on my tablets when I've checked the battery usage screen is almost always the number 1 drainer. Docking it, would, I assume, cause the battery to get less hot if it's then running off of the plugged in outlet, but then I'm not sure how hot the battery itself actually gets, probably not much compared tot he CPU and GPU.
I've always thought a NX/Switch w/ TV out would have to run at 720p and stereo rather than 1080p and 5.1 b/c I've always thought the dock would help w/ the bump up in graphics via some extra hardware. Knowing that the dock is a little more than a billboard doesn't change the idea that a cable out could still limit TV gaming to 720 and stereo. In a hotel or kids room you arne't likely to find a really large screen TV or 5.1 sound anyway. My kid plays is NES Mini on his 21" PC screen w/ those lousy built in tinny sounding speakers.
I'd be more than satisfied w/ a Switch w/ 1 dock in our main living room w/ the 52" 1080p TV and 5.1 surround sound if I could then buy a $25 cable just take the Switch to my kids rooms, bedroom, hotel or parents house and using 1 cable plug it into a tv and get 720p and stereo sound. I think Apple used to sell a $50 cable for tv out from the iPods way back when. I'd be willing to pay $25 for 1 cable even if it didn't charge it and we only got 2-3 hours of play, that's enough for a secondary TV location. If the cable spilt on the end, USB for charging and HDMI for TV, even better.
Point is, 720p and stereo is fine for travel, just don't want to pack up and haul around the dock. Which I can actually justify for $50 - there is some tech in there - but not $90. It's just $90 so people buy a 2nd Switch instead, that's the only reason. If people really want it for $90, they can have it, but a $300 Switch starts looking better.
@rjejr I totally agree with your view on how to use that cable, but like I said: that's not for all of us, and a lot of people would want a "connected to TV" experience to be superior to the handheld one, and I can also understand that point of view, so suffice to say that I'm in the middle.
But there IS a problem with this setup if solutions like that will be available in the future, seeing as portable is not only limited to 720p, but in a lot of cases also to 30fps as opposed to 60fps in docked mode. Not all coders are as good as Shin'en, who managed to keep their game 60fps no matter what configuration you play it in...
Now imagine docked players going online and you being a player that has his Switch connected to the TV with a cable, restricted to that lower frame rate, and you're already several points behind in being able to win any game that offers higher frame rates when docked...
So, ultimately, they would have to come up with a contraption that comprises all the functionalities of the dock, but is smaller than that and yet still offers enough cooling for the Switch to be able to go full force. A simple cable just won't do for that.
Then again: if you're not planning on doing online multiplayer and simply stick to local multiplayer with your kids and their respective cable-connected Switches, then you'd probably be just fine...
"In retrospect, I think I screwed up royally about the screen generating the most heat, I think I confused it with eating up the battery."
Yeah, we older, grey-templed people get confused a lot. Comes with the territory...
As for the battery vs mains power thing: that will decrease heat to some extent, at least in the battery compartment, but seeing as the chipset is performing at around 30% faster across the board when docked, the extra heat that this creates will indeed be the worst culprit an will more than make up for not having a hot battery, so more cooling is still needed, preferably in docked and/or upright position...
I'm also still not sure if it's just the USB-C connector that turns off the screen when docked, or if there is something more to it, because if there is, then that is yet another reason why a simple cable can't replace a dock, because part of having that extra power available is also tied in to the screen not being active during TV play.
I believe I've also read someone saying that the USB-C connector in the Switch dock appears to be a custom one, so that might also be were part of the answer lies and is yet another reason why we won't just be able to go out and buy any old USB-C cable, lest we blow up our Switch...
@rjejr MKs the right thing to focus on even though it's of little interest to me. It's a 3 year old port of a game that's one of the top franchises in the industry and almost nobody bought it because nobody bought the hardware it's on This is the FIRST release of MK8 for all but the 12M of us who had a WiiU. Boring to NLers, but exciting to everyone else.
@Ralizah it really couldn't possibly be affordable since you have to get the electronics from an existing dock. So nintendo probably doesnt care since they still get the money.
@rjejr I took the dock in when I showed my students at work so I could hook it up to the projectors via HDMI and show them the full experience. Only did that once.
Some people might bring it all. True story: yesterday a student brought in his entire Wii U in a bag to play during lunch at college. He had a cheap battery add-on for the GamePad but had to find an outlet for the console of course.
@NEStalgia "This is the FIRST release of MK8 for all but the 12M of us who had a WiiU. Boring to NLers, but exciting to everyone else."
Unless they all just think it's MKWiiHD. I think MKWii sold a ridiculous number. Yep 36 million. That's 3x more than the Wii U sold. If MK is so popular that it could sell 36 million copies how could the Wii U itself not sell more consoles so people could buy MK8? Here's the how and why, MK8 looked too much like MKWii to a lot of those casual players. So while I think the attach rate for MK8D to Switch might be 1 -1, the number of copies of MKWii compared to the Wii U tells me MK does not sell consoles like you might otherwise think it does. Everybody is still playing MKWii. MKWiiHD will sell, so did Skyrim HD and about a half dozen already HD games on PS3 and then on the PS4, but the people who would buy a Switch for MK8D already bought a Switch for Zelda.
@aaronsullivan Too bad you don't teach an industrial design class, you could have them design a dock that doesn't mimic an ugly gray toaster.
I know the dock is portable, heck I've carried my Dreamcast and 4 controllers places to play Gauntlet (whichever 1 was on Dreamcast) but that doesn't really make the Dreamcast portable.
I'm looking forward to where the Switch goes, dock, Joycon, tablet, everything. I think Nintnedo can out Apple Apple - see the new "iPad" that they spent 2 beers worth of time naming? - if they just try. 3DS faceplates was just the start.
@rjejr I think more to the point nobody bought a Wii for MKWii, but tons of people who bought a Wii bought MKWii. It's not a console seller on its own the way BotW is, but it never has been. But it's a huge "this platform has this" bonus. The idea that a multiplayer racing game or even an online shooter for that matter can sell hardware is weird. Even if it ends up the most played game on a platform I think single player experiences have traditionally driven hardware. Nobody bought an SNES for Mario Kart, they bought it for Mario World. Kart's always been a spinoff even if it outsells the main series in software units, it doesn't propel hardware units too much. Still exciting to everyone who skipped the WiiU though. It's not going to push the 36mil of MKWii that was just tethered to the insane install base of the Wii and matched the gameplay habits of the Wii Sports crowd well.
"Too bad you don't teach an industrial design class, you could have them design a dock that doesn't mimic an ugly gray toaster."
The tiny gray toaster is fine. It's Microsoft's VCR that needed some design improvement
Tap here to load 119 comments
Leave A Comment
Hold on there, you need to login to post a comment...