BubbleMatrix82

@BigKing

I'm going to say the same thing I said to another user on this site. If you think $20/year is a bad deal for cloud saves that expire after 180 of unpaid service, access to a growing library of ONLINE PLAYABLE old Nintendo games, online multiplayer that could one day get every game a dedicated server, special "paid service" discounts on digital releases, and the ability to spread this service over multiple Nintendo Switches under a "family" plan (pending the user on that account is the only account and is part of the family plan) then you must see the value of $20 very differently than the target audience who this is targeting.

This service is not for the "eating a McDouble sandwich every day for dinner" crew. This service is for the "I spend ~$60 each check on a new game" crew. That means that $20 is just throw away money to us. If anything it's a very generous donation/fundraiser/crowdsource to Nintendo for building us a bigger and better community. Considering that the competitors are charging 3x that for an annual subscription (and no one shakes a fist at them for doing so with no FREE offerings for backwards compatible titles) then I think your expectations are TOO DAMN HIGH.

I also compare this NES library service to Netflix. Netflix is $13/mo, so $156/year. Nintendo is $20/year. By a large margin, Netflix makes more money per subscriber. They also have 5.52 million users according to Amazon Alexa. With all that extra money, Netflex is a juggernaut. You might argue that Nintendo has a lot of money because of all the money it makes from hardware sales and 1st party games, but what you don't understand is how a corporation DIVISIONS their business. Every "department" is considered an individual business. That means that a game like ARMS is given a startup cost and it's up to that company to work within that budget to make the game or to do fundraising to get more capital with that money. Nintendo isn't going to invest more money into a game if it isn't turning over a profit. The same is happening to the online service. An initial cost was given to the network engineers for hardware, security, and for bandwidth. If the network division fails to deliver a great service, they shut down the service. Nintendo is NOT going to take a loss on a service/product; that's why they abandoned the Wii U and the Virtual Boy. So until Nintendo raises the price of the monthly/annual fee, don't expect much more from them.

Lastly, no one cares about your Virtual Console woes. If you feel Nintendo should have launched with a full library of amazing games then you clearly don't know how to run a business. Nintendo has always been a demand side economics company; much like Disney and Apple. If you think entitlement and impulsive shopping through supply side economics is going to keep Nintendo alive you are gravely mistaken. Nintendo is a novelty product, not a brand pusher like Sony or Microsoft; they know that their best products aren't even products, they are ideas and a few original universes they own the rights to. Honestly, every company that's alive and doing well has their own original universes that keep them alive. Call of Duty, Halo, Grand Theft Auto, Mass Effect, Assassin's Creed, and plenty more are only "great games" because of your belief in their storytelling and their original universes. If you didn't believe in it, then all of these franchises go away; look at what happened to the Tony Hawk series and Hitman series. Games only exist because we want them to.

While stanning anything is stupid, fans are loyal and that's why Nintendo does what it does. If Nintendo didn't, then it would have died several times since the 80s. The N64 Disk Drive, the Virtual Boy, the GameCube, and the Wii U were all failures. If Nintendo didn't have stans then Nintendo would have been taken out of the race and then we'd be stuck with the "PC wannabe" systems and no innovator. I say stop hating on people who love things because it doesn't make you an interesting person except getting attention from someone who can out logic you on a public forum.

I get it that people don't like limits, boundaries, or edgeboxes; but they also want optimization and fluid gameplay with no service interruptions. If we could all upload a 5gb backup file simultaneously at full data transfer capabilities, do you think the service would deny service to other Nintendo services? The answer is yes. Imagine an entire comic or anime convention trying to leave at the same time through a single wide doorway. That's what this is. 8Mb/s is more than enough for thr time being until Ninty can order a larger server farm to host cloud saves and more networking equipment to do load balancing.

The truth of the matter though is that Nintendo needs to shut down the Wii U and 3DS services to make space for the switch if they aren't going to buy new equipment.

Interesting. I wonder if all multiplatform games will support this? Rocket League? Stardew?

Since Square is opening up to Nintendo after the CD debacle since Nintendo wanted to stay on chips, Sony needs to do the same thing over the SNES CD as well and make this "rivalry" a collaboration, because else, big daddy Ninty is going to sweep house and make them go extinct. Sony has, after all, conceeded to Nintendo on the hand held market, so where's your god now?

"Become a true fan" is like saying "Are you a real villain?" js

I saw some relics in the video that made it very clear he was using a cybernetic brain implant doped up on Adderall to hack his mind and upload a TAS to his neo cortex. We need to remove this haxed win and give it back to heart rate monitor guy since this guy was clearly cheatering'stve. /s

For a guy who promised Wattam 4 years ago and still hasn't delivered I'm indifferent. Katamari is a great game because of replay value, Mario and Zelda not so much; I get it. But considering he hasn't released his big game yet, I think he's just spilling tea to avoid fire for his lack of release. Either that or he wants to get back into the ring and that's why he's casting shade. Either way, where's Wattam?

Most gamers complaining about this weren't gaming during the Xbox Original days. You paid $50/year or $35/3 months and all you could do was text each other and play games (some games had voice chat but not all). Considering this is a launch of online services, you have to expect it to suck at first. This is trial and error time!

@tedko No one likes leasing because everyone knows buying is a better ROI, but the truth of the matter is that buying is not good ROI on publishers who have to recoup $1M of dev costs; many have to do shady things like crap DLC to cover loses. It doesn't help that the used game industry still exists and are dipping into publishers profits. Top it off with people who give their passwords to other people to play their paid digital games purchase and you have entire communities that thrive on pennies of a dollar that takes hundreds on a penny to upkeep.

There will always be a consumer vs producer war; let's hope Nintendo delivers an acceptable DRM Netflix style platform to feed your hunger. Clearly your goal is to own a game that sells on eBay for $90 used for a fraction of the cost, but that's up to Nintendo and their partners to decide if that's part of their updated EULA of the product to do.

Anyone complaining about "after the boat" clearly did use the dog to go "back in time" and go back to that main area and continue their fun open world. As far as the "story on rails" issue that everyone is complaining about, the game was actually a really great story!!! Don't forget that Jrpg games are all about the plot and Arpg games (American) are all about the open roam and the feeling of some sense of control over the character. The game was not meant to be Skyrim, Breath of the Wild, or Witcher; it was a FF game!!!

As far as this version of the game, I added it to the collection of games I own but I haven't played it yet. The game's graphics are offputting but I would love to play the story line again without all the grinding. My biggest concern is the zombie area near the end; was it included in this version?

@tedko They just want people to adopt the service right now; this isn't the final product. HaaS and SaaS are the new pilots of the Switch; if you are familiar with the aaS market, basically they release something (anything) into the world and then they improve appoint it over time. Example: Final Fantasy XV was released then immediately after they added 3 Episodic content to fix holes in the plotline and patches to improve the overall experience of the game. This is considered "Software as a Service". The Switch is "Hardware as a Service"; meaning the system starts bare bones with little R&D invested into it besides security/stability/functionality and then they approve on it from the baseline position without overloading the system or the end user. I don't expect this level of service to be "all" that they are offering.

@electrolite77 Then pay a good price for a good service cheapskate! $96/year is the cheapest for a good service, not $20

Unwritten benefit of Nintendo Online being behind a paygate: No more dirty casuals online playing competitive games like Splatoon 2.

@electrolite77 What's textbook is all these babies wanting something NINTENDO NEVER PROMISED

@SuperZeldaMaker

Nintendo is rebuilding their brand identity after that businessman president got them out of bankruptcy risk. I don't know if you know it but the new President (a Millennial) has a very radical vision for the company and their goal is to expand beyond the "Nintendo equals nostalgia times family friendly divided by hardcore gamers plus Apple 'we are the best' arrogance" that they once had. The fact we have publishers like SquareEnix and Bethesda supporting this system is a sign of a huge shift in Nintendo strategy (reminder: SE still hates Nintendo for wasting their time on the SNES CD and forcing them to go to Sony for FF7 so this is a breakthrough).

I get it though man, $20 is worth a different value to you than it does to me. I buy $40 to $60 worth of games every week, so to me $20 A YEAR is nothing and should score me nothing besides paying my dues to get cloud saves and special deals. If the service were $50 like PSN or Live then I would be complaining but $20/year is nothing.

In comparison, Netflix is $156 a year for a very limited spectrum of content. Funimation or Crunchyroll (individually) costs $96 a year with a great range of content but not enough imho. Amazon prime costs $120 a year and it doesn't have a very robust range of content either since most is gated at a rental fee instead of included with the service. So paying $20/year for a library that is certain to grow over winter do to popular DEMAND then I think you are being childish and entitled.

But alright man you be salty and hate on this startup cost for a service that Nintendo has never done before. Nintendo is new to DRM so giving this a trial and error to me seems reasonable. Just like how our Switch system menu doesn't have folders yet or even menu music, it all needs to develop over time.

Welcome to HaaS, hardware as a service

@SuperZeldaMaker The issue is you are a niche retro gamer who values classics over indie games and the other things the system has to offer, but the system isn't being made for you exclusively. The system is being made with scarcity and demand side economics in mind. They tried the "make it and they will come" supply side approach with the Wii U and they never came (I did but not many people did). So they are going to force us to do things in waves. Surely out of boredom you will try a game you never would have liked because it is available and now you are a newcomer to a genre you thought you never liked.

Look I want access to my childhood favorites too like Lufia 2 but if the game industry wants us to not have access to that then we have to wait until they do or go on eBay and buy original hardware and the game at top dollar.

The real issue is, $20 a year is too little to pay for better games. Clearly they need cash flow to build a server farm and the appropriate network load balancing still. You may think Nintendo is this rich company but in reality, Nintendo only has a games division; Sony has music/movies/Tv's/walkman/etc and Microsoft has Windows/Office/MSNBC/Bing/Etc. It just isn't a fair fight at the moment. Give them time to evolve.

One more point is Nintendo is a culture, they need Smash to release before they take out the big guns; they make more money on Smash than any other franchise (Zelda included).

@BlackenedHalo It would work really well and kind of matches the tiers for cell phone plans so it is a tried and true system. Also most people pay $60 for live or PSN anyways so if you climb to Wii games then it makes the incremental price hikes look worth it.

Throw in Netflix at tier $30 a year and Twitch at $40 then it starts looking sweeter

@SuperZeldaMaker I mean you do you and be bitter but virtual console was a failure, maybe not to you but from a business standpoint it had very low adoption rates. By building the games into the subscription package it allows people who aren't internet or computer savvy to adopt it. Sure, it's a bit underwhelming, but that's your instant gratification talking not your wallet

Nintendo is looking at the value of their intellectual properties differently. I see no reason why they wouldn't release a tiered system. $20 for online and NES games, $30 for previous tier and SNES games, $40 for previous tier and N64, $50 for previous tier and GameCube, $60 for full access to all Nintendo systems (including Wii)

@Alex90 I have both versions on Steam though :/

How does this differ from the steam release by the same name? Just curious

Are the battles touch enabled? Like dragging the heart around? Or is it all analog or dpad controlled? Touch controls would help immensely with the Sans fight but I can see why Toby would exclude it.

My only concern is the family account thing. Is that an "all of my accounts on this switch go online" version or is it a "all my family members have switches so one bill for 4 accounts on 4 switches" thing?

If former then off on $80/month switch bill. If latter then that is a badass deal

I wonder if the game is just a port or if it will have extras. I would love me some katamari avatars for my profile though.

@Al_Godoy

For someone with Mallow as an avatar it's pretty funny you are bashing games that are quirky.

Katamari is basically a beat the clock game with a side of masochism. The graphics are simple because the absurdity and the surrealism of the game is part of its appeal. It is honestly one of the most challenging games you'll ever play because it depends a lot on stage memorization and your ability to dodge hazards with a ball in full inertia going towards it.

The trailer didn't do it justice because they used the ps2 video not the actual game with the hd textures. I'll honestly be surprised if you don't like it. The game is a huge stress relief.

Mall story was good too but yeah Game Dev Story would be fun to play again. I hope they are priced fairly. $5/ea? I actually hope we see a lot of Kairosoft, they make fun games and their mascot is cute.

@Strumpan https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQpiaGaJjwk Here's a tutorial on how to use the drum stick joycons

@ReaderRagfish Sounds like to me you're on a tight budget of time and you only play games that meet a certain level of "polish" because you don't have a lot of time to play games. Either that or you only like one type of genre (FPS or ARPG) and because of that you don't branch out. Alright though, not everyone has to buy things outside of their skillset and enjoy it, your reasons just seemed silly to me that's all

@oats-81 You played it for the trophy, that's why.

Jrpg titles have always been about the characters. You want a game that has a lot of mechanics and a lot of "feeling powerful" moments then play an american rpg. You have to be interested in the literature side of things to appreciate it.

@Eef Fangamer is the only way to get an affordable collector's edition. It's the official site according to Toby Fox and sold anywhere else will have a markup. Get it!

@ReaderRagfish @invictus4000

"Based on past disappointments" is a bad reason to hate on a game. Past disappointments just means you joined a hype train and it failed to deliver. This game is tried and true. Here's my reply to your two reasons to not buy it:

1 (you). Games that are almost exclusively praised for story/emotional impact rather than gameplay (excluding visual novels)
1(me). This game actually has a pretty great bullethell battle system which makes the final bosses on the "genocide route" very difficult if you have no bullethell skill. Also the twists that Toby Fox did on the jrpg traditional tropes is really worth checking out. Especially the way it feels like choices matter (something not even Mass Effect could pull off)

2(you). Indie games that come out of nowhere and immediately get a rabid cult fanbase.
2(me). Of course when AAA games come out of nowhere and immediately get a rabid cult fanbase (like Borderlands, Fortnite, Assassin's Creed, and Overwatch to name a few) you don't bat an eye??? Also, hating something that's popular doesn't make you an interesting person so stop being so silly with your rules and just play a cool game. It's cheap and it's fun. I'm sure you wasted $15 on something worse, like that phone case you never use any more or that hat you bought to look cool but you realized you hate wearing hats. So get off your morality high horse and just try it!

I tagged the 4000 person because they agreed with you.

@GeeEmm Create a united states account and buy it in the states if you don't want to pay the Aussie price. It's completely legal since the Switch is region free (they just have local economies for people who don't know how to get around things and they are too honest)

I love the Mordecai and Rigby from Regular Show reference in the screenshot