@Project_Dolphin People will disagree with me of course. That's just the nature of having an opinion. But I also think, judging from this very comment section, there's an overwhelming number of people who are disenfranchised with Nintendo's direction just as I am. There's a reason the Wii U has only sold 12 million units, and I think that reason goes beyond just the hardware and the messaging.
Anyway, agree to disagree I suppose. My opinion is that Nintendo's hardware and software are a far cry from what they used to be. You obviously don't have to agree with me, and it's pretty clear I'm not going to sway you in any direction, but I think there's a pretty significant number of people who do agree.
@Project_Dolphin Reviews are not objective by any stretch of the imagination. They are by definition subjective. Even if there is a score at the bottom of a page, that score is not objective, it is based on somebody's opinion. Even if there is an average of all scores on all websites, that average is determined based on reviewers' subjective opinions. Let's not confuse reviews with objectivity, because they do not belong together in any way.
Reviews are not solely what I'm getting at anyways. Review scores are a fairly outdated and poor representation of the overall quality of a game, and in the games industry, always lean to the positive end of the spectrum when games may not necessarily deserve it (most sites don't score below a 7 unless the game is decidedly bad, so 7 can often be read as average-mediocre even if it's described as "good" on the website). My point is that Nintendo has pumped out a lot of games in the last year that are utterly devoid of imagination. And even the ones that have come out this generation with some semblance of heart and imagination are often playing it safe and devoid of much risk-taking. Is that my opinion? Sure, but I think that it's pretty noticeable based on the examples I've given. I think you'll find that it becomes observably true with enough time. I can't imagine anyone looking back on the Wii U in 10 years and saying "What an innovative and memorable generation of software."
@Project_Dolphin Kirby and Yoshi, outside of interesting art styles, didn't do much to differentiate themselves from prior entries. Kirby was just Canvas Curse with a clay art style and clunkier to play on the Gamepad than on a DS. Yoshi got decent reviews, but as far as I could tell, was just more Yoshi. Also consider the fact that those two games are indicative of Nintendo playing it extraordinarily and underwhelmingly safe this console generation as a whole. Even if there are great games on Wii U (and there are), most of the first party games are all either entries in pre-established formulas, or altogether remasters:
New Super Mario Bros. U
Pikmin 3
Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze
Mario Party 10
Mario Tennis
Wii Sports Resort
Super Smash Bros. Wii U
The Legend of Zelda Wind Waker HD
The Legend of Zelda Twilight Princess HD
Super Mario 3D World
Kirby and the Rainbow Curse
Yoshi's Woolly World
Star Fox Zero
Mario Kart 8
Like I said, some of these games are good and some are even great. Smash, for example, is the best version of Smash I've ever played. And there are some exceptions to the rule of course, like Splatoon and Mario Maker. But I'm sharing this list to show that even most of Nintendo's great games on Wii U have been largely derivative. Compare this to some highlights from the GameCube's lineup, which saw the likes of Super Mario Sunshine, Luigi's Mansion, Pikmin, Wind Waker, Metroid Prime, and Animal Crossing. All games that, if they weren't altogether new IPs, shook up their respective franchises in imaginative and new ways.
The lack of innovation and imagination within core franchises (with some exceptions), coupled with the influx of games that clearly have misread what the audience wanted (Color Splash, Amiibo Festival, Federation Force), and games that simply ended up being mediocre and even abysmal (Mario Tennis, Amiibo Festival), is what's causing my doubt about Nintendo's future in console development. It's not crazy or absurd to have low expectations of their future hardware AND software, especially after the last few years. That's really all I'm getting at.
@Project_Dolphin Never argued the fact that Nintendo doesn't still make great games from time to time. Even Super Mario 3D World, which is a highly derivative game, is still a solid game. I'm simply saying that the ratio of great games to average/mediocre games is worse now than it's arguably ever been. The fact that you can only name Super Mario Maker and Splatoon as Nintendo's marquee games last year is extraordinarily disappointing. Meanwhile, Happy Home Designer, Amiibo Festival, Mario Party 10, and Mario Tennis were absolute duds, while Paper Jam, Yoshi, and Kirby were all decidedly average.
Hopefully this is indicative of AAA development on the Wii U and 3DS slowing to a halt in favor of NX development, not a sign that Nintendo is losing touch with games development in general. Still, after seeing the way Paper Mario looks and last year's slew of 'meh' games, it's hard not to be a bit worried.
@Pokefanmum82 The Wii and the Gamepad can hardly be considered "innovations" when the wider industry has failed to adopt them in any meaningful way. Hardly anyone except Nintendo develops with these peripherals in mind anymore.
The joystick and D-pad were innovative because they completely changed the way games are developed for and experienced (and have stayed around for the long haul). Other consoles' steps in pushing graphical fidelity and processing power are small innovations, but still innovations because they incrementally push the games industry forward and allow developers to make games they couldn't before.
The Wii Remote, meanwhile, was a temporary fad that may have achieved temporary widespread audience adoption, but failed to revolutionize the way the wider industry plays games. Do you see anyone developing games that use motion controls anymore? The list is extraordinarily small and almost never comes at the expense of regular joystick/button controls. Hell, even Nintendo hardly develops games using Wii Remotes. The Gamepad isn't remotely innovative and can't even be classified as a fad; not only has the industry not adopted it, but only the Nintendo hardcore (practically a niche audience at this point) have it in their homes at all.
Nintendo has not been nearly as "innovative" as people give them credit for, at least not in the last decade. Their hardware is simply different for the sake of being different, for no meaningful reason. No one, not even Shigeru Miyamoto, can develop a game that justifies why the Gamepad even exists in the first place.
That's what the Paper Mario series seems like to me too. Nintendo gutted Paper Mario of everything that made the series what it is (interesting and emotional story, humor, badges, progression system, combat system, partners) and instead threw new ideas at the wall just for the sake of making a "different" game. Then rather than simply making it a new IP, they slapped "Paper Mario" on the title, despite not having anything to do with the originals, so it would sell better. This is less "innovative" and more fixing something that wasn't broken to begin with.
@GoldenGamer88 "And regarding the track-record of Mario games lately, it doesn't help much - quite the opposite in fact. Sticker Star, every M&L since Inside Story, Mario 9-10, Mario Tennis, New Super Mario Bros., Mario 3D Land, Mario 3D World - all of them just felt too "paint by number" and utterly souless. Just the generic squeeky cleaniness of the NSMB series. Like, most of the games that I listed I still consider to be good but are nowhere near as great and UNIQUE as Mario's games from NES to GameCube/Wii era."
I'm so glad I'm not the only one who has noticed this. This is an especially alarming trend considering Nintendo has traditionally had a reputation for quality games. The hardware is not the greatest, but at least the games are imaginative and innovative. At least that's what the consensus usually is.
But we've now reached a point where even that statement can be called into question. Mario Tennis, Mario Party 10, and Animal Crossing Amiibo Festival were three of the worst reviewed games last year. Mario Tennis especially was one of the most half-assed attempts at a game I've ever seen Nintendo make. Star Fox, while it looks like it plays smoothly, still looks dreadfully ugly, paint-by-numbers, and unimaginative. And that's after its revisions and delay. Mario games, as you've said, have been remarkably stiff and soulless this generation, which is shocking to say about a franchise that contains the likes of SMB3 and Super Mario Galaxy. And now we have Paper Mario Color Splash, which looks equally mechanical and soulless. It's like Nintendo devs are putting out games not because they want to, but because they have to.
This generation has not only cast significant doubt over Nintendo's ability to make competitive hardware, but also its ability to make innovative and heartfelt software. When the Legend of Zelda is quite literally the only game that looks to live up to that standard in the future, there is a bit of a problem.
@rushiosan Couldn't agree more. Just as Federation Force is Metroid in name only, Paper Mario Sticker Star/Color Splash appear to be Paper Mario in name only, because the mechanics no longer resemble what constitutes a "Paper Mario" game. Nintendo seems content to throw literally any game under the umbrella of a preexisting IP just to make it sell better, even when the game doesn't have any resemblance to what makes the franchise what it is (Federation Force, Animal Crossing Amiibo festival, Paper Mario Sticker Star, Starfox Guard, etc.).
Really unhappy with where Nintendo is right now. Definitely doesn't help that Miyamoto has so much say in Nintendo's development lately either. His best ideas are far, far behind him.
It may be too early to automatically deem this game to be a bad one, yes, but that doesn't mean we can't look at the gameplay footage and see that this is clearly not the Paper Mario anyone wanted.
The Wind Waker comparison is not an applicable one because WW was still, at its core, a mainline Zelda game. People hated the art style a lot but the mechanics are clearly recognizable as Zelda. Paper Mario Color Splash, meanwhile, is totally unrecognizable to its foundational predecessors (PM and TTYD) in terms of mechanics. It is not mechanically a "Paper Mario" game at all, not if we're comparing it to the original PM and TTYD. Instead it's clearly a follow up to the worst game in the franchise (which I assumed was a spinoff, but that's clearly not the case anymore) rather than a return to the traditional RPG gameplay that made the originals such excellent games. What we can glean from the footage is that Paper Mario still seems to be Paper Mario in name only.
Yes, it is too early to judge the overall quality of the game, and I'm all for Nintendo trying new things. But sequels in franchises are meant to refine an already-existing formula, not throw the baby out with the bath water and transform it into something completely irrelevant to what makes the franchise what it is. Nintendo still doesn't seem to perceive what fans want out of the Paper Mario series, and that is what's most baffling. I hope I'm proven wrong about my expections of this game, but I doubt that I will be.
Do we really need another review of this game seeing as how it's already been released on Wii U? Are we going to do this with Super Metroid, Super Mario World, etc. For the umpteenth time too? Lol
@Pianomanfreak If you didn't want to hear other people's opinions, maybe you shouldn't have come to a comment section. You know, where people can voice their opinions? Telling people to "grow up" and "quit complaining" just because they have differing opinions than yours isn't the most reasonable thing to do.
I'm glad this article was written, because Nintendo really can't keep handling the Virtual Console this archaically when the NX comes around. Moves like this don't give me much faith in what Nintendo has to come.
@Ichiban Hopefully this isnt the fanfare that accompanies Nintendo's future promotions. With the NX, they cant afford a lukewarm announcement like this.
I sold my Wii U last summer after Nintendo's E3 showing, and after seeing that Nintendo had virtually nothing left on the horizon for this machine (at least nothing I was interested in). The only game that's made me remotely regret the decision to sell was Super Mario Maker. And now, with this game's mechanics being Sticker Star-like and not TTYD-like, it looks like not even this HD Paper Mario game is tempting me back.
Hope the NX can remind me why I love Nintendo, because lately I find myself more disappointed by them than anything else.
It feels like Nintendo has done this a lot lately. Starfox is getting a new game on Wii U!? Oh wait, it sort of looks like an up-rezzed Wii game. There's a new Metroid Prime game coming out!? Oh wait, it's just a multiplayer shooter for 3DS. There's an Animal Crossing game for Wii U!? Oh wait, it's just an amiibo tie-in. Paper Mario is coming to the Wii U!? Oh wait, it looks like it has mechanics ripped from the worst game in the franchise.
Too early to judge, maybe, but I have a sinking feeling about this one.
This year was straight up abysmal for the Wii U. It stuns me that so many here think otherwise. Splatoon, Mario Maker, and Xenoblade. Maybe Yoshi, I guess? That seems to be the consensus. If that's all the stuff of note that came out this year, that's a pretty sad year. Meanwhile Nintendo's competitors have had a kickass year with WAY more high quality games, and they're gearing up for an even stronger one.
Nintendo's E3 presentation was what really made me appalled though. Starfox was shown, and boy, was it ugly. A Metroid was announced that wasn't Metroid, an Animal Crossing was announced that wasn't Animal Crossing, and a Paper Mario was announced that wasn't really Paper Mario. Yay!!!
Nintendo has a near-insurmountable hill of obstacles to overcome in 2016. Sans Zelda, there are no more AAA games left coming to the Wii U. Nintendo is now releasing a new console at a time when their competitors' consoles will be hitting their strides. And if Nintendo doesn't nail it, and I mean absolutely nail it, with third party support and all, they are going to find it very challenging to stay in the console business any longer.
@Baker1000 What are you talking about? Twilight Princess sold twice as well as Wind Waker thanks to its dual release on Wii and GC. In fact, 7 out of 8 Twilight Princess copies bought were on the Wii. So I'd say it worked pretty well in Nintendo's favor. To release Zelda on only Wii U would be dooming the game, and Nintendo is probably not interested in sending one of their biggest AAA franchises to a console that has only sold 11-12 million units. Plus they probably want to push as many NX units as possible, and I bet Zelda is going to help with that.
I'll never understand why people want Nintendo to wait until 2017 to release the NX either. Nintendo has virtually nothing of AAA caliber on the horizon for 2016 besides Zelda. It makes zero business sense for them to sit on the now-barren Wii U/3DS for almost another two years.
Well a remake is better than getting practically nothing on the Wii U.
That said, after this game's announcement, there's no way any Nintendo fan can point the finger at Sony, MS, or third parties when it comes to remasters... Nintendo has remastered, or (in the case of ALBW) heavily remade/reimagined 5 of the last 7 console Zelda games, and that all happened in this single generation. They're just as guilty as anyone else when it comes to remaking and remastering old content. Arguably more so.
The fact that physical media is still around is partially because the market demands it, but more so because retail stores like Walmart or Gamestop would be at the throats of Sony, Microsoft, or Nintendo if there were no physical releases on their platforms.
Think about it: what's the one thing you have to buy physically? The console. So if Sony, for instance, were to come out and say, "We're not doing physical releases anymore," that would cut pretty hard into Walmart's game sale profits. So what's to stop Walmart from saying, "You'd better not pull your games from our stores, or we're going to stop selling your consoles."
Right now game retail stores and console manufacturers are at a standoff in that regard. And it doesn't have any indication of ending anytime soon. That said, if one console manufacturer were to be the first to say "screw you" to retail stores (just like they do to pretty much everyone else outside their sphere), it would be Nintendo.
@smashbrolink Debatable. The game has gotten very little media coverage (even among gaming sites) and evidence largely points to the fact that the original Xenoblade Chronicles sold no more than a million copies worldwide (NN3DS version included).
Just because a game "deserves" to sell millions doesn't mean that it will. The fact that the game is a Wii U exclusive also hurts its chances of selling to its fullest potential.
Side note: I like your "subtle" attack on other consoles with the use of your qualifier, "Even if it were on a different console, it would STILL deserve to sell millions." As if being on a different console is a worse situation. Give me a break.
It's such a pleasure to see you around again. And it's also good to know I'm not the only one who thinks that the NX, in Nintendo's current state, is practically destined for failure. Third parties absolutely detest Nintendo's platforms and Nintendo has only made that worse by snidely walking around E3 2015 and judging people's work. Not to mention Nintendo only just recently gave third parties dev kits for the NX, and we're likely within a year of release! And compounding the issues is the fact that releasing the NX right smack in the middle of Sony/MS's stride is a terrible idea, and when the inevitable new generation releases in 3 or 4 years, Nintendo will be behind yet again. This and dozens of other internal and external factors pretty much solidify the NX's failure at this point, unless Nintendo has been working hard at fixing all of these issues, which we have absolutely no indication of.
The Wii U has been dead in the water, even to Nintendo, for almost a full year now. There hasn't been a first party AAA release on the system since Smash Bros., and that was almost a full year ago. And the only one coming out in the foreseeable future is Xenoblade, a niche JRPG title that only the Nintendo hardcore seem to care about. This has been the fastest and most abrupt ending to a home console Nintendo has ever done, and that's saying a lot.
Is anyone really surprised by this? Nintendo is barely limping along at this point, trying to put out enough B- and C-tier games at the end of this generation to make people feel like they have something to play on their Wii U's and 3DS's, with the quality of said games suffering big time. All of Nintendo's AAA devs have moved on to the next console. And we probably should too.
@Marshi I hate to break it to you, but that's probably what they're going for. Zelda Wii U wasn't just delayed to 2016, it was delayed indefinitely. You know what else has an indefinite release date? The NX. I don't think that's coincidence.
You'll probably see it on Wii U too of course... But it won't be a Wii U exclusive.
"Given the amount of love and attention we've bestowed Xbox One title Rare Replay recently..."
Hahah, seriously? You all literally just posted a soapbox a few days ago complaining about how Rare Replay wasn't on a Nintendo console. I hardly think that's bestowing any "love and attention" on the game. Just expressing outright jealousy that Xbox owners get to play it and you don't.
Couldn't have said it better than you guys. The idea that MS fans "don't really deserve" this collection is a load of hypocritical garbage. Any Bayonetta fan could've made the same argument - that Nintendo fans "don't really deserve" Bayonetta 2, since Platinum never made the original for a Nintendo console. If you're a Nintendo fan who welcomed Bayonetta 2 with open arms, you have to be okay if other companies get your favorite games too.
Here's a novel idea: rather than crying about how other consoles have games that yours won't play, rather than demonizing other companies who put games on consoles other than yours, maybe you can just save up and buy the other console.
That's the allure of "exclusives", folks. This is not anything new, and it's something many of you should already be familiar with as Nintendo fans. If you want games from Naughty Dog, Santa Monica Studios, Guerilla Games, and third parties, you buy a PS4. If you want games from Retro, Next Level Games, and Nintendo's other studios, you buy a Wii U/NX. And imagine this: if you want games from 343, Turn 10, third parties, and now Rare, you need an Xbox One.
If you want a game, get the platform it's on. That's my soapbox.
I don't know if a "commercial splash" is what this game is going to pull off. I'm sure it'll have a great attach rate and that Wii U owners will buy it, but bundling it with systems isn't going to move units. Not after Nintendo has been talking up the NX so much.
Miyamoto hasn't exactly been at the top of his game lately. Between the two of them, I would prefer to see Takeda take the reins. Doubtful that this might happen, but my favorite scenario would be an outside hire or a younger president shaking things up a little bit.
You can stop with the sarcastic tirade now. Every publisher has issues and everyone does the whole remake/sequel nonsense, Nintendo included. You've got to admit Nintendo hasn't been the saintly bringer of new ideas this gen:
Pikmin 3 New Super Mario Bros. U Mario Kart 8 Super Smash Bros. for Wii U Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze Super Mario 3D World Yoshi's Woolly World Kirby and the Rainbow Curse Mario Party 10 Wind Waker HD Wii Fit U Wii Sports Club
Don't get me wrong, most of these are great and polished games, but they're either remakes or iterations on pre-established formulas. They're no less derivative than any of the competitors you mock.
Pachter makes a lot of sense here. Proprietary IP for proprietary hardware is definitely on the wane. This is the first console Nintendo has been selling based on first party power alone, and it's not going well for them.
Ironically, despite trying to make this gen's hardware "innovative," most of Nintendo's actual games have been anything but.
Pikmin 3
New Super Mario Bros. U
Mario Kart 8
Super Smash Bros. for Wii U
Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze
Super Mario 3D World
Yoshi's Woolly World
Kirby and the Rainbow Curse
Mario Party 10
Wind Waker HD
Wii Fit U
Wii Sports Club
Don't get me wrong, most of these are great and polished games, but they're either remakes or iterations on pre-established formulas. To look at Nintendo's whole lineup and claim that it's less derivative than anyone else's is a bit farfetched. Perhaps if Nintendo were not shackled to a dead proprietary piece of hardware, desperately trying to get well-known franchises on it for it to sell, they would be able to stop playing it safe with their actual games.
And that's a Nintendo I hope Iwata's successor is able to bring forth.
There's definitely some fault on both sides... Slightly Mad probably shouldn't have promised a Wii U version if that weren't certain they could deliver one. But then, Nintendo shouldn't have designed a console that's so damn hard to develop for.
This is probably the least surprising news I've seen in awhile. And if Nintendo makes their next hardware an obstacle like they have with the Wii U, I think we'll see them out of the hardware business sooner rather than later.
Pumped for this game - it's the only Kickstarter project I've ever backed. I can't wait to get it next year (probably on PS4, because I'm a trophy addict ).
@Aromaiden Definitely. They need all of their big sellers in attendance. At the bare minimum, a true 3D Mario, probably a 2D Mario, Zelda, Mario Kart, Smash and so on. The Wii U had most of those things and still didn't sell well, so Nintendo's IPs, while rich and coveted, are starting to lose even their selling power (at least when they're the only things you can play on a 350 dollar console). Again, I hope they figure it out, but it's a precarious position they're in.
In reference to the first poll question: The NX has been all but confirmed as a home console. Reggie referred to it as such in one of his interviews at E3, and the Metroid Prime creator heavily implied that if a full home console Metroid game was to be made, it would be developed for the NX instead of the Wii U (implying that NX is indeed the successor to the Wii U).
All that said, Nintendo has a near-insurmountable hill to climb with their next console. If it's another gimmicky console that lacks the power of its competitors', then Nintendo will again be stuck without third parties, stuck supporting a console by themselves. Which, judging from the way the Wii U is faring on that design philosophy, can most likely spell failure for the NX.
Then again, even if they do everything right, even if they release a console more powerful than PS4 and Xbox One, win back third parties, and release a gimmick-free console with a host of solid launch titles, they still face the significant obstacle of launching mid-generation, when both the PS4 and Xbox One are hitting their stride. Which means those consoles will already have a host of great games available to play, and meanwhile Nintendo will be starting from zero.
All that is to say the odds are significantly stacked against Nintendo. They don't exactly have consumer confidence right now and they alienate a greater number of their most devoted fans by the day. While I do hope Nintendo can pull a rabbit out of their hats on this one, they've got a LOT of work to do before the NX has any prayer of being a success.
As I've stated before, it took Sony an entire generation to win back gamers and third parties after the pitiful PS3 launch. Microsoft is still recovering from theirs this generation too. Nintendo has that much work to do within the next year or two, and it hardly looks like they're even trying!
Nope. I'm not Quorthon. If you look at my post history, I have interacted with him several times. And I was a pretty blind defender of Nintendo pretty early on in my post history too. It took me much longer to get burnt out on Nintendo than it took him, as far as I know.
Yes, as surprising as it is, there's more than one person on this site who takes issue with takes the way Nintendo does things.
You really expect me to take your points seriously when you use an ad hominem like that? Especially after you go on a noble rant about how you hate trolling? That sure gives validity to your argument.
All of my criticisms of Nintendo have been perfectly reasonable. The rumors turned out to be true and Nintendo is not publishing this game in North America. Just because the game is still coming out in North America does not change that fact.
My underlying point was not even so much about this particular piece of news, but rather the long string of problems Nintendo keeps stepping into post-E3, and how little they seem to care about rectifying those problems. Maybe if you had taken my comment in its context you would've seen that.
@MadAdam81 I'd argue even negative reactions that seem like "fan boy hate" will still help Nintendo in some way. It means even their most faithful fans are starting to get upset with them. It still leads to them changing, but you're right - I personally would rather see more healthy critique and less hate.
I'd also argue the more harmful fanboy reaction of the two extremes is rushing to Nintendo's side to defend their every action, even when their actions make no sense and continually strip away their own fans. Sometimes negativity is needed. With a company like Nintendo, it takes a lot of it to get through their pride.
Do I endorse blind hate? No. But a lot of people here have a right to be upset with them.
See my above comment (243) on why negative feedback is a good thing.
I'm glad people are finally critiquing Nintendo, because it's been a long time coming, and it breeds positive change. If you only wanted to read positive content, why are you even in a comment section? Why are you even on this journalistic website, which sometimes involves negative opinions? If you want blissfully ignorant positivity, you'd be more satisfied reading promotional materials on Nintendo's official website.
Exactly. Incentive needs to be there before Nintendo has any chance of changing for the better.
Although at this point, I don't know if even releasing a powerful console will solve their woes. Even if Nintendo does everything else right, they're launching mid-generation when PS4 and Xbox One will likely be hitting their stride. PS4 will probably be fast approaching 40 million sales, and Xbox One will be gaining significant traction too. PS4 and Xbox One will have tons of games to choose from by that point. Nintendo, meanwhile, will be starting from zero. And if the average hardcore gamer has already spent 400 dollars on a machine that plays current gen games, would they really be willing to shell out another 400 just to play half of those games, plus the few extra Nintendo titles? Already Nintendo has to pitch to people who want to (or who are able to) buy a second console, which is hurting their chances as it is.
Not only are they launching mid-generation, but they also have the near-impossible task of winning back third party publishers and developers, and winning back the goodwill of its own dwindling fanbase. That's something that took Sony a whole generation to do with the PS3. And Nintendo hasn't even started doing those things today (especially not with their fanbase)!
I don't know. It's an uphill battle for sure. One I hope they succeed at, but one that I have the sinking feeling they're going to fail at. And if they fail, hopefully they go third party so they can still provide hardcore experiences without the 400 dollar entry point.
I wish I were surprised by this news. I really do. But after the past few weeks of bad news Nintendo has been dishing out, it's just another normal weekday. Whoever is in charge of Nintendo's PR department sure has a lot of work to do!
It's kind of good that Nintendo has been flubbing it so badly since E3. It means that Nintendo fans (like myself) are finally forced to open their eyes and see them for the out-of-touch, prideful company they really are.
Change happens through critique and honest feedback, not blindly defending every action as being a good one. Most people on this site have been defending all of Nintendo's questionable decisions this generation (crappy console reveal, crappy third party support, artificial scarcity, amiibo shortages, Youtube Creators Program, locked on-disc DLC that's only accessible through $13+ amiibo, tablet controller that not even Nintendo knows how to make games for, etc.), but now E3 and Nintendo's subsequent mishaps are driving away even the most devoted of Nintendo fans (like myself).
Everyone in the comment section who is complaining about negative reactions needs to a) understand you're in a comment section, where people are (believe it or not) allowed to express positive and negative opinions, and b) understand that Nintendo has no incentive to change things unless its fans speak out with their voices and, most importantly, their wallets. Pretending nothing is wrong is only giving Nintendo further reason to continue in their current direction.
@VeeFlamesNL Bayonetta was promoted internally up until its launch, but Nintendo completely stopped doing any sort of promotion once the game was out. So he's not entirely wrong. Nintendo has no idea how to promote these games while still maintaining their reputation as being "family friendly."
@GuyWithTheGames This is one of the most laughable comments I've ever seen. What is it with people who come to a comment section (on any website) and expect to only see positivity? Is it really that hard to be in the presence of people you disagree with?
Nintendo needs tough love. When I critique them, it's because I love them and really do want to see them do well. That's not going to happen when they're surrounded by "yes men" who refuse to believe the predicament they're in and ignore the poor decisions they make.
@TheLastLugia I agree, Sony and MS haven't done much to differentiate themselves this generation. At the very least they openly communicate and listen to their fans, something Nintendo seemingly doesn't know how to do. And say what you will about Microsoft, but their backwards compatibility move at E3 was incredibly smart and consumer friendly. Innovative? Definitely not. But it was a good response to fan demand nonetheless.
I also think part of the reason Sony and MS haven't done anything crazy is because the gaming audience demands the same experience over and over. Sony has openly stated in interviews that the reason they didn't give Morpheus more time at their conference was because the audience would've probably torn them apart if they had. It's also probably why Microsoft spent so little time on HoloLens, and why MS also dedicated an entirely separate conference to Oculus.
Gamers don't want to hear about that stuff. They want the standard issue controller, the game, and the screen. It's good in that it forces devs to be more innovative in the games themselves and not the hardware (something Nintendo has long struggled with), but bad because it makes it difficult to really push the industry forward. Oculus could turn out to be brilliant. But because most gamers (including myself) don't want any additives to the gaming experience and prefer not to pay extra for it, those concepts could also prove to be dead at launch.
And as per your statement about DLC and all that jazz, I agree. As with any concept, it can either be used to great effect, or can be abused in much the same way. Arkham Knight is one of the biggest DLC offenders I've ever seen and I refuse to buy that game because of that. But we as gamers certainly don't have to buy into those things if we don't want them - voting with our wallets is the most effective convincing we can do.
PS3 and 360 were great systems. I'm glad we both can agree on that one. I wish Nintendo were in that discussion for that last couple generations too. But sadly it looks like they've gone in a totally different direction.
"don't come to a site called NINTENDO life to whine when they do something you don't like."
This is a comment section where, surprisingly enough, people are allowed to make comments. Positive or negative. If you're interested in why I bother saying anything here, I addressed that in this comment thread (see #210).
As for your comment about Nintendo probably not doing a MS-sized overhaul, I agree with you. It probably won't happen.
In response to your previous comment (I seem to be one behind you):
Xbox 360 introduced online gaming and online purchases on consoles, which have now been adopted as industry standards. Xbox Live is still the most stable and reliable online infrastructure of the Big 3, and Nintendo is still fumbling its way around the concept. Xbox 360 arguably perfected ergonomic controller design (a design that Nintendo and Sony both would emulate in their PS4/Wii U controllers). Sony has innovated primarily in their games. Naughty Dog consistently pushes the industry forward in terms of graphical fidelity, narrative quality, and gameplay immersion, and both Sony and Microsoft create hardware that encourages third parties and indies to develop games for it.
Tell me, what has Nintendo done in the last decade that has been innovative? Don't give me the control stick and rumble pack, because those were over a decade ago. What have they done in the last decade that has been adopted as industry standard? Motion control gimmicks that have now all but disappeared from today's games? A tablet controller that not even Nintendo knows how to make games for? Don't poke holes in the other companies until you can honestly assess your own.
Your comment reeks of sarcasm, and you poke fun at Xbox's Japan sales, but you're blatantly ignoring that Nintendo is in last place worldwide. Ironically, Xbox didn't even need Japanese sales in order to sell better overall, which should truly communicate how irrelevant Nintendo has become. Meanwhile, Nintendo's console has been out a full year longer than its competitors, and still hasn't even reached Dreamcast numbers.
Again, make fun of Xbox One's crappy launch all you want. It's certainly deserved. But Nintendo had a poor launch too, and have done little to nothing to rectify it.
@Ootfan98 Good question. Because, like you, I care about what happens to this company. Few companies hold as much sentimental value to me as Nintendo does - I grew up with them. And despite my frustration at where the company is heading, I still want to see them make a return to form. Of the Big 3, they're the ones I want to succeed most.
But when everything my favorite company has done for the last decade has been jaded, out of touch, confused, insensitive, and needlessly arrogant, it's hard for me not to be vocal about it. It's hard for me to continue to give them the benefit of the doubt and buy their hardware on nostalgia alone, while the true innovation and consumer friendliness is happening through Microsoft and Sony.
My ranting is not because I hate Nintendo. It's because I love them and wish they were the great company they used to be.
@FLUX_CAPACITOR Yes, I can read. Which is why a) because this rumor comes from Unseen 64, which is a very reliable source, there's little reason to doubt its truth, and b) I agree with canceling a game altogether if it's not looking good, but it's the part about ditching the game in just North America that makes no sense. If the quality is so bad, and development is less than fruitful, why not just cancel it altogether? Why even release it in Europe and Japan? Are those regions more deserving and accepting of a turd of a game? Don't you think, if you're releasing the game in every other territory, you could at least try to make some of your money back by letting it come to all of them?
Maybe you're right though - Nintendo's reputation hasn't been faring very well here in the US (though again, I don't see how Europe thinks any better of them), so a s**t game from them would be another nail in their proverbial coffin. But still, I feel bad for the devs of any M-rated game Nintendo decides to publish (Bayonetta included). Nintendo will stand by it up until the very last second, then abandon it altogether.
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Re: Soapbox: It's too Early to Judge Paper Mario: Color Splash
@Project_Dolphin People will disagree with me of course. That's just the nature of having an opinion. But I also think, judging from this very comment section, there's an overwhelming number of people who are disenfranchised with Nintendo's direction just as I am. There's a reason the Wii U has only sold 12 million units, and I think that reason goes beyond just the hardware and the messaging.
Anyway, agree to disagree I suppose. My opinion is that Nintendo's hardware and software are a far cry from what they used to be. You obviously don't have to agree with me, and it's pretty clear I'm not going to sway you in any direction, but I think there's a pretty significant number of people who do agree.
Re: Soapbox: It's too Early to Judge Paper Mario: Color Splash
@Project_Dolphin Reviews are not objective by any stretch of the imagination. They are by definition subjective. Even if there is a score at the bottom of a page, that score is not objective, it is based on somebody's opinion. Even if there is an average of all scores on all websites, that average is determined based on reviewers' subjective opinions. Let's not confuse reviews with objectivity, because they do not belong together in any way.
Reviews are not solely what I'm getting at anyways. Review scores are a fairly outdated and poor representation of the overall quality of a game, and in the games industry, always lean to the positive end of the spectrum when games may not necessarily deserve it (most sites don't score below a 7 unless the game is decidedly bad, so 7 can often be read as average-mediocre even if it's described as "good" on the website). My point is that Nintendo has pumped out a lot of games in the last year that are utterly devoid of imagination. And even the ones that have come out this generation with some semblance of heart and imagination are often playing it safe and devoid of much risk-taking. Is that my opinion? Sure, but I think that it's pretty noticeable based on the examples I've given. I think you'll find that it becomes observably true with enough time. I can't imagine anyone looking back on the Wii U in 10 years and saying "What an innovative and memorable generation of software."
Re: Soapbox: It's too Early to Judge Paper Mario: Color Splash
@Project_Dolphin Kirby and Yoshi, outside of interesting art styles, didn't do much to differentiate themselves from prior entries. Kirby was just Canvas Curse with a clay art style and clunkier to play on the Gamepad than on a DS. Yoshi got decent reviews, but as far as I could tell, was just more Yoshi. Also consider the fact that those two games are indicative of Nintendo playing it extraordinarily and underwhelmingly safe this console generation as a whole. Even if there are great games on Wii U (and there are), most of the first party games are all either entries in pre-established formulas, or altogether remasters:
New Super Mario Bros. U
Pikmin 3
Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze
Mario Party 10
Mario Tennis
Wii Sports Resort
Super Smash Bros. Wii U
The Legend of Zelda Wind Waker HD
The Legend of Zelda Twilight Princess HD
Super Mario 3D World
Kirby and the Rainbow Curse
Yoshi's Woolly World
Star Fox Zero
Mario Kart 8
Like I said, some of these games are good and some are even great. Smash, for example, is the best version of Smash I've ever played. And there are some exceptions to the rule of course, like Splatoon and Mario Maker. But I'm sharing this list to show that even most of Nintendo's great games on Wii U have been largely derivative. Compare this to some highlights from the GameCube's lineup, which saw the likes of Super Mario Sunshine, Luigi's Mansion, Pikmin, Wind Waker, Metroid Prime, and Animal Crossing. All games that, if they weren't altogether new IPs, shook up their respective franchises in imaginative and new ways.
The lack of innovation and imagination within core franchises (with some exceptions), coupled with the influx of games that clearly have misread what the audience wanted (Color Splash, Amiibo Festival, Federation Force), and games that simply ended up being mediocre and even abysmal (Mario Tennis, Amiibo Festival), is what's causing my doubt about Nintendo's future in console development. It's not crazy or absurd to have low expectations of their future hardware AND software, especially after the last few years. That's really all I'm getting at.
Re: Soapbox: It's too Early to Judge Paper Mario: Color Splash
@Project_Dolphin Never argued the fact that Nintendo doesn't still make great games from time to time. Even Super Mario 3D World, which is a highly derivative game, is still a solid game. I'm simply saying that the ratio of great games to average/mediocre games is worse now than it's arguably ever been. The fact that you can only name Super Mario Maker and Splatoon as Nintendo's marquee games last year is extraordinarily disappointing. Meanwhile, Happy Home Designer, Amiibo Festival, Mario Party 10, and Mario Tennis were absolute duds, while Paper Jam, Yoshi, and Kirby were all decidedly average.
Hopefully this is indicative of AAA development on the Wii U and 3DS slowing to a halt in favor of NX development, not a sign that Nintendo is losing touch with games development in general. Still, after seeing the way Paper Mario looks and last year's slew of 'meh' games, it's hard not to be a bit worried.
Re: Soapbox: It's too Early to Judge Paper Mario: Color Splash
@Pokefanmum82 The Wii and the Gamepad can hardly be considered "innovations" when the wider industry has failed to adopt them in any meaningful way. Hardly anyone except Nintendo develops with these peripherals in mind anymore.
The joystick and D-pad were innovative because they completely changed the way games are developed for and experienced (and have stayed around for the long haul). Other consoles' steps in pushing graphical fidelity and processing power are small innovations, but still innovations because they incrementally push the games industry forward and allow developers to make games they couldn't before.
The Wii Remote, meanwhile, was a temporary fad that may have achieved temporary widespread audience adoption, but failed to revolutionize the way the wider industry plays games. Do you see anyone developing games that use motion controls anymore? The list is extraordinarily small and almost never comes at the expense of regular joystick/button controls. Hell, even Nintendo hardly develops games using Wii Remotes. The Gamepad isn't remotely innovative and can't even be classified as a fad; not only has the industry not adopted it, but only the Nintendo hardcore (practically a niche audience at this point) have it in their homes at all.
Nintendo has not been nearly as "innovative" as people give them credit for, at least not in the last decade. Their hardware is simply different for the sake of being different, for no meaningful reason. No one, not even Shigeru Miyamoto, can develop a game that justifies why the Gamepad even exists in the first place.
That's what the Paper Mario series seems like to me too. Nintendo gutted Paper Mario of everything that made the series what it is (interesting and emotional story, humor, badges, progression system, combat system, partners) and instead threw new ideas at the wall just for the sake of making a "different" game. Then rather than simply making it a new IP, they slapped "Paper Mario" on the title, despite not having anything to do with the originals, so it would sell better. This is less "innovative" and more fixing something that wasn't broken to begin with.
Re: Soapbox: It's too Early to Judge Paper Mario: Color Splash
@GoldenGamer88 "And regarding the track-record of Mario games lately, it doesn't help much - quite the opposite in fact. Sticker Star, every M&L since Inside Story, Mario 9-10, Mario Tennis, New Super Mario Bros., Mario 3D Land, Mario 3D World - all of them just felt too "paint by number" and utterly souless. Just the generic squeeky cleaniness of the NSMB series. Like, most of the games that I listed I still consider to be good but are nowhere near as great and UNIQUE as Mario's games from NES to GameCube/Wii era."
I'm so glad I'm not the only one who has noticed this. This is an especially alarming trend considering Nintendo has traditionally had a reputation for quality games. The hardware is not the greatest, but at least the games are imaginative and innovative. At least that's what the consensus usually is.
But we've now reached a point where even that statement can be called into question. Mario Tennis, Mario Party 10, and Animal Crossing Amiibo Festival were three of the worst reviewed games last year. Mario Tennis especially was one of the most half-assed attempts at a game I've ever seen Nintendo make. Star Fox, while it looks like it plays smoothly, still looks dreadfully ugly, paint-by-numbers, and unimaginative. And that's after its revisions and delay. Mario games, as you've said, have been remarkably stiff and soulless this generation, which is shocking to say about a franchise that contains the likes of SMB3 and Super Mario Galaxy. And now we have Paper Mario Color Splash, which looks equally mechanical and soulless. It's like Nintendo devs are putting out games not because they want to, but because they have to.
This generation has not only cast significant doubt over Nintendo's ability to make competitive hardware, but also its ability to make innovative and heartfelt software. When the Legend of Zelda is quite literally the only game that looks to live up to that standard in the future, there is a bit of a problem.
Re: Soapbox: It's too Early to Judge Paper Mario: Color Splash
@rushiosan Couldn't agree more. Just as Federation Force is Metroid in name only, Paper Mario Sticker Star/Color Splash appear to be Paper Mario in name only, because the mechanics no longer resemble what constitutes a "Paper Mario" game. Nintendo seems content to throw literally any game under the umbrella of a preexisting IP just to make it sell better, even when the game doesn't have any resemblance to what makes the franchise what it is (Federation Force, Animal Crossing Amiibo festival, Paper Mario Sticker Star, Starfox Guard, etc.).
Really unhappy with where Nintendo is right now. Definitely doesn't help that Miyamoto has so much say in Nintendo's development lately either. His best ideas are far, far behind him.
Re: Soapbox: It's too Early to Judge Paper Mario: Color Splash
It may be too early to automatically deem this game to be a bad one, yes, but that doesn't mean we can't look at the gameplay footage and see that this is clearly not the Paper Mario anyone wanted.
The Wind Waker comparison is not an applicable one because WW was still, at its core, a mainline Zelda game. People hated the art style a lot but the mechanics are clearly recognizable as Zelda. Paper Mario Color Splash, meanwhile, is totally unrecognizable to its foundational predecessors (PM and TTYD) in terms of mechanics. It is not mechanically a "Paper Mario" game at all, not if we're comparing it to the original PM and TTYD. Instead it's clearly a follow up to the worst game in the franchise (which I assumed was a spinoff, but that's clearly not the case anymore) rather than a return to the traditional RPG gameplay that made the originals such excellent games. What we can glean from the footage is that Paper Mario still seems to be Paper Mario in name only.
Yes, it is too early to judge the overall quality of the game, and I'm all for Nintendo trying new things. But sequels in franchises are meant to refine an already-existing formula, not throw the baby out with the bath water and transform it into something completely irrelevant to what makes the franchise what it is. Nintendo still doesn't seem to perceive what fans want out of the Paper Mario series, and that is what's most baffling. I hope I'm proven wrong about my expections of this game, but I doubt that I will be.
Re: Review: EarthBound (New 3DS / SNES)
Do we really need another review of this game seeing as how it's already been released on Wii U? Are we going to do this with Super Metroid, Super Mario World, etc. For the umpteenth time too? Lol
Re: Editorial: Nintendo's Virtual Console Revolution Must Wait as We Pay Once More for SNES Games
@Pianomanfreak If you didn't want to hear other people's opinions, maybe you shouldn't have come to a comment section. You know, where people can voice their opinions? Telling people to "grow up" and "quit complaining" just because they have differing opinions than yours isn't the most reasonable thing to do.
I'm glad this article was written, because Nintendo really can't keep handling the Virtual Console this archaically when the NX comes around. Moves like this don't give me much faith in what Nintendo has to come.
Re: Paper Mario Colour Splash Coming to Wii U
@Ichiban Hopefully this isnt the fanfare that accompanies Nintendo's future promotions. With the NX, they cant afford a lukewarm announcement like this.
Re: Paper Mario Colour Splash Coming to Wii U
I sold my Wii U last summer after Nintendo's E3 showing, and after seeing that Nintendo had virtually nothing left on the horizon for this machine (at least nothing I was interested in). The only game that's made me remotely regret the decision to sell was Super Mario Maker. And now, with this game's mechanics being Sticker Star-like and not TTYD-like, it looks like not even this HD Paper Mario game is tempting me back.
Hope the NX can remind me why I love Nintendo, because lately I find myself more disappointed by them than anything else.
Re: Paper Mario Colour Splash Coming to Wii U
It feels like Nintendo has done this a lot lately. Starfox is getting a new game on Wii U!? Oh wait, it sort of looks like an up-rezzed Wii game. There's a new Metroid Prime game coming out!? Oh wait, it's just a multiplayer shooter for 3DS. There's an Animal Crossing game for Wii U!? Oh wait, it's just an amiibo tie-in. Paper Mario is coming to the Wii U!? Oh wait, it looks like it has mechanics ripped from the worst game in the franchise.
Too early to judge, maybe, but I have a sinking feeling about this one.
Re: Poll: What Did You Think of Nintendo's 2015?
This year was straight up abysmal for the Wii U. It stuns me that so many here think otherwise. Splatoon, Mario Maker, and Xenoblade. Maybe Yoshi, I guess? That seems to be the consensus. If that's all the stuff of note that came out this year, that's a pretty sad year. Meanwhile Nintendo's competitors have had a kickass year with WAY more high quality games, and they're gearing up for an even stronger one.
Nintendo's E3 presentation was what really made me appalled though. Starfox was shown, and boy, was it ugly. A Metroid was announced that wasn't Metroid, an Animal Crossing was announced that wasn't Animal Crossing, and a Paper Mario was announced that wasn't really Paper Mario. Yay!!!
Nintendo has a near-insurmountable hill of obstacles to overcome in 2016. Sans Zelda, there are no more AAA games left coming to the Wii U. Nintendo is now releasing a new console at a time when their competitors' consoles will be hitting their strides. And if Nintendo doesn't nail it, and I mean absolutely nail it, with third party support and all, they are going to find it very challenging to stay in the console business any longer.
Re: Feature: Five Key Reveals and Releases That Will Define Nintendo's 2016
@Baker1000 What are you talking about? Twilight Princess sold twice as well as Wind Waker thanks to its dual release on Wii and GC. In fact, 7 out of 8 Twilight Princess copies bought were on the Wii. So I'd say it worked pretty well in Nintendo's favor. To release Zelda on only Wii U would be dooming the game, and Nintendo is probably not interested in sending one of their biggest AAA franchises to a console that has only sold 11-12 million units. Plus they probably want to push as many NX units as possible, and I bet Zelda is going to help with that.
I'll never understand why people want Nintendo to wait until 2017 to release the NX either. Nintendo has virtually nothing of AAA caliber on the horizon for 2016 besides Zelda. It makes zero business sense for them to sit on the now-barren Wii U/3DS for almost another two years.
Re: Video: Check Out a Graphical Comparison for The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess HD
Well a remake is better than getting practically nothing on the Wii U.
That said, after this game's announcement, there's no way any Nintendo fan can point the finger at Sony, MS, or third parties when it comes to remasters... Nintendo has remastered, or (in the case of ALBW) heavily remade/reimagined 5 of the last 7 console Zelda games, and that all happened in this single generation. They're just as guilty as anyone else when it comes to remaking and remastering old content. Arguably more so.
Re: Editorial: It's Far Too Soon to Go Download-Only, and Physical Retail Still Matters
sigh
The fact that physical media is still around is partially because the market demands it, but more so because retail stores like Walmart or Gamestop would be at the throats of Sony, Microsoft, or Nintendo if there were no physical releases on their platforms.
Think about it: what's the one thing you have to buy physically? The console. So if Sony, for instance, were to come out and say, "We're not doing physical releases anymore," that would cut pretty hard into Walmart's game sale profits. So what's to stop Walmart from saying, "You'd better not pull your games from our stores, or we're going to stop selling your consoles."
Right now game retail stores and console manufacturers are at a standoff in that regard. And it doesn't have any indication of ending anytime soon. That said, if one console manufacturer were to be the first to say "screw you" to retail stores (just like they do to pretty much everyone else outside their sphere), it would be Nintendo.
Re: Talking Point: Five Key Challenges Nintendo Faces with the NX
@smashbrolink Debatable. The game has gotten very little media coverage (even among gaming sites) and evidence largely points to the fact that the original Xenoblade Chronicles sold no more than a million copies worldwide (NN3DS version included).
Just because a game "deserves" to sell millions doesn't mean that it will. The fact that the game is a Wii U exclusive also hurts its chances of selling to its fullest potential.
Side note: I like your "subtle" attack on other consoles with the use of your qualifier, "Even if it were on a different console, it would STILL deserve to sell millions." As if being on a different console is a worse situation. Give me a break.
Re: Talking Point: Five Key Challenges Nintendo Faces with the NX
@Quorthon
It's such a pleasure to see you around again. And it's also good to know I'm not the only one who thinks that the NX, in Nintendo's current state, is practically destined for failure. Third parties absolutely detest Nintendo's platforms and Nintendo has only made that worse by snidely walking around E3 2015 and judging people's work. Not to mention Nintendo only just recently gave third parties dev kits for the NX, and we're likely within a year of release! And compounding the issues is the fact that releasing the NX right smack in the middle of Sony/MS's stride is a terrible idea, and when the inevitable new generation releases in 3 or 4 years, Nintendo will be behind yet again. This and dozens of other internal and external factors pretty much solidify the NX's failure at this point, unless Nintendo has been working hard at fixing all of these issues, which we have absolutely no indication of.
The Wii U has been dead in the water, even to Nintendo, for almost a full year now. There hasn't been a first party AAA release on the system since Smash Bros., and that was almost a full year ago. And the only one coming out in the foreseeable future is Xenoblade, a niche JRPG title that only the Nintendo hardcore seem to care about. This has been the fastest and most abrupt ending to a home console Nintendo has ever done, and that's saying a lot.
Re: Review: The Legend of Zelda: Tri Force Heroes (3DS)
Is anyone really surprised by this? Nintendo is barely limping along at this point, trying to put out enough B- and C-tier games at the end of this generation to make people feel like they have something to play on their Wii U's and 3DS's, with the quality of said games suffering big time. All of Nintendo's AAA devs have moved on to the next console. And we probably should too.
Re: Early NX Reveal Was To "Reinforce Commitment" To Dedicated Hardware, Claims Nintendo's Scott Moffitt
@Marshi I hate to break it to you, but that's probably what they're going for. Zelda Wii U wasn't just delayed to 2016, it was delayed indefinitely. You know what else has an indefinite release date? The NX. I don't think that's coincidence.
You'll probably see it on Wii U too of course... But it won't be a Wii U exclusive.
Re: Early NX Reveal Was To "Reinforce Commitment" To Dedicated Hardware, Claims Nintendo's Scott Moffitt
@whodatninja Doesn't look like the Wii U has much of a future.
Re: Video: New Interviews Uncover Rare's History, Famous Nintendo-Era Games And Tantalising Cancelled Projects
"Given the amount of love and attention we've bestowed Xbox One title Rare Replay recently..."
Hahah, seriously? You all literally just posted a soapbox a few days ago complaining about how Rare Replay wasn't on a Nintendo console. I hardly think that's bestowing any "love and attention" on the game. Just expressing outright jealousy that Xbox owners get to play it and you don't.
Re: Soapbox: It's A Tragedy That Rare Replay Isn't On A Nintendo Console
@BinaryFragger @larry_koopa @hYdeks
Couldn't have said it better than you guys. The idea that MS fans "don't really deserve" this collection is a load of hypocritical garbage. Any Bayonetta fan could've made the same argument - that Nintendo fans "don't really deserve" Bayonetta 2, since Platinum never made the original for a Nintendo console. If you're a Nintendo fan who welcomed Bayonetta 2 with open arms, you have to be okay if other companies get your favorite games too.
Here's a novel idea: rather than crying about how other consoles have games that yours won't play, rather than demonizing other companies who put games on consoles other than yours, maybe you can just save up and buy the other console.
That's the allure of "exclusives", folks. This is not anything new, and it's something many of you should already be familiar with as Nintendo fans. If you want games from Naughty Dog, Santa Monica Studios, Guerilla Games, and third parties, you buy a PS4. If you want games from Retro, Next Level Games, and Nintendo's other studios, you buy a Wii U/NX. And imagine this: if you want games from 343, Turn 10, third parties, and now Rare, you need an Xbox One.
If you want a game, get the platform it's on. That's my soapbox.
Re: Talking Point: Assessing the Odds of Super Mario Maker Making a Commercial Splash This September
@SetupDisk X is definitely the biggest in terms of budget, but in terms of potential sales? Probably not.
Re: Talking Point: Assessing the Odds of Super Mario Maker Making a Commercial Splash This September
I don't know if a "commercial splash" is what this game is going to pull off. I'm sure it'll have a great attach rate and that Wii U owners will buy it, but bundling it with systems isn't going to move units. Not after Nintendo has been talking up the NX so much.
Re: Genyo Takeda The Likely Choice For Nintendo President, Analysts Claim
Miyamoto hasn't exactly been at the top of his game lately. Between the two of them, I would prefer to see Takeda take the reins. Doubtful that this might happen, but my favorite scenario would be an outside hire or a younger president shaking things up a little bit.
Re: Exclusive: Project CARS "Simply Too Much For Wii U", Developer Now Waiting On New Nintendo Hardware
@TheLastLugia
You can stop with the sarcastic tirade now. Every publisher has issues and everyone does the whole remake/sequel nonsense, Nintendo included. You've got to admit Nintendo hasn't been the saintly bringer of new ideas this gen:
Pikmin 3
New Super Mario Bros. U
Mario Kart 8
Super Smash Bros. for Wii U
Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze
Super Mario 3D World
Yoshi's Woolly World
Kirby and the Rainbow Curse
Mario Party 10
Wind Waker HD
Wii Fit U
Wii Sports Club
Don't get me wrong, most of these are great and polished games, but they're either remakes or iterations on pre-established formulas. They're no less derivative than any of the competitors you mock.
Re: Industry Analysts Speculate On Nintendo's Future And Satoru Iwata's Possible Successor
Pachter makes a lot of sense here. Proprietary IP for proprietary hardware is definitely on the wane. This is the first console Nintendo has been selling based on first party power alone, and it's not going well for them.
Ironically, despite trying to make this gen's hardware "innovative," most of Nintendo's actual games have been anything but.
Pikmin 3
New Super Mario Bros. U
Mario Kart 8
Super Smash Bros. for Wii U
Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze
Super Mario 3D World
Yoshi's Woolly World
Kirby and the Rainbow Curse
Mario Party 10
Wind Waker HD
Wii Fit U
Wii Sports Club
Don't get me wrong, most of these are great and polished games, but they're either remakes or iterations on pre-established formulas. To look at Nintendo's whole lineup and claim that it's less derivative than anyone else's is a bit farfetched. Perhaps if Nintendo were not shackled to a dead proprietary piece of hardware, desperately trying to get well-known franchises on it for it to sell, they would be able to stop playing it safe with their actual games.
And that's a Nintendo I hope Iwata's successor is able to bring forth.
Re: Exclusive: Project CARS "Simply Too Much For Wii U", Developer Now Waiting On New Nintendo Hardware
There's definitely some fault on both sides... Slightly Mad probably shouldn't have promised a Wii U version if that weren't certain they could deliver one. But then, Nintendo shouldn't have designed a console that's so damn hard to develop for.
This is probably the least surprising news I've seen in awhile. And if Nintendo makes their next hardware an obstacle like they have with the Wii U, I think we'll see them out of the hardware business sooner rather than later.
Re: Playtonic Happy to Move Away From "Box-Ticking" Culture At Microsoft-Owned Rare
Pumped for this game - it's the only Kickstarter project I've ever backed. I can't wait to get it next year (probably on PS4, because I'm a trophy addict ).
Re: Dark Pit and Palutena amiibo Are Retailer Exclusives in North America
Glad I stopped my amiibo collecting once I got Mario, Link, and Samus. I feel really bad for anyone who's actually attempting to collect them all.
Re: Poll: What Do You Want From Nintendo's NX Platform?
@Aromaiden Definitely. They need all of their big sellers in attendance. At the bare minimum, a true 3D Mario, probably a 2D Mario, Zelda, Mario Kart, Smash and so on. The Wii U had most of those things and still didn't sell well, so Nintendo's IPs, while rich and coveted, are starting to lose even their selling power (at least when they're the only things you can play on a 350 dollar console). Again, I hope they figure it out, but it's a precarious position they're in.
Re: Poll: What Do You Want From Nintendo's NX Platform?
In reference to the first poll question: The NX has been all but confirmed as a home console. Reggie referred to it as such in one of his interviews at E3, and the Metroid Prime creator heavily implied that if a full home console Metroid game was to be made, it would be developed for the NX instead of the Wii U (implying that NX is indeed the successor to the Wii U).
All that said, Nintendo has a near-insurmountable hill to climb with their next console. If it's another gimmicky console that lacks the power of its competitors', then Nintendo will again be stuck without third parties, stuck supporting a console by themselves. Which, judging from the way the Wii U is faring on that design philosophy, can most likely spell failure for the NX.
Then again, even if they do everything right, even if they release a console more powerful than PS4 and Xbox One, win back third parties, and release a gimmick-free console with a host of solid launch titles, they still face the significant obstacle of launching mid-generation, when both the PS4 and Xbox One are hitting their stride. Which means those consoles will already have a host of great games available to play, and meanwhile Nintendo will be starting from zero.
All that is to say the odds are significantly stacked against Nintendo. They don't exactly have consumer confidence right now and they alienate a greater number of their most devoted fans by the day. While I do hope Nintendo can pull a rabbit out of their hats on this one, they've got a LOT of work to do before the NX has any prayer of being a success.
As I've stated before, it took Sony an entire generation to win back gamers and third parties after the pitiful PS3 launch. Microsoft is still recovering from theirs this generation too. Nintendo has that much work to do within the next year or two, and it hardly looks like they're even trying!
Re: Devil's Third Will Be Released In North America, Just Not By Nintendo
@FLUX_CAPACITOR
Nope. I'm not Quorthon. If you look at my post history, I have interacted with him several times. And I was a pretty blind defender of Nintendo pretty early on in my post history too. It took me much longer to get burnt out on Nintendo than it took him, as far as I know.
Yes, as surprising as it is, there's more than one person on this site who takes issue with takes the way Nintendo does things.
Re: Devil's Third Will Be Released In North America, Just Not By Nintendo
@Aromaiden Ah, my apologies. I hadn't seen the most recent story from today. Thanks for pointing that out!
Color me surprised.
Re: Devil's Third Will Be Released In North America, Just Not By Nintendo
@FLUX_CAPACITOR
"The problem is that you are an imbecile."
You really expect me to take your points seriously when you use an ad hominem like that? Especially after you go on a noble rant about how you hate trolling? That sure gives validity to your argument.
All of my criticisms of Nintendo have been perfectly reasonable. The rumors turned out to be true and Nintendo is not publishing this game in North America. Just because the game is still coming out in North America does not change that fact.
My underlying point was not even so much about this particular piece of news, but rather the long string of problems Nintendo keeps stepping into post-E3, and how little they seem to care about rectifying those problems. Maybe if you had taken my comment in its context you would've seen that.
Re: Devil's Third Will Be Released In North America, Just Not By Nintendo
@MadAdam81 I'd argue even negative reactions that seem like "fan boy hate" will still help Nintendo in some way. It means even their most faithful fans are starting to get upset with them. It still leads to them changing, but you're right - I personally would rather see more healthy critique and less hate.
I'd also argue the more harmful fanboy reaction of the two extremes is rushing to Nintendo's side to defend their every action, even when their actions make no sense and continually strip away their own fans. Sometimes negativity is needed. With a company like Nintendo, it takes a lot of it to get through their pride.
Do I endorse blind hate? No. But a lot of people here have a right to be upset with them.
Re: Devil's Third Will Be Released In North America, Just Not By Nintendo
@FLUX_CAPACITOR @DiscoGentleman @WiltonRoots @jakysnakydx
See my above comment (243) on why negative feedback is a good thing.
I'm glad people are finally critiquing Nintendo, because it's been a long time coming, and it breeds positive change. If you only wanted to read positive content, why are you even in a comment section? Why are you even on this journalistic website, which sometimes involves negative opinions? If you want blissfully ignorant positivity, you'd be more satisfied reading promotional materials on Nintendo's official website.
Re: Devil's Third Will Be Released In North America, Just Not By Nintendo
@Aromaiden
Exactly. Incentive needs to be there before Nintendo has any chance of changing for the better.
Although at this point, I don't know if even releasing a powerful console will solve their woes. Even if Nintendo does everything else right, they're launching mid-generation when PS4 and Xbox One will likely be hitting their stride. PS4 will probably be fast approaching 40 million sales, and Xbox One will be gaining significant traction too. PS4 and Xbox One will have tons of games to choose from by that point. Nintendo, meanwhile, will be starting from zero. And if the average hardcore gamer has already spent 400 dollars on a machine that plays current gen games, would they really be willing to shell out another 400 just to play half of those games, plus the few extra Nintendo titles? Already Nintendo has to pitch to people who want to (or who are able to) buy a second console, which is hurting their chances as it is.
Not only are they launching mid-generation, but they also have the near-impossible task of winning back third party publishers and developers, and winning back the goodwill of its own dwindling fanbase. That's something that took Sony a whole generation to do with the PS3. And Nintendo hasn't even started doing those things today (especially not with their fanbase)!
I don't know. It's an uphill battle for sure. One I hope they succeed at, but one that I have the sinking feeling they're going to fail at. And if they fail, hopefully they go third party so they can still provide hardcore experiences without the 400 dollar entry point.
Re: Devil's Third Will Be Released In North America, Just Not By Nintendo
I wish I were surprised by this news. I really do. But after the past few weeks of bad news Nintendo has been dishing out, it's just another normal weekday. Whoever is in charge of Nintendo's PR department sure has a lot of work to do!
It's kind of good that Nintendo has been flubbing it so badly since E3. It means that Nintendo fans (like myself) are finally forced to open their eyes and see them for the out-of-touch, prideful company they really are.
Change happens through critique and honest feedback, not blindly defending every action as being a good one. Most people on this site have been defending all of Nintendo's questionable decisions this generation (crappy console reveal, crappy third party support, artificial scarcity, amiibo shortages, Youtube Creators Program, locked on-disc DLC that's only accessible through $13+ amiibo, tablet controller that not even Nintendo knows how to make games for, etc.), but now E3 and Nintendo's subsequent mishaps are driving away even the most devoted of Nintendo fans (like myself).
Everyone in the comment section who is complaining about negative reactions needs to a) understand you're in a comment section, where people are (believe it or not) allowed to express positive and negative opinions, and b) understand that Nintendo has no incentive to change things unless its fans speak out with their voices and, most importantly, their wallets. Pretending nothing is wrong is only giving Nintendo further reason to continue in their current direction.
Re: Rumour: Nintendo Isn't Bringing Devil's Third To North America
@VeeFlamesNL Bayonetta was promoted internally up until its launch, but Nintendo completely stopped doing any sort of promotion once the game was out. So he's not entirely wrong. Nintendo has no idea how to promote these games while still maintaining their reputation as being "family friendly."
Re: Rumour: Nintendo Isn't Bringing Devil's Third To North America
@GuyWithTheGames This is one of the most laughable comments I've ever seen. What is it with people who come to a comment section (on any website) and expect to only see positivity? Is it really that hard to be in the presence of people you disagree with?
Nintendo needs tough love. When I critique them, it's because I love them and really do want to see them do well. That's not going to happen when they're surrounded by "yes men" who refuse to believe the predicament they're in and ignore the poor decisions they make.
Re: Rumour: Nintendo Isn't Bringing Devil's Third To North America
@TheLastLugia I agree, Sony and MS haven't done much to differentiate themselves this generation. At the very least they openly communicate and listen to their fans, something Nintendo seemingly doesn't know how to do. And say what you will about Microsoft, but their backwards compatibility move at E3 was incredibly smart and consumer friendly. Innovative? Definitely not. But it was a good response to fan demand nonetheless.
I also think part of the reason Sony and MS haven't done anything crazy is because the gaming audience demands the same experience over and over. Sony has openly stated in interviews that the reason they didn't give Morpheus more time at their conference was because the audience would've probably torn them apart if they had. It's also probably why Microsoft spent so little time on HoloLens, and why MS also dedicated an entirely separate conference to Oculus.
Gamers don't want to hear about that stuff. They want the standard issue controller, the game, and the screen. It's good in that it forces devs to be more innovative in the games themselves and not the hardware (something Nintendo has long struggled with), but bad because it makes it difficult to really push the industry forward. Oculus could turn out to be brilliant. But because most gamers (including myself) don't want any additives to the gaming experience and prefer not to pay extra for it, those concepts could also prove to be dead at launch.
And as per your statement about DLC and all that jazz, I agree. As with any concept, it can either be used to great effect, or can be abused in much the same way. Arkham Knight is one of the biggest DLC offenders I've ever seen and I refuse to buy that game because of that. But we as gamers certainly don't have to buy into those things if we don't want them - voting with our wallets is the most effective convincing we can do.
PS3 and 360 were great systems. I'm glad we both can agree on that one. I wish Nintendo were in that discussion for that last couple generations too. But sadly it looks like they've gone in a totally different direction.
Re: Rumour: Nintendo Isn't Bringing Devil's Third To North America
"don't come to a site called NINTENDO life to whine when they do something you don't like."
This is a comment section where, surprisingly enough, people are allowed to make comments. Positive or negative. If you're interested in why I bother saying anything here, I addressed that in this comment thread (see #210).
As for your comment about Nintendo probably not doing a MS-sized overhaul, I agree with you. It probably won't happen.
Re: Rumour: Nintendo Isn't Bringing Devil's Third To North America
@TheLastLugia
In response to your previous comment (I seem to be one behind you):
Xbox 360 introduced online gaming and online purchases on consoles, which have now been adopted as industry standards. Xbox Live is still the most stable and reliable online infrastructure of the Big 3, and Nintendo is still fumbling its way around the concept. Xbox 360 arguably perfected ergonomic controller design (a design that Nintendo and Sony both would emulate in their PS4/Wii U controllers). Sony has innovated primarily in their games. Naughty Dog consistently pushes the industry forward in terms of graphical fidelity, narrative quality, and gameplay immersion, and both Sony and Microsoft create hardware that encourages third parties and indies to develop games for it.
Tell me, what has Nintendo done in the last decade that has been innovative? Don't give me the control stick and rumble pack, because those were over a decade ago. What have they done in the last decade that has been adopted as industry standard? Motion control gimmicks that have now all but disappeared from today's games? A tablet controller that not even Nintendo knows how to make games for? Don't poke holes in the other companies until you can honestly assess your own.
Re: Rumour: Nintendo Isn't Bringing Devil's Third To North America
@TheLastLugia
Your comment reeks of sarcasm, and you poke fun at Xbox's Japan sales, but you're blatantly ignoring that Nintendo is in last place worldwide. Ironically, Xbox didn't even need Japanese sales in order to sell better overall, which should truly communicate how irrelevant Nintendo has become. Meanwhile, Nintendo's console has been out a full year longer than its competitors, and still hasn't even reached Dreamcast numbers.
Again, make fun of Xbox One's crappy launch all you want. It's certainly deserved. But Nintendo had a poor launch too, and have done little to nothing to rectify it.
Re: Rumour: Nintendo Isn't Bringing Devil's Third To North America
@Ootfan98 Good question. Because, like you, I care about what happens to this company. Few companies hold as much sentimental value to me as Nintendo does - I grew up with them. And despite my frustration at where the company is heading, I still want to see them make a return to form. Of the Big 3, they're the ones I want to succeed most.
But when everything my favorite company has done for the last decade has been jaded, out of touch, confused, insensitive, and needlessly arrogant, it's hard for me not to be vocal about it. It's hard for me to continue to give them the benefit of the doubt and buy their hardware on nostalgia alone, while the true innovation and consumer friendliness is happening through Microsoft and Sony.
My ranting is not because I hate Nintendo. It's because I love them and wish they were the great company they used to be.
Re: Rumour: Nintendo Isn't Bringing Devil's Third To North America
@Aromaiden Link? I'm not personally familiar with that instance, but I wouldn't doubt it if you shared a story about it.
Fortunately the Xbox division is under much stronger leadership now. If only Nintendo could get an overhaul like that.
Re: Rumour: Nintendo Isn't Bringing Devil's Third To North America
@FLUX_CAPACITOR Yes, I can read. Which is why a) because this rumor comes from Unseen 64, which is a very reliable source, there's little reason to doubt its truth, and b) I agree with canceling a game altogether if it's not looking good, but it's the part about ditching the game in just North America that makes no sense. If the quality is so bad, and development is less than fruitful, why not just cancel it altogether? Why even release it in Europe and Japan? Are those regions more deserving and accepting of a turd of a game? Don't you think, if you're releasing the game in every other territory, you could at least try to make some of your money back by letting it come to all of them?
Maybe you're right though - Nintendo's reputation hasn't been faring very well here in the US (though again, I don't see how Europe thinks any better of them), so a s**t game from them would be another nail in their proverbial coffin. But still, I feel bad for the devs of any M-rated game Nintendo decides to publish (Bayonetta included). Nintendo will stand by it up until the very last second, then abandon it altogether.