Topic: Mario Overkill

and with the 3DS, the third best selling game is Super Mario 3D Land and the fourth best selling game is NSMB2.

Technically, it is.

I'm not sure if I can take you seriously.

Ok, see, the first mistake you made is classifying really ANY of those Wii U Mario titles together. NSMBU, 3D World, Mario Kart, and Olympic Games should never be considered anything alike. The second mistake you made was classifying Yoshi, Toad, and DK games as Mario games. The third mistake was classifying SEGA and Ubisoft games as Mario games. All of this can be forgiven, though, because as you said, you don't care.

The biggest mistake you made was this list in and of itself. [sarcasm]GEE! IT'S ALMOST LIKE HE'S NINTENDO'S MASCOT, OR SOMETHING![/sarcasm]

The mass amount of Mario, love it or not, is based on Mario's popularity. If you really hate it that much, though, how about you go out and get about 10 million people to buy all recent Kirby games and see if we can't get Mario Party 10 changed into Kirby's Lucky Roll.

It is, but then it isn't. It's set in the Mario Universe... arguably... Maybe? We actually don't even know that. It could be in the Epic Yarn Universe, or maybe it's own universe, entirely. Yoshi is associated with Mario... I suppose? Ok, yes, he's very common in Mario games... but then, so are Wario and DK... and they're not really classified as "Mario games," either... Hmm... But it's a platformer! ... But then, so are most Kirby, Donkey Kong, and Indie games... Really the only argument left is that Yoshi's first appearance was in Super Mario World, but since then, he's had a slew of his own adventures, some with a baby that makes your ears bleed every time you get hit, and others with just him and his Yoshi brethren. Heck, Sakurai doesn't even classify Yoshi as a Mario character. Though... isn't he giving Rosalina her own icon, too? Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm not. Really would have to go back and look to be sure. X3

Point is that Yoshi's Woolly World doesn't play anything like your typical "Mario game" and Yoshi has had more than enough solo adventures to justify considering him his own character. So what's the difference? Well, mostly the timer. Mario games have a timer. Yoshi games do not. There are some obvious exceptions, of course. 3D Mario games are a world of their own, but that's an argument for a later time. Yoshi and Mario are closely related, but at this point in time, their games really aren't.

Yoshi and Wario(you can even argue the Luigi games) are spins off and cant be considered a "True Mario game"

If you wanna get technical, we have:

Super Mario Bros series (includes NSMB series and Super Mario Land series)
Super Mario 64/Sunshine/Galaxy series
Super Mario 3D series
Mario Kart series
Mario & Sonic series
Mario Golf series
Mario Tennis series
Mario Party series
Mario vs. Donkey Kong series
Mario Sluggers
Mario Strikers series
Mario Sports series (pretty much everything that isn't golf, tennis, sluggers, and strikers, and even that's being unfair to the various Mario games that have nothing to do with each other aside from all being sports titles featuring Mario, but I'm not listing all of those)
Super Smash Bros. series
Mario & Luigi series
Super Mario RPG/Paper Mario RPG series
Donkey Kong Arcade series
Donkey Kong Country series
Donkey Kong 64
Donkey Kong Country Returns series (not the same as DKC, no matter what the title says)
Yoshi's Island series
Yoshi series (includes Woolly World)
Wario's Woods
Wario Land series
WarioWare series (includes Game & Wario)
Super Princess Peach
Mario Paint
Mario Educational Series
Luigi's Mansion series

And even that hardly covers it. Mario has been used everywhere, but you know what? That's why he's Nintendo's mascot. Contrary to the joke made in the Digital Event, Link probably appreciates this, as it means Zelda Kart isn't a thing.

I'm not really sure I'd consider Smash Bros. a Mario spinoff, there's nothing about it that is distinctively Mario about it, it's just a mix of various Nintendo series. By this logic, you may as well include Nintendo Land on this list, it's just as Mario as Smash Bros is.

Fair point, but my main counter argument is this:

Super SMASH Bros.
Super MARIO Bros.

Mario is always one of the first characters anyone picks in this game. He always has the most fully-slotted reps, and surprisingly has the least clones, including his extended franchise.

On top of this, Super Smash Bros came about because Sakurai put Mario and Link over the wire frames and Nintendo really liked the idea.

Nintendoland, on the other hand, is kind of its own thing that never ties itself to the Mario universe in any way shape or form. While there are Mario-themed mini-games, there are no indications that Mario, himself, could ever go to Nintendo Land. The main character of Nintendo Land, aside from Miis, is Monita. None of this directly involves Mario in any way. But there he is, in Smash. Fighting. Shooting fire. Falling off the map. You only dress up as him in Nintendo Land.

I don't really have a problem with that amount of mario games. As long as it doesn't get any more over-saturated, I think it's fine.

What really makes the Mario series interesting is that there is a lot of variety and every spin off puts new things always. Its not like say something like Professor Layton where you need to get this game so you can get the idea of the next game.

Spin offs well, that's really optional and not necessarily a true Mario game.

Yeah it's the coat of paint. The quality would remain the same if they were different characters

If all of these games are "Mario Games" then Pokemon is Earthbound......

Not sure if you're talking about OP's list or mine, but that's kinda my point. Calling all of them "Mario games" would be a horrendous disservice to the games, themselves.

Meh, if it was New Super Mario Bros (for example) being released yearly on both the Wii U & 3DS then it would annoy me but for the most part they are different games so I can happily ignore the Mario <insert sport> games and focus on the good ones like Mario Kart 8 or Super Mario 3D World.

TBH if we are calling Donkey Kong Country, Captain Toad, WarioWare etc Mario games based on it's a spin off then it shouldn't all the Mario games be called Donkey Kong games since that's where he started:P

For people saying spinoff games are not 'mario' games... let's say EA released Yarn Chewbacca and a Puzzle game called Captain Ewok... would you argue those are not Star Wars games and that them count as new IPs?

You should know the difference between a "Mario game" and a "game where Mario is a usable character".

This disconnect is why we have two pages on this topic. Half the people here consider a Mario game to be only the standard Mario platformers, while the other half look at it from an franchse perspective and hold a Mario game as any that uses the characters and locales derived from the Mario IP.

Time to start a Miiverse petition for Captain #SWAG

1) That's not quite the same scenario. Star Wars is a movie franchise, so there is no definitive "Star Wars game."
2) Even ignoring point number 1, if we assume that The Force Unleashed is the definitive "Star Wars game" then I'd gladly count Yarn Chewbacca and Captain Ewok as not being "Star Wars games." I would not, however, consider them new IP, nor are Yoshi's Woolly World or Captain Toad Treasure Tracker new IP in and of themselves. Yarn Yoshi is still part of the Yoshi series while Captain Toad is a new series, but by using Mario IP, it establishes itself as part of the Mario IP.

My actual point was that lumping NSMBU together with 3D World, Mario Kart, Mario Party, Yoshi games, Captain Toad, and whatever else you may chuck at this thing is a total disservice to gamers everywhere, as well as these respective series. After all, if I play Mario Party and decide I don't like it, when you tell me another Mario game came out called "Mario Kart" why would I think that I'm gonna like it?

Whilst I do agree with the point you're making but it is possible some people to not like Mario Party and therefore not Mario Kart too based on the tone of the games rather than the actual gameplay itself.