Cipher, you make a very good point. Sadly Nintendo is probably right in assserting that many people in this generation don't know the difference. We now have a whole new generation of gamers who most likely never played these games in their original format and never heard about the problems with older PAL conversions. Part of my motivation for writing this article was to raise consumer awareness of the issue and get people to see what they are missing out on and just how easily it could be prevented.
It's interesting to hear people saying that they have stopped purchasing VC games or avoided buying certain titles because of this issue. Certainly I can think of ten or more titles that I would have snapped up, not least of all Waverace 64.
I wonder if Nintendo realises it is actively losing out on sales by not offering a 60hz alternative.
Oregano: you make a very good point about Madworld's 50hz release. If we as consumers become complacent about the quality of virtual offerings then its easy to see why publishers might feel they can lower their standards at retail too.
Great to hear the original Prince's voice and not the one from Warrior Within.
Also the Wii version will include the SNES version of the original!
That just made it a must buy Nice to see that companies are still offering bonus content like that in the days of Virtual Consoles. This is exactly the sort of thing that helps people choose one version over another.
Thanks for all your comments guys. Keep them coming and perhaps we can then try to get a response to the article from Nintendo (or or at least clarification over the bizarre Sega Hanabi issue) . I'd also like to thank Damo for giving me the opportunity to write this article, as many of you know its something I'm rather passionate about. Apologies it took me so long Damo
@ MrWout: 99% of SNES games have had some optimisation to them to remove borders so that they run full screen, however they still don't run full speed in most cases. With N64 titles its more of a mixed bag, some like SM64 have had the borders removed however others such as Waverace 64 seem largely untouched, a real shame given that its not even technically the original N64 version (note those banner changes) and its a game that really suffered from its PAL port in terms of speed and borders.
Netflix really need to get their act together on closed captioning. It's a problem they've been dodging for far too long now and its only through a loophole in the legal wording that they are escaping breaking the law by not supporting it.
Yep, I remember waiting to purchase GTA IV at HMV watching as an airhead mother purchased the games for two kids who couldn't have been older than 8 years old and, considering it was the middle of the day, should have been in school anyway!
When the clearly concerned store clerk listed the content of the game and pointed out the rating, this walking example of bad parenting just issued an embarrassed laugh..you could tell that in her blinkered view all videogames are exactly like Sonic the Hedgehog.
Reminds me of one of the multiple reasons I don't miss Britain one iota.
Complaints are alwayways worthwhile if justified and the complaints about the first game certainly were in my view.
I did wonder whether the "different versions" was actually related more to the different parts of PAL-land the game would be released in as places such as Germany and Australia have often had problems with violence in games and had censored versions released as an alternative to no release at all.
"The inclusion of blood also means No More Heroes 2 will be available in Europe the way the legendary Suda51 intended"
Translation: We should have done this the first time around.
On a serious note, does this mean that only ONE version of the game is now getting released as previous indications had been that a censored and non-censored version were being released. Is this not longer the case? It needs some clarification.
Personally I dind't mind the black smoke and coins in the actual in-game sequences, it was the ludicrously edited boss death scenes that spoiled the experience for me where stuff would just disappear and cleaners would come and sweep up piles of...nothing very much.
I'm rather surprised that Sega hasn't tried to find a way to get the European Megadrive version of Zero Wing onto the VC yet, given the guaranteed ironic sales it would no doubt get. Although given how long it took to sweep the internet clean of that annoying meme last time, maybe its for the best that it gathers dust.
Magician Lord on SNK Collection 1 and VC kind of gets close to it in humorously garbled translation though
While I'd like to see these games too I'd prefer a NEO GEO shooter retail compilation while the current situation with the PAL Neo Geo continues. It was great to be able to play Last Resort via the SNK collection in 60hz and with the addition of bonus medals and other features. I wouldn't have been so keen on it had it got the Iron Clad treatment on VC (or for that matter didn't feature an "Easy" mode!)
Meanwhile, the curiously titled "volume 0" of the SNK Classics collection is supposedly due this year. Perhaps we'll see some shooters on that...or the long awaited Volume 2.
With the speed alteration the original PAL version got and (hopefully) the usual removal of borders that SNES VC games get this might be the nearest PAL owners ever get to playing the NTSC version.
WereBeaver, yes I can take a joke but I didn't see one in your comment which read more like a stereotype. Its like with the people who complain about the "faults" with Flower Sun and Rain's gameplay. Do they really think that Suda and Grasshopper didn't put those in intentionally? It's called commentary on a medium not intentionally bad gameplay design.
I'm sure you'll agree that It's hilarious that some people take No More Heroes seriously when everything about it is a veiled criticism of gamers and gaming culture in general. The over the top gore, swearing and toilet humour just adds to that.
Suda has been producing interesting thematic work since he first contributed that infamous ending to Super Firepro Wrestling Special. He doesn't always pull it off but his efforts are inevitably interesting all the same simply because he's one of few developers who offers that extra level of meaning in his games. It's a shame that people seem to see him as nothing but an M-rated gore merchant just because he made a game that subtly critiques those types of games.
I think you might have missed the point. Suda 51's games are typically a critique or commentary and not meant to be interpreted literally. If you think "potty jokes and gore" is what defines his work then you are not seeing the whole picture.
Downloaded this last night, it's certainly difficult to get into. Completing the tutorial gives you a textbook full of stuff to try and remember. I ended up getting bored of it and just started the game. Nice to see support for the 64 though especially from a third party.
Ezekiel, you won't encounter the problem in the States it only effects PAL areas. Basically NTSC games from back in the day were 'forced' awkwardly into a PAL shaped hole resulting in audio and visual problems that can be seen here:
and here:
Or a direct VC comparison here:
Note the slower speed of the PAL games as well as the compressed (squashed) appearance of the sprites and the added borders that has come about from trying to force one television format into another without properly recoding it. offering a 60hz option eliminates this problem and has been the standard method offered to PAL gamers since the days of the Dreamcast. However, for some reason the VC emulated games, often being just ROMS of the original don't usually offer this. The problem we have here though is that Nintendo is actively promoting some games as running in 60hz when clearly they do not, thus misrepresenting their product on the Wii shop channel. This makes it seem as if Nintendo, not for the first time, is not even checking the content going onto its shop for quality and is just taking the publishers word for it.
I'm way behind schedule on writing an article detaling the problem which I hope to have finished by the end of the month and which Damo has indicated he will host for discussion here.
I'm around the same age as you and Outrun so yeah, I think we 30+ folk are definately more discerning in our taste. Seriously though, we lived through the problem the first time hence out concern to see history repeating itself. Educating the new audiance about why they are being ripped off is the kay thing here.
Just checked and the Sega hanabi titles including pulseman do indeed carry a message saying "runs in 60hz", unless there is some secret mode to activate this appears to be at best a mistake and at worst an outright lie and something that anyone who bought the game should feel free to take Nintendo and Sega to task on.
Croz, what an interesting and informative post that was, why did you even bother posting it?
I havn't checked it but if Outrun is correct about the megadrive games also falsely advertising 60hz then you can count that complaint to Trading Standards going in tomorrow morning.
Giving poor conversions is one thing but misleading the public who are buying them is quite another.
Nintendo can trot out the old "that's the way it always was" excuse till its blue in the face for its ordinary PAL re-releases but for Hanabi games this is groundless from the start and for them to be falsely advertising them as 60hz combined with the recent Last Ninja 3 fiasco just screams the question "does Nintendo even have a clue what is being put on its VC service?"
Outrun, for the record I disagree with you on one point, its never to late to effect a change. It took 14 months with Last Ninja 3 but the consumer won in the end. All it takes is for people to make a small effort and fire off that email.
oh dear...perhaps another trip ot Trading Standards is looming for Nintendo. Stating that something is 60hz when it actually runs in 50hz is clear misselling and Spanish Screen text? That's just odd (except for Spaniards of course)
Time for PAL gamers to start sending in their complaints about Ironclad. This is becoming a disturbing trend. Why are we being asked to pay MORE for imports that do not even run like the original games did? Complaints to nintendoservicecentre@codestorm.co.uk for UKers out there who are upset about this. Meanwhile, does the fact that Nintendo are apparently erroneously advertising this as 60hz deserve a second complaint to trading standards?
According to early comments the game states it runs in 60hz but has borders at the bottom and top of the screen. Confusing, does anyone know if these borders were present in the original NTSC version ala some Street Fighter games?
Tiranytar, mine arrived in my junkmail on the 10th. Rather odd that I got one seeing as I never actually bought the game. I'm presuming that I'm on the their list because I'm the one who has kicked up a fuss about this and reported Nintendo to trading standards over it.
Other people (ones who had complained) seem to have already received their refund direct from Nintendo. It's all very odd.
It smacks of Nintendo not wanting to reinburse everyone so leaving it up to people to actually know about the problem and raise it directly with commodore gaming.
Ignore the review score and give it a chance would be my recomendation. The game got terrible scores pretty much everywhere, however its quirky, unique and unlike anything else available. I'm not even a big fan of Suda's but with this game I think he hit just the right level of Lynchian weirdness.
It will be interesting to see if Ironclad follows the standard Hanabi template of giving PAL gamers the original version running in 60hz or treads the dubious downgraded 50hz path of SEGA's Hanabi imports.
It will be interesting to see if Ironclad follows the standard Hanabi template of giving PAL gamers the original version running in 60hz or treads the dubious downgraded 50hz path of SEGA's Hanabi imports.
It will be interesting to see if Ironclad follows the standard Hanabi template of giving PAL gamers the original version running in 60hz or treads the dubious downgraded 50hz path of SEGA's Hanabi imports.
Presumably because they've issued refunds. If you take your game back to the store then you don't get to keep the broken game in question. If you try and play it now you get the message that the game isn't designed to run on your Wii, akin to the one you get if you try and load a game from an SD card that's registered to someone elses Wii. Looks like they've just retracted the licence. That's the thing with VC games, technically Nintendo can withdraw the license whenever they want. Nothing beats owning the originals
In your discussions with the folk of Nintendo did anyone bring up the state of the PAL Virtual Console with some of the people you met. Not only the paltry release schedule but the release of broken games like Last Ninja 3, the awful customer service of codestorm and the ongoing problem with 50hz only games and downgraded Hanabi titles.
It's important that Nintendo gets feedback on where its failing as well as where its succeeding so I hope somebody mentioned these things to some PR person or other when the chance was available.
It's so hard to get to speak to anyone at Nintendo themselves due to their farming out of their customer service in the UK that opportunities like this to provide constructive criticism are rare and also important to take.
Actually Marcel this week is worse than a no VC week. It's a minus one VC week as Last Ninja 3 was removed from the shop channel with this update and everone who bought the game has received a 500 point refund and had their game disabled.
Tony, you could well be right that it might have hit other territories despite being acknowledged as broken. It wouldn't be the first time this has happened with a game.
Many years ago an N64 game WWF: No Mercy appeared in North America with a glitch that randomly erased the game's memory. Despite this being raised as an issue by consumers it didn't prevent the publisher THQ from releasing it several months later in EU territories with exactly the same glitch. The game was eventually recalled but only after months of THQ and Nintendo stubbornly refusing to admit the game was at fault and blaming everything from 3rd party controller paks onwards.
Similarly with this game the attitude of Nintendo's UK customer service team Codestorm in ignoring/discounting consumer feedback for so long is truly baffling as is Commodore gaming's seeming inability to get the game working properly in over a year.
My point to Nintendo was always that while the game remained available for download the incentive for Commodore gaming to fix it simply wasn't there. Then there is the moral issue of knowingly selling broken software.
The initial responses I got from Codestorm were along the lines of "everything Nintendo ever does is perfect so there cannot be a problem with this game". They refused to take complaints on forums seriously and it was only when I showed them the review score on this site that they began even accepting that I might have a point. Even then they couldn't promise to take the game down, hence why I involved trading standards.
@IZ2010 You are right Nintendo can't fix the game but they shouldn't be hosting it knowing it is broken either, hence why they needed to take it down and have finally now done so.
Commodore Gaming are the ones that promised to fix the game and the ones that need to fix it, however they seem to have gone incomunicado along time ago and havn't updated the US release section of their website in over a year even when new games have come out.
It can be infuriating but what this shows is that it is possible to make a company listen with the right level of persistance and nobody should ever give up on their greivances. We are Nintendo's customers and its good practice for them to listen to what we want. I believe that Nintendolife changing their review score to 1/10 also was significant in getting across the point to them that the game really was broken after they initially refused to believe what they termed "third party forums". As you say though, its a pity that even after recognising the fault it took Trading Standards to get them to do the right thing.
On the subject of 60hz, Damo actually asked me to pen an article on that a while back which is currently 3/4 complete as I've been snowed under with work for months but I'd like to complete it eventually as we've already shown here that websites and the vpoice of consumers can cause Nintendo/Sega and others to sit up and listen to their audiance.
Like you I doubt we'll get change overnight but with the right level of dedication I believe that eventually the message can get through.
I've emailed them back asking if a fix is still planned, the problem is that Codestorm who run Nintendo's UK customer service line are a third party so its kind of a three way process with me contacting them then and them having to get a reply from NOE which takes a while.
I too hope there is a fix eventually though. This has got to be a first for the VC, not only does Europe get no releases this week but we (albeit rightfully and not before time) have a game withdrawn.
Here's hoping Nintendo can make it up to us soon with some of those VC titles its been holding back on.
I apologise for emailing you directly, but we have today received confirmation that “Last Ninja 3” will be reoved from the European Virtual Console service. Any consumers that have purchased this title will have the Nintendo Points value refunded to their account. Once again, thank you for providing information regarding this title.
I apologise for emailing you directly, but we have today received confirmation that “Last Ninja 3” will be reoved from the European Virtual Console service. Any consumers that have purchased this title will have the Nintendo Points value refunded to their account. Once again, thank you for providing information regarding this title.
Retro Gamer magazine posted a long interview with Mitchell a while back where he confirmed most people's suspicions that the documentary was heavily edited to make him look like the bad guy.
Meanwhile I guess Wiebe's kids are old enough to wipe there own...selves after going to the toilet these days so at least we don't have to worry about repeats of that shamful scene while Wiebe practised for this one,
Heard a rumour about a possible compilation of the GC/N64 titles not so long ago, ala Metroid Prime Trilogy. Perhaps this could be it. Although logically it would seem to make more sense to release the N64 games on VC.
Nice review Damien. It makes me want to buy one but I really shouldn't or I'm going to turn into that Youtube fellow who's wife left him
Interesting that it plays games from all regions yet the manufacturers didn't think to make it immediately compatible by not putting those silly plastic bars on it.
The likelihood is that hardcore gamers are going to be the market for this and hardcore gamers do like their imports!
I was just thinking about this game the other day and wondering about whether Nintendo might ever offer it on the VC. They've always tended to be a bit silly and secretive about things that exist in other regions (as if the internet doesn't exist) but that seems to have changed recently with import titles hitting the VC so it would seem a no brainer to release this...then again this is the company that took three years to release Super Mario Kart so...
Like many people have said, the loading times in this one are irksome in their placement. I was happy to sell my SNES cart for well over £30 a little over a year ago knowing this would eventually become downloadable. As it happens I ended up buying the far superior Saturn version in the meantime so will skip this one.
"2007’s Endless Ocean was a true original: a diving game that made little attempt to be a game, basing most of its gameplay around just touching fish"
Sorry James but, aside from your statement on the game's originality, I have to disagree with the rest of that summary, which I feel further pushes the unwanted and incorrect stereotype that the first game has of it "not being a game". For one thing, regardless of what EGM may feel, Endless Ocean is very much a "game". It has an evolving storyline, a core quest and a series of interesting locales to explore. That is the premise of the game; exploration and mapping while advancing the storyline towards your ultimate goal of tracking down the White Mother. There are numerous sub-quests from treasure hunting to performing guided dives and marine photography assignments to take part, with "touching fish" only being a part of that gameplay and only a main requirement for those completionists wanting to 100% their marine log.
Aside from that I'm glad you were able to review the game and point out the inexplicable decision to remove SD music support from it: not because I ever used it to replace the first game's beautiful soundtrack but because, with this game apparently lacking the Hayley Westenra soundtrack that made the original, I was hoping to burn her CD to SD and recreate it with this one. It's rather sad that I won't be able to, However this will still be an instant buy for me as the sequel to one of the best Wii titles I've played.
The game is alledgedly terrible which may be what convinced the developers to drop the price but considering how receptive many North Americans were towards recieving the Tingle game for DS it's not surprising that the price has been lowered to try and attract more buys. I wonder if the price drop will also apply to the usually more open minded European market when the game get's released there.
Comments 549
Re: Talking Point: The Virtual Console's PAL Problem
Cipher, you make a very good point. Sadly Nintendo is probably right in assserting that many people in this generation don't know the difference. We now have a whole new generation of gamers who most likely never played these games in their original format and never heard about the problems with older PAL conversions. Part of my motivation for writing this article was to raise consumer awareness of the issue and get people to see what they are missing out on and just how easily it could be prevented.
It's interesting to hear people saying that they have stopped purchasing VC games or avoided buying certain titles because of this issue. Certainly I can think of ten or more titles that I would have snapped up, not least of all Waverace 64.
I wonder if Nintendo realises it is actively losing out on sales by not offering a 60hz alternative.
Oregano: you make a very good point about Madworld's 50hz release. If we as consumers become complacent about the quality of virtual offerings then its easy to see why publishers might feel they can lower their standards at retail too.
Re: Ubisoft Debuts New Trailer for Prince of Persia: The Forgotten Sands
Great to hear the original Prince's voice and not the one from Warrior Within.
Also the Wii version will include the SNES version of the original!
That just made it a must buy Nice to see that companies are still offering bonus content like that in the days of Virtual Consoles. This is exactly the sort of thing that helps people choose one version over another.
Re: Talking Point: The Virtual Console's PAL Problem
Thanks for all your comments guys. Keep them coming and perhaps we can then try to get a response to the article from Nintendo (or or at least clarification over the bizarre Sega Hanabi issue) . I'd also like to thank Damo for giving me the opportunity to write this article, as many of you know its something I'm rather passionate about. Apologies it took me so long Damo
@ MrWout: 99% of SNES games have had some optimisation to them to remove borders so that they run full screen, however they still don't run full speed in most cases.
With N64 titles its more of a mixed bag, some like SM64 have had the borders removed however others such as Waverace 64 seem largely untouched, a real shame given that its not even technically the original N64 version (note those banner changes) and its a game that really suffered from its PAL port in terms of speed and borders.
Re: Hands On: Netflix Wii
Netflix really need to get their act together on closed captioning. It's a problem they've been dodging for far too long now and its only through a loophole in the legal wording that they are escaping breaking the law by not supporting it.
The deaf community deserve better.
Re: Dive: The Medes Islands Secret Surfacing on WiiWare Soon
As a big fan of Endless Ocean and the Ecco games this just went to the top of my list for anticipated Wiiware games.
Re: Mothers Against Violence: Violent Games Aren't to Blame, Parents Are
Yep, I remember waiting to purchase GTA IV at HMV watching as an airhead mother purchased the games for two kids who couldn't have been older than 8 years old and, considering it was the middle of the day, should have been in school anyway!
When the clearly concerned store clerk listed the content of the game and pointed out the rating, this walking example of bad parenting just issued an embarrassed laugh..you could tell that in her blinkered view all videogames are exactly like Sonic the Hedgehog.
Reminds me of one of the multiple reasons I don't miss Britain one iota.
Re: Europe to Struggle Desperately in Late May
Complaints are alwayways worthwhile if justified and the complaints about the first game certainly were in my view.
I did wonder whether the "different versions" was actually related more to the different parts of PAL-land the game would be released in as places such as Germany and Australia have often had problems with violence in games and had censored versions released as an alternative to no release at all.
Re: Europe to Struggle Desperately in Late May
"The inclusion of blood also means No More Heroes 2 will be available in Europe the way the legendary Suda51 intended"
Translation: We should have done this the first time around.
On a serious note, does this mean that only ONE version of the game is now getting released as previous indications had been that a censored and non-censored version were being released. Is this not longer the case? It needs some clarification.
Personally I dind't mind the black smoke and coins in the actual in-game sequences, it was the ludicrously edited boss death scenes that spoiled the experience for me where stuff would just disappear and cleaners would come and sweep up piles of...nothing very much.
Re: Feature: The Neo Geo Shooters We Need On Virtual Console
I'm rather surprised that Sega hasn't tried to find a way to get the European Megadrive version of Zero Wing onto the VC yet, given the guaranteed ironic sales it would no doubt get. Although given how long it took to sweep the internet clean of that annoying meme last time, maybe its for the best that it gathers dust.
Magician Lord on SNK Collection 1 and VC kind of gets close to it in humorously garbled translation though
Re: Feature: The Neo Geo Shooters We Need On Virtual Console
While I'd like to see these games too I'd prefer a NEO GEO shooter retail compilation while the current situation with the PAL Neo Geo continues.
It was great to be able to play Last Resort via the SNK collection in 60hz and with the addition of bonus medals and other features. I wouldn't have been so keen on it had it got the Iron Clad treatment on VC (or for that matter didn't feature an "Easy" mode!)
Meanwhile, the curiously titled "volume 0" of the SNK Classics collection is supposedly due this year. Perhaps we'll see some shooters on that...or the long awaited Volume 2.
Re: Nintendo Download: 2nd April 2010 (Europe)
With the speed alteration the original PAL version got and (hopefully) the usual removal of borders that SNES VC games get this might be the nearest PAL owners ever get to playing the NTSC version.
Re: Suda51 Keen on Making Game With Nintendo
WereBeaver, yes I can take a joke but I didn't see one in your comment which read more like a stereotype. Its like with the people who complain about the "faults" with Flower Sun and Rain's gameplay. Do they really think that Suda and Grasshopper didn't put those in intentionally? It's called commentary on a medium not intentionally bad gameplay design.
I'm sure you'll agree that It's hilarious that some people take No More Heroes seriously when everything about it is a veiled criticism of gamers and gaming culture in general. The over the top gore, swearing and toilet humour just adds to that.
Suda has been producing interesting thematic work since he first contributed that infamous ending to Super Firepro Wrestling Special. He doesn't always pull it off but his efforts are inevitably interesting all the same simply because he's one of few developers who offers that extra level of meaning in his games. It's a shame that people seem to see him as nothing but an M-rated gore merchant just because he made a game that subtly critiques those types of games.
Re: Suda51 Keen on Making Game With Nintendo
@'WereBeaver'
I think you might have missed the point. Suda 51's games are typically a critique or commentary and not meant to be interpreted literally. If you think "potty jokes and gore" is what defines his work then you are not seeing the whole picture.
Re: Ogre Battle 64: Person of Lordly Caliber
Downloaded this last night, it's certainly difficult to get into. Completing the tutorial gives you a textbook full of stuff to try and remember. I ended up getting bored of it and just started the game. Nice to see support for the 64 though especially from a third party.
Re: Ogre Battle 64 Hits Europe This Friday
This will almost make up for that gimped version of IronClad they gave us the other week!
Re: Nintendo Download: 12th March 2010 (Europe)
Ezekiel, you won't encounter the problem in the States it only effects PAL areas. Basically NTSC games from back in the day were 'forced' awkwardly into a PAL shaped hole resulting in audio and visual problems that can be seen here:
and here:
Or a direct VC comparison here:
Note the slower speed of the PAL games as well as the compressed (squashed) appearance of the sprites and the added borders that has come about from trying to force one television format into another without properly recoding it. offering a 60hz option eliminates this problem and has been the standard method offered to PAL gamers since the days of the Dreamcast.
However, for some reason the VC emulated games, often being just ROMS of the original don't usually offer this. The problem we have here though is that Nintendo is actively promoting some games as running in 60hz when clearly they do not, thus misrepresenting their product on the Wii shop channel. This makes it seem as if Nintendo, not for the first time, is not even checking the content going onto its shop for quality and is just taking the publishers word for it.
I'm way behind schedule on writing an article detaling the problem which I hope to have finished by the end of the month and which Damo has indicated he will host for discussion here.
Re: Nintendo Download: 12th March 2010 (Europe)
I'm around the same age as you and Outrun so yeah, I think we 30+ folk are definately more discerning in our taste. Seriously though, we lived through the problem the first time hence out concern to see history repeating itself. Educating the new audiance about why they are being ripped off is the kay thing here.
Re: Nintendo Download: 12th March 2010 (Europe)
Just checked and the Sega hanabi titles including pulseman do indeed carry a message saying "runs in 60hz", unless there is some secret mode to activate this appears to be at best a mistake and at worst an outright lie and something that anyone who bought the game should feel free to take Nintendo and Sega to task on.
Re: Nintendo Download: 12th March 2010 (Europe)
I'm getting some points tonight so will check out the Sega claim to see if there is anything behind it.
Re: Nintendo Download: 12th March 2010 (Europe)
Croz, what an interesting and informative post that was, why did you even bother posting it?
I havn't checked it but if Outrun is correct about the megadrive games also falsely advertising 60hz then you can count that complaint to Trading Standards going in tomorrow morning.
Giving poor conversions is one thing but misleading the public who are buying them is quite another.
Nintendo can trot out the old "that's the way it always was" excuse till its blue in the face for its ordinary PAL re-releases but for Hanabi games this is groundless from the start and for them to be falsely advertising them as 60hz combined with the recent Last Ninja 3 fiasco just screams the question "does Nintendo even have a clue what is being put on its VC service?"
Outrun, for the record I disagree with you on one point, its never to late to effect a change. It took 14 months with Last Ninja 3 but the consumer won in the end. All it takes is for people to make a small effort and fire off that email.
Re: Ironclad
oh dear...perhaps another trip ot Trading Standards is looming for Nintendo. Stating that something is 60hz when it actually runs in 50hz is clear misselling and Spanish Screen text? That's just odd (except for Spaniards of course)
Re: Nintendo Download: 12th March 2010 (Europe)
Time for PAL gamers to start sending in their complaints about Ironclad. This is becoming a disturbing trend. Why are we being asked to pay MORE for imports that do not even run like the original games did?
Complaints to nintendoservicecentre@codestorm.co.uk for UKers out there who are upset about this.
Meanwhile, does the fact that Nintendo are apparently erroneously advertising this as 60hz deserve a second complaint to trading standards?
Re: Review: Ironclad (Virtual Console / Neo Geo)
According to early comments the game states it runs in 60hz but has borders at the bottom and top of the screen. Confusing, does anyone know if these borders were present in the original NTSC version ala some Street Fighter games?
Re: Last Ninja 3 Refunds Going Out Now
Tiranytar, mine arrived in my junkmail on the 10th. Rather odd that I got one seeing as I never actually bought the game. I'm presuming that I'm on the their list because I'm the one who has kicked up a fuss about this and reported Nintendo to trading standards over it.
Other people (ones who had complained) seem to have already received their refund direct from Nintendo. It's all very odd.
It smacks of Nintendo not wanting to reinburse everyone so leaving it up to people to actually know about the problem and raise it directly with commodore gaming.
Disgusting really.
Re: Review: Flower, Sun and Rain (DS)
Ignore the review score and give it a chance would be my recomendation. The game got terrible scores pretty much everywhere, however its quirky, unique and unlike anything else available.
I'm not even a big fan of Suda's but with this game I think he hit just the right level of Lynchian weirdness.
Re: Last Ninja 3 Refunds Going Out Now
Link79, one possible answer can be found here:
http://www.vc-forums.com/showpost.php?p=97050&postcount=17
Re: Review: Ironclad (Virtual Console / Neo Geo)
It will be interesting to see if Ironclad follows the standard Hanabi template of giving PAL gamers the original version running in 60hz or treads the dubious downgraded 50hz path of SEGA's Hanabi imports.
Re: Ironclad
It will be interesting to see if Ironclad follows the standard Hanabi template of giving PAL gamers the original version running in 60hz or treads the dubious downgraded 50hz path of SEGA's Hanabi imports.
Re: Hanabi Festival 5 to Happen Soon?
It will be interesting to see if Ironclad follows the standard Hanabi template of giving PAL gamers the original version running in 60hz or treads the dubious downgraded 50hz path of SEGA's Hanabi imports.
Re: Nintendo Download: 26th February 2010 (Europe)
Presumably because they've issued refunds. If you take your game back to the store then you don't get to keep the broken game in question. If you try and play it now you get the message that the game isn't designed to run on your Wii, akin to the one you get if you try and load a game from an SD card that's registered to someone elses Wii.
Looks like they've just retracted the licence. That's the thing with VC games, technically Nintendo can withdraw the license whenever they want. Nothing beats owning the originals
Re: Live Text: European Gamers Summit 2010
In your discussions with the folk of Nintendo did anyone bring up the state of the PAL Virtual Console with some of the people you met. Not only the paltry release schedule but the release of broken games like Last Ninja 3, the awful customer service of codestorm and the ongoing problem with 50hz only games and downgraded Hanabi titles.
It's important that Nintendo gets feedback on where its failing as well as where its succeeding so I hope somebody mentioned these things to some PR person or other when the chance was available.
It's so hard to get to speak to anyone at Nintendo themselves due to their farming out of their customer service in the UK that opportunities like this to provide constructive criticism are rare and also important to take.
Re: Last Ninja 3 Pulled From European Virtual Console
The game was officially removed from the shop channel with this weeks update giving us the first ever minus VC week!
Those who bought the game will have had there license to play it disabled and a 500 point refund from Nintendo.
No apology or direct acknowledgement has yet been offered to those who were affected by this.
Re: Nintendo Download: 26th February 2010 (Europe)
Actually Marcel this week is worse than a no VC week. It's a minus one VC week as Last Ninja 3 was removed from the shop channel with this update and everone who bought the game has received a 500 point refund and had their game disabled.
The first ever MINUS ONE VC Week!
Re: Last Ninja 3 Pulled From European Virtual Console
Tony, you could well be right that it might have hit other territories despite being acknowledged as broken. It wouldn't be the first time this has happened with a game.
Many years ago an N64 game WWF: No Mercy appeared in North America with a glitch that randomly erased the game's memory. Despite this being raised as an issue by consumers it didn't prevent the publisher THQ from releasing it several months later in EU territories with exactly the same glitch. The game was eventually recalled but only after months of THQ and Nintendo stubbornly refusing to admit the game was at fault and blaming everything from 3rd party controller paks onwards.
Similarly with this game the attitude of Nintendo's UK customer service team Codestorm in ignoring/discounting consumer feedback for so long is truly baffling as is Commodore gaming's seeming inability to get the game working properly in over a year.
My point to Nintendo was always that while the game remained available for download the incentive for Commodore gaming to fix it simply wasn't there. Then there is the moral issue of knowingly selling broken software.
The initial responses I got from Codestorm were along the lines of "everything Nintendo ever does is perfect so there cannot be a problem with this game". They refused to take complaints on forums seriously and it was only when I showed them the review score on this site that they began even accepting that I might have a point. Even then they couldn't promise to take the game down, hence why I involved trading standards.
Re: Last Ninja 3 Pulled From European Virtual Console
@IZ2010 You are right Nintendo can't fix the game but they shouldn't be hosting it knowing it is broken either, hence why they needed to take it down and have finally now done so.
Commodore Gaming are the ones that promised to fix the game and the ones that need to fix it, however they seem to have gone incomunicado along time ago and havn't updated the US release section of their website in over a year even when new games have come out.
Re: Last Ninja 3 Pulled From European Virtual Console
@Ristar42
It can be infuriating but what this shows is that it is possible to make a company listen with the right level of persistance and nobody should ever give up on their greivances.
We are Nintendo's customers and its good practice for them to listen to what we want.
I believe that Nintendolife changing their review score to 1/10 also was significant in getting across the point to them that the game really was broken after they initially refused to believe what they termed "third party forums". As you say though, its a pity that even after recognising the fault it took Trading Standards to get them to do the right thing.
On the subject of 60hz, Damo actually asked me to pen an article on that a while back which is currently 3/4 complete as I've been snowed under with work for months but I'd like to complete it eventually as we've already shown here that websites and the vpoice of consumers can cause Nintendo/Sega and others to sit up and listen to their audiance.
Like you I doubt we'll get change overnight but with the right level of dedication I believe that eventually the message can get through.
Re: Last Ninja 3 Pulled From European Virtual Console
I've emailed them back asking if a fix is still planned, the problem is that Codestorm who run Nintendo's UK customer service line are a third party so its kind of a three way process with me contacting them then and them having to get a reply from NOE which takes a while.
I too hope there is a fix eventually though. This has got to be a first for the VC, not only does Europe get no releases this week but we (albeit rightfully and not before time) have a game withdrawn.
Here's hoping Nintendo can make it up to us soon with some of those VC titles its been holding back on.
Re: Review: Last Ninja 3 (Virtual Console / Commodore 64)
Email update from Nintendo today:
I apologise for emailing you directly, but we have today received confirmation that “Last Ninja 3” will be reoved from the European Virtual Console service. Any consumers that have purchased this title will have the Nintendo Points value refunded to their account. Once again, thank you for providing information regarding this title.
Kind regards,
Jackson Davies
Customer Service Team Leader
Your Nintendo Team
Re: Last Ninja 3
Email update from Nintendo today:
I apologise for emailing you directly, but we have today received confirmation that “Last Ninja 3” will be reoved from the European Virtual Console service. Any consumers that have purchased this title will have the Nintendo Points value refunded to their account. Once again, thank you for providing information regarding this title.
Kind regards,
Jackson Davies
Customer Service Team Leader
Your Nintendo Team
Re: Review: Sonic & Knuckles (Virtual Console / Sega Mega Drive)
In what way has Sega changed its stance on the 60hz issue? I'm slightly confused as to that comment?
Do you know something the rest of us don't? I hope so
Re: Steve Wiebe Crowned King of Kong Once Again
Retro Gamer magazine posted a long interview with Mitchell a while back where he confirmed most people's suspicions that the documentary was heavily edited to make him look like the bad guy.
Meanwhile I guess Wiebe's kids are old enough to wipe there own...selves after going to the toilet these days so at least we don't have to worry about repeats of that shamful scene while Wiebe practised for this one,
Re: Rogue Listing On Retailer Website
Heard a rumour about a possible compilation of the GC/N64 titles not so long ago, ala Metroid Prime Trilogy. Perhaps this could be it. Although logically it would seem to make more sense to release the N64 games on VC.
Re: Review: Sonic & Knuckles (Virtual Console / Sega Mega Drive)
Well done for mentioning the downside fo the 50hz PAL VC version. Something that's too often overlooked in VC reviews of Megadrive games.
Re: Talking Point: Nintendo Arcade Games on Virtual Console?
absolutely, especially given the slowness and general inferiority of the PAL NES ports
Re: The Grinder Gets a Release Date; Goes Multi-Platform
Does the game have more than one enemy yet?
Re: Hands On: Yobo FC-16 Go Portable SNES
Nice review Damien. It makes me want to buy one but I really shouldn't or I'm going to turn into that Youtube fellow who's wife left him
Interesting that it plays games from all regions yet the manufacturers didn't think to make it immediately compatible by not putting those silly plastic bars on it.
The likelihood is that hardcore gamers are going to be the market for this and hardcore gamers do like their imports!
Re: Review: Yume Koujou Doki Doki Panic (NES)
I was just thinking about this game the other day and wondering about whether Nintendo might ever offer it on the VC. They've always tended to be a bit silly and secretive about things that exist in other regions (as if the internet doesn't exist) but that seems to have changed recently with import titles hitting the VC so it would seem a no brainer to release this...then again this is the company that took three years to release Super Mario Kart so...
Re: Review: Street Fighter Alpha 2 (Virtual Console / Super Nintendo)
Like many people have said, the loading times in this one are irksome in their placement. I was happy to sell my SNES cart for well over £30 a little over a year ago knowing this would eventually become downloadable. As it happens I ended up buying the far superior Saturn version in the meantime so will skip this one.
Re: Review: Endless Ocean 2: Adventures of the Deep (Wii)
"2007’s Endless Ocean was a true original: a diving game that made little attempt to be a game, basing most of its gameplay around just touching fish"
Sorry James but, aside from your statement on the game's originality, I have to disagree with the rest of that summary, which I feel further pushes the unwanted and incorrect stereotype that the first game has of it "not being a game".
For one thing, regardless of what EGM may feel, Endless Ocean is very much a "game". It has an evolving storyline, a core quest and a series of interesting locales to explore. That is the premise of the game; exploration and mapping while advancing the storyline towards your ultimate goal of tracking down the White Mother.
There are numerous sub-quests from treasure hunting to performing guided dives and marine photography assignments to take part, with "touching fish" only being a part of that gameplay and only a main requirement for those completionists wanting to 100% their marine log.
Aside from that I'm glad you were able to review the game and point out the inexplicable decision to remove SD music support from it: not because I ever used it to replace the first game's beautiful soundtrack but because, with this game apparently lacking the Hayley Westenra soundtrack that made the original, I was hoping to burn her CD to SD and recreate it with this one. It's rather sad that I won't be able to, However this will still be an instant buy for me as the sequel to one of the best Wii titles I've played.
Re: Muscle March Coming to WiiWare on Monday
The game is alledgedly terrible which may be what convinced the developers to drop the price but considering how receptive many North Americans were towards recieving the Tingle game for DS it's not surprising that the price has been lowered to try and attract more buys. I wonder if the price drop will also apply to the usually more open minded European market when the game get's released there.