@Honelith I STILL love reading them from time to time.
They don't do reviews like that anymore. I mean, just for comparison, go look at the average Nintendo Life review*, and compare how many images you get, how many opinions you get, how much detail on the specific game you get, how broken down and explained every aspect of the score is.
@-DEMISE- Yes, I know there's more than just the screenshots (although that appears to make up the bulk of the compendium from what I can see), but watch this trick. . . .
Edit: Look at all the official Nintendo art in the reviews in these pdf scans:
@-DEMISE- On the Kickstarter it looks predominantly like two full pages showing a single [partial] screen of one particular game, and with a little text blurb, repeated throughout the book. Along with some other features and stuff too.
Literally, the screenshot in the article above shows you a perfect example of what most of the pages look like:
Technically speaking, there's probably more of Nintendo's "copyrighted" imagery in a single issue of Mean Machines than in this compendium (when you consider that one of those two page spread screenshots in the compendium would be a single screenshot of many in the average Mean Machines review).
Every single image I just posted above wouldn't even constitute enough for a single review in Mean Machines.
@PieNinja No probs. And apologies if it seemed like I was going mental at you. But, if you've been in here a lot, you probably already know that I go mental at most things and most people at one time or another. It's almost a right of passage at this point. lol
@PieNinja Well, I just get defensive when it comes to stuff like this, because I'm always in the favour of the consumer or the little guy over the mega corporation, just on general principle. When I think the consumers or little guys are abusing their rights I'll say that also, but most of the times I see this kind of stuff it's actually the mega corporation that is trying to stretch the law just a little too far in its favour—and I see a lot of that from Nintendo when it comes to stuff like this.
@PieNinja It's only wrong when it's wrong, and I'll say so when I believe that's the case. This book contains basically a screen or two from each game for the most part, so I think Nintendo is way pushing its luck suggesting it's owed some kind of compensation for the use of said screens. And if you think it's fair that every single mag/website/video or whatever that ever displays just a few screens from some of Nintendo's game owe's Nintendo a royalty, you are just crazy, and you're plain wrong. The fact certain people think otherwise is where the conflict arises.
Just imagine if Mean Machines had to give Nintendo a cut of the profit every time it featured an image or two from Nintendo's game in its issues (I just use Mean Machines because I love linking to the pdf scans of that mag every chance I get):
@ThanosReXXX Hey, as I've always said, "When Nintendo does it right, I'll be happy to say so."
Now, I still have some issues with the NES Classic Edition, but that Ad was frikin' awesome (so, I said so), and the system is still pretty cool too. It could be better though, a better value proposition at least, imo, but at it's largely pretty good for what it is. But, put about a hundred games in there (since there's no way to add any more after the fact), allow me to OPTIONALLY use the controllers either wired or wirelessly (so there would still be fully wired capability and response quality in there, if that's what you choose to go with), and maybe even let me use standard NES carts with it too (just because that would be a really cool feature and it doesn't break the system in any way), and then I think it would be something really special.
Seriously, those things I'm suggesting would only make it even better, with no real downsides, and it's all still entirely plug & play too if you just use it as is out-the-box (the controllers would be wired by default, you don't have to use actual NES carts if you don't want to, and more games would simply be better and wouldn't be hard to add in the slightest).
And, PLEEEASE, you people REALLY need to stop sucking Nintendo's **** when it comes to the price of these 30 years old digital NES games. Nintendo has been ripping us all off with the VC prices for years. Even $1 a piece for 30 bundled titles, or whatever, isn't some kind of magical bargain. These games are basically free for Nintendo to include at this point, regardless of how many it adds. It could technically include the entire NES library on a tiny bit of internal storage, with almost zero hassle, if it really wanted to. Expect more, or else you'll simply never get it; Nintendo will be more than happy to give you the bare minimum you ask for for as long as it can get away with it—which, with fans like you, is clearly going to be a long, long time. I, however, am not so happy about that. And it's people like you who give Nintendo permission to screw over people like me, because you take what they give you a praise them for it, even when any sane person knows they could be getting so much more bang for their buck in situations like this.
But, I'll happily admit I'm slowly changing my opinion on how well this thing thing is gonna sell, regardless of the niggles I have with it. With Ads like the one above, it will find its market, and well at that.
@Project_Dolphin Oh **** off regarding "I still haven't shown how anyone knows if something is done right". I'm wasting my breath on you at this point. I'm not here to keep trying to explain the same basic things to you time and time again because you're too ignorant to grasp some basic concepts. Get to ****!
@-DEMISE- Because, that's really supposed to only be be true if you use the artwork directly and sell it for money in and of itself or as some kind of official thing. Nintendo's copyright is of course protected—to a degree. But, if you use a bit of art from some source here and there, like a scan of the back of a box or whatever, in say a book about Nintendo, that should rightly be and mostly is protected under Fair Use law. You are legally allowed to use snippets of even Copyrighted work here and there under certain circumstances. Otherwise, every single person in the world who's ever used any of Nintendo's art, even screens of its games, for any purpose whatsoever (if money is even remotely attached, and not necessarily directly either) would legally owe Nintendo recompense—and that's just absurd. So, maybe this book used just a bit too much art, but that's largely and arbitrary amount. For example, a book that it literally filled from front to back with screens of Nintendo's games, but it's only one or two screens from each game, should be totally and utterly be protected under Fair Use law—because there's literally less than maybe 0.001% of each of those copyrighted works used in each case.
@Project_Dolphin 1. I agree with what you are saying in principle, and I have noting against trying new things and stuff; it's all just got to be done right. Star Fox Zero tried something new for example, and I think it totally failed for the most part—and both the reviews and sales largely support that assertion. So, it's important that good practice isn't just thrown out the window for the sake of trying something new and almost for that reason alone; it's got be done with an understanding of why something worked well in the past and why something new may or may not work now.
2. I think there's a lot more standards in gaming than you realise, and I'm saying that as a game designer, as someone who's worked at both Rare and Rockstar North, and even as a trained artist & animator too. There's lots of best practices that have been established over the years, right from the very first gaming systems, but even before that across all the mediums that exist within most video games, from art and music to writing and graphic design, and even things like user interface design.
And again, I'm not talking about the fun you have on a personal level; I'm talking about how the game creators actually design and make the games at a fundamental level. Most of the greatest games were created by people who knew what makes a great game, and the stuck to it for the most part, with few exceptions. Most of the bad games were made by people who didn't quite get it, or the just make stupid decisions for stupid reasons, even though the really should have known better—like with Star Fox Zero.
A whole lot of casuals clearly do enjoy Just Dance, but I still say they are largely badly designed games (well, talking about the Wii version specifically); it's just that most casuals don't know any better, and the fun they're having largely isn't because of the game design but the situation created around it. You could turn off the game and turn on a karaoke, and they'd have just as much fun. And, if you did that but kept the game running in the background on the TV, they'd probably still think they were playing the game and it was the game that was providing the fun. It's not; it's dancing to cool tunes and being judged for it, in a way that's not too serious.
It's like saying Pokemon Go is a great game just because it's hugely popular. it's not; it's actually a pretty crap game, and it suffers from issues left, right, and centre, including with basic stuff like controls. But, it's great fun to run around outside, looking for stuff, and socialising with other people. Don't, however, mistake that for the underlying game being brilliantly made—that's simply not the case. It's not some 9/10 game. It's maybe a 6/10 game getting by on it's social hook and popularity more than anything else. Although, one could argue that's part of the game design; not me though. Not intrinsically. The game could have just as well be a total flop and no one played it, and that social aspect simply wouldn't exist, because it's not actually part of the actual game. It's a byproduct. Just like being cool in school was a byproduct of playing Pokemon games back in the day—they, however, also happened to be awesome games in their own right too.
Anyone else notice how all the stuff that capitalises on Nintendo's '80s and '90s period is just rocking it of late (Pokemon Go, the NES Classic Edition, a Zelda game that harkens back to the NES original . . .)?
That's because Nintendo really was at its peak and truly awesome back then, and it still shows even now.
I want that Nintendo again, through and through, and with its new stuff too. That's a Nintendo I can love!
@gatorboi352 Totally agree. The NES and SNES basically nailed it 100%. The N64 made a few mistake but was still pretty amazing imo. And then each system after that introduced more and more points of contention for me, until it got to where we are today, where I hardly care about its new systems anymore. Hopefully the NX can change that, but I'm not confident of this.
OK, that official trailer is pretty frikin' awesome!
And, I must admit the system is actually pretty cool (even though I’m still not 100% sold on it just looking like a cheaper and even more “toy” version of the original NES), but I personally think it needs way more games in there (especially since you both can’t use actual NES carts with it or download more games later on either). I also wish there was an option to use the controllers either wired or wireless. And, I do actually wish you could use NES carts directly in it too, just because it would add so much value to the system.
Hopefully, if Nintendo decides to do a similar “SNES mini” in the future, it sees fit to include way more games (maybe closer to a hundred), allows both wired and wireless options for the controllers (it could just allow you to unplug the cable from the back of the controller basically), and let’s you actually plug old SNES carts directly into the thing too, just because it would be super cool. That’s a system I would be very much interested in (although, I couldn’t actually play it on my TV anyway, because I literally only own an old CRT SDTV. Maybe I could plug it into my monitor. . . . )
I'll take back what I originally said about its sales though; I think this thing may indeed just fly off the shelves now—especially if Nintendo's really taking that amazing retro approach with all its marketing and stuff.
Absolutely love that commercial—Nintendo hasn't felt quite like that in years to me (that AWESOME!).
Let's say for example that someone comes up with a rule in game design that says when you push up on a controller (d-pad/analog stick) the object should move up, which makes sense and works as expected—and let's assume everyone now follows this rule for the next 20 years—and then someone else suddenly decides that when you push up the object should move left instead, but only once every three pushes.
The original rule works well and makes sense. The new rule still technically works but it simply does not make sense, and 1 in 3 times it would even feel to the player like it wasn't responding properly at all.
So, if we're judging stuff based on things like logic, intuitiveness, common sense, satisfaction, best practice, etc., we can objectively say that doing it the first way is good game design and doing the other way is bad game design—given the premise that one way has long been established as a proven and tested method that works very well (which everyone has now come to understand and expect), and the other isn't and doesn't. Unless of course the designer also intends to reprogram the minds and habits of everyone who plays his games too, just so the new isn't completely wrong to them.
Something like that.
It's just a random example of how it's possible to use well established rules to inform good game design, and how to potentially create bad games if you don't understand those rules and just do everything willy nilly just because. It's taken around 40 years to figure out many of the things that actually work well/best in game design. and that's true of the art, music, animation, level design, controls, gameplay design, story, etc.
And, if I were to objectively judge the first control example vs the second, I would matter of fact judge the first higher/better than the second—and rightly so. Ergo, I would say that objectively speaking the first is good and the second is bad—as judged according to the established rules, best practices, and general principles of good game design—but, each person is still free to like whatever the hell they want.
@aaronsullivan It really is going to be interesting to see what Nintendo ultimately comes out with, and I just hope it isn't totally disappointing. lol
I'll say this much, when everyone was speculating about the original Wii there were some pretty awesome ideas and designs floating around, including my own if I do say so*, and Nintendo still managed to knock it out the park (even if the console ultimately never lived up to its true full potential imo).
But, then again, the Wii U largely ended up falling short of many people's expectations and ultimately didn't really do anything particularly mind boggling either, even though a few games did eventually show off its true potential.
Me, I'm still totally clueless as to what NX is going to be at this point. lol
@Mahe Yeah, it was the Wii version I played. And it's basically the Wii and Wii U versions I'd be talking about in here for the most part, seeing as it's a Nintendo site.
So, has the Wii U version figured out how to use the Wiimote(s) much more effectively? Because, from what I gathered, via an admittedly very quick scan of an article, it uses the same controls as the Wii version (the Wiimote).
Or are you talking about Just Dance on other systems here?
@Project_Dolphin Just want to clarify that I already edited my comment to remove the "sandbox" parts before you replied. I meant the open-world nature of the GTA games rather than the sandbox elements. I actually love sandbox gameplay in general, but I didn't think properly about what I was writing as I put it down and so I fixed it (See; this is why I edit my comments). I just don't care much for large open worlds in general, unless they are handled exceptionally well, in a way that resonates with me.
You do seem to have this terrible habit of not being able to separate someone's own subjective and individual opinion of a game with how the game can be judged in and of itself, on its own merits (based on standard rules and best practices of game design), and more objectively.
So, no; I do not think the GTA games are bad; in fact, I think they are largely very well made (even with the bugs). I simply don't like them personally. Those two things are not one and the same.
The rules are usually determined by the people who created these things from the ground up in the first place, and then the rules are both tweaked and reaffirmed over time as people realise they do in fact work and give the desired results/outcome reliably. These people who came up with the rules established best practices so others could reproduce the same results without having to learn everything from scratch again every time. You know, just like how thousands of years ago we established the rules for writing (Start a sentence with a capital letter, and finish with a full stop.), and if you follow them well your writing can be judged as good, and if you don't it can be judged as bad. But, each individual is still free to enjoy your story exactly as much as they want.
And again, I think those gamers who consider the controls in Just Dance as good—and let's talk specifically about the Wii/Wii U versions in here since this is a Nintendo site—are basically clueless as to what constitutes good controls. Not saying they can't have fun. I am saying they're having fun playing a pretty crappy game (in terms of things like the control and gameplay mechanics, which I personally consider two of the keys to any great game).
This kind of stuff isn't rocket science.
Edit: If what @Mahe says is true, and they've greatly improved the Just Dance games since the Wii version (the only one I've played), I will be willing to concede they may be better games now. Although, I'd have to play them myself to say such a thing and actually mean it.
@Project_Dolphin Well, it's as close to objective fact as a bunch of reviews based on professional opinions can be, and a whole lot more so than your singular subjective opinions.
I just don't really like the gameplay in GTA games. I'm not really into wandering around a huge open world shooting pedestrians or jumping in a car to drive from A to B and that kind of thing. I'm actually not a very open world type of gamer in general, unless there's still some clear path/goal to be followed when I decide I'm bored of just playing around in the world. And I found most of the missions too scripted and forced to really enjoy them.
That analogy does apply. There are literally specific rules to creating a video game (good practices), including the art (as in, there are established rules and techniques for creating art, and the quality of execution of such techniques is largely used to judge it by professional art critics—once you go beyond just "Do you personally like it?"), and you can judge every element of a game, and the whole too, objectively as such*. It's just that most people don't judge things based on the established rules and techniques (good practices), including most professional reviewers; they largely just tell you what they liked and score the game based on their own experience with it and little else.
Much like you appear to do.
*As an example: You might personally like controls that literally don't work properly or as intended, but they are objectively bad/broken controls (as determined by good practice game design rules for controls). So, while people with a clue would call them bad/broken controls, you might say something like "I thought they were kinda fun." Objectively bad controls, subjectively fun.
@rjejr Yeah, I've been thinking about this kind of thing for a long time too, many years now. In fact, quite a few of those ideas I have for NX were actually ideas I had for Wii originally (and I don't mean Wii U; I mean Wii).
Nah, I wouldn't be surprised at all if an NX handheld was only at 720p. I was just suggesting what I thought would be a good number based on it being able to run Wii U games directly on the screen and whatever else. But, the Wii U screen isn't even 720p, and it runs Wii U games just fine, so I could totally see the resolution being lower than 1080p. If it were done right, I don't think it would seriously bother me, but I think sometimes it's just good to give people what they actually expect and want rather than what they can tolerate. lol
Shame you didn't really understand all the backwards compatible stuff, as that's a huge point of what makes the idea compelling. lol That and the entire creation suite thing.
@Project_Dolphin Because your assertions about all these AAA games are not just you expressing your opinion; you're stating things as though they are objective fact. And I'm showing you a very simple example of how [as close to] objective fact contradicts your subjective assertions*. Simple really.
Yes, I have played Just Dance. I played it on Wii. And I thought it was total garbage. The songs were of course fun, but the game isn't automatically fun because the songs are fun. The game, at least the Wii version (and presumably the Wii U version too, seeing as it uses the same control /interaction method), was clunky crap that registered your motions/actions so arbitrarily that you might as well just dance around without touching the controller at all. That's not good game design; it's casual junk that ignorant gamers mistake for good game design.
If you want to talk about shovelware, Just Dance is a great example imo. Ubisoft is indeed "shovelling out" those games; 27 of them since 2009 (and they're not exactly screaming "quality"): Just Dance (video game series)
And, let me put it out there again: Most of those people that think Just Dance is a good game are too ignorant to know any better. You could turn off any interaction at all and just pretend they were playing, and they would literally believe it was just as fun and that they were actually playing it. But, you seem incapable of grasping that some people are simply clueless casuals who ultimately don't know crap. They're the type of people who think pressing a single button for infinity is a fun game, as long as you play a "ting" sound and display a "Congratulations! +100" popup every once in a while (I'm using terrible mobile games as a reference point here). They are basically incapable of judging what is and isn't a good game.
*If you understand that you can subjectively judge something—which clearly you do, because you're doing it when you claim all these AAA games are bad—then you have to also understand that this means there are objective measures by which things can be judged (How is it fun? Why is it not good? What measure/metric are you using to call it shovelware?). And therefore, when 99 out of 100 people have used very similar metrics/measures to judge something as good, even though this is contrary to your own judgement, you just need to accept that your opinion maybe isn't very true to the objectively reality of the situation.
If 99 out of 100 people tell you something is red, but you see it as blue, it's almost certainly red and you are simply colour blind—not, it's blue to you and red to everyone else. That's not how the world works; you don't get to say you're not colour blind just because that's what you'd like to believe personally. Or, do so—you crazy person. lol
Metacritic is simply a better indicator/measure of a game's more objective quality than you (because it aggregates multiple professional opinions together and then averages them out to remove outliers)—irrespective of each person being entitled to their own personal opinions and tastes of whatever games—and that's just a fact you're maybe going to have to accept.
@rjejr Yeah, I knew about it—as in, I'd seen it before. But, unfortunately for you, I'm not convinced this is what the NX is going to be. Or, at least, I personally hope it's not that kind of thing—not based on what I've seen of these types of devices anyway (these tablets with controller attachments).
There's a chance it could work if done right, and I mean if it's done RIGHT; and it's actually quite similar to one of my own ideas for NX in principle, although different enough from it at the same time, but I'm not convinced the particular solution you envision, as least based on your examples, is the way to go. Similarly, I'm not entirely convinced of my own idea anymore either:
PS. The fact the Wikipad went basically completely unnoticed for the most part should probably tell us something. Sure, it didn't have Nintendo's name on it, but still. I think we might all be barking up the wrong tree—although I really have no clue at this point.
@Project_Dolphin Dude, I think you seriously have everything back-to-front. And, I think at this point you're simply far too committed to your apparent hatred for AAA developers/games to see it. You really need to stop confusing a few bugs in these big AAA titles with them being bad games.
If you actually think games like The Division, Destiny, and The Last of US are bad games, you are literally clueless about what constitutes a good or bad game, or you're just really, really biased in your views. You not liking these games does not translate into them being bad games, or anywhere close to it. A game like The Last of Us doesn't get a 95 on metacritic, with only a single review dropping below the positive scoring range, based on some kind of mass blind-fanboyism for movie-like presentation and gorgeous visuals only. It's just absurd to believe that's the case.
I don't disagree that these big publishers know that presentation and graphics are important in getting lots of mainstream gamers excited about their products out-the-gate, be they good or bad, but that doesn't automatically equate to them only making pretty looking but bad games as a standard course of business, which is what you seem to think. I mean, if you seriously believe the developers of the three games I just mentioned weren't trying to create 90+ scoring games, then again, you are truly clueless. And, that's not me trying to insult you and cause an argument, or whatever; that's me stating what I believe would be a literal fact in this case.
Here's a more objective list of actual crap games:
Don't confuse the two just because you have some hate of modern AAA titles or whatever.
I mean, I don't like the GTA games, and they often have loads of bugs and stuff, but that doesn't make them anywhere close to being bad games; they're just not my cup of tea.
And, I generally hate the Call of Duty games, but if I'm being real honest here, they're actually well made games, which simply cater to a very specific type of player that's not me.
@Mahe If you're into gimmicky casual stuff where your actions hardly even register (especially on the Wii/Wii U versions) so you might as well just be dancing to karaoke without the interactive video game part of it at all, sure. I mean, I'm certainly not arguing that dancing to good music isn't fun.
@Project_Dolphin But it also makes the incentive to make them good much higher too, especially for these big developers who actually want to make money on their games. If a game can be churned out with minimal effort and make an easy profit, you're far less likely to bother too much about making it the best it can be, than if a game takes six years to make at a budget of hundreds of millions. That's just simple logic.
And, for an indie developer, their little game that maybe cost a few tens of thousand of pounds is often the equivalent of Ubisoft's multi-million dollar titles—often meaning total collapse for these indies if the title fails to sell—hence they too also try to make them the best they can be.
Shovelware basically means churned out crap*, and if a game costs one of these massive publishers peanuts and only takes a handful of guys to make, and can be resold every few months or so also, it's usually more likely to be some churned out crap, especially when it's licensed too; not always, but generally speaking.
@Ogbert "Also I feel like since they've been able to animate sprites we're seeing a lot more with concepts that really need that movement to truly be appreciated. "
Yeah, but that kinda goes to my point: The best character designs shouldn't only look good in motion, they should look good regardless, even in silhouette—that's basically the dictionary definition of a good/strong character design.
A really great character design should actually suggest the likely motion too, just by the look and pose, even in a static image. Like, you at least know a Diglett doesn't move just by looking at it (apart from maybe popping up/down or in/out of the ground, like one of those Whack a Mole games), right? You know Snorlax is just gonna lay about doing nothing, right? You know Charizard is an awesome dragon that's gonna fly around and attack you with fire, right? And you know Magikarp is just gonna flop around helplessly, and then . . . it totally blew your mind when it evolved, because its unevolved state made you think it was totally gormless and useless.
Everything matters: Colours, proportions, pose, characteristics, line of action, silhouette, expression, overall aesthetic appeal, etc.
@Project_Dolphin The problem here, as I see it, is that you are considering a game that takes probably less than 6 months to make, is churned out likely multiple times a year, and is full of extremely shallow and usually quite clunky design and gameplay, is somehow the same kind of "shovelware" as a game that took like 6 years to make, with a budget and resources tens times as high, and with a level of depth and breadth that is on a whole other level.
There's actual shovelware, and then there's your examples of "shoveware", where you're just lumping the likes of The Division, Watch Dogs, The Last of Us, and Destiny in the same league as actual shovelware, or at least stuff that's just generally mass produced meh, which is a bit of a joke really.
You might not realise this, but I think it's you that has some major bias and distortion of reality going on here.
The Let's Dance games are basically shovelware, although certainly not the worst of it (RCXMDXX, or whatever he's called, is often guilty of churning out REAL shovelware; but at least he's not a developer with multiple billions of dollars and near-endless resources at his disposal, so he kinda has an excuse). The likes of The Division, Watch Dogs, The Last of Us, and Destiny, however, don't even come close to being shovelware, regardless of them not being perfect or the kinds of games you personally like.
I want actual quality on the NX too, but let's be honest here: These big AAA games are far, far more likely to get close to providing that than yearly (at least) churned out casual junk like Just Dance. And, that is in no way saying that I think more casual experiences can't be great games too, because they can (Wii Play: Tanks, Wii Sports: Bowling, Nintendogs, Brain Training, Cut The Rope, Tetris, World of Goo, Kirby's Epic Yarn, etc.), but there's great casual games and not so great casual games too (anything Petz, anything Kardashian, Farmvile, any of those App coin grabbers, Pet Baby, E.T. etc).
So, let's start talking about actual shovelware here, if that's what we're meant to be talking about. And, sadly, there was plenty of that on Wii—maybe not the worst ever, but more than on most of the other platforms from my recollection. And there was a distinct lack of the great AAA third party games too.
@Project_Dolphin I agree, it shouldn't be just about the business. And that's generally what I mean when I say the third party support on Wii was crap. Yeah, there were actually quite a lot of third party games on the system before it died a very quick death, but it was mostly shovelware and gimmicky crap, like you said, unfortunately. That's not what I want to see on NX, and Ubisoft's recent quote does nothing to calm any fears I might have of it happening again.
@Project_Dolphin You don't have to be impressed by it, but they're getting it. And, while Wii U will almost literally fall off the face of the Earth once NX comes out--unless it does something that could give the Wii U more life--you can be pretty sure the competition's consoles will be seeing strong third party support for many years to come, even after the next-gen consoles come out. And that is not something to just sniff off lightly. It's just one of the many reasons why Nintendo consoles in recent times simply have no represented as strong value propositions as the competition.
You're right though, the list does absolutely go on.
And, I've not blamed the Wiimote for any developer's inability to make a good game. I've blamed the numerous issues with Wii overall as one of the reasons why developers didn't make games for it in general, and certainly not many good games. But, to be clear, there are still issues with the Wiimote itself in terms of just putting off many developers and whatever else. It has its strengths too though.
@-DEMISE- Possibly. But, the fact there's guys on the dev team who even say such things in the first place, such that someone else has to step in with a bit more sense.
@ThanosReXXX Yeah, all I would really add is full 1080p 60fps visuals, online competitive racing (and still have split-screen too), a possible track editor (which would make total sense if it were on Wii U because we could use the GamePad to easily "draw" tracks and stuff), a decent story mode with high quality and generally pretty straight-laced presentation, a possible OPTIONAL tilt-control scheme (if on Wii U, and if NX uses tilt controls at all), and just a few other little tweaks here and there.
@rjejr Yes, absolutely; I believe quite a few of the rumours we've heard and patents we've seen around NX actually have nothing to do with NX at all. It is, however, a total lottery as to which ones. lol
Because, to me, I'm just affraid that ultimately translates into "gimmick* that will likely on really appeal to and satisfy casuals or the most loyal fanboys, and something that most third parties and AAA developers simply won't give a flying **** about".
I'm worried, for sure.
*Doesn't mean the underlying idea isn't potentially great, but I'm saying it likely won't realise its full potential and therefor will never be truly satisfying; just like the Wii with its Wiimote and the Wii U with its touchscreen GamePad failed to ever really reach their full potentials as far as I'm concerned, and therefore they were both ultimately disappointing and mostly unsatisfying.
To be clear, the new Ghostbusters' issues don't all stem from the fact it's an all female cast; it's a whole lot of crap that makes this movie look bad, although an all female cast is actually a small part of it too.
From everything I've seen thus far, it's just looking to be a pretty **** movie all-round: Bad special effects (way too obvious cgi), idiotic conceits (Do you really believe a bunch of supposedly intelligent scientist types, female or otherwise, would hire what amounts to a mentally ******** secretary?), some really stupid new items (only there for the toys angle), some terrible acting (especially OTT on Leslie Jone's side of things), blatant and intentional sexism (which, funnily enough, wasn't a real thing in the first movie), and yes, even making the cast all females blatantly just to make some social commentary (this is patently obvious if you look at all the other aspects of the film; mentally ******** male secretary, shooting end baddie in **** to defeat it, girls making jokes about stuff happening "because I'm a woman or black", etc.)
Ghostbusters 2016 just looks like a **** movie; and the PR/marketing men and a mass of easily "guided" social media sheep can't deflect all that by trying to pretend it was all just because everyone's sexist and racist—they can shove that kind of ******* spin and deflection right up their ***.
It's all very much like the way this Ghostbusters 2 game was likely **** purely because it was ****.
@TheWPCTraveler Well, that I can understand. I can totally get how some people prefer smartphone/tablet gaming similarly. Not me personally, but some people.
@Project_Dolphin You seem to be ignoring the fact that those other consoles are still seeing support even now, whereas Wii basically died a death the moment Wii U was announced. Whether you get it or not, that kind of stuff makes a huge difference to most gamers beyond the most blindly loyal Nintendo fans—a near ten year lifespan vs a 5 or so year lifespan (even when the machine is one of the most successful consoles of all time).
And I've said this many times before too, I'm calling out Nintendo's particular issues because this is a Nintendo site; it doesn't mean the other guys were perfect, but if I wanted to call them out I'd do it on a Sony or Microsoft site for the most part.
Also, I never claimed the Wiimote was the cause of all the Wii's issues; I simply claimed the Wii had a lot of issues. The Wiimote caused some of the Wii's issues, but its problems go far beyond the Wiimote—and Ubisoft claiming NX is going to "bring casuals back in" just makes me worry it might end up suffering many of the same issues as Wii. I'm complaining because Wii was disappointing in so many ways it's not even funny.
"someone else may say, 'no, actually, that's already been done in another game'"
That's such a stupid way of thinking, imo. It's cool to want to do new stuff, but thinking you can't really do something if someone else has done it, is just stupid. And, of course it would be ideal to take cool ideas and always try to do them slightly differently, but that shouldn't be some kind of steadfast mantra. Some ideas exist because they work.
This kind of thinking is why we still haven't seen a new F-Zero; and F-Zero really deserves a new game, and it could still be totally great even in 2016, with largely the same formula and just a few extras here and there.
Ultimately, I'm fine with seeing stuff that's been done before, especially if it's been done really well.
Ya know, I really hope there's flying through the skies (maybe even on Loftwings) and sailing on the seas in the game too, just like in Skyward Sword and Wind Waker. It would be really cool if all the different elements from previous games were fully realised in this world.
Comments 6,304
Re: NES Visual Compendium Dispute Comes To An End, Kickstarter Resumes For Final 24 Hours
@Honelith I STILL love reading them from time to time.
They don't do reviews like that anymore. I mean, just for comparison, go look at the average Nintendo Life review*, and compare how many images you get, how many opinions you get, how much detail on the specific game you get, how broken down and explained every aspect of the score is.
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/zelda3snes.pdf (a Mean Machines review example)
Better times, in many ways—and not even nostalgia.
*https://www.nintendolife.com/reviews/wiiu-eshop/pokemon_ranger_guardian_signs_ds (literally the first one that popped up when I quickly checked on the site)
Re: NES Visual Compendium Dispute Comes To An End, Kickstarter Resumes For Final 24 Hours
@-DEMISE- Yes, I know there's more than just the screenshots (although that appears to make up the bulk of the compendium from what I can see), but watch this trick. . . .
Edit: Look at all the official Nintendo art in the reviews in these pdf scans:
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/fzerosnes.pdf
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/mariobros3nes.pdf
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/supertennissnes.pdf
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/zelda3snes.pdf
From box art, instruction manuals, official comics, and all.
It's like magic or something!
Re: NES Visual Compendium Dispute Comes To An End, Kickstarter Resumes For Final 24 Hours
@-DEMISE- On the Kickstarter it looks predominantly like two full pages showing a single [partial] screen of one particular game, and with a little text blurb, repeated throughout the book. Along with some other features and stuff too.
Literally, the screenshot in the article above shows you a perfect example of what most of the pages look like:
Technically speaking, there's probably more of Nintendo's "copyrighted" imagery in a single issue of Mean Machines than in this compendium (when you consider that one of those two page spread screenshots in the compendium would be a single screenshot of many in the average Mean Machines review).
Every single image I just posted above wouldn't even constitute enough for a single review in Mean Machines.
Re: NES Visual Compendium Dispute Comes To An End, Kickstarter Resumes For Final 24 Hours
@PieNinja No probs. And apologies if it seemed like I was going mental at you. But, if you've been in here a lot, you probably already know that I go mental at most things and most people at one time or another. It's almost a right of passage at this point. lol
Re: NES Visual Compendium Dispute Comes To An End, Kickstarter Resumes For Final 24 Hours
@PieNinja Well, I just get defensive when it comes to stuff like this, because I'm always in the favour of the consumer or the little guy over the mega corporation, just on general principle. When I think the consumers or little guys are abusing their rights I'll say that also, but most of the times I see this kind of stuff it's actually the mega corporation that is trying to stretch the law just a little too far in its favour—and I see a lot of that from Nintendo when it comes to stuff like this.
Re: NES Visual Compendium Dispute Comes To An End, Kickstarter Resumes For Final 24 Hours
@PieNinja It's only wrong when it's wrong, and I'll say so when I believe that's the case. This book contains basically a screen or two from each game for the most part, so I think Nintendo is way pushing its luck suggesting it's owed some kind of compensation for the use of said screens. And if you think it's fair that every single mag/website/video or whatever that ever displays just a few screens from some of Nintendo's game owe's Nintendo a royalty, you are just crazy, and you're plain wrong. The fact certain people think otherwise is where the conflict arises.
Just imagine if Mean Machines had to give Nintendo a cut of the profit every time it featured an image or two from Nintendo's game in its issues (I just use Mean Machines because I love linking to the pdf scans of that mag every chance I get):
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/zelda3snes.pdf
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/supermario4snes.pdf
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/supertennissnes.pdf
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/simcitysnes.pdf
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/fzerosnes.pdf
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/pilotwingsnes.pdf
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/mariotwones.pdf
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/drmariones.pdf
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/nintendoworldcupnes.pdf
http://www.meanmachinesmag.co.uk/pdf/mariobros3nes.pdf
It would be totally and utterly absurd. And this is exactly why the Fair Use law exists.
Re: Nintendo Entertainment System: NES Classic Edition Gets a Snazzy Trailer and Website
@ThanosReXXX Hey, as I've always said, "When Nintendo does it right, I'll be happy to say so."
Now, I still have some issues with the NES Classic Edition, but that Ad was frikin' awesome (so, I said so), and the system is still pretty cool too. It could be better though, a better value proposition at least, imo, but at it's largely pretty good for what it is. But, put about a hundred games in there (since there's no way to add any more after the fact), allow me to OPTIONALLY use the controllers either wired or wirelessly (so there would still be fully wired capability and response quality in there, if that's what you choose to go with), and maybe even let me use standard NES carts with it too (just because that would be a really cool feature and it doesn't break the system in any way), and then I think it would be something really special.
Seriously, those things I'm suggesting would only make it even better, with no real downsides, and it's all still entirely plug & play too if you just use it as is out-the-box (the controllers would be wired by default, you don't have to use actual NES carts if you don't want to, and more games would simply be better and wouldn't be hard to add in the slightest).
And, PLEEEASE, you people REALLY need to stop sucking Nintendo's **** when it comes to the price of these 30 years old digital NES games. Nintendo has been ripping us all off with the VC prices for years. Even $1 a piece for 30 bundled titles, or whatever, isn't some kind of magical bargain. These games are basically free for Nintendo to include at this point, regardless of how many it adds. It could technically include the entire NES library on a tiny bit of internal storage, with almost zero hassle, if it really wanted to. Expect more, or else you'll simply never get it; Nintendo will be more than happy to give you the bare minimum you ask for for as long as it can get away with it—which, with fans like you, is clearly going to be a long, long time. I, however, am not so happy about that. And it's people like you who give Nintendo permission to screw over people like me, because you take what they give you a praise them for it, even when any sane person knows they could be getting so much more bang for their buck in situations like this.
But, I'll happily admit I'm slowly changing my opinion on how well this thing thing is gonna sell, regardless of the niggles I have with it. With Ads like the one above, it will find its market, and well at that.
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Project_Dolphin Oh **** off regarding "I still haven't shown how anyone knows if something is done right". I'm wasting my breath on you at this point. I'm not here to keep trying to explain the same basic things to you time and time again because you're too ignorant to grasp some basic concepts. Get to ****!
Re: NES Visual Compendium Dispute Comes To An End, Kickstarter Resumes For Final 24 Hours
@-DEMISE- Well, I've not read it, so I can't say. It does, however, appear that some kind of agreement has been reached either way.
Re: NES Visual Compendium Dispute Comes To An End, Kickstarter Resumes For Final 24 Hours
@-DEMISE- Because, that's really supposed to only be be true if you use the artwork directly and sell it for money in and of itself or as some kind of official thing. Nintendo's copyright is of course protected—to a degree. But, if you use a bit of art from some source here and there, like a scan of the back of a box or whatever, in say a book about Nintendo, that should rightly be and mostly is protected under Fair Use law. You are legally allowed to use snippets of even Copyrighted work here and there under certain circumstances. Otherwise, every single person in the world who's ever used any of Nintendo's art, even screens of its games, for any purpose whatsoever (if money is even remotely attached, and not necessarily directly either) would legally owe Nintendo recompense—and that's just absurd. So, maybe this book used just a bit too much art, but that's largely and arbitrary amount. For example, a book that it literally filled from front to back with screens of Nintendo's games, but it's only one or two screens from each game, should be totally and utterly be protected under Fair Use law—because there's literally less than maybe 0.001% of each of those copyrighted works used in each case.
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Project_Dolphin 1. I agree with what you are saying in principle, and I have noting against trying new things and stuff; it's all just got to be done right. Star Fox Zero tried something new for example, and I think it totally failed for the most part—and both the reviews and sales largely support that assertion. So, it's important that good practice isn't just thrown out the window for the sake of trying something new and almost for that reason alone; it's got be done with an understanding of why something worked well in the past and why something new may or may not work now.
2. I think there's a lot more standards in gaming than you realise, and I'm saying that as a game designer, as someone who's worked at both Rare and Rockstar North, and even as a trained artist & animator too. There's lots of best practices that have been established over the years, right from the very first gaming systems, but even before that across all the mediums that exist within most video games, from art and music to writing and graphic design, and even things like user interface design.
And again, I'm not talking about the fun you have on a personal level; I'm talking about how the game creators actually design and make the games at a fundamental level. Most of the greatest games were created by people who knew what makes a great game, and the stuck to it for the most part, with few exceptions. Most of the bad games were made by people who didn't quite get it, or the just make stupid decisions for stupid reasons, even though the really should have known better—like with Star Fox Zero.
A whole lot of casuals clearly do enjoy Just Dance, but I still say they are largely badly designed games (well, talking about the Wii version specifically); it's just that most casuals don't know any better, and the fun they're having largely isn't because of the game design but the situation created around it. You could turn off the game and turn on a karaoke, and they'd have just as much fun. And, if you did that but kept the game running in the background on the TV, they'd probably still think they were playing the game and it was the game that was providing the fun. It's not; it's dancing to cool tunes and being judged for it, in a way that's not too serious.
It's like saying Pokemon Go is a great game just because it's hugely popular. it's not; it's actually a pretty crap game, and it suffers from issues left, right, and centre, including with basic stuff like controls. But, it's great fun to run around outside, looking for stuff, and socialising with other people. Don't, however, mistake that for the underlying game being brilliantly made—that's simply not the case. It's not some 9/10 game. It's maybe a 6/10 game getting by on it's social hook and popularity more than anything else. Although, one could argue that's part of the game design; not me though. Not intrinsically. The game could have just as well be a total flop and no one played it, and that social aspect simply wouldn't exist, because it's not actually part of the actual game. It's a byproduct. Just like being cool in school was a byproduct of playing Pokemon games back in the day—they, however, also happened to be awesome games in their own right too.
Re: Nintendo Entertainment System: NES Classic Edition Gets a Snazzy Trailer and Website
Anyone else notice how all the stuff that capitalises on Nintendo's '80s and '90s period is just rocking it of late (Pokemon Go, the NES Classic Edition, a Zelda game that harkens back to the NES original . . .)?
That's because Nintendo really was at its peak and truly awesome back then, and it still shows even now.
I want that Nintendo again, through and through, and with its new stuff too. That's a Nintendo I can love!
Re: Nintendo Entertainment System: NES Classic Edition Gets a Snazzy Trailer and Website
@gatorboi352 Totally agree. The NES and SNES basically nailed it 100%. The N64 made a few mistake but was still pretty amazing imo. And then each system after that introduced more and more points of contention for me, until it got to where we are today, where I hardly care about its new systems anymore. Hopefully the NX can change that, but I'm not confident of this.
Re: Nintendo Entertainment System: NES Classic Edition Gets a Snazzy Trailer and Website
@Captain_Toad Now everyone will be reminded that Nintendo did actually care about power once upon a time. lol
Re: NES Visual Compendium Dispute Comes To An End, Kickstarter Resumes For Final 24 Hours
So, Nintendo has almost certainly wangled some money out of them. Likely a percentage of every copy sold.
Re: Nintendo Entertainment System: NES Classic Edition Gets a Snazzy Trailer and Website
@Koranos49 Good to hear.
I won't get a NES mini, but I may just get a SNES mini (especially if Nintendo sees fit to do the stuff I've suggested above).
Re: Nintendo Entertainment System: NES Classic Edition Gets a Snazzy Trailer and Website
OK, that official trailer is pretty frikin' awesome!
And, I must admit the system is actually pretty cool (even though I’m still not 100% sold on it just looking like a cheaper and even more “toy” version of the original NES), but I personally think it needs way more games in there (especially since you both can’t use actual NES carts with it or download more games later on either). I also wish there was an option to use the controllers either wired or wireless. And, I do actually wish you could use NES carts directly in it too, just because it would add so much value to the system.
Hopefully, if Nintendo decides to do a similar “SNES mini” in the future, it sees fit to include way more games (maybe closer to a hundred), allows both wired and wireless options for the controllers (it could just allow you to unplug the cable from the back of the controller basically), and let’s you actually plug old SNES carts directly into the thing too, just because it would be super cool. That’s a system I would be very much interested in (although, I couldn’t actually play it on my TV anyway, because I literally only own an old CRT SDTV. Maybe I could plug it into my monitor. . . . )
I'll take back what I originally said about its sales though; I think this thing may indeed just fly off the shelves now—especially if Nintendo's really taking that amazing retro approach with all its marketing and stuff.
Absolutely love that commercial—Nintendo hasn't felt quite like that in years to me (that AWESOME!).
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Project_Dolphin I dunno . . .
Let's say for example that someone comes up with a rule in game design that says when you push up on a controller (d-pad/analog stick) the object should move up, which makes sense and works as expected—and let's assume everyone now follows this rule for the next 20 years—and then someone else suddenly decides that when you push up the object should move left instead, but only once every three pushes.
The original rule works well and makes sense. The new rule still technically works but it simply does not make sense, and 1 in 3 times it would even feel to the player like it wasn't responding properly at all.
So, if we're judging stuff based on things like logic, intuitiveness, common sense, satisfaction, best practice, etc., we can objectively say that doing it the first way is good game design and doing the other way is bad game design—given the premise that one way has long been established as a proven and tested method that works very well (which everyone has now come to understand and expect), and the other isn't and doesn't. Unless of course the designer also intends to reprogram the minds and habits of everyone who plays his games too, just so the new isn't completely wrong to them.
Something like that.
It's just a random example of how it's possible to use well established rules to inform good game design, and how to potentially create bad games if you don't understand those rules and just do everything willy nilly just because. It's taken around 40 years to figure out many of the things that actually work well/best in game design. and that's true of the art, music, animation, level design, controls, gameplay design, story, etc.
And, if I were to objectively judge the first control example vs the second, I would matter of fact judge the first higher/better than the second—and rightly so. Ergo, I would say that objectively speaking the first is good and the second is bad—as judged according to the established rules, best practices, and general principles of good game design—but, each person is still free to like whatever the hell they want.
Re: Nintendo Reconfirms March 2017 NX Launch And Quality Of Life Concept Development
@rjejr lol
Hey, if it helps it sell more NX units. . . .
And, it kinda goes with Nintendo's own past of creating love hotels and love testers too.
Re: Nintendo Reconfirms March 2017 NX Launch And Quality Of Life Concept Development
@aaronsullivan It really is going to be interesting to see what Nintendo ultimately comes out with, and I just hope it isn't totally disappointing. lol
I'll say this much, when everyone was speculating about the original Wii there were some pretty awesome ideas and designs floating around, including my own if I do say so*, and Nintendo still managed to knock it out the park (even if the console ultimately never lived up to its true full potential imo).
But, then again, the Wii U largely ended up falling short of many people's expectations and ultimately didn't really do anything particularly mind boggling either, even though a few games did eventually show off its true potential.
Me, I'm still totally clueless as to what NX is going to be at this point. lol
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Mahe Yeah, it was the Wii version I played. And it's basically the Wii and Wii U versions I'd be talking about in here for the most part, seeing as it's a Nintendo site.
So, has the Wii U version figured out how to use the Wiimote(s) much more effectively? Because, from what I gathered, via an admittedly very quick scan of an article, it uses the same controls as the Wii version (the Wiimote).
Or are you talking about Just Dance on other systems here?
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Project_Dolphin Just want to clarify that I already edited my comment to remove the "sandbox" parts before you replied. I meant the open-world nature of the GTA games rather than the sandbox elements. I actually love sandbox gameplay in general, but I didn't think properly about what I was writing as I put it down and so I fixed it (See; this is why I edit my comments). I just don't care much for large open worlds in general, unless they are handled exceptionally well, in a way that resonates with me.
You do seem to have this terrible habit of not being able to separate someone's own subjective and individual opinion of a game with how the game can be judged in and of itself, on its own merits (based on standard rules and best practices of game design), and more objectively.
So, no; I do not think the GTA games are bad; in fact, I think they are largely very well made (even with the bugs). I simply don't like them personally. Those two things are not one and the same.
The rules are usually determined by the people who created these things from the ground up in the first place, and then the rules are both tweaked and reaffirmed over time as people realise they do in fact work and give the desired results/outcome reliably. These people who came up with the rules established best practices so others could reproduce the same results without having to learn everything from scratch again every time. You know, just like how thousands of years ago we established the rules for writing (Start a sentence with a capital letter, and finish with a full stop.), and if you follow them well your writing can be judged as good, and if you don't it can be judged as bad. But, each individual is still free to enjoy your story exactly as much as they want.
And again, I think those gamers who consider the controls in Just Dance as good—and let's talk specifically about the Wii/Wii U versions in here since this is a Nintendo site—are basically clueless as to what constitutes good controls. Not saying they can't have fun. I am saying they're having fun playing a pretty crappy game (in terms of things like the control and gameplay mechanics, which I personally consider two of the keys to any great game).
This kind of stuff isn't rocket science.
Edit: If what @Mahe says is true, and they've greatly improved the Just Dance games since the Wii version (the only one I've played), I will be willing to concede they may be better games now. Although, I'd have to play them myself to say such a thing and actually mean it.
Re: Hands On: Squashing Space Pirates in Metroid Prime: Federation Force
But why did they have to make the characters stupid frikin' chibi designs!
That's honestly the biggest gripe I have with this game.
Re: Nintendo Reconfirms March 2017 NX Launch And Quality Of Life Concept Development
@rjejr Yeah, I don't think it will be "normal". And my fear is just how not "normal". lol
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Project_Dolphin Well, it's as close to objective fact as a bunch of reviews based on professional opinions can be, and a whole lot more so than your singular subjective opinions.
I just don't really like the gameplay in GTA games. I'm not really into wandering around a huge open world shooting pedestrians or jumping in a car to drive from A to B and that kind of thing. I'm actually not a very open world type of gamer in general, unless there's still some clear path/goal to be followed when I decide I'm bored of just playing around in the world. And I found most of the missions too scripted and forced to really enjoy them.
That analogy does apply. There are literally specific rules to creating a video game (good practices), including the art (as in, there are established rules and techniques for creating art, and the quality of execution of such techniques is largely used to judge it by professional art critics—once you go beyond just "Do you personally like it?"), and you can judge every element of a game, and the whole too, objectively as such*. It's just that most people don't judge things based on the established rules and techniques (good practices), including most professional reviewers; they largely just tell you what they liked and score the game based on their own experience with it and little else.
Much like you appear to do.
*As an example: You might personally like controls that literally don't work properly or as intended, but they are objectively bad/broken controls (as determined by good practice game design rules for controls). So, while people with a clue would call them bad/broken controls, you might say something like "I thought they were kinda fun." Objectively bad controls, subjectively fun.
Re: Nintendo Reconfirms March 2017 NX Launch And Quality Of Life Concept Development
@rjejr Yeah, I've been thinking about this kind of thing for a long time too, many years now. In fact, quite a few of those ideas I have for NX were actually ideas I had for Wii originally (and I don't mean Wii U; I mean Wii).
Nah, I wouldn't be surprised at all if an NX handheld was only at 720p. I was just suggesting what I thought would be a good number based on it being able to run Wii U games directly on the screen and whatever else. But, the Wii U screen isn't even 720p, and it runs Wii U games just fine, so I could totally see the resolution being lower than 1080p. If it were done right, I don't think it would seriously bother me, but I think sometimes it's just good to give people what they actually expect and want rather than what they can tolerate. lol
Shame you didn't really understand all the backwards compatible stuff, as that's a huge point of what makes the idea compelling. lol That and the entire creation suite thing.
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Project_Dolphin Because your assertions about all these AAA games are not just you expressing your opinion; you're stating things as though they are objective fact. And I'm showing you a very simple example of how [as close to] objective fact contradicts your subjective assertions*. Simple really.
Yes, I have played Just Dance. I played it on Wii. And I thought it was total garbage. The songs were of course fun, but the game isn't automatically fun because the songs are fun. The game, at least the Wii version (and presumably the Wii U version too, seeing as it uses the same control /interaction method), was clunky crap that registered your motions/actions so arbitrarily that you might as well just dance around without touching the controller at all. That's not good game design; it's casual junk that ignorant gamers mistake for good game design.
If you want to talk about shovelware, Just Dance is a great example imo. Ubisoft is indeed "shovelling out" those games; 27 of them since 2009 (and they're not exactly screaming "quality"): Just Dance (video game series)
And, let me put it out there again: Most of those people that think Just Dance is a good game are too ignorant to know any better. You could turn off any interaction at all and just pretend they were playing, and they would literally believe it was just as fun and that they were actually playing it. But, you seem incapable of grasping that some people are simply clueless casuals who ultimately don't know crap. They're the type of people who think pressing a single button for infinity is a fun game, as long as you play a "ting" sound and display a "Congratulations! +100" popup every once in a while (I'm using terrible mobile games as a reference point here). They are basically incapable of judging what is and isn't a good game.
*If you understand that you can subjectively judge something—which clearly you do, because you're doing it when you claim all these AAA games are bad—then you have to also understand that this means there are objective measures by which things can be judged (How is it fun? Why is it not good? What measure/metric are you using to call it shovelware?). And therefore, when 99 out of 100 people have used very similar metrics/measures to judge something as good, even though this is contrary to your own judgement, you just need to accept that your opinion maybe isn't very true to the objectively reality of the situation.
If 99 out of 100 people tell you something is red, but you see it as blue, it's almost certainly red and you are simply colour blind—not, it's blue to you and red to everyone else. That's not how the world works; you don't get to say you're not colour blind just because that's what you'd like to believe personally. Or, do so—you crazy person. lol
Metacritic is simply a better indicator/measure of a game's more objective quality than you (because it aggregates multiple professional opinions together and then averages them out to remove outliers)—irrespective of each person being entitled to their own personal opinions and tastes of whatever games—and that's just a fact you're maybe going to have to accept.
Re: Nintendo Reconfirms March 2017 NX Launch And Quality Of Life Concept Development
@rjejr Yeah, I knew about it—as in, I'd seen it before. But, unfortunately for you, I'm not convinced this is what the NX is going to be. Or, at least, I personally hope it's not that kind of thing—not based on what I've seen of these types of devices anyway (these tablets with controller attachments).
There's a chance it could work if done right, and I mean if it's done RIGHT; and it's actually quite similar to one of my own ideas for NX in principle, although different enough from it at the same time, but I'm not convinced the particular solution you envision, as least based on your examples, is the way to go. Similarly, I'm not entirely convinced of my own idea anymore either:
http://www.inceptional.com/2015/06/26/heres-the-gist-of-my-idea-for-nintendos-nx/ (this is one of my ideas for what NX could be)
I guess we'll see. . . .
PS. The fact the Wikipad went basically completely unnoticed for the most part should probably tell us something. Sure, it didn't have Nintendo's name on it, but still. I think we might all be barking up the wrong tree—although I really have no clue at this point.
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Mahe Yeah!
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Project_Dolphin Dude, I think you seriously have everything back-to-front. And, I think at this point you're simply far too committed to your apparent hatred for AAA developers/games to see it. You really need to stop confusing a few bugs in these big AAA titles with them being bad games.
If you actually think games like The Division, Destiny, and The Last of US are bad games, you are literally clueless about what constitutes a good or bad game, or you're just really, really biased in your views. You not liking these games does not translate into them being bad games, or anywhere close to it. A game like The Last of Us doesn't get a 95 on metacritic, with only a single review dropping below the positive scoring range, based on some kind of mass blind-fanboyism for movie-like presentation and gorgeous visuals only. It's just absurd to believe that's the case.
I don't disagree that these big publishers know that presentation and graphics are important in getting lots of mainstream gamers excited about their products out-the-gate, be they good or bad, but that doesn't automatically equate to them only making pretty looking but bad games as a standard course of business, which is what you seem to think. I mean, if you seriously believe the developers of the three games I just mentioned weren't trying to create 90+ scoring games, then again, you are truly clueless. And, that's not me trying to insult you and cause an argument, or whatever; that's me stating what I believe would be a literal fact in this case.
Here's a more objective list of actual crap games:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_games_notable_for_negative_reception
Here's a more objective list of actual good games:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_games_considered_the_best
Don't confuse the two just because you have some hate of modern AAA titles or whatever.
I mean, I don't like the GTA games, and they often have loads of bugs and stuff, but that doesn't make them anywhere close to being bad games; they're just not my cup of tea.
And, I generally hate the Call of Duty games, but if I'm being real honest here, they're actually well made games, which simply cater to a very specific type of player that's not me.
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Mahe If you're into gimmicky casual stuff where your actions hardly even register (especially on the Wii/Wii U versions) so you might as well just be dancing to karaoke without the interactive video game part of it at all, sure. I mean, I'm certainly not arguing that dancing to good music isn't fun.
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Project_Dolphin But it also makes the incentive to make them good much higher too, especially for these big developers who actually want to make money on their games. If a game can be churned out with minimal effort and make an easy profit, you're far less likely to bother too much about making it the best it can be, than if a game takes six years to make at a budget of hundreds of millions. That's just simple logic.
And, for an indie developer, their little game that maybe cost a few tens of thousand of pounds is often the equivalent of Ubisoft's multi-million dollar titles—often meaning total collapse for these indies if the title fails to sell—hence they too also try to make them the best they can be.
Shovelware basically means churned out crap*, and if a game costs one of these massive publishers peanuts and only takes a handful of guys to make, and can be resold every few months or so also, it's usually more likely to be some churned out crap, especially when it's licensed too; not always, but generally speaking.
*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shovelware
Re: Gallery: A Closer Look at the Latest Additions to Pokémon Sun and Moon
@Ogbert "Also I feel like since they've been able to animate sprites we're seeing a lot more with concepts that really need that movement to truly be appreciated. "
Yeah, but that kinda goes to my point: The best character designs shouldn't only look good in motion, they should look good regardless, even in silhouette—that's basically the dictionary definition of a good/strong character design.
A really great character design should actually suggest the likely motion too, just by the look and pose, even in a static image. Like, you at least know a Diglett doesn't move just by looking at it (apart from maybe popping up/down or in/out of the ground, like one of those Whack a Mole games), right? You know Snorlax is just gonna lay about doing nothing, right? You know Charizard is an awesome dragon that's gonna fly around and attack you with fire, right? And you know Magikarp is just gonna flop around helplessly, and then . . . it totally blew your mind when it evolved, because its unevolved state made you think it was totally gormless and useless.
Everything matters: Colours, proportions, pose, characteristics, line of action, silhouette, expression, overall aesthetic appeal, etc.
Re: Nintendo Reconfirms March 2017 NX Launch And Quality Of Life Concept Development
@rjejr I honestly don't really know at this point.
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Project_Dolphin The problem here, as I see it, is that you are considering a game that takes probably less than 6 months to make, is churned out likely multiple times a year, and is full of extremely shallow and usually quite clunky design and gameplay, is somehow the same kind of "shovelware" as a game that took like 6 years to make, with a budget and resources tens times as high, and with a level of depth and breadth that is on a whole other level.
There's actual shovelware, and then there's your examples of "shoveware", where you're just lumping the likes of The Division, Watch Dogs, The Last of Us, and Destiny in the same league as actual shovelware, or at least stuff that's just generally mass produced meh, which is a bit of a joke really.
You might not realise this, but I think it's you that has some major bias and distortion of reality going on here.
The Let's Dance games are basically shovelware, although certainly not the worst of it (RCXMDXX, or whatever he's called, is often guilty of churning out REAL shovelware; but at least he's not a developer with multiple billions of dollars and near-endless resources at his disposal, so he kinda has an excuse). The likes of The Division, Watch Dogs, The Last of Us, and Destiny, however, don't even come close to being shovelware, regardless of them not being perfect or the kinds of games you personally like.
I want actual quality on the NX too, but let's be honest here: These big AAA games are far, far more likely to get close to providing that than yearly (at least) churned out casual junk like Just Dance. And, that is in no way saying that I think more casual experiences can't be great games too, because they can (Wii Play: Tanks, Wii Sports: Bowling, Nintendogs, Brain Training, Cut The Rope, Tetris, World of Goo, Kirby's Epic Yarn, etc.), but there's great casual games and not so great casual games too (anything Petz, anything Kardashian, Farmvile, any of those App coin grabbers, Pet Baby, E.T. etc).
So, let's start talking about actual shovelware here, if that's what we're meant to be talking about. And, sadly, there was plenty of that on Wii—maybe not the worst ever, but more than on most of the other platforms from my recollection. And there was a distinct lack of the great AAA third party games too.
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Project_Dolphin I agree, it shouldn't be just about the business. And that's generally what I mean when I say the third party support on Wii was crap. Yeah, there were actually quite a lot of third party games on the system before it died a very quick death, but it was mostly shovelware and gimmicky crap, like you said, unfortunately. That's not what I want to see on NX, and Ubisoft's recent quote does nothing to calm any fears I might have of it happening again.
Re: Zelda: Breath Of The Wild Delays Partly Due To Developers "Breaking" The Game, Says Eiji Aonuma
@ThanosReXXX Exactly.
My frustration, however, is that this really should have been on Wii U already. It could have been so awesome with that GamePad used properly.
Still, if we get it on NX, I'll at least be a bit happier.
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@IceClimbers Indeed.
I mean, there's no reason Nintendo couldn't get a whole lot of the core gamers back, but not if it keeps making the same mistakes over and over again.
And those casuals really aren't very reliable, even if you do treat them well for the most part.
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Project_Dolphin You don't have to be impressed by it, but they're getting it. And, while Wii U will almost literally fall off the face of the Earth once NX comes out--unless it does something that could give the Wii U more life--you can be pretty sure the competition's consoles will be seeing strong third party support for many years to come, even after the next-gen consoles come out. And that is not something to just sniff off lightly. It's just one of the many reasons why Nintendo consoles in recent times simply have no represented as strong value propositions as the competition.
You're right though, the list does absolutely go on.
And, I've not blamed the Wiimote for any developer's inability to make a good game. I've blamed the numerous issues with Wii overall as one of the reasons why developers didn't make games for it in general, and certainly not many good games. But, to be clear, there are still issues with the Wiimote itself in terms of just putting off many developers and whatever else. It has its strengths too though.
Re: Zelda: Breath Of The Wild Delays Partly Due To Developers "Breaking" The Game, Says Eiji Aonuma
@-DEMISE- Possibly. But, the fact there's guys on the dev team who even say such things in the first place, such that someone else has to step in with a bit more sense.
Re: Nintendo Reconfirms March 2017 NX Launch And Quality Of Life Concept Development
@aaronsullivan God knows what it is or could be at this point. I have no clue. lol
"Or it's just Ubisoft being pleased that Just Dance continues to fit nicely with it somehow."
That's something that genuinely worries me at this point and based on the quote.
Re: Zelda: Breath Of The Wild Delays Partly Due To Developers "Breaking" The Game, Says Eiji Aonuma
@ThanosReXXX Yeah, all I would really add is full 1080p 60fps visuals, online competitive racing (and still have split-screen too), a possible track editor (which would make total sense if it were on Wii U because we could use the GamePad to easily "draw" tracks and stuff), a decent story mode with high quality and generally pretty straight-laced presentation, a possible OPTIONAL tilt-control scheme (if on Wii U, and if NX uses tilt controls at all), and just a few other little tweaks here and there.
Re: Nintendo Reconfirms March 2017 NX Launch And Quality Of Life Concept Development
@rjejr Yes, absolutely; I believe quite a few of the rumours we've heard and patents we've seen around NX actually have nothing to do with NX at all. It is, however, a total lottery as to which ones. lol
Re: Nintendo Reconfirms March 2017 NX Launch And Quality Of Life Concept Development
'"brand new" concept'
Again, this still kinda worries me.
Because, to me, I'm just affraid that ultimately translates into "gimmick* that will likely on really appeal to and satisfy casuals or the most loyal fanboys, and something that most third parties and AAA developers simply won't give a flying **** about".
I'm worried, for sure.
*Doesn't mean the underlying idea isn't potentially great, but I'm saying it likely won't realise its full potential and therefor will never be truly satisfying; just like the Wii with its Wiimote and the Wii U with its touchscreen GamePad failed to ever really reach their full potentials as far as I'm concerned, and therefore they were both ultimately disappointing and mostly unsatisfying.
Re: Video: We Need To Talk About Ghostbusters 2 On The NES
To be clear, the new Ghostbusters' issues don't all stem from the fact it's an all female cast; it's a whole lot of crap that makes this movie look bad, although an all female cast is actually a small part of it too.
From everything I've seen thus far, it's just looking to be a pretty **** movie all-round: Bad special effects (way too obvious cgi), idiotic conceits (Do you really believe a bunch of supposedly intelligent scientist types, female or otherwise, would hire what amounts to a mentally ******** secretary?), some really stupid new items (only there for the toys angle), some terrible acting (especially OTT on Leslie Jone's side of things), blatant and intentional sexism (which, funnily enough, wasn't a real thing in the first movie), and yes, even making the cast all females blatantly just to make some social commentary (this is patently obvious if you look at all the other aspects of the film; mentally ******** male secretary, shooting end baddie in **** to defeat it, girls making jokes about stuff happening "because I'm a woman or black", etc.)
Ghostbusters 2016 just looks like a **** movie; and the PR/marketing men and a mass of easily "guided" social media sheep can't deflect all that by trying to pretend it was all just because everyone's sexist and racist—they can shove that kind of ******* spin and deflection right up their ***.
It's all very much like the way this Ghostbusters 2 game was likely **** purely because it was ****.
These turds need to own their *******.
Re: Japanese Launch Of Pokémon GO Delayed Due To McDonald's Email Leak
@JHDK lol
Re: Video: This Is What The Next Generation Of Pokémon GO Could Look Like
@TheWPCTraveler Well, that I can understand. I can totally get how some people prefer smartphone/tablet gaming similarly. Not me personally, but some people.
Re: Ubisoft CEO Says Nintendo NX Will Help Grow The Industry And Pull In Casual Players
@Project_Dolphin You seem to be ignoring the fact that those other consoles are still seeing support even now, whereas Wii basically died a death the moment Wii U was announced. Whether you get it or not, that kind of stuff makes a huge difference to most gamers beyond the most blindly loyal Nintendo fans—a near ten year lifespan vs a 5 or so year lifespan (even when the machine is one of the most successful consoles of all time).
And I've said this many times before too, I'm calling out Nintendo's particular issues because this is a Nintendo site; it doesn't mean the other guys were perfect, but if I wanted to call them out I'd do it on a Sony or Microsoft site for the most part.
Also, I never claimed the Wiimote was the cause of all the Wii's issues; I simply claimed the Wii had a lot of issues. The Wiimote caused some of the Wii's issues, but its problems go far beyond the Wiimote—and Ubisoft claiming NX is going to "bring casuals back in" just makes me worry it might end up suffering many of the same issues as Wii. I'm complaining because Wii was disappointing in so many ways it's not even funny.
Re: Zelda: Breath Of The Wild Delays Partly Due To Developers "Breaking" The Game, Says Eiji Aonuma
"someone else may say, 'no, actually, that's already been done in another game'"
That's such a stupid way of thinking, imo. It's cool to want to do new stuff, but thinking you can't really do something if someone else has done it, is just stupid. And, of course it would be ideal to take cool ideas and always try to do them slightly differently, but that shouldn't be some kind of steadfast mantra. Some ideas exist because they work.
This kind of thinking is why we still haven't seen a new F-Zero; and F-Zero really deserves a new game, and it could still be totally great even in 2016, with largely the same formula and just a few extras here and there.
Ultimately, I'm fine with seeing stuff that's been done before, especially if it's been done really well.
Re: Zelda: Breath Of The Wild Delays Partly Due To Developers "Breaking" The Game, Says Eiji Aonuma
Ya know, I really hope there's flying through the skies (maybe even on Loftwings) and sailing on the seas in the game too, just like in Skyward Sword and Wind Waker. It would be really cool if all the different elements from previous games were fully realised in this world.