@electrolite77 @Cobalt My theory is more along the lines of a Nintendo Switch Pro and a 4k Dock Home Console launch with VR being the main selling aspect. Meanwhile PS5 will have VR baked into its hardware and Xbox Scarlet is an attempt at a cheaper Switch that is a streaming console.
@Camilla @Wanjia I am going from a different angle and I think a game's file size would be the easiest explanation to why Nintendo isn't getting the game. No third party game is bigger then 32GB as of yet and Nintendo is planning to introduce a 64GB cartridges in 2019 possibly with the rumour new SKU. The 32GB really puts the Switch at a sweet spot somewhere between the PS3 and PS4 which is approximately where it sits in terms of power.
@EightBitMan seems to be very critical of the Switch but Nintendo actually put the best chip it can into such a small handheld and the results showed. A PS3 Pro in the palm of your hands. (It is actually 1TFLOPs docked!) The only thing they could have done better was go Tegra X2 with a 6 months delayed launched.
@FragRed @Spoony_Tech @1UP_MARIO Not really. I agree with @Kirby-in-Kirkby.
Its an interesting fact but the lesser product tends to sell better then the superior product. In marketing it is known as Blue Ocean Strategy.
Just look at how "impressive" McDonalds and fast food chains outsell fine dinning and organic home made food chains and you might not find it as impressive anymore.
I'm with the finer dining restaurants...all the way.
It works basically the same way.
Case in point, I was more interested in the Wii then my parents, sister and grandparents were. They were all more interested in Sony's system because it was an all-in-wonder. Asked them what they think the future of gaming is and they say VR and Holograms.
Casuals knows what they want while hardcore are more invested in odd gimmicks like gameplay.
Blue Ocean products are very successful in their own right. The PlayStation-line is basically a glorified CD, DVD, Blu-Ray player which happens to also play games, movies, etc. PSP was a better GBA. Move was a generic version of the Wii Motes.
I would say that from a marketing perspective, Sony is far more successful and will continue to be. Sony is also the only entertainment company that makes their own hardware.
Mass marketing is the key.
In fact, I believe the rumour that PlayStation 4 might have VR baked right in.
I think Nintendo will be forever stuck this way. They products are Red Ocean set pieces masterfully done and targeted at a casual core audience. They are like Apple, kings of reinventing the wheel.
The Switch is another one of this. Ask a casual what they think of the system vs someone who is a hardcore. My sister for example says it is targeting the same core audience and doesn't entice someone like her to buy though she really like Zelda.
For what it is, it is very powerful but it is a hard sell. It won't flop but it isn't going to compete as well as one might think.
@Razer @NEStalgia @Heavyarms55 I could disagree with both of you but I think it will fall on mute ears.
China is a technocracy, it means it priorities technology above pretty much everything else. I would argue that China is actually a nation in decline.
If you think of it like art, you can't steal art even when you have the skills to replicate the art yourself...which is no easy feat. There are artists these days that make a living copied famed artists of years pasts. You see this in visual arts but its also called pop art/music.
Technology on the other hand is much easier to replicate...at least certain part of it. This is the stealing you call but it isn't necessarily so.
I remember reading somewhere about how to launch a successful business and the first thing they mention is to not think that anyone is stealing anything. A good idea cannot be copied.
A lot of times many people come up wit the same / similar things but an outstanding idea is one that people can't easily replicate.
Also it is often the "leader" who falls behind.
Using consoles as an example, Sony showed off that patent of theirs that was similar to the Nintendo Switch but not really.
Most successful companies follow what is called a Blue Ocean Strategy in which they make the competitors irrelevant but that usually requires an outstanding idea as I said before.
That's to say Sony probably had a similar idea but it was too generic for their taste to launch to market.
So it wouldn't be too "mindblowing" for Sony to seemingly copy the Switch and launch their patented device.
It works pretty much the same way with the PlayStation, PlayStation Move and the PlayStation Portable. These devices have been working on for some time.
On the one hand, it looks like Sony "copied" Nintendo, on the other, Sony simply didn't have that unique touch that they were looking for an so went back to R&D with the device.
Ironically, Sony is an iconic engineering brand / entertainment company that manufactures its own hardware, is it not?
Strange how that works.
How Nintendo is "out-innovating" Sony or so it seems.
Going back to China, it is more the same.
@NEStalgia The reason why China is being hated by Chinese people is because they wanted China to adapted the more modern and popular American model of living all for the sake of their children and the next generation. They don't want Chinese children to be treated as second class citizen and whatever else.
China is a nation on decline. It has been since the Ming Dynasty. They basically invented everything back in the day and it was copied by the West so what the different between then and now?
That said, you are also right. Western Imperialism has taken over and China is adopting its model to survive. I think the whole freedom thing is just thrown around by powers of all sides to prove their point. China is plenty free practically speaking.
Don't forget the Roman Empire which SPAWNED from so called Roman democracy. You really think if the West ruled the World, there wouldn't be a second Rome?
The Roman West conquered Egypt and basically uses the same trick on the Egyptians and their Gods. I think China might fall to the ground for the same reasons and might never come back. (This goes more into speculative history, Biblical prophecies and why I think the West will end up ruling the world.)
Going back to the console wars, this is the same thing as the Switch vs consoles.
The Switch is not without it detractors. Nor are consoles.
As @EightBitMan puts it: I am absolutely disgusted by the current state of this company; the exploitation of consumers, the promises they make and break, the lies they spread, and the treatment of core gamers by delivering ridiculous hardware. Unacceptable. I want a better Nintendo, not this disgraceful, anti-consumer company.
Yet this is all perspective.
If the Switch succeed and someone like Sony continues to make standard consoles people would probably complain then too. That said, more often then not, it is the lesser products that succeed in marketing as I mentioned before.
The Blue Ocean Strategy.
In years to come, who will become the irrelevant one?
Only time will tell.
For now all we know is that people are still doing business with Nintendo and China.
Edit: Remember all that talk and rumour about Nintendo going third party?
Well I feel the situation is with China is the same.
I think I must be the only guy who think Nintendo is actually at the strongest they've ever been. This IS them. They are getting some third party support for the Switch, more then before anyway and making some easy money. Nintendo is set for twenty years just selling Switches alone. What happens after is another story.
What you want to play is a Sony game. Sony can easily roll out a generic version of the Switch and sell millions. Blue Ocean Strategy style.
In China's case, it is the same thing, you don't want to be the silent inventor forever, you gain nothing for it especially back in the day when patents don't exist.
Oh, I have a bunch of paper patents that said I invented this or that. So what?
What you want to be is the guy who can easily adapt to any technological change in the environment and this is what China is today.
Let the other guy roll out the innovations, I can handle it, copy it, replicate it with ease. That's true power there.
@sixrings @electrolite77 I know its kinda irrelevant to what you guys have said but I would like to see a PSP-like device from Nintendo. The GameBoy Advance was doing so good in terms of its games and was getting there then life was cut short and replaced by the DS. The DS was more like a reboot (GameBoy 2.0 if you will) then a sequel even though it could play most your GameBoy Advance games and is more comparable to the Wii-line. It found a new Blue Ocean and had essential games but was lacking something. 3DS continues this trend and was more comparable to a DS version of the Game Boy Color. It'll be interesting to see if history repeats itself with Nintendo rolling out a 4DS which doesn't sell as well but has the game catalogue of a GBA/GC then Sony jumping in and taking the market by storm with a DS-like device.
@sixrings @electrolite77 Yes and no. Actually mathematically speaking the returns should technically be the same because 4k is 4x 1k but we haven't got there yet. So it should look like 480p jump to FullHD as FullHD is to 4k. Because of the way the game is designed, Metroid Prime will probably be that series where we can compare the differences (or the lack there of) between Metroid Prime Trilogy (480p upscaled to FullHD), Metroid Prime 4 (HD/FullHD) to Metroid Prime Future (4k). Once we get past 4k I'm sure we'll have to start using our imaginations again to think of stuff to put into digital universes that isn't doable in real life. You will notice a difference with late 4k games to 1k games in terms of background environments and details and what not. That said, we have to get more creative then that from there. Maybe instead of making it visually more impressive someone will implement say a system similar to our DNA strand. It might not change the visual appeal very much but it'll make games more interesting again and use up complex resources like that. Just like 8 bit to 16 bit games again. The jump isn't about seeable graphics necessarily though we can tell a difference it more about what else we can do with it thus the diminishing returns argument. Our visual cap is limited only by our imagination.
As for the game being very low resolution/framerate, it was kind of a "lazy" port. The engineer showed results in one day...but I guess that's because in a game like this people don't care. Unlike the other two (Xbox and PlayStation), I doubt Activision even has an engine specifically designed for any Nintendo system because they keep changing their damn architecture all the time. There's a reason why the other two have specs similar to that of a PC and are almost exactly the same as each other....because they design their system around getting third party ports who develop for the PC primarily. Its the same reason why Apple took forever to get Photoshop running native on the Mac despite having arguably the more powerful hardware. Nintendo will have to stick to their guns for at least a generation if they want third party onboard the hype train. I would argue the Switch is like a GameBoy 3.0 and like the GameBoy, how many non-Nintendo games do you remember playing on there honestly? (Especially visually impressive ones or groundbreaking titles?) The Advanced was much better and my favourite of the lot but short lived and didn't arguably have as many Nintendo titles. Then the PSP came along and finished the job while Nintendo moved on to the DS. I suspect that for the Switch something similar might happen.
@Cobalt I have Pikmin 3 and have played Pikmin 3. I would say its the best in the series and one of my favourite games of all time but its not a new IP was my point. Pikmin 3 was worth getting a Wii U over but clearly a lot of people don't feel that way otherwise it would have sold more then it did. You've got to understand things from someone else's framework in order to convince them otherwise. Unless I'm mistaken, which I could be in this case, I was stating that I am generally an elitist of modern society which is about acceptance of others cultures and difference of opinion unlike a classic elitist which were experts of a specific niche. Although I'm probably a bit of both. I live in Australia and come from a family with a music and alternative medicine background and can play the piano though haven't in years. I myself come from an IT background and want to get into the game industry. I also enjoy all forms of music, games, films, food and general entertainment. As for McDonalds I mean that I am lucky enough to have a fast metabolism and can appreciate junk but that said, I do eat pretty healthy as well. Also my point there was that their apple pies is something unique to McDonalds and a finer point to wanting to eat there even if it is junk. Sometimes you've got to look at things from multiple angles. Sorry for the verbose rants but I tend to do that when I am deconstructing what people are saying to make sense of what they are trying to say. I try to be reasonable and understand what they are saying instead of disagreeing with someone outright.
@Cobalt As for music you might feel that most music has junk that is true but going with that comment, some music will then be more junk then others. No different from saying "eating out isn't good for you but McDonald's is the worst."
But that's unimportant anyway, if I was to eat at McDonald's what would I eat? That's a more important question to ask. I like their apple pies and soft serve. What sort of junk you like then? I personally don't mind Jackson but prefer pop, rock and metal like The Beatles, U2, Muse, Dream Theater, Within Temptation and Diablo Swing Orchestra, etc. I found them to be far more innovative and more open to influences from other genres. I'm okay with pop bands like CHVRCHES and the occasional Taylor Swift song. I'm not a big fan of pop and R&B music as I don't feel there is much "music" involved. The music is often secondary focus to the vocal performances of the said individual or the lyrical writing of the producers. I didn't come here to say Jackson is a random dude who is a nobody without his producers, that's what you said about Bieber but not what I said, I came saying that Jackson makes pop music and that all pop musicians rely on some degree the marketing of these labels just like most bands. The reason why I said it is because often this reliance is blown way out of proportion when the artists is disliked by someone and vise versa when simply put that is not true. As I said, I know people who will say Bieber is "revolutionary" with his pop and R&B music. They too are musicians and have studied music. If I was going to go with facts then Bieber also co-writes and produces a small amount of his music while Jackson didn't write ANY nor produce ANY of his earlier music. It wasn't until 1979's "Off the Wall" where he took off because he wrote his own music and started to produce some of them himself. So what is your point? Because from what I can see he was created by the industry.
Like all industries its good to have rules but the importance is that these rules should allow us to co exist with other people's music and games and to tolerate their tastes and fashion.
Not the other way round.
I consider myself an elitist and its hard being a modern elitist for that reason. Sometimes you have to tolerate uninformed opinions and "racism" as I would like to call it.
If I personally feel something is junk I try to not make a big deal out of it and try to understand why this junkie exist beyond trying to make a living out of selling crap.
Maybe they do truly appreciate art and want to be part of the curb and cannot contribute in the way a normal artist would.
Going back to Nintendo that's to say that next to Sony they can't compete with them on a hardware level or Microsoft on a software level...but they'll give a shot and provide a unique experience along the way.
So does that make Nintendo crap now because it can't compete with Sony in the hardware division and Microsoft in its online services and software division? What happen if like the Wii U and Switch drop the ball with their marketing techniques and its awesome gameplay and unique games?
@Cobalt I don't think you are understanding what I am saying. Did I mention Mario or Zelda? No. I mentioned Pikmin 3 which is akin to Pikmin but in HD. They could have called it Pikmin HD and people won't really be able to tell the difference. This is how some of my friend's feel and I can understand it from that stand point because from their perspective they've played a Mario game already. I just said we are comparing apples to apples. And a Mario game is still a platformer no matter the changes. Whether they love or hate platformers, the point becomes mute unless they are open to see the game's innovations or understand its changes but then the same can be said about Remasters and HD Remakes.
You yourself said you don't like Wii U ports for the Switch. Well one could feel the same way about Mario. See the double standards there? How is that any different?
You: Mario Kart 8 is available for the Wii U. Lame.
Them: Mario Kart 8 is still a Mario Kart game. Lame.
Just as Wii U ports aren't convincing you, the same franchises aren't convincing them. They just have a different standard to you. That's not to say they don't like Mario or can't see the changes between Mario 64 and Sunshine. Those are two different things. Maybe they just don't care about the changes. Just as I couldn't care less if you like or not like Mario or whether you feel its the same game or not.
Seriously, there's been like 7 to 13 Assassin's Creed on the PlayStation 4/Xbox One and going by that logic none of them are the same game. Can you tell me how Mario is not the same game but Assassin's Creed is?
So again is your point that the Wii U has Mario as an exclusives vs 13 games which were innovative for its time? What sort of identity is that?
The bitter truth is that Mario isn't out innovating 13 Assassin's Creed games. Nintendo simply does not have that development power nor want to spam us with the same titles over and over so they take more of an "innovation" in one hit approach. They're playing catchup and are rather quite slow.
If I gave you $10 and you spend it all to make $13. Then good on you.
If I gave you $10 and you spend $1 to make $2 and you did this 10x who's the winner?
Just look at their consoles. They take 5-6 years to R&D and by the time it comes out, the hardware is dated. Sony and Microsoft on the other hand uses hardware that are more within 3 years of hardware iterations.
Some people say the reason for this is because Nintendo might not be what they are used to be anymore but one thing is that they try to play fair and punch above their weight.
The Wii U could have sold more if it had a better identity. It was a confusing mess and while 15 million is probably not a failure, depending on their R&D costs, I wouldn't say it was a runaway success. If there were more exclusives that showcase its dual screen and off TV play. If it was the more powerful system and got more third party. It was like most Nintendo systems, a mediocracy of success. A survivor in the deadly realms of the video games business.
Think of a 2k Switch which had Kindle-like apps, Netflix, Apple TV like features, a 4k dock, etc. That's a complete package right there. There's no excuses not to play Nintendo even if I'm not a big gamer or the most uber hardcore of gamer or portable fan. Instead we got a mainstream core-focused 720p console with no Netflix and Kindle apps. No 4k dock. No 4DS. With PS5 and XBOX Too just around the corner. Its like the Wii all over again.
Iwata himself said that they consider the war won with Sony and Microsoft and want to compete with the likes of Apple but their sales number aren't reflecting that. Unless they change their business practices overnight, Nintendo will remain the underdogs...and even then there's nothing wrong with that.
I understand what you're saying but have a different reasoning and understanding of the situation. You're saying the Switch has "no identity" and that it doesn't have the games it needs to make the big push to completely "destroy" the competition. Instead we're getting last gen ports.
Whereas I think one of the reason Nintendo is doing what they are doing is because they are staying true to themselves and playing fair game. They're not here to destroy the competition but coexist with them. They're not doing a PS3 and rolling out theoretical consoles that claim to be more powerful then the competition but is hard to program for because no one has heard of the "Cell" processing unit before. Nintendo just doesn't do that. They're developers of the Blue Ocean Strategy not a King of the Hill strategy. They believe the ocean is big enough for everyone to exist in it and for everyone to have their niche.
The Switch like the U before it will achieve mediocracy success for what it is.
@Cobalt I dunno if you misread but as I stated only about 4-6 of those games you listed were true console platform exclusives to the Wii U.
Most of the rest have appeared on other consoles BEFORE hand. Pikmin for example is initially a GameCube game, not a Wii U game. The GameCube came out in 2001. 'The Last of Us Part II' is a Sony platform exclusive but it is still a 'Last of Us' game. I wouldn't use that as an example of exclusivity of the PlayStation 4 if someone has played 'the Last of Us' on the PlayStation 3. Your point just become mute. You're not convincing me to buy a PlayStation 4 for "new experiences" but rather another sequels to it. I would consider 'Heavy Rain' and 'Indigo Prophecy' the same vain.
If comparing Sony to Nintendo then I might but we're on a Nintendo website and comparing apples to apples. Even then the point becomes mute if I listed all 3 Uncharted as the "greatest PlayStation games ever" because it seems like I don't have anything else to offer.
So if you consider 'Pikmin 3' an "exclusive" just because Nintendo made it for the Wii U and gave it a different tag then you have to consider 'Mario Kart 8 Deluxe' an enhanced port and also an exclusive which makes things complicated...
An enhanced port is not the same as a straight up port. Like Twilight Princess HD is not Twilight Princess. Hyrule Warriors Definitive Edition is not Hyrule Warriors, etc.
The game and its storyline as well as the graphics has changed? Is it still the same game?
See how I'm beating a dead horse?
When talking exclusives it should be fresh AND great new IPs or its nots.
As my comment stated Nintendo already has 4-6 exclusives for the Switch. Even if I include Mario, Pikmin, Zelda and some of the rest, you're still comparing 1 year to 5 years worth of effort.
Also as I stated a lot of the games came BEFORE or from other platforms like Monster Hunter Tri was a Wii game then 3 and 4 Ultimate were also 3DS games.
These games are not real exclusives but sequels to games or are other platforms. Also a lot of things you state are simply opinions and not facts. While Jackson was said by some to be a prodigy, he relies as much on his producers and record companies for his music as with many bands and artists. Personally, I prefer rock and metal music and European music over American music in general and would say that he is not as good as most of these rock musicians preceding and came after him. I listen to everything from classical music to things like avant-garde metal and I doubt that a someone who thinks Michael Jackson is a genius has such a wide range of tastes. The same critic you use to praise Jackson compared to Bieber's is what I'm using to dismiss his status. In the end he writes pop music and pop music is mostly akin to trash.
See again how it works?
Also I know several people who would call Bieber "revolutionary", does that make them right?
These things are in the end opinions not fact. When it comes to entertainment, the facts can mean very little to someone as it is very subjective. We all know the best games for example don't necessarily sell the most because of the competition alone.
For me, these multi-plats as you call them are showcasing what the Switch can do. They are unique to the Nintendo platform. Every generation there are Nintendo fan and detractors and every generation it is the same: "Nintendo has no games", "Nintendo has too many exclusives".
For once they have more third party then exclusives why is that a bad thing?
And now we have the reverse complain? I don't get it.
This IS the Switches identity.
It is different to that of the Wii U. Multi-plats is not a crime. In fact its a good thing. It means it can reach a larger audience.
Just because something is exclusive doesn't mean it is good or new. As I stated before a lot of what you listed are sequels to old franchises. These are not new experiences. A lot of them are also not that great.
I rather they do away with Bayonetta and just give us a Devil May Cry port for example. The exclusiveness doesn't do anything when it isn't earth shatteringly new and we are getting the same type of gameplay. That's MY point.
I would like a game like Beyond Good and Evil 2 on the Switch for example so its a good thing something like Panic Button exists and something like that can potentially happen.
The Switch's portability and the ability to bring it with you on the go is what is going to sell the Switch.
The Nintendo exclusives will still come but its the third party support that's to look out for.
@Cobalt I'm not sure if you got to my reply yet but most of the Wii U titles you listed were not Wii U exclusive.
"That the identity of those tunes is related to Bieber or that is the identity of Jackson?" First both of them are pop music but that asides, It'll be related to Justin Bieber because the original work differs from it. In this case, the Wii U can do something that the Switch cannot which is to say that a Michael Jackson does Michael Jackson better because of his moonwalk.
I think that is what you're trying to say is that the Wii U can do something the Switch can't. The Wii U has an identity in that sense and games developed for that platform should fit and stay on that platform and not be marketed elsewhere. Sushi Striker for example is a great 3DS game but doesn't work so good on the Switch.
They've essentially replaced their Home Console, the Wii U with the Switch when it isn't really a replacement of sorts. That said, 2018 is not just a great year for the younger generation. There's every thing from Starlink to Fornite to Ys VIII and Tales of Vesperia coming. You've clearly forgotten all the jRPGs coming to the Switch.
@ilikeike That aside, it also has to do with that none of the third parties takes Nintendo seriously or can because they constantly change. They're hard to develop for and best left alone.
A massive title that will sell say 10 million easily will not likely appear on the Switch for one reason, cartridges are expensive. Even at $1 for a 64GB cartridges, I'm going to have to pay up 10 million dollars if my game were to sell that many copies and I don't think any third party is willing to do that upfront.
Thus, most likely I'll want to market a game that can be advertised through either quicker burst marketing or smaller drip marketing.
In other words, I'll rather a smaller AA title that take time to warm up to an audience or an A title that will get people on the hype train quickly and abruptly because its expensive to develop some AAA that does both.
@ilikeike Well sure, none of what you said is wrong but in this day and ages I've given up on massive ports that aren't even that great anyway.
Every generation Nintendo fans say the same things. One of which is "Its a big win to get this third party onboard"....but for what and for how long?
Its like they want their favourite platform to sell through the roof which I get that because I've been there but at what expense?
A lot of fans just hope Nintendo will just serve its niche and be done with that. Every 5 years they're trying to find a new niche in this large blue ocean and it can be frustrating to keep up.
Nintendo isn't even about massive games these days but rather spinoff of massive franchises. Everything they do is about marketing this new niche they've discovered. If people look hard enough they will find that there's never a non-essential Nintendo console because of that reason.
Going back to your point, its a big win but a big lost at the same time since Nintendo fans tend to miss out on a lot of titles. We shouldn't even be talking about Final Fantasy being ported to the Switch in the first place. It should just be normal business as usual like your FIFA and CoD. The latter which appeared on the Wii and now they've stopped getting since CoD Ghosts on the Wii U. Same deal or story there.
With porting, graphics is rarely an issues, if you could port to the Wii in the first place. Its marketing to see if it fits the platform and its audience and that particular side of the blue ocean they've just have discovered. Its like introduce a species to a specific ecosystem. Its got to fit for it risks falling all apart and/or killing off other species already there. Which is why its a pain to heard that developers have not considered a certain game for the Switch or are so called "opened" to opportunity because it means they have other plans in mind.
@ilikeike You really believe those stories? That's just market hype to get people to continue to support Square Enix while they "struggle" to get FF15 to go on the Switch. I wouldn't pick that game as my first game to port if I was Square Enix.
Also, I've more or less moved on from Final Fantasy anyway. I never felt it was that "great" to being with but yeah.
I would honestly rather them port over Star Ocean (series really went downhill), Deus Ex, Life Is Strange, Sleeping Dog, Drakengard, etc make more (and make them available on the Switch), Tomb Raider, Parasite Eve and SaGa titles. Hopefully, get a new Lufia as well. Oh and the Mana series.
Then there's a Nier: Automata which I really want on the Switch...but not likely going to happen because of Square Enix policies.
Oh and revive Psychic Force. That was an awesome title.
@Cobalt Nintendo rehashes their franchises every generation. Name me one console of theirs that doesn't?
Some say the Switch is a Wii U 2.0 but I would argue that its more a GameBoy 3.0. Its more of an evolution of the GameBoy line then a Wii U done right.
At least try to give better examples.
Also its one years worth of content vs 5 years. I own a Wii U btw (several in fact) and have been following the Switch since Day 1 and the Switch wins hand down.
"Bayonetta 2 is a Wii U game."
Based of an older IP which almost died. It is a Platinum Game and isn't Nier: Automata. Bayonetta 3 is also coming to the Switch but Meh.
"Captain Toad Treasure Tracker is a Wii U game."
A great platformer I'll give you that one but again not that unique.
"Zelda Breath of the Wild is a Wii U game."
BotW isn't anything new. It arguably not even the best Zelda game as people claim it to be. The Wii U had 3 Zelda's. 2 of them were HD ports.
"Splatoon is a Wii U game."
The first new IP you've listed.
"Monster Hunter Ultimate is a Wii U game."
Monster Hunter has been around for some time and have been on the PSP and 3DS. The Wii U games are 3DS ports of 3 and 4 Ultimate.
"Hyrule WARRIORS is a Wii U game."
A hack and slash Warriors games. We're not even getting the mainline Warriors games anymore.
"Super Mario Maker is a Wii U game."
Okay, that's a second one.
"Project Zero V is a Wii U game."
Fatal Frame was originally a PlayStation series.
"Tokyo Mirage Session is a Wii U game."
That one is one of those special generational crossovers that was bound to happen. Its based of Shim Megami Tensei and Fire Emblem...neither of which we got on the Wii U (without going into Virtual Console).
"Zombi U is a Wii U game."
An its by Ubisoft designed for the Wii U.
"Lego City Undercover is a Wii U game."
Okay, that got ported to the PS4 and XBOX One and Nintendo Switch.
So totally, you have like 4-6 games on the Wii U that was unique.
That's like one game a year for the Wii U.
The Switch already has:
-Mario + Rabbids Kingdom Battle
-Octopath Traveler (which I'm not a fan of)
-ARMS (also not a fan off)
-Nintendo Labo
-DragonQuest Builders (also a PS3 title)
-Seasons of Heaven (Yes, an odd ball but an exclusive)
-Daemon X Machina (2019, which looks like its going to be amazing)
-and other amazing third party the Wii U can only dream off.
Did I mention the third party?
The Switch has more of an identity then the Wii U especially when it comes to third party.
Does the Wii U have:
-South Park: The Fractured But Whole
-Ys VIII
-Wonder Boy: The Dragon’s Trap
-Super Bomberman R
-Disgaea 5 and 1 Complete
-Valkyria Chronicles 4
How about Doom and Wolfenstein II, L.A. Noire, Rocket League?
Yes, the Wii U also had some third party but it was even more restricted then the Switch and mostly famed western franchises like Mass Effect 3 (Didn't even get the first two).
Also as I stated before did the Wii U get a Fire Emblem? No. A Metroid? Okay it got a Trilogy remix.
Warframe is another win for the Switch. Just as Fornite, Paladin and Arena of Valor was.
The Switch still has 5 years to go to prove itself. I would say that comparing Apples to Oranges (in other words comparing it to the iPad) it is by no means a successful product. The iPad sells 4x as much.
The Wii U also proved itself but failed more so then it succeed.
@westman98 You guys don't play enough jRPGs. NIS America has like over 15 games for the Switch: https://store.nisaeurope.com/collections/switch-1 I think the 6 years thing is to denote that they have a lot of experience compared to other developers. 6 years is a gaming generation so they are trying to denote the fact that they've been working with Nintendo for about a generation.
@ilikeike Where did you get that impression? Square doesn't want mainline Final Fantasy on the Switch. There hasn't been a mainline Final Fantasy game on a Nintendo platform since VI. Why would they change their stance now?
I didn't read through all the comments but am I the only one for this idea?
I have little interest in buying a PlayStation 4 let alone a PlayStation 5. So I would love to see a TV and phone that plays PlayStation games so I don't have to buy another console. I would love to see XBOX provide XBOX Live on everything it can possibly imagine including the Switch. I think Nintendo will also go and make more mobile games and should provide some sort of service where you can steam Nintendo games with or without owning a Switch.
@HobbitGamer @MrGawain @Cobalt @IPrino Hmmm...some great points there but mind you I think why Nintendo won't get those AAA third party is because cartridges are, to this day and age....expensive. That why the experiences they put on the Switch are not AAA titles but smaller bit sizes ones that sell like AA titles. At least no one is pulling a leg here with the console isn't powerful enough crap.
Think about it, even if it only cost $1 more then it does for a 64GB cartridge compared to a 50GB Blu-Ray to produce, and lets say that I know it will sell ten million copies, that's ten million dollars upfront I'll have to pay to get enough copies out in the wild and as a company I'm unwilling to fork out this much money for an investment that might not get the returns it deserves. That's why we are not likely going to see AAA titles on the Switch until much later in the consoles life cycle. The ones that come early on will sell in limited quantities which doesn't help the franchise brand in the long run because developers are looking to sell millions upon millions of copies but without having to pay any upfront cost associated with it.
Keeping stock limited is actually the only way to make sure you get a return on investment but it slows down momentum and doesn't look good for the franchise in the long run. (EG: Say you know you have 500 customers but you only produce 5-50 copies, it'll keep the demand going, sell and you'll make your profit but will limit your potential compared to if you actually had produce 500+ copies. However, I can't "afford" to produce 500+ copies. This is problem and a cycle with Nintendo consoles.) You can't buy what isn't in stock so it doesn't help that the other platforms continues to get the game out earlier and for next to no upfront cost. And by the time that it can sell ten million copies without hiccups, the next generation of consoles are just around the corner. That's why Nintendo will continue to get the AA titles and not the AAA ones.
That said, most AAA titles are impulsive buys from people who either trust the brands that these companies produce or purchased on discounts and never get around to playing it. I suspect that's where the majority of AAA get their sales from. Nintendo also miss out on that because SD Cards can't keep up with HDDs and people are more selective with what they purchase. Nintendo consumers are probably more aware of what they are buying (for themselves or they kids) then those of Sony and Microsoft's.
That's actually why I actually like Resident Evil 7 idea and was surprise this E3 there wasn't a heavy Nintendo focus on Cloud-based games coming to the Switch...but a lot of people are hating on the idea because of what it brings to the industry.
If Nintendo learns from history they will realise that their products look and act timeless and thus should function and be supported as such.
Like Apple, there's nothing wrong with selling both an iPad, iPhone and iPod at the same time.
Think about how cool it would be if a Nintendo 64 had continued till today with modern specs. Or a GameCube. I don't think they would ever have a fail product if they continue to just support them till the end of the earth.
That said, I'll be happy with a 4k Nintendo Switch Dock that focused on specs, streaming and download and ran Nintendo's version of Apple TV, XBOX Live and a Kindle.
@electrolite77 Which is what I suspect is the case.
The 3DS has an advantage over the Switch and that is that it can act as both a classic controller and a phone like device for your smaller pocket. That why it deserves a proper sequel and not a funeral.
I don't get the people that wants the 3DS to rest in peace?
I just don't see how some of the games that are designed for the Dual Screen are going to work as well without it.
Honestly they have two paths to take from here. Roll out one a sequel that is closer to a Nintendo Phone or one that acts as a classical controller killer.
Also, what they might be saying is that they don't plan to make a 4DS and will continue to support the 3DS till death do we part...
If they only stick with the Switch I will Sigh.
Edit: I would say this, even the Wii U still has functionality that is unique and cannot be replaced. I was surprised that they didn't continue to support the Wii U with Switch ports seeing how easy that would have been.
Even if they overlapped in function the fact is that Nintendo needs to realise that they are just selling a product. Its like comparing an iPad mini to an iPhone S. Nothing wrong with two similar products.
@electrolite77 @Jeronan
A lot of people are interested in the classic consoles here.
That said, a $300 4k 12+ TFLOPs Pascal dock would put them right back in the console game.
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Re: Head Of Abstraction Games Addresses Technical Performance Of The Switch
@electrolite77 @Cobalt My theory is more along the lines of a Nintendo Switch Pro and a 4k Dock Home Console launch with VR being the main selling aspect. Meanwhile PS5 will have VR baked into its hardware and Xbox Scarlet is an attempt at a cheaper Switch that is a streaming console.
Re: Ubisoft Will Not Release Rainbow Six Siege On The Nintendo Switch
@Camilla @Wanjia I am going from a different angle and I think a game's file size would be the easiest explanation to why Nintendo isn't getting the game. No third party game is bigger then 32GB as of yet and Nintendo is planning to introduce a 64GB cartridges in 2019 possibly with the rumour new SKU. The 32GB really puts the Switch at a sweet spot somewhere between the PS3 and PS4 which is approximately where it sits in terms of power.
@EightBitMan seems to be very critical of the Switch but Nintendo actually put the best chip it can into such a small handheld and the results showed. A PS3 Pro in the palm of your hands. (It is actually 1TFLOPs docked!) The only thing they could have done better was go Tegra X2 with a 6 months delayed launched.
Re: Nintendo Has Sold Over 700 Million Video Game Consoles To Date
@FragRed @Spoony_Tech @1UP_MARIO
Not really. I agree with @Kirby-in-Kirkby.
Its an interesting fact but the lesser product tends to sell better then the superior product. In marketing it is known as Blue Ocean Strategy.
Just look at how "impressive" McDonalds and fast food chains outsell fine dinning and organic home made food chains and you might not find it as impressive anymore.
I'm with the finer dining restaurants...all the way.
It works basically the same way.
Case in point, I was more interested in the Wii then my parents, sister and grandparents were. They were all more interested in Sony's system because it was an all-in-wonder. Asked them what they think the future of gaming is and they say VR and Holograms.
Casuals knows what they want while hardcore are more invested in odd gimmicks like gameplay.
Blue Ocean products are very successful in their own right. The PlayStation-line is basically a glorified CD, DVD, Blu-Ray player which happens to also play games, movies, etc. PSP was a better GBA. Move was a generic version of the Wii Motes.
I would say that from a marketing perspective, Sony is far more successful and will continue to be. Sony is also the only entertainment company that makes their own hardware.
Mass marketing is the key.
In fact, I believe the rumour that PlayStation 4 might have VR baked right in.
I think Nintendo will be forever stuck this way. They products are Red Ocean set pieces masterfully done and targeted at a casual core audience. They are like Apple, kings of reinventing the wheel.
The Switch is another one of this. Ask a casual what they think of the system vs someone who is a hardcore. My sister for example says it is targeting the same core audience and doesn't entice someone like her to buy though she really like Zelda.
For what it is, it is very powerful but it is a hard sell. It won't flop but it isn't going to compete as well as one might think.
Re: DOOM Eternal Will Raise Hell On Nintendo Switch
@mazz I think @Spoony_Tech thought this was the first Doom?
Edit: Oh, right. The pre-order thing.
Re: Chinese Gaming Giant Appears To Rip-Off Zelda, Mocking Nintendo Fans And Lying In The Process
@Razer @NEStalgia @Heavyarms55 I could disagree with both of you but I think it will fall on mute ears.
China is a technocracy, it means it priorities technology above pretty much everything else. I would argue that China is actually a nation in decline.
If you think of it like art, you can't steal art even when you have the skills to replicate the art yourself...which is no easy feat. There are artists these days that make a living copied famed artists of years pasts. You see this in visual arts but its also called pop art/music.
Technology on the other hand is much easier to replicate...at least certain part of it. This is the stealing you call but it isn't necessarily so.
I remember reading somewhere about how to launch a successful business and the first thing they mention is to not think that anyone is stealing anything. A good idea cannot be copied.
A lot of times many people come up wit the same / similar things but an outstanding idea is one that people can't easily replicate.
Also it is often the "leader" who falls behind.
Using consoles as an example, Sony showed off that patent of theirs that was similar to the Nintendo Switch but not really.
Most successful companies follow what is called a Blue Ocean Strategy in which they make the competitors irrelevant but that usually requires an outstanding idea as I said before.
That's to say Sony probably had a similar idea but it was too generic for their taste to launch to market.
So it wouldn't be too "mindblowing" for Sony to seemingly copy the Switch and launch their patented device.
It works pretty much the same way with the PlayStation, PlayStation Move and the PlayStation Portable. These devices have been working on for some time.
On the one hand, it looks like Sony "copied" Nintendo, on the other, Sony simply didn't have that unique touch that they were looking for an so went back to R&D with the device.
Ironically, Sony is an iconic engineering brand / entertainment company that manufactures its own hardware, is it not?
Strange how that works.
How Nintendo is "out-innovating" Sony or so it seems.
Going back to China, it is more the same.
@NEStalgia The reason why China is being hated by Chinese people is because they wanted China to adapted the more modern and popular American model of living all for the sake of their children and the next generation. They don't want Chinese children to be treated as second class citizen and whatever else.
China is a nation on decline. It has been since the Ming Dynasty. They basically invented everything back in the day and it was copied by the West so what the different between then and now?
That said, you are also right. Western Imperialism has taken over and China is adopting its model to survive. I think the whole freedom thing is just thrown around by powers of all sides to prove their point. China is plenty free practically speaking.
Don't forget the Roman Empire which SPAWNED from so called Roman democracy. You really think if the West ruled the World, there wouldn't be a second Rome?
The Roman West conquered Egypt and basically uses the same trick on the Egyptians and their Gods. I think China might fall to the ground for the same reasons and might never come back. (This goes more into speculative history, Biblical prophecies and why I think the West will end up ruling the world.)
Going back to the console wars, this is the same thing as the Switch vs consoles.
The Switch is not without it detractors. Nor are consoles.
As @EightBitMan puts it: I am absolutely disgusted by the current state of this company; the exploitation of consumers, the promises they make and break, the lies they spread, and the treatment of core gamers by delivering ridiculous hardware. Unacceptable. I want a better Nintendo, not this disgraceful, anti-consumer company.
Yet this is all perspective.
If the Switch succeed and someone like Sony continues to make standard consoles people would probably complain then too. That said, more often then not, it is the lesser products that succeed in marketing as I mentioned before.
The Blue Ocean Strategy.
In years to come, who will become the irrelevant one?
Only time will tell.
For now all we know is that people are still doing business with Nintendo and China.
Edit: Remember all that talk and rumour about Nintendo going third party?
Well I feel the situation is with China is the same.
I think I must be the only guy who think Nintendo is actually at the strongest they've ever been. This IS them. They are getting some third party support for the Switch, more then before anyway and making some easy money. Nintendo is set for twenty years just selling Switches alone. What happens after is another story.
What you want to play is a Sony game. Sony can easily roll out a generic version of the Switch and sell millions. Blue Ocean Strategy style.
In China's case, it is the same thing, you don't want to be the silent inventor forever, you gain nothing for it especially back in the day when patents don't exist.
Oh, I have a bunch of paper patents that said I invented this or that. So what?
What you want to be is the guy who can easily adapt to any technological change in the environment and this is what China is today.
Let the other guy roll out the innovations, I can handle it, copy it, replicate it with ease. That's true power there.
Re: Video: Digital Foundry Takes A Look At Crash Bandicoot N. Sane Trilogy On Switch
@sixrings @electrolite77 I know its kinda irrelevant to what you guys have said but I would like to see a PSP-like device from Nintendo. The GameBoy Advance was doing so good in terms of its games and was getting there then life was cut short and replaced by the DS. The DS was more like a reboot (GameBoy 2.0 if you will) then a sequel even though it could play most your GameBoy Advance games and is more comparable to the Wii-line. It found a new Blue Ocean and had essential games but was lacking something. 3DS continues this trend and was more comparable to a DS version of the Game Boy Color. It'll be interesting to see if history repeats itself with Nintendo rolling out a 4DS which doesn't sell as well but has the game catalogue of a GBA/GC then Sony jumping in and taking the market by storm with a DS-like device.
Re: Video: Digital Foundry Takes A Look At Crash Bandicoot N. Sane Trilogy On Switch
@sixrings @electrolite77 Yes and no. Actually mathematically speaking the returns should technically be the same because 4k is 4x 1k but we haven't got there yet. So it should look like 480p jump to FullHD as FullHD is to 4k. Because of the way the game is designed, Metroid Prime will probably be that series where we can compare the differences (or the lack there of) between Metroid Prime Trilogy (480p upscaled to FullHD), Metroid Prime 4 (HD/FullHD) to Metroid Prime Future (4k). Once we get past 4k I'm sure we'll have to start using our imaginations again to think of stuff to put into digital universes that isn't doable in real life. You will notice a difference with late 4k games to 1k games in terms of background environments and details and what not. That said, we have to get more creative then that from there. Maybe instead of making it visually more impressive someone will implement say a system similar to our DNA strand. It might not change the visual appeal very much but it'll make games more interesting again and use up complex resources like that. Just like 8 bit to 16 bit games again. The jump isn't about seeable graphics necessarily though we can tell a difference it more about what else we can do with it thus the diminishing returns argument. Our visual cap is limited only by our imagination.
As for the game being very low resolution/framerate, it was kind of a "lazy" port. The engineer showed results in one day...but I guess that's because in a game like this people don't care. Unlike the other two (Xbox and PlayStation), I doubt Activision even has an engine specifically designed for any Nintendo system because they keep changing their damn architecture all the time. There's a reason why the other two have specs similar to that of a PC and are almost exactly the same as each other....because they design their system around getting third party ports who develop for the PC primarily. Its the same reason why Apple took forever to get Photoshop running native on the Mac despite having arguably the more powerful hardware. Nintendo will have to stick to their guns for at least a generation if they want third party onboard the hype train. I would argue the Switch is like a GameBoy 3.0 and like the GameBoy, how many non-Nintendo games do you remember playing on there honestly? (Especially visually impressive ones or groundbreaking titles?) The Advanced was much better and my favourite of the lot but short lived and didn't arguably have as many Nintendo titles. Then the PSP came along and finished the job while Nintendo moved on to the DS. I suspect that for the Switch something similar might happen.
Re: Panic Button Is Porting Online Co-Op Hit Warframe To Nintendo Switch
@Cobalt I have Pikmin 3 and have played Pikmin 3. I would say its the best in the series and one of my favourite games of all time but its not a new IP was my point. Pikmin 3 was worth getting a Wii U over but clearly a lot of people don't feel that way otherwise it would have sold more then it did. You've got to understand things from someone else's framework in order to convince them otherwise. Unless I'm mistaken, which I could be in this case, I was stating that I am generally an elitist of modern society which is about acceptance of others cultures and difference of opinion unlike a classic elitist which were experts of a specific niche. Although I'm probably a bit of both. I live in Australia and come from a family with a music and alternative medicine background and can play the piano though haven't in years. I myself come from an IT background and want to get into the game industry. I also enjoy all forms of music, games, films, food and general entertainment. As for McDonalds I mean that I am lucky enough to have a fast metabolism and can appreciate junk but that said, I do eat pretty healthy as well. Also my point there was that their apple pies is something unique to McDonalds and a finer point to wanting to eat there even if it is junk. Sometimes you've got to look at things from multiple angles. Sorry for the verbose rants but I tend to do that when I am deconstructing what people are saying to make sense of what they are trying to say. I try to be reasonable and understand what they are saying instead of disagreeing with someone outright.
Re: Panic Button Is Porting Online Co-Op Hit Warframe To Nintendo Switch
@Cobalt As for music you might feel that most music has junk that is true but going with that comment, some music will then be more junk then others. No different from saying "eating out isn't good for you but McDonald's is the worst."
But that's unimportant anyway, if I was to eat at McDonald's what would I eat? That's a more important question to ask. I like their apple pies and soft serve. What sort of junk you like then? I personally don't mind Jackson but prefer pop, rock and metal like The Beatles, U2, Muse, Dream Theater, Within Temptation and Diablo Swing Orchestra, etc. I found them to be far more innovative and more open to influences from other genres. I'm okay with pop bands like CHVRCHES and the occasional Taylor Swift song. I'm not a big fan of pop and R&B music as I don't feel there is much "music" involved. The music is often secondary focus to the vocal performances of the said individual or the lyrical writing of the producers. I didn't come here to say Jackson is a random dude who is a nobody without his producers, that's what you said about Bieber but not what I said, I came saying that Jackson makes pop music and that all pop musicians rely on some degree the marketing of these labels just like most bands. The reason why I said it is because often this reliance is blown way out of proportion when the artists is disliked by someone and vise versa when simply put that is not true. As I said, I know people who will say Bieber is "revolutionary" with his pop and R&B music. They too are musicians and have studied music. If I was going to go with facts then Bieber also co-writes and produces a small amount of his music while Jackson didn't write ANY nor produce ANY of his earlier music. It wasn't until 1979's "Off the Wall" where he took off because he wrote his own music and started to produce some of them himself. So what is your point? Because from what I can see he was created by the industry.
Like all industries its good to have rules but the importance is that these rules should allow us to co exist with other people's music and games and to tolerate their tastes and fashion.
Not the other way round.
I consider myself an elitist and its hard being a modern elitist for that reason. Sometimes you have to tolerate uninformed opinions and "racism" as I would like to call it.
If I personally feel something is junk I try to not make a big deal out of it and try to understand why this junkie exist beyond trying to make a living out of selling crap.
Maybe they do truly appreciate art and want to be part of the curb and cannot contribute in the way a normal artist would.
Going back to Nintendo that's to say that next to Sony they can't compete with them on a hardware level or Microsoft on a software level...but they'll give a shot and provide a unique experience along the way.
So does that make Nintendo crap now because it can't compete with Sony in the hardware division and Microsoft in its online services and software division? What happen if like the Wii U and Switch drop the ball with their marketing techniques and its awesome gameplay and unique games?
Re: Panic Button Is Porting Online Co-Op Hit Warframe To Nintendo Switch
@Cobalt I don't think you are understanding what I am saying. Did I mention Mario or Zelda? No. I mentioned Pikmin 3 which is akin to Pikmin but in HD. They could have called it Pikmin HD and people won't really be able to tell the difference. This is how some of my friend's feel and I can understand it from that stand point because from their perspective they've played a Mario game already. I just said we are comparing apples to apples. And a Mario game is still a platformer no matter the changes. Whether they love or hate platformers, the point becomes mute unless they are open to see the game's innovations or understand its changes but then the same can be said about Remasters and HD Remakes.
You yourself said you don't like Wii U ports for the Switch. Well one could feel the same way about Mario. See the double standards there? How is that any different?
You: Mario Kart 8 is available for the Wii U. Lame.
Them: Mario Kart 8 is still a Mario Kart game. Lame.
Just as Wii U ports aren't convincing you, the same franchises aren't convincing them. They just have a different standard to you. That's not to say they don't like Mario or can't see the changes between Mario 64 and Sunshine. Those are two different things. Maybe they just don't care about the changes. Just as I couldn't care less if you like or not like Mario or whether you feel its the same game or not.
Seriously, there's been like 7 to 13 Assassin's Creed on the PlayStation 4/Xbox One and going by that logic none of them are the same game. Can you tell me how Mario is not the same game but Assassin's Creed is?
So again is your point that the Wii U has Mario as an exclusives vs 13 games which were innovative for its time? What sort of identity is that?
The bitter truth is that Mario isn't out innovating 13 Assassin's Creed games. Nintendo simply does not have that development power nor want to spam us with the same titles over and over so they take more of an "innovation" in one hit approach. They're playing catchup and are rather quite slow.
If I gave you $10 and you spend it all to make $13. Then good on you.
If I gave you $10 and you spend $1 to make $2 and you did this 10x who's the winner?
Just look at their consoles. They take 5-6 years to R&D and by the time it comes out, the hardware is dated. Sony and Microsoft on the other hand uses hardware that are more within 3 years of hardware iterations.
Some people say the reason for this is because Nintendo might not be what they are used to be anymore but one thing is that they try to play fair and punch above their weight.
The Wii U could have sold more if it had a better identity. It was a confusing mess and while 15 million is probably not a failure, depending on their R&D costs, I wouldn't say it was a runaway success. If there were more exclusives that showcase its dual screen and off TV play. If it was the more powerful system and got more third party. It was like most Nintendo systems, a mediocracy of success. A survivor in the deadly realms of the video games business.
Think of a 2k Switch which had Kindle-like apps, Netflix, Apple TV like features, a 4k dock, etc. That's a complete package right there. There's no excuses not to play Nintendo even if I'm not a big gamer or the most uber hardcore of gamer or portable fan. Instead we got a mainstream core-focused 720p console with no Netflix and Kindle apps. No 4k dock. No 4DS. With PS5 and XBOX Too just around the corner. Its like the Wii all over again.
Iwata himself said that they consider the war won with Sony and Microsoft and want to compete with the likes of Apple but their sales number aren't reflecting that. Unless they change their business practices overnight, Nintendo will remain the underdogs...and even then there's nothing wrong with that.
I understand what you're saying but have a different reasoning and understanding of the situation. You're saying the Switch has "no identity" and that it doesn't have the games it needs to make the big push to completely "destroy" the competition. Instead we're getting last gen ports.
Whereas I think one of the reason Nintendo is doing what they are doing is because they are staying true to themselves and playing fair game. They're not here to destroy the competition but coexist with them. They're not doing a PS3 and rolling out theoretical consoles that claim to be more powerful then the competition but is hard to program for because no one has heard of the "Cell" processing unit before. Nintendo just doesn't do that. They're developers of the Blue Ocean Strategy not a King of the Hill strategy. They believe the ocean is big enough for everyone to exist in it and for everyone to have their niche.
The Switch like the U before it will achieve mediocracy success for what it is.
Re: Panic Button Is Porting Online Co-Op Hit Warframe To Nintendo Switch
@Cobalt I dunno if you misread but as I stated only about 4-6 of those games you listed were true console platform exclusives to the Wii U.
Most of the rest have appeared on other consoles BEFORE hand. Pikmin for example is initially a GameCube game, not a Wii U game. The GameCube came out in 2001. 'The Last of Us Part II' is a Sony platform exclusive but it is still a 'Last of Us' game. I wouldn't use that as an example of exclusivity of the PlayStation 4 if someone has played 'the Last of Us' on the PlayStation 3. Your point just become mute. You're not convincing me to buy a PlayStation 4 for "new experiences" but rather another sequels to it. I would consider 'Heavy Rain' and 'Indigo Prophecy' the same vain.
If comparing Sony to Nintendo then I might but we're on a Nintendo website and comparing apples to apples. Even then the point becomes mute if I listed all 3 Uncharted as the "greatest PlayStation games ever" because it seems like I don't have anything else to offer.
So if you consider 'Pikmin 3' an "exclusive" just because Nintendo made it for the Wii U and gave it a different tag then you have to consider 'Mario Kart 8 Deluxe' an enhanced port and also an exclusive which makes things complicated...
An enhanced port is not the same as a straight up port.
Like Twilight Princess HD is not Twilight Princess. Hyrule Warriors Definitive Edition is not Hyrule Warriors, etc.
The game and its storyline as well as the graphics has changed? Is it still the same game?
See how I'm beating a dead horse?
When talking exclusives it should be fresh AND great new IPs or its nots.
As my comment stated Nintendo already has 4-6 exclusives for the Switch. Even if I include Mario, Pikmin, Zelda and some of the rest, you're still comparing 1 year to 5 years worth of effort.
Also as I stated a lot of the games came BEFORE or from other platforms like Monster Hunter Tri was a Wii game then 3 and 4 Ultimate were also 3DS games.
These games are not real exclusives but sequels to games or are other platforms. Also a lot of things you state are simply opinions and not facts.
While Jackson was said by some to be a prodigy, he relies as much on his producers and record companies for his music as with many bands and artists.
Personally, I prefer rock and metal music and European music over American music in general and would say that he is not as good as most of these rock musicians preceding and came after him. I listen to everything from classical music to things like avant-garde metal and I doubt that a someone who thinks Michael Jackson is a genius has such a wide range of tastes.
The same critic you use to praise Jackson compared to Bieber's is what I'm using to dismiss his status. In the end he writes pop music and pop music is mostly akin to trash.
See again how it works?
Also I know several people who would call Bieber "revolutionary", does that make them right?
These things are in the end opinions not fact. When it comes to entertainment, the facts can mean very little to someone as it is very subjective.
We all know the best games for example don't necessarily sell the most because of the competition alone.
For me, these multi-plats as you call them are showcasing what the Switch can do. They are unique to the Nintendo platform. Every generation there are Nintendo fan and detractors and every generation it is the same: "Nintendo has no games", "Nintendo has too many exclusives".
For once they have more third party then exclusives why is that a bad thing?
And now we have the reverse complain? I don't get it.
This IS the Switches identity.
It is different to that of the Wii U. Multi-plats is not a crime.
In fact its a good thing. It means it can reach a larger audience.
Just because something is exclusive doesn't mean it is good or new. As I stated before a lot of what you listed are sequels to old franchises. These are not new experiences. A lot of them are also not that great.
I rather they do away with Bayonetta and just give us a Devil May Cry port for example. The exclusiveness doesn't do anything when it isn't earth shatteringly new and we are getting the same type of gameplay. That's MY point.
I would like a game like Beyond Good and Evil 2 on the Switch for example so its a good thing something like Panic Button exists and something like that can potentially happen.
The Switch's portability and the ability to bring it with you on the go is what is going to sell the Switch.
The Nintendo exclusives will still come but its the third party support that's to look out for.
Re: Panic Button Is Porting Online Co-Op Hit Warframe To Nintendo Switch
@Cobalt I'm not sure if you got to my reply yet but most of the Wii U titles you listed were not Wii U exclusive.
"That the identity of those tunes is related to Bieber or that is the identity of Jackson?" First both of them are pop music but that asides, It'll be related to Justin Bieber because the original work differs from it. In this case, the Wii U can do something that the Switch cannot which is to say that a Michael Jackson does Michael Jackson better because of his moonwalk.
I think that is what you're trying to say is that the Wii U can do something the Switch can't. The Wii U has an identity in that sense and games developed for that platform should fit and stay on that platform and not be marketed elsewhere. Sushi Striker for example is a great 3DS game but doesn't work so good on the Switch.
They've essentially replaced their Home Console, the Wii U with the Switch when it isn't really a replacement of sorts.
That said, 2018 is not just a great year for the younger generation. There's every thing from Starlink to Fornite to Ys VIII and Tales of Vesperia coming. You've clearly forgotten all the jRPGs coming to the Switch.
Re: Panic Button Is Porting Online Co-Op Hit Warframe To Nintendo Switch
@ilikeike That aside, it also has to do with that none of the third parties takes Nintendo seriously or can because they constantly change. They're hard to develop for and best left alone.
A massive title that will sell say 10 million easily will not likely appear on the Switch for one reason, cartridges are expensive. Even at $1 for a 64GB cartridges, I'm going to have to pay up 10 million dollars if my game were to sell that many copies and I don't think any third party is willing to do that upfront.
Thus, most likely I'll want to market a game that can be advertised through either quicker burst marketing or smaller drip marketing.
In other words, I'll rather a smaller AA title that take time to warm up to an audience or an A title that will get people on the hype train quickly and abruptly because its expensive to develop some AAA that does both.
Re: Panic Button Is Porting Online Co-Op Hit Warframe To Nintendo Switch
@ilikeike Well sure, none of what you said is wrong but in this day and ages I've given up on massive ports that aren't even that great anyway.
Every generation Nintendo fans say the same things. One of which is "Its a big win to get this third party onboard"....but for what and for how long?
Its like they want their favourite platform to sell through the roof which I get that because I've been there but at what expense?
A lot of fans just hope Nintendo will just serve its niche and be done with that. Every 5 years they're trying to find a new niche in this large blue ocean and it can be frustrating to keep up.
Nintendo isn't even about massive games these days but rather spinoff of massive franchises. Everything they do is about marketing this new niche they've discovered. If people look hard enough they will find that there's never a non-essential Nintendo console because of that reason.
Going back to your point, its a big win but a big lost at the same time since Nintendo fans tend to miss out on a lot of titles. We shouldn't even be talking about Final Fantasy being ported to the Switch in the first place. It should just be normal business as usual like your FIFA and CoD. The latter which appeared on the Wii and now they've stopped getting since CoD Ghosts on the Wii U. Same deal or story there.
With porting, graphics is rarely an issues, if you could port to the Wii in the first place. Its marketing to see if it fits the platform and its audience and that particular side of the blue ocean they've just have discovered. Its like introduce a species to a specific ecosystem. Its got to fit for it risks falling all apart and/or killing off other species already there. Which is why its a pain to heard that developers have not considered a certain game for the Switch or are so called "opened" to opportunity because it means they have other plans in mind.
Re: Panic Button Is Porting Online Co-Op Hit Warframe To Nintendo Switch
@ilikeike You really believe those stories? That's just market hype to get people to continue to support Square Enix while they "struggle" to get FF15 to go on the Switch. I wouldn't pick that game as my first game to port if I was Square Enix.
Also, I've more or less moved on from Final Fantasy anyway. I never felt it was that "great" to being with but yeah.
I would honestly rather them port over Star Ocean (series really went downhill), Deus Ex, Life Is Strange, Sleeping Dog, Drakengard, etc make more (and make them available on the Switch), Tomb Raider, Parasite Eve and SaGa titles. Hopefully, get a new Lufia as well. Oh and the Mana series.
Then there's a Nier: Automata which I really want on the Switch...but not likely going to happen because of Square Enix policies.
Oh and revive Psychic Force. That was an awesome title.
Re: Panic Button Is Porting Online Co-Op Hit Warframe To Nintendo Switch
@Cobalt Nintendo rehashes their franchises every generation. Name me one console of theirs that doesn't?
Some say the Switch is a Wii U 2.0 but I would argue that its more a GameBoy 3.0. Its more of an evolution of the GameBoy line then a Wii U done right.
At least try to give better examples.
Also its one years worth of content vs 5 years. I own a Wii U btw (several in fact) and have been following the Switch since Day 1 and the Switch wins hand down.
I took the time to go through your games list and prove a point:
Xenoblade Chronicles is Wii game.
The Wonderful 101 is based on Viewtiful Joe a GameCube/PS2 game by PlatinumGames.
Donkey Kong Country is SNES old.
Super Mario 3D World isn't earth shatteringly new.
Yoshi's Wooly World isn't a new IP. There was Kirby's Epic Yarn before it on the Wii.
Mario Kart 8 Deluxe is a Wii U port but the series has been around forever.
Pikmin is a GameCube game.
Super Smash Bros first arrived on the N64.
Pokken Tournament is really Pokémon Stadium and Tekken.
Kirby and the Rainbow Paintbrush is another Kirby game.
Paper Mario also first arrived on the N64 and is based of the SNES game Mario RPG.
So what identity are you talking about?
"Bayonetta 2 is a Wii U game."
Based of an older IP which almost died. It is a Platinum Game and isn't Nier: Automata. Bayonetta 3 is also coming to the Switch but Meh.
"Captain Toad Treasure Tracker is a Wii U game."
A great platformer I'll give you that one but again not that unique.
"Zelda Breath of the Wild is a Wii U game."
BotW isn't anything new. It arguably not even the best Zelda game as people claim it to be. The Wii U had 3 Zelda's. 2 of them were HD ports.
"Splatoon is a Wii U game."
The first new IP you've listed.
"Monster Hunter Ultimate is a Wii U game."
Monster Hunter has been around for some time and have been on the PSP and 3DS. The Wii U games are 3DS ports of 3 and 4 Ultimate.
"Hyrule WARRIORS is a Wii U game."
A hack and slash Warriors games. We're not even getting the mainline Warriors games anymore.
"Super Mario Maker is a Wii U game."
Okay, that's a second one.
"Project Zero V is a Wii U game."
Fatal Frame was originally a PlayStation series.
"Tokyo Mirage Session is a Wii U game."
That one is one of those special generational crossovers that was bound to happen. Its based of Shim Megami Tensei and Fire Emblem...neither of which we got on the Wii U (without going into Virtual Console).
"Zombi U is a Wii U game."
An its by Ubisoft designed for the Wii U.
"Lego City Undercover is a Wii U game."
Okay, that got ported to the PS4 and XBOX One and Nintendo Switch.
So totally, you have like 4-6 games on the Wii U that was unique.
That's like one game a year for the Wii U.
The Switch already has:
-Mario + Rabbids Kingdom Battle
-Octopath Traveler (which I'm not a fan of)
-ARMS (also not a fan off)
-Nintendo Labo
-DragonQuest Builders (also a PS3 title)
-Seasons of Heaven (Yes, an odd ball but an exclusive)
-Daemon X Machina (2019, which looks like its going to be amazing)
-and other amazing third party the Wii U can only dream off.
Did I mention the third party?
The Switch has more of an identity then the Wii U especially when it comes to third party.
Does the Wii U have:
-South Park: The Fractured But Whole
-Ys VIII
-Wonder Boy: The Dragon’s Trap
-Super Bomberman R
-Disgaea 5 and 1 Complete
-Valkyria Chronicles 4
How about Doom and Wolfenstein II, L.A. Noire, Rocket League?
Yes, the Wii U also had some third party but it was even more restricted then the Switch and mostly famed western franchises like Mass Effect 3 (Didn't even get the first two).
Also as I stated before did the Wii U get a Fire Emblem? No. A Metroid? Okay it got a Trilogy remix.
Warframe is another win for the Switch. Just as Fornite, Paladin and Arena of Valor was.
The Switch still has 5 years to go to prove itself. I would say that comparing Apples to Oranges (in other words comparing it to the iPad) it is by no means a successful product. The iPad sells 4x as much.
The Wii U also proved itself but failed more so then it succeed.
Re: Panic Button Is Porting Online Co-Op Hit Warframe To Nintendo Switch
@westman98 You guys don't play enough jRPGs. NIS America has like over 15 games for the Switch:
https://store.nisaeurope.com/collections/switch-1
I think the 6 years thing is to denote that they have a lot of experience compared to other developers. 6 years is a gaming generation so they are trying to denote the fact that they've been working with Nintendo for about a generation.
Re: Panic Button Is Porting Online Co-Op Hit Warframe To Nintendo Switch
@ilikeike Where did you get that impression? Square doesn't want mainline Final Fantasy on the Switch. There hasn't been a mainline Final Fantasy game on a Nintendo platform since VI. Why would they change their stance now?
Re: Nintendo Is Considering A Successor To The 3DS According To Its New President
Why I want a 4DS...
https://entertainmentepilogue.wordpress.com/2018/07/07/the-future-of-nintendo-why-i-want-a-4ds/
Re: Ubisoft CEO Believes The Next Generation Of Consoles Will Be The Last
I didn't read through all the comments but am I the only one for this idea?
I have little interest in buying a PlayStation 4 let alone a PlayStation 5. So I would love to see a TV and phone that plays PlayStation games so I don't have to buy another console.
I would love to see XBOX provide XBOX Live on everything it can possibly imagine including the Switch.
I think Nintendo will also go and make more mobile games and should provide some sort of service where you can steam Nintendo games with or without owning a Switch.
Re: Ubisoft's CEO Shares Views On Partnership With Nintendo And State Of The Video Game Industry
@HobbitGamer @MrGawain @Cobalt @IPrino Hmmm...some great points there but mind you I think why Nintendo won't get those AAA third party is because cartridges are, to this day and age....expensive. That why the experiences they put on the Switch are not AAA titles but smaller bit sizes ones that sell like AA titles. At least no one is pulling a leg here with the console isn't powerful enough crap.
Think about it, even if it only cost $1 more then it does for a 64GB cartridge compared to a 50GB Blu-Ray to produce, and lets say that I know it will sell ten million copies, that's ten million dollars upfront I'll have to pay to get enough copies out in the wild and as a company I'm unwilling to fork out this much money for an investment that might not get the returns it deserves. That's why we are not likely going to see AAA titles on the Switch until much later in the consoles life cycle. The ones that come early on will sell in limited quantities which doesn't help the franchise brand in the long run because developers are looking to sell millions upon millions of copies but without having to pay any upfront cost associated with it.
Keeping stock limited is actually the only way to make sure you get a return on investment but it slows down momentum and doesn't look good for the franchise in the long run. (EG: Say you know you have 500 customers but you only produce 5-50 copies, it'll keep the demand going, sell and you'll make your profit but will limit your potential compared to if you actually had produce 500+ copies. However, I can't "afford" to produce 500+ copies. This is problem and a cycle with Nintendo consoles.) You can't buy what isn't in stock so it doesn't help that the other platforms continues to get the game out earlier and for next to no upfront cost. And by the time that it can sell ten million copies without hiccups, the next generation of consoles are just around the corner. That's why Nintendo will continue to get the AA titles and not the AAA ones.
That said, most AAA titles are impulsive buys from people who either trust the brands that these companies produce or purchased on discounts and never get around to playing it. I suspect that's where the majority of AAA get their sales from. Nintendo also miss out on that because SD Cards can't keep up with HDDs and people are more selective with what they purchase. Nintendo consumers are probably more aware of what they are buying (for themselves or they kids) then those of Sony and Microsoft's.
That's actually why I actually like Resident Evil 7 idea and was surprise this E3 there wasn't a heavy Nintendo focus on Cloud-based games coming to the Switch...but a lot of people are hating on the idea because of what it brings to the industry.
Re: Kimishima Says Nintendo Has Plans For The 3DS In 2019 And Beyond
If Nintendo learns from history they will realise that their products look and act timeless and thus should function and be supported as such.
Like Apple, there's nothing wrong with selling both an iPad, iPhone and iPod at the same time.
Think about how cool it would be if a Nintendo 64 had continued till today with modern specs. Or a GameCube. I don't think they would ever have a fail product if they continue to just support them till the end of the earth.
That said, I'll be happy with a 4k Nintendo Switch Dock that focused on specs, streaming and download and ran Nintendo's version of Apple TV, XBOX Live and a Kindle.
Re: Kimishima Says Nintendo Has Plans For The 3DS In 2019 And Beyond
@electrolite77 Which is what I suspect is the case.
The 3DS has an advantage over the Switch and that is that it can act as both a classic controller and a phone like device for your smaller pocket. That why it deserves a proper sequel and not a funeral.
Re: Kimishima Says Nintendo Has Plans For The 3DS In 2019 And Beyond
I don't get the people that wants the 3DS to rest in peace?
I just don't see how some of the games that are designed for the Dual Screen are going to work as well without it.
Honestly they have two paths to take from here. Roll out one a sequel that is closer to a Nintendo Phone or one that acts as a classical controller killer.
Also, what they might be saying is that they don't plan to make a 4DS and will continue to support the 3DS till death do we part...
If they only stick with the Switch I will Sigh.
Edit: I would say this, even the Wii U still has functionality that is unique and cannot be replaced. I was surprised that they didn't continue to support the Wii U with Switch ports seeing how easy that would have been.
Even if they overlapped in function the fact is that Nintendo needs to realise that they are just selling a product. Its like comparing an iPad mini to an iPhone S. Nothing wrong with two similar products.
Re: Nintendo's Shinya Takahashi Hints That A New Games System Is On The Horizon
@electrolite77 @Jeronan
A lot of people are interested in the classic consoles here.
That said, a $300 4k 12+ TFLOPs Pascal dock would put them right back in the console game.
Re: Reggie Fils-Aimé Targets an "Extra Nintendo Twist" for the Switch Online Service
Perhaps they mean they'll do something like Miiverse, StreetPass and Mii Plaza again. That'll be great.