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Topic: Do Story in games need to be necessary?

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I-U

21. Posted:

I can't think of a videogame genre where story hasn't greatly added to the overall experience and helped create a memorable release not just an enjoyable one. Even in the Puzzle genre, I use to think Tetris DX was as far as they could go then the DS came out with Meteos, and completely changed the value such a genre could deliver. Meteos tied its puzzle gameplay to dozens of worlds and races to create a very memorable experience where players were immersed into the victory/defeat of these planets and had to overcome each world's traits to secure salvation against Meteos or other hostile planets. Meteos is a release that makes it very clear that great gameplay is just the foundation to a great experience and that great story builds upon that foundation. In other words, gameplay is like the frame of a house and its slab, where as story is the interior/exterior walls and their details. Story is what gives a game identity, and so it weighs more on me than gameplay.

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Austroid

22. Posted:

Its mind-boggling how more and more titles are coming out each year; winning "game of the year" awards, and are basically interactive movies.

What happened to the GAME aspect?

This is one of the many reasons why I'm glad Nintendo exists, gameplay has always been their top priority. They still prove that some of the greatest games ever made consist of nothing as complicated as "go save the princess!" But offer a wholesome gameplay experience.

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8BitSamurai

23. Posted:

For most games, no I don't think it's necessary. It just depends on the game. But for some games, it absolutely is necessary. I don't think that makes them any worse games. I think games have become better at telling stories then even books, movies, etc.

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Philip_J_Reed

24. Posted:

the_shpydar wrote:

Philip_J_Reed wrote:

I don't demand gameplay from my books,

Well, except the Choose Your Own Adventure books. Those were awesome. :D

Did you ever have the Super Mario ones? I think there was some standard "If you choose to x, turn to page 23, if you choose to y turn to page 87," but there were also mazes and puzzles and such to solve, and if you solved them right you'd advance the story...solve them wrong and you'd be penalized.

They were actually really good! ...I remember thinking when I was 10.

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OptometristLime

25. Posted:

Memeboy3 wrote:

Do Story in games need to be necessary?

This is not a dumb question, but the phrasing is more confusing than you intended.
Possible alternatives:
Is the Story necessary in games? / Is Story in games necessary?
Does a game need to have Story?

Many others, but those hew pretty close to your words.

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CM30

26. Posted:

CanisWolfred wrote:

I mean, I'm a guy who thinks of Story as a nice bonus, but I don't think I've ever seen a game that wasn't improved even a little bit by having a decent story, even if that story was just a basic premise. So long as it adds context for what you're doing, it stops feeling like a waste of time, at least for me. Like I can't find any reason to progress in those romhacks. I'll play a level for a while, but it just feels pointless. I mean, if a game has no story, I tend to forget about them, too. Do you remember the contents of those romhacks you've played at all?

I remember the level design, gimmicks and various other things in many of them. And hey, I know I don't care for the story in them, since most of them are Japanese and I can't read a single word of it. So yeah, quite a few games I enjoy playing that are both quite memorable and basically completely non understandable for me.

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Ludicoloishome

27. Posted:

yes
The walking dead bored me to death during gameplay but the story kept me going and made me feel for clementine

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BandG

28. Posted:

No story is not necessary. most of my favorite games do not have a great story, it isn't what makes a game great. But the games that do have stories, and fantastic ones at that, really stand out in my mind, and my favorite game ever is story-based. It also has good gameplay, so if a game can master gameplay and story, it is going to be better that a game that has only mastered gameplay. There are different types of games we can play, and I think story-based games are almost in a different category than non story-based ones.

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KittenKoder

29. Posted:

Depends on the game. Simple games do not require story, however they have to have something to keep it interesting. A lot of games that need story are lacking in it, either the story is bland or does not exist. All RPG games, and adventure games, must have a story though, because that's what they are. Without a story, and a good story at that, they are just another puzzle game and nothing great. Cinematic scenes are the key to a good RPG, and to make cinematic scenes any good they must tell a good story, otherwise even the boring FPS fans will lose interest.

The best game I ever played was Xenosaga, all three parts, even though the system for the second and third were not that great, the story kept you playing to the end. The games took forever to complete, though the levels were small, because of the cinematic scenes.

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micronean

30. Posted:

There are some games that are made with a story in mind, and then there are games that just shoehorn in a story because they feel they have to. FPS, for example, hardly need a story. Stuff like DOOM 3 I think was made worse with a story. Then there are the same old derivative tales of some elite crack team with a super secret mission to save the world.

And worse, then there are puzzle games, or kart racers, that make it necessary to go through "story mode" in order to get stuff unlocked. That kind of stuff really bugs me.

I often miss the times when all you had to do was hit the button at the title screen and start playing. No cutscenes, no movies, no celebrity voice actors making it look like this is the most important game in the whole world.

micronean

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NintyMan

31. Posted:

This doesn't sound dumb to me at all. It's a good question.

It really depends on the game. For platfomers like the Mario games, it can have a generic story, but there can be a problem when it has a generic story for too long. Obviously, the gameplay is what matters most and if the game is fun, then that should be the biggest concern, but if the story is simple for so long, it feels redundant and is in need being shaken up. Bowser kidnapping Peach is cool for the first few games, but after so long it gets predictable and not that enduring. That's why I'm happy that Peach is playable in Super Mario 3D World. It got off to a right start when you had to rescue Peach as a hostage in her own castle rather than traveling to Bowser's Castle to get her like nearly every other game.

RPGs and Adventure games must have a story. Shooters can get by with a generic story. Puzzle games need no story, though a simple one could work. Racing games don't need a story too, but in the case of Diddy Kong Racing, it worked out well.

Edited on by NintyMan

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6ch6ris6

32. Posted:

i think the only games i bought where the story mattered are halo and metal gear solid games. both have excellent gameplay so i am pretty sure i would have bought them even without the story.

games dont need to have a great story to be good. because of the interactivity i can still have fun with it. now movies without a good story is different. even action movies should have a story that is acceptable or some funny one-liners to give the characters some "character" lol

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micronean

33. Posted:

6ch6ris6 wrote:

i think the only games i bought where the story mattered are halo and metal gear solid games. both have excellent gameplay so i am pretty sure i would have bought them even without the story.

games dont need to have a great story to be good. because of the interactivity i can still have fun with it. now movies without a good story is different. even action movies should have a story that is acceptable or some funny one-liners to give the characters some "character" lol

Yeah, it's kind of weird that way. Most action movies need a story but don't have it; most action games have a story but don't need it.

micronean

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bezerker99

34. Posted:

Gameplay >>> Story

It's like writing a song. Music is the important part - lyrics are always secondary.

bezerker99

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CanisWolfred

35. Posted:

Philip_J_Reed wrote:

the_shpydar wrote:

Philip_J_Reed wrote:

I don't demand gameplay from my books,

Well, except the Choose Your Own Adventure books. Those were awesome. :D

Did you ever have the Super Mario ones? I think there was some standard "If you choose to x, turn to page 23, if you choose to y turn to page 87," but there were also mazes and puzzles and such to solve, and if you solved them right you'd advance the story...solve them wrong and you'd be penalized.

They were actually really good! ...I remember thinking when I was 10.

I had one of those! It was amazing when I was 7! I could never find my way to the end, though.

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CanisWolfred

36. Posted:

6ch6ris6 wrote:

i think the only games i bought where the story mattered are halo and metal gear solid games. both have excellent gameplay so i am pretty sure i would have bought them even without the story.

I'm very surprised to hear that...because literally the only thing keeping me playing Halo and MGS are their stories. Halo is and always was a generic FPS with a solid story. Metal Gear Solid...is quite honestly terrible in terms of gameplay, especially its combat, I'm really surprised to hear someone likes it. I'd have zero reason to play either game without their good stories. There are way better games out there.

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MAB

37. Posted:

If I can just take you back, way back to the Amiga 500 days full of less cutscenes and story but chockablock maximum gameplay ;)

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CanisWolfred

38. Posted:

bezerker99 wrote:

Gameplay >>> Story

It's like writing a song. Music is the important part - lyrics are always secondary.

I don't agree with that at all, though that does explain your posts in the music thread. For me at least, terrible lyrics can ruin a song just as easily as a wrong note or a bad melody. I'd never want to listen to songs like what the Backstreet boys used to sing, because I don't like their lyrics. Sure, their songs are catchy, but if their lyrics irritate me, being catchy is only going to make that worse. Now, that's not to say I wouldn't want to listen to a song with good lyrics and bad music, because that'd be just as bad. I prefer songs that have good everything, or is at least good at one thing and competant at everything else.

Which takes us back to games. Most good games are at least competant - good enough - with their stories or scenarios, if not good or great at them, while also being at least competant at everything else, including the gameplay. Really, I can't think of many games where the story is great and the gameplay is crap that is well-regarded. Heavy Rain? I'd say Metal Gear Solid, but apparently there were people who were okay with the gameplay in that series. Other than that, I can't think of anything. At the same time, I can't think of much that had good gameplay that had a genuinely bad story, including a premise that didn't adequately provide some context or motivation for what you're doing. Most good games can at least have stories that are "good enough".

Really, I feel like a lot of people are underestimating how important story can be - it doesn't always have to be exceptional, but it does at least have to be good enough, just as gameplay always has to be "good enough" to hold your interest. Now of course, how you define good enough depends on your preferences. I believe most people who are saying they don't need a good story are probably right, but what they're really saying is that they've deemed story to be good enough at a much lower point that someone who demands a "good" story in all of their games.

...I'm probably just debating semantics, but I can't help it, it's just how I'm seeing things right now.

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KittenKoder

39. Posted:

CanisWolfred wrote:

bezerker99 wrote:

Gameplay >>> Story

It's like writing a song. Music is the important part - lyrics are always secondary.

I don't agree with that at all, though that does explain your posts in the music thread. For me at least, terrible lyrics can ruin a song just as easily as a wrong note or a bad melody. I'd never want to listen to songs like what the Backstreet boys used to sing, because I don't like their lyrics. Sure, their songs are catchy, but if their lyrics irritate me, being catchy is only going to make that worse. Now, that's not to say I wouldn't want to listen to a song with good lyrics and bad music, because that'd be just as bad. I prefer songs that have good everything, or is at least good at one thing and competant at everything else.

Which takes us back to games. Most good games are at least competant - good enough - with their stories or scenarios, if not good or great at them, while also being at least competant at everything else, including the gameplay. Really, I can't think of many games where the story is great and the gameplay is crap that is well-regarded. Heavy Rain? I'd say Metal Gear Solid, but apparently there were people who were okay with the gameplay in that series. Other than that, I can't think of anything. At the same time, I can't think of much that had good gameplay that had a genuinely bad story, including a premise that didn't adequately provide some context or motivation for what you're doing. Most good games can at least have stories that are "good enough".

Really, I feel like a lot of people are underestimating how important story can be - it doesn't always have to be exceptional, but it does at least have to be good enough, just as gameplay always has to be "good enough" to hold your interest. Now of course, how you define good enough depends on your preferences. I believe most people who are saying they don't need a good story are probably right, but what they're really saying is that they've deemed story to be good enough at a much lower point that someone who demands a "good" story in all of their games.

...I'm probably just debating semantics, but I can't help it, it's just how I'm seeing things right now.

I totally concur with you on the music topic, considering almost all music is nothing more than remastered classics, especially today.

Back on topic, this whole debate is about nothing more than which color is better. Some people like blue, some people like red, it's all subjective. It's all nothing more than opinion.

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MAB

40. Posted:

Here is a little Indiana Jones mofo with a gun and some dynamite... Some quick story using text then BAM! hit me with that gameplay up in da house ;)

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