MarsOne

Let's get our 3x faster CPU and GPU Switch (ram needs improvement the most). 1080p/60 for the next console or Nintendo should hang their heads in shame.

I think they should just do it better. Get the iPad Air 2020 performance in a new Switch Pro. The reason the Switch is a bad hybrid device is because the home console portion isn't fast enough.

I do think selling a Switch box with a pro controller is a good idea also. More options are fine. The Lite didn't wreck the original Switch.

More Power and a cheaper Box version also.

Nintendo's home console sales for 2020: Almost zero. In other news, Nintendo continues to rule the roost in mobile sales.

Everyone is pretending that Nintendo exiting the home console market is an improvement. The Switch is a nice upgrade for 3DS owners. I can't wait for the next Switch, and hopefully an actual home console from Nintendo, something like the Series S for Nintendo fans would be perfect.

@Inc That has nothing to do with the quality of Metroid. It came out on the Gamecube. Total sales mean nothing. For many people Metroid was THEIR FAVORITE game on SNES and Prime on Gamecube.

@Lordplops I think the entire point of his post is having a good game isn't enough, you need marketing, or new distribution models ala Game Pass.

Buy a compact normal monitor instead. $80 USD IPS and much better and also portable at 20 inches.

DLSS doesn't help in games without TAA, if you want raw fast edgy pixels like I do and don't like TAA, DLSS can't be applied. It is for improving TAA images.

It is new technology and it is upscaling that is only done on the source device. TVs use "nearest neighbor" or some other kind of math on one image at a time. The PS4 uses temporal reconstruction, the previous frame helps to construct the next frame (TAA) and it can be combined with other methods such as checkerboard rendering. nVidia's DLSS was garbage when it came out (DLSS 1.0) but it exists for a reason, and that is that TAA makes the image soft. DLSS also uses the previous frame, but it applies the neural network learning to use shortcuts between what the rendered image looks like and what it would look like if it was rendered at 16k to make a composite image that looks in between those two.

You have to train the neural network on 16k output of the original game, which is why it has to be enabled on a game by game basis. It could be possible for Nintendo to set up servers that train every major title they put out on the console (render it at 16k and improve upscaling between source 1080p and upscaled 4k to look more like the 16k version).

There are some disadvantages of DLSS, but the main advantage is you get the benefits of TAA (anti-aliased edges) without the soft blurry look.

That's not the kind of upscaling we are talking about. We are talking about DLSS or temporal reconstruction.

@Jeronan

Completely wrong. Expect DLSS upscaling of 1080p to 4k to be a next gen feature on the next Switch. There are many ways to get to a better than 1080p image through upscaling to 4k.

Fans have proven to Nintendo that you can take 3 emulated games that cost $30 and pack them together and charge $60 and make 100x more money and sales. I don't think virtual console is coming. I think more "here are 3 emulated games" collections are coming.

Wave Race x F-Zero 4 n64 and Gamecube games? $60. Copy of N64 Pokemon Snap with the Switch Pokemon Snap? Zelda compilation for $60?

$180 in Canada after tax to play 4 old virtual console ports. Yay. No remasters, just widescreen originals. I don't know how anyone can defend Nintendo anymore. I don't care how much money they are making. I'm done with the Switch for good.

@Jeronan It is not true that there isn't a much faster SoC available. The main problem with the Tegra X1 was the memory bus cut in half. The Tegra X2 alone already more than doubles memory bandwidth through the bus, then you can also use faster ram. The CPU is 6 years old, you can use a 2 year old CPU instead, like what is in the cheapest phones today (like what is in the Pixel 4A). And as for the GPU? The Switch uses Maxwell and does everyone remember that going from the GTX 970 to 1070 was a whopping 70 percent improvement in The Witcher 3? Nintendo would get that just from Switching to Pascal. Even better, just stick 768 Ampere cores and you'd already have a system 4x faster. The Switch launched using the N20 node, nVidia already has the N5 node available for 2021. Logic density is increased more than 10x... they can put as many cores as they want, even 1000, and not use more than the original 20W budget. Just like Apple, Nintendo has 6 years of iPhone improvements available to them already.

The Switch is hot right now, that will give them a huge boost with a new system, and it is always a good idea to launch around when your competition launches.

Nintendo like many companies isn't just serving their consumers, but also their developers. I'm sure the demand for a better system is insanely high. Squaresoft has made FF7 Remake for example, and they know that they can make more money selling it on Switch than anywhere else, but sadly it won't run. They'll be pressuring Nintendo, promising Nintendo their glorious 30 percent cut of the revenue, "please release a faster Switch, and we'll bring all our games there".

@NEStalgia I think it would be smart to take advantage of the desire for a better Switch and get a huge install base before the PS5 and Series X are established. There's a reason consoles often launch in sync.

Imagine a next gen Switch launches with FF7 Remake in April. Heads would explode.

@NEStalgia Graphics are not just pretty eye candy. If the game is at 30fps, it isn't as good a game. If you can't see clearly it isn't good. So resolution and frame rate are separate from "pretty" graphics. The final problem is if you have not enough power, you don't have the game at all. Again it isn't about pretty or not pretty graphics, it is about being able to play the game or not.

Final Fantasy 7 isn't coming to Switch, it is too slow. It isn't a problem of visuals, you literally can't play it at all. A faster Switch brings more games to the platform. You can wreck the visuals and lower the resolution and frame rate, FF7 still won't come to the Switch, the very engine that drives the game won't work.

@SwitchForce Which Switch haters? The users who always attack anyone who likes the idea of a new and better Switch? The only haters I see are the owners of the Switch.

@Heavyarms55 It's not semantics. The gameboy and gameboy advance and vita all had docks, they were not home consoles. Laptops are not desktops, some people understand the differences. I do agree Nintendo might not want to be in the home console market at all since tech has changed and weaker mobile chips might be enough for them, but that would be a bit of a sad end to their 40 year history of state of the art gaming. But it is forward looking, modern hardware might be all going mobile. Cheers

@Jeronan Another person who can't understand "4k output" and not "4k resolution", those are totally different things.

@Heavyarms55 Nintendo did die in the home console market, they've always been on top with portable hardware, and they are doing better than ever with portable hardware, but the home hardware market? They exited the market in failure.

There is nothing wrong with wanting the NES-Gamecube days to come back, when you can buy one console and play all the latest games, Nintendo and third party.

You can plug your laptop in to your TV, but you can't then claim that you own the desktop market.

@westman98 The Switch is half a GTX 750, the cheapest GPU nVidia sold in 2014, and the CPU is from the 2014 Note 4. People just want an up to date CPU (which could handle 60fps open world) like a 2 year old A76 core like in the Snapdragon 855, and a full GPU from 2020, like a GTX 1650, the cheapest card today, instead of half of one. One of the reason the Switch is so slow is they cut the bus width to the memory in half also, so it is literally half a GTX 750 mobile chip. Using a mobile max Q GTX 1650 shrunk to 7nm would be perfect for the Switch.

@Moistnado did you just fail to read all the comments explaining it is about native 4k output, not resolution?

@skywake exactly, proper 4k upscaling is a weird omission of the current Switch

@Heavyarms55 Yeah I was getting annoyed at all the outright negativity surround new hardware. Xbox and Sony and PC people are all happy to get new stuff, heck Linus Tech Tips is devoted to "what's new" but Nintendo sites are just constantly attacking anyone who says THEY want something more, as if because someone is satisfied with their Switch that changes the fact that there are 10's of millions of people who want a faster one. Nintendo literally lost in the home console market and died out, and there are still 100 million people who'd rather have just one console, a Nintendo one, instead of buying two.

@graysoncharles Yes, motion resolution is a thing, the actual resolution when moving the camera is incredibly low when you are at 30fps, like 200p, not 1080p...

I think Mario Odyssey looks great on Switch, thank you 60fps.

@westman98
I'd personally love 1080p / 60fps Breath of the Wild 2. For many people, myself included, 30fps is painful on the eyes, it is not just about looks. It causes a lot of fatigue to play at 30fps.

Also the article says "正打造下一代Switch". "Next Generation Switch", a model with a lot of changes.

@Heavyarms55

I didn't say they need to upgrade their TV, it is based on the fact that a majority of TVs are in 4k already and costs little to nothing, I was responding to all the ignorant (which isn't an insult so much as a fact, and warranted when someone uses it to attack the 4k comment in the original article without even comprehending the words used) comments interpreting 4k support as somehow the games would then be rendered at 4k, which no one ever suggested.

Thank you for agreeing though, it is hardly a problem to release a better console. It is up to developers which consoles they support, it isn't "hard" in anyway.

Over 1/3 of households have a 4k tv, and more than half of all new tvs sold are 4k.

@WiltonRoots And noticed Nintendo died in the home console market. You think digital foundry is a joke, but the entire market for home consoles abandoned Nintendo and they had their worst sales ever, the Wii U. That was because the hardware sucked and was overpriced and didn't even come with a normal controller, those basic things you are mocking. Switch sales have nothing to do with that, the Switch IS GOOD portable hardware, 100x faster than the 3DS, unusually gutsy for Nintendo. The problem is the lack of a quality home console.

You have to laugh at all the ignorant comments at the top of the article. 4K support means it can output a 4k signal to a 4k TV. That way, you have native scaling (instead of relying on the TV's scaling or worse the receiver's). HDMI 2.0 support is all that means, which is a bare minimum for any console. It has NOTHING TO DO with the internal resolution of the game, which can be anything, but it will look better. The nVidia shield already supports it. I can't stand all the "I don't need anything better" attitudes around here. When did Nintendo fans stop caring about anything. They are demanding no games and no improved hardware. And new hardware isn't hard to target, you just make the game for the old hardware and the new one easily runs it, hurting no one. I can't stand the people on this site anymore. No desire for better or new hardware or for more games.

They'd rather Nintendo was still making NES games.

@Razer It's not a home console because of the cost. That makes no sense. I find it bizarre how effective Nintendo's marketing is, it is a portable, the successor to the 3DS, that is obvious. It uses portable hardware (the same as the portable nVidia Shield devices) and it is indeed portable, you can play the Switch portably.

I can dock the gameboy, the gameboy advance (my gamecube has a dock for it) and the Vita, they are still portables, not home consoles. Nintendo is not selling a home system at the moment. When they want to use a GPU that uses more than 10 watts then we will have a home console again.

@Giancarlothomaz

It isn't a normal home console though so comparing the PS4 numbers vs. the Switch doesn't make sense, you should compare the Switch vs. the PSP and 3DS and DS.

Clearly Nintendo should release a new more powerful Switch in 2021 with Final Fantasy 7 remake a launch title

@electrolite77 Fair enough, launching a home console the same year they launch a Switch revision would make sense, get the CPUs in sync etc., even if the GPU power would be miles different. Though it's not about what I want, as regarding financials. I was trying to point out that Sony's financials have been declining since the PS2/PSP era, and Nintendo and Microsoft have been declining since the Xbox 360 and Wii/DS era.

There were a lot of articles like this one buying Sony's and Nintendo's PR this week. I just wanted to point out also that actually the desiribility of consoles has decreased a lot. They are just selling to more and more countries that are wealthier now. Look at NA alone:

PS2: 53 million, Wii + DS: 45 + 57 = 102 million, Xbox 360: 49 million, all vastly outsold the Switch and PS4 (just 34 million in NA). Nintendo might hit 100 million combined in NA with a Switch, Switch Lite, Switch Pro, and home console however. Who knows.

@electrolite77 Again though you misunderstand what I want, NOBODY is asking Nintendo to split them, but to serve both consumer demands and the market at the same time. They can easily release a home console that plays only the exact same games you can play on the Switch, but with a normal controller included, a much lower price, and higher resolutions and frame rates.

This is not an either / or situation, but a "both" situation. The Switch isn't successful because of a lack of a home console or the Wii U's failure, but due to its own merits. And the games are the same, because the Switch is so powerful for a mobile system, not because a home console doesn't exist.

@Richnj Also don't forget that a "Switch Home" would be cheaper than the Switch. It would only cost $199 to $250 to make a lower powered Wii type console (like a GTX 1650), and you'd get a good controller in the box, instead of no standard controller.

@Toy_Link You are quite right, Sony is not doing well. It does matter that they lost the mobile market. Sony is not making much money off the PS4 compared to the PS3 and PSP.

@Richnj Having a home console doesn't mean you can't buy a Switch. The Switch has inherent worth, but doesn't need to replace a proper home console. Why are Switch owners always attacking all the Nintendo fans out there? You can play all the same games on both consoles.

1-2 Switch, and Mario Tennis Aces were both not very good, so that makes sense.

@Richnj Notice how people are cheating and including the Switch Lite in sales of the Switch, then saying it is overtaking the SNES in home console sales? The Switch Lite isn't a home console. We should be comparing vs the DS but that would look bad in comparison, and what is really bad is Nintendo's total platform sales, Wii and DS vs. Switch. The thing Nintendo fans (and investors) actually care about. They replaced two profitable businesses with one that is smaller, that isn't a great long term strategy. I love the Switch, but I'd like to see Nintendo expand. Where's the home console?

@retro_player_22

You're not limiting the market by making a non Switch system. Just ensure the same games are for both systems. One portable, one at 4k 60fps etc.

This is actually not that successful for Nintendo. They sold 250 million Wii and DS, you have to look at the total business. They are missing the home console market right now, better to have two complementary products than one, and have double the sales. The Switch and the Home Console are not competitors, but complementary. For Nintendo's sake and the fans, I hope they release a GTX 1650 Super based home console soon. Would be the perfect $199 home console like the Wii was. The difference between high end hardware and low end hardware is small compared to 10 years ago.

Could use the $150 RX 5500 which is equal in power to the Xbox One X also. Would make a great Wii type device, but be even cheaper to make than the Wii (no optical drive, just use the cartridges from the Switch). The main problem with the Xbox and PS4 is their hard drives and weak CPUs, and the CPU issue for a Nintendo home console would be solved by any modern ARM core. They are tiny and cheap, would add less than 10 percent to the cost of manufacturing. 4 x Cortex A76 cores (basically HALF of a Snapdragon 855 in a modern phone), there you go, faster than Xbox One X's CPU and costs nothing to add to the RX 5500 or GTX 1650 Super.

The Wii was also manufactured by NEC in Japan, which cost a lot more than using TSMC in Taiwan, and would also bring large cost savings, riding on the work that mobile makers have done.

The Switch is slightly slower than the $199 iPod Touch. If even Apple makes ENOUGH money at $199 I'm sure Nintendo can.