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Topic: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U - OT

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DefHalan

Jazzer94 wrote:

DefHalan wrote:

Wave Dashing is a glitch the professional players used. It wasn't supposed to be in the game. I find that most professional circuits (except maybe MOBAs and RTSs) rely on glitches too often. Professionals often point to "mastering" these glitches as the key to playing these games.

Actually Sakurai knew about wavedashing and left it in so although originally a not intended they allowed it to be in the game so not completely true.

Really? Where did you hear that? I would be interested to read more on it

People keep saying the Xbox One doesn't have Backwards Compatibility.
I don't think they know what Backwards Compatibility means...

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8BitSamurai

DefHalan wrote:

Jazzer94 wrote:

DefHalan wrote:

Wave Dashing is a glitch the professional players used. It wasn't supposed to be in the game. I find that most professional circuits (except maybe MOBAs and RTSs) rely on glitches too often. Professionals often point to "mastering" these glitches as the key to playing these games.

Actually Sakurai knew about wavedashing and left it in so although originally a not intended they allowed it to be in the game so not completely true.

Really? Where did you hear that? I would be interested to read more on it

I heard it too and was gonna post it, but I don't remember where it was, so I have to take it with a grain of salt.

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DefHalan

DefHalan wrote:

Jazzer94 wrote:

DefHalan wrote:

Wave Dashing is a glitch the professional players used. It wasn't supposed to be in the game. I find that most professional circuits (except maybe MOBAs and RTSs) rely on glitches too often. Professionals often point to "mastering" these glitches as the key to playing these games.

Actually Sakurai knew about wavedashing and left it in so although originally a not intended they allowed it to be in the game so not completely true.

Really? Where did you hear that? I would be interested to read more on it

Googled and found it, still seems like a glitch to me. Just a glitch they chose not to fix. You can argue it isn't a glitch because they knew about it before the end of development. I still consider it was a glitch and probably just too difficult to fix at the point in development that they found it.

Edited on by DefHalan

People keep saying the Xbox One doesn't have Backwards Compatibility.
I don't think they know what Backwards Compatibility means...

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The_Ninja

I hope Sakurai doesn't listen too much to the competitive scene. Most of them think Project M is superior than Brawl, and that the competitive scene knows how to create a game better than Sakurai.

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Joeynator3000

The_Ninja wrote:

I hope Sakurai doesn't listen too much to the competitive scene. Most of them think Project M is superior than Brawl, and that the competitive scene knows how to create a game better than Sakurai.

I think I heard that at the E3 roundtable one of those competitive people was attending...thinking he knew everything. Asked if he could be Sakurai in a match, if that he could help with balancing this game. Sakurai pretty much shut him up after that. "Do you know how to develop a game?" xD

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DefHalan

The_Ninja wrote:

I hope Sakurai doesn't listen too much to the competitive scene. Most of them think Project M is superior than Brawl, and that the competitive scene knows how to create a game better than Sakurai.

Competitive players become too ingrained in a certain meta. That is why we see lots of fighting games that come out and barely change things from the one before. (example: Street Fight 4, how many different version of essentially the same game are there?)

People keep saying the Xbox One doesn't have Backwards Compatibility.
I don't think they know what Backwards Compatibility means...

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19Robb92

I think this game really seems to be spot on when it comes to how SSB should be developed. It looks to be an amazing party game that anyone can play & if you want to, you're able to play it very competitively.

It shouldn't be focused on being solely a party game or solely a competitive game, IMO.

Edited on by 19Robb92

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DefHalan

19Robb92 wrote:

I think this game really seems to be spot on when it comes to how SSB should be developed. It looks to be an amazing party game that anyone can play & if you want to, you're able to play it very competitively.

It shouldn't be focused on being solely a party game or solely a competitive game, IMO.

Yea my brother is kinda getting into the competitive side of Melee and I keep showing him Smash 4 stuff and he just shrugs it off. He doesn't like how "slow" it is compared to Melee. I think it is faster than Brawl but he doesn't.

People keep saying the Xbox One doesn't have Backwards Compatibility.
I don't think they know what Backwards Compatibility means...

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Jazzer94

DefHalan wrote:

DefHalan wrote:

Jazzer94 wrote:

DefHalan wrote:

Wave Dashing is a glitch the professional players used. It wasn't supposed to be in the game. I find that most professional circuits (except maybe MOBAs and RTSs) rely on glitches too often. Professionals often point to "mastering" these glitches as the key to playing these games.

Actually Sakurai knew about wavedashing and left it in so although originally a not intended they allowed it to be in the game so not completely true.

Really? Where did you hear that? I would be interested to read more on it

Googled and found it, still seems like a glitch to me. Just a glitch they chose not to fix. You can argue it isn't a glitch because they knew about it before the end of development. I still consider it was a glitch and probably just too difficult to fix at the point in development that they found it.

Yeah sorry forgot to provide a link but the fact is wavedashing isn't as much of a glitch as people make out and isn't the most important tech skill L cancelling is much more important and that is not a glitch.

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19Robb92

DefHalan wrote:

Yea my brother is kinda getting into the competitive side of Melee and I keep showing him Smash 4 stuff and he just shrugs it off. He doesn't like how "slow" it is compared to Melee. I think it is faster than Brawl but he doesn't.

It's definitely faster than SSBB. I saw people playing Bowser during the 3DS tournament at SDCC and he moves a LOT quicker than in Brawl. People seemed to love playing as the guy.

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DefHalan

Jazzer94 wrote:

Yeah sorry forgot to provide a link but the fact is wavedashing isn't as much of a glitch as people make out and isn't the most important tech skill L cancelling is much more important and that is not a glitch.

I would also count L-Canceling as a glitch, just as I count BXR and Double Shot in Halo 2 as glitches and they use the same concept. (sorry Halo 2 was my most competitive game back in the day so I might compare it a lot lol)

Edited on by DefHalan

People keep saying the Xbox One doesn't have Backwards Compatibility.
I don't think they know what Backwards Compatibility means...

3DS Friend Code: 2621-2786-9784 | Nintendo Network ID: DefHalan

Jazzer94

DefHalan wrote:

Jazzer94 wrote:

Yeah sorry forgot to provide a link but the fact is wavedashing isn't as much of a glitch as people make out and isn't the most important tech skill L cancelling is much more important and that is not a glitch.

I would also count L-Canceling as a glitch, just as I count BXR and Double Shot in Halo 2 as glitches and they use the same concept. (sorry Halo 2 was my most competitive game back in the day so I might compare it a lot lol)

How can it be a glitch when Smash 64 tells you how to do it.

Edit: Translate this page http://www.nintendo.co.jp/n01/n64/software/nus_p_nalj/smash/C... go down to Air attack landing and read the bit about Z cancelling which became L cancelling in Melee.

Edited on by Jazzer94

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Nintendo_Ninja

The competitive scene improves stuff in the game, and ruins stuff in the game. Those who find Melee superior to the new one after both new games have been released need to put up or shut up. Enough of Melee. It had it's time. Now you need to embrace the new games and the new games need to replace Melee. I understand why people dislike Brawl, but why dislike the new games? Those Project M guys do more harm then good and the Melee crowd prevents progress in the franchise.

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Jazzer94

Nintendo_Ninja wrote:

The competitive scene improves stuff in the game, and ruins stuff in the game. Those who find Melee superior to the new one after both new games have been released need to put up or shut up. Enough of Melee. It had it's time. Now you need to embrace the new games and the new games need to replace Melee. I understand why people dislike Brawl, but why dislike the new games? Those Project M guys do more harm then good and the Melee crowd prevents progress in the franchise.

I don't agree with this people should be allowed to play what they want if the competitive community enjoy playing Melee more I can't see why they should stop if new games do not satisfy what they deem fun and competitive. I haven't played enough of SSB4 to give a complete 100% certain judgement on the game but even from the 8 minutes I played the Wii U version and like 1-2 hrs 3DS I know I'm still going to continue to play Melee along with 4 due to the fact that landing lag was a lot grabs were a tad janky compared to previous entries, the game was faster and there was more hitstun but a few things felt off I'm still excited to buy and play it but can't see why I should abandon Melee just because it isn't new anymore to me that is a silly reason.

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Prof_Clayton

Jazzer94 wrote:

Nintendo_Ninja wrote:

The competitive scene improves stuff in the game, and ruins stuff in the game. Those who find Melee superior to the new one after both new games have been released need to put up or shut up. Enough of Melee. It had it's time. Now you need to embrace the new games and the new games need to replace Melee. I understand why people dislike Brawl, but why dislike the new games? Those Project M guys do more harm then good and the Melee crowd prevents progress in the franchise.

I don't agree with this people should be allowed to play what they want if the competitive community enjoy playing Melee more I can't see why they should stop if new games do not satisfy what they deem fun and competitive. I haven't played enough of SSB4 to give a complete 100% certain judgement on the game but even from the 8 minutes I played the Wii U version and like 1-2 hrs 3DS I know I'm still going to continue to play Melee along with 4 due to the fact that landing lag was a lot grabs were a tad janky compared to previous entries, the game was faster and there was more hitstun but a few things felt off I'm still excited to buy and play it but can't see why I should abandon Melee just because it isn't new anymore to me that is a silly reason.

Pretty sure they were referring to the people who completely disown Brawl and Smash 4 because Melee is way better to them. Just because one is 'perfect' doesn't mean you have to ignore the others.

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Mickey

Nintendo_Ninja wrote:

The competitive scene improves stuff in the game, and ruins stuff in the game. Those who find Melee superior to the new one after both new games have been released need to put up or shut up.

The term "put up or shut up" usually means "take action in order to do what they were talking about, or stop talking about it." Like, what would taking action be for people who like Melee better? Play Melee? Because I think that's what they've been doing...

Enough of Melee. It had it's time. Now you need to embrace the new games and the new games need to replace Melee. I understand why people dislike Brawl, but why dislike the new games? Those Project M guys do more harm then good and the Melee crowd prevents progress in the franchise.

Okay, first: They don't need to do anything. It's their life. Second: What are the Project M guys doing that's causing harm? Modifying a game (that they bought) in order to have more fun with it? How is this affecting anything or anyone else? Are you saying that they're making people not buy the newer games with their mods of Brawl? Because that shouldn't be on them. It should be Nintendo's job to convince the Melee crowd that the new game is worth buying (which they've been doing a splendid job of, I must say), not the people who do mods of an old game that isn't making Nintendo anymore money nowadays.

TL;DR: Let the people play their game. The games they play (or modify) do not—and should not—concern you.

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The_Ninja

I still have Melee, and I love it, but I doubt I'll play it much after Smash 4 is out. I barely play it now, it's just for my collection. I much prefer playing Brawl. You don't have to play it, just stop hating on it. If M2K started developing Smash, it would have no items, Final Destination and Battlefield, no modes besides the smash mode, be exactly like Melee etc.

@Mickey They can have fun, but do they need to be so ignorant? Thinking they can create a game better than Sakurai? They love continuously hating on Brawl too.

Edited on by The_Ninja

The_Ninja

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JunkosBoobies

I personally prefer Melee to Brawl, because I enjoy fights in Melee. However, I still think Brawl is a great game, not hating on it at all. Don't think I'll be playing either much though, when SSB4 comes out.

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Mickey

The_Ninja wrote:

@Mickey They can have fun, but do they need to be so ignorant? Thinking they can create a game better than Sakurai? They love continuously hating on Brawl too.

Should it even matter to you that they think they can create a game better than Sakurai?

The answer is "No," by the way.

I personally disagree with them, but you're not gonna see me crying about how not everyone has opinions that match up 100% with mine. If anything, you should be revelling in the fact that you're enjoying a game more than somebody else! That's more happiness for you, man! So they could be missing out on a potentially great game, it's their life, let them miss out. And while they're missing out, we can play what could be the best Smash Bros. yet! I don't know about you, brother, but that excites me. ^_^

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Jazzer94

Prof_Clayton wrote:

Jazzer94 wrote:

Nintendo_Ninja wrote:

The competitive scene improves stuff in the game, and ruins stuff in the game. Those who find Melee superior to the new one after both new games have been released need to put up or shut up. Enough of Melee. It had it's time. Now you need to embrace the new games and the new games need to replace Melee. I understand why people dislike Brawl, but why dislike the new games? Those Project M guys do more harm then good and the Melee crowd prevents progress in the franchise.

I don't agree with this people should be allowed to play what they want if the competitive community enjoy playing Melee more I can't see why they should stop if new games do not satisfy what they deem fun and competitive. I haven't played enough of SSB4 to give a complete 100% certain judgement on the game but even from the 8 minutes I played the Wii U version and like 1-2 hrs 3DS I know I'm still going to continue to play Melee along with 4 due to the fact that landing lag was a lot grabs were a tad janky compared to previous entries, the game was faster and there was more hitstun but a few things felt off I'm still excited to buy and play it but can't see why I should abandon Melee just because it isn't new anymore to me that is a silly reason.

Pretty sure they were referring to the people who completely disown Brawl and Smash 4 because Melee is way better to them. Just because one is 'perfect' doesn't mean you have to ignore the others.

But why are people so concerned about this just let them play what they want, plenty of competitive players played Brawl but players and viewers didn't not find it as good as Melee in terms of a competitive play style/entertaining/rewarding so migration went back to Melee no one should be forced to play something they don't want to so I can't understand this chain of thought it's a tad asinine.

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