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Topic: I found this interesting quote from the E3 2011 "Iwata Asks"

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LordTendoboy

1. Posted:

Taken from http://e3.nintendo.com/iwataasks/

Iwata The other things is, shortly after the Wii console was released, people in the gaming media and game enthusiasts started recognizing the Wii as a casual machine aimed toward families, and placed game consoles by Microsoft and Sony in a very similar light with each other, saying these are machines aimed towards those who passionately play games. It was a categorization between games that were aimed towards core, and casual. I've been having a sense of disagreement as I personally think the definition of a core gamer is much wider, namely, someone who has a much wider range of interests, someone who enthusiastically plays many types of games that challenges different creative directions.

On the other hand, I certainly do not think that Wii was able to cater to every gamer's needs, so that's also something I wanted to resolve.

The keyword for our presentation at this year's E3 is "Deeper and Wider". With Wii U, I would like to offer this proposal with that concept.

Of course, with the Wii console I'm sure everyone would agree that we tried really hard to go wider, but even though we worked aggressively to go deeper in certain areas, the general public's impression that Nintendo was casual grew as time went by.

But first of all, your works have definitely laid the structural foundation of games that are considered core today, Miyamoto-san.

Miyamoto Well…people in the media tend to categorize into different genres, the core and casual because it's easier to characterize it that way. But as you can see with games like The Legend of Zelda, Nintendo is fully staffed with members who are into working on a very core level of detail. And because we know that, we haven't really taken those accounts seriously.

But one of the key reasons that such things as the core and the casuals exist today is that we decided not to adopt HD on the Wii console. Of course, besides that there are things like issues with the controller and the challenges that it brings, network functionalities and many other things, but I think HD was the biggest factor that everyone was able to clearly understand the difference.

In terms of the HD capabilities, Wii U can do something similar, and on top of that, it is equipped with this new controller that adds an entirely new structure to games. I think this is an opportunity for those games that were considered to be core up to now, to evolve into something even more interesting structure. In that sense, I do wish all kinds of games would be released, regardless of the debate over core or casual.

Iwata That core vs. casual debate seems like something that can never see a resolution, but with Wii U, I have a feeling that it all may change. I even feel that the barrier that separated the two genres was only something psychological, just an impression that people had towards them. For example, The Legend of Zelda games were something geared towards the toughest audience, and it has been so from the beginning. So it's not like Nintendo doesn't have it in us. But there are quite a number of people who assume that Nintendo is the equivalent of being casual.

If we are able to break those psychological barriers with Wii U, I feel like we will be able to take our goal of expanding the gaming population even further to the next step. It would even be possible to expand our customer base and bring in more people, and out of those new people, there will be those who will find certain controls or elements of deeper gameplay intriguing, and eventually will become passionate game fans. That was the way the history of video games has been, and I want to keep the tradition going so it doesn't fade away. That, I think is the true meaning of "a game for everyone". A game for everyone isn't just wide, but also very deep. That's how it will become everyone's game.

Do you agree with Iwata and Miyamoto's discussion? I think it sums up the "casual vs core gamer" debate quite nicely, and I really hope Nintendo can inspire 3rd-party developers and gamers with their new systems.

Edited on by LordTendoboy

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arrmixer

2. Posted:

yeah pretty much... the only thing I miss from owning just a wii console is the other third party games i miss... Hopefully with the Wii U, a lot of those third party franchises will be re-release. I just hope the third party companies see potencial $$$$$ in this endeavor. :)

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kkslider5552000

3. Posted:

This amuses me. These guys are partially responsible for this casual vs. hardcore nonsense, and even they're like "this is not what we meant, we are dissappointed people actually think this way." That's not how they put it because they are not stupid.

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JayArr

4. Posted:

tl;dr version?

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Gamesake

5. Posted:

The Wii U sounds more and more like what everyone's been asking for.

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LordTendoboy

6. Posted:

JayArr wrote:

tl;dr version?

You don't like to read? :)

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LordTendoboy

7. Posted:

kkslider5552000 wrote:

This amuses me. These guys are partially responsible for this casual vs. hardcore nonsense, and even they're like "this is not what we meant, we are dissappointed people actually think this way." That's not how they put it because they are not stupid.

Well Apple and Zynga are also responsible for the whole "casual gaming" phenomenon, yet everyone blames just Nintendo for some reason.

If Nintendo can keep their promises, then perhaps the Wii U will truly bridge the gap between "casual and traditional" games. In a way, the Xbox 360 already does that with Kinect and the controller, but the two devices aren't integrated very well together. PS Move is a good attempt by Sony, but most people consider it to be an optional accessory, even though it's bundled with the PS3.

Edited on by LordTendoboy

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abINC4L

8. Posted:

It's a good discussion, I actually never noticed this whole "hardcore vs casual" thing until narrow minded gamers started making a big fuss about it. It was pretty much when the first Playstation came out that people started labeling other consoles (Nintendo in particular) as the kiddie systems and I just thought it was ridiculous, but then again, there are a great majority of people who are just too narrow-minded and ignorant that they'll just label something stupid because it doesn't match what they like.

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LordTendoboy

9. Posted:

abHS4L wrote:

It's a good discussion, I actually never noticed this whole "hardcore vs casual" thing until narrow minded gamers started making a big fuss about it. It was pretty much when the first Playstation came out that people started labeling other consoles (Nintendo in particular) as the kiddie systems and I just thought it was ridiculous, but then again, there are a great majority of people who are just too narrow-minded and ignorant that they'll just label something stupid because it doesn't match what they like.

From these interviews, it seems that Iwata and Miyamoto understand where this mindset comes from, and it looks like they want to address it with the Wii U and 3DS.

I find it very ironic that Nintendo needs to "win back the core gamers" when that demographic almost put them out of business during the GameCube era. And casual gaming flourishes on iOS and Android devices, and no one seems to be complaining about that.

Edited on by LordTendoboy

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RYBlast

10. Posted:

That sounds good on paper, but will Nintendo really be able to utilize that idea and win? We'll see at E3.

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abINC4L

11. Posted:

LordTendoboy wrote:

abHS4L wrote:

It's a good discussion, I actually never noticed this whole "hardcore vs casual" thing until narrow minded gamers started making a big fuss about it. It was pretty much when the first Playstation came out that people started labeling other consoles (Nintendo in particular) as the kiddie systems and I just thought it was ridiculous, but then again, there are a great majority of people who are just too narrow-minded and ignorant that they'll just label something stupid because it doesn't match what they like.

From these interviews, it seems that Iwata and Miyamoto understand where this mindset comes from, and it looks like they want to address it with the Wii U and 3DS.

I find it very ironic that Nintendo needs to "win back the core gamers" when that demographic almost put them out of business during the GameCube era. And casual gaming flourishes on iOS and Android devices, and no one seems to be complaining about that.

Well, it really it the "hardcore gamer" that keeps the industry alive. Casual gamers tend to run the risk of growing out of or tired of gaming, hardcore gamers will most likely be into gaming for a very long time. Being one of many interests and hobbies, I did go for a couple of years when I hardly played videogames save one or two games on occasion, now I'm all into gaming again.

But I get what you're saying, it drives me insane when I see comments like "Nintendo and the same old tired games like Zelda and Mario." especially when they say EXTREMELY ignorant things like "Nintendo milks their franchises." especially when considering the high quality and length of time between each release of Nintendo's IP's, but alas, Nintendo does need core gamers since like I stated, we're the ones who keep the industry alive.

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Aviator

12. Posted:

LordTendoboy wrote:

JayArr wrote:

tl;dr version?

You don't like to read? :)

When you say quote, it usually doesn't mean 10 paragraphs.

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LordTendoboy

13. Posted:

abHS4L wrote:

LordTendoboy wrote:

abHS4L wrote:

It's a good discussion, I actually never noticed this whole "hardcore vs casual" thing until narrow minded gamers started making a big fuss about it. It was pretty much when the first Playstation came out that people started labeling other consoles (Nintendo in particular) as the kiddie systems and I just thought it was ridiculous, but then again, there are a great majority of people who are just too narrow-minded and ignorant that they'll just label something stupid because it doesn't match what they like.

From these interviews, it seems that Iwata and Miyamoto understand where this mindset comes from, and it looks like they want to address it with the Wii U and 3DS.

I find it very ironic that Nintendo needs to "win back the core gamers" when that demographic almost put them out of business during the GameCube era. And casual gaming flourishes on iOS and Android devices, and no one seems to be complaining about that.

Well, it really it the "hardcore gamer" that keeps the industry alive. Casual gamers tend to run the risk of growing out of or tired of gaming, hardcore gamers will most likely be into gaming for a very long time. Being one of many interests and hobbies, I did go for a couple of years when I hardly played videogames save one or two games on occasion, now I'm all into gaming again.

But I get what you're saying, it drives me insane when I see comments like "Nintendo and the same old tired games like Zelda and Mario." especially when they say EXTREMELY ignorant things like "Nintendo milks their franchises." especially when considering the high quality and length of time between each release of Nintendo's IP's, but alas, Nintendo does need core gamers since like I stated, we're the ones who keep the industry alive.

True, we do keep this industry alive, but without the casual gamers, the Wii and DS would have never had such huge success. And it's the casual gamers that made iOS and Android so popular. So I guess the industry needs both casual and "core" gamers.

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abINC4L

14. Posted:

LordTendoboy wrote:

abHS4L wrote:

LordTendoboy wrote:

abHS4L wrote:

It's a good discussion, I actually never noticed this whole "hardcore vs casual" thing until narrow minded gamers started making a big fuss about it. It was pretty much when the first Playstation came out that people started labeling other consoles (Nintendo in particular) as the kiddie systems and I just thought it was ridiculous, but then again, there are a great majority of people who are just too narrow-minded and ignorant that they'll just label something stupid because it doesn't match what they like.

From these interviews, it seems that Iwata and Miyamoto understand where this mindset comes from, and it looks like they want to address it with the Wii U and 3DS.

I find it very ironic that Nintendo needs to "win back the core gamers" when that demographic almost put them out of business during the GameCube era. And casual gaming flourishes on iOS and Android devices, and no one seems to be complaining about that.

Well, it really it the "hardcore gamer" that keeps the industry alive. Casual gamers tend to run the risk of growing out of or tired of gaming, hardcore gamers will most likely be into gaming for a very long time. Being one of many interests and hobbies, I did go for a couple of years when I hardly played videogames save one or two games on occasion, now I'm all into gaming again.

But I get what you're saying, it drives me insane when I see comments like "Nintendo and the same old tired games like Zelda and Mario." especially when they say EXTREMELY ignorant things like "Nintendo milks their franchises." especially when considering the high quality and length of time between each release of Nintendo's IP's, but alas, Nintendo does need core gamers since like I stated, we're the ones who keep the industry alive.

True, we do keep this industry alive, but without the casual gamers, the Wii and DS would have never had such huge success. And it's the casual gamers that made iOS and Android so popular. So I guess the industry needs both casual and "core" gamers.

Of course, but I think Nintendo has recognized that for a gaming company like them, they really cannot survive on just casual gamers, which is why they're so dead set on winning back the "core gamer". Either way, I'm excited for the Wii U, if all goes well with it, I might not have to buy games for my 360 anymore (since none of Microsoft's exclusives interest me). I'm hoping Namco Bandai treats the Wii U with the same love they do with Sony's system and give us some damn Tales games! I'm super excited for Tales of Graces F and Tales of Xilia but both are for the PS3 ><, at least my brother owns one and I can just play when he's not home, haha.

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LordTendoboy

15. Posted:

In order for Nintendo (and any console manufacturer) to be truly successful, they need to have balance. Dont cater to just "core" or "casual". They need to treat both demographics equally.

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Unca_Lz

16. Posted:

No wonder I love Nintendo. The head honchos have a good head (PUNNY) on their shoulders.

I'm just fed up with all this casual vs. hardcore crap. The terms have been misused and abused to the point where they don't mean the same thing to everyone. I'm a big time gamer but I like the "casual" games too; what does that make me, a core or casual gamer?

I also find it ironically hilarious that some gamers claim that Nintendo is milking their franchises considering they're more than likely playing games by Activision, EA, Capcom or Square Enix.

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BenAV

17. Posted:

I own a Wii and I don't own a PS3 or 360 and I wouldn't consider myself a 'casual' gamer.
I spend a majority of my free time playing video games, and I enjoy playing games from many different genres.
The Wii may not be HD or have very much decent third party support, but personally I feel like it still has an extensive library of quality titles from many different genres, and it has been keeping me pretty occupied for hours on a daily basis for the last several years.
I guess I don't really understand what the term 'casual' means if the Wii is just a system for casual gamers.

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Squid

18. Posted:

To be honest, I don't see how the Wii U could "bridge the gap" between hardcore and casual gamers. Once the new console comes out and people see the Nintendo name, they will probably still label it as "casual". Even if the more "hardcore" games are available on the Wii U, who's to say they won't also be available on other consoles? If they are available on other consoles, then people would probably buy the games for those more "hardcore" consoles instead. Therefore, there could still be problems with this debate. How could this be different than Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 being on Wii, yet the game gets better reviews on other platforms?

Edited on by Squid

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JGMR

19. Posted:

I sincerely got a problem with the philosophy of 'a game for everybody'. Super Mario Bros. wasn't a 'game for everybody', and yet it changed gaming forever. It looks like Nintendo is trying to do (force) something which can only happen spontaneously and without any effort. Taoists will understand what I am talking about.

Day by day I get more disappointed in the way things are going in the 'games world'. And I don't think I'll get a Wii U because of it.

Edited on by JGMR

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abINC4L

20. Posted:

DarkSquid wrote:

To be honest, I don't see how the Wii U could "bridge the gap" between hardcore and casual gamers. Once the new console comes out and people see the Nintendo name, they will probably still label it as "casual". Even if the more "hardcore" games are available on the Wii U, who's to say they won't also be available on other consoles? If they are available on other consoles, then people would probably buy the games for those more "hardcore" consoles instead. Therefore, there could still be problems with this debate. How could this be different than Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 being on Wii, yet the game gets better reviews on other platforms?

That's what Nintendo's trying to fix with the Wii U, the Wii U will have superior graphics (games will look closer to the PC version compared to the 360 and PS3 versions). Plus they're hoping the developers take the extra step and give the Wii U versions added functionality to make the Wii U version stand out in comparison. I know I'm probably going to buy whatever multiplatform game I want on the Wii U instead of 360 for the most part (maybe I'll stick to fighting games on the 360 but I don't get those as much).

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