Topic: The Nintendo Switch Thread

@YummyHappyPills
Whether you have better options is completely subjective. To the people buying this device, they probably view this as the best option.

Why would you do that when there's streaming apps? The same reason you would buy a Switch despite the fact PS4 streams to Vita. Streaming sucks and it is not a viable alternative.

You keep asking why would somebody want it. It's not just about "playing PC games on the go", it's about playing video games on the go. Whether or not they are PC games is completely irrelevant. What do you mean where is the mouse or trackpad? Nobody wants a mouse or trackpad on a handheld gaming device. People want a clamshell with analog sticks and buttons. Most PC games now are compatible with a controller. It's no different than buying a game on the PS4. Native controller support, and even if there's not, GPD Win auto maps the mouse to analog. So you can literally play any PC game as a handheld game.

It's not about touting itself as "portable PC gaming". It's about touting itself as "portable gaming". Whether or not the games run on PC is completely irrelevant. It's video games. People want to play video games on handhelds. You can't segment every single gamer out there into a nice little compartmentalized box and slap a label on it. Oh well either you're a "PC gamer" and you want mouse and keyboard and the absolute latest and greatest games. Or oh you're a "console gamer" and you want tv play. There is a lot of gray area in between and a lot of just straight up gamers who want to play video games on the go, and are willing to pay for it if it means getting a premium experience.

Yes this thing plays some PC games. Just as Switch plays some of the games available in the industry. Just as certain PC's play some games. But it's not about the games can't play, it's about what it can play. And the games the original could play was a list thousands of games long. This one will be 10,000.

The entire Xbox 360 library that came to PC will be playable on this. The entire PS3 library that came to PC will be playable as well. The entire Wii library. GameCube library (and make no mistake, that's been the dream of many gamers for years). PS2 library. Even some current gen games. DOOM runs at full 720p at nearly 50fps. Fallout 4 will be running just as well as consoles once they figure out the best configurations. You're getting a experience of Skyrim just as good as Switch. There are countless games that this thing will run. You keep saying some like it's just a basket of a dozen games but we are talking entire generations of libraries that will run on this. There will be more games that will run on this thing out of the box then the switch will ever see in its entire life span. The promise of a portable PS3/360 is here.

If you're asking who it's for, it's for the same people who bought the last one. And probably more people this time, because the last one wasn't that impressive. It was just on the verge of having enough power... it needed just a little more oomph. And this one brings the oomph and then some. And yes it is most definitely for people who want to play emulators, but this time Dolphin. That's been the dream for years. GameCube and Wii on handheld has been the dream. And yes it runs PC games at lower settings just as any portable device will run at a lower setting than PC would. Every single Switch game in existence runs at lower settings than a PC would run it at. That is the nature of portable gaming. If you're trying to get the highest settings you're not going to be playing portably. But a hundred million handheld gamers out there care about gaming on the go. And they aren't comparing their handhelds to their PCs. They're comparing their handhelds to their previous handhelds and this thing blows their previous handhelds out of the water. Maybe only a select few of them are willing to pay for such a premium device, but that's fine. At least the option is there for those that want it.

The price is steep though, and that will ensure it stays niche. But this is, by far, the most powerful handheld gaming device ever created... as it should be. For $600, I would expect nothing less. But let's not pretend there isn't a market out there for premium handheld gaming. People don't want to stream, and Switch doesn't offer much in the way of 3rd party games. So there really has been no other viable alternative to play all these other games... until now. Think about all the games out there: Mass Effect 1, 2 and 3 on the go. Dragon Age, Mirrors Edge, SSX, Burnout Paradise, Rayman Origins and Legends, Xcom, Fallout 3, Fallout New Vegas, Fallout 4, The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion and Skyrim, maybe you want to play Dark Souls, Dark Souls 2, Dark Souls 3, Metal Gear Rising Revengeance, Portal, Portal 2 and Half Life 2, Forza Horizon 2, Fable games, Divinity Original Sin, Divinity Original Sin 2, Torment Tides of Numenera, Diablo 3, Darksiders 1 and 2, countless Assassins Creed and Call of Duty games, Wolfenstein The New Order (maybe even Wolfenstein 2?), Dishonored, Bioshock games, Tomb Raider, Rise of the Tomb Raider, Ultra Street Fighter IV, Ori and the Blind Forest, Ori and the Will of the Wisps, GTAV, The Witcher 2, DMC4, Metal Gear Solid V (the first could almost run it), Bayonetta, Beyond Good & Evil HD, Valkyria Chronicles, Tales of Symphonia HD, Cuphead, etc etc etc.

That's making no mention of having an HD handheld GameCube and HD handheld Wii. Xenoblade Chronicles, Metroid Prime 1, 2 and 3, Fire Emblem Path of Radiance and Radiant Dawn, F-Zero GX, Zelda Windwaker and Twilight Princess, Pikmin and Pikmin 2, Super Mario Sunshine, Paper Mario Thousand Year Door, Mario Kart Double Dash, Smash Bros Melee, Kirby AirRide, Waverace Blue Storm and 1080 Avalanche, Baten Kaitos Origins and Baten Kaitos EWatLO, Skies of Arcadia, Metal Gear Solid Twin Snakes, The Last Story, Pandoras Tower, Mario a Galaxy 1 and 2, Super Paper Mario, Mario Kart Wii, Smash Bros Brawl, DKC Returns, Sin & Punishment 2, Metroid Other M, Resident Evil 4, Muramasa, Okami, etc etc etc

And even all that is just the tippity top of the iceberg. There are so many games out there ripe for the picking it's ridiculous. Even if it's just a handheld GameCube + Wii + Xbox 360 + PS3 + small range of select current gen titles... that's an incredibly appealing proposition for those who are willing to pay the price. And really, it's no different than Xbox One X. People said the same thing you are saying now- "Who's it for? People who want high-end gaming will just play on PC. People who want consoles don't want to pay that much." Etc etc. But we see from its sales, there are people who want a high-end console. Just like there are people who want a high-end handheld. It's never going to be a mass appeal product- we're talking about a premium, $600-700 gaming handheld after all. But I foresee this being much more popular than the first one. The price will drop after a while. And once it hits that $500 mark, I think that's the sweet spot that'll start turning heads. Especially once it's been put through enough tests to compile a list of which games are compatible to run properly.

@FragRed I'd say it's inevitable Golf will be one of the games that will have online play included as part of the subscription.Really curious how they're going to do this.1st party NES games that could have online added aren't exactly plentiful. There are the sports games, most of which have aged terribly, Dr Mario and Balloon Fight which have already been announced, Excite Bike, Ice Climbers and Urban Champion and a handful of others at most. Even f they were to only include one game with added online play each month as part of the subscription, they'll be out of games in just over a year. This subscription is surely going to be an ongoing thing, at least for the next 3 or 4 years of the Switch's life anyway. No doubt there will be some 3rd party games like Bubble Bobble and Contra as part of it as well but there has to be more to this than what we think.

Super Mario Bros 3 is also apparently one of the games with added online, that didn't have 2 player co-op though so to me that's a big clue that this Classic Game Collection is going to be more than just a simple ROM dump with basic online functions. They were criticised already for only having 1 NES game and 1 SNES game with added online each month. That was then scrapped and as it says in their website just now, it'll just include NES games. After the criticism, surely they're not going to then come back with just 1 NES game instead. That'll then be a worse deal than what we were getting before haha.

@DarthNocturna

Yes it's compatible. It has a button on the front to switch modes between normal and the analogs working as the mouse. You could, in theory, look up a mouse and alternate keyboard if you so desired. But I don't know why you would. This thing is basically a premium 3DS, and designed to be played like any other clamshell handheld. I guess if you really wanted to though, it's always an option.

Some people might prefer to carry a full laptop that is more powerful, but some people like the pocket portability of a handheld device. At least now we finally have a viable option to choose from. Options are good. And it's not like this thing is going to affect Switch in any way. People who have enough money to buy this thing likely have enough money to buy multiple consoles.

Nintendo started thinking about the concept for Switch in 2012

http://nintendoeverything.com/nintendo-started-thinking-about...

http://toyokeizai.net/articles/-/200053

@OorWullie I should point out that the games were said to have "online play", which isn't necessarily the same thing as online multiplayer. In most cases the online play will be leaderboards or daily challenges or something like that.

@SLIGEACH_EIRE Sounds about right. Wasn't there an Iwata Asks on the Wii U that showed a Gamepad prototype that was a piece of cardboard with Wiimotes attached to the sides?

@DarthNocturnal

Yeah, those aren't typically games I would try to play on a handheld system. I'd stick with games that have controller support from being on consoles. There's so many games that can be played well with a controller and were designed for a controller, or at the very least work well with the mouse mapped to the controller (Dragon Age, for example) that I would save those types of games for when I was actually home playing on a PC. Just because the handheld is running Windows, I wouldn't take that to mean you should try to play those types of games on it. Just from my experience with my brother, he really treats it as a traditional handheld. Console-ported games only, preferably with native controller support, although as I mentioned, there are some older games without native controller support that can be mapped and do work well enough.

@DarthNocturnal @JaxonH Or a mouse for anything that requires aiming. That too.

And Jax buddy, you've got to remember, yes, this is the most powerful gaming portable ever, and yes, it is a handheld, but what is the full extent of its library that sets it apart from my PC? It's a damn load more portable. As an experience, I would dare say it's inferior to the Switch especially for $600 you're paying for the spec more than anything in something that size.

Plus it's interesting to see how you've gone from championing and endorsing Switch third party support as great, to now it's not very prevalent and this is better. Bit of a sudden 180 there buddy.

I also want to point out the size of this thing. You and I both hear all the time that the "Switch is too small and cramped for these big games. It hurts my hands". Imagine what they think of a clamshell device for playing DOOM, or Skyrim, or Destiny 2, or Overwatch, or ARMA III, or Dark Souls 3.

I will say the jury is out. Yes, the specs are there. The library is there. The value is potentially there.

This is a niche product for the relatively well off. Those who can afford all those games, and want Dolphin on the go, and are okay with using a smaller device for these games.

And as you say $500 may be the point it goes more mainstream BUT just like Xbox One X, it will always be a niche product and a very small subset of the market for the simple reason that it's price and usability will be limited, as well as the far smaller market awareness.

And for fun in future, I'm going to do something. Everytime you start lauding a third party release on Switch, because you will, I'm going to have the above quote on standby. To remind you that you got absolutely giddy over this $600 handheld and how many games it could play and how it was just the tip of the iceberg and imagine how awesome it is, and I'm going to turn around at every instance that you laud a 3rd party Switch game, because I'm going to be honest: The GPDWin sounds like a far better product for you as an individual.

The games are cheaper on Steam. It has MORE games than Switch ever will have by that virtue. It's more powerful than Switch. It's more portable. Lord knows you of all people can afford it. So go get one. Put your Switch down, and buy one. Play all those games with that little powerhouse. Take it to work and show your colleagues. Play hundreds of 3rd party games and love every minute of it because no doubt it'll be great.

But just remember every time you love a release on Switch, that you once upon a time said this: "Switch doesn't offer much in the way of 3rd party games". "The promise of a portable PS3/360 is here." "But a hundred million handheld gamers out there care about gaming on the go. And they aren't comparing their handhelds to their PCs. They're comparing their handhelds to their previous handhelds and this thing blows their previous handhelds out of the water"

@JaxonH I should stress this isn't me being spiteful or anything. I have an eidetic memory so I remember everything everyone says. I actually made that quite useful today in an article on Sony when I called out some BS from 2011 on a blog post they wrote.

You've now said Switch doesn't have much in the way of 3rd parties and this is superior. This runs completely counter to your previous gushing over DOOM, Skyrim, Resident Evil, NBA2K18, FIFA18, and many more.

There is a better handheld experience now. So if you ever say "This is the best portable experience of x game", that's not strictly true. If you ever say a game runs great, sure, it may indeed run great, but it can run better for double the price + more games in the long run, by your own admission.

So why would someone buy a Switch? TV play? There is a better alternative. Portable gaming? There is a better alternative. Nintendo games? Well we don't want to fall into that stereotype do we?

This is the hill you chose mate. Now I don't know if its the one you want to stay on, defending a niche product for how awesome it is while you also state something factually inferior is just as awesome when it comes up, despite having said otherwise while discussing the GPDWin, but hey, you do you.

The GPDWin will serve its niche well. It will be the best portable ever made. Be it via legally grey ROMS and emulation as well as mid-spec PC games (Assuming they don't necessitate something that removes portability, like a keyboard or mouse aiming) and for that niche it will (probably) be the best product for them.

But will it be the best product for everyone else? Probably not, be it on library, battery, size, controls, price, it will not be perfect, just like Switch, Xbox One X, PS4, Vita, Atari Jaguar.

But now we can watch on, as the only saving grace from the man who never shuts up about how great third party games are on Switch and are finally portable, has to change his tune to, great but not amazing portably, but at least you can also play it on your TV.

This actually confirms my belief about the Switch: Jack of all trades, not very good at any of them.

Anyway back on topic, finally, Rocket League is great fun on Switch, though I do notice the textures and resolution getting VERY low both docked and undocked, typically on a select few stages as the match starts, probably due to netcode.

@YummyHappyPills
I think you're taking this a little too personal.

I think the third party support on switch is good and will improve, for a Nintendo console. I think it's promising relative to Wii U. But if you haven't heard my complaints lately about games not coming to Switch then you haven't been paying attention.

Even if switch got the absolute best third-party support possible it will still never compare to the other platforms. It just won't. And I never said it would. And that's where a device like this really shines. My views have not changed- they're the same as they always have been.

I do gush and still gush about DOOM and Skyrim. Because 1 they are portable entries but more importantly 2 they are tribrid experiences. And I love that and I will continue to love that and I will continue to gush about that and absolutely nothing has changed about that.

But just because I gush about games on Switch doesn't mean I can't gush about games on another platform too! YES I gush about DOOM and Skyrim and LA Noire. YES I gush about RE Revelations. Not only are they HD portable entries but you can play them on the TV instantly and then back on the handheld and with motion and... it's a fantastic experience. Nothing has changed about my views, and I stand by absolutely every last word I've said. I DO love those games on Switch and will CONTINUE to love those games on Switch.

But that doesn't change the fact that this device has thousands of games that the Switch won't and never will have. Is that supposed to not be exciting? Am I supposed to get excited for these games on Switch but NOT get excited for a version that looks even better? That would be hypocrisy.

The two are not mutually exclusive, and never once did I claim the Switch has every single game the PC has. Never once did I even remotely imply the Switch had that many 3rd party games. I said I liked the ones it was getting, and I'm glad it's getting decent support, AND IT IS. But decent support for a Nintendo console is in no way going to rival the spanning library of PC. In no way whatsoever.

And no, GPD will not necessarily be the best portable ever made. It will run some games better than any other portable that exists, but other games it might not run as well. But whether it does or doesn't is completely irrelevant. What's important is that it runs games at least as well as Switch or in the general ballpark, but has a spanning library of 3rd party games and is pocket portable. Is that better? It depends who you ask and what they value most.

I haven't changed my tune one note. I stand by everything I said and I do not change my views. But liking Switch doesn't mean I can't like other consoles too, and you seem to think that because I like another console and acknowledge what it has to offer, that suddenly means I hate the Switch. Its ridiculous. How does acknowledging this console has far more third party games than Switch ever will, how does that suddenly mean I've changed my views on Switch getting great support? Which by the way, I never thought it was getting great support, except relative to the Wii U and within the context of being a Nintendo platform. Even then I have said from day one I want to see more games. MORE GAMES. I've been complaining when I see other games go to other systems and not Switch.

But even if I hadn't, saying I'm thankful for the support Switch is getting doesn't suddenly warp reality into the Twilight Zone and mean I have no interest in other games. It doesn't suddenly mean I'm delusional to the point that I think every single game out there will come to Switch. In fact I specifically stated that even at its best, Switch will never get more than a portion of 3rd party games other consoles get. You expect me to just stick my head in the sand like an ostrich and pretend all these third-party games the GPD Win 2 will offer are suddenly on Switch?

Man i regret buying Volgarr The Viking and Count Lucanor on Switch. Both are games that could'ave been good,but aren't. Disappointed in these games and in myself for buying them.

@JaxonH I never said you cant like other consoles.

In fact I encourage it, always have and will, because the best gaming experience is not found from just one device. If it ever is, then God help us in terms of pricing because uuugggghhhh $599 PS3 again would be the case.

But this is the thing. Yes GPD Win will have the entirety of Steam on there, within reason. That also comes with the err.....the you know. Crap. The Unfiltered.

On one hand I'd love to have a GPD Win 2 thingy. I'm sure it'd be great. BUT If I get a game on Steam I'll also have it on my PC at that point and well then I basically have a less immediate Nintendo Switch. A portable option that plays games well, and a stationary option that does Max Settings.

Downside is total cost would be....around £2000. I mean it'd be a great experience but....damn.

If you remember my expectations for Nintendo Switch were far, far below Wii U. When I had hands on with it in January I came away "Meh" from that. Only recently has the potential of the system been shown but in seeing that potential I can't help but be realistic and see....limitations.

Some ports will be great. Some will be bad. In future some games will be downgraded heavily, some wont. I hope more stick to not heavy downgrades.

Ideally, Switch 2 will surpass the GPD and provide more of an Xbox One experience on a TV (If they stick with this idea anyway...cant say with Nintendo's sometimes dumb desire to do something new repeatedly). My fear is we wont get a Switch 2 but something else new and out there.

Looking to the future I do see ports becoming harder, I do see third party support of current games actually shrinking, if only a little, when it comes to ports from PS4 and the soon-successors to those systems, and that is worrying me a little, but then I see the history of Nintendo and I realise...this is an idea that wont stick around.

I feel the GPD Win is a little too early and Switch is a little too late. It's frustrating because as we move forward, we will the GPD Win with its high price and potential issues, and Switch with it's low specs and lack of support.

I honestly don't think either can win, not with PS5 on the horizon by 2020.

@YummyHappyPills

Well this was never about "winning". GPD is a niche product for a niche market. Always has been. The device has been around for years. They aren't trying to break into the console market or the handheld market. They're doing what they've always done by selling a cool pc-based gaming handheld to the small audience who's interested.

And I love it. Absolutely love it. It looks like it's an incredible device and I am absolutely stoked to play DOOM on it. But it probably won't be the best option for any other game that makes it to Switch. Skyrim Will definitely look better on Switch (GPD is only running the vanilla version), it has motion controls, amiibo content, and TV and portable console integration on a system level. This will probably be the case for 99% of games that are on both systems. Switch is gonna be the better choice, for reasons mentioned above. The only reason DOOM runs better I think is because of Vulcan. They couldn't even get it to run using OpenGL. So that's going to be the exception more than the rule. But again, the excitement doesn't come from playing the same games Switch has, it comes from all the other games Switch doesn't have. But hey, if there's a few that actually run better on GPD that were known for having low resolution on Switch... even better.

At the end of the day, nothing has changed. But as a handheld loving gamer who has been dreaming about playing GameCube and Wii games on a handheld for the better part of 10 years... this is a dream come true. I was hoping Nintendo would do it by simply releasing virtual console on switch and my backup plan was if they didn't then I would wait until they hack the system. And I would still prefer to have those games running on switch if possible but... beggars can't be choosers, and if it takes another device to do it then so be it. I'll just have to buy a bigger case that can fit both Switch and GPD Win2 inside.

@JaxonH Rumour is virtual console is coming to Switch as they have added Just In Time management to the OS for memory, which is a feature used in all emulators due to the nature of having the CPU in a system compiled code meant for an emulated device in real time, hence the name Just in Time.

So yeah, emulators are a thing on the system.

@YummyHappyPills
We know they're coming. But my guess is it's just going to be lame NES games and if we're lucky, and I mean really lucky....SNES.

They seem to be on that whole "online classics" nonsense. Nobody wants to play 8-bit NES games with online. At least I know I don't. And I'm not even sure we'll have the opportunity to buy them to own, or if they will stay exclusive to the membership. If I can't buy them to own, I'm not interested. Not really interested in NES anyways, aside from a very short list of exceptions (notably, Super Mario Bros 3- the Mega Man games we're getting from Capcom). So there is quite literally only one single game I'm interested in for the NES from Nintendo. Like really, truly interested in.

@JaxonH Yeah but now we know they are coming sooner than we thought given the management software for emulators is now part of the OS.

I bet close follow-ups are Rocket League, FIFA 18, Fire Emblem Warriors, DOOM, Golf Story, SteamWorld Dig 2, Oceanhorn, Snake Pass, and Wonder Boy: The Dragon's Trap.

I think Human Fall Flat is the next indie game with megaseller potential.

Is there something wrong with the Switch eShop cause error code when try to connect.

@Eagle9 Nintendo servers probably couldn't handle how many people were getting Switch today. I was able to access the Switch eshop around 5 hours ago but can't now.

@Eagle9 It's probably the influx of new owners going online that's causing it to crash. It happened with the Wii U in the past.

Heh, yep of course