To be fair, though, they don't have to do ANYTHING to appeal to the people who backed the game, because they already have their money. They need to appeal to a broader range of gamers at this point, which is what this trailer is attempting to do.
Yeah, I dunno, I mean I backed it so I'm going to be playing it anyway no matter what so I'll keep an open mind. I'm not going to let the fact that it was delayed cloud my judgement and ability to enjoy it if it actually turns out to be good. And I'm not offended at the drop of a hat like many people seem to be due to that one line in the trailer.
I played the demo and thought it was fine, so if they've built on it a bit since then and refined it, it's going to be a fun game.
But it's the cool thing to do nowadays, hate games before they're released just because they happened to be delayed or it wasn't what you were expecting, so I'm not surprised at the backlash.
So again, I'm going to reserve judgement until I actually play it. I hope it turns out to be good. If it's not, oh well. Life goes on.
I think they were going for the whole "Anchorman" vibe with the narrator, because a lot of people think that's cool and someone figured it was marketable. Why are we looking so deeply into this?
Welcome to the Age Of Offense. Everyone and everything has to be treated with kid gloves because the loudest, most easily-outraged people have access to social media.
Let's try not to hate everything before it's even released.
I backed it, I'm not happy about the delays but that's life. I'll give it a shot before I decide I hate it. Who knows, it could end being a pretty good game. The demo was good.
Man, that Santa Claus analogy is the best analogy I've seen for present-day treatment of Nintendo. Hats off to you, that's perfect and completely sums everything up.
"As I explained, Nintendo Life reviews are really generous when dealing with first party Nintendo games. Wait 10 years and check what Nintendo Life says then about Star Fox Zero. I'm sure they will be harsher."
Then this is not at all relevant to the discussion. If NintendoLife ALREADY gives generous reviews to first-party Nintendo titles, if you couple that with the already-expected nostalgia that comes with Super Mario World for practically everyone, then you would have an incredibly overblown score.
Further still, you're also telling me that in order for my point to be admissible in this discussion, then I'd have to "wait ten years" for NintendoLife's updated review.
And if anything, I actually think the reviews of Star Fox Zero will be more favorable in the future once the whole "I'm just mad they delayed it for the controls" nonsense has become ancient history. It's likely that Nintendo will do a 180 on their control scheme for the next iteration of the series, completely eliminating the motion aspect. Then SFZ will be remembered as a game that was a huge leap forward in the series and a step in the right direction but people will instead give Nintendo grief for "caving into pressure" and "not sticking to their guns" after they change the controls back to suit the whiners.
Nintendolife also said Star Fox Zero is a fantastic game and one of the best in the series.
If I'm supposes to agree with the opinion on Super Mario World, then you certainly should agree with theirs for Star Fox Zero.
I also happen to think Mario Bros U has the tightest and most refined controls in 2D Mario history. And the most varied moveset. I know many others agree.
I don't deny that Super Mario World is still very popular, but it's been done better several times over since then. But people are going to love what they grew up with.
It's the same reason Mega Man 2 is still "widely considered" to be the "best" game in the series. There is absolutely nothing about it that wasn't refined and done better in later iterations. It's simply the one people glommed onto most with nostalgia.
No racing games? Blame the 3rd party devs. Although, we did get Sonic racing all-stars, which was pretty good.
The fact you even take sales numbers into consideration towards the worth of a video game system speaks enough volumes of the quality of discussion I would have with you anyway, so I'm happy for you to write me off as an employee of the company and just move on.
With a gun to my head, I couldn't even make a guess how many copies of Super Mario Galaxy 2 were sold. But is it still one of the best games I have ever played in my entire gaming life? Absolutely. So what do I care about the sales figures?
Same goes for the fools who put so much stock into framerate and resolution of graphics and processing power of games and consoles. If these things matter to you, you are not a gamer at heart.
From from both a surface-level as well as core gameplay perspective, the New Super Mario Bros. series completely trumps Super Mario World in every way. The same goes for Super Mario Galaxy 1+2 over Mario 64 and Sunshine. Every single thing about the game is better. Better gameplay, better graphics, better longevity, better controls. It's nostalgia talking when someone says Super Mario World was the "pinnacle" of a Mario game.
And believe me, I am an enormous Mario fan who grew up playing Super Mario Bros 1 and every game beyond that. It is perfectly ok to be nostalgic about a game. It's just important to recognize when you are doing it.
Shovel Knight made an absolute killing on Wii U. Guacamelee did the same. They use the "profitability" excuse as a crutch for their laziness and apprehension.
Heck, even the most-respected guys from Rare who are developing Yooka-Laylee insisted that they are dedicated to developing a port for Wii U because they think it's a fantastic system with a dedicated fanbase.
"Not a chance recent Mario games are nearly as good as Super Mario World (2D) or Super Mario 64/Sunshine (3D) - visuals apart. "
Whoa whoa whoa, there you go with an onslaught of opinions again.
Even then, what about Super Mario Galaxy 1 and 2? Those games were head-and-shoulders the best Mario games I have ever played in my life.
Additionally, I enjoy the New Super Mario Bros Wii and Wii U games far more than Mario World. And I grew up with Mario World, so I've put my nostalgia aside. I'm also not sure what's so wrong with 3D World. I thought that was a fantastic game!
I agree with Mario Tennis and Other M, but you certainly have a lot of bias in the rest of your opinions. I'm not being insulting when I say that, just addressing the point.
Again, I reiterate, out of the games we've discussed previous to this post, none of them were bad games. You had a couple in there you didn't like, but they're far outweighed by the truly quality titles Nintendo has been able to develop for the Wii U.
Meh, those are your opinions. I've been buying Nintendo consoles since the 1980s and I can't say that I have been disappointed by the Wii U. In fact, it's been one of my most favourite systems due to the diversity of the games and the experiences I've had.
I'm really only interested in hearing about the Wii U titles because those ones are relevant to this topic. So you were disappointed with Mario Tennis Ultra Smash, Animal Crossing Amiibo Festival, Mario Party 10, NSMB and Star Fox Zero.
I disagree with NSMB and Star Fox Zero completely, but can understand about the rest (even though I still somewhat agree on a couple of them). But that's still really not THAT bad of a track record when you compare those games to the amount of truly quality first-party games they delivered on the Wii U.
Even if you didn't LOVE them, there are still some other great games released beyond that "first two years" mark you are set with. They may not have been your cup of tea, but a lot of other people have enjoyed them.
Yeah, I'm actually STILL working through 00 Agent in Goldeneye because it's very challenging. It's not simply "run and run and run until you get to the next checkpoint". That's the kind of games we have these days, which lends to the lazy and entitled attitudes of today's gamer. Everything has to be super easy right off the bat and never punish you for doing something wrong. Infinite lives, infinite continues, constant hints on the screen, hour-long glorified tutorial levels disguised as "intro missions", etc.
If you're not smart enough to realize that you're always ripped off when you trade in a game, then I don't have a lot of confidence in your ability to understand Star Fox Zero's controls. So of course these people will hate the game.
But there are also countless games that truly don't need multiplayer.
And I do truly feel that Star Fox did not NEED one. It would have been cool, sure, but I still feel the single player experience offers enough. Especially if you're going for medals and challenges. Because at its core, Star Fox is an arcade-style shooter. And they gave us a co-op mode to enjoy locally with a friend anyway.
So again, it just comes down to opinion.
I am quite happy with Nintendo being the best place to find quality, unique titles and excellent single-player (and couch co-op/competitive) experiences. At least they have a niche, whereas Sony and Microsoft are the same company with a different coat of paint.
Yeah, if someone is going to complain about Star Fox Zero leaving out the multiplayer mode, then they should be equally as annoyed with Smash Bros Wii U leaving out any sort of worthwhile single player mode.
But they won't because it's cooler to hate SFZ and no one will agree with them about Smash.
And also because they don't care about it, that means everyone has the same opinion.
In my opinion, there are far too many games that are online ONLY multiplayer and not enough couch co-op or couch multiplayer.
I don't care about online gaming, to be perfectly honest. I have enough friends in real life to have them over and play couch-multi. Why don't games cater to this attitude anymore? Why is it largely just Nintendo delivering this, but no one seems to praise them for it?
Further to it, what's wrong with focusing on creating an excellent single-player experience in favor of devoting time and resources to an ultimately unnecessary multiplayer experience? While I won't disagree with the idea that Star Fox multiplayer would be fun, I also don't think many other Wii U games would have benefitted from an online component.
The Arkham games gave the same kind of answer when people criticized them for not having an online multiplayer component. "Why? That's not the game we wanted to make".
"When will you realize that you just don't like Nintendo video games anymore? There's no point at gettng angry at a zebra because he doesn't change his stripes."
The same attitude is reflected with the whole Star Fox Zero debacle.
"I'm a huge Star Fox fan and I love Star Fox games but they've sucked since Star Fox 64".
We're now FIVE games beyond Star Fox 64. That means you really only like TWO Star Fox games from the series. So perhaps you just need to admit that while you find the idea of the series interesting, you just aren't a fan of the series.
You make a great point about not buying Star Fox for the multiplayer and not buying Smash Bros for the single player.
Me, personally? I really enjoyed Subspace Emissary and actually had a better time playing single player on Brawl than I did multiplayer.
So when I found out Smash Bros Wii U was heavily multiplayer and removed almost all of the worthwhile single player elements, did I dismiss it as a terrible game where Nintendo "failed everyone" and it now sucked because it should have had features I believed it should have?
No, I appreciated the game for what it was. I haven't gotten as much play out of it because I'm not crazy about the online competitive component of the game and am more of a couch-party gamer with friends, but that certainly doesn't mean it wasn't worth the money I paid for it at release.
You seem to have missed the rest of my point as well.
Why are we so quick to blame Nintendo when they are already developing these titles all on their own? Sony and Microsoft aren't developing their own blockbuster titles. These are done by all of the 3rd part studios supporting them, which Nintendo doesn't have. So to expect a blockbuster title from Nintendo every single year is absurd.
Nintendo's doing pretty damn well on their own. Blame the 3rd part devs.
@gatorboi352
Opinions. I felt it was an appropriate length because it's a game that focuses on challenges, achievements and medals. That's where your replay value comes in for an arcade-style shooter.
@VanillaLake
I don't actually understand your most recent post.
How many games are artificially extended by useless fetch quests? And side missions that ultimately result in glorified time trials and endless back-tracking?
What's wrong with a tight, action-packed, focused campaign?
Same goes for the whole online thing. Why does EVERY game need an online component shoe-horned in?
But again, I don't necessarily think Nintendo deserves all of the blame. They are clearly trying to do different things. Not everything will work. But it's not like they just abandoned the Wii U one year after launch or immediately after 3rd party devs had a tantrum and ran away. I know I may come across that way sometimes, but I am certainly not a blindly loyal Nintendo fanboy. I own every system. But I think it's absurd that Nintendo is getting so much flak for "making the Wii U hard to develop on".
There are a lot of indy developers who have managed to make it work. Shovel Knight is an amazing game and it works just fine on Wii U. Then you've got idiots like the guy who developed Binding of Isaac throwing his little fit about how it's "too hard" to develop on the Wii U and it's "not powerful enough" for his little flash game, but then he goes on and releases a Wii U version anyway within a few months. Why was that so hard but Shovel Knight wasn't? SK is an infinitely deeper and better game.
No one seemed to have pointed out the hypocrisy of that as much as they blamed Nintendo for making things "too difficult". Devs, much like a lot of gamers these days, have become pretty lazy. If they have to take a bit of time to learn something, they write it off.
Do we need blockbuster titles every year, though? I mean, I think that three a year is perfectly suitable as long as there is enough replay value in them. Smash Bros, Splatoon, Mario Kart and Mario Maker alone provide that. As would XCX for those who are into it.
Aside from that, there are other great games like Kirby: Rainbow Curse, Rayman Legends, LOZ: Twilight Princess, etc.
There isn't the mass volume of games like there is on PS4 and/or Xbox One, but there is absolutely enough to keep a gamer busy with Wii U.
Again, Nintendo is largely developing all of these on their own, so I don't think it's a matter of them "not caring enough" or "not putting in an effort". Blame the lazy 3rd party devs.
I don't understand your opinion about Nintendo putting "no effort" into the Wii U's library.
People are so quick to point out that 3rd party developers refuse to release games on the Wii U, but then they fail to realize that this means the onus is almost solely on NIntendo's shoulders to create, produce and release their OWN games on their own system. And yet we have had some excellent original titles released on the Wii U.
Splatoon, Mario Kart 8, Mario Maker, Zelda U (it's been in development for quite some time so it counts), Smash Bros, Pikmin 3, Star Fox Zero, Yoshi's Wooly World, Super Mario 3D World, New Super Mario Bros U, Xenoblade Chronicles X.
Not too bad for having to do everything on their own because they don't have all of the other studios cranking out their yearly filler titles to pad the library.
That's what always gets me about everyone wanting the Wii U to die and calling it a failure and saying the gamepad was stupid and whatever.
Without the gamepad, we would not have had Mario Maker. Game creation engines offered by something like Little Big Planet have absolutely nothing on Mario Maker. That game ALONE justifies the existence of the Wii U.
I traded my copy in. I just couldn't figure out the controls. It was like, push up to go forward and push down to brake? What?? How does that make sense? And they expected me to use two sticks and I had to pay attention to the screen or else I'd die. I also couldn't figure out how to use two screens at once without looking up and down so frantically and so often that I got dizzy and passed out.
The game also didn't tell me when to go to the bathroom so I had a lot of accidents in my pants.
That was really weird how they got used to the controls with a little bit of practice. It's almost like 20 minutes of practice sets you up for success or something.
Ah, who am I kidding? They probably just filmed the guys sitting on a couch and then overlaid demo gameplay on the screen to pretend they were the ones playing it. Because we all know the game is horrifically broken and unplayable. Jimquisition told me so.
"I think they've made the game more immersive and enjoyable, but that's just me."
It's not just you. 367 people on Metacritic appear to feel the same way. Heck, you could even add in the 48 people in the "mixed" category because they clearly found a lot to enjoy about it, too.
It's kind of along the same lines when the "professional" gaming press criticizes Nintendo for underutilizing their motion controls, but then turns around and complains when they make it a point to do so.
So far, according to NintendoLife's perpetuation of unfounded rumors (where do they even come from most of the time?) Nintendo's next big invention will be a wacky hybrid console called the NXMH where you take the handheld controller (also an independent handheld gaming system called MH) and plug it into your home-based console called NX (MH is the controller, without it, the NX is useless!) and then you may or may not have to download games because it is both digital-only as well as disc-based but also cartridge-based and will be simultaneously more powerful as well as less powerful than the Xbox One at the same time.
AGAIN, the Arwing is a fantasy aircraft in a futuristic world populated by anthropomorphic animals.
If you want to play a realistic flight simulator, there are plenty of those out there. This game values gameplay over realism.
Perhaps in this reimagined universe the Arwing is redesigned to have those types of weapons?
Why not take issue with the fact that the animals don't wear space helmets? How do they breathe in space? How do they handle the extreme forces of the moves they perform without some sort of oxygen-providing apparatus connected to their mouths?
Apparently you find it acceptable that Arwings are "immune to G forces" but it blows your mind that they would have a weapon layout similar to an attack chopper.
You just pick and choose what's most convenient to your argument.
You'd think people would be more annoyed at the developers for flat-out refusing to even try and develop on the Wii U rather than Nintendo for trying to be innovative. But apparently having the exact same hardware as the competition is "innovation" these days. It seems to work for Sony and Microsoft. People don't want different consoles from different companies. They just want every company to offer the same console, but painted a brand-exclusive colour.
Sometimes if you don't have anything of substance to say, it's better to say nothing at all. Or give us a talking point that isn't just about fabricated rumors.
And then Alex makes a video that basically says the exact same thing that all of the prior articles have already said but includes a nonsensical skit or two.
Glad you added that, because it's an excellent point. Braking while aiming down AND shooting was absolutely CRUCIAL for me in passing the mission where you have to stop the missiles from entering the wormhole.
I have absolutely no idea how I would have done that one if I was using the "perfect" Star Fox 64 controls. That mission was fun as hell, too, so I wouldn't want them to change it completely to suit a non-motion control scheme.
Can't we for once just appreciate the consoles we currently have? Within a year of NX's release, we're going to be talking about what the next Nintendo console should/will be like.
I've defended many times why I think the controls are perfectly suitable. They are natural and make sense. You can't seem to get over how Fox, the anthropomorphic space animal is able to independently aim and fly the plane. Suspension of disbelief in favour of gameplay. We've been over this.
You barrel roll as you would in a real plane. You have a throttle that controls your speed and brake. You have a stick that controls your altitude.
Many others have given you the exact same explanation of why the controls make sense, but again you conveniently choose to ignore them.
And yet again, the user reviews on Metacritic reflect that an overwhelming majority of people have been able to understand and utilize the controls. A small, but VERY vocal minority has not. And from the critic reviews, it appears that the majority of them are annoyed that they have to use motion controls and it takes time to learn them.
I don't know what else people can say to present a counter argument to everything you say. If you don't like the game, that's your right. Just find one you DO like and move on.
Oh, I'm definitely guilty of that at times, I won't deny it. But I don't do it out of an angry "you have to agree with me or else" attitude. It's more when someone is citing their personal opinion as fact. I try and back everything I say up with some sort of source. And if I can't, I make sure its clear that it's just my opinion. Like people who say that Star Fox Zero is "hated by everyone". Well, I point out the Metacritic user ratings. I point out that I and many others on this site happen to enjoy it. Just making it clear that their opinions are not a universal fact.
And what I do is more a "defensive" thing in that I'm not going into every article and making the same tired points and starting the same arguments. It's mostly just been articles pertaining to SFZ and calling out the same people who have been making the same complaints since before the game was even released. Even worse, the people who haven't even PLAYED it who think they can attest to the quality of it! There are a lot of others who hate SFZ that I just ignore and let them do their own thing because they're not obnoxious and overbearing about it.
I just happen to want more proof and evidence behind some of the absurd claims people make. And for them to stop trying to force their opinions as facts.
Also, I happen to have a lot of time to kill at work every week so I'm on the message boards more often.
What about Splatoon? Did it come naturally to you to understand that shoulder button = "turn into squid" and that you need to move the controller around to aim? And that you can call to your teammates with another button and throw a bomb with another?
You do not need to immediately understand the controls when you pick the game up blind as long as they provide a detailed tutorial.
Which Star Fox Zero does. It has a tutorial section for every vehicle as well as an introductory tutorial level to allow you to get used to the controls before you even begin the game proper.
The levels just happen to demand a higher skill level than some people are ready to play at. Much like your example of Kaizo Mario. Not every game will be the right game for every person. Does that mean the game is broken?
You're totally right. People have hated Star Fox Zero since they first announced it would be delayed because they wanted to refine the motion experience. It suddenly became "boo! motion controls! They've already ruined the game!"
I did not enjoy XCX at all and am probably going to sell it. But am I claiming it's a terrible game and no one should like it and here's where they went wrong and they should have done this and blah blah blah and Miyamoto doesn't know what he's doing and it's a betrayal of RPGs and whatever?
No. I recognize that it's not the game for me. I did not have a good experience with it, but it doesn't mean the game is broken or unplayable or terrible by any means. I just don't happen to be very good at it and am not willing to invest the time to get better at it. There are a ton of other games out there for me to enjoy.
Comments 352
Re: Inti Creates CEO Takuya Aizu Really Doesn't Like The New Mighty No. 9 Trailer
@TromboneGamer
To be fair, though, they don't have to do ANYTHING to appeal to the people who backed the game, because they already have their money. They need to appeal to a broader range of gamers at this point, which is what this trailer is attempting to do.
Re: Inti Creates CEO Takuya Aizu Really Doesn't Like The New Mighty No. 9 Trailer
@BensonUii
Yeah, I dunno, I mean I backed it so I'm going to be playing it anyway no matter what so I'll keep an open mind. I'm not going to let the fact that it was delayed cloud my judgement and ability to enjoy it if it actually turns out to be good. And I'm not offended at the drop of a hat like many people seem to be due to that one line in the trailer.
I played the demo and thought it was fine, so if they've built on it a bit since then and refined it, it's going to be a fun game.
But it's the cool thing to do nowadays, hate games before they're released just because they happened to be delayed or it wasn't what you were expecting, so I'm not surprised at the backlash.
So again, I'm going to reserve judgement until I actually play it. I hope it turns out to be good. If it's not, oh well. Life goes on.
Re: Inti Creates CEO Takuya Aizu Really Doesn't Like The New Mighty No. 9 Trailer
I think they were going for the whole "Anchorman" vibe with the narrator, because a lot of people think that's cool and someone figured it was marketable. Why are we looking so deeply into this?
Re: Inti Creates CEO Takuya Aizu Really Doesn't Like The New Mighty No. 9 Trailer
@TheBigK
Welcome to the Age Of Offense. Everyone and everything has to be treated with kid gloves because the loudest, most easily-outraged people have access to social media.
Re: Inti Creates CEO Takuya Aizu Really Doesn't Like The New Mighty No. 9 Trailer
Let's try not to hate everything before it's even released.
I backed it, I'm not happy about the delays but that's life. I'll give it a shot before I decide I hate it. Who knows, it could end being a pretty good game. The demo was good.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@Turbo857
Man, that Santa Claus analogy is the best analogy I've seen for present-day treatment of Nintendo. Hats off to you, that's perfect and completely sums everything up.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@VanillaLake
"As I explained, Nintendo Life reviews are really generous when dealing with first party Nintendo games. Wait 10 years and check what Nintendo Life says then about Star Fox Zero. I'm sure they will be harsher."
Then this is not at all relevant to the discussion. If NintendoLife ALREADY gives generous reviews to first-party Nintendo titles, if you couple that with the already-expected nostalgia that comes with Super Mario World for practically everyone, then you would have an incredibly overblown score.
Further still, you're also telling me that in order for my point to be admissible in this discussion, then I'd have to "wait ten years" for NintendoLife's updated review.
And if anything, I actually think the reviews of Star Fox Zero will be more favorable in the future once the whole "I'm just mad they delayed it for the controls" nonsense has become ancient history. It's likely that Nintendo will do a 180 on their control scheme for the next iteration of the series, completely eliminating the motion aspect. Then SFZ will be remembered as a game that was a huge leap forward in the series and a step in the right direction but people will instead give Nintendo grief for "caving into pressure" and "not sticking to their guns" after they change the controls back to suit the whiners.
Nintendo can never win.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@VanillaLake
Nintendolife also said Star Fox Zero is a fantastic game and one of the best in the series.
If I'm supposes to agree with the opinion on Super Mario World, then you certainly should agree with theirs for Star Fox Zero.
I also happen to think Mario Bros U has the tightest and most refined controls in 2D Mario history. And the most varied moveset. I know many others agree.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@VanillaLake
I don't deny that Super Mario World is still very popular, but it's been done better several times over since then. But people are going to love what they grew up with.
It's the same reason Mega Man 2 is still "widely considered" to be the "best" game in the series. There is absolutely nothing about it that wasn't refined and done better in later iterations. It's simply the one people glommed onto most with nostalgia.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@Dezzy
People didn't even buy Watch Dogs on PS4 and Xbox One.
It's poorly reviewed by user ratings. If it didn't sell on Wii U, that's because it's not a good game.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@gatorboi352
No sports games? Blame the 3rd party devs.
No racing games? Blame the 3rd party devs. Although, we did get Sonic racing all-stars, which was pretty good.
The fact you even take sales numbers into consideration towards the worth of a video game system speaks enough volumes of the quality of discussion I would have with you anyway, so I'm happy for you to write me off as an employee of the company and just move on.
With a gun to my head, I couldn't even make a guess how many copies of Super Mario Galaxy 2 were sold. But is it still one of the best games I have ever played in my entire gaming life? Absolutely. So what do I care about the sales figures?
Same goes for the fools who put so much stock into framerate and resolution of graphics and processing power of games and consoles. If these things matter to you, you are not a gamer at heart.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@VanillaLake
From from both a surface-level as well as core gameplay perspective, the New Super Mario Bros. series completely trumps Super Mario World in every way. The same goes for Super Mario Galaxy 1+2 over Mario 64 and Sunshine. Every single thing about the game is better. Better gameplay, better graphics, better longevity, better controls. It's nostalgia talking when someone says Super Mario World was the "pinnacle" of a Mario game.
And believe me, I am an enormous Mario fan who grew up playing Super Mario Bros 1 and every game beyond that. It is perfectly ok to be nostalgic about a game. It's just important to recognize when you are doing it.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@Dezzy
Shovel Knight made an absolute killing on Wii U. Guacamelee did the same. They use the "profitability" excuse as a crutch for their laziness and apprehension.
Heck, even the most-respected guys from Rare who are developing Yooka-Laylee insisted that they are dedicated to developing a port for Wii U because they think it's a fantastic system with a dedicated fanbase.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@VanillaLake
Which recent Zelda games haven't been good? You seem to only mention Triforce Heroes.
Link Between Worlds and Twilight Princess HD were fantastic.
Hyrule Warriors, as a spinoff, was great too.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@VanillaLake
"Not a chance recent Mario games are nearly as good as Super Mario World (2D) or Super Mario 64/Sunshine (3D) - visuals apart. "
Whoa whoa whoa, there you go with an onslaught of opinions again.
Even then, what about Super Mario Galaxy 1 and 2? Those games were head-and-shoulders the best Mario games I have ever played in my life.
Additionally, I enjoy the New Super Mario Bros Wii and Wii U games far more than Mario World. And I grew up with Mario World, so I've put my nostalgia aside. I'm also not sure what's so wrong with 3D World. I thought that was a fantastic game!
I agree with Mario Tennis and Other M, but you certainly have a lot of bias in the rest of your opinions. I'm not being insulting when I say that, just addressing the point.
Again, I reiterate, out of the games we've discussed previous to this post, none of them were bad games. You had a couple in there you didn't like, but they're far outweighed by the truly quality titles Nintendo has been able to develop for the Wii U.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@gatorboi352
Meh, those are your opinions. I've been buying Nintendo consoles since the 1980s and I can't say that I have been disappointed by the Wii U. In fact, it's been one of my most favourite systems due to the diversity of the games and the experiences I've had.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@VanillaLake
I'm really only interested in hearing about the Wii U titles because those ones are relevant to this topic. So you were disappointed with Mario Tennis Ultra Smash, Animal Crossing Amiibo Festival, Mario Party 10, NSMB and Star Fox Zero.
I disagree with NSMB and Star Fox Zero completely, but can understand about the rest (even though I still somewhat agree on a couple of them). But that's still really not THAT bad of a track record when you compare those games to the amount of truly quality first-party games they delivered on the Wii U.
Even if you didn't LOVE them, there are still some other great games released beyond that "first two years" mark you are set with. They may not have been your cup of tea, but a lot of other people have enjoyed them.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@InternetBowser
Yeah, I'm actually STILL working through 00 Agent in Goldeneye because it's very challenging. It's not simply "run and run and run until you get to the next checkpoint". That's the kind of games we have these days, which lends to the lazy and entitled attitudes of today's gamer. Everything has to be super easy right off the bat and never punish you for doing something wrong. Infinite lives, infinite continues, constant hints on the screen, hour-long glorified tutorial levels disguised as "intro missions", etc.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@VanillaLake
Which first-party Nintendo titles disappointed you on the Wii U?
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@MarioPhD
A very important point to highlight.
If you're not smart enough to realize that you're always ripped off when you trade in a game, then I don't have a lot of confidence in your ability to understand Star Fox Zero's controls. So of course these people will hate the game.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@VanillaLake
But there are also countless games that truly don't need multiplayer.
And I do truly feel that Star Fox did not NEED one. It would have been cool, sure, but I still feel the single player experience offers enough. Especially if you're going for medals and challenges. Because at its core, Star Fox is an arcade-style shooter. And they gave us a co-op mode to enjoy locally with a friend anyway.
So again, it just comes down to opinion.
I am quite happy with Nintendo being the best place to find quality, unique titles and excellent single-player (and couch co-op/competitive) experiences. At least they have a niche, whereas Sony and Microsoft are the same company with a different coat of paint.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@Turbo857
Yeah, if someone is going to complain about Star Fox Zero leaving out the multiplayer mode, then they should be equally as annoyed with Smash Bros Wii U leaving out any sort of worthwhile single player mode.
But they won't because it's cooler to hate SFZ and no one will agree with them about Smash.
And also because they don't care about it, that means everyone has the same opinion.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@VanillaLake
In my opinion, there are far too many games that are online ONLY multiplayer and not enough couch co-op or couch multiplayer.
I don't care about online gaming, to be perfectly honest. I have enough friends in real life to have them over and play couch-multi. Why don't games cater to this attitude anymore? Why is it largely just Nintendo delivering this, but no one seems to praise them for it?
Further to it, what's wrong with focusing on creating an excellent single-player experience in favor of devoting time and resources to an ultimately unnecessary multiplayer experience? While I won't disagree with the idea that Star Fox multiplayer would be fun, I also don't think many other Wii U games would have benefitted from an online component.
The Arkham games gave the same kind of answer when people criticized them for not having an online multiplayer component. "Why? That's not the game we wanted to make".
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@Project_Dolphin
You make some very good points.
"When will you realize that you just don't like Nintendo video games anymore? There's no point at gettng angry at a zebra because he doesn't change his stripes."
The same attitude is reflected with the whole Star Fox Zero debacle.
"I'm a huge Star Fox fan and I love Star Fox games but they've sucked since Star Fox 64".
We're now FIVE games beyond Star Fox 64. That means you really only like TWO Star Fox games from the series. So perhaps you just need to admit that while you find the idea of the series interesting, you just aren't a fan of the series.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@Turbo857
You make a great point about not buying Star Fox for the multiplayer and not buying Smash Bros for the single player.
Me, personally? I really enjoyed Subspace Emissary and actually had a better time playing single player on Brawl than I did multiplayer.
So when I found out Smash Bros Wii U was heavily multiplayer and removed almost all of the worthwhile single player elements, did I dismiss it as a terrible game where Nintendo "failed everyone" and it now sucked because it should have had features I believed it should have?
No, I appreciated the game for what it was. I haven't gotten as much play out of it because I'm not crazy about the online competitive component of the game and am more of a couch-party gamer with friends, but that certainly doesn't mean it wasn't worth the money I paid for it at release.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@Dezzy
You seem to have missed the rest of my point as well.
Why are we so quick to blame Nintendo when they are already developing these titles all on their own? Sony and Microsoft aren't developing their own blockbuster titles. These are done by all of the 3rd part studios supporting them, which Nintendo doesn't have. So to expect a blockbuster title from Nintendo every single year is absurd.
Nintendo's doing pretty damn well on their own. Blame the 3rd part devs.
@gatorboi352
Opinions. I felt it was an appropriate length because it's a game that focuses on challenges, achievements and medals. That's where your replay value comes in for an arcade-style shooter.
@VanillaLake
I don't actually understand your most recent post.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@gatorboi352
@Turbo857 has a point though.
How many games are artificially extended by useless fetch quests? And side missions that ultimately result in glorified time trials and endless back-tracking?
What's wrong with a tight, action-packed, focused campaign?
Same goes for the whole online thing. Why does EVERY game need an online component shoe-horned in?
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@VanillaLake
I forgot Tropical Freeze, myself.
But again, I don't necessarily think Nintendo deserves all of the blame. They are clearly trying to do different things. Not everything will work. But it's not like they just abandoned the Wii U one year after launch or immediately after 3rd party devs had a tantrum and ran away. I know I may come across that way sometimes, but I am certainly not a blindly loyal Nintendo fanboy. I own every system. But I think it's absurd that Nintendo is getting so much flak for "making the Wii U hard to develop on".
There are a lot of indy developers who have managed to make it work. Shovel Knight is an amazing game and it works just fine on Wii U. Then you've got idiots like the guy who developed Binding of Isaac throwing his little fit about how it's "too hard" to develop on the Wii U and it's "not powerful enough" for his little flash game, but then he goes on and releases a Wii U version anyway within a few months. Why was that so hard but Shovel Knight wasn't? SK is an infinitely deeper and better game.
No one seemed to have pointed out the hypocrisy of that as much as they blamed Nintendo for making things "too difficult". Devs, much like a lot of gamers these days, have become pretty lazy. If they have to take a bit of time to learn something, they write it off.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@arnoldlayne83
Do we need blockbuster titles every year, though? I mean, I think that three a year is perfectly suitable as long as there is enough replay value in them. Smash Bros, Splatoon, Mario Kart and Mario Maker alone provide that. As would XCX for those who are into it.
Aside from that, there are other great games like Kirby: Rainbow Curse, Rayman Legends, LOZ: Twilight Princess, etc.
There isn't the mass volume of games like there is on PS4 and/or Xbox One, but there is absolutely enough to keep a gamer busy with Wii U.
Again, Nintendo is largely developing all of these on their own, so I don't think it's a matter of them "not caring enough" or "not putting in an effort". Blame the lazy 3rd party devs.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@VanillaLake
I don't understand your opinion about Nintendo putting "no effort" into the Wii U's library.
People are so quick to point out that 3rd party developers refuse to release games on the Wii U, but then they fail to realize that this means the onus is almost solely on NIntendo's shoulders to create, produce and release their OWN games on their own system. And yet we have had some excellent original titles released on the Wii U.
Splatoon, Mario Kart 8, Mario Maker, Zelda U (it's been in development for quite some time so it counts), Smash Bros, Pikmin 3, Star Fox Zero, Yoshi's Wooly World, Super Mario 3D World, New Super Mario Bros U, Xenoblade Chronicles X.
Not too bad for having to do everything on their own because they don't have all of the other studios cranking out their yearly filler titles to pad the library.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@Marshi
That's such a huge issue with this game. The detractors don't seem to understand that there IS a gray area.
To them, the game is either "best Star Fox game ever in every way" or it's total garbage.
When really, it has its faults just like any other game. But it is a perfectly good addition to the Wii U library.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
@InternetBowser
Well said.
That's what always gets me about everyone wanting the Wii U to die and calling it a failure and saying the gamepad was stupid and whatever.
Without the gamepad, we would not have had Mario Maker. Game creation engines offered by something like Little Big Planet have absolutely nothing on Mario Maker. That game ALONE justifies the existence of the Wii U.
Re: Random: Store Shelves Appear To Be Filling With Pre-Owned Copies Of Star Fox Zero
I traded my copy in. I just couldn't figure out the controls. It was like, push up to go forward and push down to brake? What?? How does that make sense? And they expected me to use two sticks and I had to pay attention to the screen or else I'd die. I also couldn't figure out how to use two screens at once without looking up and down so frantically and so often that I got dizzy and passed out.
The game also didn't tell me when to go to the bathroom so I had a lot of accidents in my pants.
Poor design! 3/10!
Re: Video: Watch Star Fox Developer Dylan Cuthbert Play Star Fox Zero And Talk Miyamoto
That was really weird how they got used to the controls with a little bit of practice. It's almost like 20 minutes of practice sets you up for success or something.
Ah, who am I kidding? They probably just filmed the guys sitting on a couch and then overlaid demo gameplay on the screen to pretend they were the ones playing it. Because we all know the game is horrifically broken and unplayable. Jimquisition told me so.
Re: Poll: Do You Want The Rumoured 'MH' Next Generation Portable to be Separate from NX?
@PlywoodStick
Ain't that the truth! I have a friend who buys the new iPhone every time it's released and sells his old one at a significant loss.
Re: Nintendo Publishes Part Two of the Miyamoto and Hayashi Star Fox Zero Interview
@-DEMISE
"I think they've made the game more immersive and enjoyable, but that's just me."
It's not just you. 367 people on Metacritic appear to feel the same way. Heck, you could even add in the 48 people in the "mixed" category because they clearly found a lot to enjoy about it, too.
Re: Nintendo Publishes Part Two of the Miyamoto and Hayashi Star Fox Zero Interview
@SharkAttackU
It's kind of along the same lines when the "professional" gaming press criticizes Nintendo for underutilizing their motion controls, but then turns around and complains when they make it a point to do so.
Nintendo can't win!
Re: Poll: Do You Want The Rumoured 'MH' Next Generation Portable to be Separate from NX?
So far, according to NintendoLife's perpetuation of unfounded rumors (where do they even come from most of the time?) Nintendo's next big invention will be a wacky hybrid console called the NXMH where you take the handheld controller (also an independent handheld gaming system called MH) and plug it into your home-based console called NX (MH is the controller, without it, the NX is useless!) and then you may or may not have to download games because it is both digital-only as well as disc-based but also cartridge-based and will be simultaneously more powerful as well as less powerful than the Xbox One at the same time.
Re: Nintendo Publishes Part Two of the Miyamoto and Hayashi Star Fox Zero Interview
@Yorumi
AGAIN, the Arwing is a fantasy aircraft in a futuristic world populated by anthropomorphic animals.
If you want to play a realistic flight simulator, there are plenty of those out there. This game values gameplay over realism.
Perhaps in this reimagined universe the Arwing is redesigned to have those types of weapons?
Why not take issue with the fact that the animals don't wear space helmets? How do they breathe in space? How do they handle the extreme forces of the moves they perform without some sort of oxygen-providing apparatus connected to their mouths?
Apparently you find it acceptable that Arwings are "immune to G forces" but it blows your mind that they would have a weapon layout similar to an attack chopper.
You just pick and choose what's most convenient to your argument.
Re: Poll: Do You Want The Rumoured 'MH' Next Generation Portable to be Separate from NX?
@Project_Dolphin
Sad, but true.
You'd think people would be more annoyed at the developers for flat-out refusing to even try and develop on the Wii U rather than Nintendo for trying to be innovative. But apparently having the exact same hardware as the competition is "innovation" these days. It seems to work for Sony and Microsoft. People don't want different consoles from different companies. They just want every company to offer the same console, but painted a brand-exclusive colour.
Re: Poll: Do You Want The Rumoured 'MH' Next Generation Portable to be Separate from NX?
@Vineleaf
Sometimes if you don't have anything of substance to say, it's better to say nothing at all. Or give us a talking point that isn't just about fabricated rumors.
Re: Poll: Do You Want The Rumoured 'MH' Next Generation Portable to be Separate from NX?
@Robotron2084
And then Alex makes a video that basically says the exact same thing that all of the prior articles have already said but includes a nonsensical skit or two.
Re: Nintendo Publishes Part Two of the Miyamoto and Hayashi Star Fox Zero Interview
@Turbo857
Glad you added that, because it's an excellent point. Braking while aiming down AND shooting was absolutely CRUCIAL for me in passing the mission where you have to stop the missiles from entering the wormhole.
I have absolutely no idea how I would have done that one if I was using the "perfect" Star Fox 64 controls. That mission was fun as hell, too, so I wouldn't want them to change it completely to suit a non-motion control scheme.
Re: Poll: Do You Want The Rumoured 'MH' Next Generation Portable to be Separate from NX?
Why are we always so eager to replace everything?
Can't we for once just appreciate the consoles we currently have? Within a year of NX's release, we're going to be talking about what the next Nintendo console should/will be like.
Re: Nintendo Publishes Part Two of the Miyamoto and Hayashi Star Fox Zero Interview
@Yorumi
I've defended many times why I think the controls are perfectly suitable. They are natural and make sense. You can't seem to get over how Fox, the anthropomorphic space animal is able to independently aim and fly the plane. Suspension of disbelief in favour of gameplay. We've been over this.
You barrel roll as you would in a real plane. You have a throttle that controls your speed and brake. You have a stick that controls your altitude.
Many others have given you the exact same explanation of why the controls make sense, but again you conveniently choose to ignore them.
And yet again, the user reviews on Metacritic reflect that an overwhelming majority of people have been able to understand and utilize the controls. A small, but VERY vocal minority has not. And from the critic reviews, it appears that the majority of them are annoyed that they have to use motion controls and it takes time to learn them.
I don't know what else people can say to present a counter argument to everything you say. If you don't like the game, that's your right. Just find one you DO like and move on.
Re: Nintendo Publishes Part Two of the Miyamoto and Hayashi Star Fox Zero Interview
@SLIGEACH_EIRE
Oh, there are plenty of negative opinions that I let slide. The problem is when people push their opinion as fact.
Or when negative opinions are expressed in spite of the person not even having played the game.
I think this is all pretty easy to understand.
Re: Nintendo Publishes Part Two of the Miyamoto and Hayashi Star Fox Zero Interview
@Vee_Flames
Oh, I'm definitely guilty of that at times, I won't deny it. But I don't do it out of an angry "you have to agree with me or else" attitude. It's more when someone is citing their personal opinion as fact. I try and back everything I say up with some sort of source. And if I can't, I make sure its clear that it's just my opinion. Like people who say that Star Fox Zero is "hated by everyone". Well, I point out the Metacritic user ratings. I point out that I and many others on this site happen to enjoy it. Just making it clear that their opinions are not a universal fact.
And what I do is more a "defensive" thing in that I'm not going into every article and making the same tired points and starting the same arguments. It's mostly just been articles pertaining to SFZ and calling out the same people who have been making the same complaints since before the game was even released. Even worse, the people who haven't even PLAYED it who think they can attest to the quality of it! There are a lot of others who hate SFZ that I just ignore and let them do their own thing because they're not obnoxious and overbearing about it.
I just happen to want more proof and evidence behind some of the absurd claims people make. And for them to stop trying to force their opinions as facts.
Also, I happen to have a lot of time to kill at work every week so I'm on the message boards more often.
Re: Nintendo Publishes Part Two of the Miyamoto and Hayashi Star Fox Zero Interview
@Yorumi
What about Splatoon? Did it come naturally to you to understand that shoulder button = "turn into squid" and that you need to move the controller around to aim? And that you can call to your teammates with another button and throw a bomb with another?
You do not need to immediately understand the controls when you pick the game up blind as long as they provide a detailed tutorial.
Which Star Fox Zero does. It has a tutorial section for every vehicle as well as an introductory tutorial level to allow you to get used to the controls before you even begin the game proper.
The levels just happen to demand a higher skill level than some people are ready to play at. Much like your example of Kaizo Mario. Not every game will be the right game for every person. Does that mean the game is broken?
Re: Nintendo Publishes Part Two of the Miyamoto and Hayashi Star Fox Zero Interview
@aaronsullivan
You're totally right. People have hated Star Fox Zero since they first announced it would be delayed because they wanted to refine the motion experience. It suddenly became "boo! motion controls! They've already ruined the game!"
Re: Nintendo Publishes Part Two of the Miyamoto and Hayashi Star Fox Zero Interview
@Vee_Flames
And that's the difference here.
I did not enjoy XCX at all and am probably going to sell it. But am I claiming it's a terrible game and no one should like it and here's where they went wrong and they should have done this and blah blah blah and Miyamoto doesn't know what he's doing and it's a betrayal of RPGs and whatever?
No. I recognize that it's not the game for me. I did not have a good experience with it, but it doesn't mean the game is broken or unplayable or terrible by any means. I just don't happen to be very good at it and am not willing to invest the time to get better at it. There are a ton of other games out there for me to enjoy.