Random: Metroid Prime 3 Dev Left Retro Studios After "Unhealthy Relationship" With Nintendo Micromanagement

Fans do care about the small details, and it’s clear that Nintendo values this attention to detail as well. At the end of the day, Metroid is a Nintendo franchise, and they have the right to request edits to maintain visual cohesion and integrity. If you’re an artist seeking complete creative freedom, it might be more fulfilling to develop your own original projects rather than working within the boundaries of someone else’s intellectual property.

I'm glad and thankful that Nintendo goes to the measures that it does to protect its IP. Only wish George Lucas had applied a similar level of care when he sold off Star Wars.

But it's Nintendo's IP and they payed for the entire development. I know Retro is soley responsible for bringing Metroid into 3D, but telling Nintendo to "go away" just because they want minor adjustments in design to their character, would be a bad idea with potentially even worse consequences.

I get that it can be annoying if someone requests changes often but it's their IP after all so it's weird to say that they should "go away"

Small details are what Nintendo do, to not expect that is insane.

Random dev didn't like working on someone elses IP so left. Feels like a non-story.

I’m glad all the comments so far echo my thoughts. No one artist is bigger than the IP. Get a grip.

"but it didn't turn out great because some shoulder pad was shifted slightly" - arguably it turned out great exactly because shoulder pad was shifted slightly to serve IP, instead of doing what was easier.
Attention to detail like that are what makes the difference and makes Nintendo the king of polished experiences.
These tradeoffs are sometimes hard, but it takes knowledge and experience to understand what exactly is important in the shipped product, and usually it is details not appreciated by implementers (no disrespect).

As noted too, character art wasn’t even his department. He doesn’t talk about getting “micromanaged” in his scope of work there. So it seems logical to me that Nintendo would protect their characters and make them EXACTLY how they wanted while allowing the world to be built out in an appropriate manner. I’d have to watch the video to get full context, but I just don’t care enough to do so.

No one likes to be micromanaged, but c'mon, this is a Nintendo IP. What else were you expecting?

@Twilite9 Oh wow, that's awesome. I'm a huge animation enthusiast hoping to break into the industry one day, myself. Maybe someday I'll get to work alongside you.

Don’t forget, we’re only getting one side of the story here. For example, I know he’s paraphrasing but he was never told to “go away”, I refuse to believe that. Unsure why he’s coming out with this 17 years after the game release too, what is the point? Like everyone else, I’m siding with the so-called micromanagers as that Nintendo quality is obvious through the course of their work.

Words from a guy who has no idea how to run big projects. That's not micromanaging and this isn't exclusive to game development. Having sets of eyes belonging to people who don't have their hands in it every day is invaluable. My boss can't do a lick of coding and if she could she wouldn't because she's extraordinary at setting the vision and keeping the team on task. I have people jumping in on bigger projects to give their insight all the time from a brand perspective. And Nintendo has one of the most valuable IP stables of all time.

@yvo84 Exactly. We're Nintendo fans because of Nintendo's integrity when it comes to its IPs. It's what makes the company's first and second-party games special.

"If you're not directly working on the game, go away".

That alone tells me the type of person this guy is, he doesn't want a boss, he wants someone to fund his life while he gets to do what he wants with someone else's property.
It's their IP, they have the rights to show it as they see fit.

In today’s world, Nintendo is very wise to watch development especially closely. You can’t allow one team to derail your franchise and potentially cost the company multiple millions. The buying audience is not what a lot of western studios have been trying to sell to in recent years.

@PessitheMystic He's bringing it up now because he was invited to speak on a podcast about his experience working with Retro/Nintendo.

First of all, I cannot be the only one who at first glance read the headline as "Random Metroid Prime 3 Dev..." (without the colon, which would change the headline context).

Second, what was he expecting from working with someone else's IP?
Imagine if he received feedback from Sakurai (who in turn needs to send their work to the diferent IP owners, including Nintendo). To put it lighlty, he would tell him to go screw himself.

Off-topic idea that just crossed my mind: I legit wonder, on the idea of Sakurai sending the team's work to the IP owners, who oversaw the work on Banjo-Kazooie? Was it Microsoft of Rare themselves?

Better to micromanage your IP than have Sonic Boom.

Honestly, I would be honored if the IP owner would fly all the way from Japan to give me pointers on things, no matter how small.

The Nintendo contract says you make Nintendo’s game Nintendo’s way down to the last pixel. Nintendo says make Samus jump, you better be asking how high. Give developers any freedom to approach their creative ideas and 10 out of 10 times you’ll end up like Square Enix fumbling with a Balan Wonderworld. No story. No thinking. Toads only. No developer freedom. Not your IP. Miyamoto.

Having worked in some toxic environments there are ways to deal with people in a supportive way and still get the desired outcomes. Clearly this guy was an unhappy employee. I’m not sure any of us were there to be able to dismiss his experiences so lightly.

No offense, but it sounds to me like that's exactly what I want from a developer. As the end gamer, I want every single thing to be as polished as is humanly possible. And if the dev's result isn't absolutely spot on, get the micromanagers in there I say.

Also, the power of the Wii should never have been an stifling thing on art, just technical flash. Great artists can, will, and actually did make some gorgeous looking art on Wii, the kind that holds up decades later. While so many modern artist just let shaders and duplication tools do most of the work and settle for stuff that, as soon as you turn the shader off to maybe port the game to a less powerful platform that can't run the shader or whatever, just looks crap. That's not great art; that's useful technology doing most of the work. And it's why I actually have an issue with so many modern games, especially the ones they keep down-porting to my blimmin' Quest 3.

Nah, just give me amazing art. And if someone can see areas where your art could genuinely be improved--let's assume they legit are in fact doing exactly that rather than just being pencil pushers who actually have no artistic understanding whatsoever--take their feedback onboard and improve your art.

PS. Everyone even remotely interested in game art, game design, gameplay design, game music, level design, game animation, character design, level design, etc, should watch all of "Masahiro Sakurai on Creating Games" videos for a masterclass on how basically every stage of game design should be done.

Probably an artist that likely did not undergo formal art education at a competitive college. My animation professors would die laughing from this artist's issues.

@PessitheMystic just to clarify as the article taking that quote makes it look like Nintendo said that to him.

But no, this artist told the people from Nintendo to go away if they weren't working on the game.

Could well be fired for this immediately imo.

Letting the art team do whatever they want to an IP is how you get something like Bomberman: Act Zero. Nintendo is smart to keep a tight hold on the leash to prevent that.

Not caring about the details of your IP is how you end up with Metroid Other M and Federation Force. I don't think Nintendo wants to make those mistakes again. This artist should understand that and if they don't like it, then work on a new IP. Protecting the parity your brand is huge!

I don't mind the micromanagement so much as the waste of flying over there instead of just talking over the phone/internet...

"stifling for an art career"

Almost every game that has even an ounce of the creative art displayed by 2007 Nintendo since then is capable of being run on a Nintendo console, usually without issue. Big budget releases are almost always corporate cash grabs.

@gcunit Maybe if people hadn't been so hard on those prequels he might have had more confidence/motivation to keep working with that IP...

So There are tons more videos out there(from the same podcast) where the Retro devs PRAISE Nintendo but this one rando gets his negative comments pushed for all to see?
Nice ragebait.

It seems like this guy was incompatible with his work environment. So he made the right move in leaving. I read much of his comments more with light-hearted delivery than as critical though.

Many other comments seem to echo my sentiments. I get wanting creative freedom and not having someone breathe down your neck, but an IP holder has every right - in games or otherwise - to define exactly how they want their artistic vision to look. This is common. Edit: Granted, it depends HOW constructive criticism and micromanagement are conducted. There are good and bad ways to go about this. Going by feedback from other former Retro employees, it seems like this guy's feedback is in the minority in terms of the Retro/Nintendo relationship.

This is more an extreme example of why Retro has the highest turn over of any division of Nintendo; Texas Pride. Stronger than average American "bull headedness," Texas Pride makes it so someone believes they know how to accomplish a task better than anyone: especially someone they don't physically see on a daily basis. This guy also sounds like he has some good old fashioned racism informing his distaste for the Japanese editors.

Regardless of the rights and wrongs in a situation like this, I really struggle to see what someone gains from having a public moan on a podcast, other than 5 minutes of exposure. Long term it will just put prospective employers off employing you. Odd choices people make.

@gcunit Lucas had full and much more control over the prequels than the originals, and they're universally agreed to be worse than the originals. The only thing I can agree on is that the sequels might have been less worse than Disneys take.

I’d appreciate this if they were making something completely original. In that case just leave them to it and let them make their vision. When it comes to existing IP though I can understand why they’d be controlling even if it is frustrating for the artists.

Yeah sorry but it’s Nintendo. They expect high quality and they don’t release broken unfinished games like most developers do. You can’t go work for Nintendo and not be meticulous or expect high quality. That’s why they are the best. This guy sounds like his ego was bruised.

Nintendo micromanages because they learned from experience.

They tried being hands off with a live action Mario movie back in the 80s ... It ended up a mad Max like hell scape full of drugs and sex and they had to spend a lot trying to salvage it.

Frankly speaking if they feel the need to keep asking for corrections then your probably not doing the job right.

I mean, I get that nobody likes being micromanaged - which is usually done by people who have little understanding of what actually needs to be done, but we're talking about Nintendo here. The experts. I mean, if I'm making a game and Miyamoto pops his head in with some notes, I am for sure going to take heed! This could be others besides Miyamoto too - they know what they're taling about.

I respect his opinion but he sounds kind of jaded. 😅 I think there's more going on, especially if he called the Wii "stifling".

Similar words came from the head of Silicon Knights when they were working as a second party developer for Nintendo, making Eternal Darkness and Metal Gear Solid: Twin Snakes. And then when they were released to make what they wanted, what happened? They made Too Human and X-Men Destiny.

Sometimes you need to understand that criticism and direction from outside parties shows that they are interested and that they care.

I think he was lead artist on Skyrim while at Bethesda, so it's not some random guy. He left Bethesda during Starfield's development and is now an indie developer. Looks like roles with more creative freedom are better suited to him.

If you don't want to be micromanaged, then don't work on someone else's IP. Simple as.

As an animator I can understand his frustrations. However… it’s the norm.
Maybe what he meant is that the people giving pointers were not people involved in the project and maybe one or two random executives with no artistic or creative notion coming in to make changes. But that’s why there are creative and art directors, those should have been the ones making the changes and giving pointers. Gotta respect the chain of command according to the responsibilities.
But as I said, having worked for so long in the creative industry, one should expect this… and having the opportunity to work with Nintendo and quitting because of that, well… it’s not a good move… but it happens when you feel you’re not happy with your workplace.

"If you're not directly working on the game, go away"
I really think it needs to be more clear that this quote is from the artist, not Nintendo.

Because it's an incredibly negative way to speak to someone but the headline kinda makes it seem like that's Nintendo being ratty towards him, but it's the other way around.

I guess now we know why Metroid prime 4 was delayed. They couldn't get the shoulder pads right in HD.

I can see why he left. There is nothing worse than a micromanager touching up every little detail.

Every commenter saying any variant of "it's not your IP" as justification for awful micromanagement has never had to work in a professional, collaborative environment, and it shows.

Nintendo is in their right to make changes to their game. You get paid for the job, they pay for their product and changes being done.

Another click article but I clicked, right? Micromanaging sucks I left a job because of it. BUT it is their IP and we as Nintendo fans enjoy that "Nintendo Polish."

a mediocre dev i see

Glad for him he moved away. Better places to work and hopefully get to do some things he wants to do.

Nintendo can be over protective when it comes to one of the gold franchises in their library.

Checked out of caring about this goons opinion when he claimed that the Wii was stifling from an art perspective. Like I’m not defending the Wii it was weak but like you can tell this is a guy eager to go work on like a Assassins Creed level game on a system like a PS5 so he can express all his art and then be mad and shocked when he gets laid off because the game sells badly and the studio gets shut down. Non story here.

I noticed, by reading the article, he says the art "teams." As in all the artists were micromanaged. My question is; he's only credited in the 3rd game, what were the other 2 games like in development? Were they also flying in from overseas cause personally that's a waste of gas. Even then we had plenty of ways to communicate long distances without flying across the entire planet so it seems really wasteful, doubly so if it's just to say, "make them purple" or "fix their pauldron by 2 pixels to the right."

And thanks for the article with a different perspective. It's nice seeing different takes than usual and it's fun to see sides of gaming history you wouldn't normally hear about.

The more he talks, the more he sounds like a bit of a diva that just wanted his first pass to be accepted. And then half of this frustration that made him quit, didn't even happen to him anyway? And it was all hear-say by his own admission? It all sounds exaggerated to make him seem more reasonable. Like, they asked for it to be more colourful and you had to implement the client/publisher/IP holder's wishes? Yeah that's the job. That's what they're paying you for.

I've worked with people who talk poop like this and in my experience the problem has always been them more than anything. Maybe he's not like that, but man, he sure is coming off that way and his receipts just aren't there.

thats not micromanagment, publishers asking for small details changes is pretty common in gaming industry and overall in tech industry. Micromanagement is basically constant checks between the manager and the worker, request for art or programming changes is not micromanagement, Nintendo in this case is the client/publisher not the manager.

I also think the “Wii hardware was creatively stifling” quote is slept on here for how stupid it is. Imagine environmental artists at Monolith Soft thinking that way.

It’s one thing to think that in the moment in 2006, but with hindsight that’s admitting your own incompetence at the time.

Not a fan of micromanagement at all, but one must understand that such heavy quality control reflects on the end product's... quality. It seems obvious but no one cares about small details in most western game studios.

Ever heard the expression of give someone an inch and he'll take a foot (or a centimeter and takes a meter 😉).
Well, Nintendo understands that and it won't be long and after screwing up the shoulder pads (or whatever else), you get a Samus looking like the Doomguy or whoever else and you could easily trash your franchise after tweaking the Metroids to become a bad copy of a Cacodemon.
That's how franchises become trash

@Stormcloudlive Ah yes you’re right, I was tired when I commented this morning so didn’t read properly.
I also seen your follow-up comment where you wrote that the article could be more clear, so I don’t feel as bad, haha.

boo hoo cry me a river this guy is full of it.

This is the same company that told Disney to reanimate how bowser held a tea cup. When it comes to details involving their IP’s Nintendo doesn’t play around and it’s for the better, so honestly not sure what he was expecting.

It’s actually a great thing that they care so much about the little details.

If you can’t or don’t want to work with that, it’s just not the right company for you.

He sounds like a whiny cow. Nintendo is paying for the game, do your job.

For sure echo the majority of the comments, the minor details make Nintendo games… whenever a Metroid game comes out, we all stare at the shoulders, what do they look like in this game? Slightly strange comments and sounds like they needed to go work on their own stuff. Also saying that working with the low tech of the Wii also makes me question them… just because graphics aren’t top end doesn’t mean you can’t make a top game, again, Nintendo show that regularly.

Nintendo offered the same help to Silicon Knights and they didn’t listen.

This is a tricky one to gauge. On one hand, being micromanaged sucks. I don’t dislike having someone in charge and having a broad idea of a direction. But I don’t need every direction or detail barked at me.

With that being said, this is Nintendo’s IP. They have every right to be as protective and particular about how it’s handled and presented. It’s also not like their way of doing things is or has ever been a secret. So I’m not sure what was expected in this case.

I can see how over time this would be incredibly annoying for the devs at Retro. However, the Japanese in general are the biggest perfectionists in the gaming industry. They will focus on making the tiniest details of a game look beautiful and individual. This even extends to background details 99% of players won't notice. Since this is Nintendo's property, they're going to make doubly sure a foreign developer gets it right and is consistent with their own work.

Someone call this guy a Waaahmbulance!

WiiU WiiU WiiU!

Deal with it. If you're not cut out for it, don't sign up. Fans are absolutely rabid over character details... Get on board or get out.

@PessitheMystic He said that about Nintendo employees, not they to him.

@ecco6t9 And look where they are now.

Ehhh it's Nintendo, you were hired by them to make a game using their IP. I'm sure it's frustrating, and if you were making a game with an IP you owned, I would definitely agree with the "go away" comment.

Also, lets be real, Nintendo's "micromanaging" straight up saved Retro Studios, and gave them the opportunity to work with one of their best (imo) franchises over multiple games. Given that history, I find it a bit distasteful to complain about it.

@BTB20 see my previous comment where I already corrected myself, thanks.

Well, Metroid is kinda Nintendo's IP, and majority owned, so idk...

I think his name being "Purkeypile" is a bigger problem, so I wish him the best.

@gcunit
Believe it or not, he tried
He said the three scripts he wrote with Arndt were supposed to be what was filmed
Di$ney threw them out, hired Abrams and the rest is now bad history

Pretty sure Nintendo has greater say for Metroid than Retro does. Retro didn’t create Metroid nor did they fund the project. If you wanted 100% creativity and no micromanagement then self publish with a new IP.

I would rather have too much micromanagement, but game comes out good then no micromanagement and you get a fiasco like Concord (which previously devs prided themselves for Sony giving them “freedom” to do whatever). Management isn’t always a bad thing.

"The beatings will continue until morale improves."

I'm all for Nintendo following this logic as long as the game(s) are fun as hell!

(Obviously I'm not completely serious. Just what comes to mind when I read the headline )

@PessitheMystic oh yeah, I totally read it like that until I read into the story to see it was from his chat. Happens to the best of us 😄

As for what others say, complete agree here, Nintendo quality exists for a reason, they've been around for longer than my grandparents and will continue to be around after I'm gone. They care about their IP.

Also someone pointed out they called out Disney on how to animate Bowser, of course they'd then pull up some artist drawing Samus incorrectly, she has a pretty crazy design when you think about those shoulders, it's gotta be spot on or you know it will look weird.

@Qwiff He wasn't the lead artist, but he was one of the World Artistes. (Edit: Was curious when i read your comment, so I decided to look it up if it was true or not.)

Nintendo obsessed with the smallest details? Sounds like typical Nintendo.
Remember when Nintendo told Disney how Bowser had to hold his teacup in Wreck-it-Ralph?

With Prime 3, Nintendo likely wanted to make sure it was a real show stopper.
They were VERY pressed at the time leading up to the Wii launch.
In the end, it's my least favorite of the trilogy. Tries WAY too hard, which might be partly rooted in the demands and the micro management.

@JimmyFleck Yeah, we should be glad Nintendo took matters closer to their own hands with Other M.

"Pfff, what does Nintendo know about making games?! I'm out!"

I also immediately thought of Sakurai's extremely picky revision examples.

I also think of the Mark Twain quote:

“The difference between the almost right word and the right word is really a large matter. ’tis the difference between the lightning bug and the lightning.”

Sounds like it’s just not for him. As a musician I get him, part of you wants total freedom and when you’re on a job that has you constantly adjust to feedback it can get annoying. That’s when you have to decide what path to take, which he did and left.

Oh waaahhhh this person is full of themselves

I do understand that level of micromanagement may feel very annoying for a creative artist who want to do his thing and vision. But that's also the thing that make Nintendo games stand out as extraordinarily polished and their IPs cohesive and familiar through the decades.
Just seem to be that this guy just don't like to work under such detail focused conditions on an IP with an already established vision.

@cmdrmarc Got you to click though? Seems that's all this site wants.

Understandable but pub's decisions, go either way, Retro already have tons of projects they got revealed of on Did You Know Gaming or probably elsewhere.

With how Execs/western studios are these days sure, but back then West or East I think it was expected wasn't it.

Some rooms/levels have more of a wow factor of design to them and they want that. Not just 'make level, put bare minimum in it'. Others have particular purposes. Depends on the room they made, what enemies, what doors, what weapon attachment/ability was offered or not. Atmosphere matters a lot to Metroid games for sure.

This clip of Retro studios old staff that moved on 2 years ago: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rZBql2LtBlk&pp=ygUnS2l3aSB0YWxreiB3aHkgdGhleSBsZWF2ZSByZXRybyBzcnVkdW9z

So only getting out DK and Metroid when Rare got DK and more, different times, different skills/output, different consoles and things required for them for sure aside.

Some devs like this one I mean, it can go either way, the leaders can be particular but they also know what's intended for the product. Some like a Starfox Adventures are annoying to see putting another brand on it whenever during development to try make it sell when a game like Dinosaur Planet would have probably have been fine really like Banjo and others did.

But at the same time the Halo comparisons and them having to make it more their own like article months/year prior when Nintendo products feel very like them. Being what they consider not comparing to others which is why the game stand out so much is their take on something. Sure you can make comparisons and they can be similar in some ways but most times they try to go for their own impression on things and I like that.

Or how Samus's model looks or other little decisions in the game make sense why they have done what they have with the Prime series.

Even the immersive stuff in Prime series is so good regardless of GameCube the visor and weather and other little details or regular series on SNES and elsewhere, they are just great to see. Prime 3 was different then 1 & 2's structure but was still a surprise what they were going for.

Others like Other M/Fed Force trying something different were what they were, I don't mind them but I get why they aren't what people really wanted besides opening up the IP more or expanding on it even though any other could have gone that way or a new IP and format like Splatoon suiting better.

Either way this thing a dev is saying kind of sounds how I think of adaptations of anime/games end up, they get an IP, they do whatever with it and they end up sucking more.

Or how Neo Yokio ended up being just weird.

If people want their own creativity they can try (but like a janitor to low level staff or leadership and what particular decisions of ideas get through that suit the goal/IP) but unless an Indie or like the big noteworthy in the movie industry more so then gaming even if could be comparable.

They have to follow what's expected or present other ideas and see how closely they match the goal of the project, if their ideas don't make it in that's what happens. If they do in other ways then sure you got some ideas in but not all your ideas well end up in the final, they may be cleaned up or none at all, maybe they fit the next game.

Nature of the business and what's expected at least back then, maybe still now.

He sounds rebellious.