Topic: The Nintendo Switch Thread

Well this got fun to read.

The only times I've noticed frame drops in docked mode is in Torigoth to be honest and I've played XC2 for over 200 hours. I've only played portable mode once and it was fine but I wasn't doing enough to properly come to a conclusion (e.g. I've done no battles in portable mode).

@MFD Oh man XC2 runs like hot garbage in portable mode especially when you're in a fight.Don't know why Nintendo let this game release like this,or better yet haven't made the dev team patch it up.

@MsJubilee Well, if you look at my post that refers to that frame-drop in docked mode, they consider it normal. I can only guess that the way handheld runs is also considered "normal" and since enough people don't complain about portable and are content with it, nothing will change.

In fact, look at the comments in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9no_CvzuUS4 particularly this one "Totally a Tomato: Há 2 meses Portability >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Graphics & 60 fps"

That just scares me.

Tfw I played 160+ hours in portable mode and barely noticed any framerate drops. If there is, it must be not so bad since I didn't even remember

Framerate should never be a part of the "Who needs graphics when the gameplay is fun!" argument.

@GrailUK Sure they wanted to pick up that new audience. Capcom has a well documented infatuation with the big Western "COD" audience that almost killed them once before. I don't think anyone doubts that putting the game on PS4 along with its open world structure and de-Japanifying it was intended to reach the Western audience (whether that's a wise move given the still complicated game, and difference in audience playstyles is another issue, even regarding that the Western base for the game actually grew substantially on Nintendo where it previously failed miserably on Sony hardware....)

But the distinct absence of the game on Nintendo hardware for a series that has it's largest audience and most success on Nintendo hardware is what's striking. "All hardware except Nintendo" because hardware differences isn't a new running policy for may publishers. But MH in particular was a series that saw it's greatest retention and growth on that hardware. Companies walk away from what doesn't work, but rarely do they walk away from what DOES work unless there's incentive to do so. There's a severe lack of business sense in that. And though you may suggest that they took a gamble in hopes of a big payoff, their own sales estimates on World show they were not expecting a big payoff. So why would a business abandon a stable, growing market that has shown long term loyalty to chase a new audience with a more expensive product that isn't actually expected to return higher numbers while leaving a large market that has been repeat customers? They woudln't. Not unless there was some bankrolling for it. Unless you think the intense lure of being on XBox for a primarily Japanese series was just too much to ignore in favor of Nintendo's unknown next platform succeeding the one that just sold you upward of 10M unit sales?

Clearly they were roped by the promises of the incoming hardware from Sony/MS....but those platforms were ALSO unknowns back when they allegedly made these decisions.... Maybe Sony sweet talked them into believing the PS4 would take Japan by storm........but considering even Sony decided to delay the launch of PS4 in Japan....that's like an argument for buying salt water on an desert island.

@darkfenrir Even that list makes things look stranger than reality. Many of those games are the same game in different release/regional packages. 4, 4U are actually all the same game - U was an expansion pack in Japan, but the only version of 4 elsewhere. Same with Tri & 3G, X & XX, F2 &F2U,. So the real list looks more like:

1. MH4 & 4U (3DS) - 8.2m
2. MH Freedom 2 & Freedom Unite (PSP) - 6.2m
3. MH X & XX (3DS & NSW) - 6.1m (NSW numbers not included, may change position.)
4. MH Freedom 3 [Portable 3rd] (PSP) - 4.9m
5. MH Tri / 3G / 3GU (Wii & 3DS & WiiU) - 4.5m (WiiU numbers not included, may change position.)
6. MH Freedom (PSP) - 1.3m

Of note is the fact that the numbers haven't actually dropped, and not seen in the chart is a franchise growth in the West on Nintendo, and a relative stasis in Japan (itself a feat with the Japanese shift away from consoles.) Also note that X & XX were a somewhat unwanted rehash to milk 4/4U for all its worth. They sold quite well for a game that was almost an expansion to 4U in its own right.

Also of note is that when they supposedly started in on MHW, they had only the success of 4 and the growth over the 3 they considered a smash success to go by without knowing the sales of X. (It also indicates that X was truly a cash grab, being churned out of recycled assets from 4 while they were half-way done World....)

@darkfenrir Or maybe you're not one to pay as much attention to it. As an MMO and RTS player, I notice when frames are dropping, and that certainly extends to other games. The thing that really gets me, is how Nintendo notes it as "normal" that frames can drop quite serious at certain points. That means they'll excuse anything of the sort on future games.

@MFD That probably is the case, unless it went really, really tanking, I think I won't notice. Although to be honest, I think the treatment is because of XC2's status as niche- you don't see them ignoring BotW, heck, they tried to improve it like mad with the patches.

Because it's just that- XC2 is a niche title, and yet I think it needs huge funding, so it barely cashed back the money poured into it. That's probably why it's so unpolished vs Ninty's other title, but that's my guess.

@MFD Because framerates are stable on PS4 and XBox One S. Heck, I saw framerate drops frequently in the MHW demo on PS4 Pro...... Maybe X1X will prevent frame drops? For that matter SHMUPS on arcade boards suffered this problem severely back in even the 80's.

The problem is developers, including Nintendo apparently (remember Pokemon X & Y framerate? Or the BotW Forest?) value putting extra graphical flourishes in, and deem it acceptable so long as only "certain spots" have framerate drop because of it rather than forcing fluid framerate even if the whole game's graphics have to be denied those graphical flourishes.

Power difference or not, I see it as the same problem on Switch, PS4, X1, even PC back when I played. Heck I bought a PS4 Pro PRIMAIRLY to throw it in boost mode and prioritize framerate stability. When you have to buy upgraded hardware just to hope to get the stable framerate the base hardware claims...something is wrong in the industry.

@darkfenrir Unpolished, but at the same time this is what I got back from a Nintendo representative in an e-mail "In regards to the frame rate drop, considering the game is a Nintendo Switch exclusive, the publisher certainly took the device's specifications into account when developing the game, and are aware of the frame drop, which is considered normal in certain situations during the game play, but abnormal, should this happen constantly. In which case we would suspect there may be something wrong with the game card itself."

Looking at the thickened piece of sentence, how did this happen all things considered? Well, this would be a reason, but nonetheless one I'm pissed off at Nintendo for: https://www.resetera.com/threads/xenoblade-chronicles-2-staff...

@NEStalgia I still maintain the ability to choose between a lower resolution, say 720p 60fps and higher resolution, say 1080p 30fps like most games are, would be a must on PS4 and Xbox One. But no, buy a new system for that feature.

Heck even on my PC playing PUBG at medium settings, there are noticeable drops briefly, usually when someone is around. This is more prominent on Xbox One, but its there on PC.

@MFD Care to share photographic proof of that email there buddy?

@NEStalgia Graphical flourishes? A friend of mine sent me a picture of XCX, and it looks basically the same as XC2, since it is, after all, and upgraded engine from that. And at least the PS4/Xbox One versions look reasonable, the Switch just has the end of the stick on this one.

And yes, stable-frames is something lacking everywhere, and I can understand if it happens in multiplats. But XC2 isn't a multiplat, is it? Neither is Zelda: BotW, and that drops frames like nothing else when you Stasis+ and pan the camera. Either there's laziness from Nintendo in having people optimize and quality control, or the Switch can't handle more than this.

@MFD I mean even some games have dips in other consoles, other PCs, and with the massive scale of XC2, I think it's pretty normal to happen especially in places where there's a lot of things happening at once, like 10+ enemies attacking you

Idk, I would still standby "as long as it's not constant and it truly happens during times where there's a lot of things that need to be rendered, it's really normal"

Might be some part of me that is used to dipping fps since I was playing games in GT650M before lul

@MFD BOTW is multiplatform sir...I know its easy to forget but...it is.

Also, yeah XC2 looks like XCX, same engine and all that, with some development overlap. I don't know what PS4/Xbox One versions you are referencing though, unless you swapped to some unmentioned game mid-paragraph.

@YummyHappyPills This is the mid-section of the e-mail, I do not wish to show the name of the representative due to privacy: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/347646519878483969/405...

@YummyHappyPills And for that, XC2 sacrificed: https://www.resetera.com/threads/xenoblade-chronicles-2-staff...

The game needed more time in the oven, but it was denied.

@darkfenrir Here's the thing I must ask: Why is, what is basically the machine not able to handle what's going on, excused? It's the machine not being up to the task it's presented with, why is that excused and alright? Either a game is made to work with the hardware, or if the hardware isn't strong enough, you make sure there's enough power to fit the team's vision. If neither of these are done properly, frame-drops are the result.

@MFD I very much doubt that e-mail is real, given the horrendous spelling and customer service apparent almost immediately.

Odd how a Nintendo rep would refer to the company in third person, give such loose references to what Switch is, not spell check "Whether".

"In this case as you have guessed, even though we are consumers ourselves". That's not a very good PR response I'm afraid. Nor does that statement mean anything in context, especially since we don't see the email you sent, therefore we don't see what they are referring to.

When sourcing information please give whole context.

@YummyHappyPills

Now please, make it quick. Some things aren't meant to be out in the open, you know.

I am leaving now, so I'll remove the upload as well. You can look at it later when I return.

@MFD you wrote nintendo crying about frame rates in xenoblade2? there must be something wrong with your switch dude, this game runs awesome.