Wii U Forum

Topic: Wii U and the state of the industry

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Mandoble

141. Posted:

[quote=Mandoble]

GameLord08 wrote:

I'm telling you to provide me with concrete evidence as to why the 3DS is undeniably "outclassed" by the Vita

Are you joking, right? Do you do that on purpose? It happens that 3DS and Vita belong to the same class, it was not the case with Wii and PS360, as the Wii, because of its control scheme, was perceived as a totally different toy as well that is was as aimed to a totally different kind of population.

But now lets compare again both handhelds:
Vita:
CPU: 4x1.5Ghz
GPU: 4x300 MHz
RAM: 512MB / 128MB VRAM
Effective resolution: 960x544
Communications: 3G, Wi-Fi 802.11 b,g and n
Control: dual analog sticks, 2 shoulder physical buttons, plus six more mapped on the back multitouch panel, cross digital pad, multitouch frontal screen, multitouch back panel, giros + GPS position (3G)

3DS:
CPU: 2x266 MHz.
GPU: 1x133 MHz
RAM: 64MB / 4MB VRAM
Effective resolution: 400x240
Communications: Wi-Fi 802.11 b and g
Control: single analog pad, 2 shoulder physical buttons, cross digital pad, single touch frontal screen, giros.

Do you really need more arguments about how one device is outclassing the other? And this is unrelated to price or game catalogs.

Mandoble

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Reala

142. Posted:

Tech specs never prove one console outclasses another only game selection can prove that otherwise you could say 3DO and jaguar outclassed the SNES and megadrive; which would be pretty crazy.

there's nothing that's certain... of that you can be certain

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Mandoble

143. Posted:

Fine, then as said before GBA outclasses both, 3DS and DS together. And WiiU will be outclassed by the Wii during some years as well, right?

Edited on by Mandoble

Mandoble

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DeMoN-13ruce

144. Posted:

[quote="Mandoble"]

GameLord08 wrote:

Mandoble wrote:

I'm telling you to provide me with concrete evidence as to why the 3DS is undeniably "outclassed" by the Vita

[/div]

[/div]

Are you joking, right? Do you do that on purpose? It happens that 3DS and Vita belong to the same class, it was not the case with Wii and PS360, as the Wii, because of its control scheme, was perceived as a totally different toy as well that is was as aimed to a totally different kind of population.

But now lets compare again both handhelds:
Vita:
CPU: 4x1.5Ghz
GPU: 4x300 MHz
RAM: 512MB / 128MB VRAM
Effective resolution: 960x544
Communications: 3G, Wi-Fi 802.11 b,g and n
Control: dual analog sticks, 2 shoulder physical buttons, plus six more mapped on the back multitouch panel, cross digital pad, multitouch frontal screen, multitouch back panel, giros + GPS position (3G)

3DS:
CPU: 2x266 MHz.
GPU: 1x133 MHz
RAM: 64MB / 4MB VRAM
Effective resolution: 400x240
Communications: Wi-Fi 802.11 b and g
Control: single analog pad, 2 shoulder physical buttons, cross digital pad, single touch frontal screen, giros.

Do you really need more arguments about how one device is outclassing the other? And this is unrelated to price or game catalogs.

[/div]

sorry but if you look that way then your AN GRAPHIC ADDICT....i bought the 3ds and vita FOR THE GAMES and HAVING FUN and wasting boredom....NOT the one thats better.

ps2 was the weakest of the three the consolewar before and sold like 150+ million untis? check ds and psp 150m units vs 70m.......price does indeed matter sodoes the games only some ppl want top notch graphics while other just buy it to have some fun or get rid of boredom:P

Edited on by DeMoN-13ruce

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DeMoN-13ruce

145. Posted:

Mandoble wrote:

Fine, then as said before GBA outclasses both, 3DS and DS together. And WiiU will be outclassed by the Wii during some years as well, right?

DUH i'm not goig to even explain this....

3DS Friend Code: 2879-0303-7697
Metal Gear Solid (rising etc)

Best game series i ever played:D

BIGG BOSS (Naked Snake) is my favorite game character of all time!

GANGNAM STYLE!!!

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Reala

146. Posted:

Mandoble wrote:

And WiiU will be outclassed by the Wii during some years as well, right?

That's getting into the realms of reading the future really since so little is known about wii u, plus backwards compatibility complicates things a little.

there's nothing that's certain... of that you can be certain

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DeMoN-13ruce

147. Posted:

Reala wrote:

Mandoble wrote:

And WiiU will be outclassed by the Wii during some years as well, right?

[/div]

[/div]

[/div]

That's getting into the realms of reading the future really since so little is known about wii u, plus backwards compatibility complicates things a little.

[/div]

[/div]

Off topic but i hope wii games can be played on the upad:p playing zelda or metroid ah PLEASE NINTENDO

on topic....the 3ds also got backwards compatibility and the vita not sure they have digital psp games but what about other ppl stick with umds?;p

i just don't download games becuase what if my system gets broken :/

Edited on by DeMoN-13ruce

3DS Friend Code: 2879-0303-7697
Metal Gear Solid (rising etc)

Best game series i ever played:D

BIGG BOSS (Naked Snake) is my favorite game character of all time!

GANGNAM STYLE!!!

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kyuubikid213

148. Posted:

Mandoble wrote:

@kyuubikid213, I understand you were joking, but the others were not, and in this thread there is a generalized wrong feeling about the games available for the Vita. I already explained the comparison GBA vs 3DS, 3DS vs Vita. But I can repeat if you want. GBA has a better library of games? Yes it has. GBA was outclassed by 3DS, yes it is in every main aspect, control, power and graphics. The same happens with 3DS vs Vita, but in this case 3DS has not even a way better and larger library of games. As you said, 3DS is backwards compatible with DS, but how many DS games can you find at stores today? And the same happens with PSP, but in the case of Vita you can effectively download hundreds of PSP games that you will not find any more in stores. When comparing the devices (3DS vs Vita) it is not only that Vita has way better graphics capabilities, but also processing power and RAM. Only with RAM it doubles the PS3! It is like comparing Wii with PS3, but in this case it is the Vita the one with notorious advantage for the controller. Can you name a single technical or functional aspect where the 3DS can match the Vita? Because I cannot, and I have both consoles (in fact 2 3DS).

Including here some specs as well:
Vita:
CPU: 4x1.5Ghz
GPU: 4x300 MHz
RAM: 512MB / 128MB VRAM
Effective resolution: 960x544
Communications: 3G, Wi-Fi 802.11 b,g and n

3DS:
CPU: 2x266 MHz.
GPU: 1x133 MHz
RAM: 64MB / 4MB VRAM
Effective resolution: 400x240
Communications: Wi-Fi 802.11 b and g

The point I was trying to make by countering your GBA argument is that the GBA library being compared to the 3DS library is like comparing the PSP library to the Vita library. Both the GBA and PSP were out and (except PSP) completed their lifecycles with many, many games. Comparing libraries to two new systems wouldn't make sense because there are still more games coming.

And as for the technical aspects of 3DS vs Vita, this means nothing. The DS was vastly inferior to the PSP in nearly every way, but the DS won that handheld battle. The 3DS, as you've already mentioned, is inferior to the Vita in almost every way, but so far, it's doing better. I know it had a year's headstart, but Sony and most of their fans said the Vita was going to destroy the 3DS when it came out. The Vita was going to win inevitably. But as the numbers have shown, the 3DS is more popular still. Only time will tell, but looking back, the 3DS still has a fighting chance. The only actual advantage the 3DS has over the Vita is control. It is through an accessory, but with the Circle Pad Pro, the 3DS gains two more shoulder buttons and a right analog stick thus giving it the same amount of control options as playing a Wii game that is compatible with the Classic Controller.

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Aviator

149. Posted:

Buy a Vita. You don't need to buy anything else to play.

Buy a 3DS.

  • and a circle pad pro which is sold separately

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Mandoble

150. Posted:

Reala wrote:

Mandoble wrote:

And WiiU will be outclassed by the Wii during some years as well, right?

[/div]

[/div]

That's getting into the realms of reading the future really since so little is known about wii u, plus backwards compatibility complicates things a little.

[/div]

No, it doesnt. The WiiU clearly outclasses the Wii independently of the support it will have for games. If doesnt matter that you try to use that non sense argument only when conventient for you, game library doesnt determine whether a device is or not outclassed by another. Vita outclasses also the PSP, independently how many games the PSP has, and the same happens with Vita vs 3DS. With this I'm not saying that Vita will be able to sell as many units as 3DS, this is also unrelated to the term outclass. But on the other side the term "outclassed" is quite related to the longevity of the device before needing to be replaced.

Do you think that Sony needs to update the Vita with something? Do you think that something is missing on its design? Can you say the same for the 3DS?

Edited on by Mandoble

Mandoble

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Reala

151. Posted:

well PS2 is still selling xbox isn't so better tech doesn't exactly ensure longevity either.

there's nothing that's certain... of that you can be certain

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DeMoN-13ruce

152. Posted:

The 3ds and vita are fine and if we are talking about games the 3ds psp and ds have better games then vita

3DS Friend Code: 2879-0303-7697
Metal Gear Solid (rising etc)

Best game series i ever played:D

BIGG BOSS (Naked Snake) is my favorite game character of all time!

GANGNAM STYLE!!!

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Mandoble

153. Posted:

kyuubikid213 wrote:

The point I was trying to make by countering your GBA argument is that the GBA library being compared to the 3DS library is like comparing the PSP library to the Vita library. Both the GBA and PSP were out and (except PSP) completed their lifecycles with many, many games. Comparing libraries to two new systems wouldn't make sense because there are still more games coming.

aha, so we cannot compare GBA and 3DS libraries because GBA was already longer in the market, but on the other side we can compare 3DS and Vita's libraries based on the same argument might be? I would say that is "a bit" unfair, then might be you guys should wait a year or so before comparing game libraries. mmm how many decent games had the 3DS before the price cut BTW? I bought it as soon as it was released and the first year was like a dry desert.

The funny part is that if I say that MK7 or MLand were decent games, some one will come and using the very same argumentation as for the Vita and PS3 they must reply me sayng that these are worthless because the Wii ones were way better, correct Moomoo?? Someone will come saying the same about OOT because it was just a port from N64 adding nothing special, right? Of course same applies to Starfox, so what do we have left for the 3DS? RE? Again using the same argumentation the versions for big consoles are better too. It is interesting to see how people attack Uncharted because PS3 versions are better, but they dont say anything about Mland vs MGalaxy or MK7 vs Mkart. Then they say that most Vita games are ports or similar to ports, but the same doesnt apply to OOT, Starfox, MK7, MLand, MTennis and even Pilot Wings vs Wii Sport Resort. Because if they apply the same criteria, what would be left as original and unique for the 3DS? the horrible KI? Using the very same argument Vita games are overpriced, but the same doesnt apply to 3D, right? And the extremist fanboy is me, right?

Mandoble

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Reala

154. Posted:

Mandoble wrote:

The funny part is that if I say that MK7 or MLand were decent games, some one will come and using the very same argumentation as for the Vita and PS3 they must reply me sayng that these are worthless because the Wii ones were way better, correct Moomoo?? Someone will come saying the same about OOT because it was just a port from N64 adding nothing special, right? Of course same applies to Starfox, so what do we have left for the 3DS? RE? Again using the same argumentation the versions for big consoles are better too. It is interesting to see how people attack Uncharted because PS3 versions are better, but they dont say anything about Mland vs MGalaxy or MK7 vs Mkart. Then they say that most Vita games are ports or similar to ports, but the same doesnt apply to OOT, Starfox, MK7, MLand, MTennis and even Pilot Wings vs Wii Sport Resort. Because if they apply the same criteria, what would be left as original and unique for the 3DS? the horrible KI? Using the very same argument Vita games are overpriced, but the same doesnt apply to 3D, right? And the extremist fanboy is me, right?

well they might well say those things if that is their opinion the internet is full of opinion, pretty par for the course on a forum; as for which is overpriced to me they both are.

there's nothing that's certain... of that you can be certain

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shingi_70

155. Posted:

Soo when. Do you think the next gen consoles will be announced and released.

For the 720 I'm going with an annoucment between October and December withs release next November. For Sony a tease at tgs and maybe a release in 2014.

shingi_70

3DS Friend Code: 3093-7342-3454 | Nintendo Network ID: shingi70

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kyuubikid213

156. Posted:

@Aviator Yeah, you can buy a 3DS with the Circle Pad Pro and you would have still spent less than getting the Vita. Don't forget your proprietary memory stick :) .

@Mandoble I'm certain you were comparing the Vita and 3DS as well and in fact saying that the Vita had more games and games of better quality. So no, the 3DS's year long advantage isn't an unfair comparison to make when you name eleven Vita games to try and compare to five 3DS games.

I don't know where you're coming from with the "all Vita games ar ports" argument. I didn't say that. Most games on the market today are ports, sequels, or remakes, so saying that against any console's library would just give your opposition room to say the same. The same with the overpriced thing, I didn't say that either. I only think the Vita itself seems over priced in that you have to buy a proprietary memory stick that costs about $20 on a system where you would desparately need the extra space.

And please stop saying Kid Icarus is a horrible game. It really isn't.

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Mandoble

157. Posted:

You didnt say that, I was referring to MooMoo, as well as many others saying that Vita games are too similar to what they already have for their PS3, but at the same time they dont apply the same critic for 3DS ones. And I cannot stop saying KI is horrible, it is not only horrible visually speaking, its control is horrible too, the argument, the story, the gameplay, the lack of localization other than English (quite incredible for a company like Nintendo BTW), everything is horrible there ;) But yes, I said that for me current Vita library is more solid than 3DS one, I was replied that I'm the minority which is fine, then wait one year and lets see what happens with that supposed majority.

3DS with circle pad pro is not any option as only few devs will be doing anything specific for it, not even the horrible KI supports it AFAIK. You cannot develop a game based on an awful piece of plastic that only a minority might be using. I hope you dont try to imply that all the extra cost of the Vita is just because of its second analog, right?

Mandoble

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moomoo

158. Posted:

@Mandoble: Hah! You see right for me.
Confession time: I bought a 3DS because my DSlite had broken L and R buttons. I didn't want to get it fixed when I could just buy a DSi for not so much more money. However, the 3DS had just come out, and since the 3DS was only $100 more, I thought "why not". Also, there'd be a new Pokemon game on it eventually, so there was very little to lose.
Now, in regards to the portable games vs. their console brethren: Mario 3D Land takes a very different approach to platforming then Mario Galaxy. I don't think it's as good, but it's a very different kind of game. Uncharted: Golden Abyss is Uncharted in your pocket. That's it. Since part of what makes Uncharted so great are the grand setpieces (that train level in Uncharted 2 still wows me), some of the effect is lost. It doesn't try to be different, and while that is great in it's own right, it's very hard to justify buying it if you don't own the other games yet. As for MK 7 (as in Mario Kart), you got me. Mario Kart is more suited to portable play, but when compared to the one on DS, I found it to be kind of lacking.
3DS and Vita both have mostly overpriced stuff. I think $40 is just too big an asking price for most games. That's why most of my games I didn't buy for $40; I bought most of them for half-off at least. A year head-start really helped it in that regard.

As for Kid Icarus being horrible, it's your opinion. I found the game to be the best on the 3DS, although I loved Metroid Prime Hunters and Moon on the system, so maybe that has something to do with it.
As for the Resident Evil argument, a lot of people found Revelations to be a far superior game to RE 5, so there's that. Right now, it's looking a lot better then RE 6 too, which is coming out later this year. Isn't it kind of ironic that a portable game could be the best one this year? But I digress.

I do think you're completely right on the circle pad pro. No dev is going to make a game that will work exclusively with it. There's just too few people using it.

Edited on by moomoo

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DeMoN-13ruce

159. Posted:

Mandoble wrote:

I hope you dont try to imply that all the extra cost of the Vita is just because of its second analog, right?

yup the 2nd analog stick defently upped the price sorry

3DS Friend Code: 2879-0303-7697
Metal Gear Solid (rising etc)

Best game series i ever played:D

BIGG BOSS (Naked Snake) is my favorite game character of all time!

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shingi_70

160. Posted:

Who gives a about vita vs 3ds. Both are good systems with their shortcomings.

Edited on by theblackdragon

shingi_70

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