Hah! Your postings in this thread kick 3 and a half asses (ass? assi?) on scale of 4 possible ass kickingness.
I mean I could be getting ZERO cheese. I should thank my lucky stars I get single slices of boogercheese and marginalsequalcheese each week!!! Thanks for keepin me real.
And I'd like to complain about Sonic Tuesdays............... but it's just too cool a concept to ever complain about.
As far as typical Wii usage goes, I seem to be either mindlessly doing polls or playing River City Ransom of late. I REALLY need to hunker down and polish off Mega Man 9. A criminal lack of attention lately on my part.
I fully support a little gamesmanship about who's ahead in the release total. Something interesting, yet meaningless to discuss while waiting for something of actual value to be released for the VC ......one of these weeks. One of these one game weeks. Although obviously this topic is only interesting so long as NA stays in the lead.......
Hey, congrats Europe. Any Last Ninja is a gem, and the Impossible Mission concept is a classic, even if #2 is a slightly lesser version of itself (inspite of sprucier graphic details). And Boogerman.......er, so how about that Last Ninja 3?!
I'm glad I get to be slightly less disappointed in Nintendo, thanks to at least Europe getting a fair showing.
Actually, yes, if any semi-reliable company put out a wireless N64 controller, I'd probably throw caution to the wind and snag it none too long after it came out. Such a release would also create an up tick in the number of N64 games I currently own on the VC.
I think we need to set our standards as low as possible. We should lobby for 1 game per month. Heck, we don't even deserve that much......maybe one game per major holiday. But perhaps that would still be an unfair burden to place on Big N ......we really shouldn't be so demanding and ungrateful.
Indeed as the Big N would probably put it ....... Let them eat cake!!
This message has been brought to you by the Committee for People Not Being Passive Doormat Consumers.
. There's being appreciative for things provided in the past, and THEN there's also being honest about the treatment happening in the present. People remaining silent and thankful for Big N's crumbs when this is a market where money talks ............ I really don't know what to say to folks who don't want to at least try to drive their own car. Metaphorically speaking.
In other news, as single games go, this week could have been worse. And it could have also been a lot better. If 1 game weeks are Big N's way of enhancing the appreciation of the few games of top quality that are featured and released (probably like for Christmans), then I'd say they were nuts....... cept for the fact that the starve (for months at a time) and then pamper (for a week or two at a time) marketing strategy seems to be working on some of their customers. Can a manipulative marketing strategy really be "wrong" if it's successful? If I drop a house on someone and no one saw me (caught me) do it, did that person still get pancaked??
(Sorry, I'm getting philosophical again. )
Anyway, with the US having been staked in the heart again this week (well that may be a bit harsh, since it was at least a Hedgehog game), I do what I can and pray for Europe to get a better VC week(s) than us. Let them eat Mario Golf and Secret of Mana!!
And I'll continue to expect nothing each week (for the US VC releases) and settle for the imagination of what it would be like to have long-term positive release trends that would give me a reason to get excited in advance of each week.
I could live undisappointed with two VC releases per week of garbage for months at a time far better than one release per week that alternates garbage/fair/garbage/great/garbage/fair/garbage......... I only have so many weeks left in my life Big N!! And even fewer before you release your next Next-Gen system and start ignoring VC gaming even more than now..........................
I suppose Big N might be wanting to push folks toward buying $50 games rather than supplying better $5 game availability. I just wish they'd say so up front and give us an advance schedule of the multitude of drought stages. I'm running out of anti-depressants at this rate!
Although I join the other folks expressing caution about buying generic for a motion sensitive controller that makes up the heart of Wii motion gaming, I will say that I support any solid market competition for Nintendo that might provoke the Big N to stick to quality and offer some better deals and variety than they would with a monopoly.
I won't buy these 3rd party controllers (typically, save for special purpose ones like Hori's fighting stick.....which doesn't really compete with Big N hardware, since Big N only seems to do enough to fundamentally support the Wii), but I'll cheer the 3rd party companies on to take as much market share as they can.
Maybe it'll at least provoke Big N into some alternative colors, styles, and maybe even an auto-fire (not something I use much, but it's nice to have the option for certain games........ YEAH, that's right, I'm pointing YOU Track and Field II).
Yeah, there was a period back in the day where my obsessive compulsive streak really came out for Wrecking Crew......I recall playing so long a single sitting once that when I finally went to bed I dreamt I was inside the game, being chased around by the monsters and beating on brick walls as if my life depended on it. It's far more scary a game in Dreamscape First Person.
It was almost like what I'd imagine a "bad" acid trip would be like.
But yeah, a game perhaps even more addictive than Tetris. heh
Yeah, that was kind of a rehash post of what you said, I just got too excited to see someone looking at the big picture.
And it's true enough, we've preaching to the choir here on this web site, or to put it another way via a rhetorical response to Tony's last line in the post 99........... Yes they should. And no, they won't.
GO ON Nintendo......prove me wrong!! I dare ya! I double dog dare ya!!!
As far as arcade version of games, since my first play of Contra was in the arcade (I was an arcade rat well before I got my hands on a NES), I'd really love to get an arcade perfect port downloaded to the Wii. I dunno if I wanna monetarily support Microsoft in any way shape or form (I got a grudge against extra ruthless business practices), but I imagine I'll eventually break down and buy the cheapest XBox360 I can find, just to download all the stuff I can't get on my Wii VC.
And it's a pity the PS3 has pissed me off with it's weak support for it's ancestor games. I'll probably never fork over the 400 dollars for one.........unless it gets all the Final Fantasy downloads when Square gives up the ghost of disc sales of old games......at which point I may try to buy one at a discount......Dham my sentimental streak!!
But regardless of the system, I'd raze several small border villages for the first warlord who'd supply me with an arcade perfect port of Double Dragon (and maybe Contra.....in a double pack).
@ "I would also like to say that speaking for myself, at least, I tend to get more upset reading the posts of people defending Nintendo and telling the complainers to shut up than by the complaining or the actual releases. We really don't need that kind of animosity here."
Absolutely. Reading people doing Counter-posting, especially in a "you're wrong, stop talking" style......that's definitely the least useful part of this great site that for the majority of posts and posters have created a really positive vibe and a well applied common appreciation of the VC concept and content all over this site. It was refreshing when I first came across it, and with the international camradre in addition, this is all-in-all a marvelous little site. It gives me that warm fuzzy feeling I used to get when the older QUALITY Nintendo Power, Gamepro, and EGM used to arrive at my door each month......cept this is the electronic and interactive version I suppose.
And @MaxPlastic: ......WORD to your Pro Wrestling exclamation!
Ya know, I'd almost settle for Big N putting their releases out in chronological order.........then at least a plain yet shiny gem like Pro Wrestling gets put out by now (MAYBE)......and hey, then we wouldn't get spoiled by the later fancier games until we had already well enjoyed the classic classics for what they were, within their generational limits.
But yeah, too late now I guess to suggest that to Nintendo for them to ignore (along with the myriad other fan base suggestions).
Hm, perhaps touffeboy is using some sort of super shiny reverse psych sarcasm tool to make their point. I mean I was swayed by it ....... I just can't tell which way.
@"Okay, seriously, I think I'm done this time. If you actually read all the way through that, you have my sincerest thanks."
I did. You're welcome. And I say eureka! to someone expressing the insight that the volume of selection is not a defacto impediment to people making purchases, and certainly would be nothing close to the DOOOOOOOM of the VC. (DOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMM ....I say!!! )
And I find the suggestion previously made (that too large a selection would lead to reduced purchasing of some games that would lead to game makers and license owners abandoning the VC and the DOOOOOOO.....OOOOOOOOOOM of the VC) a really EXCELLENT application of Reductio Ad Absurdum and much appreciate proving Stuffgamer1's point by reducing the current It'd be a "doom"ly large selection of games to choose from! theorized outcome to its absurd conclusion. (Sorry if that sounded a bit heavy, I couldn't pass up the chance to take my college philosophy logic class for a walk)
I'd suggest that the non-classic (less desirable) games would STILL be bought, even if the extreme occurred and the full available library were made available in the next 24 hours. People will buy their favorites first, of course. They'll play them, hopefully A LOT, and then they'll say "Hey, I got this VC library thing sitting here, and I've got all the games I used to play and loved..........now what else is out there for a cheap 5 to 10 dollars, that I might love or at least find interesting?".......and the almost greats and the sorta greats and the cult classics and the out right strange will still get played. Heck, with a full library out there, some folks might start with the unknowns, knowing that they can go to the mainstream classics any time they want, since they can choose from either type at any time.
I'll be the first in line to fully agree that less profit will be made off of the "less desirable" games that way. However I'm going to say in my best possible estimation that the money lost by not selling to those hyperactive "gotta feed the need" few who gobble most anything each week, that lost money will be marginal compared to the amount spent on those same games while generating way more enthusiasm for the VC via the larger library appealing to more people just by sheer variety.
Besides, surely it should be obvious that marginal profit gained 5 to 10 dollars a purchase by starving players into buying marginal games will not amount to all that much moolah compared to people telling other prospective Wii buyers about all the great classic games they can get on their Wii right now today.
Or I could be off my the mark, and simply the Heir to the Throne of the Kingdom of Idiots. It can be a fine line sometimes.
On the discussion of weekly ratios of VC to Wiiware games (and with the caveat that I do indeed understand that neither game library is fundamentally in and of itself "better" or more desirable in general) I do want to suggest that there may be more validity to the concern about wiiware dominating the weekly release ratio than just "classic gamers" vs "new/creative gamers".
With the VC being a selling point of the Wii since Nov 2006 (1st game released to VC), while Wiiware only being a selling point of the Wii since March 2008 (and that initial release was in Japan), people toting the perspective that the VC is more proprietary and deserves at least equal time each week may be at least somewhat justified in their perspective.
For myself in particular, I do have a leaning toward the VC. I bought my Wii primarily based on the existence of the VC (bought it right before Wiiware kicked off actually) and the potential for Commodore 64 support for it in the US, with the Wii's motion control gaming being more of a fringe benefit and only mild interest (I used a Power Glove back in the day and I knew enough to not hold high expectations..... though I have indeed been really pleased with the motion control functions so far, if under supported in games).
Yet, I can step outside my preference and appreciate the almost indie nature of Wiiware games and the opportunity to have never before seen games available via download.
I'd just like to suggest that folks consider that the Wiiware is not considered as much a core component of the Wii as VC. People with a preference will most always consider their preference "core" to something. But how valid is it for a game system to start out as something and then evolve years later with new options and suddenly within that year have the new options be supported equal to, or worse dwarf the fundamental and long standing components of the game system (as the Big N is doing with their currently active VC/Wiiware release schedule)?
Anyway, sorry for the dissertation. I just see a flaw in folks applying an (commendable) equality perspective to a situation where equal balance, or a Wiiware leaning balance, is not representative of nor appropriate for a player base that has been building for multiple years previous to the Wiiware coming into existence.
Personally, I don't mind an even split between Wiiware and VC, but regardless of the split, IMHO the VC needs at least two releases a week (so one stinker can't stink up the place too much for a whole week of my Wii life). I would like to see a more complete library by the time I'm 50 (a ways out there). And the concern about "running out of games to release" is a hollow concern in my opinion, since the size of the current game library carries more weight than a "potential" library ever will..... not that I'll claim that the Big N understands that concept. )
@the discussion about Metal Slug 2:
Understand, while I like Metal Slug 2 quite a bit (#1 has more sentimentality for me though), I don't consider it a satisfying game experience when it can be played with the slow down. When a playable MS2(X) shows up I'll spend the Wii points, inspite of the collection I could by on disc, largely because I too want the classic controls.
But what does it say for the lone VC game released this week when even strong fans of the franchise are likely to skip it because it's playability is so plagued (some parts worse than others)??
In theory, a very nice release..... in reality though, it's an empty VC week for BOTH those disinterested in the game genre AND for those who actually enjoy it.
I wonder if Contra 1 is currently sitting around unreleased while they stock their shelves with a game crippled enough that it needed a rerelease?
I dearly appreciate the existence of the VC, but it's greatest value is only maintained as long as it receives proper support and continues to grow it's library. Being content with what is already out is a perspective best left for those days when (in general) a next generation system comes out and even the pretense of support for the previous game system's library is hobbled or gone entirely. Let's hope we can have slightly higher expectations for our current generation Wii VC system than that.
@Wariofan:
I think people are simply wanting better odds, more of a fighting chance at something desirable rather than waiting week after week, one single shot at a time for a decent game. Since the number one is about as close as you can get to zero, I'd suggest that two games a week is not exactly asking for the world.
Compared to the likes of Boogerman, Metal Slug 2 made EU's last update seem at least ok. But now it seems like it only makes for both sides of the pond to be left in the cold for another week (or two, depending which side yer on). NA got a nice string of games going into the current drought, so overall EU is getting the worst of the current drought (even with Castlevania 3).
Disappointing...... but everything in life cycles. All I know is that the more Nintendo crams WiiWare down our throat instead of making headway on absent NES/SNES/N64 classics, the less interest I have in Wiiware in general. And these one VC game weeks seem to be designed to force people into participating more in Wiiware (perhaps).
A month passes and, save for Mega Man 3, we see an overpriced Metal Slug 2 (considering the slowdown), Boogerman (nuff said), a hamstrung Forgotten Worlds (needs the second joystick), and .........Space Invaders (a joke lacking humor).
I don't recall the last time I saw any other store so consistently stock it's shelves with substandard merchandise. Even if the store wants to cover minority interests and cult followings, they generally will at least balance their offerings with more generally desirable offerings.
Oh well, corporate thinking has often been detached from applicability.
Sorry folks. Been building that perspective up during the current drought and the one previous (previous to offerings like Mega Man 2 and SupMarRPG). I'll take refuge in my PS1 Final Fantasy Tactics for the time being, I guess.
I'm not sure which ring of hell it belongs in, but which ever one I'm sure it'd be titled "Press Play on Tape."
It made me appreciate my lone cartridge game, Congo Bongo.
If the US VC ever gets C64, I hope they get around to putting out Rambo First Blood Part 2 for it. For some odd reason I miss that one as much as any of them. Between that and Raid Over Moscow I lost many an hour.
It's funny, but what once seemed like the most awkward controller ever devised (the N64 controller), once playing Goldeneye with itfor a bit it became my all time favorite controller. That and a select set of high quality games like Banjo Kazooie, Starfox64, Mario64, and Zelda OoT, and 4 player capability built in...... it may have become the best all around system for my money. Perhaps even still today.
Besides that was the last hurrah for cartridges......and that betrayal by the Big N caused me to skip owning a Gamecube right up until late last year.
@badmouthsadmouth:
You're not alone, there are times when I consider SMB2 to be very inspired originality. And most of the rest of the time I at least respect it's unique style and variety of gameplay. In it's innovation of new environmental interaction it did remain true to the franchise.
Now that I ponder on it, what is it about the second games of major building block franchises and them being the blacksheep that go their own way, often to polarized reviews...... Super Mario 2, Zelda 2, Castlevania 2.........?
Although I won't knock Mega Man 2 for sticking to the original style and building on it.
I'd say Altered Beast still looks pretty cool, but yeah the depth of gameplay never was quite there.
But that's what we need today, more new game systems sold with perfect arcade ports included. I think the Super NES was the last time I got a really satisfying game included standard with a game system. I'm not sure which is worse, the fact that it isn't as much of a standard anymore (except for special packages and usually at greater expense), or that I'm OLD school enough to say "Ahhhh, back in the day........"
And I recall trying to play Bruce Lee on my C64 and being forever baffled as to my goal. It was an odd mix of fun and frustration.
Major congrats Europe. Castlevania 3 is a great classic (not quite the character of 2 in my opinion, but nice graphics, a new posse system, and some great bosses).
And Ghosts and Goblins.......not the perfect arcade port I would have asked the Big N for back in the day, but it was still one of those games I loved to impale myself on semi-regularly.
A pair of true classics......... and......... a Pac Man game with Gannondorf up top dancing around, looking like it came from an Atari 2600........ uh, well, two out of three ain't bad!
In total, definitely a great gift to find in the ol candy bag!
What.......wasn't the solution to that dead end problem OBVIOUS??
All ya had to do was punch a hole in it with your HEAD.
I mean a villager SAID so, and as we all know it's a gaming certainty to get reliable critical answers to the big problems from game townspeople ........how much more "help" could a person have needed??
But yes, some games were just MADE for a Nintendo Power counter part. Reminds me of a Commodore 64 game where the solution to a locked Martian pyramid door involved a neon sign and wire cutters.
Ah, god bless yah Deborah Cliff........ you Wrench of the Monkey in our nice straight line gaming lives.
Definitely a thought provoking list. I'm in hearty agreement about the edge Super Mario 3 has on Super Mario World, and I'm saying this with SMW having a very fond place in my heart as the first great SNES game I played. What SM3 did with the NES graphics capability, and the originality of the content...... it JUST barely edges SMW's strengths in graphics (which while fancier, were almost a bit too kiddie like compared to the somewhat darker feel of SM3's design.....almost like Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles compared to FF3 [US 3, not the Japanese numbered 3 of the series] ...except that SMW added to its franchise while FF CC... well, didn't, in my humble opinion.) and variety of tools and interactive environments.
If I had to pick the 10 best VC available games to date: 1. Super Mario RPG (Nintendo & Square..... that is all) 2. Zelda: Ocarina of Time (unparalleled expansive realm and gameplay abilities) 3. River City Ransom (visually simple double dragon + RPG level ups + BARF = greatness) 4. Starfox 64 (one of those truly Complete games...... Top of the line N64) 5. Mega Man 2 (another one of those truly Complete games....... with one of the great endings) 6. Castlevania 2 (a level of sinister ambiance and mystery rarely matched by other games) 7. Zelda: A Link to Past (another another one of the truly Complete games...and in Hyrule no less) 8. Super Mario 3 (Perhaps the greatest design and balance of any game, certainly of any Mario platformer) 9. Summer Games II (Just missing skeet shooting from the first one to be darned near perfect) 10. Impossible Mission (One of those other few games with the sinister ambiance, and great action/puzzles gameplay as well)
(the two C64 games might be higher among the top 10, but I just can't get past the feeling of Apples/Oranges with them vs the console games)
And if I went to my top 20 it'd get pretty tough to figure which were great and my fav and which were just my fav....but the second 10 would probably include: Zelda1, Lolo1, F-Zero, Ninja Gaiden 2 (barely beating the first 1's nostalgia), Metroid, Super Dodge Ball, Punch Out, Street Fighter II: TWW, Super Mario World, & Super Metroid......in no particular order.
TMNT would be in the second ten, but few would probably understand the respect I have for the game, it being one of the most difficult games I've ever played that didn't feel cheap in it being so (see Ninja Gaiden 3 for an example of cheaply insanely tough).
Mario Kart 64 would be in the second 10, maybe the top 10....but I feel that Super Mario kart was a better, purer game than the 64 one and in good conscience put the 64 one up when it is topped by it's ancestor.
I'd LOVE to put the C64's World Games up there.....just based on the image of a cliff diver going head first into the mud and the sound effect for it....along with the sight of a skater bouncing on his butt across barrals....but alas, not to be.
Altered Beast ought to be in there somewhere, just based on the awe I had of it's graphics and how it essentially WAS the Sega Genesis to me. And the second Sonic the Hedgehog could easily be in my top 20 too, if only I weren't so in love with my Nintendo experiences
If the NES Double Dragon had been 2 players simultaneous, it would be in the top 5. If any of the first 3 US Final Fantasy games were in yet, they might all three be in the top 10, well, FF1 might have to slide to the second 10.....
And Pro Wrestling, Bionic Commando, Goonies 2, and Metal Gear would all be guarenteed in the top 20, probably most all in the top 10.....somehow.....and I'd give Bionic Commando a lock for a spot in the top 5. It and Mega Man 2 are among what I consider near perfect NES games, and great games for any system or time. .......if ANY of them were even available on the VC......
Just.......WOW! Awesomw looking game that I had NO CLUE was on the VC until today. Kept hearing the name dropped, but hadn't looked it up until now. It's looks like an Ikari Warriors 3D.
This is now on top of my To Buy list! If the controls don't hamstring the gameplay (multiaxis aiming and moving is always a tough trick to pull off via natural controller limitations and human desire to not be controlling 4 joysticks simultaneously..... ), then it's GOT to be a great game.
Reminds me a bit of Contra 3's overhead levels, but with less overhead view and 50 times more awesomeness.
If I recall correctly, the sequel to this one (Tactics Ogre) was the one that played quite a bit like Final Fantasy Tactics. I've played my friend's Tactics Ogre, but I've always wanted to get my hands on it's predecessor. Even if it ends up being unfun, I'd definately buy a VC of this, if for nothing else but to compare and try something entirely different from what I consider a classic in Ogre Tactics. If we ever get OT, it may be the closest we'll get to having FFT on the VC, sadly.
But seriously, that opening bit asking the player's name, and the music........ thats FFT all the way. There MUST have been some inspiration there.
Thanks for the really interesting rating list Corbie!
Having been limited to Nintendo consoles (and a bit of Sega via friends) and my C64, it's interesting to have some recommendations from the other console realms. Half the value of the Wii was the classic games I enjoyed from my youth, and the other half was all those great great classic systems, their games, and their own almost fingerprint like gaming visual and control styles.
And BRAVO for getting Simon's Quest into your top 10! It's one of those games that is really hard to justify liking ......... graphics are ok to good, controls are slightly sloppy but not at all bad, but items are somewhat limited, whip powerups are spread far apart, ........yet the minimalness of it, the days turning to nights and leaving you invariably overmatched and running for your life, the distances you travel between places......it accomplished a sense of isolation and travel that few games of any generation have duplicated, at least for me. And while many find the final battle cheap, I actually LOVE the absence of life in the section leading up to it ("death" WOULD have a necklace of emptiness near it) and the ease of the battle is a relief after the bizarrity (the odd text translations actually added to the that) and length of the game up to that point.
I may or may not check out the shooters on the list, since I've rarely been able to sustain interest in shooters.....although HOW I can enjoy what is basically a vertical shooter in Commando (NES) and only mildly enjoy a Gradius...... humans are odd creatures.
But the deferring to games like Neutopia over Zelda actually makes sense to me. It is more a list of timeless favorites, rather than Great For Their Time games. If Neutopia swipes the heart of Zelda (not a bad thing, but rather a wise thing....unless it happens too much) and then upgrades it, it is Zelda+ (though some may still prefer the original feel and visual of Zelda even over enhanced gameplay) and ought to rank in higher.
This is very positive news. I can indeed see a market for classic portable games released on a portable VC, as such would be much less desirable on the big screen of the Wii.
Which brings me to why I'm not one who'll benefit from a portable VC. As much as I consider my old gameboy Baseball and TMNT gaming as precious fun, I've pretty much been off of portable gaming for a quite a while. I just can't talk myself into putting out money for a gaming experience limited to such a small viewing area. The gaming can still be addictive and fun (Tetris plays and addicts well under almost any circumstances), but it just loses too much for me when I press a button too hard and my screen moves, or I have to strain my eyes to pickup on an approaching enemy.
So much of my gaming enjoyment is in the controls and the precision challenges (I obviously still have my Mega Man play from last night on my mind), and a small screen just loses too much.
My money will go towards my tabletop gaming systems, but I am very excited for others who'll get to enjoy the classics on the newer portable systems!! Good on ya Big N.
And it helps that NES games have always been a passion of mine. Woe was the day the big N broke my heart and tuned away from the awe and majesty of the cartridge with Gamecube.
@Mickeymac: Hey, congrats! That secret round is really clever in how they went about making it the most challenging battle of the game. The opponents scale to your team, just by nature. Really pretty cool.
Actually, I share that sentiment (about the Air Man stage in MM2) Mickeymac. It was always sort of a signature level that was almost entirely about the jumping skills and timing rather than nasty enemies in nasty places. And with a fairly straightforward/easy Air Man at the end, it sort of had it's own reward. That level more than any in MM2 tests poise and patience along with control of Mega (sort of what the Heat Man timed blocks area was meant to be and failed, due to being just plain too obnoxious and unforgiving).
But yeah, Air Man, Metal Man, and Wood Man were always the first three stops for me.....mostly because they were among the most fun levels. Oh and Bubble Mans too, but usually that is more of a fun-easy rest stop between fun-hard levels.
Ah YUP. My best squad usually is made up John for survival, and the Sam and either Randy or Steve (more often Randy, since both his super shots seem highly effective against the computer, especially on Hard mode, where the computer suddenly catches more often than not, and will come up with properly executed super shots at least half the time (or so).
A couple more tricks, in case they might help:
Jumping power shots from as deep into the enemy's side as possible are highly effective (leaves the computer the least amount of time, from the moment you release your shot, to react/adjust to your shot......just be careful of being exposed while your guy automatically runs back to your own side.
Also, even though it may SEEM suicidal, sometimes the best way to survive the computers throws (most especially the power throws) is to stand up front, as close to mid court line as possible (maybe just one step back....that works best for my catch timing)....... not only will this allow you to do a catch based on the running speed of the opponent throwing (rather than their ball speed after release), but you can even get the comp to throw it's jumping super shot BEHIND you and straight into the ground, handing you a free possession.
Other than that, try to also get John up front and use his great catching skills and energy durability as often as possible, then hand it off to a better dude to counter attack. Also, learning to time your jumps to steal the ball when the comp tries to feed it back to it's teammates on the three sides of your half of the court...... stealing those are free possessions, which become HUGE in Hard mode.
As for beating the final team......the one you play when you don't lose anyone in the process of beating the Russian team........ use the Sam, gamer.......let GO your other players (for attacking)....... use the Sam.
Oh yeah, about Sam......his running supershot is like a bowling ball and as long as it's not caught (only beaten by his jumping SS for uncatchableness by the computer), it'll barrel through the enemies and go right to your guy in back. You can take some teams down without ever giving them a shot (see Iceland.... )
Anyway, hope some thing of all that might help. The great thing about fun BASIC games, at least for me, is the chance to strategze the limited options into some cool stuff.
And when the World Tournament gets old, Bean Ball presents a different kind of challenge. It actually is the more challenging of the two gaming modes, at least once you get your locations and strategies down for the World Tournament.
@Adroitone: Huh. I've never seen that version before. After being brought up on the relative simplicity of NES one, that looks pretty freaky (but probably quite fun). Kinda reminds me of Metal Slug compared to Contra.
@occipital: Ditto on the nature of the flicker, you can almost get used to it as just a alternate mode of game play. And YES, the irony of the slowest shot in the game launching the person...... perfection! That, the around the world, and the accelerator one (the one that's launched from a super jump, sails down to the ground and runs parallel and picks up speed the whole time......especially when launched from the BACK of your own court ) are beauty in motion.
When I was younger, I thought the lightening shot was the coolest thing around..........until a friend showed me how frickin easy it was to dodge (until that trick, all I had was a last minute dash to out run it.... ). But now it's all about Sam the Man.
Oh, and gotta love that Kenya level...... running power shots almost standing still. This game really amazes me in it's smart chosen variety.
@Mickeymac: I needed to warm it up and take a look to be sure my memory was right, but it was. You can get a look at both your teams player by player stats, as well as your opponent team's, by pressing the Select (or minus button as it is on Wii) button while it is showing doing the intro for the current round of play and your next opponent (when the players keep running across the screen). The first time you press Select, it will show your teams players and their stats, press it a second time and it'll show you the opposing team, press it a third time to cycle back to the Round/Opponent intro screen. It'll just keep cycling in that order with each press. You can do it for each level while playing through the World tournament and get a look at all the players, team by team.
But things like who has which kind of power shot on each team is something that is trial and error. And as I recall one player on each team even has a standing jump "power shot" (it makes the sound, does the extra damage, but doesn't glow or do any unusual flight path)...... I can't recall if it is Bill, Steve, or Randy on the US team, but I think one of them has it for the US squad.
And incase the stat categories don't all make sense right out: Energy = life Ball PW = throwing power/damage Throw TQ = Throw Technique which measures liklihood of successful catching of the throws (as I recall) Break = measure of how much control you have to change the path of the throw after its released (always cool with Sam's running power shot..... ) Agility = your classic RCR running speed measure Catch TQ = how capable (likely) your player is at successfully catching a ball (I think perfect timing will catch every time, but better numbers here make up for imperfectly timed press of the catch button) Damage = Ironically, it's the players ability to give up as little life as possible when hit (kinda like RCR's "Strength" measure) John Stone is Da Man on the US for toughness, too bad his power shots are inversely impressive in the damage and deception categories....
And now I'm all excited to play a run through the World Tournament (GOTTA love the Iceland level..........the cheap is to just keep tossing Sam's running power throw and watch them either get nailed, or catch it and slide back into the wall and get knocked down anyway (while also handing you the ball to keep "running the table").
@Clayfrd - There were indeed one or two more Mega Man titles after the first 3...... ......but after #3 followed #2's formula so closely, I felt I saw a downward future for the series and got off the ride before the series had an inevitable decline by being too derivative of #2's style and formula too many times. Two full length NES style Mega Man games were enough to keep my Mega interests satiated. (Though how can one not hunger for the new MM, with such great artistic taste to use the old NES style?? It simply MUST be purchased! )
But, from what I've read from other folks here and there, #4 and so on may not have been too poor. But for me, in my own strange little universe, I saw #2 as the high point, #3 as a nearly as good follow on, and called it at that. And #1 I never actually owned, but from the renting, I did enjoy it quite a bit (when I wasn't utter angered by it kicking my arse up one side and down the other.......hated the guts man level with a passion. But the sort of hate that was mixed with respect for a tough AND good/fun game.
For me, 3 was enough and 3 is all there was.
Speaking of tough/fun games, I'm now reminded to wonder where my Strider is for the VC??
@The Joker: I too was troubled by the whole Square standoff nonsense for quite a while, but after some thought I'm now suggesting that folks not fret too much. As pathetic as it is, I'm pretty sure that plain old greed will fetch them round, just as it is leading them to play it the way they are currently, disrespecting all their loyal NES and SNES fans who paid their exorbitant prices back in the days of the original FF releases (I seem to recall managing to talk my mom into putting down something like 60 to 70 dollars for FF2 (US numbering) early in my SNES days........... could that possibly be right?? I must be imagining things.....
I had Last Ninja 3 way back when I still had my Commodore 64, and I was always in awe of the graphics, but utterly frustrated by positioning, especially when it came to jumping from stone to stone across a river.
As well done as this one was, I still enjoyed other ninja games a bit more, like the Mastertronic one just called Ninja, and a rather smooth task oriented game called Saboteur.
Goodness I miss my C64. I always found its gaming abilities WAY superior to most other computer systems and games of the time period, and even beyond for a good long while. I'd pay a good $20 dollars for a C64 module on my US Wii, and another $10 spot if the classic EPYX and MicroProse games emerged, especially the Winter and Summer games, Pirates, Gunship, Airborne Ranger, Silent Service, F-15 Stike Eagle, The Train.........and something really cool and different called Accolade Comics (almost anything Accolade would be great too).
Alas, I can't even play beloved Pitstop, because the US gets no C64 love. Just another good reason to move across the pond.
Setting aside the ones that aren't so likely (US Final Fantasy 1, 2, and 3; Bionic Commando; Goldeneye; Banjo and Kazooie; Metal Gear), we dearly need to see:
Goonies II (I wouldn't mind trying out a port of the Goonies I, especially since I tried it in the arcade and sort of enjoyed it) Pro Wrestling, Faxandu, Crystalis, Rygar (WHERE are these early NES classics??) Willow (would LOVE to see a true port of the arcade Willow game somewhere on the VC/WiiWare as well) Blaster Master the ONE decent Double Dragon game that was properly 2 player (DD2) Duck Hunt
The release of this and Megaman 2 go a LONG ways toward rounding out my NES must haves list. If someone can get Big N to conjure up Pro Wrestling and Goonies II some time soon, this might be the month in the history of the world.
As far as the RCR characters games, all that is really missing now is that Soccer game they made as a sort of Super dodge ball parallel, and They will have done the little flat top guys a true service.
Super dodge ball is uttely amazing. It has only moderate depth and options, yet it is so clean and designed with such great intuitive and responsive controls, and the mix of throws and power throws provide just enough to both blast people out of the court and also strategize a bit. I still have my NES and this game, and I LOVE standing just a bit away from the midline, do a blind catch and then run up and power blast the other player in the back of the head while they are trying to retreat!!
And........ there is no force on earth or in this game that can stand against a well used Sam. (a jumping power shot from Sam flying out the back of the court can REALLY do some damage due to "screen pull". Ohhhhh how I LOVE classic NES game mechanics!
After an inconceivable number of soul crushing weeks of marginal vc games (and FAR too few classic NES games, which was the deal maker for me buying a Wii), "They" finally warmed things up bit by bit with Y's and then Mario RPG, and now MM2 last week followed by Super Dodgeball this week (perhaps two of the most completely fun and well made games in the history of games IMHO).
And in the same week a true heir to the original NES Megaman trilogy emerges?! I have MM2 for my NES and I bought the VC version in the blink of an eye! And even though I have Super Dodgeball for my NES, and I will ABsolutely be buying it (one of the most repeat pickup-and-playable games ever) for my Wii's VC. My shiny new Super Dodgeball VC game, playable wirelessly and finally looking decent on a 40 inch screen, might even delay me starting in on the new MM for an extra day or two.......
Finally a week to stir pride in being a VC focused Wii owner.
Comments 133
Re: USA VC Update: Sonic the Hedgehog 2 (Master System)
@ Manicfatty:
Hah! Your postings in this thread kick 3 and a half asses (ass? assi?) on scale of 4 possible ass kickingness.
I mean I could be getting ZERO cheese. I should thank my lucky stars I get single slices of boogercheese and marginalsequalcheese each week!!! Thanks for keepin me real.
And I'd like to complain about Sonic Tuesdays............... but it's just too cool a concept to ever complain about.
As far as typical Wii usage goes, I seem to be either mindlessly doing polls or playing River City Ransom of late. I REALLY need to hunker down and polish off Mega Man 9. A criminal lack of attention lately on my part.
I fully support a little gamesmanship about who's ahead in the release total. Something interesting, yet meaningless to discuss while waiting for something of actual value to be released for the VC ......one of these weeks. One of these one game weeks. Although obviously this topic is only interesting so long as NA stays in the lead.......
Re: EU VC Update: Last Ninja 3, Impossible Mission II and Boogerman
Hey, congrats Europe. Any Last Ninja is a gem, and the Impossible Mission concept is a classic, even if #2 is a slightly lesser version of itself (inspite of sprucier graphic details). And Boogerman.......er, so how about that Last Ninja 3?!
I'm glad I get to be slightly less disappointed in Nintendo, thanks to at least Europe getting a fair showing.
And complete ditto to Corbie @ #27!
Re: USA VC Update: Sonic the Hedgehog 2 (Master System)
I wish to complain about cheese.
Re: Hands on with SnakeByte's XS Starter Pack
Actually, yes, if any semi-reliable company put out a wireless N64 controller, I'd probably throw caution to the wind and snag it none too long after it came out. Such a release would also create an up tick in the number of N64 games I currently own on the VC.
Re: USA VC Update: Sonic the Hedgehog 2 (Master System)
I think we need to set our standards as low as possible. We should lobby for 1 game per month. Heck, we don't even deserve that much......maybe one game per major holiday. But perhaps that would still be an unfair burden to place on Big N ......we really shouldn't be so demanding and ungrateful.
Indeed as the Big N would probably put it ....... Let them eat cake!!
This message has been brought to you by the Committee for People Not Being Passive Doormat Consumers.
.
There's being appreciative for things provided in the past, and THEN there's also being honest about the treatment happening in the present. People remaining silent and thankful for Big N's crumbs when this is a market where money talks ............ I really don't know what to say to folks who don't want to at least try to drive their own car. Metaphorically speaking.
In other news, as single games go, this week could have been worse. And it could have also been a lot better. If 1 game weeks are Big N's way of enhancing the appreciation of the few games of top quality that are featured and released (probably like for Christmans), then I'd say they were nuts....... cept for the fact that the starve (for months at a time) and then pamper (for a week or two at a time) marketing strategy seems to be working on some of their customers. Can a manipulative marketing strategy really be "wrong" if it's successful? If I drop a house on someone and no one saw me (caught me) do it, did that person still get pancaked??
(Sorry, I'm getting philosophical again. )
Anyway, with the US having been staked in the heart again this week (well that may be a bit harsh, since it was at least a Hedgehog game), I do what I can and pray for Europe to get a better VC week(s) than us. Let them eat Mario Golf and Secret of Mana!!
And I'll continue to expect nothing each week (for the US VC releases) and settle for the imagination of what it would be like to have long-term positive release trends that would give me a reason to get excited in advance of each week.
I could live undisappointed with two VC releases per week of garbage for months at a time far better than one release per week that alternates garbage/fair/garbage/great/garbage/fair/garbage......... I only have so many weeks left in my life Big N!!
And even fewer before you release your next Next-Gen system and start ignoring VC gaming even more than now..........................
I suppose Big N might be wanting to push folks toward buying $50 games rather than supplying better $5 game availability. I just wish they'd say so up front and give us an advance schedule of the multitude of drought stages. I'm running out of anti-depressants at this rate!
Re: Hands on with SnakeByte's XS Starter Pack
Although I join the other folks expressing caution about buying generic for a motion sensitive controller that makes up the heart of Wii motion gaming, I will say that I support any solid market competition for Nintendo that might provoke the Big N to stick to quality and offer some better deals and variety than they would with a monopoly.
I won't buy these 3rd party controllers (typically, save for special purpose ones like Hori's fighting stick.....which doesn't really compete with Big N hardware, since Big N only seems to do enough to fundamentally support the Wii), but I'll cheer the 3rd party companies on to take as much market share as they can.
Maybe it'll at least provoke Big N into some alternative colors, styles, and maybe even an auto-fire (not something I use much, but it's nice to have the option for certain games........ YEAH, that's right, I'm pointing YOU Track and Field II).
Re: USA VC Update: Metal Slug 2
Yeah, there was a period back in the day where my obsessive compulsive streak really came out for Wrecking Crew......I recall playing so long a single sitting once that when I finally went to bed I dreamt I was inside the game, being chased around by the monsters and beating on brick walls as if my life depended on it. It's far more scary a game in Dreamscape First Person.
It was almost like what I'd imagine a "bad" acid trip would be like.
But yeah, a game perhaps even more addictive than Tetris. heh
Re: USA VC Update: Metal Slug 2
@ #98. Stuffgamer1:
Yeah, that was kind of a rehash post of what you said, I just got too excited to see someone looking at the big picture.
And it's true enough, we've preaching to the choir here on this web site, or to put it another way via a rhetorical response to Tony's last line in the post 99........... Yes they should. And no, they won't.
GO ON Nintendo......prove me wrong!!
I dare ya!
I double dog dare ya!!!
As far as arcade version of games, since my first play of Contra was in the arcade (I was an arcade rat well before I got my hands on a NES), I'd really love to get an arcade perfect port downloaded to the Wii. I dunno if I wanna monetarily support Microsoft in any way shape or form (I got a grudge against extra ruthless business practices), but I imagine I'll eventually break down and buy the cheapest XBox360 I can find, just to download all the stuff I can't get on my Wii VC.
And it's a pity the PS3 has pissed me off with it's weak support for it's ancestor games. I'll probably never fork over the 400 dollars for one.........unless it gets all the Final Fantasy downloads when Square gives up the ghost of disc sales of old games......at which point I may try to buy one at a discount......Dham my sentimental streak!!
But regardless of the system, I'd raze several small border villages for the first warlord who'd supply me with an arcade perfect port of Double Dragon (and maybe Contra.....in a double pack).
@ "I would also like to say that speaking for myself, at least, I tend to get more upset reading the posts of people defending Nintendo and telling the complainers to shut up than by the complaining or the actual releases. We really don't need that kind of animosity here."
Absolutely. Reading people doing Counter-posting, especially in a "you're wrong, stop talking" style......that's definitely the least useful part of this great site that for the majority of posts and posters have created a really positive vibe and a well applied common appreciation of the VC concept and content all over this site. It was refreshing when I first came across it, and with the international camradre in addition, this is all-in-all a marvelous little site. It gives me that warm fuzzy feeling I used to get when the older QUALITY Nintendo Power, Gamepro, and EGM used to arrive at my door each month......cept this is the electronic and interactive version I suppose.
And @MaxPlastic: ......WORD to your Pro Wrestling exclamation!
Ya know, I'd almost settle for Big N putting their releases out in chronological order.........then at least a plain yet shiny gem like Pro Wrestling gets put out by now (MAYBE)......and hey, then we wouldn't get spoiled by the later fancier games until we had already well enjoyed the classic classics for what they were, within their generational limits.
But yeah, too late now I guess to suggest that to Nintendo for them to ignore (along with the myriad other fan base suggestions).
Re: USA VC Update: Metal Slug 2
Hm, perhaps touffeboy is using some sort of super shiny reverse psych sarcasm tool to make their point. I mean I was swayed by it ....... I just can't tell which way.
@"Okay, seriously, I think I'm done this time. If you actually read all the way through that, you have my sincerest thanks."
I did.
You're welcome.
And I say eureka! to someone expressing the insight that the volume of selection is not a defacto impediment to people making purchases, and certainly would be nothing close to the DOOOOOOOM of the VC. (DOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMM ....I say!!! )
And I find the suggestion previously made (that too large a selection would lead to reduced purchasing of some games that would lead to game makers and license owners abandoning the VC and the DOOOOOOO.....OOOOOOOOOOM of the VC) a really EXCELLENT application of Reductio Ad Absurdum and much appreciate proving Stuffgamer1's point by reducing the current It'd be a "doom"ly large selection of games to choose from! theorized outcome to its absurd conclusion. (Sorry if that sounded a bit heavy, I couldn't pass up the chance to take my college philosophy logic class for a walk)
I'd suggest that the non-classic (less desirable) games would STILL be bought, even if the extreme occurred and the full available library were made available in the next 24 hours. People will buy their favorites first, of course. They'll play them, hopefully A LOT, and then they'll say "Hey, I got this VC library thing sitting here, and I've got all the games I used to play and loved..........now what else is out there for a cheap 5 to 10 dollars, that I might love or at least find interesting?".......and the almost greats and the sorta greats and the cult classics and the out right strange will still get played. Heck, with a full library out there, some folks might start with the unknowns, knowing that they can go to the mainstream classics any time they want, since they can choose from either type at any time.
I'll be the first in line to fully agree that less profit will be made off of the "less desirable" games that way. However I'm going to say in my best possible estimation that the money lost by not selling to those hyperactive "gotta feed the need" few who gobble most anything each week, that lost money will be marginal compared to the amount spent on those same games while generating way more enthusiasm for the VC via the larger library appealing to more people just by sheer variety.
Besides, surely it should be obvious that marginal profit gained 5 to 10 dollars a purchase by starving players into buying marginal games will not amount to all that much moolah compared to people telling other prospective Wii buyers about all the great classic games they can get on their Wii right now today.
Or I could be off my the mark, and simply the Heir to the Throne of the Kingdom of Idiots. It can be a fine line sometimes.
Re: USA VC Update: Metal Slug 2
On the discussion of weekly ratios of VC to Wiiware games (and with the caveat that I do indeed understand that neither game library is fundamentally in and of itself "better" or more desirable in general) I do want to suggest that there may be more validity to the concern about wiiware dominating the weekly release ratio than just "classic gamers" vs "new/creative gamers".
With the VC being a selling point of the Wii since Nov 2006 (1st game released to VC), while Wiiware only being a selling point of the Wii since March 2008 (and that initial release was in Japan), people toting the perspective that the VC is more proprietary and deserves at least equal time each week may be at least somewhat justified in their perspective.
For myself in particular, I do have a leaning toward the VC. I bought my Wii primarily based on the existence of the VC (bought it right before Wiiware kicked off actually) and the potential for Commodore 64 support for it in the US, with the Wii's motion control gaming being more of a fringe benefit and only mild interest (I used a Power Glove back in the day and I knew enough to not hold high expectations..... though I have indeed been really pleased with the motion control functions so far, if under supported in games).
Yet, I can step outside my preference and appreciate the almost indie nature of Wiiware games and the opportunity to have never before seen games available via download.
I'd just like to suggest that folks consider that the Wiiware is not considered as much a core component of the Wii as VC. People with a preference will most always consider their preference "core" to something. But how valid is it for a game system to start out as something and then evolve years later with new options and suddenly within that year have the new options be supported equal to, or worse dwarf the fundamental and long standing components of the game system (as the Big N is doing with their currently active VC/Wiiware release schedule)?
Anyway, sorry for the dissertation. I just see a flaw in folks applying an (commendable) equality perspective to a situation where equal balance, or a Wiiware leaning balance, is not representative of nor appropriate for a player base that has been building for multiple years previous to the Wiiware coming into existence.
Personally, I don't mind an even split between Wiiware and VC, but regardless of the split, IMHO the VC needs at least two releases a week (so one stinker can't stink up the place too much for a whole week of my Wii life). I would like to see a more complete library by the time I'm 50 (a ways out there). And the concern about "running out of games to release" is a hollow concern in my opinion, since the size of the current game library carries more weight than a "potential" library ever will..... not that I'll claim that the Big N understands that concept. )
@the discussion about Metal Slug 2:
Understand, while I like Metal Slug 2 quite a bit (#1 has more sentimentality for me though), I don't consider it a satisfying game experience when it can be played with the slow down. When a playable MS2(X) shows up I'll spend the Wii points, inspite of the collection I could by on disc, largely because I too want the classic controls.
But what does it say for the lone VC game released this week when even strong fans of the franchise are likely to skip it because it's playability is so plagued (some parts worse than others)??
In theory, a very nice release..... in reality though, it's an empty VC week for BOTH those disinterested in the game genre AND for those who actually enjoy it.
I wonder if Contra 1 is currently sitting around unreleased while they stock their shelves with a game crippled enough that it needed a rerelease?
I dearly appreciate the existence of the VC, but it's greatest value is only maintained as long as it receives proper support and continues to grow it's library. Being content with what is already out is a perspective best left for those days when (in general) a next generation system comes out and even the pretense of support for the previous game system's library is hobbled or gone entirely. Let's hope we can have slightly higher expectations for our current generation Wii VC system than that.
@Wariofan:
I think people are simply wanting better odds, more of a fighting chance at something desirable rather than waiting week after week, one single shot at a time for a decent game. Since the number one is about as close as you can get to zero, I'd suggest that two games a week is not exactly asking for the world.
Re: USA VC Update: Metal Slug 2
@Bass
Doh ya, I forgots about the Fantasy Star IV. That was an A game to get. I've been lickin my chops for it since ya'll got it.
I suggest a hostage swap...... Secret of Mana for Phantasy Star IV.
Re: USA VC Update: Metal Slug 2
Hm. A flawed tweener sequel and nothing else.
Compared to the likes of Boogerman, Metal Slug 2 made EU's last update seem at least ok. But now it seems like it only makes for both sides of the pond to be left in the cold for another week (or two, depending which side yer on). NA got a nice string of games going into the current drought, so overall EU is getting the worst of the current drought (even with Castlevania 3).
Disappointing...... but everything in life cycles. All I know is that the more Nintendo crams WiiWare down our throat instead of making headway on absent NES/SNES/N64 classics, the less interest I have in Wiiware in general. And these one VC game weeks seem to be designed to force people into participating more in Wiiware (perhaps).
A month passes and, save for Mega Man 3, we see an overpriced Metal Slug 2 (considering the slowdown), Boogerman (nuff said), a hamstrung Forgotten Worlds (needs the second joystick), and .........Space Invaders (a joke lacking humor).
I don't recall the last time I saw any other store so consistently stock it's shelves with substandard merchandise. Even if the store wants to cover minority interests and cult followings, they generally will at least balance their offerings with more generally desirable offerings.
Oh well, corporate thinking has often been detached from applicability.
Sorry folks. Been building that perspective up during the current drought and the one previous (previous to offerings like Mega Man 2 and SupMarRPG). I'll take refuge in my PS1 Final Fantasy Tactics for the time being, I guess.
Re: Kaasa Interview - Commodore 64 on Virtual Console
Ahhh yes, the ol C64 cassette deck............
I'm not sure which ring of hell it belongs in, but which ever one I'm sure it'd be titled "Press Play on Tape."
It made me appreciate my lone cartridge game, Congo Bongo.
If the US VC ever gets C64, I hope they get around to putting out Rambo First Blood Part 2 for it. For some odd reason I miss that one as much as any of them. Between that and Raid Over Moscow I lost many an hour.
Re: Corbie's Top 20 Virtual Console Releases - Part 2
It's funny, but what once seemed like the most awkward controller ever devised (the N64 controller), once playing Goldeneye with itfor a bit it became my all time favorite controller. That and a select set of high quality games like Banjo Kazooie, Starfox64, Mario64, and Zelda OoT, and 4 player capability built in...... it may have become the best all around system for my money. Perhaps even still today.
Besides that was the last hurrah for cartridges......and that betrayal by the Big N caused me to skip owning a Gamecube right up until late last year.
@badmouthsadmouth:
You're not alone, there are times when I consider SMB2 to be very inspired originality. And most of the rest of the time I at least respect it's unique style and variety of gameplay. In it's innovation of new environmental interaction it did remain true to the franchise.
Now that I ponder on it, what is it about the second games of major building block franchises and them being the blacksheep that go their own way, often to polarized reviews...... Super Mario 2, Zelda 2, Castlevania 2.........?
Although I won't knock Mega Man 2 for sticking to the original style and building on it.
Re: Corbie's Top 20 Virtual Console Releases - Part 1
I'd say Altered Beast still looks pretty cool, but yeah the depth of gameplay never was quite there.
But that's what we need today, more new game systems sold with perfect arcade ports included. I think the Super NES was the last time I got a really satisfying game included standard with a game system. I'm not sure which is worse, the fact that it isn't as much of a standard anymore (except for special packages and usually at greater expense), or that I'm OLD school enough to say "Ahhhh, back in the day........"
And I recall trying to play Bruce Lee on my C64 and being forever baffled as to my goal. It was an odd mix of fun and frustration.
Re: EU VC Releases - NES Halloween Trio
Major congrats Europe. Castlevania 3 is a great classic (not quite the character of 2 in my opinion, but nice graphics, a new posse system, and some great bosses).
And Ghosts and Goblins.......not the perfect arcade port I would have asked the Big N for back in the day, but it was still one of those games I loved to impale myself on semi-regularly.
A pair of true classics......... and......... a Pac Man game with Gannondorf up top dancing around, looking like it came from an Atari 2600........ uh, well, two out of three ain't bad!
In total, definitely a great gift to find in the ol candy bag!
Re: Corbie's Top 20 Virtual Console Releases - Part 2
@rodoubleb:
What.......wasn't the solution to that dead end problem OBVIOUS??
All ya had to do was punch a hole in it with your HEAD.
I mean a villager SAID so, and as we all know it's a gaming certainty to get reliable critical answers to the big problems from game townspeople ........how much more "help" could a person have needed??
But yes, some games were just MADE for a Nintendo Power counter part.
Reminds me of a Commodore 64 game where the solution to a locked Martian pyramid door involved a neon sign and wire cutters.
Ah, god bless yah Deborah Cliff........ you Wrench of the Monkey in our nice straight line gaming lives.
Re: Corbie's Top 20 Virtual Console Releases - Part 1
Definitely a thought provoking list.
I'm in hearty agreement about the edge Super Mario 3 has on Super Mario World, and I'm saying this with SMW having a very fond place in my heart as the first great SNES game I played. What SM3 did with the NES graphics capability, and the originality of the content...... it JUST barely edges SMW's strengths in graphics
(which while fancier, were almost a bit too kiddie like compared to the somewhat darker feel of SM3's design.....almost like Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles compared to FF3 [US 3, not the Japanese numbered 3 of the series] ...except that SMW added to its franchise while FF CC... well, didn't, in my humble opinion.)
and variety of tools and interactive environments.
If I had to pick the 10 best VC available games to date:
1. Super Mario RPG (Nintendo & Square..... that is all)
2. Zelda: Ocarina of Time (unparalleled expansive realm and gameplay abilities)
3. River City Ransom (visually simple double dragon + RPG level ups + BARF = greatness)
4. Starfox 64 (one of those truly Complete games...... Top of the line N64)
5. Mega Man 2 (another one of those truly Complete games....... with one of the great endings)
6. Castlevania 2 (a level of sinister ambiance and mystery rarely matched by other games)
7. Zelda: A Link to Past (another another one of the truly Complete games...and in Hyrule no less)
8. Super Mario 3 (Perhaps the greatest design and balance of any game, certainly of any Mario platformer)
9. Summer Games II (Just missing skeet shooting from the first one to be darned near perfect)
10. Impossible Mission (One of those other few games with the sinister ambiance, and great action/puzzles gameplay as well)
(the two C64 games might be higher among the top 10, but I just can't get past the feeling of Apples/Oranges with them vs the console games)
And if I went to my top 20 it'd get pretty tough to figure which were great and my fav and which were just my fav....but the second 10 would probably include:
Zelda1, Lolo1, F-Zero, Ninja Gaiden 2 (barely beating the first 1's nostalgia), Metroid, Super Dodge Ball, Punch Out, Street Fighter II: TWW, Super Mario World, & Super Metroid......in no particular order.
TMNT would be in the second ten, but few would probably understand the respect I have for the game, it being one of the most difficult games I've ever played that didn't feel cheap in it being so (see Ninja Gaiden 3 for an example of cheaply insanely tough).
Mario Kart 64 would be in the second 10, maybe the top 10....but I feel that Super Mario kart was a better, purer game than the 64 one and in good conscience put the 64 one up when it is topped by it's ancestor.
I'd LOVE to put the C64's World Games up there.....just based on the image of a cliff diver going head first into the mud and the sound effect for it....along with the sight of a skater bouncing on his butt across barrals....but alas, not to be.
Altered Beast ought to be in there somewhere, just based on the awe I had of it's graphics and how it essentially WAS the Sega Genesis to me. And the second Sonic the Hedgehog could easily be in my top 20 too, if only I weren't so in love with my Nintendo experiences
If the NES Double Dragon had been 2 players simultaneous, it would be in the top 5. If any of the first 3 US Final Fantasy games were in yet, they might all three be in the top 10, well, FF1 might have to slide to the second 10.....
And Pro Wrestling, Bionic Commando, Goonies 2, and Metal Gear would all be guarenteed in the top 20, probably most all in the top 10.....somehow.....and I'd give Bionic Commando a lock for a spot in the top 5. It and Mega Man 2 are among what I consider near perfect NES games, and great games for any system or time. .......if ANY of them were even available on the VC......
Re: Sin and Punishment
Just.......WOW! Awesomw looking game that I had NO CLUE was on the VC until today. Kept hearing the name dropped, but hadn't looked it up until now. It's looks like an Ikari Warriors 3D.
This is now on top of my To Buy list! If the controls don't hamstring the gameplay (multiaxis aiming and moving is always a tough trick to pull off via natural controller limitations and human desire to not be controlling 4 joysticks simultaneously..... ), then it's GOT to be a great game.
Reminds me a bit of Contra 3's overhead levels, but with less overhead view and 50 times more awesomeness.
Re: Ogre Battle: The March of the Black Queen
If I recall correctly, the sequel to this one (Tactics Ogre) was the one that played quite a bit like Final Fantasy Tactics. I've played my friend's Tactics Ogre, but I've always wanted to get my hands on it's predecessor. Even if it ends up being unfun, I'd definately buy a VC of this, if for nothing else but to compare and try something entirely different from what I consider a classic in Ogre Tactics. If we ever get OT, it may be the closest we'll get to having FFT on the VC, sadly.
But seriously, that opening bit asking the player's name, and the music........ thats FFT all the way. There MUST have been some inspiration there.
Re: Corbie's Top 20 Virtual Console Releases - Part 2
Thanks for the really interesting rating list Corbie!
Having been limited to Nintendo consoles (and a bit of Sega via friends) and my C64, it's interesting to have some recommendations from the other console realms. Half the value of the Wii was the classic games I enjoyed from my youth, and the other half was all those great great classic systems, their games, and their own almost fingerprint like gaming visual and control styles.
And BRAVO for getting Simon's Quest into your top 10! It's one of those games that is really hard to justify liking ......... graphics are ok to good, controls are slightly sloppy but not at all bad, but items are somewhat limited, whip powerups are spread far apart, ........yet the minimalness of it, the days turning to nights and leaving you invariably overmatched and running for your life, the distances you travel between places......it accomplished a sense of isolation and travel that few games of any generation have duplicated, at least for me. And while many find the final battle cheap, I actually LOVE the absence of life in the section leading up to it ("death" WOULD have a necklace of emptiness near it) and the ease of the battle is a relief after the bizarrity (the odd text translations actually added to the that) and length of the game up to that point.
I may or may not check out the shooters on the list, since I've rarely been able to sustain interest in shooters.....although HOW I can enjoy what is basically a vertical shooter in Commando (NES) and only mildly enjoy a Gradius...... humans are odd creatures.
But the deferring to games like Neutopia over Zelda actually makes sense to me. It is more a list of timeless favorites, rather than Great For Their Time games. If Neutopia swipes the heart of Zelda (not a bad thing, but rather a wise thing....unless it happens too much) and then upgrades it, it is Zelda+ (though some may still prefer the original feel and visual of Zelda even over enhanced gameplay) and ought to rank in higher.
Cool list Corbie!
Re: The DSi – One Step Closer to a Portable Virtual Console?
This is very positive news. I can indeed see a market for classic portable games released on a portable VC, as such would be much less desirable on the big screen of the Wii.
Which brings me to why I'm not one who'll benefit from a portable VC. As much as I consider my old gameboy Baseball and TMNT gaming as precious fun, I've pretty much been off of portable gaming for a quite a while. I just can't talk myself into putting out money for a gaming experience limited to such a small viewing area. The gaming can still be addictive and fun (Tetris plays and addicts well under almost any circumstances), but it just loses too much for me when I press a button too hard and my screen moves, or I have to strain my eyes to pickup on an approaching enemy.
So much of my gaming enjoyment is in the controls and the precision challenges (I obviously still have my Mega Man play from last night on my mind), and a small screen just loses too much.
My money will go towards my tabletop gaming systems, but I am very excited for others who'll get to enjoy the classics on the newer portable systems!! Good on ya Big N.
Re: USA VC Releases: Super Dodge Ball and Vectorman
Bah..... you should see the size of my emails.
And it helps that NES games have always been a passion of mine. Woe was the day the big N broke my heart and tuned away from the awe and majesty of the cartridge with Gamecube.
Re: USA VC Releases: Super Dodge Ball and Vectorman
@Mickeymac: Hey, congrats! That secret round is really clever in how they went about making it the most challenging battle of the game. The opponents scale to your team, just by nature. Really pretty cool.
Re: USA VC Release: Mega Man 2
Actually, I share that sentiment (about the Air Man stage in MM2) Mickeymac. It was always sort of a signature level that was almost entirely about the jumping skills and timing rather than nasty enemies in nasty places. And with a fairly straightforward/easy Air Man at the end, it sort of had it's own reward. That level more than any in MM2 tests poise and patience along with control of Mega (sort of what the Heat Man timed blocks area was meant to be and failed, due to being just plain too obnoxious and unforgiving).
But yeah, Air Man, Metal Man, and Wood Man were always the first three stops for me.....mostly because they were among the most fun levels. Oh and Bubble Mans too, but usually that is more of a fun-easy rest stop between fun-hard levels.
Re: USA VC Releases: Super Dodge Ball and Vectorman
Ah YUP. My best squad usually is made up John for survival, and the Sam and either Randy or Steve (more often Randy, since both his super shots seem highly effective against the computer, especially on Hard mode, where the computer suddenly catches more often than not, and will come up with properly executed super shots at least half the time (or so).
A couple more tricks, in case they might help:
Jumping power shots from as deep into the enemy's side as possible are highly effective (leaves the computer the least amount of time, from the moment you release your shot, to react/adjust to your shot......just be careful of being exposed while your guy automatically runs back to your own side.
Also, even though it may SEEM suicidal, sometimes the best way to survive the computers throws (most especially the power throws) is to stand up front, as close to mid court line as possible (maybe just one step back....that works best for my catch timing)....... not only will this allow you to do a catch based on the running speed of the opponent throwing (rather than their ball speed after release), but you can even get the comp to throw it's jumping super shot BEHIND you and straight into the ground, handing you a free possession.
Other than that, try to also get John up front and use his great catching skills and energy durability as often as possible, then hand it off to a better dude to counter attack. Also, learning to time your jumps to steal the ball when the comp tries to feed it back to it's teammates on the three sides of your half of the court...... stealing those are free possessions, which become HUGE in Hard mode.
As for beating the final team......the one you play when you don't lose anyone in the process of beating the Russian team........ use the Sam, gamer.......let GO your other players (for attacking)....... use the Sam.
Oh yeah, about Sam......his running supershot is like a bowling ball and as long as it's not caught (only beaten by his jumping SS for uncatchableness by the computer), it'll barrel through the enemies and go right to your guy in back. You can take some teams down without ever giving them a shot (see Iceland.... )
Anyway, hope some thing of all that might help. The great thing about fun BASIC games, at least for me, is the chance to strategze the limited options into some cool stuff.
And when the World Tournament gets old, Bean Ball presents a different kind of challenge. It actually is the more challenging of the two gaming modes, at least once you get your locations and strategies down for the World Tournament.
Re: Super Dodge Ball
@Adroitone: Huh. I've never seen that version before. After being brought up on the relative simplicity of NES one, that looks pretty freaky (but probably quite fun). Kinda reminds me of Metal Slug compared to Contra.
@occipital: Ditto on the nature of the flicker, you can almost get used to it as just a alternate mode of game play. And YES, the irony of the slowest shot in the game launching the person...... perfection! That, the around the world, and the accelerator one (the one that's launched from a super jump, sails down to the ground and runs parallel and picks up speed the whole time......especially when launched from the BACK of your own court ) are beauty in motion.
When I was younger, I thought the lightening shot was the coolest thing around..........until a friend showed me how frickin easy it was to dodge (until that trick, all I had was a last minute dash to out run it.... ). But now it's all about Sam the Man.
Oh, and gotta love that Kenya level...... running power shots almost standing still. This game really amazes me in it's smart chosen variety.
Re: USA VC Releases: Super Dodge Ball and Vectorman
@Mickeymac: I needed to warm it up and take a look to be sure my memory was right, but it was. You can get a look at both your teams player by player stats, as well as your opponent team's, by pressing the Select (or minus button as it is on Wii) button while it is showing doing the intro for the current round of play and your next opponent (when the players keep running across the screen). The first time you press Select, it will show your teams players and their stats, press it a second time and it'll show you the opposing team, press it a third time to cycle back to the Round/Opponent intro screen. It'll just keep cycling in that order with each press. You can do it for each level while playing through the World tournament and get a look at all the players, team by team.
But things like who has which kind of power shot on each team is something that is trial and error. And as I recall one player on each team even has a standing jump "power shot" (it makes the sound, does the extra damage, but doesn't glow or do any unusual flight path)...... I can't recall if it is Bill, Steve, or Randy on the US team, but I think one of them has it for the US squad.
And incase the stat categories don't all make sense right out:
Energy = life
Ball PW = throwing power/damage
Throw TQ = Throw Technique which measures liklihood of successful catching of the throws (as I recall)
Break = measure of how much control you have to change the path of the throw after its released (always cool with Sam's running power shot..... )
Agility = your classic RCR running speed measure
Catch TQ = how capable (likely) your player is at successfully catching a ball (I think perfect timing will catch every time, but better numbers here make up for imperfectly timed press of the catch button)
Damage = Ironically, it's the players ability to give up as little life as possible when hit (kinda like RCR's "Strength" measure) John Stone is Da Man on the US for toughness, too bad his power shots are inversely impressive in the damage and deception categories....
And now I'm all excited to play a run through the World Tournament (GOTTA love the Iceland level..........the cheap is to just keep tossing Sam's running power throw and watch them either get nailed, or catch it and slide back into the wall and get knocked down anyway (while also handing you the ball to keep "running the table").
Re: USA VC Releases: Super Dodge Ball and Vectorman
@Clayfrd - There were indeed one or two more Mega Man titles after the first 3...... ......but after #3 followed #2's formula so closely, I felt I saw a downward future for the series and got off the ride before the series had an inevitable decline by being too derivative of #2's style and formula too many times. Two full length NES style Mega Man games were enough to keep my Mega interests satiated. (Though how can one not hunger for the new MM, with such great artistic taste to use the old NES style?? It simply MUST be purchased! )
But, from what I've read from other folks here and there, #4 and so on may not have been too poor. But for me, in my own strange little universe, I saw #2 as the high point, #3 as a nearly as good follow on, and called it at that. And #1 I never actually owned, but from the renting, I did enjoy it quite a bit (when I wasn't utter angered by it kicking my arse up one side and down the other.......hated the guts man level with a passion. But the sort of hate that was mixed with respect for a tough AND good/fun game.
For me, 3 was enough and 3 is all there was.
Speaking of tough/fun games, I'm now reminded to wonder where my Strider is for the VC??
@The Joker: I too was troubled by the whole Square standoff nonsense for quite a while, but after some thought I'm now suggesting that folks not fret too much. As pathetic as it is, I'm pretty sure that plain old greed will fetch them round, just as it is leading them to play it the way they are currently, disrespecting all their loyal NES and SNES fans who paid their exorbitant prices back in the days of the original FF releases (I seem to recall managing to talk my mom into putting down something like 60 to 70 dollars for FF2 (US numbering) early in my SNES days........... could that possibly be right?? I must be imagining things.....
Re: PEGI and ESRB Update: Last Ninja 3, Enduro Racer and More
I had Last Ninja 3 way back when I still had my Commodore 64, and I was always in awe of the graphics, but utterly frustrated by positioning, especially when it came to jumping from stone to stone across a river.
As well done as this one was, I still enjoyed other ninja games a bit more, like the Mastertronic one just called Ninja, and a rather smooth task oriented game called Saboteur.
Goodness I miss my C64. I always found its gaming abilities WAY superior to most other computer systems and games of the time period, and even beyond for a good long while. I'd pay a good $20 dollars for a C64 module on my US Wii, and another $10 spot if the classic EPYX and MicroProse games emerged, especially the Winter and Summer games, Pirates, Gunship, Airborne Ranger, Silent Service, F-15 Stike Eagle, The Train.........and something really cool and different called Accolade Comics (almost anything Accolade would be great too).
Alas, I can't even play beloved Pitstop, because the US gets no C64 love. Just another good reason to move across the pond.
Re: RPG Titles Dominate Nintendo Power’s Most Wanted List
Setting aside the ones that aren't so likely (US Final Fantasy 1, 2, and 3; Bionic Commando; Goldeneye; Banjo and Kazooie; Metal Gear), we dearly need to see:
Goonies II (I wouldn't mind trying out a port of the Goonies I, especially since I tried it in the arcade and sort of enjoyed it)
Pro Wrestling, Faxandu, Crystalis, Rygar (WHERE are these early NES classics??)
Willow (would LOVE to see a true port of the arcade Willow game somewhere on the VC/WiiWare as well)
Blaster Master
the ONE decent Double Dragon game that was properly 2 player (DD2)
Duck Hunt
Re: Super Dodge Ball
The release of this and Megaman 2 go a LONG ways toward rounding out my NES must haves list. If someone can get Big N to conjure up Pro Wrestling and Goonies II some time soon, this might be the month in the history of the world.
As far as the RCR characters games, all that is really missing now is that Soccer game they made as a sort of Super dodge ball parallel, and They will have done the little flat top guys a true service.
Super dodge ball is uttely amazing. It has only moderate depth and options, yet it is so clean and designed with such great intuitive and responsive controls, and the mix of throws and power throws provide just enough to both blast people out of the court and also strategize a bit. I still have my NES and this game, and I LOVE standing just a bit away from the midline, do a blind catch and then run up and power blast the other player in the back of the head while they are trying to retreat!!
And........ there is no force on earth or in this game that can stand against a well used Sam. (a jumping power shot from Sam flying out the back of the court can REALLY do some damage due to "screen pull". Ohhhhh how I LOVE classic NES game mechanics!
Re: USA VC Releases: Super Dodge Ball and Vectorman
After an inconceivable number of soul crushing weeks of marginal vc games (and FAR too few classic NES games, which was the deal maker for me buying a Wii), "They" finally warmed things up bit by bit with Y's and then Mario RPG, and now MM2 last week followed by Super Dodgeball this week (perhaps two of the most completely fun and well made games in the history of games IMHO).
And in the same week a true heir to the original NES Megaman trilogy emerges?! I have MM2 for my NES and I bought the VC version in the blink of an eye! And even though I have Super Dodgeball for my NES, and I will ABsolutely be buying it (one of the most repeat pickup-and-playable games ever) for my Wii's VC. My shiny new Super Dodgeball VC game, playable wirelessly and finally looking decent on a 40 inch screen, might even delay me starting in on the new MM for an extra day or two.......
Finally a week to stir pride in being a VC focused Wii owner.