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Topic: Pokemon Legends Arceus

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kkslider5552000

I flat hate the "it looks like a GCN/PS2 game" complaints some games get. Like even if a game looks awful, if its a new game, it almost certainly looks fundamentally different than what you would see on those systems. It's a complete, embarrassing misunderstanding of graphics in general. Doubly stupid since there are GCN Pokemon games to compare it to, so you can be proven wrong very quickly.

Also, considering how those comparisons don't hold up at all, the only valid possible comparisons make me think of games that still hold up visually. Which...actually does make the new Pokemon games look bad. I'm not saying its the worst example of this, but visually, I much prefer the best of that generation than any 3D Pokemon game (including the actual GCN Pokemon games tbh), regardless of the factual graphical improvements a modern Pokemon game would have by comparison. If we're making that comparison, Pokemon is actually better AND worse than that.

Tell me you wouldn't want Wind Waker or Mario Sunshine or Viewtiful Joe style for Pokemon instead. I'd love that. It'd never happen, but it sounds cool to me. (though again, its not like all GCN games hold up as well as those)

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Snatcher

@VoidofLight Like in what world can a gamecube run a game like that? I just can't understand where the "It looks like a gamecube game" comes from.
@kkslider5552000 I hate it too.

Edited on by Snatcher

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Pizzamorg

VoidofLight wrote:

@Pizzamorg I've seen people say BotW looks 10 times better, and that Legends should look like that... but BotW also had really muddy textures, and the world is also pretty empty looking in some aspects.

I've seen people say how SMT V is also better looking, but SMT V has apparent limits that Legends doesn't have graphically.

The only thing that Legends has that's a graphical issue is it's textures. The rest of the game looks perfectly fine, and performance-wise, it looks fine as well. There's slight pop-in in the gameplay we've seen, but it's not that awful either.

I just think people are saying it looks awful because it's a pokemon game, while they wouldn't really do the same for any other series. Yes, I get Pokemon makes tons of money, but so do other series. Not to mention, the dev team behind these games aren't really strong with HD console games, as Sword and Shield was technically the first mainline game on a console. Let's Go barely counts, given how it wasn't made by the main team at Gamefreak.

Yeah, BOTW looks as good as it does, because it had the full might of Nintendo behind it, is set predominantly in one big open field and uses extensive cell shading so it doesn’t have to render a lot of detail. And you’re right, it still managed to have some low res, muddy, blurry visuals, even docked. And that isn’t to say BOTW isn’t a gorgeous game, but using it as some kind of benchmark for everything seems asinine to me. Sure, this is what the Switch can achieve, but it isn’t like a regular occurrence, this is the result of mountains moved. And sure, you could argue that we should expect all devs to do the same, but I live in the real world and just know that isn’t how it works.

SMT V does put Pokemon S/S to shame in a lot of ways in terms of both the amount of things on screen and the draw distances, but they balance that with mostly pretty simplified environments, muddied visuals, smoke and mirrors filters and that still came with some significant performance hits, especially in handheld. And while I’d rather not be in a position where I have to choose, if I must choose between a few more things on screen or a stable frame rate, I pick frame rate every time.

kkslider5552000 wrote:

I flat hate the "it looks like a GCN/PS2 game" complaints some games get. Like even if a game looks awful, if its a new game, it almost certainly looks fundamentally different than what you would see on those systems. It's a complete, embarrassing misunderstanding of graphics in general. Doubly stupid since there are GCN Pokemon games to compare it to, so you can be proven wrong very quickly.

Also, considering how those comparisons don't hold up at all, the only valid possible comparisons make me think of games that still hold up visually. Which...actually does make the new Pokemon games look bad. I'm not saying its the worst example of this, but visually, I much prefer the best of that generation than any 3D Pokemon game (including the actual GCN Pokemon games tbh), regardless of the factual graphical improvements a modern Pokemon game would have by comparison. If we're making that comparison, Pokemon is actually better AND worse than that.

Tell me you wouldn't want Wind Waker or Mario Sunshine or Viewtiful Joe style for Pokemon instead. I'd love that. It'd never happen, but it sounds cool to me. (though again, its not like all GCN games hold up as well as those)

Yeah, I think if people don’t like the style or art design, that is something different. I think maybe the biggest problem here is people using “graphics” as some catch all term for what their eyes can see. This creates pretty misleading statements, because objectively based on what we’ve seen, the Legends graphics aren’t bad in the context of the Switch. And, like you say, the asinine GC comments can be swiftly debunked with a quick Google search. But if they are talking about specific things about the visuals, I think they should really clarify that. And that might sound really anal, and maybe it is a bit, but it just annoys me that the term ‘graphics’ is just slapped on everything.

Edited on by Pizzamorg

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Snatcher

VoidofLight wrote:

@Pizzamorg I've seen people say BotW looks 10 times better, and that Legends should look like that... but BotW also had really muddy textures, and the world is also pretty empty looking in some aspects.

I've seen people say how SMT V is also better looking, but SMT V has apparent limits that Legends doesn't have graphically.

The only thing that Legends has that's a graphical issue is it's textures. The rest of the game looks perfectly fine, and performance-wise, it looks fine as well. There's slight pop-in in the gameplay we've seen, but it's not that awful either.

I just think people are saying it looks awful because it's a pokemon game, while they wouldn't really do the same for any other series. Yes, I get Pokemon makes tons of money, but so do other series. Not to mention, the dev team behind these games aren't really strong with HD console games, as Sword and Shield was technically the first mainline game on a console. Let's Go barely counts, given how it wasn't made by the main team at Gamefreak.

This. Breath of the wild was no perfect snowflake yet people act like it is, I have heard no one say BOTW looks like a gamecube game, Thats because I'm sure half of the people saying that, just doesn't like pokemon, Or is just so used to PS5 graphic levels, they need it to be as smooth as a lego block.

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VoidofLight

@Snatcher I feel like most people complaining about Pokemon's graphics are complaining because it's pokemon. At least it feels like that at times.

And yeah, the art style for Legends isn't terrible. I personally find it passable, and some of the stuff they've shown looks really pretty, while other stuff does kind of look ugly. Like, I noticed that some outfits for these characters are a bit muddied, compared to the artwork. I wish they'd be able to polish up these textures, but I'm fine if they don't. People are also missing other aspects of the game as well, like how the Pokemon are fully 3D modeled now, and no longer rely on textures for their mouths and eyes, or how all the pokemon have specific animations for their moves, instead of just having a giant fist summoned and fly towards other pokemon. It's exactly what people wanted out of the animations in Sword and Shield, but then they still find more to pick apart anyways, disregarding that.

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Snatcher

@VoidofLight No joke! Yall got the animations you have been begging for! you get it, and what do you do? find something else to wine about, Thus be the internet I guess.

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JaxonH

I just found out you craft your Pokeballs in this game... why am I just now hearing about this?!!

So, it's Pokémon in open world-ish areas similar to Monster Hunter Rise, you gather materials and craft, you can use stealth to your advantage, fights are real time... anything else I'm missing here?

This sounds AMAZING! Ya, the game isn't visually impressive, but the latest batch of clips and vids show a stable framerate, and the visuals at least look clean. They're good enough to enjoy the game.

But I'm genuinely intrigued by these new revelations!! Dare I get hyped for this game? I think I might. I really think I might

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VoidofLight

@JaxonH Yep, it's effectively just pokemon if it combined with monster hunter. The world structure is more akin to Monster Hunter, with a village you always return to and stock up at, with the open areas being segmented and the only way to travel between is by picking them on the map or something. They also confirmed missions as a thing, making it even closer to Monster Hunter. The visuals look pretty decent, even though the textures are still iffy. I genuinely like how all the pokemon have brand new 3D models as well.

"It is fate. Many have tried, yet none have ever managed to escape it's flow."

Pizzamorg

One correction… fights aren’t in real time… are they? Like you do have some real time combat in the over world, kinda? Like dodging angry mons and that, but I believe once you throw out your Pokemon it becomes a standard turn based battle, right? Or am I wrong? Please don’t tell me they decided to use Ni No Kuni’s awful turn based menu in a real time combat setting?

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Octane

@Pizzamorg I don't think they are real time, but they aren't turn-based either in the classic sense. Fast Pokemon may be able to attack more than once per 'turn' for example. And who knows if there is real time dodging and the likes present. Then there are Agile and Strong battle styles, so you can either boost a mon's power, or increase their speed.

Octane

Pizzamorg

I really hope there isn’t stuff like real time dodging in the middle of the battles, or whatever. I’ll honestly be pretty sad if it becomes yet another turn based franchise where they add a load of real time crap into the middle of the battle to appease the ‘turn based bad’ crowds, but then make the combat significantly worse in every way.

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JaxonH

This is a Pokémon spinoff looking to change up the formula, and as such, I have no problems with whatever changes they make. I love turn based, and hate the new Final Fantasy games for abandoning it, but that's not whats happening here. Pokémon clearly sticks to its roots, but because it sticks to its roots, we're getting this particular game to provide a different kind of experience.

Let them make whatever radical changes they want. I'll keep an open mind to whatever they try.

All have sinned and fall short of Gods glory. Wages of sin is death. Romans

God so loved the world He sent His only Son- whoever believes on Him has eternal life. Unless you believe, you will die in your sins. Whoever believes, rivers of living water flow within them. John

Pizzamorg

https://www.currys.co.uk/gbuk/gaming/console-gaming/games/nin...

If you are preordering and in the UK, the code ARCEUS15 knocks about 7 quid off. Doesn’t look like you get stuff like the case or the ball like you do with the preorder from Amazon UK. But it works out to be about 12 quid cheaper here, so I think and 12 quid seems like a lot for a tin case and a tiny plastic ball lol

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VoidofLight

@Pizzamorg the battle system isn’t real time, and is still turn-based, but turns are decided by styles and speed. You basically manipulate turn order, and there’s something which displays turn order.

You do have segments where you have to dodge attacks as a trainer, give your pokemon either faint, or you can’t brute force a pokemon. For example, Noble pokemon. You can’t just brute force them, and have to throw balms at the pokemon first on order to weaken it and dispel it’s energy.

Edit: we still have no idea if abilities are still a thing or not, as the website doesn’t list them.

Edited on by VoidofLight

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Eel

I received a healthy amount of eShop cards on the holidays, so I switched from a physical preorder to a digital one.

I kinda wanted the physical one, but hey, it’s free this way.

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JaxonH

I preordered the EU version from FNAC in France, as it comes with the EU exclusive steelbook case, and I'm a sucker for 1st party steelbook cases on Switch (and 3rd party if it's a big game I like such as Monster Hunter Rise, Daemon X Machina, Persona 5 Strikers, Shin Megami Tensei V, etc).

I keep saying, for every Pokemon game, this actually looks good and I'm gonna get into Pokémon. And then I never do. Closest I came was with Sword and Shield, with about 15 hours in.

But this game... I really do feel like this may be the one.

All have sinned and fall short of Gods glory. Wages of sin is death. Romans

God so loved the world He sent His only Son- whoever believes on Him has eternal life. Unless you believe, you will die in your sins. Whoever believes, rivers of living water flow within them. John

Fizza

@JaxonH I would definitely recommend finishing SwSh if you haven't already, there are some really cool things that happen in the latter half of the game and, if that grabs you, you should ABSOLUTELY pick up the DLC. If the price is too high for you, that's understandable, but it is even better than what's already there and, to me, what's already there is pretty damn good.

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Pizzamorg

VoidofLight wrote:

@Pizzamorg the battle system isn’t real time, and is still turn-based, but turns are decided by styles and speed. You basically manipulate turn order, and there’s something which displays turn order.

You do have segments where you have to dodge attacks as a trainer, give your pokemon either faint, or you can’t brute force a pokemon. For example, Noble pokemon. You can’t just brute force them, and have to throw balms at the pokemon first on order to weaken it and dispel it’s energy.

Edit: we still have no idea if abilities are still a thing or not, as the website doesn’t list them.

Good to know it is still a proper turn based game, speed has always determined turn order in Pokemon games (or at least has for the last bunch of generations). I can live with having to roll about on the floor outside of battles, as long as it doesn’t encroach on the battle itself, which should remain fully turn based.

And in regards to preorders, I would generally always be digital only, but it kinda makes no sense to pay like 14 quid extra to have a digital version.

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