Cally

"I'm not buying games that I don't want to play just to keep the service going,"

Certainly not. And of course, if someone actually did something like that it wouldn't exactly send the suppliers the right info about the demand, anyway.

Nintendo deserves credit where it's due, and after that, power to the complainers.

"MM9 sucks"

I believe you mean "Mega Man & Bass," which some erroneously refer to as "Mega Man 9." Mega Man & Bass was a horribly designed, fan-made game that Capcom actually decided to publish.

I thought Mega Man 8 was severely under-appreciated. I'm nothing but excited about the new MM9, though. How can you possibly recycle the same engine and sprites from Mega Man 1-6 too many times?!

The only thing that worries me a little is that, with all the people going from frustrated to complacent and burnt out, someone at Nintendo is going to think something like "well, almost nobody's downloading the one game we release every week anymore so maybe we should give up on the market." Like, minus feedback, some moron might conclude that people just don't care anymore and that it doesn't have something to do with the real reasons why they are losing interest.

Personally, therefore, I'm totally on the side of the complainers. I don't think Nintendo is going to get their feelings hurt so badly by all of it that they would punish their fan base at their own expense.

Somebody wrote NOA and I'm trying to figure out how to do it myself. Yes, there are better things to do in life, but I personally enjoy the exercise.

@ firebrand and maxplastic

(I own all three conoles) Xbox 360 is losing Bioshock as an exclusive. I won't be surprised if more and more follow. But I can't believe you didn't mention: Gran Turismo 5, God of War 3, Final Fantasy XIII, Killzone 2 . . .

And I still say MGS4 is head-and-shoulders above ANYTHING on the 360 (not to mention graphics-wise).

Edit: Also: Disgaea 3, Infamous, the upcoming Castlevania . . .

Arcade conversions can be nasty, though. In a fighting game, the first match is so pansy you'll score a perfect match with ease, while the last fighters are about a jillion times harder, so you'll feel like you've made all kinds of progress, not wanting to lose it, and keep putting quarters in.

So personally, I'm mostly not too wild about unaltered arcade conversions, since they are innately designed to munch quarters and have that monster difficulty spiking.

. . . I'll never forget the last level of Ghouls 'n Ghosts, an otherwise awesome game with such a fantastically hard last level (I think I overheated my Xbox for trying it too many times over many hours on a collection).

@ Adamant

Thanks for clearing that up.

Oh, the Mega Man Anniversary Collections, except the GC one, also have the option of remixed tunes. And they're actually REALLY GOOD. (Coming from a die-hard MM fan). They all come with some other extras too, with artwork and music. (GC: interviews, PS2: so-so cartoon episode, Xbox: different cartoon episode+interview).

Is "Shodown" just a misspelling, or some kind of pun (like from the word Shogun or something)?

I also wondered if the word "Gradius" was actually supposed to be "Gladius" (like the Roman sword), but wasn't corrected from Japanese which, in its L-deficiency always changes an L from a foreign word to an "R".

I downloaded a few Neo Geo titles, only to find out that they would come out on collections (again, equivalent of $1.25 per game). I don't know about you guys, but I don't intend to make that mistake twice.

"I am also very disappointed about the mega man collection for GBA that never came out. It died a quiet death. hopefully i'll be able to find MMV at my local trading store some time."

I was sad about that too, especially when they were newly-colorized. There was some nonsense about losing some code for one of them . . . a GameBoy game . . . -__-

@Mike: Sounds about right.

Looks like Chrono Trigger DS is going to be the same graphics but with touch screen support. I doubt it will ever come on the VC, then, along with everything else Squeenix has that people would pay full-price for.

To generalize, Americans are, at worst, cynical and untrusting, and at best determined not to settle for less than what they can get . . . and we especially don't take kindly to (real or perceived) getting jerked around in some way.

Yes, there's a way to do that right in some ways and we don't always do it. I, for instance, am severely annoyed at Nintendo's marketing tactics regarding the VC that have been brought up here already, while they could just release games when they're ready. If they didn't use prepaid points, you could claim "buyer's remorse" within three days and by law you'd be refunded, but you can't because the actual transaction was made to the points--which you subsequently "used" so legally can't be returned. How ingenious is all that?

They could clearly post release dates, release them when ready--they really could please everybody. I'd said before that--annoying as it is that they drip their games out--they could clearly balance obscure with popular better to please better. They COULD provide demos like on SSBB, but . . . it's easy to figure out the rest.

So some people just blow off steam.

Right. With all the other stuff Hudson puts out, I'm sure they're being strategic about its release timing. 2007 was definitely "year of the shooter" so they probably responded to the market. I have no doubt that it will make it eventually, and the more Hudson throws out, the less chance of it getting put off.

I almost bought a Turbo Duo just for that until I heard of the VC.

Hudson's site says 3 TG-16 games will come out in July. Glad that's back on track.

I suppose I should fess-up to getting baited a couple of times there. A couple things I shouldn't have said.

Regardless, I hope we're still all basically having a good time. I mostly don't mind arguing at all (even heated ones) so long as personal attacks don't happen.

My question was mostly directed at: people should "try it" to be open-minded.

"It's no different than looking for a new Wii game."

You can still sell a Wii game if you thought you might like it, but ended up absolutely hating it. A download mistake=vaporized money. I couldn't even donate the thing to someone who appreciates it more than me.

@ Rexy
"The fact remains that you've had a go at least, and that's more than what anyone in your side of the pond would do."

It's a good thing to be shamed into buying something?

@Demon212

. . . what?!

Condescending="I'm perfectly happy with everything and I need to teach everyone who isn't some kind of lesson."

Are the complainers really succeeding in raining on your parades? (I refer to all who whine at the complainers.)

That aside, I am still also interested in an answer to the specific question I asked (post 179).

As far as Mega Man goes, I'm as biased as they get. Mega Man 2 is my favorite game of all time.

I love this series. The original ranks #3 to me, and it is absolutely not to be missed. Everything clicks in these games, spot-on control for platforming and shooting, levels with a theme and corresponding boss--selectable at any time--you can't beat this stuff with a stick. I don't see the excessive sequels as rehash so much as just more Mega Man. What's better than one Mega Man? A jillion of 'em.

Yup, the box-art looks like a relic from some pagan ritual. What of it?

. . .

Can someone please explain to me the reasoning behind saying "just try it" (for the games certain people don't want)? You have to BUY IT. You can't rent it, play a demo, or sell it if you don't like it.

Let's hear it, folks. That ridiculous phrase borders on crazy. Asking people to have an open mind is all fine and good, but treating them like that must entail an irreversible transaction--rather, apparently, lots of them--is such a stupid argument it isn't even funny.

@will

I own all three systems, and both the 360 and the Wii's true heavy-hitters are behind us at the moment. I'm sure that won't last long, though, especially for the Wii. The games division at Microsoft is so far in the hole (RROD=billions lost) who knows what Microsoft will do, though if they euthanize another console their credibility is toast for good. I'm actually partial to my PS3.

The Wii is the only console that actually makes a profit from the unit itself (the costs of manufacturing a PS3 or a 360 is greater than the shelf price). Super Mario Galaxy is enough to make me glad I bought the thing, but I really hope something manages to motivate Nintendo to keep it up.

@Mike

Someone pointed out, the scheme is pretty clear, between the prepaid points and spontaneous releases. If you had, say, the whole schedule for the year, you would wait for certain dates, buy a certain number of points for the stuff you want (by experience, curiosity, or research, as there are no secrets as to what these games are like). As it is, you wake up Monday with some amount of points sitting idly on your machine,more tempted to download something out of frustration and maybe just get caught up in the euphoria of the whole VC ritual. (If you do, I hope you're made of money)

But Mike is right in saying that if people stop buying into that and truly wait for what they're waiting for (again, there are no secrets left about these old games that a VC release ought to change your mind about them, and you can't try it without buying it unlike XBLA, suspiciously enough) Nintendo would knock it off and put out based on what most people want, when they want it. I mean, I've enjoyed some obscure games and imports, and my most-wanted title right now is Ys Book I and II. It's probably not most popular to the majority, but if I didn't get what I personally wanted then I'd much rather that the majority did than some victim of "Donkey Kong Jr. Math" for heaven's sake. So "crap week" to me is this: not especially a bad game, or something that I personally didn't want, but they sure could have released something that more people wanted (if not just me). And fans speak up enough that Nintendo could hear if they paid attention (to places like this).

@Mazero

"Please try it"? I believe you mean "buy it," as I don't know of other ways you can "try" a VC game.

Come to think of it, XBLA lets you play trial versions of stuff . . .

@MaxPlastic

I read an IGN review of that collection (I don't see this game on the list). Like the reviewer said, 16 Neo Geo games on one disc=$1.25 per game (many of which are VC games). He complained about some technical issues, though.

@StrarDust

The GC controller thing blows my mind.

Dude #1: "How should we handle SNES games with a GC controller?"

Dude #2: "Easy: just map A to A, B to B, X to X, Y to Y and not even give the player the option to change it!"

Dude #3: "Well, the GC's face buttons are actually positioned completely differently-" <gets shot by Dudes 1 and 2>

(yes, I bought a Classic controller)

"Nice list, but I WAN'T Y'S BOOK I + II IN THE USA!!!!!"

Yup. That one is driving me absolutely up the wall--it may very well hold the record for the longest time spent on that freaking "coming soon" list, and Japan has had it for ages.

I get the vibe that Hudson just loves the VC, and suspect they're putting a bit of thought into the timing of releasing it.

It's too bad they don't have options for configuring the controller. The "run" and "jump" buttons for, say, Super Mario Bros. 3 and Super Mario World are different and (after all these years of figuring out obvious conveniences like this) there's no option to change the default configurations outside the occasional game that let you in the first place (like Super Metroid).

Another VC fact that's just like . . . why . . . ?

"Don't we pay extra money to play our games in English?"

No. DoReMi Fantasy (and I think some other ones too) didn't have too much text, but they didn't bother to translate it, and it was still a buck extra. It was still worth it, of course, but as far as I know they didn't exactly do any extra--ahem--WORK. I also have Bio Miracle and Sin and Punishment (which was dubbed in English already) . . . I think they did a little to the menus so it was playable.

It's too bad, but I'd never, ever expect Nintendo to translate an RPG for an extra two or three bucks. Some imports would be well worth double the normal price for a translation. But why would they do that before throwing out the other stuff they're sitting on?

"the C64 had NOTHING that could compare to the awesome sauce that is the SMRPG."

Yeah, I'd be happy to give the C64 a shot . . . after I'd given hundreds of other things (including what I've both have and haven't played) a go.

"Hey admins, can we have a vote for your game of choice to come out type thing? Or make a single nomination or whatever?"

Once again, I second this Viral idea.

By the way, how does the Genesis version of Earthworm Jim compare to the SNES version?

Wow. Japan got two excellent RPGs at once, and a plethora of other stuff . . . did I just count eight releases at once?

"Isn't Mario Kart 64 already out on the VC? If you want a Mario Kart fix then that could do you some good... or is there something specific about the SNES version that you particularly want to experience again?"

I never understood the hate-ons for certain Mario Karts, but I've heard an awful lot of fans speak of a real soft spot for the original, and most fans insist that it's better than MK64 (even the review on this site, I think).

"licencing issues would mean that not every game would ever see the light of day"

True, but I really don't think there are too terribly many such issues, and I thought I remembered SMRPG having "issues with Square," it's co-developer. Well . . . they've clearly been resolved, no? I suspect a lot of companies (like Hudson) are just happy to get some bucks out of old stuff. Rare is now owned by Microsoft, I think, so of course they can't support a competing console, but beyond that, high consumer demand has a way of making things happen. (Shinji Mikami: "If Resident Evil 4 comes out for any other system, I will cut my head off" . . . I wonder where his head is right now . . .)

@Adamant:

Perhaps I don't have a taste for most old sports games, or just didn't have the patience. (I thought Baseball Stars 2 was great fun, though, but that's mostly it) I also played Blades of Steel back in the day . . . which I guess lots of people also think is great. Which is to say, my severe mistake, apparently, in suggesting that no one cares about that.

. . .

I wonder if there's a little something to be said about the paradox that is whining about "whiners".

Just a thought.

"But 10 to 1 says we end up getting something like Boy and his Blob, Elmo's ABCs and 123s and some weird croquet wiiware game."

Hey, how can you have Donkey Kong Jr. Math and not that, though? How am I going to learn my ABCs?!

"Haha, "bickering".

Sounds like a cookie..."

It totally does, doesn't it? So how popular is the C64 anyway? I seem to remember one of these wonderful editors commenting about Nintendo having to be crazy to expect people to shell out five bucks for those. (Nintendo hasn't thrown those at America, yet).

"Maybe they are hoping that, out of frustration and impatience, that we will all spend our points on Donkey Kong Jr. Math or Volleyball when the games we want don't appear."

Ya hit the nail on the head!

. . . diablos=smarter-than-Cally

Yeah, and if you're worried about system memory you'll say goodbye to 128 blocks with SSBB's save file alone (which, for some reason, you can't even transfer to an SD card).

I got Alex Kidd, which is great.

Otherwise, though, I'm pretty much gone playing Metal Gear Solid 4, which is making me wonder why I spent money on pretty much any other "next-gen" game I've gotten.

A "good week?"

If it has to be just three a week, make sure they're all notable titles that someone out there really, really cares about or is respected as a classic. Who in the blazes wanted "Ice Hockey" or "Baseball" on the NES? "Altered Beast"? "China Warrior"? "Donkey Kong Jr. Math"? Need I go on? Who did they think actually enjoyed those games, other than some poor sucker who didn't know any better or didn't care to research them?

So if the best they can do is three a week, leave out the stuff that--let's be honest--nobody would call their favorite game ever until we got all the more highly-regarded (read: the stuff people WANT) classics.

"This sux so bad. My main gripe is that Y's book I & II have been on there forever and have yet to be released. I wish they'd hurry things up. I WANT MY Y'S!!!!!"

That was totally my most-wanted ever since I heard about the VC. I almost tracked down a Turbo-Duo for that game . . . and now it's like one of the only notable TG-16 games that hasn't shown up yet.

@ Adamant:

"I'm sure they did it due to the insane whining for Earthbound we got since the game was rated."

Oh really? In that case, what are they going to do about the insane whining that's going to happen on account of people being even more (unnecessarily) in the dark? But like someone said, the other rating systems (PEGI and oflc) are still safe for now.

"A collection that's available only in America, not in Europe, even. I think most Europeans would gladly trade the VC releases of MM1 and MM2 for the Anniversary Collection."

<sigh> I think I have to eat my own words a little. If you're talking about the GameCube version, that obscene oversight of mapping "jump" to the B-button and "shoot" to the A-button on the GC controller actually is a very good reason to pretend the collection didn't exist for that system. (If you have a PS2/3 or Xbox/360, though, the collection is great and even offers some extras and the option of switching the games' music to some awesome remixes.)

"I think that this site needs a vote for a game you think deserves to be on VC, have like a top most wanted games (make it like, 20 games long because you know people are going to over-vote for Earthbound, SMRPG, Chrono Trigger, ect. It'd be unique to see what makes it to 6-20!"

YES!!! That would fantastic! And who knows--maybe the word will eventually get out to Nintendo. Maybe more people would register on this site just so they could participate?

"WiiWare is almost like a half-arsed excuse to compete with the X-Box Live Arcade."

I got Lostwinds and thought it was great, and it's kind of nice to see some modern games without the modern length/complexity (usually old-style stuff seems to be reserved for handhelds). But likewise I somewhat see it as a bit of a red herring to the VC . . . which pretty much already smeared XBLA.

@ Birdo

Here it is again: why not the Mega Man Anniversary collection? I guess if the Wii is your only console, that button-layout screw-up is a considerable issue.

. . . .

Where's "VC-holics Anonymous"?

@ Adamant:

I suppose I envy your positive attitude, then, since it's totally the "watched pot never boils" thing for those of us who get excited about certain titles (that we either played back in the day or wanted to). And granted, the releases aren't really scattershot either--most of them really are classics that people would want or (likewise for me) wouldn't mind giving a shot, although it's a tough pill to swallow: when the VC was first announced, and was a considerable factor in the Wii's appeal, and I, personally, never dreamed that I'd be waiting this long for completely unaltered versions of old games (and sans extras like in compilations). It's simply disappointing . . . I thought the wait for stuff would mostly be over within a few months of the Wii being out. And for the most part, it totally could have--unless I'm badly mistaken, the ESRB does NOT rate unfinished products, even if it's an unfinished emulation, which means all those rated are ready to go. And look at how fast Earthbound got on that list.

Speaking of which (I'm referring to the write-ins at NP), the squeaky wheel gets the oil, no? (at Nintendo) Granted, whining without being productive is annoying, but I don't have to have a "bad attitude" to make some noise and try to inspire some change, do I? (Like in will's case, maybe?)

At any rate, I can certainly respect a positive attitude.

@Rexy

Nothing is "glaring" if you aren't accustomed to a game on the GC and then start playing it on the Wii (I actually have a 60gig PS3, which actually has the PS2 chip in it--THAT's when perfect backward compatibility is really going to happen). The system architecture of the Wii is so little different from the GC (it's about one and a half times the power of a GC, and almost completely the equal to an Xbox1) that they just run it off the Wii hardware--no extra chip. Super Mario Sunshine didn't look as bright or clean, for instance. I suppose for old, 2-D stuff like Sonic even I wouldn't sweat it though.

As for Sonic CD, I don't know anything about versions . . . except that I loved playing it on Sonic Gems. I know that "Sonic R" on that disc is based on the PC version, which is cleaned up compared to the Saturn version (I thought that was stupid-but-enjoyable game), and Sonic CD has the US and not the Japanese soundtrack. As far as I'm concerned, though, Sonic CD is really the only Sonic game that deserves to be mentioned in the same sentence as any of the main Mario platformers. (Many reasons--FINALLY doing right with difficulty balancing, a cool stage interactivity with past/present/future stuff that led to different endings . . .)