Topic: The Nintendo Switch Thread

@Dezzy
True, but for the kind of "non-game" software you might want to run on a device like the Steam Deck there has already been a bit of demand carved out for it from things like the Raspberry Pi. There's already a pretty significant demand for emulators & media players on Linux so it should be fine there. The real space Linux is lacking is in professional software but... you wouldn't be doing video/photo editing on portable gaming device anyways.

Well, it also falls short a bit in games. You have to lean pretty heavily on Proton which can be a bit hit-and-miss and even when it works well performance can be less than it would be on Windows. But again, this thing is a piece of hardware not a locked platform. You could always just install Windows on it, or even dual-boot.

@JaxonH @skywake

So it's actually running the windows version of the games on the Steam OS, through some kind of wrapper program?

How could that be more efficient than simply installing some version of windows instead?

@Dezzy
It's not emulation, it's more of a different set of libraries that looks close enough to windows that it can run. Sometimes it runs better, sometimes it runs worse, sometimes it breaks. And some games have outright native support for Linux (in my Steam Library it's a tad over a 3rd) so it's not an issue.

As for why? Because it doesn't cost them anything and Valve ideally wants to be in full control of their store. It's kinda like what Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft have with their consoles but... minus the completely locked down hardware

@skywake

When you say it doesn't cost them anything, I assume you mean in terms of having to pay for a third party OS?

There might not be any performance differences though?

@Dezzy
And I would add, not just their store but the OS itself. Windows isn't exactly designed around portable gaming. But Steam OS is. It makes navigating and general use much easier for the average end user.

Not that Windows doesn't work. I have Windows 10 on my Win 2. With Steam Big Picture mode it's great. But, doing anything outside of that is a little bit less streamlined. It does have a Switch that makes the analog control the mouse and buttons the mouse clicks. But Windows has tiny icons and text for a small screen, especially in context menus and stuff like that.

I think the previous failures of Valve's hardware were due to marketing and not the excellence of the products. If they market this right (frankly, NOT primarily toward PC gamers), it's gonna do well.

@rallydefault

That seems likely true. With the previous Valve hardware, I was never completely sure what it was they were selling, or why I should want it.

The Steamdeck is a lot more self-explanatory, and I'm seriously considering buying it instead of getting a laptop in the next few years.

@Magician I was just looking for a list of switch games physical release, so it I am buying games on eshop that I do not make the mistake of buying a download game, when there is a phyisical. It is a bit stupid to buy the game download and I could have got a physical game. So a list would be really handy. Is there a physical list on switch e shop ? 😕

@Dezzy
Exactly. Most people probably couldn't even tell you off the top of their head what pieces of hardware Valve has made. They need to cast a much broader net, going more heavily toward casual gamers rather than core PC gamers, in my opinion.

Pokémon Unite is gonna be released on Switch in july 21th

@rallydefault

Yep, and that's why the lowest cost version of the Steamdeck is important. It puts it into the same kinda territory as the Switch, so people who want a handheld will start considering it as a competitor.

Honestly I feel like if SteamDeck really takes off it's going to seriously end the whole "this would be perfect for Switch" debate in regards to AAA non-exclusive games

Like why even play third party ports on Switch if they're obviously going to be seriously compromised in some way when this thing shows up being able to play stuff like NiER Automata or FFXV at really good and well optimized settings in addition to the versatility the Switch offers by basically doubling as a flat out PC alternative. In addition to that since it's basically a handheld Steam Machine, literally any game that comes to Steam will be optimized to work on this thing in the future, and on top of that you can install stuff like emulators or RetroArch on this thing and basically have a portable legacy library of older games excluding maybe PS3 ones if they're too CPU intensive

I realize they're aiming for different audiences here but for people who don't readily have access to gaming PCs or laptops and play mostly on Switch this is like a serious option now despite costing as much as any of the next gen consoles

It is basically the world's cheapest gaming laptop, assuming you buy the cheapest version.

Not to mention the Steamdeck will (likely?) have the same sales that Steam has. That means daily, weekly, and seasonal sales that will put most of Nintendo's eShop sales to shame, especially on AAA and first-party stuff. The eShop does get some nice discounts from time to time, and it's an indie lover's dream for smaller games that cost very little, but Steam brings those same prices and usually better pricing to the big games, too.

@TheFrenchiestFry
It’s definitely a serious option. If you are a fan of video games I don’t understand how you don’t like this thing. Know what I mean? Forget all the silly tribalism and sports team bickering. If you like video games, how could this device not at least intrigue you or pique your interest? Maybe you’re not a portable gamer, ok then. That’s fair. But even then one can still appreciate its appeal.

That being said, this isn’t going to sell anywhere close to the Nintendo switch. So the overwhelming majority of portable gamers are not going to own one. Which means third party games on switch are going to remain as important as ever. And even for me, as someone who now has a 512 GB Steam Deck reserved, The fact it’s over twice as heavy as a Switch Lite and nearly 4” wider, means I’m not carrying this thing in my back pocket to work every day like I do with the Lite. Which means having those third party games on switch are still going to be desirable for me. I’ll certainly take this to work also in a case, but maybe just on weekends. A tiny Lite is easy to whip out and play for a bit on the down low. Busting out this massive cinder block… not so much.

So, while your reasoning is sound, I think there’s going to be plenty of reason to play third-party ports on the Switch for the majority of portable gamers, even some of those who own a Steam Deck. And in a few years when Switch 2.0 drops and it can run games with approximate parity (perhaps even better if it utilizes Nvidia’s DLSS, something this AMD-based system will not be able to do), that will be even more true. In fact, I think this thing only really has about three years to catch on, because after that, once the next generation Switch drops and it can run basically any game the Steam Deck can, It’s going to start getting a lot of games ported over, and the utility of the Steam Deck will be severely diminished. We don’t know what the future holds but, right now, this is a perfect time for a device like this, especially coming off the back of Switch Pro rumors and the thirst that has left in gamers’ mouths.

Any of my hopes about Switch breaking into the AAA third-party scene effectively ended when I played TW3: Blood and Wine on it. Amazing that it runs on potato hardware? Sure. But it's still a version of the game that only a really dedicated Nintendo fan could love.

Switch is great for indie stuff, big-budget third-party exclusives like Monster Hunter Rise, Shin Megami Tensei V, Mario + Rabbids: Kingdom Battle, etc., AA Japanese releases, Nintendo exclusives, and ports of older games that can run well on the system. That's a massive swath of third-party games that general fit well on the console.

But it is definitely not the device to own if you want the hottest new AAA games in hybrid form. Switch Deck, if it holds up, is looking to promise that. While I still think the thing looks damn uncomfortable and too bulky, it's a really impressive piece of technology, and considering how smitten I am with portable hardware, I'll probably end up getting one at some point if it's not subject to the same state of perma-drought as damn near everything else is right now that uses computer chips.

Frankly, even if I never get one, if it puts an end to discussion about a Switch Pro, it'll have done good work.

EDIT: A thought just occurred to me. With Sony putting their stuff on Steam, we might actually get a de facto handheld that plays Playstation games again. Pretty cool. It's nuts to think that stuff like Horizon Zero Dawn, Tales of Arise, Resident Evil Village, etc. will all probably run pretty well on this thing.

Success for the Steam Deck is success for the form factor not necessarily this particular product. Which will probably be to the detriment of Nintendo in the medium term because currently Nintendo has virtually no competition in this space. I mean the biggest sign Valve is onto a winner here would be if Microsoft releases a portable XBox Series in the next couple of years. Which I think is fairly possible if this gains some traction. That'd definitely pull some people across from Nintendo

One thing we do know now but is that it is possible to release an x86 product leaning on the efficiency of Ryzen for a console competitive price. So it's only a matter of time before others get in on that. I don't think this form factor is going to die anytime soon.

With that said, Nintendo has what they've always had. Compelling IP. No matter how slick whatever comes next is and now matter how far behind Nintendo remains you'll still have to buy into Nintendo to play Zelda, Mario, Metroid, Animal Crossing, Splatoon and Smash Bros. It'll be the only platform Bayonetta 3 will come out on and having Bayonetta 1 on Steam doesn't really cover that. Also the Switch is almost 5 years old now, there will be new hardware at some point, that new hardware will close the gap significantly

Also Nintendo's button layout is the only correct one

That's a big thing here. For a few reasons (some legit, some seriously outdated) there's still a stigma toward PC gaming for the crowd who just wants to buy and play. That looks like that's what this does for PC gaming. Yes, you can buy a ready to go gaming laptop/tower, but the Deck really streamlines it. Doesn't look like there's anything more involved than there is buying a new dedicated console. The timing of the Deck is also certainly helping it, following the rumours of Switch Pro that didn't pan out to be true and gamers really wanting one. This is a big focus on some other forums and sites I visit, the OLED is a lackluster "upgrade" for many and Deck is more in line with what they wanted.

@rallydefault Not even likely, it WILL. It legit uses the same SteamOS custom made for the handheld and also uses the Proton layer over the Linux OS so it can run virtually all the Windows-compatible Steam games as well, so it's nowhere near as limited as those Steam Machines from 2014/2015

Keep in mind, this is amazing value for price, and most definitely something I and other enthusiasts are interested in.

But the price goes to show it’s not cheap making a powerful handheld, and it’s hard to make one that’s small and compact. $400 with no dock included, only 64 GB space (which unlike Switch won’t get you nearly as far), no OLED screen, same resolution as Switch (except being 16:10 instead of 16:9) and judging by Valve’s comments about price being painful for them, they’re eating a sizable cost on each unit sold. Anyone else trying to enter the market will face those same obstacles and won’t ever be able to hit a $200-300 price point, and will have to strip down storage just to get price in the PS5 range.

The appeal of it with Steam Deck is the Steam library which is already configured to run on different powered hardware, emulation, trackpads and gyro. Gyro is crucial for aiming well on a handheld. Sony and Microsoft notoriously do not have Gyro in their games (aside from one or two anomalies on PS). That alone kills any appeal of a portable Xbox or PS. Not to mention the fact their games aren’t designed to run on hardware of different power. And with their games coming to Steam anyways, I see little to no value in a portable device from them. I’ll take Steam Deck any day over whatever anyone else comes up with. Valve is the only one who could have pulled this off correctly, and they’ve nailed it.

Long has there been a desire for a product like this. It’s just been out of reach for most people because GPD Win and Aya Neo were crazy expensive ($850-1,000), had no gyro, and if you got a lemon, Sending back to China is quite the hassle. But we do have to thank GPD and Nintendo Switch, because without them trailblazing the market of portable console gaming, I don’t think we’d have a Steam Deck today.

It’s going to be the perfect device to complement the Switch. No longer will I have to get frustrated waiting for some third-party game to come to Switch (like Mass Effect Legendary edition). Now I can just enjoy Switch for what it gets, and whatever it doesn’t is Steam Deck by default.

And best of all, with Microsoft putting their Xbox games on Steam, and even Sony putting their exclusives on Steam, and Nintendo GameCube and Wii games being able to be emulated, and Switch games being on Switch, virtually every game in the universe worth playing will be available hybrid.

Switch docked permanently. Cloud saves to OLED Switch or Switch Lite for portable play. Hybrid without needing to dock/undock.

Desktop gaming PC connected to TV permanently. Steam cloud saves to Steam Deck for portable play. Hybrid without needing to dock/undock.