Topic: Super Smash Bros. Ultimate

In regards to Cloud and Joker, they might seem out of place in Smash despite the fact that these characters appeared in Nintendo games (in spin-off titles), but the thing is, they are only the "face" of series that were born on Nintendo consoles and have a long history with Nintendo. Both Final Fantasy and Megami Tensei had all exclusive mainline games as early as the NES and SNES before they shifted to Playstation and then became multiplatform series. In my eyes having Cloud and Joker is no different to having other NES icons such as Snake, Simon, Mega Man, or Hero.

In regards to Terry: Fatal Fury / King of Fighters (and SNK fighters in general) were the only fighting games back then that could take on Street Fighter II in gameplay, quality, and popularity. There was no Mortal Kombat, Tekken, Soul Calibur, or Dead or Alive in 1991. Also, Sakurai was a big fan of it, and without it Super Smash Bros. would not exist. Apart from chronological hierarchy and videogame history, that's just another reason for Terry's inclusion before any other fighting game character. On a side note, there are 40+ Nintendo games released that have Terry in them, from Switch all the way back to the SNES.

@SKTTR Most of your points on Crash were faulty. There are plenty of people who enjoy Crash Bandicoot games, myself included. They've aged very well, and the remake made them look even better. I'll take the very well-polished, low-priced N-Sane Trilogy, over 3D All-Stars, which didn't change a single damn thing.

I do and will always respect your opinions so don't take it personally.

It's fine. It's ok to like Crash. I can respect that. Plenty of people think he's good because they only had a PS1 back then and no access to better platformers. I just played the 3 original Crash games/remakes on Switch and think they are still as rubbish as in 1997, especially now that I've completed Mario 64 again which is still amazing.
I stand by the point that there are at least 6 or 7 other platformer main characters (not yet in Smash) that are part of much better platforming games, so it's natural I would put those before Crash. However, I have only played 4 Crash games, so... maybe missed the good one.

@SKTTR Crash's games may not have aged as gracefully as other platformers around at the time like Rayman but I can for sure say the original PS1 trilogy has aged way better than Mario 64 or even most N64 games in general

64 just feels so archaic when paired next to subsequent 3D Mario games, but Crash has such tightly constructed levels and the right amount of difficulty that the only things that feel archaic about its design mentality are the stuff surrounding the level progression, like how you have to rescue Tawna to save the game, or how trial and error the Gem trials are.

@SKTTR Yeah, I get ya. We all have our preferences. I would gladly have Rayman or Conker before Crash.

I would take Mario over the marsupial any day, but in terms of early platforming design, I think Crash wins. It was definitely difficult, but nothing too teeth-clenching or gut-sinking. I have a wee bit of nostalgia for it as well since I played those types of games during the "3D" era.

Gonna be quite fun to see all the various characters in their art styles on that stage.

@Northwind Spider-Samus, Spider-Samus, does whatever a Spider-Samus does..

@Northwind I cant wait I think steve will come out at least a day or two maybe a week I could not wait that long.

For me it's the other way around. Crash's stiff digital controls that only have extremely basic physics and animations, his lacking moveset, and the linear and uninspiring stages have more in common with the worst indie platformers nowadays, while Mario 64's precise analog controls, the anbundance of moves with animations and physics that lend to a vast array of combinations, and richness of great ideas and amazing level designs are some of the best even today.

For me Crash's gameplay is exactly like something you'd find in dozens of terrible party game collections where the platforming sections are just one of several other cheaply made minigames.

Super Mario 64 on the other hand, you can't go wrong with it. When you completed Odyssey, Galaxy 1&2, and Sunshine, and need more 3D-Mario greatness, it feels like an extension that is still worth playing.

My hopes for Rex being one of the DLC fighters has been completely smashed.
With Nintendo picking the characters and Sakurai having very little control over who gets in and who doesn't, I think Rex doesn't stand a chance anymore.

Also, I'm seeing a trend with these Fighter Packs. The very first DLC was Piranha Plant, a first party character. Then we got 4 third party characters until the first Fighters Pass finished things off with Byleth. The second Fighters Pass started with Min Min and now we've got Steve, which makes me think the next three DLCs will be third parties as well and the final character of the second pass will be a first party character. And if there's only one more first party character left, Rex has basically no chance.

I could be wrong but it appears to me that Sakurai has much more control over who gets in the base game than he does over who gets added later as DLC. If that's the case then Rex's chances are very, very low. I think it's more likely he'll be added to the next Smash game, if there's ever going to be one, on Nintendo's next console than him appearing in Ultimate.

Edit: by the way, even though I don't care much for Steve at present time, I'm still going to watch Sakurai's presentation later today.

@Rexenoboy
Rex would actually be 5th on my Not Wanted list. I left him out though, because I still want him some day. Just not yet.

The sole reason I don't want him now is Xenoblade Chronicles X. I really want Elma and don't want Xenoblade Chronicles X to be skipped over. That would be a travesty. Everything about XBC X was better than XBC 2. From graphics, to soundtrack, to story, to gameplay. It's just the sales that weren't as good.

However, I think Rex's chances are extremely high, and I wouldn't count him out just yet. Sakurai wanted him in originally. His Mii costume as a bonus in Fighters Pass 1 is evidenced by that. He was shelved because they had to ship the game.

If Fighters Pass 2 is like 1, starting with a 1st Party, then four 3rd Partys and then another 1st Party to close it off, there's still hope for him.

@Rexenoboy you're implying Sakurai would included Rex in the first place, he might not care.

I would worry too much about pattern predictions for who the pass fighters are, it's like the tin hat conspiracists looking for proof of 9/11 or Coivd in the bible.

@jump
Sakurai clearly stated before he wanted to add Rex but couldn't because of time constraints.

@SKTTR
I'm positive Rex would have been added to the game already if Sakurai had any say in who gets added as DLC, but that's the problem here. Sakurai doesn't get to decide, Nintendo does. And that's what worries me.
I understand why you want Elma to be added first though. It's only natural if you think XCX is a better game than XC2. I liked X very much but wasn't that big on its story and characters.

@Christofu Well, it's not like you'd need to do every test straight away, and there could always be a feature where others could test a course to allow that character to be available for everyone to choose. That would make the work easier on the creator and still allow all characters to be available (but the player would know the character might not be able to complete it since they're the one doing the testing).

Having just played the Crash N Sane Trilogy for the first time less than two months ago, I have to say those games have aged a lot better than Mario 64 and Sunshine. Crash is definitely not as inspired or creative but they still hold up reasonably well, whereas those early 3D Marios can be extremely frustrating in places. I think that's to be expected though since the Crash games are more simple, linear games, which usually age better than more open games.

As for whether I want Crash in Smash: he wouldn't be my first choice but he's certainly a very popular and long-running character so I'd be happy for him to be added. I don't really like his design though, he looks like a C-list Sonic character. I prefer Coco so hopefully she'd be available as an alt skin.

@Rexenoboy Sakurai gets to decide. Nintendo approaches him with fighter ideas, but Sakurai ultimately has to sign off on who he picks based on how efficiently he can adapt their particular moves and best traits to suit the Smash environment, and obviously a personal level of respect for the series that he's working with as evidenced by Joker and Steve's inclusions. He still has the ability to veto any ideas Nintendo might throw at him if he feels that they can't be turned into a fighter without betraying how they were depicted in their games.

Honestly if anything I think the final nail in the coffin for Rex was probably when he willingly chose Byleth over Rex, given at the time of their inclusion, Three Houses was still an extremely new game, while Xenoblade 2 had been out for about a year at that point, completely contradicting his claims that he couldn't be added into the game due to time constraints. I think in actuality he just either forgot about Rex or might not even care at all.

@Northwind The day will come were mario can fight crash.

45 minutes. Not expecting much. Hopefully we’ll get some cool mii costumes and music!

@Blooper987 I hope they show more amiibo and cool mii fighter skin.

@TheFrenchiestFry
I've seen a lot of conflicting reports on who's deciding which characters get added as DLC.
I'm not sure what to believe anymore, but I do know Rex's chances have become very slim.