Topic: Metroid Dread

@Quarth That means I haven't even reached the second part of the fight, lol!

Can’t understand why the High Jump was replaced by a limited space jump (can’t remember what it’s called as it’s been replaced by something else). In the heat of a chase, it’s so easy to miss the second jump point I started to wonder whether my pro controller’s B button was not registering.

It’s sad but more and more as I go along I start to think that Mercury Steam was trying to implement elements of twitch reaction combat more commonly seen in fast paced hack & slashes where enemies give you half a second to react and you have to react exactly as they believed in their head (looking at you red charged beam slash attack). Biggest mistake is that the “dodge” ability you get later doesn’t go through enemies and you can still be hurt when dodging.

@X-Slayer That's wise, my friend.

@Octane It has three stages:
In stage one, just keep firing missiles in its mouth, and avoid or destroy the projectiles it vomits and throws at you (destroying them gives you health and missiles if you're running low). Eventually, you'll fall down through the floor and it's time for stage two. In the second stage, shoot normal blasts at its belly button (best is to stand farthest to the left), while also avoiding the goo (jump to the middle) and the stakes (duck). In this stage it also shoots projectiles which you can destroy to gain back health. After shooting the belly button for a while, it shoots three stakes (duck!) and a magnetic elevator wall appears. Grab it and go up for the third stage. Here you'll fire missiles (or charged up beam shots) in its mouth again. It will continue to throw projectiles, destroy those or you'll fall back down and have to repeat stage two again. Eventually, you'll HAVE to repeat stage two as the boss (in stage three) will do a punch attack that will instakill you if you don't let go of the magnetic wall. It's pretty brutal. But you'll learn the pattern.

i need help with an energy tank puzzle
i'm stuck on the energy puzzle in Ataria where you have to speed boost, then morph ball bomb 2 gates, flash shift past a gate and then use your speed boost charge towards the roof to get the energy tank. how the hell do you keep your Speed Boost charge while trying to flash shift through the gate without the gate closing or losing the Speed Boost charge, i've tried so many times and i just can't get it?

After a couple of hours: Its lovely. Fun gameplay, smooth controls, beautiful graphics (that lava-area, breathtaking), beautiful music. First 2 bosses where pretty good already. The speedboost seems a bit weird in this game though. It was always tricky, but here you have to press the analogue-stick button, wich is very weird.

Just finished it. Fantastic game. My favorite game of the year.

The EMMI complains are sort of weird imo. Had no problem with any of them and thought they were a lot of fun really. Use your mini-map.

@James_Bond
This game isn't even in the same city block as Ghosts and Goblins in terms of difficulty. Not even remotely.

I'm gonna speak frankly here, and I hope nobody takes offense. But ppl have become so pampered these days, that any game that offers even the slightest whiff of difficulty suddenly gets lumped in with Dark Souls, Ghosts and Goblins, etc.

There are brutally difficult games (Dark Souls, Ghosts and Goblins) and there are games which offer a satisfying challenge (Monster Hunter, Donkey Kong Country, Metroid).

Now, I do understand that different gamers have different levels of skill. That's definitely true. And because so many gamers haven't really played games with satisfying challenge, its highly probably some will perceive the game to be hard. I knew ppl who took 10+ tries to beat certain DKC Tropical Freeze bosses. They're just not as skilled in 2D games as many others.

Just know that this game isn't on the level of Dark Souls or Ghosts and Goblins. Even for an unskilled player, you're gonna get way farther in this game with way less frustration than either of those. It's just not that kind of game.

Seems all games nowadays are either laughably easy or brutally difficult. But Metroid is a game that hits that perfect sweet spot in the middle. Oh, you'll get tested. You'll die some. But it's not that bad. Especially with how the game pampers you with modern amenities like instant restart from 10 seconds ago.

@JaxonH
As somebody who has played games for over 3 decades but always been average at best at most games, even ones I take time to master, I've got to concur with your comment on the difficulty in this game. I won't speak to stuff like the Souls series because I haven't had enough experience with it, but this game has a very fair challenge, imo. I've had to start a boss fight or two over, and messed up on the EMMI from time to time but I don't feel like it's because the game is 'cheating.' Back in the day, there were some games where boss fights felt cheap for the sole purpose of annoying the player. Haven't experiences that yet with Metroid: Dread.

@Octane
I got stuck on him also for a bit. It's not too hard. The second stage is definitely easier, really the trick is to be overzealous with the missiles

@JaxonH I've got to agree with you there to be honest. I haven't completed Dread yet, I'm 3 or 4 hours in and so far it's not too difficult at all.

And to he honest, although the Dark Souls games are perceived as "brutally difficult", they're very fair games. There's a pattern to everything and timing is key in combat. I find games like Sonic Rush which seems to have a million random bottomless pits that come out of nowhere more rage quit inducing than Dark Souls or Metroid Dread.

@Gamer83
Ya, cheap deaths and significant progress and time lost upon said death will turn me off from playing a game.

I love a good challenge that pushes me to do what I know I can, yet doesn't punish exceedingly when I fail. Dying is fine just so long as the game doesn't use it as a means to frustrate. Some of my favorite games are ones that have a decent challenge, but don't make you hate attempting the challenge because you fear death's repercussions. Hollow Knight, as much as I love that game, was horrible in that respect. It's what made the game frustrating to play, in contrast with Metroid Dread which encourages the player to be bold, as death isn't really a big deal.

Every time I get caught by an EMMI, I don't feel frustrated, because I know I can immediately give it another crack, learning from my previous mistakes.

@Reprise
My younger brother is a diehard Souls fan and he's always goading me to play the games. I've played each Soulsborne game for about 3-5 hrs- I totally recognize it's an amazing series (hence why some ppl are so crazy about it). What turns me off is the punishment after death. I really hate redoing a sizable amount of playtime, and I hate losing my souls. I lost a bag of souls that was like, an hour's worth of grinding and exploring. Then died before I could reclaim it. That's the last time I played. It was just too much. And the challenge is pretty high, too. The Knights always get me. Even early game- one wrong move and bam, you died, gotta redo the run from last bonfire and hope you can reclaim Souls by the same knight that just killed me, and is likely to kill me again.

But ya. Quality games, just very demanding of your time, patience and willingness to "get gud" as they say.

@JaxonH Yeah, I can get that to be fair. I'm not a huge fan of the series, but enjoyed the first one, Demon Souls before it and Bloodborne. I have to get into 'the zone' so to speak when playing those games. The runs aren't too long when you work out what you're doing and where you're going in my opinion and I don't mind redoing them, trying to learn from my mistakes, but I get why they aren't for everyone.

@Gamer83 @JaxonH
It's definitely not the hardest game. As you guys have said you definitely die a heap but there isn't any real punishment for dying. Which is usually what makes me stop playing. Also the deaths always seem fair, even the instant deaths which is a bit of a feat

With that said, I wasn't a fan of super fast boy yellow EMMI. I feel like I just got lucky with him

@skywake
Oh my gosh. The yellow one is faster, isn't it. No wonder I died to it the first two times.

Just got the Morph ball, and suddenly the game has opened up a ton. Can you roll into the EMMI ducts or are those off limits?

I've not played Dread yet (I'm assuming it's not Celeste B-Side levels of difficulty) but I do think that a realistic risk of dying and losing significant progress is an important part of the Metroidvania template. That sort of panicked feeling of being low on health whilst lost in an unfamiliar and uncharted part of the map and desperately hoping there's a save room behind the next door or else you lose the past 20 minutes of progress... That's a core part of the design and I think you lose something if it's gone (but I 100% get the convenience and I'm conflicted because I'm not sure I'd personally want to go back)

All that said - I'm not generally a fan of hard bosses (especially multi-stage bosses). Too often they just represent a difficulty spike and go back to being brute pattern memorization.

@JaxonH
Exactly. In fact, as far as checkpoints, I'd say this game is as forgiving as it gets. Get caught by an EMMI? Start right back at the entrance to the EMMI zone. Can't beat a boss? Restart right before it. Back in the day you got f'd over big by certain games.

Just finished the game with 100% items, some were extremely annoying to get, but felt great when pulled off. Clear time 12:39:56. The wait was worth it. I just hope the game has done well enough that Nintendo continues to make another in the future.

@StuTwo
Ya, it does add to the tension, that's for sure. It made reaching a save point particularly rewarding in the Prime series.

Unfortunately, it comes at a very high cost. And I don't think I'm willing to pay that kind of price anymore. As a kid, or unemployed 20 yr old loafing around all day playing Metroid Prime from sun up to sun down, it wasn't a big deal. But now... I just don't have the patience for it. There are other games that offer that, and I think there are ways to provide tension and challenge without falling back on a penal approach to death.

@skywake
Had a little bit more difficult time with the Yellow EMMI but I found a spot where I was able to put enough distance where I could weaken it then run a little further to set up the finishing shot.