Wow... lots of new people in the forum these days, all just rehashing the same discussions we've been having for years.
Hey guys, my coffee from Dunkin' was 4 dollars today, and it gave me roughly 17.5% the satisfaction of a month of NSO (if that's the fancy abbreviation we're giving it these days).
Oooooo! Stimulating! Deep! Totally worthy of discussion and emotional feelings feeling things.
you are not doing the NSO any service when you compare it with American coffee...
One thing to remember is that cloud saves doesn't save you from all kinds of errors. If the game itself corrupts your save file, it might very well upload it to the server and now you have no way to get back to an uncorrupted file. The same thing if you somehow delete it yourself, if the game then deletes it from the server you are screwed.
To really have be safe it isn't enough to upload saves, you need to have saves history. Just uploading saves really just save you from when the device breaks or you get a new one, which I don't think is the most common use case.
Overall I think steam should be the baseline for functionality. Steam doesn't offer much, but those things are free at least. Nintendo haven't really been able to get up to that level.
I also really dislikes when companies abuses their monopoly status to cash grab and I hope it bites them in the end. Especially in a case like this where they have no real cost associated with online play.
One thing to remember is that cloud saves doesn't save you from all kinds of errors. If the game itself corrupts your save file, it might very well upload it to the server and now you have no way to get back to an uncorrupted file. The same thing if you somehow delete it yourself, if the game then deletes it from the server you are screwed.
To really have be safe it isn't enough to upload saves, you need to have saves history. Just uploading saves really just save you from when the device breaks or you get a new one, which I don't think is the most common use case.
Overall I think steam should be the baseline for functionality. Steam doesn't offer much, but those things are free at least. Nintendo haven't really been able to get up to that level.
I also really dislikes when companies abuses their monopoly status to cash grab and I hope it bites them in the end. Especially in a case like this where they have no real cost associated with online play.
I hope Nintendo and other companies don't be like Steam. Because Steam also gave birth to arrogant and jerky PC fanboys who think PC gaming is master race. I know someone who is a arrogant PC fanboy and I don't want Nintendo and other companies follow the same route Steam took. That's why I hate PC fanboys because they are arrogant, jerky and narsctic who thinks their PC gaming is better than console gaming. Shouldn't we like all consoles and PC instead of bragging about how one of them is better than the other?
And how is it that companies abused their monoply to cash grab? I didn't met anyone who said that companies are becoming greedy and not caring about their fans.
I hope Nintendo and other companies don't be like Steam. Because Steam also gave birth to arrogant and jerky PC fanboys who think PC gaming is master race. I know someone who is a arrogant PC fanboy and I don't want Nintendo and other companies follow the same route Steam took. That's why I hate PC fanboys because they are arrogant, jerky and narsctic who thinks their PC gaming is better than console gaming. Shouldn't we like all consoles and PC instead of bragging about how one of them is better than the other?
That is your view. But personally I have seen bad seeds in both the PC community and the console communities. Last gen Nintendo fans were for example extremely against paying for online, and Miiverse was the best thing ever! And the gen before it was the PS crowd.
And yes, if another company does something better, I think it is justified to call them out on it. Blind fanboyism is never good. Bad practices are bad practices regardless if steam, Nintendo, Sony or Souya boy do them.
And how is it that companies abused their monoply to cash grab? I didn't met anyone who said that companies are becoming greedy and not caring about their fans.
Psyonix makes a popular game named "Rocket league". Said game is a multiplayer game, with their own servers. They pay Nintendo a license fee to be on their platform. Nintendo haven't payed psyonix for the development, nor for their servers, their maintenance or their customer service. They are now behind the sub, which lessens the value of their product = less sales. If you want to continuing to play you need to pony up a sub fee despite Nintendo have nothing at all to do with your connection to psyonix's servers.
If a company starts adding an extra cost on a service while having no overhead what so ever, but can get away with it because they have a local monopoly, what would you call it instead of abusing a local monopoly?
In my mind there is no way this would fly if it was google doing it on the android platform.
@Alantor28 I don't think I've ever heard the PC Master Race thing being connected to Steam before. Steam is bascially just a digital storefront. PC elitism does very much exist though, but is no more toxic than what comes out of console fanbases where there are many people exactly like that the person you know who is like that about PC (personally, I've found the PS elitism worse in recent years).
Steam itself is a wonderful digital platform and if it's functions came to console, so many people would be ecstatic as it already does what people have been asking for on console. Top of that list is always having your library available, no matter the machine you move to. I've moved my Steam account between 5 or 6 PC's over the years and my games are always available. No rebuying, no hassle. Just download the client and install the games I want. I have games from 2003 that I can redownload and play on my newer PC's, whereas on consoles, I have to rebuy them anytime I get a new machine. People have been asking for permanent account-bound digital purchases on console for a long time and Steam has that. A precedent has been set within gaming, but consoles haven't adopted it yet.
Then you have your free online, free cloud saves, friend list that has functionality.
I'd be absolutely ecstatic if Nintendo did what Steam does. All of my previous digital Wii U and 3DS purchases available to me on Switch would be amazing.
I suppose I'm what you would call a PC fanboy (also a Nintendo one, though ). I prefer kb/m for some game types, I like being able to upgrade, I like what Steam offers, I like having access to all mods. But I also don't care what other people prefer to play on.
I fully agree though that everyone should just play on what they want to play on and no one should really care what other people prefer. I'm hoping more crossplay and other cross-functions help with that as people can play together on whatever they prefer.
Sorry, I didn't mean to offend you. While I like NSO, it wouldn't hurt it to be like Steam like you and Therad said. Though Nintendo bringing all their classic console games to a Steam like Nintendo Switch Online could be a problem as they are really ancient (I could be wrong though) and emulating them could take years or decades depending on how good the programmers at Nintendo are. But yeah, I think a Steam like NSO could be great (Though I like the Netflix like version of NSO right now). And since Nintendo is hiring people to make NSO even better, I hope they do something like Steam does, possibly without the toxic PC elitism.
I enjoy NSO but it needs a lot of new things SNES games maybe a few other consoles. Better online on those games. Dedicated servers The online service has potential and much to improve. i have since i like to play games online and every once in a while NES games. But the service is in no way perfect. Just my 2 cents also this topic has turned into pointless disagreeing over nothing form both sides so the topic is kinda a dumpster fire. Well that is my thoughts.
So I had a go at the free trial. Happy to see it works with games Ive bought on different accounts. I won’t be paying for it yet as although it still works OK For Rocket League and MK8D Smash was a bit flaky and laggy. Also the NES games don’t feel right with the Button mapping they use and bizarrely, no option to remap them.
Might go for it when they announce the SNES games though. Your move Nintendo.
@electrolite77 I hope they add button mapping in a update. I still don’t find it much value on its own other than cloud saving but family subscription gives it value. If that wasn’t there I doubt I’ll continue subscribing. If you know other switch owners it might be a good idea to join in with them
We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.
I might try that at some point. The button thing just really irritated me. That and the NES games Online being restricted to friends only. The chance of a few Online games of Dr Mario would have tempted me but the way they’ve handled that is really offputting.
Yeah maybe they could restrict some games, or give the option to. It looks like the way they’ve configured the App makes changing that side of it difficult. Missed a selling point for me, as I got a lot of use out of Online Dr Luigi on the Wii.
Since people here were wanting some dedicated servers so they can play online without fear of disconnecting and hackers, let's be real here... Dedicated servers can also be hacked like normal servers. Thanks to the rapid advancement of technology, hackers can even hacked into dedicated servers. So even if Nintendo does put in dedicated servers in their games, it's not gonna make the problem go away.
Because the hackers are not that stupid, if they can hack into normal servers, they can even hack into dedicated servers. So sorry to say this, but dedicated servers for online games will also be hacked. And as someone in a article say: nothing is 100% secured, even dedicated servers.
Yeah, but I just learned that dedicated servers cost $100K a year, that's breaking the bank. And I also learned that the p2p vs dedicated servers debate is a bit like the 90s debate of something.
@electrolite77 You could use X as the NES B button instead of the Switch's B button for a similar feeling to using B and Y, but yeah I do agree there should be button mapping. Waiting for SNES games isn't a bad idea, though I would imagine they would make SNES online friends only like they did for NES. I agree with @ReaderRagfihs on making certain games playable with anyone, particularly competitive games such as Super Mario Kart and Tetris Attack, though the matchmaking should prioritize who has the best connection the moment the player connects.
Yeah, but I just learned that dedicated servers cost $100K a year, that's breaking the bank. And I also learned that the p2p vs dedicated servers debate is a bit like the 90s debate of something.
And yet psyonix can afford that, without a subscription. And if Nintendo have 1 million subscribers a 20 bucks, they can afford those servers. Tell me again what are you getting for the added paywall? NES and cloud saves don't count, those are separate services not connected to playing online.
The 90s complaints were because lan parties were the standard at the time, you really couldn't host a lan party on a dialup connection, it would become insanely expensive if the connection could even handle it. Different time, different tech.
@Alantor28 Dedicated servers aren't being used by the majority of games across all platforms for a reason.
It's amusing to watch people complain about the lack of and wanting something that could potentially make their lag worse.
Sure, you can get more lag, but at least you will have a fixed lag. If you (and most other people) have a lag of 100ms, it is much better than you having a lag of 50ms and the host having only of 1ms (from controller to next frame).
Also, if you connect to another persons home, you are 100% at the mercy of their connection and their hardware with no one to complain to. Home hardware isn't built like professional hardware. And if you have a cap on bandwidth and become a host, you will hit your cap faster than if everyone connects to a server.
But still, the problem is that the service doesn't become any better because you pay. It actually becomes worse. It was p2p before the sub and nothing has changed because of it. Or rather, the changes that have happened are all negative for the consumer.
It costs money = less people playing online
Less people = less people at the same level as you = worse matchmaking
Less people = less hosts to chose from = increasing lag
Less people = harder for online centric games to survive (morphies law anybody?) = less consumer options.
If you think cloud saves, NES games and their chat app are worth $20 bucks a year, you shouldn't think it needs to be bundled with online. But for some reason everyone seems to think it is necessary, while in fact those are different services tied to each other.
Even more strange is it that some games are exempt from their practice. It isn't like Nintendo have higher costs they need to recoup associated with rocket league than they have for fortnite.
This would never have been accepted if it happened on mobile and rightly so.
Yeah it’s better that way just not....quite....right.
It would be a real shame if they restricted SNES games to Online only. I think to a certain generation 8 player Online Super Mario Kart is very attractive and could be quite brilliant. But you’re right, that is what they will do unfortunately.
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