Zael

What made nes and snes great consoles were games like super mario, metroid zelda and donkey, but also games like megaman, street fighter, castlevania, final fantasy, demon's crest, probotector, turtles, final fight, street gangs, duoble dragon, metal gear, breath of fire, terranigma, chrono trigger, secret of mana, demon's crest, mrtal kombat, ninja gaiden, bubble bobble, ducktales etc etc
and many of those games were from third parties
Probably metroid and zelda are the most beautiful, but third parties had an important rule
This because every one has own preferences and only with a big variety of games and developers you can reach everyone
Nintendo simply have to make new hardware which can support third parties and continue to make its game,
The innovation is in the games, not in the gamepad. But games can be innovative only when you have many producers
For example I rarely buy games from atlus but after I saw dragon's crown I decided to buy the game on day one.
I haven't bought games like tomb raider or the last of us, that are best sellers, because I don't like them.
This to say that if you have many producers you can find a game for you
In the past nintendo made only one or two mario for console ( snes n64 gamecube), now it is starting to inflationate mario and forget ip like kid icaris, f zero, starfox, or brand new ip.
It is ok to have a mario for each console but there are also other ip
The low sales of wii u are a consequence of this
And also of problems related to the game pad that is very uncomfortable to play with
Also, many people dislikes the double screen
The hd space is also small considering that they have made promotions like pikmin+ wonderfl 101 with 30% safe only via digital
First you produce a console with 8gb space, then you release a promotion on 2 games that exceed the space on hd
Another problem is the cost of the gamepad. If I broke my gamepad where I can buy another one? and how much it will cost? 100 euro for a replacement gamepad?
I can say that there are many problems related to this hardware
I thnk that nintendo also lost ground in the wii era. In fact many casual gamers have bought a wii but have discovered that it has lack of support and now want to play the multiplatform games they saw on the ps3 and xbox360. So they have chosen to to pass to the ps4.
So the wii sold well but this can mean also that many buyers could have changed their mind about the lack of support that an underpowered console brings
I hope that nintendo will listen to its fans and will change its absurd policies about hardware
i know that graphic isn't everything but if graphics can help the support then it is important
To have low sales means also to have a minor quantity of games in the future and of minor quality

you can plug but when you play fzero in nintendo land or donkey with the gamepad plugged it is very uncomfortable, also when you have to use it as a viewfinder in zelda. So in 2013 you have to play plugged?
Many people find very uncomfortable to recharge the battery 2 times a day, you use a home console with all the problems of an handheld
Those problems will emerge exspecially on games like zelda where you have to play many hours
Many people will start to hate the hardware for this
Third parties will not support the game pad because they produce multi platform and have no reason to spend more money for wii u features, they will use it only for the off screen mode and for maps. It is useless
Only nintendo could support it but at the moment we can say that it is not supporting because
pikmin 3
nsmbu
dktf
zelda ww hd
mario 3d world
ssb
mk8
are all games that are similar to the wii version and can be played also without gamepad, the gamepad features are few (only the maps or the viewfinder that already exist with the wii mote)
You have to admit that the gamepad isn't innovative like the wii mote
It is useless. It only make the gaming much more uncomfortable
Also bayonetta 2 will not use the gamepad
It only raises the console price and the battery consumption
But i agree on the fact that it is impossible to remove it now, so they could produce a smaller version of the same to reduce the cost and the battery consumption.
A small scrren like the 3ds one
In this way you can use all the wii u function but you can reduce the problems
Considering it is useless at least you reduce the problem
Also it is useless to have two screens because you can use only one scrren a time (you have only 2 eyes, not 4), all the gamepad function can be reproduced with the pause button

I agree on the lack of games, but we have to say that the lack of games is a consequence of the hardware and how third parties see the hardware.
About the gamepad I think that it is the most wrong peripheral of the last decade
Yesterday I was playing dungeons and dragons and, while I was online, the battery shut down and all the people had to wait for me because there was no way to continue
This happend also today. The battery is always low, and the pad functions are useless
I think the wii u sells bad because it is primarily an uncomfortable console.
And there is also a lack of support
When nintendo games will come out the sales will improve but nintendo has to change its hardware politc
I imagine myself while playing zelda hd and having to recharge the battery 2 times a day
its absurd
Yes nintendo always search new ways to play but this time is wrong
This is why the console sells bad

great game, in europe it's called street gangs, I have the cart for nes

Probably, on wii, it would have sold way better, also the controls would have been better, with the wii mote drawing on the screen

I will get this game, sad too see that the gamepad support is near to zero.
At least menu and magic spells could have been used on the gamepad for a quick selection
The gamepad has finished to be only a cost for the console

@NinGamer85
consider that it will cost about 76 dollars and allows remote play.
Also, if you want to play games like YS celceta on tv (when it is a ps vita exclusive)
you can
it isn't a bad idea

I think nintendo has to revamp its console business to survive in the future but I think also that it will survive this gen because has good cash.
It is also hard to predict a quick changement because if they would release a new console in 2015 (for example) in the mean time sony and microsft would already have a base of millions console sold for this gen (ps4 x1)
So it would be too late the same
they have to think a solution like the gameboy player for gamecube, to allow 3ds games and ds games run on wii u. In this way they can reduce the third parties support problem and revamp the wii u with a wider game library
It can be the response to ps vita tv
For the future it's difficult to say because the next next gen will start in 2020 and for that time the market will be different
I can only suggest to nintendo to support the third parties because story tells us that only one company can't produce a sufficient number of games to satisfy all

consider that ff15 is a multiplatform, and lose a multiplatform like ff15 is a crime
those are games that come out only one time in a decade

I agrre on the fact that nintendo games have a difference, are art etc. but there are also games like final fantasy 15 that are art and can push sales.Also castlevania sotn was art and nintendo lost it when saturn and psx grab it, and what about ff7? I only say that, even if you have the best games, you have at least to bring the most important games from third parties to create a complete offer.
For example there is a lack of fighting games on nintendo,
rpg now we have xeno but on gamecube we suffered the absence of dragon quest and ffx, ys 6 etc. In usa they risked to lose xeno, the last story and pandora, it is only for operation rainfall that they could play them
Now there is dragon quest x never localized and we have been one year without a rpg

@Frank90
all people has at least a smartphone and it is difficult to see a 30 years old man playing a 3ds on street instead of his smartphone
This is because you have to bring the smartphone with you for job and it is unconfortable to bring also a 3ds in your pocket
also, to play games like zelda smash bros etc you have to concentrate yourself on the screen, this when you are walking and you are busy on the street
A smartphone is much more trendy for peope, youngs etc
You finish to play your 3ds at home on your sofa on relax but at this point isn't it better to support the home console?
what are we talking about?
If there are 33 mln 3ds and 3 mln wii u and the 30 mln 3ds player don't buy a wii u is because the handheld is supported better than the wii u, but not because they need an hand held. In fact ps vita is died because not supported as ps3 etc.
nintendo has two different politics for 3ds and wii u. But there is no sense in making hand held to play at home and home consoles to take dust
the 2ds is everything but an handheld, you need a bag to transport it

also I have noticed that today we are all gathered here to discuss nolan statement, about 200 comments that aren't on other news.
Even if they seem comments to defend nintendo I think that all this comments hide a sense of disappointment
I think that all nintendo fans today would like a different console hardware and third party support
even if we know that nintendo ip are the best

@jayclayx exactly

also sega supporters spoke so before sega toke its path to irrilevance
We can say that nintendo isn't sega but a good critic today can save nintendo tomorrow, if they haven't understood yet that the hardware policy is wrong then I foresee a catastrophe for the future.
Buyers have given a message to nintendo, and it's clear

nintendo isn't able to read the market and what player want.
Players want a powerful and complete console for home, to play also pro games ike sf4, to live the current gen well. The hand held market was strong in 80 because the technology was poor, now you have a screen also on your watch and can play zelda and mario clones on a smartphone.
There is less need of portability

the fact is that nowadays the smartphone is trendy, also boys, when go out, take with them the smartphone and possibily play games on street. On the other hand many people buy a 3ds to play at home becayse the nintendo home console lack of games, the result is that you don't sell wii u and at the same time the handheld is a smartphone

The problem is that nintendo launches assassin's creed 3,call of duty bo2, darksider 2, tekken tag 2, batman ac, when there are 170mln ps3/xbox360 fan base that can play those games on the console they already have. Moreover the conversions are poor.
Nintendo should have launched a true next gen to convince people to pass from ps3 x360 to them. Because people buy a new console every gen and the only way to catch that train is to have a competitive hardware. Now wii u is supported only by ubisoft and activision (ea and namco have given up), but when the true nex gen will start they will not be able anymore to do porting.
So we will play only nintendo games
there are third parties like platinum but nintendo can finance only a couple of games for year and, considering the sales of wond 101 (which I have bought), I think that also those collaborations will drop.
What will happen after bayonetta 2 and x? we'll have to wait other six months to see a game? On other consoles they will proceed regularly with the next gen and announcements.
Someone could say that wii made the same thing and sold 100 mln, but the gamepad isn't the wii mote and 2013 isn't 2006. This is a much more competitive market and all casual gamers, who bought the wii for the balance, already have a balance. They don't care about games, in fact xenoblade sold only 1 mln on 100 mln wii
we have to be realistic, nintendo has made a great mistake.
Many people has bought 2 consoles in the old gen because nintendo could not support third parties. Now it is clear that people don't want to buy 2 consoles, the game pad isn't so innovative because is useless, so there is no reason to buy a wii u when you have a ps3 or a xbox with bayonetta 1
Nintendo is too late this time
About the gamepad I say that when I play I watch only one screen for time, because I have not 4 eyes, so it is useless to have two screen when you have only 2 eyes
Also you have to recharge every 3 hours, so there are only problems and poor beneficts
With the same price people buy a ps4, with much more confort plays the next gen.

I repeat that the ds sold 150 mln of device, the 3ds only 33 in 3 years, I think that the 3ds sales are good but nintendo is losing ground because of tablet and smartphona, nolan is right

so how can a console that is considered secondary also by nintendo sell well?

now monster hunetr 4 only on 3ds and not on wii u

In a situation where tablet and smartphones destroy the handheld market, nintendo handhed destroy nintendo home console sales (in coop with ps3 and x360). This because people see that the handheld gives them more games than home console (see the ds where there was final fantasy 3 4, nino kuni, dragon quest, castlevania etc.)

@Jono97 And in effect the 3ds damages also the wii u sales because many people, in the ds wii gen, has understood that the handheld gives them the games a wii doesn't.
I have played castlevania on ds and not on wii, dead or alive and sf4 on 3ds and not on wii, so people start to buy only the 3ds because knows that the home console has a poor offer of games (even if of quality)

@Snkfiend Ok but I have the sensation that the market is changing
the nes generation now is about 30 year old and probably likes mario and zelda the same way but want to play also adult strong content. The new generation of players born in a situation where nintendo is considered a secondary console and watch only graphic because want to challenge friends at the game "my console is better".
In this situation nintendo risks to lose much ground, and it is hard to recover
probably that kind of people you refer doesn't exist anymore
If they want to restart to be competitive they have to make a competitive console in terms of hardware and joypad, next attract 3d parties. With their ip they can have a plus to convince people to buy the nintendo so they can play every type of game

@Spoony_Tech
well but on nes and snes third party like square, capcom konami sold very well, in fact their ip born there. So this story of nintendo only for nintendo is a degeneration, and it's nintendo fault. They begin to not support well 3d parties with n64, an hardware without cd when psx and saturn had. Nintendo hardware politc must change, I know they can recover if change their wrong concept of hardware, and final fantasy can sell well on nintendo console if it is the real final fantasy, not crystal chronicles
if they continue to bring only trash games like crystal chronicles, castlevania judgment resident evil fps then it is clear that those ip will not sell on a nintendo cosnole

about the other multi games, consider that there is a base of 70 mln of xbox and 70 mln of ps3 so it was sure that an old gen hardware had sold bad for games like call of duty and assassin creed

@Spoony_Tech It's true, but if they made pc based hardwares probably 3d parties could port their games with few money. This gives a wider choice to the player and low risks to the 3d parties which can bear low sales because the game is the same
But I think that games like final fantasy or mg would sell good also on nintendo, if we talk of ninja gaiden we know that the porting was bad and ng3 was a bad game. But I think that good games would sell

@Snkfiend The fact is that I don't want to pay other 400 euros for another console,
As me, many other players think they don't want to miss important games and don't want to pay other 300 for a wii u.
Every one makes his choice but nintendo asks every time to give up games like final fantasy etc so at this round many people decided to not buy 2 consoles and wii u is collapsing because has the better games ip but they are only few, and for 7 years those games aren't enough
third parties are important to cover dead times

If hardware doesn't matter then make confortable hardwares to attract everyone

@Spoony_Tech
if hardware doesn't matter then why they make strange hardwares? the game pad has repelled many costumers because two screens are useless and confusing

having a closed hardware has brought nintendo to isolation, this is bad also for nintendo players. If they sold less it means that those strange hardwares don't bring anything good

@ScorpionMG
I know that nintendo games are better but I want to play also final fantasy, metal gear, street fighter, dead or alive castlevania etc

You have to understand that today zelda and mario are grat games and triple a production because of fan support and sales. Sell only 3mln of wii u means to have worse game in the future, so it is our interest to have a nintendo console that sells well. If this mean have a standard hardware then let's make a standard hardware, they have to stop with these strange hardwares

I have a wii u, lol

Sometimes I don't understand nintendo because they make consoles without listening fans and players, but after this they produce games like mario,zelda to support player desires (and there is a lack of new ip) so they search innovation in hardware but not in games. I think it is better to have new games on standard hardware that the opposite

After I have had a nes, snes n64, and gamecube, I can recognize that the wii u is the worst console ever made by nintendo. And sales punish nintendo for this

ok people but we have to be realistic
ds sold about 150 mln
gameboy about 120 mln
3ds 30 mln after 3 years
I think that this market is changing, is useles to joke ourself
vita did worse, so this is the prof that the handheld console are becoming secondary

I admit that nintendo has made a mistake with the gamepad and the hardware because nowadays a console must be at 360 °, so we will lose something like final fantasy 15, kh3, metal gear etc. that could have been on nintendo simply making an hardware similar to the others, adding all the nintendo ip I think nintendo could have won this gen. But I think that, in the next next gen, graphic will became a secondary aspect and probably all third parties will work on nintendo console again
I would have preferred a console like the gamecube instead of wii u.
About handhelds I think nolan is right, so I think that nintendo should concentrate on home console, not handhelds, becaus home consoles have always something more than smartphone, more confortable etc, so it is better to challenge sony and microsoft on that stage, as they did in the past.
The wii u gamepad is uncomfortable like an handheld but it isn't an handheld.
You have to charge the battery every time, is weight, etc
I think nintendo should listen to players and change something
although this i prefer the wii u to the other consoles fo the games, but I feel a little frustrated when I think at this hardware and how it could have been

ok but there were only few retail games in q2, much more vc games etc

will download d&d mystara

the wii u is the best console for playing at this round, no matter the power, we are getting the best games like X, bayonetta 2, smash bros, mario kart, wonderful 101, fire emblem, and will arrive zelda, metroid etc.
Many people hasn't understood this yet because think that graphic is everything, they are wrong.
Ok the gamepad isn't so great and probably is useless, but with games like x and bayonetta I think this is a secondary aspect

talking about the arcade version I think super is better, about the snes version we can say that super is too heavy, so probably turbo fits better on a snes. But have a super sf2 on a snes was a great thing for the time.
About the speed I think that 3 stars are ok, I don't like ultra speed which worsen the gameplay, moreover when you raise the speed there is an higher frame skipping, so you lose quality

Hope the zelda bundle will help

I respect jo jo, but I don't understand why a great game like won101 sell so low
in japan

konami should produce a new castlevania for wii u, order of ecclesia style.
Also a ds virtual console would be great
or a ds player

day one

we have to continue asking for all the street fighetr on wii u, also on mii verse, on the sf channel, they have to bring all the sf to nintendo wii u, no excuse

day one forever, megaman rocks

street fighter 3 hd is good, but sf2hd mmmmmm, I prefer the original arcade

also street fighter 3 third

Ok, it's cool to see the snes sf2 trio, but capcom, you really should release ssf2 arcade version (through the cps2 machine you emulated for dungeons and dragons) and ultra sf4.
Sf2 is one of the most downloaded game on eshop, nintendo players want street fighter, want megaman, Capcom you really should do something, we are happy for the snes games (also breath of fire), but you have to do a step forward, release also megaman x 3 4 5 6 on vc
And what about re7?