Sonic Mania Dev Confirms Superstars Translates 'Retro Engine' Physics Into 3D

I hope we'll get video footage of the Switch version soon; I want this game on my shelf of Switch games with Mania and Origins, but not if it runs like crap.

Playing Sonic Mania with my daughter and having a great time! This game looks great! Hope it runs well on the Switch. I'd prefer to pick it up physically for it.

@Magician Inti Creates has made many incredible games, and also Mighty No. 9.

I appreciate being skeptical of the big corporation, but come now.

I guess I’ll be the optimist here. The game looks good. Physics looks good, the art style looks nice, and the areas you go to seem interesting.

Oh, I also enjoyed Yoshi’s New Island. Sue me, lol.

@RupeeClock If I remember correctly Naughty Dog was the same in the 90s. I understand being cautious, but things are always changing in general and anyone can improve. Personally, I don't understand the need for people to put and keep down others.

I don't really care about the developer as long as the game is fun.

Dimps made some of the best Sonic games imo: the Sonic Advance series, Sonic Rush, (and some really wonderful anime tie-ins) but they also made the 3DS version of Generations, where Sonic plays like a tank, and stages have long empty environments on top of the halved fps.

@Magician
That has less to do with Arzest being a bad developer and more to do with Yuji Naka's poor leadership causing massive internal strife during Balan's development.

Cool, it has the sonic mania Physics!

On the other hand. it has the Ballan Wonderworld/Yoshi's New Island/Hey! Pikmin devs...

@westman98 But, they also made Yoshi's new Island and Hey! Pikmin, as a matter of fact, people was worried about they ruining the project when Yuji Naka still had good reputation.

So the Mania team didn't return to help with Superstars but Sonic Team and Arzest still fully translated their physics engine into Superstars? Still not sure why they didn't just fully bring them in to help make the game altogether but at least they're aware enough to know they had something good there and didn't let the hard work of The Taxman and company go to waste.

@westman98 Naka was just a face to market the game, he was off the project during development, wasn't that why he sued SE?

@westman98 As much as I love Naka's work on Sonic and NiGHTS, he's also spent decades building a reputation for being very difficult to work with. So I suspect you're not far from the mark.

@AlienX 4-5 members of the staff teamed up to kick Naka off the project six months before release, but Yuji Naka was on charge during the majority of the development.

@RupeeClock Nobody can deny that. And it's good to be wary. But the comment I originally replied to was silly.

@fenlix
Neither of those two games are great, but they are a lot better than Balan.

Finally Sega it took you ‘ages’ to understand the need!
This game looks great, plays great….it’s a purchase!

@KayFiOS
Yeah im definitely curious to see how it runs on switch.

The screenshots of that version look noticeably lower resolution but i would be cool with that if it meant they got it running at 60fps in order to get it to play as smooth as the classics/mania.

Isn't Retro Engine only built for sprite-based games? Superstars is far more likely to be built in Hedgehog Engine 2

@PikaPhantom I have no idea how game development works but I do know Cuphead and Subnautica are both made using Unity for example

That is interesting. Please don't disappoint

NGL, I had doubts about Superstars as well. Hearing that tidbit straight out of Christian Whitehead's mouth has gone a long way towards alleviating the majority of those doubts. However - nailing the physics is only half the battle when it comes to 2D Sonic. The other half is level design that complements those physics. Will Sonic Team/Arzest actually stick the landing on this? Or will it be less Sonic Superstars and more Sonic Superfarts? Tune in this fall to find out - same hedgehog time, same hedgehog channel.

@Mgalens Exactly what I'm thinking. All the sacrifices to the visuals will be pointless if it doesn't at least run smooth like butter to compensate.

If it has the same physics as Sonic Mania then I am optimistic. It will at least be as good or better than Sonic Frontiers.

I always hoped Sonic Mania would become a trilogy like the Sonic Advance series. But if fun to play Sonic Mania, Sonic Origins and Sonic Superstars is still a great collection of 2D Sonic games for the Switch. A few years ago I didn't have any hope for 2D Sonic games.

I wonder if this was a case that the Mania engine is the intellectual property of Christian Whitehead/HeadCannon/Etc, and perhaps SEGA paid them to use their engine, but without their developmental assistance? Just trying to figure out why they didn't just bring the Mania team on board to develop it. Speculation, but I guess we'll get the details from Christian Whitehead eventually.

@Magician While I'm sure that quote means well, it also feels like one of those "grindset" sayings that doesn't do much service to the discourse or criticism.

Granted, we as consumers should have some expectations and standards for companies that demand our money, but creatively, that quote isn't the healthiest mentality for creatives to adhere to.

@OstianOwl The news broke a few days ago during an interview, but the Mania Team, at least Christian Whitehead was asked to come back and make another 2D Sonic game. All we know is that Whitehead chose not to come back after talks with Sonic Team, but not the reasoning why.

@Nua Huh. That only makes it stranger honestly...

@KayFiOS
yeah i feel like its especially noticeable in sidescrollers, i remember going back to star allies after playing return to dreamland deluxe and the difference really showed while forgotten land didn't feel as noticeable by comparison.

when you have a game as fast as sonic it becomes especially important so I'm definitely hoping they manage to get this running smooth on switch.

Reeeeally wish they would finally do something like--when moving to the right, for example--shift Sonic about 20% to the left side of the screen so the player can see a bit more of what's in front of him.

@MeloMan I'm guessing it may have been down to release window, possibly Sega wanted it sooner then Sonic Mania team could deliver

@PikaPhantom It's ported physics code

@Magician I'm not sure I agree.

For example, everyone is hyped for Remedy's Alan Wake II, but the last thing they put out was CrossfireX's single-player campaign. I think everyone knows how that went...

Milking Retro Engine for the 7th time is cool, as long as it keep the fun I'll still get the game.

Anyone else remember the Sonic Fan Remix demo... was my immediate thought when I saw this one. For me it needs to be 60fps really, in a high speed 2D game, I feel 30fps is really noticeable. Good it has the physics, but I'm mostly seeing grinding and spring bouncing through tunnels in the gameplay I've seen so far.

@Magician Balan Wondercrap was 100% Yuji Naka’s fault. cut the devs some slack

@Magician Then I guess it's safe to say, at point blank, that this isn't the game for you.

That much I'll say. That said, I do believe in giving people a chance. Even if said group's track record is iffy at most.

Christian's retro engine is flawless so if he licenced it or is involved in Sonic Superstars development, it's wonderful. Also, Sonic's designer is involved as founder of Arzest. Sonic Team is supervising. Call me crazy but as long as Sega doesn't rush the developers this will be excellent.

@roy130390 I agree with you. That attitude would translate as a teacher saying, "You failed the exam. You are going to fail forever and ever."

@OstianOwl The issues were not with Christian Whitehead but with Simon Thomley (Headcannon) who blamed Sega on Twitter the day Sonic Origins was released. Christian is the creator of the Retro Engine. It's unclear if Sega was allowed to translate it to 3D or if he did.

SEGA do seem to do a decent job of porting sonic to the switch. Frontiers ran pretty well in my experience (it looked pretty blurry, but it ran smoothly for the most part) so hopefully the switch port will be up to par with the other sonic ports.

Of course, having said that, the colours ultimate port was a thing, and that as well all know had issues. But from personal experience, that was the odd one out, so hopefully, superstars will be fine

Good to have it officially confirmed.

There's some red flags, but hey, hope it's great.
... I'm just not a Sonic guy because I grew up with the good ones.
ARGH, SORRY!
I really can't seem to say that without trolling. Okay I will try again (ahem).
I am not a fan of Sonic the Hedgehog and Yuji Naka deserves to go to prisUGH NEVERMIND.

The fact Whitehead couldn't reach a deal with Sega to make Mania 2 on terms where they were both involved was worrying, and some of the botched nature of the early release of Origins, when it should have been an easy port was caused by poor undertstanding and implementation of the Retro Engine into Sega's menu systems making him very snarky and annoyed really made me worry that they had properly fallen out and he'd given up on them having the level of quality that he wants his name attached to.

However, the fact he previously liked that tweet and is now both that quote and the fact he's hinting at being able to say more in the future says to me that at the very least, even if not properly involved with this game, he approves of it and thinks its good. Thats more than enough of a "thumbs up" for me. He's never been one to mince words if he doesn't like something.

Much as I agree that Arzest's track record is not perfect, I would point out that many of its staff members are some of the lead teams from some of the best regarded old games by Sega and Artoon (some of the very best Saturn devs including the Panzer Dragoon series). I'm not even remotely concerned that they won't be able to nail something simple and retro in the style of classic Sega.