
Rumours regarding Shovel Knight's inclusion in the Super Smash Bros. roster have been doing the rounds for quite some time, but we've managed to unearth some fresh evidence which suggests that Yacht Club Games' famous character is indeed about to take a bow in Nintendo's famous fighter.
We've been in touch with multiple sources within the video game retail sector - which we sadly can't name as it could lead to their dismissal - who claim that Shovel Knight is indeed about to make to his Smash Bros. début, and there will be an amiibo figure to accompany this grand event.
If you cast your mind back a little, you'll recall that Nintendo recently held a ballot to decide which characters the public would like to see added to the game, and admitted that even non-Nintendo characters could be in the running. In our own poll, Shovel Knight came second.
You might have seen rumours posted recent regarding a Shovel Knight amiibo on a Spanish retailer's site, and while the mocked-up image of the figure has led some to assume it's fake, the fresh info we've been handed would suggest that it's actually very, very real.
Yacht Club itself has been teasing a "megaton" reveal on its site this week, as well as promoting the upcoming Plague of Shadows DLC. A press release regarding the DLC seems to hint at "exclusive" content coming to Nintendo systems:
We've heard the cries of bringing more exclusive content to Nintendo platforms. It might not be quite what you expect… but keep an eye out for another MEGATON announcement soon!
The expansion will be shown off at the forthcoming PAX event, and it is understood that Nintendo has booked Wii U kiosks with Super Smash Bros. for Wii U installed on them. Could the two companies be using PAX as a platform to announce Shovel Knight's addition to the cast of Smash Bros.? We're speculating a little here, but the stars do seem to be aligning quite nicely.
Anyway, you can watch the full report on this rumour in the video below. Let us know what you think by posting a comment after you've allowed your eyes and ears to take it all in.
Comments 223
I guess it could be good
I would really enjoy having Shovel Knight in the Smash Bros game. I'm really enjoying the new characters and levels and hope they continue (the Mii outfits I don't buy, but if others enjoy them that is great too). Hopefully we will get a sequel to Shovel Knight announced in the future as well.
I hope so if only just to reduce the massive Nintendo drought. Currently there's not much left to look forward to outside of Super Mario Maker.
I hate paid DLC.... but I'd at least give this a thought.
I wouldn't mind Shovel Knight being in Smash, and I would definitely get the amiibo. But Shantae deserves it much, much more.
YES YES YES GIVE ME SHOVEL KNIGHT AND THE AMIIBO!
I'm hyped if you couldn't tell.
@Grumblevolcano Seriously? They just announced the holiday lineup. Star Fox, Yoshi, Xenoblade, Animal Crossing, Zelda Tri Force Heroes, Yokai Watch, Devil's Third, Skylanders, Lego Dimensions, Chi Bi Robo, Pokemon Mystery Dungeon.
If you don't like ANY of those games, you really shouldn't own Nintendo systems.
Well there's no doubt that both Shovel Knight and Professor Layton (rumoured a few days ago) are really popular characters and they somewhat deserve to be in Smash, but honestly, I'd have preferred something else than them (Wonder Red and Bayonetta to be precised)..... oh well.
I haven't bought Shovel Knight since I am waiting on the physical release. I won't buy Shovel Knight DLC in Smash Bros until I play the actual Shovel Knight game.
It's probably true!
Ponder this - Shovel Knight SSB DLC and amiibo will cost more than the entire Shovel Knight game.
Soooooo many other characters I would rather get in SSB...
Nice try, Sakurai... shovelfighters still count as swordfighters! Just put in some more Fire Emblem characters while you're at it!
@XCWarrior That's why his name is grumble volcano and not MrHappySunshine.
I've been in touch with the guys at YCG before and they're genuinely nice, down-to-earth people. I hope they do get the exposure they deserve.
@XCWarrior I'm from the UK so Yoshi has already been out for 2 months. Star Fox (20th November) and Xenoblade (4th December) are way too late to get excited about currently. The others I'm not interested in except Tri Force Heroes which is a maybe but only after I see 1 player gameplay (3 player co-op doesn't excite me). So yeah, it's looking like only Super Mario Maker until late November.
A part of me wants Rayman just a little more...but that doesn't change the fact that if Shovel Knight was in Smash, I would be EXTREMELY excited .
I would buy Shovel Knight SSB dlc immediately upon release!
....rjejr make a very valid point though.
@NintyMan They could have selected one character now and chosen another at the end of October, I suppose.
I just watched the trailer for the Plague of Shadows dlc......anyone else pumped for this? Is it still free? If so, WOW!
Megaton announcement: retail release date of the original Shovel Knight.
I must be the only person that wants NINTENDO characters in smash still. Shovel Knight has 1 game, and it's a multiplat. Doesn't sound like a Nintendo all star to me, but whatever makes you guys happy is fine I guess.
Why would retailers have information regarding Smash Bros. DLC?
I swear to god Shantae better be right behind him
@Nintendo69 I know right? I find it even more annoying that people want these indies or third party characters in Smash just because "lol I like the character!!!" instead of, y'know, someone that'd actually be an interesting fighter that would make sense.
Smash is a NINTENDO all-stars fighter, not a cesspool of random characters in a game with Smash's mechanics. If people want that they might as well play Super Smash Flash 2, Super Smash Bros Crusade or other fanmade crap that has rosters with ridiculous choices that'd never really see the light of day in the official games.
I love Shovel Knight, Shantae and other characters/games like that a lot, don't get me wrong, but it's still annoying that they're pushed this much. They don't deserve it, a Nintendo character deserves the spot way more than outsider characters do.
IF this is true, I would be happy for his fans, but I think that other Nintendo characters with a greater legacy should have been revealed earlier for Ballot DLC.
I am still taking this with a grain of salt though, considering that Shovel Knight is a one-game wonder and an Indie at that which is also NOT exclusive to Nintendo.
Other Nintendo characters would be much higher on my list like Isaac, K. Rool, Dixie Kong, Wonder Red, and many more. Having an indie character along with the 3rd party legends, Ryu, Megaman, Sonic and Pac-Man would somewhat cheapen the deal in my opinion.
I agree with the Isaac avatar dude above.
Honestly, I don't think he deseree it. 1 multiplayform game?
All the evidence is pointing in the right direction!
@sWiTcHeRoO if we are going to be celebrating Nintendo, as Smash is a celebration of all things Nintendo, we should have a Smash character that encompasses Nintendo's stride in the indie scene.
Whether that be Shantae or Shovel Knight or some other character... Someone should represent.
Didn't vote for him, but was never against him. He's so different from the other characters (and from many of the popular ones being voted on), that it's a great change of pace. Excited.
@rjejr Fair point on GrumbleVolcano. And Shovel Knight retail will be like $30, so it will be more expensive than DLC + amiibo in that sense.
@Nintendo69 I agree 100%. What about characters from Golden Sun, Sin & Punishment, Chibi Robo, Wario Land, etc...I would even prefer K. Rool to Shovel Knight, or if you have to go 3rd party how about Bomberman??
But the Yacht Club Games made an official statement declaring the amiibo fake.
Unless it was a ploy to throw people off for now, or maybe this IS true, but that particular picture was indeed fake. Who knows.
@rjejr
"That's why his name is grumble volcano and not MrHappySunshine"
Funniest comment I've read in a while
I sure hope this any of this isn't based on that retail listings which was actually just fan art. It could be smash or Shovel Knight 64 which they jokily said was the sequel
@Nintendo69 @sWiTcHeRoO Who's to say that we won't be getting some Nintendo characters out of the ballot?
@LasermasterA @SBurness I see what you're saying. He's only had one game that isn't even a Nintendo exclusive, and he doesn't have the same sort of legacy as Sonic, Megaman, Pac-Man and Ryu. Granted, I would still love for him to be in, but I completely understand why others wouldn't.
@SBurness Shovel Knight was on Nintendo first, and was a very successful 3rd party game this generation. Heck it might be the only one outside of Monster Hunter and Yokai Watch in Japan.
Also, Earthbound is in Smash, it has had 0 hit games in NA. Game and Watch also has never sold well, its in the game. Wii Fit Trainer is from a game that was simply updated twice and re-released. Sonic is from a disgraced franchise from a company that used to hate on Nintendo. So logic is flawed a bit.
And have you played Shovel Knight? it's the Mega Man-esqe game we've waited Capcom to make for years.
Pinch of salt - Check.
Ugh... I didn't like shovel knight the game, and even if I had, I was hoping no Indies would get into smash. I just don't feel they deserve a place. Plus I hate shovel knight's character design. But that's just me being a downer, and I know my opinion is the exception, not the norm....
I feel like Shovel Knight would make a cool Assist Trophy but as a full playable character I'm kind of "meh" about it.
@SBurness
it's amazing though
@XCWarrior but all those low selling games like earthbound and G&W are still Nintendo properties, they belong in a Nintendo character game more than a 1 hit wonder character. As for Sonic. He's damn near a Ninty character. As of 2001 how many sonic games haven't been on Nintendo? 4. And not to mention all the exclusive GBA, DS, and Wii sonics. And he shares a series with freaking Mario. Can't get much closer than that.
@3Daniel It's celebrating Nintendo's all-star characters. Nintendo characters, old and new all come together to fight. Nintendo helping out the indie scene is more of a business strategy, I wouldn't relate it to the characters being under Nintendo's wing all of a sudden. Indies are still, in fact, multi-platform now.
@NintendoFan64 I'm not saying that. I'm referring to non-Nintendo characters and their chances. They don't deserve it. I'd rather have a more deserving character that would turn out to be an interesting character FROM NINTENDO instead of an outsider. I don't mind the third parties in Smash because they're at least iconic characters and were part of Nintendo's history AND gaming history as a whole (barring Snake for only 1 Metal Gear Solid game before Brawl's release). Shovel Knight and Shantae don't feel like they're quite on that scale.
@XCWarrior Actually that's not true, Shovel Knight was first released on PC (Steam).
Smash was always about Nintendo characters. Popular or not.
Taking this with a pinch of salt, and if it's true then I"m disappointed as there were much more deserving choices. (And that's coming from the guy with the Shovel Knight icon!)
Also quite disappointed in NL for reporting on this... no actual source and even if it was true, it's a bit irritating to have "Shovel Knight" immediately in the headline. Some people prefer not to have the surprise ruined.
Non Nintendo-exclusive Indie game characters in Smash? Who wanted this? Is the Smash community too young to remember classic iconic videogame characters and just voted for what's popular at the moment?
Well, it sound good, but, ""In my opinion"", Shovel Knight only has one game and is "very recent", and well, It would be much better that will appear in the next installment of smash bros; furthermore, more classic characters deserve appear first.
@emayer The crux of the rumor (at least for the retailer part) is that they're going to be stocking up on Shovel Knight amiibo later this year, at the very least implying some sort of functionality exclusive to Nintendo consoles. Supposedly, these amiibo are branded under the Smash Bros. line...
I would be okay with it. Shovel Knight isn't exactly my first choice, but I definitely see the moveset possibilities. My concern as a Smash Bros fan is that the characters are fun to use, while having some relation to Nintendo (as small as that may be). So bring it on, I say.
@Koz I thought I was the only one! Seriously though, sometimes it feels like "Indie" games are spoiled rotten. Sure some are hidden gems among some other eshop games, but I don't think any of the characters in another pseudo-retro-platformer eshop game are deserving enough to be in Super Smash Bros. They haven't left enough of an impact.
I can't find where Yatch Club have say that, in the link of the press release, there is no mention of that.
If Shovel Knight makes it in as a playable character, that's really gonna mess up the criteria of needing to be a Nintendo IP/Exclusive or from a franchise/company that played a major part in video game history. Because lord knows there's far more deserving characters than a dude from a single [really good and successful] multiplatform indie game.
But I guess if we HAVE to start a precedent of "NIndie" reps in Smash, Shovel Knight wouldn't be the worst choice.
He doesn't deserve an Amiibo or to be in SSB
NintendoLife gets visitors's hopes up for clickbait vol. 12.
@JaxonH Glad you recognize funny. I actually like grumble, he and I are usually in agreement, I wasn't trying to start trouble.
@XCWarrior - "And Shovel Knight retail will be like $30"
Well the eShop DL is $15, and usually $13 US for amiibo, and $3 for a playable character in SSB, so that's $16. So it would cost $1 more for a toy and character in a another game than to actually buy and play the character in his own game. I just thought that was funny.
@yuwarite That's literally what they do.
I think they probably just mean the game will get a Nintendo exclusive, much like how the game has exclusive content in other consoles.
@rjejr lol wow you might be right
@KeithTheGeek We're only just getting the Mewtwo amiibo in November. Lucas, Ryu, and Roy amiibo are nowhere to be seen this year. Why would Shovel Knight's amiibo release so far ahead of any of those?
This'll be fun. Was hoping for Bayonetta but... meh. I'm not all that surprised.
Now, if there is going to be a Shovel Knight amiibo released this year, it'd make a lot more sense if it was tied to the upcoming Shovel Knight DLC, and not to Smash.
@emayer Eh, I wouldn't have the answer to that. It's just what the rumor says.
Mind, I don't necessarily believe this is going to happen, but the source is rather credible. If this ends up being wrong, that's going to break a lot of people's trust in Tamaki/Nintendo Life.
Shovel Knight deserves to be in the game as much as Shantae. They may not have been around as long as some of Nintendo's IP, but their games are excellent, the characters are genius, and if done properly their moves would be both unique and fitting to the game. Shovel Knight felt just like a real classic Nintendo game when I played it extensively on 3DS. The only reason he doesn't "deserve" to be in SMASH is because an ambitious entrepreneur dreamed him up and not the high and mighty N team. If it happens, be HAPPY for Yacht Club. They released an excellent game, earned an audience, and fans such as myself welcome Shovel Knight with open arms. I'd rather Shovel Knight or Shantae be in the game than another clone. Some characters from W101 and some other Nintendo characters like Kamek or Mike Jones would be neat. We wanted Ridley, but they said he was too big. They could have just used the Xenomorph one from Metroid 1. They could have given us Geno. I can point out negatives all day long. Lets be positive, and happy for Yacht Club games if this is true.
Now, if I don't get my Mario Clash DLC stage I'm gonna burn a mutha down! BURN A MUTHA DOWN! (; loljk
While Shovel Knight is a decent game, I would love to see either Rayman or Banjo & Kazooie in the game before Shovel Knight.
I'm not forgetting what Sakurai said about the rest of DLC fighters.
I'd rather see characters that actually has some meaningful gaming history behind them in Smash (like Sonic), not recent third party characters that has 1 or 2 games in their lineup. Shovel Knight, etc, shouldn't be in Smash.
@emayer That is a very good point. Shouldn't Lucas come out next?
Shantae, Layton and now Shovel Knight.
If these three are real I will be super glad, now we just need Issac and possibly Bayonetta and we can all be happy.
@EarthboundBenjy yeah.... No
@shinokami
Hey, we all have our opinions. Rayman 2 was one of my first 3D platforming games I played as a child, so I have a lot of attachment to the character.
Mii costume...
Eh...I don't know.
Freakin' hell, this is a nightmare! As if Smash 4 wasn't already crippled enough from the lack of content - now we get characters thrown in out of goddamn nowhere?! Ugh, I knew it was a bad idea to let fans make decisions, but the Ballot has just reached a completely new height of pretentiousness.
@sWiTcHeRoO I fully agree with you. It just comes off as unfair in regards to several Nintendo franchises that find general mention in Smash (especially Golden Sun), but then Shovel Knight gets a chance because of a popularity poll that never considers if he actually has any connection to Nintendo in particular (which he doesn't).
"famous"
@rjejr maybe it could be that you get a download code for shovel knight in smash for the Nintendo version of shovel knight.
I remain unconvinced! There was even circulation of Artsy Omni's SK rendering as official design. I don't see a backbone to these so called clues.
I will be ok with this.
On a side note, this helped me remember why I quit looking at /r/smashbros. This stuff gets diwnvoted while articles about the life of this dude who has nothing else to do but play Smash for 20 hours a day are Super popular.
@DreamOn
Yes, you are indeed correct on the fan art used for the listing.
There is a link that confirms that the rumor is a fake
http://nintendonews.com/2015/08/shovel-knight-amiibo-rumor-denied/
The most likely MEGATON announcement would be a brand new nintendo-exclusive content for Shovel Knight
@Nintendo69 I feel that way as well. I have loads of other nintendo characters that I would really like. Which my opinion seems to be very unpopular but lol. Skull Kid, Toad/Captain Toad, Chibi Robo, Paper mario, mallo etc.
@Retro_on_theGo LMAO!
I guess Shovel Knight would be cool, though I'd much prefer K. Rool, Dixie Kong, Inkling, Chorus Kids or Chibi-Robo first. First-party stuff should get preference, IMO. This is a Nintendo-themed fighting game, after all...
@JohnshiBRPG Yacht Club has in the past denied a physical release of Shovel Knight was happening, but that ended up actually coming true. And the natures of NDAs mean they can't exactly say something is happening. For better or for worse we just have to wait for it to be proven wrong by other means.
I like Shovel Knight and all, but he doesn't really deserve a place in the Smash roster. He's kind of a joke character anyway, and he doesn't really have an established presence on multiple Nintendo platforms.
I think Shantae deserves to be in Smash. If not her, and we're allowing for newer characters, then why not an inkling?
@Kaze_Memaryu Lack of content? You might be talking about Spatoon when it first launched.
Why can't Wolf come in Smash first?
Welp. Let the flame wars in sue if this turns out false.

@XCWarrior "And Shovel Knight retail will be like $30"
$20 on Wii U or 3DS according to Amazon US. So if they make Shovel Knight SSB DLC $7 like Ryu he could still be more.
http://smile.amazon.com/Shovel-Knight-Wii-U-nintendo/dp/B010U1MUVA/ref=sr_1_1_twi_gam_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1440603564&sr=8-1&keywords=shovel+knight
@amiiboacid You mean the $20 retail box? That could work, but I think that's too cheap for Ntinedo, they like to gouge their SSB DLC.
As for the amiibo
https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQfsztC6sc4STubzsfLX19y0sPeV77xgJAUsVRU2Z0H2G43d-M0zohW8bE
You guys are better than this! Here is where the render comes from. http://smashifiedart.com/characters/shovel-knight
On one hand, not K. Rool. Boo.
On the other, Shovel Knight.
I can work with this.
I thought the ballot was supposed to end in October.
I voted for Shovel Knight. I mean, how awesome would it be to whack people with a shovel?!
Hopefully this'll all be true. I'd quite like trying SK out in Smash. Curious about his moveset, which I hope won't include the invencibility item, haha.
@mariovslink62 Wouldn't be the first time unofficial renders (or simply incorrect renders) have been used by official sources. It happens a lot with Mega Man and Capcom for example. I believe at one point in time they advertised Mega Man 10 with fan-made artwork, and there was a Sony thing that used his Smash Bros render.
https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2014/12/weirdness_sony_uses_art_from_super_smash_bros_to_celebrate_20_years_of_playstation
I'm not gonna lie, I'm scared as to how people will respond if he gets in, now.
@MoonKnight7 Very awesome. Very awesome indeed.
@epicmartin7
(img)gif/image url(/img)
Just replace () with [].
@Kaze_Memaryu Lack of content...what? There were 51 characters (counting the Miis as three in one) at the beginning, a crapton of songs and trophies, multiple game modes, customs for characters, and different collections of stages in both versions (Wii U had 46 at launch. 3DS had 36).
That doesn't really seem like a "lack of content".
@lividd3ad
"Also quite disappointed in NL for reporting on this... no actual source and even if it was true, it's a bit irritating to have "Shovel Knight" immediately in the headline. Some people prefer not to have the surprise ruined."
The first word in the headline is "Rumour".
I'm not sure I understand your argument. The article states that they cannot list a source. Obviously, the sources want to remain anonymous. That can leave the door open to disbelief, but that's why it is a rumour.
Don't know about Smash Bros, however we still need a exclusive level for the Nintendo versions...
I'm honestly hoping Wolf gets announced at PAX. Star Fox Zero is there, and So is Smash 4, which is already out.
As for the amiibo, once again I don't think Sakurai and his team would use a fan render. The amiibo thing is most likely fake. Shovel Knight in Smash would be cool, I will not lie, but for now, I'm on team fake.
I certainly hope so. My fiancé and I voted for him and Shantae, respectively. Shovel Knight would be a perfect fit, and assuming his amiibo won't work on any other game (Mario Maker?), I'll probably just leave him in the box. Speaking of amiibo, wouldn't his figure come out much later than the DLC character? Ryu and Roy aren't out, yet, and they're only just getting to Mewtwo and Lucas.
I wonder if he'd have a voice actor or just sound effects from the original game.
@Kaze_Memaryu
"Freakin' hell, this is a nightmare! As if Smash 4 wasn't already crippled enough from the lack of content - now we get characters thrown in out of goddamn nowhere?! Ugh, I knew it was a bad idea to let fans make decisions, but the Ballot has just reached a completely new height of pretentiousness."
Lol, come on man, settle down.
The ballot allowed for any video game character. I don't understand why this character deserves so much cursing. Is it because he's relatively new or something? What is the crime?
To reiterate on what others said: Lack of content?? Smash Bros. is not in that category. I think you've confused it with Splatoon.
Kind of an odd choice, Shovel Knight being a multiplatform franchise and all. I'd download him in a heartbeat though.
And yeah, Shantae and Wayforward probably deserve it more considering their history with Nintendo.
@Genesaur That is weird , but the Mewtwo amiibo is coming out before Falco, and Mewtwo is DLC.
@Genesaur The amiibo release dates situation is rather odd as you have Falco (a secret character but on disc) releasing after Mewtwo (DLC).
@rjejr Yeah it could work, especially considering you could get the inkling mii fighter costume if you pre-ordered Splatoon at gamestop.
WHERE IS MY WALUIGI / PHOENIX WRIGHT / CAPTAIN TOAD / PROFESSOR LAYTON / BAYONETTA DREAM TEAM??!
Seriously though, Shovel Knight is just such a great fit!
WHERE IS MY WALUIGI / PHOENIX WRIGHT / CAPTAIN TOAD / PROFESSOR LAYTON / BAYONETTA DREAM TEAM??!
Seriously though, Shovel Knight is just such a great fit!
Seeing how Shovel Knight is the most popular indie character, I wouldn't be surprised. I would LOVE for him to be in Smash. I just don't think this rumor is true. Mainly the amiibo. Now the megaton announcement, I'm 40% on this.
I would be so hype for this, but could you imagine the hype yacht club must feel? They love Smash Bros.!
So instead of reporting on what Liam Robertson has to say on rumors, they let him write article himself.
@NintendoFan64 Thank You!
Not against Shovel Knight getting in, but at the same time there are far more deserving characters.
I should point out though that indie characters actually have a higher chance than most other 3rd party characters because the licensing is less of a headache. This also goes for Rayman, since he's already in the game.
As far as indie characters go, I'd say Shantae is the most deserving.
F*****g sweet—if true.
Shovel Knight is right up there with my top picks for new Smash Bros characters.
Cool and all, but I agree with people who say there are more deserving characters than Shovel Knight.
Now, make a new Shovel Knight game (still 2D view and gameplay but with 3D graphics—so 2.5D basically), where the visuals look as good as this:
And that would just be literally awesome.
If this leak is true Sakurai must be going bonkers right now!! First ryu and Roy, now potentially shovel knight? Somebody buy Sakurai a jumbo size Zip lock bag because his office is less than airtight!
@Kirk They did say they would like to make Shovel Knight 64, so it is possible. I don't think the amiibo is real mainly because its using the Smashified render.
@Nintendo69 I couldn't agree more, he has absolutely no reason to be in the game besides the fact his game launched on the WiiU...........on the same day as the PC in America (months later here in the UK).
If any indie character deserves to be in Smash it's Shantae imo, at least she started with Nintendo and was exclusive to Nintendo for well over a decade.
Ugh! Whilst I'm sure Shovel Knight will play well, I'd rather see more Nintendo characters making the grade, rather than 3rd party.
Anything Nintendo can do to strengthen relations with Nindies is a good thing. Not only that, Sakurai said that there would be SEVERAL dlc fighters. This is the issue with how Sakurai worded the smash ballot. It is a popularity contest with the most votes most likely going to shovel knight with all the online results going around. Sure Sakurai could ignore shovel knight but he seems devoted to giving the fans what they want.
UGHHHHH PLEAASE NO I WANT BAYONETTA OR THE SQUIDS !!!! SHOVEL KNIGHT IS SOOO OVERRATED IM SO MAD ATM. sorry
Sakurai's surprises constantly get ruined...assuming this one is real. >_>
@argh4430
PLOT TWIST
@sWiTcHeRoO I can see Shovel Knight in that...conflicting space, but how can you rank Shantae there? She may not be as 'iconic' in regards to Nintendo(which seems to be an issue with you) but, up until Half-Genie Hero's release, you may as well have considered her a Nintendo-based character:
Shantae (GBC)
Shantae: Risky's Revenge (Dsiware)
Shantae and the Pirate's Curse (3ds - initially)
If anything, someone like her should get a slot over the former and we could honestly use someone from a different franchise over adding a billion characters more from solely Nintendo games(which we have plenty of, particularly the ones you can consider dang near clones). She also could have a really unique moveset, which you could easily tell from her games.
It just kinda bugs me a bit when (and this isn't directed at you) you hear people trying to hammer for King K. Rool(nit that he'd be a bad choice) and others from franchises that we have more than one representation for, when this could be an opportunity to give other (n)indie series that have stayed, for the most part, with Nintendo for a while now, a bit of spotlight.
I personally highly agree with those who want Shantae and Isaac(Golden Sun) for this reason! ...hell, I've been screaming for them for a while.
I would adore seeing Shovel Knight in Smash, and I would love to see the stars align in the right way so he can be announced soon, but it's a shame the amiibo leak is fake, at least. The design used for him there is the fan render made by Artsy Omni as part of his Smashified series, and I'd highly doubt that Sakurai and co. would use that as the official art! I remain ever hopeful, though.
As I pointed out earlier, somebody probably just found the render on google image search and threw it up on the retailer's website. Stuff like this happens fairly often believe it or not. It doesn't confirm nor deny the existence of the amiibo, so focusing on the one website using the fake render is a waste of effort IMO.
I voted for Shantae. That said, if this is true, Shovel Knight would be the younger character to join Smash Bros roster? Pretty awesome if you ask me (I haven't got the game yet btw, so I don't know why this game is so popular).
Seems like a pretty natural fit to me. Although I hope he won't be the only character taken from this ballot if in fact this is true.
I'd really really like to see a Space Pirate from Metroid, Simon Belmont, or even Rayman before a lot of the others I have heard people have been voting for.
Shovel Knight would be very cool. I /really/ hope that Shantae (my #1 pick!) is joining him, along with a couple of Nintendo characters like Dixie Kong and Krystal. And maybe, /maybe/, we can get Simon Belmont too? Those five would be a dream com true result for me.
I really hope this rumor isn't true. The pretentious "Indie canon" that thinks it's so high and mighty doesn't deserve the attention of a Smash rep.
And by "Indie canon", I consider Shovel Knight, CommanderVideo, Shantae, Meat Boy, The Player, and Scram Kitty to all be from the same series since they all show up in any indie release ever nowadays. The indie canon is "indie" in name only.
This is when Sakurai turns round and delivers something that no-one expects. Either multiple characters, or a character that no-one ever expected. He is still the king of teases.
Anything but King K rool is fine.
Hoping Shovel Knight makes it in, and see people complain about it, because they think their personal opinions of a 'much deserving'; character didn't got in
@TheXReturns I'm honestly kinda expecting multiple characters anyway, considering how well-received and profitable the DLC for Nintendo's games have been. I'm expecting at least three, maybe five.
I forgot, there is at least another $30 or so dollars of DLC coming to the $100 already game (well, for everything).
Rumors in the world of video games so often are true, I'm inclined to believe this. It's great and I'll support his inclusion, but I voted for Shantae.
Yes, please! Shovel Knight deserves more attention and is an interesting character. At least an assist-trophy would be cool.
I have no ill feelings towards Shovel Knight in SSB, but I have a hard time believing he was the winner of the voting ballots when there are so many other influential game characters out there. This just seems like a good marketing move as opposed to fan wishes.
@MasterGraveheart I think 5 is how many characters we'll be getting in the future. One more veteran (most likely Wolf), and 4 newcomers from the ballot. The newcomers in question being composed of three Nintendo characters and one guest character (Whteher or not that guest character IS in fact Shovel Knight, we'll just have to wait and see. This is only a rumor.)
@Megumi I can't help but feel bad for the guy sometimes.
Its not too late guys! Vote for Simon Belmont!!!
Wasn't the amiibo already confirmed fake by yacht club?
@insertmemehere Yes.
shovel knight here, shovel knight there... this thing is being talked about since its been realeased. I dont see how its so amazing as people make it out to be. like what you want, its just weird to me.
I don't know, i'm going to approach this like any rumor instead of getting excited. We just had a Layton rumor already debunked by his voice actor. I know how much everyone wants Shovel Knight but i much rather have an actual "retro" character.
Sure, Shovel Knight is cool and all, but I'd rather have Shantae.
Oh, I'd love to have Shovel Knight in Smash! Downloading him to my Amiiqo and fighting him would be so fun.
@Lalivero Indie characters shouldn't get priority over Nintendo's original characters. That's the problem. The game is for Nintendo all-stars, not for third party characters to jump in for the hell of it. The only ones we've had in Brawl and Smash 4 have been picked carefully and make AT LEAST a degree of sense, again, though, barring Snake. Indie characters don't have any of that going for them.
I'd like to see Shovel Knight in Smash, but at the same time he's a very new character and has only appeared in one game so I'd think there were more deserving characters. Still, his moveset could end up being great and he could be fun to play.
@DarthNocturnal "Third, and I say this as a Golden Sun fan meself... but after the long hiatus and then a lukewarmly-received game (followed by yet another hiatus), I think Golden Sun has dropped into niche territory. It has better chances of getting a rep then, say, Urban Champion, but less so then other Nintendo AND non-Nintendo reps."
And yet we have gotten the Ice Climbers with only one game under their belt, Mr. Game & Watch who barely anyone knew of around Melee's time, same with R.O.B. and other series in Smash. That argument holds 0 water.
Isaac was acknowledged as an assist trophy in Brawl and even has GS music going for him. He's missing in Smash 4 as an assist (but still has his Brawl music and a new one in Palutena's Temple), it's only fair to assume he could be playable later down the road since he's not already in the game in some other form. Not only that, but Nintendo is acknowledging the series a fair bit by bringing the first two games as VC titles on Wii U. I can only imagine the DS one is coming soon if The Lost Age being rereleased is any indication. It looks a bit like how M&L: PiT got into the VC some time after Paper Jam got announced.
I'd still rather wait and see before blindly jumping to conclusions based on little details like those though.
@mariovslink62 Yeah, it's more than likely not real, but it sure looks good.
@sWiTcHeRoO So you'd choose a goomba to make it in then, over a (n)indie character who has shown a rather lengthy(even if not constant) history with solely Nintendo? Seems reasonable.
But seriously, I'd see your point with random outright third party characters, but Shantae? Isaac(Golden Sun series)? (just as two examples)They are hardly random indies, in regards to Nintendo; both are series that have been rather...ever present on Nintendo's handhelds(and, until HGH for Shantae, solely for the most part).
Not that it would be wrong to have more characters from prominent first party series, but it baffles me to think that someone like, say, Daisy should have some instant priority over a consistently present (n)indie character, just because she's first party. ._.
I honestly can't say for certain if it will become true because wasn't the amiibo listing discredited for using Smashified's Shovel Knight art and multiple sources claiming it to be fake. That aside, I have had it in the mind that apart of the megaton annoucement could be his entrance into Smash but we will see. Shovel Knight isn't the highest character on my list due to being a new character and not taking priority over Bandana Dee, Banjo-Kazooie and especially my number one Isaac, but he isn't the worst choice for a character. Overall, just hoping Sakurai's several character choices are good ones and hell, even if they aren't my favorites (Ryu), I haven't regretted my DLC purchases since they are all still solid characters
Shovel Knight is easily my top pick for Smash. Love the game, plus his moveset would likely fit my playstyle better than any of the existing Smash characters.
Amiibo is likely fake (as Yacht Club said previously) but I think Shovel Knight in Smash seems extremely likely considering all the hints.
I have a solution
Dont like him=Dont buy him
@Lalivero No I wouldn't? Way to miss the entire point.
Golden Sun isn't even indie. It's Nintendo.
I never even mentioned Daisy either. The only character I'm seriously pushing for is Isaac. I hate Daisy and I didn't mention anyone else in my reasoning, so I don't now where you're pulling that from. I want a DLC newcomer to be Nintendo, but I still want it to be a reasonable choice. I thought that was obvious.
As much as I love Shovel Knight, and as great as that game was (seriously it's fantastic!), it would bug me a little if he got in after one multi platform game whilst the likes of Chibi Robo, Issac, Dillon, Mallo and other fantastic, multiple titles in their series, first party IPs are still MIA.
Maybe though it'd be a good relationship builder with Yatch Club. Nintendo really could do with more second party devs to help share the load and they're an extremely talented bunch who seem to want to work with Nintendo. Shovel Knight 2 exclusive to Nintendo? Yatch Club developed Wario Land? Dare I say....Metroid?
Ok, it wouldn't be the worst thing by any stretch. Plus a Shovel Knight amiibo? Yes please!
But seriously at the very least make Chibi Robo an assist! He could come in, tidy up all the items on the floor and sweep the legs of any fighter in his way!
@Grumblevolcano Agreed. Mario Maker's the only great game I can think of on the horizon.
I'd love to see Shovel Knight in Smash but I'm also interested to see who the other DLC characters will be.
The amiibo is fake. It's literally the same render that Smashified made. They wouldn't just rip his art without permission and one of the channel creators said that they never ok'd it.
@sWiTcHeRoO Hence why I said 'but seriously' on that second part(no idea who'd want to add a goomba)? And I threw Daisy in there as a random example because of the 'Nintendo's own original characters should have priority' thought...didn't say you said her specifically.
Golden Sun isn't exactly an 'indie'(which I didn't clarify in my point, so I'll give you that; your last reply also wasn't around when I mentioned that, so sorry), but it isn't exactly a prominent franchise...I guess it would've been better to have just left Shantae in my reply.
Btw, fwiw, I do see your point, but then I'm not sure why I got that original reply from you...I wasn't saying to let random indie characters have just as much pull into getting an invite. ._. I question Shovel Knight(from the circumstances) just like anyone else.
@Grumblevolcano
We must have very different tastes indeed, because I'm excited for Mario Maker, Star Fox, Tri Force Heroes, and Yoshi's Woolly World (granted everyone outside of North America has already gotten this one). I played each of these games at E3 and had a lot of fun with all of them. Also looking forward to the new Chibi Robo and Mario Tennis games, although those might not be day-one pickups for me.
@Ogbert
I love that idea for a Chibi Robo assist trophy! I could also see him zipping around the stage and hoovering up projectiles for a period of time before leaving.
@MoonKnight7 @NintendoFan64 @mariovslink62 Yeah, 51 characters, none of which have any context whatsoever, instead just being there for the hell of it, while also having several clones among them. And a boatload of music, more half of which is ripped straight from other games, while the rest is half-baked remixes and at least 20 different iterations of the same horrible Smash 4 leitmotif without any creativity whatsoever. And Game Modes that all change nothing about the gameplay, instead just slightly altering the concept behind the whole franchise. Maaaan, so much content... that is fully explored after about 3 hours, 4 if you're really taking it slow.
@DarthNocturnal As for the Ballot, I don't care which character, it's never a good idea to ask fans what they want in a game without any kind of limitation, and without any idea what would actually make sense. Even if Shovel Knight isn't a Ballot pick, he's a strong sign that Smash is starting to degenerate into a promotion platform (see Ryu/Pacman/MegaMan/Snake/Sonic).
As for content, see above response.
As for Playstation Allstars: yeah that game had even less content, but that doesn't make Smash 4 any bigger.
And in regards to Golden Sun: need I remind you that Captain Falcon is on an even longer hiatus than that, since F-Zero GX was released even before GS:DD? Or that Ice Climbers were in Brawl despite only having one freaking game in their entire history - in the 80's?Or that Marth and Roy were kept in Melee despite Fire Emblem having remained japan-only until shortly thereafter? Or that they still acknowledge the Golden Sun franchise by including music from the game in Smash 4? Besides, it's just an example to show how easy it is to keep the roster closer to Nintendo - Shovel Knight is a far cry from "close" to Nintendo, even moreso than the other immigrant characters in the game.
Definiely not my first choice, and i highly doubt he will make it it.
I also doubt he has an amiibo prepared
I am sure IF he gets into smash then he'll get an Amiibo but unless his Amiibo also UNLOCKS the character (as an alt way of getting the character) there is no way he would be available before say Ryu and Roy
Kinda torn between Shovel Knight and K. Rool, honestly.
@abe_hikura What would be interesting to see is what happens if you scan the Mewtwo amiibo without having purchased him.
Rayman was my first choice, with King K. Rool as a close second, but I'd be cool with Shovel Knight. I think he was the third character I voted for in the Smash Ballot, if I'm not mistaken. I voted for like 8 or 9 different characters, even though you're only supposed to cast one vote. Does that make me a bad person?
I'll take this with a slice of pizza rather than a pinch of salt. izza:
Where's the pizza emoji?!
I guess every emoji is now a pizza.
Edit: it looks like the issue was resolved lol. xD
@Grumblevolcano I guess he'd still unlock as a sparring partner, just you wouldn't be able to play as him yourself.
"multiple sources within the video game retail sector".... uh, the character DLC won't be going to retail, and the video game retail sector can't pull their heads out of their collective *ss*s to order/stock enough amiibo. "the video game retail sector" will be the absolute LAST group of people to trust regarding this type of rumor.
@Grumblevolcano @Ogbert Yeah that's my feeling too, The DLC amiibo's would only act as normal, giving you the FP of that character and not unlock anything else for "non DLC owners"
Of cause this isn't factoring in Nintendo's random nature, Its possible that you might be able to play as the DLC character whilst the FP is in the match but its also possible that it might not work at all.
@Grumblevolcano For me, it's Pokemon Super Mystery Dungeon. Probably gonna be my GOTY.
@Kaze_Memaryu 1. Really? You're mad at the fact that there's no apparent reason for the characters to be in there? A) Smash TRIED having a story in Brawl, and look at how that turned out, and B) there's always the theory that it's just a kid playing with his toys.
2. Dr. mario, Dark Pit and Lucina were originally alts, but became characters because it would be easy and take little time. I can't believe how many times I've had to explain that AFTER it was confirmed that was the case.
3. The modes work around Smash's mechanics. For example, Home-Run contest: The goal in Smash is to launch your opponent off-screen, so let's see how far you can launch something!
4. Okay, yes, most of the tracks are ripped either from past installments or other games, but there's still a ton of them!
5. So you're not even bringing up the stages? Okay then...
6. There's the challenges, which don't take 3-4 hours to complete...for a normal person, anyways. I'm sure there's this super-human out there who managed to do it all that quickly.
Long story short: Smash still has stuff to keep you busy.
@TheAceofMystery THIS. If Shovel Knight DOES get in and you don't want him in, than all you have to do is avoid buying him. Bam. Now he'll never be in your game. Also, to everyone who think that Shovel Knight gets in means we won't get in a beloved Nintendo character, there will be more than one character coming out of the ballot. If Shovel Knight gets in, it doesn't mean we won't be getting anyone like K Rool or Isaac.
@KeithTheGeek Why? For reporting on a rumour? We're not necessarily saying this or that will happen, just that this is what is being said. We're not fortune tellers.
@Kaze_Memaryu 51 characters, ton's of music, stages, and extra modes is a lack of content. OK then please stop talking.
@sWiTcHeRoO TheDE fighters wold be very interesting, just look at other character's in smash. Besides that Nintendo wanted outside characters, they would've stated otherwise if they didn't.
So by all of your logic, before Shovel Knight can get it, every single Nintendo character in existense and every single third party character in existense has to get into smash first
@Kaze_Memaryu The moment you cited Ryu, Pacman, Megaman, and Sonic as examples of signs that Smash is degenerating, you lost what little credibility you had.
@liljmoore Rayman too.
@LiamR I'm basing this on the more...rabid part of the smash fanbase, in wake of the many "leaks" and such that happened during the pre-release period for the game. I guess I should have worded that more carefully, though.
Maybe saying "break people's trusts" was wrong, but I've seen in the past people lose credibility in the eyes of a fandom for reporting on rumours that didn't come true.
@LiamR Hey Tamaki. I understand that you probably have enough questions being fired at you right now, but I have an important question. The leaks group from SmashBoards and I would like to interview you on possible information you might have regarding Shovel Knight. The interview will just likely consist of the mods from the leaks thread and me in a private PM. Any additional information not in the video or in this article will just be kept private between me, the mods and you. This type of information is good to keep track of and could really help in our research. Of course it's up to you, but we would highly like if you consider the offer. Thank you for your time and we'll be waiting for your response!
@epicmartin7 I'm not sure how much help I'd be able to be, but hit me up on Twitter and I'll see if we can work something out.
@LiamR I actually don't have a twitter this current moment. Sorry about that. Are you willing to sign up for SmashBoards at all?
EDIT: Here's the link if your interested: http://smashboards.com/threads/nintenzone-social-thread-swamp-wants-you-to-read-the-threads-rules-in-the-op-before-posting.405399/page-882#post-20019017
@Nintendo69 Completely agree with you. I'm neutral on Shovel Knight (never played the game, I'm waiting for a physical release), but I'd prefer if we got some Nintendo-exclusive characters. I think that with the 4 third party characters that are in the game now, that flank is covered.
@Nintendo69 Completely agree with you. I'm neutral on Shovel Knight (never played the game, I'm waiting for a physical release), but I'd prefer if we got some Nintendo-exclusive characters. I think that with the 4 third party characters that are in the game now, that flank is covered.
@Nintendo69 Completely agree with you. I'm neutral on Shovel Knight (never played the game, I'm waiting for a physical release), but I'd prefer if we got some Nintendo-exclusive characters. I think that with the 4 third party characters that are in the game now, that flank is covered.
@DarthNocturnal You obviously don't even get what I'm getting at, but I hardly care to continue explaining myself at this point.
@LiamR Would an e-mail work instead?
EDIT: Just emailed you, hopefully that should work.
@epicmartin7 Sure. You can find it on my YouTube.
@LiamR Thank you.
Skipping down after getting halfway through the comments. All the salt over an additional character. I get it, the game's recent and multiplatform, so the character's impact is negligible for not being a Ninty exclusive, but when one says "eShop", what are the arguments in favor? I'd imagine Shovel Knight is one of the "must-buy" recommendations, up there with the Shantae games (Risky's Revenge being a large proponent for DSiWare).
I like the character, and his goofy proportions, and dat shovel, so I'm good by it. But seeing all this Isaac love... Man oh man, I'd love a Golden Sun character in. Heck, make half of Isaac alts be Felix (like the other Robin, and Olimar, the Villager...), and I'll swoon.
Not sure if anyone's down here reading this, but I saw this on Yacht Club Games' website in their post regarding Nintendo's Nindies@Night event. "Thursday, August 27th at 8PM! Food, drinks, and video games await! Be the first to compete for glory in Shovel Knight’s Challenge Mode against other party-goers!"
Ahem...
"...compete for glory..."
Not sure if that means anything, but hey.
I hype Smash Bros. DLC more than Nintendo's new games xD
@TheAceofMystery Heh. Same.
Anyway I wouldn't like it if Shovel Knight was chosen. He's too popular with crowds I don't like.
@LiamR Unrelated to the article, but I've been hearing new rumors on Devil's Third. Basically, the rumor is that XSeed is unhappy with NoA and how they handled Devil's Third (their 180 kneejerk reaction to the massive online backlash). XSeed's relationship with Nintendo has now been potentially damaged for the foreseeable future if the rumor is true as a result of Nintendo's fans and critics demanding that NoA publish a horrible game.
Do you have anything on this rumor?
I think it must be a pretty big coincidence that so many character rumors for the Smash Ballot are happening now. Shovel Knight, Prof. Layton, Shantae, all of these rumors have been given fairly strong hints from someone behind the scenes, particularly Shovel Knight and Shantae.
I personally hope for all three of those guys.
I still want Takamaru, Lyn, Isaac and Bomberman to appear at one point, but Shovel Knight would be really fun.
@panicathebedroom Which part of the website is it on?
EDIT: Nevermind, found it .
For one, it seems NintendoLife is quick to believe any rumor they want to be true. Shovel Knight is not getting into Smash and he's not getting an amiibo. Your sources are just messing with you because they know fans want to believe it.
Why would Shovel Knight even make sense? He's been in one game, which is a multiplat. Smash is a Nintendo fighting game, the Japanese call it "Nintendo All-Stars Battle Royale Smash Bros". Some third parties are okay if they've been part of video game history of have some relation to Nintendo (barring Snake). But if Shovel Knight is added they might as well put Crash Bandicoot and Heavy from TF2 in.
Meh. Quote would be a better indie character. Or Curly, I guess. But what about all the other NINTENDO characters that people wanted? I don't know, this is kind of cool, but it's just meh to me.
...Aaaand KRool?
I'm not going to get my hopes up.
@Kaze_Memaryu WTF I didn't know fighting games needed context lmao.
Go outside if you complete everything in smash 4 in 3 or 4 hours because thats literally impossible. Apparently Smash Run and Smash Tour are the exact same as a normal smash battle?!! What the hell are you talking about. Wow Nintendo put characters that have a history with Nintendo is their game!? SHOCK HORROR FIRE BRIMSTONE! "Well um Ice Climbers only had wun gam so they shouldn't bwee inn" Smash is a "Who has the most games contest" now? Ness only has one game too ya know.
I have this strong feeling that you've never played the game since you didn't even bring up stages of the fact that most of the "ripped music" is actually remixed. You must be the reason the Octarians lost the great turf war. ;P
Also Isaac is such an iconic Nintendo character lmao. Must be why they cut his assist trophy
I don't have a problem with smash adding more content and characters, i'm not going to go on a rant and complain at all, but i really REALLY don't think shovel knight deserves a spot. ESPECIALLY if Wolf does not comeback.
Honestly the only 3rd party characters I want to see at this point are either Shantae, Lloyd, or Nightmare. Shante and Lloyd both originated on Nintendo consoles despite going to others later. Nightmare would just be Namco and Nintendo completing the crossover trade with Link in Soul Calibur II.
@XCWarrior I'm with @Grumblevolcano firstly Lego and Skylanders have nothing to do with Nintendo so we can ignore them. Star Fox looks underwhelming as does the Zelda spin off, speaking of which it who's bothered about the Animal Crossing board game? Not keen on another Pokemon spin off either and Yoshi looks a little safe. Fair point with Xenoblade which does look amazing but Super Mario Maker is the stand out and very much the game Littlebigplanet wanted to be, after that though I don't see where the Wii U is going.
The other problem for Star Fox is those of us who own one of the other consoles, Star Wars Battlefront is released a couple of days earlier and I know which looks better.
That would be a pretty big thing. The Shovel Knight game and the franchise would be elevated a lot as the result of an inclusion. And it would only seem logical if Nintendo receives something in return. Could be the beginning of a closer relationship between the two companies.
@IceClimbers Not heard anything about that.
Shovel Knight isn't a bad choice I think, but I'd prefer for the next new character to be Nintendo created like others have posted. It just makes me happy seeing so many classic Nintendo characters battling it out in a single game. That being said, it was only a matter of time before they started including more third party characters. Not that I mind. This is just a rumour right now though, so I won't jump on the bandwagon and believe it is real until it has been officially announced.
@MarioFanatic64 What "strong hints" are there for any of them? This article has no cited sources, and IMDB can be edited by freaking anybody.
Anyway, no, I don't want Shovel Knight in Smash Bros. . He's had one multiplatform game; hardly a "Nintendo All-Star". Why don't we see discussion about NINTENDO CHARACTERS for Smash Bros.?
I reslly want to see how he would look like in 3D but for the rest I don't' care for this character.
@carlos82 Well Mrs. Negative Nancy, I think Star Fox looks great, and certainly think Star Wars Battlefront looks like a game which will only be fully unlocked after you get thorugh all the extra pay walls.
I played the Zelda Tri Force Demo the week of E3, it's good fun and even with 2 people I enver met, we were able to work together well.
People are going to buy Animal crossing, even if you two don't.
Pokemon is a spin off, but again, some people will buy it.
Don't downplay Xenoblade. Anyone who plays it is going to get a lot more game time out of that than they will Super Mario Marker.
I have Mario Maker preordered, but it's like #4 on my most wanted games for the end of the year, behind Star Fox, Xenoblade and even Yokai Watch, b/c that is a new IP and a fresh take on the Pokemon concept. There is probably a reason it outsells POkemon in Japan currently, and Pokemon is selling well.
I think it's time you keep a open mind on the other stuff coming.... cause we are all ignoring good eshop games coming, like Runbow today.
@CrazedCavalier When was the ballot for Nintendo allstars exclusively? Oh yeah it never was...
I'm just really going nuts over their teases about the exclusive Nintendo stuff they're claiming for Shovel Knight. Xbox got Battletoads...I hope we get something really awesome like that.
Let's hope it's a fake rumor.
@NintendoFan64 What's wrong about expecting Nintendo to continue the ir context approach from every previous Smash game? The whole "kid playing with his toys" them just got instantly dropped, turning a neat fantasy escalation into a suspension of disbelief marathon. I don't care how few people cared about Brawl's Story Mode, it was a very good approach at actually establishing a universe - and now it's "whatever, throw in everything".
As for the clones, nothing excuses clones. It doesn't matter what they were originally intended for, they're still clones, or in other words, superficial laziness.
I didn't mention the stages simply because I forgot to write anything, and they're basically the only thing that actually works in favor of expanding the content.
In regards to Game Modes: yes, they work around the Smash formula, but nothing is actually dedicated towards anything. None of these alternate modes change your general combat approach. It's just different frames for the same picture. But both Brawl and Melee broke the general core with the Story/Adventure Mode, which involved progressive levels with platforming, light puzzles, and secrets to discover. That doesn't exist in Smash 4. Nothing even comparably complex, it's all just surface-level gatherings.
The music also doesn't speak for content, either. Bayonetta 2 has a humongous score, but that doesn't change that you can finish it in about 5-10 hours.
The challenges are mostly very easy to finish, so I don't see your point on that at all.
And even if you're going for 100%, Smash 4 still falls behind Brawl. Besides, trophies and music are mostly RNG-dependant, so no amount of skill guarantees anything.
@TeeJay Yes, how dare I say something negative about characters other people like?
@DarthNocturnal The Ballot itself imposed only one limation: one vote per mail address. Nothing else was specifically prohibited. People could vote for literally anything they wanted. Of course, Nintendo pointed out that they must look into what can be realized, but not every Smash fan has an idea of what is realistic and what isn't.
@Kaze_Memaryu 1. Okay, fine. If you liked the idea of Smash having a story, then very well.
2. Do you think that if they didn't put in the "superficial lazyness", they would've been able to put in a brand new, original character? Because the answer to that is this: NO. Even if you got rid of all 6 of Melee's clones (double that of Sm4sh!), you still wouldn't be able to make a new character.
3. So...Smash Run and Smash Tour are the same as a regular match, eh? Alrighty then. Also, they're still things that you can do.
4. Songs are still part of the game.
5. There are more challenges in Sm4sh than in Brawl. Brawl had 128 challenges, and Sm4sh has (counting both versions) 245. I think Sm4sh is gonna take a bit more time to finish than Brawl.
@NintendoFan64 Can you even count? We have reached the pinnacle of cloning in Smash 4 (Dr. Mario, Ganondorf, Lucina, Dark Pit, Roy, Falco, Toon Link - that makes seven, and don't give me the "moves work different" excuse, that was always the point of clones, and can also be applied to Melee). Also, considering how long it took them to actually release Roy, it's very easy to say that they wasted a good amount of resources on just upscaling and minorly tweaking him. During Melee's development cycle, the clones were just flat-out unnecessary, no matter what. But these clones have far-reaching consequences, as Smash 4 shows by continuing the trend in full effect. It's a good example of quantity over quality (with Lucina in particular being a rather lousy waste of a character slot), but the saving grace is that established Nintendo characters are the base of these clones, so fans of the character will be happy nonetheless. It's a twofold safety-plan: new characters are instantly getting hyped for their very existence, and clones get tolerated because the character has enough fans to prevent people from actually noticing how Nintendo didn't even try to make anything different.
Now for Smash Run: I would actually agree that it's a change of pace - but then I remember that no players interact with each other until the maze part is already over, and then it's the usual yet again. And Smash Tour is even lazier, being a randomized board game that has no substance whatsoever. More importantly, the only thing of any actual concern is once more the fights themselves.
And the challenges are a different thing altogether. Counting both games (which have several identical challenges, anyway) is cheap, so lets stick to the one that has more, which is the WiiU version - and it still falls behind Brawl. No matter how you twist and turn it, the idea of replayability through Singleplayer Modes was simply replaced with the Online functionality - not that it changes the gameplay, just the players you have access to.
@Kaze_Memaryu The kid playing with toys thing was never important lol and Brawl dropped it before smash 4 did so your point is. Even so this is a Nintendo fighting game you should never expect some great story and you don't need any reason or context for the characters to be fighting.
'So Nintendo is bad for not bringing back an extremely unpopular mode? (subspace) Shame on them amirite. I won't even waste time on your other points as others have already said it better than I could of.
@Kaze_Memaryu So your not concerned about making sure you have enough fighters or that your stats are up to snuff in smash run? Have you even played the mode?? 7 clones vs 44 original characters doesn't seem so bad to me. Thats obviously quantity over quality. sarcasm How would you know when they started working on Roy? You're making some pretty baseless assumptions lol. Good thing brawl had poopy online and a single player no-one liked lmao.
@Kaze_Memaryu Ok you're a "harsh critic" right? Well then how come all of your complaints about this "crippled" game are BS..
1. You say that most music is ripped when most tracks are actually remixed
2. You mention how bad it is that Nintendo would't bring back a single player like subspace when Nintendo was in the right mind to do so after seeing the huge amount of backlash they got from Brawl's Subspace mode.
3. You bring up the high amount of clones and how most characters have clones when in reality there are only 7 characters compared to the 44 who aren't clones.
You're a great critic LMAO
@Zombo Considering you didn't wanna bother with everything I said, you sure are putting a lot of effort into it. Neat.
But to start things off, who the hell ever said that Smash 4 is crippled? I sure didn't, so that assumption is all yours. Now, for the rest of your "argumentation":
The Story: Maybe it wasn't important to you, but it basically made the game. It provided a narrative and reason to the existence of Master Hand, the figure theme, and how all these characters appear in the same universe without any referential knowledge of their own universe (Shulk never reacts to Metal Face, Ganondorf never gets killed by Link, Mario actually fights Peach head-on, and many more things that normally make no sense at all). And as the series progressed, more elements got added to this narrative - until Tabuu kinda raised questions. Nonetheless, the narrative was thrown out of the window to remove a boundary - that's comparable to burning history books to spread fanfiction.
Also, what is it with people like you constantly excusing Nintendo's unwillingness to put effort into their stories for certain games? They've already shown that they can do this, but I keep hearing this idiotic "Nintendo isn't about story" bull. Does Nintendo have some kind of "who needs story" free pass? It's completely irrelevant who it is, throwing a story away out of convenience is lazy as hell.
Also, you don't seem to play fighting games other than Smash at all, because almost every other fighting game has a story, sometimes even extremely complex ones that give freaking world-spanning RPG's a run for their money, and nobody says "kill the story" - they appreciate and discuss this effort, because it gives the characters, well, character.
Smash Run: Have YOU played it? I won Smash Run multiple times without pressing a single button (except to progress menus), because the AI is unable to actually use modified stats properly, instead suiciding by overshooting, or just being the regular kind of incompetent, anyway. The same applies to Smash Tour - a friend even uses it for cheap farming. Start a Smash Tour with 3 AI opponents, go buy groceries, and when he's back, it's already over, sometimes with him as the winner. The huge RNG factor eliminates any skill requirements, turning it into a full-on lottery.
1. Wrong. Many tracks are straight originals from their respective franchises. See through the music list, and you'll notice it's quite a lot. A good number of remixes was also taken from Brawl.
2. What kind of backlash? People were extremely divisive about Subspace Emissary. Also, it's pretty narrow-minded of you to think Nintendo couldn't do it better this time around. There's always room for improvement, and this game had more than enough potential to improve and expand the story immensely. Instead we got one of the cheapest cop-outs I've ever heard from any Nintendo person ("People were uploading most of the story to YouTube and spoilered stuff to people who willingly clicked onto the videos, so we decided to drop it for the next game", as Sakurai put it).
3. That makes it only even less justifiable to have clones at all. If the roster is already large, why even bother with clones in the first place? No matter how you view it, clones are lazy, period.
@Kaze_Memaryu
"Yeah, 51 characters, none of which have any context whatsoever, instead just being there for the hell of it, while also having several clones among them."
Sorry I'm late.
Isn't that what Smash is all about?? A beautiful mess of random characters beating the crap out of each other. How has it lost it's way exactly? This Shovel Knight amiibo confirmation must make you see red. One step closer to him being in Smash (not confirmed though of course).
@MoonKnight7 From a gameplay standpoint alone, you're absolutely right. But I'm talking about what Super Smash Bros had as a franchise, and how it turned away from that as if it was a bad thing.
But I don't have anything against Shovel Knight in particular, and the amiibo looks surprisingly good (though it helps that Shovel Knight's design is also very simplistic). My issue with this is how Nintendo ignores a vast range of their own characters for indie appeal, which isn't inherently wrong, but still out of place, especially since Shovel Knight has no connection to Nintendo except for being released on WiiU (but only AFTER the Steam release).
I would love to see shovel knight in the game. But how did the game do internationally? I'm wondering because if the game never came out in Japan, or did poorly in Japan, then it will be doubtful we will see him. Because since SSB is developed by Japanese people, it wouldnt make sense for them to add a character that they have never heard of.
@Kaze_Memaryu "As if Smash 4 wasn't already crippled enough from the lack of content" That's when you called the game crippled btw.
Anyway, I would much rather just agree to disagree seeing as almost everything we're arguing about here are just opinions, and its never good to argue about opinions. Oh and I've played tons of fighters other than smash.
So yeah, lets stop
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