Video games are a medium bourne in the white heat of cutting edge technology undergoing incredible advances so it’s understandable that technological prowess has always been highly valued and discussed... but that rate of progress has long since slowed. Very few games today are actually limited in any substantial way by the power available to them. Today it’s far more often budget and the ingenuity of the developers that limits what can be achieved.
With God of War the thing that’s really interesting to me from the reviews is that it’s all in ‘one take’ (the camera pans but never switches to another one). But even that (which explores the boundaries of what a virtual space is) is just a cool trick that isn’t really necessary for the core experience.
The medium is being stretched and moved forwards in a thousand ways but, I feel, aside from graphical prowess it’s clever indies with good ideas that are doing it. Things like Papers Please and Her Story and Minecraft.
You could also make the broader argument that limitations (whether technical or self imposed) are the challenges that actually move the medium forward. How have devs managed to create successful action games on phones without buttons for instance or how have they managed to tell stories without words like Journey.
If Switch were to sell 100 million units (I believe it will sell far more than that) you’ll see some games scale and others deliberately leave it behind but you’ll also still see an ecosystem that pushes the boundaries of the medium in ways that they couldn’t be pushed on the PS4 and XBox One.
Not necessarily better ways or worse but different ones and equally important ones.
In an ideal world, where I had no job, no responsibilities, no friends, and just sat in a room all day playing video games, I would absolutely want the highest power and best graphics possible. Everyone does. Even Switch owners. It's just... we don't live in a world like that. And as a result, other aspects of the experience are weighted with varying degrees of value.
It's not just about portability of the Switch either. The gap between mid-range and high end just continues to shrink to the point where at 1080p even entry level hardware is good enough. So give me 1080p 60fps at high details vs 4K 60fps at ultra if it means a reduced power consumption and having a box under the TV where the fans aren't screaming. Especially given that that also means more money for games and/or a slightly better TV.
Of course as tech improves we will be able to have our cake and eat it too. But at that point 4K/60fps at Ultra will be the low end spec, that'll be what the next generations of Switch will be pushing. What will the high end be offering then? Slightly better lighting? 8K? Nah, consoles will continue to fall further behind the bleeding edge because the end user is going to continue to care less and less about specs. Eventually buying a next generation console will be an impulse buy.
@JaxonH Ah, gotcha, I have kinda limited budget, hm... I'll hunt reviews and ask for more people opinion before plunging myself headfirst. (I can comfortably buy something physical because at least I can resell it, but digital with no easy refund is definitely something I have to recheck around first)
@JaxonH Oh ayyy that's good. Hopefully imported by the sellers over here, otherwise I might just give it a try on PC, refund then buying it proper on Switch XD
@skywake we’re not too far off the point where the ‘OS’ or the ‘entry fee for an ecosystem’ or the ‘manufacturers cost of marketing the system and securing exclusive releases’ (however you want to see it) is the biggest part of the cost of a new console (if it isn’t already).
@StuTwo
I think we're pretty much already at the point in some respects. Consider this, the XBOne S adjusted for inflation costs about as much as the DS Lite did at launch. The Wii at launch in Australia, adjusted for inflation, cost as much as the PS4 Pro does today. Hell, adjusted for inflation you could buy a Switch, XBOne S and a PS4 with change for the RRP of the 60GB PS3 SKU at launch
Ten years ago buying a console was something you kinda had to be into gaming to do. These days I could see someone getting an XBOne S for their new 4K TV with no intention of ever really playing any games. Just as a device that can push out some HDR/4K content.
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The fact it's eShop only, and $20 at that, and $5 with purchase of VC4 at that, gives us insight to their thinking. They don't have much confidence it will sell well. It's entirely possible they don't believe the revenue generated by implementing the localization into this version, paying for ratings in multiple western countries, etc... is worth the cost.
But let's hope you're right. It would be tragic... tragic, if this game wasn't localized on Switch. Seeing DQ Heroes 1/2 still not localized, seeing Nobanuga's Ambition Taishi, which already released on Switch in Japan, get announced for PS4 and PC in the west but not Switch, continues to paint the picture we see where publishers only believe western sales come from non-Nintendo platforms.
I need to get back to learning Japanese. I would be so much happier and stress-free if I had access to every JP Switch game and could understand it. We finally have the greatest console ever created, it's finally here, and their stubbornness and refusal to adapt leaves its full potential recklessly squandered everywhere I look.
In an ideal world, where I had no job, no responsibilities, no friends, and just sat in a room all day playing video games, I would absolutely want the highest power and best graphics possible. Everyone does. Even Switch owners. It's just... we don't live in a world like that. And as a result, other aspects of the experience are weighted with varying degrees of value.
I have a job as a teacher, which comes with a lot of responsibility, a nice group of friends, am usually out and about rather than at home... and I still prefer sitting down in the evening to play a game for an hour.
I know you really like your Switch, but to say that you can only enjoy playing those games with the greatest power and visual fidelity “if you had no job, no responsibility and no friends” is awfully far-fetched.
@JaxonH That deal doesn't sound much different from the Bayonetta strategy. Outside of rare cases (the physical Wii U and Switch versions of the first game were rare), Bayonetta 1 has been digital only on Nintendo systems and gets heavily discounted if you buy Bayonetta 2. Both Bayonetta and Valkyria Chronicles are SEGA franchises.
Capcom straight up said they arent releasing physical games here in the EU because its not financially viable. We've discussed this on PS but you cant even find moderately niche games on store shelves here - or in stock anywhere. Its all the usual sellers so why would a third party release a game here in the UK for the lowest selling system by a mile that doesnt even have its big hitters in most stores?
We're only getting Dark Souls because Nintendo coughed up cash here. Nicalis had to find other partners to publish stuff like TBOI which came months later.
I think its quite evident how some third parties feel about the platform. There is money but its not enough money.
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@Peek-a-boo
I never said I can only enjoy. I said nothing of the sort actually.
What I said was, that would be my preference if I sat around all day and did nothing and went nowhere. But that's not the case and thus it is not my preference.
Of course I can enjoy games only on a TV- that's how I've been playing games for 25 years. I never said I can't enjoy games only on a TV. That would be ridiculous.
But in lieu of my eyes being opened to the freedom offered by playing games on a hybrid system (which doesn't have to be Switch specifically- it could be any hybrid system that had the same features- you show me another hybrid system that can dock to the TV instantaneously and has split controllers with motion and I'll champion that right along side Switch) that is by far the preferable experience.
And all I said was that because this system conforms to my lifestyle so that I can enjoy it more than just 3 hours a night when I'm at home in my bedroom (which I'm often not even in the mood to play video games after a hard days work, so that 3 hours is more like 1 hour), the value that offers far outweighs relatively insignificant value of having slightly higher resolution, or a higher frame rate I can barely even tell the difference between.
So I'm not really quite sure what you were taking offense to with my statement. You can be a teacher and you can prefer to play games at home all you want. That's fine. But for me and for millions of others, theres a better way. An experience that offers a higher degree of enjoyment.
What you do or what you prefer is perfectly fine. Still doesn't change the fact that switch is literally changing the way people view playing video games and it's certainly changed mine. And it is very much true if I had no responsibilities and no job and sat around the house and never left, I would probably prefer playing on Xbox or PS4 just like you do. Because of course I would. The value of switch would be diminished to playing on separate televisions or different rooms in the house, which still has value, perhaps would not outweigh the value of is somewhat higher resolution and frame rate.
But since we do not live in a world like that, other aspects of the experience come into play with varying degrees of value. I don't see what you being a teacher or preferring to sit down and play a game has to do with any of this. You do what you want to do. It still doesn't change the fact that there are other aspects of this experience besides visuals alone that matter to people. It's why 3DS sold 80 million units. It was the value of being able to play a game anywhere superseded the value of visual splendor. It's why any handheld system has sold what it has.
I'm not really sure what you're arguing against. Except to tell me your own personal preference which hey, that's great and all, it doesn't make my statement any less true.
edit
And to further expound on what I've said, let me be clear that when I am actually at home, I do typically prefer playing on the TV. And as such, in an ideal world, I would play the best looking console version at home and the best looking portable version on the go. But the world doesn't work like that. I would need 2 completely separate save files for 2 completely separate copies of every game. And that is actually what I did for many years- PS4 and Vita, Wii U and 3DS. Spend $100, buy 2 versions of the same game, and play one at home and one on the go. When I was really lucky there would be some sort of save transfer tool (Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate, God Eater) or it would be a MP game where saves didn't matter much (Smash Bros 4).
The cost paid for that, both monetarily and in time lost playing 2 separate save files, is incredibly steep. Whereas with 1 single Switch version of a game, I can attain everything (and more) in a single purchase, with a single save file, without clumsy save transfer tools (if the game was even lucky enough to have one). I also attain an HD, console-quality handheld version which can also be played in tabletop, closely resembling home console play, and can play MP on the spot. Mario Kart 8 races with my coworkers, for example. With real controllers in hand.
The only price I have to pay, for all of that, is a marginal compromise with regard to home console quality. A price to be paid, for sure, but a significantly smaller sacrifice for what I get in return versus the previous method. So it's not that I don't prefer sitting down and playing on X1/PS4 at home like you. I do. I'm just like you. But unlike you, I don't see "1080p 60fps instead of 1080p 30fps" being of higher value than "console version + HD handheld version + tabletop version + MP anywhere + motion/touch + instant transition without save transfers".
Again, if I was unemployed like back in my teenage years, and chilled out with my brother all day playing video games at home, then all the value that offers me would be rendered relatively useless. But since my life is rather busy, and my time at home where I'm actually free and in the mood to play a video game is in short supply, a video game console which allows me to both play a 90% as good version at home and anywhere else with features which make it exponentially more enjoyable (motion and MP anywhere, when applicable) simply outweighs the remaining 10%.
Next month, when GPD Win 2 releases, the 2nd hybrid experience will join the Switch. Buy one game on STEAM, play at home as a console game on par with PS4/X1, play on the go as a handheld game on par with Switch. There are some drawbacks, such as playing STEAM games offline being a hassle the first time, no detachable controllers or motion, no MP capabilities, etc... but the core hybrid experience of buying a game once and sharing a single save file at home as a console game and on the go as a handheld game, is intact.
And I couldn't be more excited. For any games that don't come to the Switch, STEAM hybrid approach via "PC on the TV for console play/GPD Win 2 on the go for handheld play" will be the next best thing.
I can still enjoy games tied to a single TV (PS4, X1), just as I can still enjoy games tied to a handheld (3DS, Vita). But it's significantly more limited. PS4/X1 games can only be enjoyed while at home, in my bedroom, when in the mood to play, and 3DS/Vita games can only be enjoyed in sub-HD on a small handheld device with limited button set. All of them can still be enjoyed and if there's a good enough game, I will deal with those drawbacks to experience that game. The problem is, I find myself playing Switch games a lot more than any other console. Even the very best games on PS4, I have a hard time staying interested. Because when I can only play when I'm at home, in my bedroom, and in the mood, I only end up playing a few hours a week. And I ultimately just lose interest and stop playing and move on to something else. This wasn't a problem before Switch released, but now that I have a console attached at the hip, I'll play that when gone, get interested in something else, and then it's a wrap. I forget about the other games I was playing. I played MH World all the way through. But that game was actually good enough to keep me interested even when playing other games on Switch, with limited time each day at home. I still would've preferred it on a system that I could've brought with me and played anywhere. That's the unfortunate reality of all games releasing nowadays. Which is a shame because there's so many good games releasing on other consoles.
@Tsurii Gotta remember businesses are weird. SEGA have been one of the better ones about Switch support and localisation but of course, we need to see more.
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Numbers in brackets are previous positions based on: 14/04/2018 (Unless they haven't moved)
1: Rocket League - £15.04 2: Minecraft: Nintendo Switch Edition - £19.99 3: Football Manager Touch 2018 (NEW) (Up from 4th) - £29.99 4: Stardew Valley (Down from 3rd) - £10.99 5: Arcade Archives: Vs. Super Mario Bros. - £6.29
6: The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim - £49.99 7: Shovel Knight: Treasure Trove (20% OFF) (Up from 9th) - £17.99 (Usually £22.49) 8: Oxenfree (75% OFF) (Up from not charting) - £3.99 (Usually £15.99) 9: Snake Pass (Down from 8th) - £15.99 10: SteamWorld Dig: A Fistful of Dirt (Down from 7th) - £8.99
11: Mario Kart 8 Deluxe (Up from 12th) - £49.99 12: Kirby Star Allies (Down from 11th) - £49.99 13: Don't Starve: Nintendo Switch Edition (NEW) - £17.99 14: Sonic Mania - £15.99 15: ARMS (Down from 10th) - £49.99
So takeaways today, Football Manager is a hit - Skyrim seems to be evergreen right now. Oxenfree shot up out of nowhere, and some indie gems are resurging. Don't Starve showed up too which is good. ARMS will be gone again in a day or two.
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Topic: The Nintendo Switch Thread
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