Topic: So NX Is A Home Console Afterall?

@arronishere: Plenty of people seem eager for Nintendo to go third-party and support e.g. Playstation. By that logic, if the NX could complete with the PS4 and X1 in terms of performance, and if for some reason the installbase would take off, bringing all that vaunted 3rd party support with it, plus all those Nintendo exclusives and polish, why would that be a bad thing?
The problem seems not to be that such a approach cannot work, but that at this point in time, it would be hard to get it going, starting from scratch. The only time being all that unique and "innovative" really worked for them in their history, was that magical Wii-moment, something they have been chasing ever since, with abysmal success.
Also Microsoft tried something like that by being all about entertainment not just games, "snapping" stuff, bundling the kinect in, creating a "unique" framework for entertainment and all that fluffy PR stuff. Unfortunately not even the U.S. managed to find any enthusiams for such experiments, and that system was tailored to that market ... Sony did the exact opposite, and it worked well for them sales wise. Now, Micrsoft been pivoting to the same approach (plus price cuts) for two years now, and they managed something that could soon be considered a comeback of sorts.
If your takeaway here is that only blue ocean strategies can work in terms of consoles (for Nintendo), I'd say that that is a curious conclusion.

There's like 12 months between now and then for them to do that.

After third-party developers have just recently been shown it, meaning they probably wouldn't have any games ready at launch?

Sony began shipping out proper dev kits for the PS4 roughly a year before launch. Shouldn't be much of an issue if Nintendo starts shipping dev kits this month or the next.

And about a month after it most likely is shown at E3?

If it's launching in July/August you can expect a reveal early next year. Like February at the latest.

Okay. But I just don't see it happening that early.

The Nintendo plus 3rd parties argument doesn't work for me, just look at the Gamecube and the DS was huge with it's gimmick. You're also confusing my use of the word different to mean gimmicky, when I mean a different I mean console with a different prupose to the other dedicated hardcore console like the Wii was to the 360 and PS3.

Well think of it is this way...not everything needs to operate around E3. Nintendo already started bucking that trend two years ago when they nixed their live E3 conference.

Come on! Where's your sense of excitement?! This is exciting! Even if this rumor turns out to be not true or not their next home console (or maybe the "console" turns out to be something totally unexpected), at least it's Nintendo up to their old tricks and trying something different or shaking things up.

Also, people need to stop with this whole "18 months isn't long enough to develop a game." That is just factually false. A decent-sized dev team can certainly produce a game in 18 months. That's 1.5 years. And if the architecture is anywhere similar to Wii U, PS4, or Xbox One (in other words, if it's not something completely out in left field), development can (and maybe already has) be started right away. And that's just third parties. Nintendo's probably been hard at work on its own NX titles for awhile now, including the next Zelda.

Sorry still getting used to the existence of the reply button.

No, otherwise companies would just re-release the same system over and over again under new names, and release games exclusively for the "new" platform.

"Software sells hardware" is a mantra that, while accurate to a degree, is often over-applied to the industry. Yes, impressive new games will bring people to your system, but generally, people are steadily less impressed by the ideas possible on a particular set of hardware as time goes on (ideas are used and become old instead of new; think of how Twilight Princess's graphics were received at launch vs. today). So new hardware is brought along to re-impress audiences. Look at the PS4, it literally sold for 1.5 years on the promise of impressive new experiences.

The mantra really better applies within a generation. People looking for a new experience have a choice of system, and game library tends to motivate the purchase of one or the other, or of a second purchase.

I suppose I do mean "better experience"

If the rumour is true and it's a proper console then I expect there will be no more Wii U games after GIR#FE. Releasing that in January 2016 and then console reveal in February.

It wasn't an official announcement. Nintendo has always made a console's official announcement the year BEFORE it launches.

Nintendo really needs to give us a proper name for that game

Zelda U is still coming. Also, didn't Iwata say that they wanted to continue the support for Wii U even after the NX has launched? There's more to come for the Wii U in 2016.

I'll believe it when I see it, even regarding Zelda U still coming to Wii U if the NX is a proper console. If it isn't then Wii U and 3DS will be lasting longer than 2016.

I'm a bit unclear on what you're saying here. Which gimmick was huge on the DS, and how does the Gamecube figure in? Also, I'm completely unclear on your notion of "different purpose", because if you're not talking about a gimmick/feature like motion-control or 2nd-screen, and not about a X1 approach - of a general "entertainment" device (TV, streaming, music, games etc.) - then what are you talking about? ^^

I don't know man, did they ever scrap a system after 4 years, and launched a new one in the midst of the current console cycle? Also, Reggie did basically announce it, obviously they are not ready to show it yet. and make it offical, since they are probably still working on the "finishing touches" so to speak, but anyways, at the risk of repeating myself, I think the key in all of this is time!
They didn't have time for a normal development, production and announcement cycle and outside a small, or to be honest, a friggin huge miracle, a 2017 launch will spell certain doom. Even if they manage to stay more or less competitive, within like 3 years they will face new generation of consoles once more, and what are they going to do then? They are in a really bad spot with this, and every months they loose, is putting them deeper into that hole.
Furthermore, it's not like you need to have 2 years inbetween presentation and launch, neither X1 nor PS4 ahd any such luxury if I recall correctly.

Because it's not a sinking ship. It's a ship that had rough times, that went through troubled water, and some other ships passed it, but it's a ship that shows some extraordinary success and resolve... it's still leading in Japan, its attach rate is magnificent, it has new hits like Splatoon, and a booming and quite amazing amiibo business. It's also profitable. It's not sinking at all, it's doing just fine.

No. The Wii U, AKA "the sinking ship," is not doing "just fine." Please. Listen to reason.

I love my Wii U, as well. I love the games on it. I love it to death, as do you, I can tell. And that's great. But it just didn't take off. And as much as you and a few others around here obstinately refuse to accept time and time again, the video game market IS a COMPETITIVE environment.

And the Wii U fell face-first onto a rock right out of the gate.

It's behind - WAY behind the other competitors, and even if they are turning a profit on the hardware (that they sure aren't selling a whole lot of), the employees and marketing that go into the "sinking ship" behind the scenes are being wasted on a lame horse that may "just be getting by," but isn't doing much else. Nintendo managed to post its first profit in a long time last quarter, but the word "managed" needs to be stressed - as in, just barely. You can't tell me that Nintendo's board is fine with "just barely" posting profits. The Wii U didn't pan out, it isn't contributing much, and Nintendo's investors and most people aside from us want a new piece of hardware.

They have posted a profit the last few quarters, I think you mean for the first year on year rather than quarter.

@Ralek85:
You are assuming their system is only going to be as powerful as the PS4/XB1. If that's the case, releasing it at any point would be a huge mistake. They install base would be so far behind and their momentum so low, that they STILL wouldn't get third party support.

2017 is a 5 year life cycle just like the SNES, Gamecube, and N64. If Sony and Microsoft also follow 5 year lifecycles, their next systems would be out in 2018. So as long as Nintendo is competitive with the NEXT generation of consoles, they should be fine with that.

The Wii U has been making money for a while now. It's just not successful in a "units sold" perspective.

@rallydefault
"It's behind - WAY behind the other competitors."
It would be more accurate to say that it's way behind PS4. Currently, Wii U has sold 9.7 m, with it's closest rival Xbox one dragging at 12.6 m. The gap between 'em ain't that large I think- at least not yet.

@arronishere: The NDS did succeed because of dual-screen?

As for the Gamecube, well aside from the fact, that it was not a DVD player, it's ridiculous to argue it had "3rd party multiplatform support and big name exclusives" when it was competing against the PS2, against which it needs to be compared then. Everyone, and their mom, and her best friend were making games for the PS2 - and owned one. It does not matter if were are talking about an onslaught of niche Japanese RPGs or big budget western games. PS2 was Final Fantasy, Metal Gear Solid, Grand Theft Auto, Gran Turismo, Kindgom Hearts, Dragon Quest and dozens of other huge selling franchise ... were most definitely not on the GC, and most of them were not 1st party either.
The 3rd party support was amazing compared to the WiiU, but crap compared to the PS2, so the argument about the power of a Nintendo console + 3rd party is still neither proven nor disproven either way. But yeah, it was technically the most beefy system out there, not that I can recall Nintendo ever making any big fuss about that, or advertisment, but that could just be my memory ^^

As for your last argument, I would simply say, that the Wii was a singular home console product, it did not happen for them before, and it did not happen for them since. What you are suggesting, is exactly what they have been doing: chasing this moment ever since.
What most people don't seem to get, is how that moment came about, and what changed since. The simple truth is, that the Wii's success is due to games like those:
Wii Fit 2007 22.67 Million
Wii Fit Plus 2009 20.86 Million
Wii Play 2006 28.02 Million
Wii Sports 2006 81.99 Million
Wii Sports Resort 2009 31.89 Million

Some of the biggest sellers on the system. Those were games sold to a bunch of people who did not necessarily previously buy consoles ..... and, this is THE point, don't necessarily do so since that day. One part stuck to Wii, and still plays Wii Fit or Just Dance on that system, since nothing the Wiiu or anyone else does, really makes it worthwhile to upgrade for them (if they even care anymore), the other part went on to play similar games on smartphones, and tablets, and these days on phablets, as well as on any other device.

So .... these people are NOT going to come back, maybe they will buy some Nintendo stuff once they have mobil games out, quite possibly, but that is it. Your advice to chase the "magical Wii moment" of a money printing console, which everyone buys, no matter if a gamer or not, is foolish, since that market is saturated entirely. It's more saturated than the "hardcore" market ...
Basically you are saying Nintendo should make another WiiU, and take another shoot in the dark, hoping to by chance hit the magical unicorn rumored to be still running around out there. Unfortunately, the unicorn went home a long time ago, sitting comfortable before it's TV, with a tablet and an old dusty WiiU under the TV. Nintendo can shoot at the darkness all it wants ... well, until they run out of bullets anyways.

Nintendo failed to seize the parts of the market, that are now seized by Sony and Microsoft. I don't know if there is a way out of it, maybe it should aim to be another "accesible secondary devices", but honestly, what is the WiiU, if not that ... one can only hope it was really just bad advertisement/ PR and the coinciding rise of tablets that screwed the WiiU, as Miyamoto suggested. It's going to be an uphill battle for them no matter what, luckily the Wii and NDS made enough cash for them to take more than two shots at this particular problem!

@iKhan I don't know if the WiiU is making money, that is actually hard to judge. They are not selling it at a loss, and they probably recouped their development costs, but looking at Nintendo having run at a deficit for years after the WiiU launched, if I recall correctly, I doubt anything short of failure is an approriate term. The worst damage of course, is not the financial one and the devaluation of stock, but the loss of image and presence in the consumer market.
Nintendo said repeatedly, that they have no interest in entering the "technological arms race", so frankly, I have no idea if they will make a system more powerful than the current gen of Microsoft and Sony consoles. The PS3 lasted 7 years, and the PS4 will last as long as it possibly can. In fact, we are seeing a profound shift, with the Ps3 still seeing support to this day, so in some terms it will maybe even last 10 years or so, although this year we will see that not next to everything sees a parallel last-gen-current-gen release thingy happening unlike 2014
If they are planning to compete against a Ps5, which might not be around until like 2020, they would have to launch one beefy system I'd say. I think they won't do that, but rather plan for another console after a couple of years, but yeah, that is anyone's guess. More importantly though, they should aim to make it easy to work on and adapt a architecture similar to the other two.

Your point about the SNES, N64 and GC lifetime is well taken, but it's also true, that each of those consoles was a worst performer for them respectively. SNES lost like 12 Mio sales vs the NES, N64 lost 16 Mio sales vs the SNES, and GC lost like 12 Mio sales vs the N64, so there were increasingly good arguments for keeping the cycle short. The WiiU is actually looking more like a N64 in terms of sales for now.
Anyways, there are other factors in play here, than what they have done in the past quarter century. Circumanstances certainly changed quite a bit since then.
To me, the NX still seems like a panic reaction of a kind, and not like a long planned "it was all part of the plan" once-a-decade platform transition. That is just my impression though. On the other hand, if they had planned all along to launch a new console mid-cycle (vis a vis their two competitors), than this was simply a pretty bad plan ^^

@Cia: If you don't count 2 million as a "large" gap, then maybe not. But you're also not taking into account the Wii U had a full extra year... and they are still 2 million behind Xbox One. Ouch. Not good.

@arronishere
Yea, that's what I meant.