I don’t understand the continual need to bring up sales in this topic?
1. The Switch 2 is selling fine.
2. As previously mentioned, as long as it sells enough to receive support, sales shouldn’t really factor too much into the someone’s value of a console.
I also feel there’s a habit here to extrapolate one’s own views of the console as if it’s what the whole market thinks.
I don’t understand the continual need to bring up sales in this topic?
...
I also feel there’s a habit here to extrapolate one’s own views of the console as if it’s what the whole market thinks.
I think trying to avoid doing that is why sales are brought up; sales are basically the only concrete data point we have of how many people decided Switch 2 was 'worth it'. Sure, a few people may have buyer's remorse afterwards, but if they didn't think it was worth it when they bought it, they should re-examine their purchasing habits.
And if I hear tentpole one more time I'm sending y'all to Glastonbury.
Is there a better word? There are lots of big games which aren't necessarily ever-green system sellers so it's convenient to have a word to separate the big sellers from the ginormous sellers.
It's quite sad how much anger there is in this thread. So many worse things happening in the world, and people are fighting over a completely subjective opinion.
You can't avoid sales when discussing whether something is worth it. Being worth it is reflected in demand, which is reflected in sales. They're inextricably linked. We can speculate the reasons but that data is the one concrete metric we have by which to judge.
And be sure of this- it would be used to argue as evidence against it being worth it if the shoe was on the other foot (and, it would be a fair observation if that were the case).
If someone regrets it... Too bad, I guess. Sell it if it's not worth having. Sunk cost fallacy should never be invoked. Or, ya know, keep it and keep buying games for it and just keep complaining about it for the next 10 years. I'm sure that'll help.
Like, imagine buying a product that's supposed to bring you happiness, yet it only disturbs you emotionally to the point of repeatedly coming online, not to share in happiness or excitement, but to compulsively complain about it.
Your quality of life just got slashed in half. If I owned a device that brought me so much unhappiness and discontentment I felt the need to complain about it online for months on end, I wouldn't even care how much I paid for it. I'd throw that hunk of junk in a dumpster and wash my hands of it.
Anything short of that is a contradiction between words and reality. You couldn't pay me to keep a product that caused me that much discontentment.
Psalms 22:16 (1,000 yrs before Christ)
They pierced My hands and feet
Isaiah 53:5 (700 yrs before Christ)
He was pierced for our transgressions
These are two groups of people, although the group that doesn't think it's worth it yet buys it anyway is infinitesimal and not represented in this thread.
That infinitesimal group who thought Switch 2 wasn't worth it but bought it anyways appears to be over-represented on this website (and similar sites) as far as I can tell.
I suspect the number of people who had buyer's remorse is also quite small percentage-wise, though also heavily over-represented on this thread.
And there is definitely a decent overlap in the two categories at least on the Internet. I suspect that is because long time Nintendo fans and game collectors feel some pressure to buy new things even when they don't feel it will be worth it. And, not shockingly, some of them regret it afterwards.
It's quite sad how much anger there is in this thread. So many worse things happening in the world, and people are fighting over a completely subjective opinion.
You might want to check out a current events website/forum/thread instead of one focused on video games?
Why this thread remains so active despite how trivial and foolish it is absolutely baffles me. Just about everyone here is arguing on completely different frameworks of what makes a console worth it to them and trying to impose their own framework on others. Different people in this thread value the worth of the Switch 2 on criteria such as: how much fun they've had with it overall, the amount of 'tentpole' exclusives, the sales of the console and its games in the long run, et cetera. Even when people are in agreement on certain frameworks, the success of the Switch 2 in said framework can vary wildly from person to person. I've had a great experience with the Switch 2, with both the hardware and games (new and old), so I classify it as worth it for me. Other people may find themselves unsatisfied with the hardware and games, and they would be equally justified deeming it not worth it to them. The problem with this thread comes with people using their own framework and subjective opinions of games and the system itself as the de facto value of the Switch 2. All arguments in this thread amount to most of the time is complaining about the previous poster using a different criterion to oneself.
That's not even considering the other circumstances surrounding each individual's experience with the console. For instance, the more disposable income someone has, the easier it is for the console to be worth it. Additionally, people who have many gaming devices may find themselves playing Switch 2 less often, only really playing when there is a tentpole release; those with fewer gaming platforms will get much more time and value out of the console. There are myriad outside factors which may determine the value of a system outside of what I mentioned previously.
All in all, the various debates held in this thread achieve nothing because people are arguing about the value of the Switch 2 in a manner that completely ignores the importance of the individuality of the person playing the Switch 2 in determining its worth. The real question is if the Switch 2 is worth it to you, not to anyone else.
"well it appears I am upside down. what ever will I do?"
Currently Playing: Super Mario Galaxy 2
Nintendo Switch 2 Username: Owlex he/him
@UpsideDownRowlet
It's actually been a fascinating psychological sort of thing.
It was started by a forum member (troll) who joined the same day they created the thread and has since contributed a grand total of 10 posts to this forum, the last of which was blocked and was made almost two months ago.
But you gotta hand it to them: they knew what they were doing when they used the phrase "worth it" in the title, along with no fewer than three tasteful question marks.
Anyway, it's one of those question setups where technically the language appears neutral and the OP can hide behind the good ol' "But I'm just asking a question" defense; but in practice it's a pretty biased springboard for disgruntled people to gather and whine as loudly as possible. I hate the phrase, but it's accurate in this case: it's a dog whistle for people just itching to stir up drama.
Why this thread remains so active despite how trivial and foolish it is absolutely baffles me.
Apparently we're all masochists 😆 Or bored.
Joking aside, there were a half dozen 'complain about Switch 2' threads in the early days of Switch 2 and this is the one which has survived. I feel like the name of the thread should be changed since half of the debates have nothing to do with the title of the thread. A few of those discussions have even been interesting such as discussing game release schedules in general.
It's kind of like the unpopular opinion thread — stick most of the negativity in one spot so that the main Switch 2 thread can be more positive. The unpopular opinion thread is only sometimes negative, but you get my point. I'm not sure if @MrHorse is still active, but if they renamed it 'the Switch 2 debate thread' or 'Switch 2: complain and defend' or something like that, I feel like it would be more accurate.
If MrHorse is gone, a moderator could step in of course... though I doubt they will since it is an organizational issue rather than a moderation one.
Like, imagine buying a product that's supposed to bring you happiness, yet it only disturbs you emotionally to the point of repeatedly coming online, not to share in happiness or excitement, but to compulsively complain about it.
Your quality of life just got slashed in half. If I owned a device that brought me so much unhappiness and discontentment I felt the need to complain about it online for months on end, I wouldn't even care how much I paid for it. I'd throw that hunk of junk in a dumpster and wash my hands of it.
Anything short of that is a contradiction between words and reality. You couldn't pay me to keep a product that caused me that much discontentment.
I don't think it has to be like that at all. I've bought many consoles and have favourites and others I'm less impressed with but still enjoy many games on them. Just because I say the Switch 2 is poor value or the games are poor value or the console is a little underpowered doesn't mean people are not enjoying owning it its just on reflection you can see the issues with the console. I had a great time with the wii u but it was still technically weak console and had poor ports of multi-platform games and when people asked me about it I would openly admit it was weaker than ps3 and 360 in many ways despite being a new console at the time. It doesn't mean I didn't have a whale of a time playing Mario Kart 8 etc.
When I had a PS2 I remember being very disappointed with it overall but still it had many games I really enjoyed. I thought the Gamecube and original Xbox were much better consoles for the type of games I enjoy.
I'm not seeing people that truly hate the Switch 2 I'm seeing people disappointed with pricing, maybe disappointed with performance for some games and disappointed with some of the games which turned out good rather than great in playability. We are right at the beginning though really. In a years time maybe it will be better or maybe it will be worse if pricing of components remains high and sales of Switch 2 decline significantly. All opinions are valid because they are individual opinions and based on that person's criteria which maybe different to mine or yours.
What I find most disappointing with the Switch 2 is the value. The upcoming Super Mario Bros Wonder is a £70 cartridge and it just feels far too much for such a game. It's just the old switch game with minor enhancements. There is much more innovation and value on PC it seems. I just find Nintendo pricing really annoying to be honest. Also multi-platform games are often inferior on Switch and Switch 2 but despite that the most expensive versions.
@skywake
I remember the confusion of the wiiu's reveal, iirc even with those who knew it was a new console were confused by the reveal trailer due to the emphasis on "the new controller" and the console itself just being in the background, it also didnt help that the games shown in said trailer seemed to either be mockups or tech demos, like that NSMB thing they showed.
on the flipside the switch reveal trailer clearly showed what the systems whole deal was, it also feels smart that they saved some detail like some of the joycon features for that japanese showcase thing later on (the one where they revealed a bunch of games) instead focusing on that its a handheld device you can play on your TV and it has a new Mario!
A bit of a ramble i apologize, but just reminiscing about said reveals.
In my humble opinion as a lover of the Switch OLED I personally think the Switch 2 should have not been developed just yet. I think that Nintendo could have done more for the Switch than bringing out the 2 at this point. Of course I have nothing to base my opinion on since I never touched a switch 2.
Atomic77
Nintendo Switch OLED Pokémon Scarlet and Violet Edition Gamer
I did not, at any point, say that new games do not matter. All I've said is that the end user does not care about what "class" of games a game is, which games came from where, how many items there are in a wikipedia list. What they care about is whether or not the gaming hardware can and will continue to deliver games they are interested in playing. And how well it can deliver those games in a way that they wish to play them. That's where the value comes from
There may be some truth to this seeing as how controversies that people discuss on internet forums don't seem to bare out in sales (for example, complaints about the NSMB games rehashes don't seem to have affected that series selling, and Pokemon continues to sell despite being slammed online for being unpolished and lacking content/ambition). But when it comes to old vs. new? No, there's a pretty clear trend there.
For the Wii U the value was shot because it was clear that the platform wasn't going to get long term support. It was also a fairly clunky form and confusing sell to the average end user. First party support was slow out of the gate and third parties dropped support quickly. Then additionally it never got a brand new Zelda, it never got an Animal Crossing. It did have Wii BC so there was a library there sure, including stuff like Animal Crossing and Zelda, but by 2012 gamers had moved on from motion controls SD gaming. Especially if it was behind a clunky sub-menu with no tangible benefits over playing on the original. Ultimately the games weren't really there and there wasn't really much confidence that they ever would be
Fast forward to Switch 2 and, ultimately, the same things are in play. Just in different shapes. Probably most importantly is the fact that Switch as a product is still popular, it's just increasingly looking a bit dated. Both in terms of how the games themselves run but also in terms of a growing anxiety amongst consumers about how much longer the platform will be supported. Both of which put a drag on the Switch's value propsition. The Switch 2 addresses this. Of course it will have, and already does have, those big Switch 2 only games. Bananza, Mario Kart World, presumably something big for the tail end of this year. But it's also getting decent third party support and it has access to the vast Switch catalogue in addition to the continued support for the Switch. Even better, a lot of these Switch games are getting enhanced for the Switch 2. These things, collectively, give it value
So I don't think you're being entirely honest about the Switch 2 and what people are criticizing about it. And there are some vague but non-neglible similarities to the Wii U that are concerning people. First, while the Switch 2 isn't quite the confusing mess the Wii U was in terms of what the hardware offers, the hardware design, lack of new features, and marketing doesn't really convey that it's a new generation. It largely feels like just another Switch. Third party support hasn't quite fallen off a cliff like the Wii U has, but it also hasn't taken off either and is being stymied by the GKC situation and a lack of dev kits. First party support also feels slower compared to the earlier years of the Switch (it's about on par with the later years, but no one really expected that to be the new normal and thought that was the result of the pandemic and working on Switch 2 games behind the scene and expected the output to turn around when the Switch 2 was announced). Look around at what people are saying about the lineup. "Where's 3D Mario?". "Why is Animal Crossing getting a S2E instead of a new game?" "I want 3D Zelda, but sadly it's years away". That's the kind of discourse that's occurring right now. There's people that don't feel that the games are enough. So like the Wii U, the Switch 2 so far has arguably failed to convince people that it has any must-have hardware or software.
As I said, these Switch 2 upgrade packs are frequently pretty high on the top of the eShop charts. As are the Switch 2 Editions. People are clearly buying them. And in any case, if I'm buying a Switch game on the Switch 2 I'm buying a Switch game. Which would be (checks notes) a Switch game and count for the Switch
And I replied, that is not an honest rankings that shows how well the games are doing overall, just what's selling right now. Which you ignored.
In any case, if you want evidence lets continue this obsession with the Switch. If ports and old games are not popular at all and Wii U ports did not matter for the value proposition of the Switch.
Statistical trends are almost never 100%, there's some variance and other factors involved. I highlighted several others of them earlier, such as earlier games outselling later games and 3D games outselling 2D games. Another is just the IP in general, some IPs just seem to have broader appeal than others.
I thought I mentioned this one but apparently not. Now this one is interesting because it defies some of the trends I mentioned. If I had to guess, it's because NSMBU had 4 more years on the market than Wonder. Other potential reasons could be because Wonder was late and people were waiting for Switch 2 and because NSMBU just seems to do well with the casual audience for some reason.
Why did Tropical Freeze and Skyward Sword HD both outsell Pikmin 4, Metroid Dread, ARMS and Echoes of Wisdom?
Another misunderstanding, I did not say that all new games outsell all old games, that's a ludicrous claim and you need to look no further than MK8D to disprove that. But a new game of THE SAME IP almost always outsells an old game for that same IP (not always, you've pointed out several exceptions, but this is largely a trend). You can find numerous examples of old games in highly popular IPs outselling new games in more niche IPs, it's best not to make those comparisons.
Hell, why did Link's Awakening outsell Echoes of Wisdom?
On the surface this seems like another exception, but EoW is a bit difficult to classify because it's somewhere in between a main series 2D game and a 2D spinoff. It's possible that Zelda being the protagonist of EoW may have negatively affected it. It could also be a similar situation to NSMBU Deluxe vs. Wonder where Link's Awakening had more time on the market.
Okay this one is just out there. You're talking about two different consoles that operated under different circumstances. If you pick another set of games, like MK8 vs. MK8D, it becomes obvious why the port outsold the original.
In Skyward Sword's case, the likely factors are that it came out on the tail end of the Wii's lifespan and because the Wii had a more casual audience. But comparing games from different consoles invites factors in the console itself that could affect game sales.
The truth is that sales tend to follow the cycle of the console itself. Games tend to sell better in the middle of the cycle, when interest is at its prak. And naturally games released earlier in the cycle tend to sell better overall because they are available to purchase during that period. You can't buy a game that doesn't exist. And obviously the smaller that peak is for a platform the lower that potential
That's basically the only real pattern that exists. It's why a sequel can do better on a platform with a larger audience. It's also why a port or generally "less new" game can outsell something more interesting that comes later. There's no real "remake penalty" or anything like that. Especially not for evergreen titles and brand new releases
And the hardware is just a means to an end. It's just a way to access games. Which is why on Switch 2 there's not this massive difference in interest between cross-gen games, exclusive games and so on. It's just an improved piece of hardware that has access to games
@skywake They're buying S2Es right now for the same reason that earlier games sell better than later games. They can only buy games that actually exist on the market. It's not much of an accomplish to beat out this lineup of Switch 2 games. Come back in a year or two and see if these S2Es can beat out the likes of Pokemon Gen 10, 3D Mario, Luigi's Mansion 4, or whatever other tentpole games are out that point. Past sales data implies they probably won't.
In my humble opinion as a lover of the Switch OLED I personally think the Switch 2 should have not been developed just yet. I think that Nintendo could have done more for the Switch than bringing out the 2 at this point. Of course I have nothing to base my opinion on since I never touched a switch 2.
The Switch 2 was actually meant to be released much earlier. The T239 chip was purposely designed for the Switch Pro and that was developed back in 2019/2020. The Switch 2 was originally designated the Switch Pro it seems and development kits did get sent out to some developers back then. I'm sure it would have been a slightly different spec. Maybe 8GB of memory, 128GB of storage, maybe a 720p screen but Nintendo cancelled it as the Switch 1 was still selling so well and hugely profitable. Also of course there was covid. So the Switch 2 is a hugely delayed console as it is, perhaps 3 years later than it was planned to come out. The T239 chipset in the Switch 2 is still on a fabrication process from that era which is mainly 10Nm but partly 8Nm. I can't imagine them delaying it much more without having to re-design the chipset etc. The CPU performance is fairly weak in the Switch 2 but hats off to Nvidia their graphic chip has some decent functionality and performs very well thanks to fantastic DLSS AI upscaling. However that does seem to bring some input lag, more input lag than games that don't use DLSS typically. Lets face it they probably couldn't have released it in 2026. I could imagine Nintendo scrapping the launch if they were faced with the cost of RAM and NAND chips today. I feel the time to release the Switch 2 ideally was probably Christmas 2024 about 6 months before they did. That would have given them two Christmases before they hit RAM/NAND hyper-inflation.
The Switch 1 OLED does represent a superior console in many ways, a fantastic display panel, greater portability, longer battery runtime. A decent 1:1 pixel map of 720p Switch 1 games making them clearer compared to standard compatibility mode of Switch 2. I don't think anyone who has a OLED should be too upset if they can't upgrade currently for whatever reason. I found battery runtime annoying with the original launch Switch 1 and Switch 2 seems to be a little worse at 2 hours rather than 2.5 hours and of course the OLED is a minimum of 4.5 hours. It's a world apart in battery runtime combined with its truly fantastic OLED screen are two huge wins for the OLED model.
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Topic: Is The Switch 2 Worth It???
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