Creators Of New Switch Emulator 'Suyu' Hope To Avoid Nintendo's Wrath

They better tread carefully, or they’ll end up in Doug Bowser’s castle.

I hope that you putting it on here will highlight it and get it taken down. fingers crossed.

Is playing games for free worth the legal ramifications that you have seen other people suffer through? Sepnd 50 dollars on a game today, or create an emulator and play it for free, and then pay 50 million later.

Nintendo has been on a a winning streak with crushing these projects out lately, so I am sure it will only be a matter of time. I always wonder what these folks do for a living, because it must be a huge undertaking to keep these emulators updated and communities active.

Glad its being continued

Personally i've got no problem with it as long as people use their own copy of the game to emulate it.

Reminds me of setting up a PSX emulator back in the day with how you used to be on your own with finding a bios 😂

@dew12333 If it gets taken down, another will simply arrive. Love it or hate it, people will keep doing it regardless. Only this time, they will be careful not to repeat Yuzu's mistakes.

I sincerely, truly wish them great success ❤️
Just don't make the same mistakes that Tropic Haze LLC made (i.e. stay off of Patreon).

I give it 11 minutes

Makes me scared that this one gets sued even while being in a safe area and a judge decides in favor of nintendo anyway, opening a terrible precedent for other emulators.

I knew one would pop up right after Yuzu fell. This is basically just Yuzu with a name change and some minor changes. Hopefully they avoid the ninjas where Yuzu can't.

Suyu??? They had to choose a name like that...??? Let's hope it doesn't live up to that meaning as it sounds...

You know the way the colonel talks about Rambo being a mythical killing machine who absolutely destroys anything in his sights? That's how Nintendo talk about their legal team.

@DanijoEX-the-Pierrot It's a name to remind them of what happen to Yuzu probably. They also need to lay low as well cause there's multiple companies out there also named Suyu (pronounced sue-you).

@Vexx234 I know that, with all the demand for getting your games for free I am not surprised either.

So Nintendolife thinks lets writes an article about it so there are more spotlights on them. So Nintendo will try to take them down and then Nintendolife and others can write an article about it.

@JohnnyMind Is what you are describing not 'aiding and abetting?

@dew12333 Johnny is simply pointing out a reality here. Pirates are going to pirate regardless. People are going to make emulators regardless.

Nintendo may have won this battle, but in the process they've inspired others to take on the challenge.

(o_O)
(O_o)
Let's see how this goes.

So not only are they going to not monetise this thing, but they have already spent money on legal advice.

Sounds utterly pointless to me. I can only assume they, wrongly, think accepting donations or advertising revenue will be allowed.

Maybe get your legal advisor to update you on how that will go down when you end up in court...!!!

How about Nintendo coming half way to the consumer and towards game conservation by pledging that once you buy a licence for a Nintendo game, they will see to it that it will be playable on every future platform via official means.
If they'd do that I'm never going to (unofficially) emulate anything Nintendo again. And if Sony would follow suit then I'd never use unofficial means period.
These companies must admit that the main "bad player" in this legal whackamole are they themselves with their anti consumer practices. Offer me good service and I'll go for it.

Yeah, I still don't understand people doing this. Why would you spend your time on this? And claiming it's not for the money? What for then? Fame, celebrity?
To be going to jail and getting big fines, there are easier and quicker ways.

@dew12333 You can play pirated games with both your Nintendo Switch (2017 Edition) and a PC running Yuzu (or forks).
Do you want to ban the Switch console too?
I think it's severely puzzling how some people demand for Big Tech to ban their completely legal means of game preservation and enjoyment of their own, bought software. As an IT person I can assure you how important emulation technology and things like compatibility layers or virtual machines are to technology and, really, civilization as a whole. Legal precidents to criminalize these completely justified usecases are disastrous and should be avoided at all costs

I wish the developers and their legal team the best of luck, thank you for standing up for freedom and against corporate tyranny

sweet! If they wanna do it without making it how yuzu did it, that would be awesome. I dont really have any use for it right now, but a good few years from now when the switch is old and grey, it'll be nice to know ive got a way to play my library on pc

@Yalloo That's my thought too. I don't really know what these projects do in the long run. It's nice for some legacy games that are expensive to get on original hardware (Thinking Project64), but emulating current generation seems harmful for current developers.

I do understand that Switch games are not accessible in many regions, as the reality of import taxes are abhorrent in countries like Mexico. (When relatives come to Canada because things are cheaper, you know it's bad.)

However, I can't say I'm rooting for these folks. I'm sure 'legal advice' also does not mean a legitimate paid aid. And it's safe to say that anyone can interpret 'grey area' advisory to be above a warning of potential repercussions. Enjoy the lawsuit for no gain, I suppose.

The legal gray area of “we’re still stealing your stuff”

cool logo! 👍

There is a fundamental misunderstanding of why Nintendo went after Yuzu. There is another popular Switch emulator that has not been touched by Nintendo. It is fine.

I'm not going to regurgitate it all here as I suspect won't listen anyway. Suffice to say that if Suyu sticks to just emulation it will be absolutely fine and Nintendo are unlikely to go after it.

However, it's fundamental problem as I see it it the underlying code. If, as rumoured, Nintendo gained ownership of the code as part of the legal agreement then it is not open source any more and they WILL and CAN go after Suyu.

If they don't own the code it is not likely they will.

Yuzu wasn't sued because they allowed people to emulate switch games.

@Overzeal That's what they're trying to avoid, all the bits that supposedly directly facilitate stealing software, although that does raise the question: What else would you make an emulator of current hardware for?

I'm all for pirating stuff that's no longer available, if you can't buy it legitimately any more (The inflated secondary market aside, where Nintendo earns nothing anyway), all bets are off, but for current hardware, there can only be one reason to even make an emulator.

@kr0n0tu I do not want there to be any change in the law to take away people's right to do what they like with the product they have purchased. But there are laws in what you can do with what you can do with it when you have modded it.
And please do not use that preservation argument, what gives anyone the right to preserve something because they think it should be? In that case we should all have a copy of every game ever made.

Pretty insane to come out with this so soon after the high-profile closure of Yuzu. I’m sure their alleged legal consultation will be absolutely useless and I anticipate the day it gets taken down.

I like how they say that they consulted "someone with legal experience" and not "an attorney". Lol, they're toast.

@tektite_captain Ah yes, Friendly Neighbour Jim appears with his Coursera legal certificate to save the day. Thanks, Jim!

As a pun-lover, I hereby support its existence. Or at least its name.

@JohnnyMind Thank you for your response. I am in no way trying to attack your opinion.
I just think the modding and hacking community use similar tools to do what they want. A bit like if I made a universal car key to help all the people that get locked out of their car. So because I don't hold any interest in modding I feel we would be better with neither.

All that I wanted to say is… Great game choice on the photo that illustrates this article Zion!

@Taro I remember Virtual Game Station was available for the Mac, where you could just insert the PlayStation disc and play the games through the software. Connectix no longer exists today, it’s owned by Microsoft, whom mainly bought them for their Virtual PC technology that allowed emulated Windows to run on Mac OS Classic and OS X; plus run prior versions of Windows on newer hardware. I remember Connectix had to pull sale of the software due to an injunction from Sony. They won the case, but the damage was done by then and they wound up discontinuing its development. It was a wild time for Mac gaming from 1999-2000, where you could just play ANY PSOne game, regardless if it was legitimate or not.

Can't they wait until Switch is discontinued?

If you want to challenge yourself and create a Switch emulator, chapeau! But don’t distribute it! There is no gray area, you cloned a system that is not yours. Invent something yourself, use your talents positively.

@tameshiyaku That would make too much sense. Remember that corporations don't like doing stuff that make sense. Also you would still use emulation no matter what. Nobody will never not do something they claim they won't do.

The best way for them to stay alive is to STFU and NOT bring any publicity to themselves.

Its simple don't try to make money from this and don't promote piracy.

That name choice is hilarious.

In the words of the late Norm Macdonald: “Now this might strike some viewers as harsh, but I believe everyone involved in this story should die.”

From Gamesradar: [F]ollow the suit, Yuzu also expressed a strong anti-piracy stance, and said that it had "always been against piracy"

Cut to one of the leads having a folder full of ROMS for other developers for ‘testing’

And from Nintendo: “The copyrights of games are valid even if the games are not found on store shelves [or available digitally for purchase,] and using, copying and/or distributing those games is a copyright infringement.”

Oh, you like this game that’s now only resold for hundreds of dollars? PAY THE SCALPERS.

@progx haha I remember that!

Sigh, just emulate older console and games thats not known rather than emulating this gen hardware, the "preversation of games" angle don't work because you can still buy the switch games on physical or eshop 😕

@dew12333 Jesus, dude

I’m sure when the next big Nintendo game inevitably gets leaked they’ll resist the temptation to capitalize on it. Maybe.

Console emulator users who own a copy of the game are probably a really really small percentage of all the people who use console emulators. We all know the rest of the large majority are pirates.

It's easy for emulator creators use that small minority as a stepping stone to claim there is nothing wrong with what they are doing, but we all know it smells like bull poop.

I speak about modern consoles, it's definitely not really the case of old consoles no longer on the market. With modern consoles being emulated and at risk of game piracy, game developers need to lean more on live services shenanigans and microtransactions. We are very lucky that Nintendo first party games don't do that. With taking down emulators like Yuzu, I hope we can continue to get quality titles without live services battle passes and predatory microtransactions.

"Hopes to avoid Nintendo's wrath"? They're bloody inviting it with a name like that.

The Nintendo Ninja team will probably try to shut down the Suyu right after reading this article.
They will feel the wrath of Nintendo Zeus.

They are just begging for the axe lol. The problem with emulators is 95%+ of users are pirating.

Gotta say... the name suyu is brilliant.

@Perpetual_Change Nintendo of America has ZERO to do with this, they are just a PR branch.

This is NCL and they are still very insular.

Lordy, just can’t stop poking the bear can we…… this is why we can’t have nice things. Sheesh

@JohnnyMind Homebrew is a good point. While I'm not a fan of modern emulation for piracy, I do have a collect of N64 homebrew cartridges that I have purchased. This is also not a 'legal' use of Nintendo's properties, although at the time I felt it was innocent as they were new games produced by individuals. In fact, the history of 'home brew' or unlicensed with the NES was also quite extensive, if you look at the Tengen cartridges. It seems that this is an archaic problem for Nintendo in a new format.

The mod point is true too. I like to play Stardew and Skyrim on Switch, and sometimes wish I could mod them. Especially Skyrim, which would do better (during early release crashed frequently) with some of the fan made stability mods. I suppose this sort of happened in the end with anniversary edition, as it runs much better now.

Alas, I suppose what will nail these guys overall is the intent, and whatever potential breach of use is involved with Nintendo products. However, it is possible they can fall into a safe zone, although the Switch being a current hardware makes me not so sure. Things like Project 64 live on because who is going after the N64 anyways?

@dew12333 why on earth would you wish for that? Emulation is the only way to preserve the console's library.

The name is funnily ironic. Guess they know what they're in for, lol.

Nintendo, just what is your problem with Emulators?, It's a virtual instance of the system hardware, their intended use isn't for piracy. Last time i checked, Making a copy of a game you've legally purchased, for personal use within an emulator, is not piracy. The same goes for the console you own, using those encryption keys for use within the emulator, again personal use.
However, i completely agree that It's piracy when these copies are distributed with others. This takes potential sales away from developers.
I for one am not sold on their argument saying that piracy and emulation will likely stifle future creativity, Yeah, you keep telling yourselves that Nintendo, despite the fact they'll be receiving $2.4M from taking down YUZU.

I can only really see good things from emulators, they can also enhance the experience of games, eg: better performance and resolution for games. I didn't need to mention playing online with emulators as i was focusing on Single player games, and using them online would be risky. Accounts could be banned etc.

Other than the 'Piracy' Argument Nintendo always seems to bleat about, I fail to see what their issue is with these Emulators.

I loved the name of this emulator btw, Very sly!
Apologies for the long-ish post.

Sounds awesome! And the name always makes me laugh, which I can't say for other software names.

@norwichred Yuzu was licensed under the GPL, even if Nintendo owns the code and re-licenses it, they only own the future code they develop based upon what they acquired during that time. By law Nintendo has to allow the current Yuzu code to freely exist and be freely modified and distributed as long as those modifications don't infringe on the code that Nintendo develops/owns.

So please explain why would I as a legal owner of a game and legal owner of a console to play said game want to emulate it on PC? So I can mod it? Improve it? But then I’m not playing the original game and the creators’ original vision. I’ve got the console. This I don’t understand. And expecting to be able to play a game on every Nintendo device ever because I once bought the licence is unbelievable. You bought the game. Keep the game. Look after your console and game, and guess what you can play said game. Congratulations. Why won’t my VHS collection play on every AV device ever? Why won’t I always get everything ever and more? Why do business look after their IP? Why do businesses need to make money and not give me stuff for free for ever and ever.

@WheresWaveRace you brought up a few things, but the one about ppl keeping their devices and games is one thats crossed my mind

@WheresWaveRace Not everyone wants to emulate on PC, but it's their choice if they want to. Same with modding, it's subjective. Usually people are content with a more responsive experience. Example: Try playing BoTW or ToTK on original switch hardware, then try it emulated on a PC with much more capable hardware with no performance drops, then try going back to the Switch.
Either way you're playing it how the developer intended it to be played whether you realise it or not.
We're only talking about making a copy of what you've paid for for personal use, it's not the same as expecting something for free from a developer.

Do not monetize or sell emulators in any shape or form. That's the basics of the basics, yet people fail to understand.

Nice to see emulation thriving as usual 👍

@Rozetta

I guess they're gonna end up in Shuntaro Furukawa's minka then.

This edge lord nonsense deserves to be taken down.

Short of being a game developer or perhaps a level-90 technomancer, there's no properly justifiable reason to emulate a fully-available current-gen system.

I suspect this won't end well.

@tameshiyaku this 100%. Making classic games on the Switch, into a subscription service was the biggest disrespect to Nintendo fans. I've already purchased these older games several times in both physical and e-shop forms. Heck, I probably would have begrudgingly purchased them again on Switch.
But I'm sure as hell not paying a subscription to access them. Emulation is fully justified.
I don't even want to purchase new switch games anymore because of Nintendo's behavior over the years.

I feel fortunate to be in a position to not have to pirate. I’m happy to support the developers and the artists who make such great games. Having said that, I personally don’t care if someone of lesser means pirates games they couldn’t otherwise afford. There’s some truly amazing games out there on par with artwork that everyone should get to experience regardless of financial status.

@WheresWaveRace I had already beaten BotW on switch, and then I played it on PC to try out the Linkle mod. It's very cool.
Anyway, there are plenty of reasons. A lot of people have purchased games and just enjoy messing with them or trying them on different hardware etc etc. it's genuinely a hobby that people are clearly passionate about or they wouldn't take the time and effort in the first place.
Some people have blazing top of the line hardware and want to play in 4k with all sorts of effects.
I'm in the opposite end. I like to see de-makes, and how games can be stripped down to play on the weakest hardware possible.

Doesn't matter really matter what grey area they think they're in with the legal system being what it is. Nintendo can take them to court and bury them in legal fees. Worst thing they could have done is make themselves known, and they made that even worse by saying they're continuing the work of the operation that just got shut down so they're really not off to a good start here.

Really is best just to run these things out of Russia, Brazil etc. Away from Nintendo's reach

Suyu "is openly against any suggestions of piracy." What do you think people will do with your emulator?

I'm openly against robbing banks, but here's the combination to the vault.

Um, not worth the risk perhaps eh?

@Mr_Monochrome I'm a combination - I love playing games at all the lowest settings with the highest possible frame rate. I haven't set up BOTW or TOTK on PC yet, but I'm excited to because I want to play at like 640p and 180fps. Today I saw a YouTube video of someone playing TOTK on suyu at 65 to 120fps. Assuming it was real and the frame rate reading was accurate it looked so fun, so beautiful.

These social credit score posts are cracking me up!

I hope Big N takes them down. I pay for all my games, I don't see why someone else should get them for free. I can understand if it's college kids or something, but grown adults with actual income? Gtfo.

@gojiguy What is the necessity of preserving games?

@Omarzy Thank you for the compliment, but I am only a mere mortal.

@Mr_Monochrome but if you’ve already purchased them you don’t need a subscription service because you’ve already got them. Doesn’t the license dictate that you can play the game on a particular console? Not on every machine that the company ever puts out

@its_luke_c It's about being able to play the game in 30 years.
I have every 1st party switch games, and I, my wife and 3 kids all have a switch (I have 2)

But, just like my NES that doesn't work but half the time now, these too will fail, when that happens, without emulation, we are at the whims of Nintendo to continue to provide a way for us to play the games. I don't condone piracy, but at the same time, development of these emulators needs to be done asap to ensure compatibility. Bug reports for a switch emulator (which is in high demand) can get worked through much faster while the system is still out vs 15 years down the road when we are looking at the switch 3, at that time it'd be a little harder to test things.

@dew12333 I doubt this website is on Nintendo's radar at all.

They will be more than aware of the numerous forks of Yuzu.

Good luck. There has to be room for emulation.

@X68000 Suyu is one of the forks. Either way, Nintendo can’t do much about this one other than try and drag out the legal process for as long as possible to make it more expensive for the Suyu developers.

@dew12333 the necessity is that keeping record of what could be important history and culture in the future is a task for us now. Plenty of old consoles are starting to fail, including my own. Sure, they can be fixed, but one by one they will fail again and again and they won’t be fixable or replaceable.

Also, why are you so against the emulator? Piracy is the issue here, and is where Nintendo should crack down. The emulator itself isn’t a problem.

Love it. I have my fair share of legit purchased Switch games, about 112 I think, but I enjoy my pirate collection as well on the Steam Deck.

@Zeebor15 SpongeBob reference?

@N0SEGaming Quack

Ubisoft, Warner and 2K. They drop sales quickly. Sometimes only a month after release MK1 and Arkham Trilogy are already close to half price. Borderlands 3 has already hit that. Makes me wonder how their sales are at launch.