SFANS Provokes the Ire of Indiegogo Backers With Delay and Design Change

Never betray your supporters. This is why I'm always careful about funding stuff like this, since you're basically hoping they do what they say they will.

It's interesting to see what happens with all these crowdfunded accessories that were first to make the news but have since been pushed to the sidelines by companies like Nyko.

"we have researched the customer feedback from Amazon. We also have researched many other Switch™ dock/adapter on Amazon and we found that customer not only need an adapter but also want a dock for Switch"

How about researching your backers needs and asking them for feedback? You know, the ones who made your product possible.Unbelievable!

And this is why I never use Kickstarter.

The Switch does not get hot enough to warp the plastic shell nor the metal chasis...

It's like a lotto ticket.

Except those actually give you a chance to win.

TBH I felt the new design would be better as I believe the Switch doesn't like to be laid on its back whilst running due to heat vents located back there.

Also there are the reports of the Nyko one damaging a few units putting the whole 3rd party dock offerings in question for me.

But yeah, this really is something they should have talked over with the backers before doing. Those requesting refunds should be refunded as their money is now being used for something they did not back.

I’ve yet to actually dock my Switch. I’m pretty much portable only these days and don’t have anyone to play split screen multiplayer with so I don’t dock. That said, I trust Nintendo’s product design well enough to not really care about this product. I can see why some would be upset about this situation obviously, though.

Definitely seems like a possible lawsuit.

Issues here are that right up to the point of Sfans posting their update today - they were telling backers that it would be shipping on 22nd October having been manufactured already. Clearly this is not the case and therefore clear proof that the backers have been lied to.
If a campaign lies to its backers - what does that say about the company? They have your money. They don't have to give it back most likely until a lawsuit came through - a very unlikely event. All that time they can use your money - in this case over $100,000 as they please. . .
It may be they eventually deliver the new dock. It may be that the new dock actually costs less to manufacture per unit and they've spent time re-negotiating manufacturing costs with suppliers.
It may be they've taken your money to the casino and have lost it meanwhile bankrupting their own company legally .
Please understand these are legal and common business practices. .

@justin233 How do you charge it? Did you buy a separate adaptor of just use the cable it came with? Or do you dock it to charge it and I'm misreading you? Or do you use a portable battery?

Sorry for so many questions but we're getting our Switch Friday - according to my pre-order but who knows these days - and I've already purchased 2 plug adaptors and sets of cables, A and C, to make the Switch playable in handheld mode while it's charging at the same time so I'm wondering what other people do. Still looking into car chargers - need to replace my car fuse - and portable batteries.

"We also have researched many other Switch™ dock/adapter on Amazon and we found that customer not only need an adapter but also want a dock for Switch™.

Bad Engrish. Bad sign.

@rjejr I just use the AC adapter that came with the Switch. I can play and charge just fine. The cord isn’t super long, but I have an outlet right by my spot on the couch. I mostly play while the significant other watches TV. I bought a nice padded case to keep the system in when I’m not playing it. The Switch seems slightly fragile to me, so I’m very cautious with keeping it safe considering the soul-crushing loss it would be to me if something happened to it. I lost a Wii with probably a thousand+ dollars worth of software downloaded to it (not to mention many physical games) in a house fire and my heart is still a little broken. I guess no case will save it from fire... hmm... maybe I need a fire proof safe to keep it in.

I only use my Dock as a charging stand. I guess this would be cool as it is less bulky - but the Nintendo one works fine.

@rjejr any portable battery works
any $5-7 USBC cable will charge it when it is plugged in, but depending what you have it plugged into, it might still drain the Switch battery. Apple wall plugs and wall adapters are best, but other ones are also fine.

Overall i spent a total of $12 on Switch accessories and i play it in the car, walking the city and waiting in line at conventions.

@rjejr Any USB-C charger should charge the SWITCH without the dock - This inlcudes portable batteries - However, to get the official SWITCH dock to run - you need the Official Nintendo charger - it handshakes. Thus you can only run an official dock off the mains (240v in my case in the UK). See this video here: https://youtu.be/TNMc6EvkvfU showing a portable Battery that outputs at 240v and can accept the official Nintendo Charger - This battery ran the dock and the Switch for 4:30 on a single charge playing Zelda. .

Never back anything. Problem solved

That new design is bad. Give me the old one and one of those 3DS stands that came with Kid Icarus Uprizing or something instead.

What a bunch of idiots. Kind of amateurish actions I'd expect on an episode of The Apprentice.

Yikes. That's a pretty awful thing to do. This is exactly why I'm never involved in crowdfunding campaigns.

This is why I don't support crowdfunding campaigns cause you never know those makers could potentially back stab you at any time. Bloodstained, Project CARS, Mighty No. 9, Unsung Story, and Yooka-Laylee all proved that crowdfunding promises will never stay faithful. You're basically giving your money to crooks.

@russellohh $12 would be nice. So far I've picked up the $50 GoPro Supercharger for $15 since it's C-C w/ a cable, and a $30 charger for $8 that has A-C and Qualcomm x3. I'll try them both out and probably return one. Waiting on the battery to see how the car charges from the built in USB port. Well I know it won't charge, just need it to play.

@cfgk24 I'm planning on just setting up the dock once and leaving it, not messing around w/ that, just want some power for my kids in handheld mode in the house and car. Preferably that won't fry the system.

@justin233 Thanks for all of that. Sorry about the house fire. I was going to just use the plug it came w/ but since I'll only play on TV and my kids will mostly play in handheld that seemed like too much work constantly moving it back and forth. And we will be in the car and a lot of hotels over the holidays, so I'll need to power it, but I'm leaving the dock at home.

Hey, My comment got put up here. I did pay extra for a stand, and now the stand isn’t even on the product page anymore. Super sketchy.
I found out about Sfans from you guys, NL, so I’m glad you’re keeping up with it.

@rjejr No worries. The memories of the fun times I had with it live on. It mostly sucked because I didn't get any of those discounts for rebuying the VC games on WiiU.

I can see where they're coming from. I personally consult Amazon customer feedback before every important life decision.

So they looked at reviews on Amazon for a dock, yet didn’t ask the very people that have funded the product, absolute scummy move from them...

Those idiots expecting a refund should do a reality check.
It is a indiegogo campaign, your funds are almost a donation.
You back it, you suck it!
Deal with it!

This is exactly why I pass on Kickstarter campaigns. No matter how great the idea seems, they all fall prey to delays & changes with many never shipping at all. I’ll stick to buying products that are available at the time of purchase.

This proves all crowdfunding projects are all scams.

Kickstarting was a good idea, but lately it just lends itself to scams. I hope people can get the dock or their money back.

@mikegamer I hope that’s sarcasm, as it most certainly doesn’t.

HAHA! As I already said months ago, just buy the DIY version for 20€ and be happy. It's ridiculous how SFANS can't do what everyone can do at their homes.

@mikegamer @Supadav03 @nsmon25
Stop spreading this nonsense, you couldn't be further from the truth!
Not all crowdfunding projects are scams. In fact, almost none of them are. Most people who pledge something get what they ordered.
You absolutely can request and get a refund anytime (I've done that twice).
In fact, if a campaign doesn't reach it's funding goal, you automatically get your money back.
Finally, delays and design changes are not specific to crowdfunding campaigns. They happen all the time with any product, especially with tech and IT. It's just part of the process.

@cfgk24 You're in the ballpark, but not quite there... there is no "handshake" between the Nintendo power adapter and the Switch like there is with Lightning cables and iPhones/iPads. The issue is that the dock needs a 15v/2.25amp supply of power to run, otherwise known as a USB-PD (Power Delivery) profile, which counts out most USB power supplies. If you use a USB power adapter that is rated for USB-PD, the dock does indeed function. As far as I know, this is also the case with aftermarket docks.

I am glad that I did not support. Was thinking about last week...

@shani while delays & design changes are common place, they happen BEFORE I pay, not after. So I know exactly what I’m getting before plunk my money down. Plus you know how it goes, people remember the bad more than the good and these bad crowdfunded campaigns tarnish the movement as a whole.

@shani Who said all crowdfunded projects were scams?
Read my comment again!
I clearly state you are running on faith.
It could go well, it could go bad.
But there is no legal obligation to give anybody a refund, so idiots that expect one should do a reality check!

When the money is transferred to the campaign creator (that is just after the project is funded), you have no guarantee of receiving a refund, there is no legal obligation. Who cares what happens before the project was funded? It doesn't apply to this case, or to any case that matters. You learn quite later if the project starts going south.

Just in case: legal mumbo-jumbo https://support.indiegogo.com/hc/en-us/articles/526876-Refunds-Can-I-get-my-money-back-

Aww that sucks, I was hoping this would be a nice addition to my nyko dock when it comes in. oh well.

I actually love the design, and as a consumer I'm glad they're doing this because the Nyko dock was reportedly frying USB-C ports... its all over customer reviews on Amazon and Reddit.

But I would definitely be upset if I backed the project and specifically wanted the older design. Really sucks for those people but for myself, I'll probably end up buying this once it's released, thanks to Nyko screwing the pooch.

It is funny how they prey on unsubstantiated theories floating around the Internet to try to sell their product though, with statements like this:
don’t need to concern your Switch™ will warp in the dock because of heat

@mikegamer
That's some pretty shaky logic to say because one project changed their design that equates to all kickstarter project being scams.

Every now and then there are some controversial projects. But for every controversial project you have 100 that deliver exactly what they say they will. I have backed well over a dozen projects and they have all come through or are in the process of coming through.

@Racthet916 Ah! Interesting - so as long as you can hit those power supply requirements - you can power the dock?

Man...earlier today I was thinking about how I could put one of these to use.

@cfgk24 That's correct. It's worth noting though that non-Nintendo power supplies that will actually power the dock are difficult to find. The issue isn't just whether the power supply can provide enough power, the power supply must support a very specific protocol know as USB-PD (Power Delivery). To make matters even more confusing, power adapters that support Power Delivery only output in USB-C, but not all adapters that only output in USB-C support power delivery. There are so far a couple of companies that are marketing power bundles specifically for the Switch like the one from Bionik Gaming:

https://www.bionikgaming.com/products/rapid-charge-kit

As it is now, I would stick with the official Nintendo product or something like the products from Bionik or Nyko to avoid confusion over compatibility.

This is why I never back Kickstarter projects anymore. Been burned too many times. It does still work as a portable dock so that is something. However is not what backers thought they where getting. Those who want refunds should be given them

Why are the ports on the front? or is the switch the other way around to show them? That wouldn't make any sense at all.

Just requested a refund. I can't believe how they've handled this campaign. Sure, things don't always go smoothly with these things, but to have the audacity to change the entire design on top of the delays is ludicrous.

@nsmon25 The site you just posted details how you can get a refund (and doesn't contain any legal matters at all). So, of course you can get a refund - unless you already got the product. And @Mikegamer said all crowdfunding campaigns were scams.

@Supadav03 Well that's the beauty of crowdfunding, you actually get involved in the whole process instead of being a passive customer who just pays (more) for the finished endproduct.
Also, you pay a much lower price than people who buy the product after the crowdfunding campaign is finished. And you get the product sooner than everyone else.

Besides, even traditional products get delayed all the time and then you have to buy them later.
I happen to be working in the IT sector and delays are normal. They are also normal in every other sector, even with artistic work.
I don't get the whole problem, if you just expect everything to be delayed, there is no disappointment.

@Racthet916 ok - Yes - I like the official Nintendo power supply anyway - it's good quality and I Use it to power my Phone(usb) and MacBook too.
I have one of those chinese Dongle Switch docks - that can be powered by any usb C input. . . I prefer to use the official dock though.

@sjredo USB C is reversible. I would imagine you can dock it in either direction and the way it is docked in the image is just to show the ports. If it is not reversible (because of the shape of the dock or something else), than I agree that it is a bad design.

Wait what? They apparently made over 120,000 Dollars with this? Wow.

@shani No, you can't. Read well. After the money is transferred to the organizer of the campaign, it cannot be refunded. It is transferred early on. And nobody can go against him if he doesn't want to return the money. It has happened before. Many times. I am only telling you so you know the rules of the game, but you should research on your own.

PS: Yet knowing that hasn't stopped me from participating on crowdfundings, it is only that I already go knowing it is a gamble, I try to fund someone doing something that I want done, but still if it fails, I already know what I was getting into.

If you look further into the set of documents from indiegogo you will find the following:

To the campaign owner: "If you’ve raised money by credit card, it can take up to two weeks after your deadline to see funds in your bank account. Intermediary banks, mis-typed account information or missing bank information can all slow down the disbursement process. Don’t commit yourself to writing any checks for at least two weeks after your campaign deadline."

To the backer: "Contributions cannot be refunded by Indiegogo, if any of the following are true: The contribution funds have already been transferred to the campaign owner"

@nsmon25 Yes, and some campaigns just go 'quiet' and are always 'ongoing' - Indiegogo have taken their cut at this point anyway. .

Whether it's a good or bad choice, when you have a lot of backers for your product and suddenly you change it, you're gonna upset people.

And this is yet another reason why I never participate in any campaign like this no matter how appealing it might seem.
My money is too valuable and hard to earn to waste it.

As someone who backs stuff all the time on Kickstarter, I must say this is not a good way to do business. They should issue a refund to everyone who wants one.

I also want a new dock, the Switch gets way too hot otherwise, which cannot be good for it in the long run.

@JaxonH Well with crap like Mighty No. 9, it's kinda hard to trust crowdfunding shrug

@rjejr Well, at least they should have the stones to give people a heads up beforehand.

All the changes are for the better so I don't see any problem. Are you not allowed to get a refund if you don't like the change?

Just wow. I always wonder why people decide to suicide with their companies. The "Dock" already exists in a better, cheaper and easier to obtain version. The original design was what people paid for and now they have the guts to force a other product on the supporter?

This shamble of a mess is why I've never supported any form of pandhanding on kickstarter or the rest. At least KS you're not having your money taken until after. The others they can just take your money immediately and use it to their own whims not being held accountable for changes (dramatic even like this one here) on scummy spots like indiegogo. I feel sorry for the backers, but not entirely as they knew what they were getting into if they read the site faqs on how the money gets used.

If they all get refunds nice, but I'm kind of inclined to believe that cash has been burned through.

@nsmon25 You still don't get it. Those instructions are not the law. You can always get a refund if you don't receive the item that you paid for. At least that's the law in the EU.
Besides, as previously stated, I've already got a refund twice after the campaign was over. Which you would've known if you knew how to 'read well'.
I am only telling you because you obviously haven't done any research...

@shani You are not paying for a product, that is what you don't realize, there are no refunds if you do a donation. You getting lucky because the owner of a crowdfunded project that has no legal obligation to do a refund gave you one anyway doesn't set precedent and is not the commonplace case.
Research the previous instances when this already happened. I am not arguing anymore, do your research, I did mine. I know what I get into, I am not here to convince you.

I took part of this and glad I got a refund because it was becoming such a mess that I couldn't handle it, especially when there were cheaper options online and now they've redesigned it (which admittedly looks good) without telling any of the backers?

For shame, SFANS. For Shame.

@retro_player_22
Care to explain how Playtonic are "crooks"? Yeah, some people thought Yooka-Laylee was lacking in quality, but by all accounts, they did deliver the product they promised (more or less). How does that make them crooks?

@TheGameSquid You may had miss the backstabbing part of my comment. If they aren't crooks then where's the Wii U version? I know they change plan and move on to the Switch but there's still no reason to abandon the platform that was already promise to receive the game which is why they are crooks and you defending their decision ain't changing my opinion cause you may be one of them.