Sonic Team, for the longest time, seems to think that Sonic is all about speed. To be fair that’s what all the marketing for the original games was pushing, but in reality speed in Sonic is a reward for playing well, not the standard staple of each game in the series (in terms of the old school classics, at least).
And so you can probably tell where we’re going with these first impressions. Yes, we’ve played Sonic Forces and yes, it’s just what you’d expect if you're a pessimist. It's a modern Sonic game that disappoints at nearly every turn. We played three different levels with three different characters, namely Modern Sonic, Classic Sonic, and the infamous custom-created Avatar.
The Classic Sonic stage was a boss fight, starting off as very typical and straighforward, and then immediately getting carried away by having Robotnik (no, we're not calling him Eggman) enter a giant mech, which he naturally uses to throw rocks from a great distance. You know, rather than just stamping on the blue blur’s face repeatedly which a giant mech usually lends itself rather well to. For the most part gameplay for this level was fine, although the controls and weight of Sonic felt slightly off. No doubt this is either just your scribe playing too much Sonic the Hedgehog 2 recently or a small error that can easily be resolved before release. On the whole though the boss was relatively boring to fight.
Modern Sonic’s affair is precisely what you’d expect; a cookie-cutter modern Sonic-style course more akin to the ‘mach speed’ sections in the 2006 reboot we daren’t mention by name, although thankfully hitting a wall doesn’t result in a ridiculous and instant death. Run as fast as you can collecting rings if you want, jump every so often and then after a moment stop dead still and kill a group of characterless robotic minions. This kind of gameplay - although perhaps not entirely to everyone's taste - can work, and we’ve seen it do so in games like Sonic Colours, but the entire level felt overly short and had nothing in terms of secrets or hidden paths that we could find, likely because the game kept encouraging us to speed through without taking the time to absorb anything of any detail.
The Avatar’s stage, on the other hand, was even worse. Speed is put on the back burner - which is a good idea in theory - but there’s no speed at all beyond a handful of CPU-controlled manoeuvres that have plagued Sonic games for well over a decade now. Instead you have to use your weapon - the demo we played offered a choice of a flamethrower or an electric-like whip - to swat away foes like wet tissue paper, and each activation of said weapon slows you down, meaning the core mechanic of the Avatars has nothing to do with speed. It feels worryingly similar to Shadow the Hedgehog on the GameCube, which isn't something to be too thrilled about in this writer's opinion.
Plenty are excited for Sonic Forces, thinking that perhaps Sonic Team has learnt - from approving Sonic Mania and just generally being a group of humans who enjoy video games - that substance is far more important than style. Unfortunately the Sonic Forces demo falls down flat in almost every regard. On the Switch it runs like an asthmatic slug through a salt mine (by Sonic standards, of course), and the gameplay is bland and utterly predictable. Developers have proven that Sonic in 3D can work with the likes of Sonic Colours, Sonic Generations, and even the Sonic Adventure series, providing of course you ignore all the levels that aren’t Sonic or Shadow orientated.
It may be unfair to judge Sonic Forces harshly considering that the game’s not even finished, but if this truly is representative of the final game then we have serious reservations. Classic Sonic feels just about fine, although we didn’t get to play anything outside said boss battle. Modern Sonic feels dry and boring, forcing you to take no time to appreciate anything. Finally the Avatar stage feels like an afterthought, as though someone at Sonic Team suddenly had the great idea of letting people insert their own characters into the game (not an inherently bad idea in theory, despite all the jokes) late on in development and some poor sod had to create an entirely new gameplay system to incorporate them.
Nothing feels like it has any focus or passion behind it; it’s more as if it’s a game being pushed out to make money in a hurry, and as soon as something passable for a game is there SEGA is ready to just throw it out, consequences be damned. It’s worrying, and unless the final release manages to pull something out of the hat we’re looking at ‘just another modern Sonic game’, and not in a good way.
Comments 179
Me...interest....ZERO
I'm cautious about this game, but sheesh this article was way too harsh. I would enjoy it because of playing Sonic Colors and Sonic Generations, as they were both good Sonic games. Hope more value comes from the character editor in the final product and clear out any framerate issues on the Switch version.
which is unfortunate because I'd love a GOOD 3D Sonic Game, but I'm not sure it's possible, and I've played a decent amount of them, they feel fun for a level, but they are either TOO on rails or they aren't and then they feel clunky, I'm not sure there is a WIN at least for me. I think the last Sonic game that I enjoyed was Sonic Rush on DS.
"Robotnik (no, we're not calling him Eggman)"
Why not, he's been called Eggman for over a decade now
This article seems unusually... aggressive? The random 'Robotnik' part and the "rather than just stamping on the blue blur’s face repeatedly" part? I dunno, might just be me.
I'm hoping a demo releases for this game so I can try out the gameplay for myself. I've been known to have a higher tolerance for 'bad' games/movies than most people.
A disapointing Sonic game? Ya don't say?
He's been called Eggman forever in the east.
There are two main problems with Sonic games. And the same problems that Alex mentioned here affected Sonic Colors, Unleashed, Lost World and Generations to a huge extent.
1. Automatic Sections.
Automatic sections have no place in platformers, but Sonic games like to force these automated sections down our throats. Sonic 4 was ESPECIALLY guilty of this. Count the amount of boost pads in the entire game a classic Sonic game, and then compare it to a modern level. What was once a satisfying reward just makes me groan.
2. Padding with bad 2D sections!
Yes, 2D sections in modern Sonic games are really really really bad. Much worse than the 3D sections. You can tell they put in so many because the 3D sections are expensive, difficult to make, and time consuming. The current formula simply cannot sustain a full game because of how EXPENSIVE it is to make a solid 3D level that will last long enough for Sonic to travel at high speed, so 2D sections make you grind to a halt and do imprecise platforming. This flaw affects every single Sonic game with the Boost formula, and it was horrible in Lost World.
To be expected, if it had chao's in it I still would have bought it.
We arent allowed anything...are we? Oh well.
Nice passive aggression. Advice for the review: get someone who will actually appreciate the game in some way. Rather than a guy who wants nothing to do with said series.
I'll wait until it's €4.99 in the steam sale in two years time so.
Sonic Mania on Switch is a definite for me. Also just picked up Sonic Racing Transformed (again) and Sonic Generation's (again) on Steam for €4.99 each last night so I think I'll be ok for 3d Sonic for the next while.
Loved Transformed on the WiiU, played it to death. But never finished Generation's on the PS3.
"2006 remake we daren’t mention by name"
Oh you mean Sonic Genesis for the GBA.
Maybe they should completely change the type of game Sonic is.. I dunno perhaps forget about the emphasis on speed entirely - or make the lack of speed central to the overall plot of the title. Make him old with arthritis or have someone steal his shoes or something.
When my educated guess proves relatively correct
Can also be applied to Sega's rush jobs. In all fairness, with the disappointment fans have been through, the do deserve better.
Wow, I was expecting Forces to be a miss but not to this degree. At least we're still getting Mania.
Gutted. Absolutely gutted.
"Nothing feels like it has any focus or passion behind it; it’s more as if it’s a game being pushed out to make money in a hurry, and as soon as something passable for a game is there SEGA is ready to just throw it out, consequences be damned."
That describes most modern Sonic games, and is the philosophy Sega openly stated as a problem that they intended to remedy. A new logo isn't going to fix that.
@BLP_Software Ordinarily I'd agree with you, but Alex is a core Sonic fan and his sentiments represent the overwhelming majority of the long-time Sonic fan base. Only a long time fan can understand what's been going wrong with it and can tell us if it's still going wrong. If he says it's still wrong....there's a fair chance he's right.
So that's how you pronounce your last name.
Sega really hasn't made a great 3D Sonic imo, and a huge part of that is failing to nail the particular Sonic visual style in 3D truly properly, as well as the overall gameplay just being meh.
Sonic Mania, however, looks spot on in pretty much every way imaginable.
"no, we're not calling him Eggman"
Totally agree.
As far as I read, his actual name is supposed to be Robotnik and Sonic only called him Eggman as an insult.
Robotnik is by far the cooler name.
Not really surprised. The game didn't look good when I first saw it, and footage at E3 only reinforced that first impression. How many bad Sonic games are we up to now?
Oh well. At least Sonic Mania looks as delightful as ever. Perhaps Sega should consider hiring the designers behind that game to make new Sonic games going forward. Sonic Team clearly has no idea what it's doing.
@BLP_Software Normally I'd agree - but with the poor poor crap Sega has given us in the form of Sonic over the years, how you can you blame anyone for not giving a review anymore thought than, "Sonic Team hasn't learned its lesson yet, the game is bland VS being '06 bad - HARD PASS"? If they want to put just a little thought in it, then a reviewer should reflect that. Yes it isn't a finished game, but this is a demo for the upcoming holiday release, surely it'd set a tone?
I don't expect very much from this game as well, but I feel like this article was written by some aggressive Genesis era fan. You know, these kind of people who took over Sonic fandom and spitting in the face to everyone who dare to say Adventure games were good.
@Kutal That's what every new-age internet-type gamer says when someone has some honest and harsh, and well-deserved criticisms about whatever game. Modern gamers are often such ponces who don't seem to be able to cope with harsh words coming out of the mouths of journalists, long-time fans, gamers in general, whatever; all they seem to want to see/hear is artificial niceness, politeness and political correctness--which is totally symptomatic of the modern OTT PC "social"-media-tainted age we live in. But the criticisms are often spot-on--and the truth sometimes hurts--so deal with them.
At least Sonic Team is trying to make their games good, unlike Bandai Namco and Camelot with Mario Sports.
I'm still cautiously optimistic for this game, and will inevitably pick it up anyway unless it catastrophically bombs on launch. I would have liked to hear more about the game's performance on switch - gameplay is largely subjective when it comes to Sonic. As far as hidden paths go in the first stage we know already it features the collectable red rings which are usually hard to get and require multiple runs as they're usually on different branches of the stage. While I appreciate this was only a short bash at a demo copy, it feels as though Alex played and wrote about it somewhat reluctantly, as a result the whole article came across very negatively rather than granting a more objective overview of the state of the game, which is a shame really.
I've read other media outlets saying the game is promising, but I'm still rather cautious about it. I did know and read that Forces on the Switch is 30 FPS (which is really bad for a Sonic game) and it has plenty of framerate issues. If anything, I would just get the PS4 version to play the game without any hiccups. But if Sonic Team actually addresses these issues, then I'll get myself the Switch version (Splatoon 2 and Minecraft did improve on graphics over development). But for now, just have to wait for reviews on the Switch version
@Kutal SA2 was probably my favorite Sonic game. Was, being the key word. Time has not been kind to those games, and I would have a hard time recommending anyone play them.On the other hand, Sonic 2/3 are still pretty good today.
He'll always be Robotnik to me.
Wait, Sonic Team STILL has no idea what they're doing? What. A. Surprise.
@Ralizah I'm convinced the problem is Sonic Team is continuously told "Make a big blockbuster hit to rival COD, using Sonic." Instead of "make a great Sonic game" This is the result.
Though I suppose it's only fair. The original Sonic team was told "Make a big blockbuster hit to rival Mario, using Sonic." And all we got out of it was Sonic.
I can't believe these continue to sell. There are too many good games out there for you to waste your time on these.
So 8/10?
Nope still looking forward to it, from what I've seen it still looks like something I've wanted, sorry but this isn't going sway me, Until I hear it from another Sonic reviewer.
Loving the comments were someone said 30fps is bad for Sonic games. Did you play Generations on anytbing but a PC?
e.o?
This preview/review took the wind outta my Sonic Forces sails. I was hoping for an average game at least, but now....
I'll wait till the game comes out and read a bunch more reviews before putting money down on this. Sonic Mania is still a day one purchase for me though.
@Vinny
Not to mention he was always called Eggman in Japan.
I looked in the comments of the video and saw at least 80+ hate comments. People can't take opinions seriously.
(no, we're not calling him Eggman) Sorry but this line alone is enough to ruin the credibility of the article. It comes off like it's written by a classic fan that hates everything Sega has released past that. The Modern Sonic criticism takes it even further. It is balanced out by the Sonic Colors/Generations etc. remarks though.
Anyway lets at least give Sega a chance to polish up (or share more of) the game, those last months can be crucial, and we know how Sonic Team is with deadlines...
@NEStalgia It really feels like Sonic Team has no vision whatsoever for this series. Each new game seems like a chaotic mishmash of different gimmicks and game design elements, like they're throwing everything at the wall and waiting to see what sticks.
If Nintendo is occasionally too conservative with Mario, making games where they just stick with what works (although Mario Odyssey is looking like the most experimental Mario game in ages), then Sega is the opposite with Sonic: they can't seem to find anything that works well (in 3D). Generations kinda-sorta worked, so now Sega is just designing a game that looks like a worse version of that one.
Sonic is a sub mediocre series and always has been. The reason people continue to be disappointed is because they hang onto a mistaken belief that Sonic was ever actually any good.
I enjoy Colors and Adventure 2, as their cringe worthiness somehow crystallises into a sort of demented charm after a few years. They are some of the few games left with those big, wide open blue skies and lush, bright green environments. And the Jap-Pop-Rock soundtrack is occassionally great.
But as games, they suck. Large.
Alex, haven't I seen you frequenting the Sonic Retro forums?
Anyway, you did nail it with the "Sonic is about player skill, not speed" bit at the beginning. Colors and Generations were fun--great, in their own ways--but decidely shallow when compared to the Genesis classics.
I've been cautiously optimistic about Forces, though I've thought from the beginning that the inclusion of Classic Sonic is emblematic of Sonic Team's lack of direction--and this was before they revealed the questionable create-a-character mode.
Still hoping Forces will be at least passable, but I'm hyped to the moon and back for Mania.
Sonic really doesn't work in 3-D. Honestly, I think we all saw this coming, but it's good to know that Mania looks good, at least.
@BLP_Software Is there any reason not to?
grabs phone
rapidly mashes buttons
Hello, Super Special Sonic Search and Smash Squad? I've got a new job for you...
@thesilverbrick Didn't work particularly well in 2D either, let's face it.
Love the old side scrollers, and especially love Adventure 1 and 2. After that, it has been all down hill though. I've felt like I've had very little control over Sonic in games like Unleashed and Colors, yet this looks very simialar to those, red rings and all. I just don't know about this one.
Won't be the first time I'll buy and enjoy a Sonic game a number of other people didn't enjoy. Won't be the last time either. Whatever.
@Dr_Corndog Generations runs at 3pfos and upscaled resolution unless its on PC. Thats a reason to play on PC if 30fps is bad.
@HappyMaskedGuy Well, if we're being honest, I have to agree with you. I do enjoy the old Genesis Sonic games, but even they have not aged all that well, compared to, say, a game like Super Mario World. However, I'm sure we will both agree that the 2D Sonic games were much better than those in recent years and Sega should stick with what works better if they plan on ever changing the series' reputation into something respectable instead of the laughingstock that it has become.
I'm gonna keep an eye on this, at the end of the day it was a very minimal demo, can't jump to much based on that alone.
This just reinforces my opinion that Sonic Mania is the only Sonic game for me this year.
@Vinny Technically he's been called Eggman since the beginning. The Japanese manual of the first game referred to him as Dr. Eggman.
Tbh i take criticism with a pinch of salt these days, especially when some people seem to think that 7 is a bad score, because they forget that opinions differ and one man's 7 can easily be an 8 for somebody else.
I've seen a few TV shows/films that deserved higher than their given score, especially with anime.
I don't play "follow the sheep" i try something for myself to see if i enjoy it, not decide i hate it if others do. Unfotunately that seems to be a theme these days, with some trolls deliberately giving something like a 1 star rating on sites like IMDB.
@Ralizah What doesn't make sense about that is how they can NOT understand how to get it right? I still feel it's management setting targets and not designers with ideas that's the real weight dragging the series down.
I realize part of the problem is Sonic is a platformer, and platformers generally are over with. Rayman managed to stick to the roots and be good. New Super Mario was bland, but technically competent. 3D mario is great, but 3D mario is really a separate designed game not trying to bring the 2D games into 3D but to do their own 3D thing using some of those elements: But look at even Odyssey. They put 2D gaming in a 3D space to keep what works. Sonic games follow none of the above, and just put PIECES of the different elements together. Looking at Lost World it doesn't feel like a game that the designer drafted it out from start to finish and said "this will be a fun game!" It feels like a game that the designers said "Well, Yashino-san said it had to have a, b, and c....those are all in, Hiramatsu-san said it had to have d, e, and f, those are all in.......how are we going to fit the 15 things Nagashi-san said we have to put in...it's not compatible at all with the other systems?!"
@HappyMaskedGuy Advance and Rush games are good.
I just have to disagree. This article seems like a giant hyperbole. The main reason why is because this is literally the only place I've come where someone said anything this bad about the game. Almost every other gaming outlet said the Modern Sonic is just as good as Generations, and Classic Sonic felt just as good as Generations. The most controversial thing was the OC, who everyone seems 50/50 on. I was at E3 this year, and played Sonic Forces on the PS4, and my impressions are a whole 180 from yours. Like you mentioned 06, saying this gameplay reminded you of it, and I had to just cut the video off. And then you started talking about poor performance, which then I read that you played the Switch version which any outlet who played that version, complained about, because it was poorly optimized. If that's the case, then I can see where you are coming from. I understand you are Nintendo Life, and you HAVE to play the Nintendo version of the game, but you should definitely not judge it based on the worst version.
This whole article was just overly aggressive nonsense. I'm still trying to grasp how you said the formula worked and you enjoyed Colors and Generations, but Forces, which is the exact same formula with even better improvements, is comparable to 06. What?
I'll stay optmisitic. I believe it'll be a good game. I BELIEVE!
@impurekind 33/33/33 on this. Sometimes I think this opinion is valid. If there's nothing good about a game (when a reviewer is giving "us" their impression) why should said reviewer "try" to find something nice to say about it? This isn't a junior high art project group critique, this is a product people pay for, made by professionals.
HOWEVER, I do think that a lot of people are harsh on stuff because it doesn't match their personal fan nostalgia, and they just trash on it because their so deep in their own idea of the what the game should be. And then there's others who just trash on stuff harshly because it gets them attention. Some people are so used to those types that viewers start reacting poorly to any harsh reviews.
Sorry NL, I don't believe you. I think you're getting carried away with the current "everything is awful" internet mentality. You played 3 small levels on a preview and already are calling it categorically bad, whereas from where I'm standing, it looks exactly like what I wanted: A new Sonic Generations game. Your headline for the video is even worse. These days a lot of people, specially young children, take previews and reviews from reputable sources at face value, and I think you're jumping too far too soon in the negative.
Also, the avatar gameplay I've seen looks even better than the actual Sonic gameplay, I think you're just expecting something that is not what is intended of the game.
Looks like sonic mania is getting my money.
I don't agree on the part that Sonic Team rushed this out to make money. This game had a very very long development cycle, and Sonic essentially skipped a game in the 25th anniversary simply because Forces was not ready. I think a lack of talent is this issue. Some people try the very hardest and still fail, like poor Waluigi....
Sonic Generations has all those issues, it is just a lot better than most of the other 3D Sonic games and is a lot more polished. And it is a big source for fan service, so in the end it is a pleasant experience for a Sonic fan, but it is not a very good game and it does not approach the speed element in the same playful and deep way old games did, it is mostly a speedfest itself. But I have the feeling that Sonic Forces will not be as good for the fan service material
So what I'm hearing is that it is a decent game, but a bad sonic game.
I would have picked up this game...if Mario Odyssey didn't exist and look 10X better.
I feel sorry for Sega, because Sonic Forces is going to get obliterated by Mario this holiday.
@westman98 Mario Odyssey and Sonic Forces are going for two completely different styles of platformer. But I have to admit Mario has the speed and movement part nailed down better than Sonic has haha
The MOMENT I saw Modern Sonic and Classic Sonic AGAIN + this Custom Hero Character, I KNEW this gave would be total garbage.
I LOVE Sonic but SEGA keep doing that stuff to his games... please SEGA, sell all your IPs to Nintendo and begone from the game industry ASAP.
When was the last time Sega developed a really good game? Like universally loved 9 scores galore game? Game of the year game?
Hopefully the end result is better then the demo
@memoryman3
To me, Mario Odyssey and Sonic Forces are indeed different, as in, one looks far better than the other.
@memoryman3 I'm kind of interested on Nintendo's take on Sonic if they were given control for a game. Nintendo has done a lot of different platformers with varying gameplay styles so I'm curious to see if they'd be able to make a good 3D Sonic game.
Maybe in exchange for SEGA developing another F-Zero game XD
EDIT: I think Volition might be able to do a decent take on Sonic after playing Saints Row 4. Super speed was actually pretty fun in that game (especially since you can also run up walls and across water). It would be a great way to keep the game fast paced when you can simply run up obstacles. With 3D Sonic they might be better off going with a mission based open world style that's a bit more forgiving than 2006 when it comes to maintaining speed and navigating obstacles.
It's robotnik.
Dr Robotnik
Then there is articles like this:
https://www.sonicstadium.org/2017/06/sonic-forces-e3-impressions-jasons-take/
I say like most games, you really should try it for yourself. Especially with games like Sonic where the opinions are far and wide
@BLP_Software Hah. Just realized I made a mistake in my comment. I meant to say, "Is there any reason NOT to?"
Meh. I think people really overestimate the "good" qualities of the original Sonic games. I liked Sonic when I was a kid, but as an adult, I think Sonic has always generally sucked. He was all marketing and zero substance, like Poochie from the Simpsons. From a gameplay perspective, even the best Sonic games feel like crap. The slow parts are frustrating because it's like running and jumping on a thick layer of molasses, the fast parts are a useless gimmick, and neither one feels like you're really in control. To me, Sonic plays like a freight train without tracks to guide his movement. Just my opinion, though.
I'll see how the game turn out before I buy it. If it's worst than Sonic Boom then I may not even bother with it at all.
"Gotta go fast" works great...in 2D.
"Gotta go fast" doesn't work so great in 3D.
I'm still optimistic! I loved what I saw from E3, and now I'm looking forward to this game even more than before! Can't wait to hear more about it, especially the story!
No offense but that "no we're not calling him Eggman" line makes the reviewer look like a Classic Sonic fanboy, which is probably not a good thing. Also, you claim it ran poorly on Switch, yet I saw off-screen footage of that version and it looks like it runs fine minus some drops here and there. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8JwnP9eFo-c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbASYe68UWU
I was honestly more excited for Forces than Mania, because I'm more interested in new directions rather than nostalgic throwbacks. Will still wait on the final review, but this is concerning.
This article seems unusually... aggressive. I thought in the beginning that the author was this guy who always comments negatively (I don't remember his name), but it was not.
@impurekind Same here. The one serious Sonic cartoon, where he was sinister as hell, he was called Robotnick as well. I refused to call the character eggman.
@impurekind whoa, we got an edge-lord here. I agree with what you're saying, but you don't have to come off as rude. There's a difference between PC and rude.
It is disappointing that this seems like it is turning out to be another dud. At least Mania looks good.
I'm not concerned. I enjoyed Sonic Colors and Shadow the Hedgehog, so to me...I don't really get why you're being so pessimistic. Go play Sonic Mania if you want speed so bad! xD
@NowhereMan11 I haven't played those, but I have them somewhere in my collection. Will give them a blast. Thanks for reminding me. The RPG game was meant to be good too wasn't it?
@Cosats - You mean Siglitch Eire or whatever? I find it funny that everyone on this site seems to hate him so much, they added an Ignore button to the comments, mainly just to deal with his crap. And yet, he NEVER leaves! xD
@AlexOlney I think you are going to have to invest in a wig and false nose set to keep yourself safe in public from now until the final release of Forces, but hopefully mania will come to the rescue and cool all the fury
Hello there, lovely pe... oh, wait...
No surprise if this game turns out bad in the end. What else is new with a 3D Sonic game?
When this was announced I'll admit to being a bit curious. It would be nice to play a decent sonic game again. Having said that, reading this preview makes it sound like yet another misstep for Sega's golden boy, it seems to have all the same failings we've seen time and time again.
Meh, still getting it.
@MrYuzhai you do know they had Robotnik steal his shoes back in Sonic Labyrinth (I think it was originally on the Game Gear?) and it was horrible. Robotnik replaced them with shoes that made it so he couldn't run, only walk, and he couldn't jump. So he walked at a snail pace (usually causing the player to run out of time) or could spin dash which the screen couldn't keep up with. Probably best if no one stole his shoes again.
@impurekind excuse me, I've been around since before the first Sonic game and while I greatly enjoyed the original games, the Adventure games (especially 2) were my favorite in the series, and I've met plenty of others who enjoyed them. Doesn't mean I accept poor quality though, honestly this sounds like garbage thus far, especially having sections like Shadow the Hedgehog? (I bought that game and it's one of the few games I actually shelled out money for and regretted, it just... I can't put into words how bad it was.) Seriously, I was hesitant with the customizable avatar in this game but they're giving him WEAPONS? I was hoping this game would be somewhat redeeming but guess I'll stick to Mania...
I really don't understand why people were getting their hopes so high for this game. I never saw anything that made it look like it was changing anything from the past few mediocre Sonic games.
Sad. As someone who hasn't played a Sonic game since the first one on the Game Gear (though I might have played Sonic 2, but can't remember it), I was kind of looking forward to this. Hope they pull it back together.
What the hell is Sega's problem?
@AlexOlney
Sorry Nintendo Life. I think you're lying about this game being bad. I would like to cite your use of qualifiers regarding past Sonic games as evidence of your dishonesty. You say you liked the 2D Sonic games best! You say you liked the 3D Sonic games least!
I can't wait to get the chance to play this game for the first time because I like this game. I have played other video games and I have liked a lot of them and sometimes when I like one game I like another game too.
You, on the other hand, seem to have formed opinions about this game you've played based entirely on other games you've played.
You're buying into the negativity of the internet when you say "Yes, we’ve played Sonic Forces..."
I hate to say it because it's so tired, but this is how we got Trump and Brexit.
@impurekind When they made the change (in Sonic Adventure, I think?) I actually assumed they were making it stupider for Western audiences on purpose. I was shocked to learn it was the opposite many years ago, and it still surprises me.
@HappyMaskedGuy I'll just leave this here 😉:
https://youtu.be/WYDsz1NFBJw
Even I have to admit that this preview comes off as being a little aggressive, which is even more odd considering Alex seems like such a jolly fellow. Was he in a bad mood when he wrote this or what because I am sure he has written about worse games in the past but I don't recall any other preview being like this? Either way if it isn't a good game I guess I will be enjoying Sonic Mania instead, but I will say that I played the Classic level of the Sonic Forces demo at E3 and I thought the game handled very well, not exactly like the Genesis games but it still felt like Sonic.
Ugh. This isn't really a surprise. If you're disappointed by this, what did you expect?
@Jasonmd it has chaos in it, didn't you watch the e3 trailer where shadow, metal sonic, chaos, zavok and infinite appear?
So my takeaway from this is Sega saw Generations did fairly well (compared to most recent games) and thought, "hmm, what about Generations was different than other Sonic games we've been making? Oh, it must be that we have two Sonics, Classic and Modern!" They seemed so certain they figured it out, it's sorta sad...
FYI I'm reserving final judgment for closer to release where hopefully there's a demo (but if not at least reviews), but my hopes aren't high, the second I heard how the avatar segments play my heart sank. Weapons? Really? Sure, I can just slug through those parts, but honestly slugging through the werehog parts in Unleashed was bad enough. They took forever and then the day levels were so short comparatively, so that the result was most of my time was spent in the worse gameplay (that's ignoring the stupid coins needed to unlock more levels, which I wound up short on and had to go back to the day levels to search for them, which was a pain because they seemed to expect you to be at full speed the whole time and stopping to look half the time just got me killed).
@andrew124 I want the cute chao not the amorphous chaos
@Drommajin
Sell all SEGA IP to Nintendo ?
Hmm....
Nintendo will have MaiMai Arcade as well.
I play MaiMai Murasaki from SEGA every weekend at my local Game arcade TimeZone.
@Mainsaile Trump won because the alternative was worse than he was.
Alex seems to have a strong dislike of this game. Could it possibly be because... This game is that bad?
@Jasonmd oh,ok.
Not surprised, it's all about Mania
@Gerbwmu
SEGA was NEVER delivered 9 from 10 score games, even joined with Nintendo. Mario & Sonic at Olympic games still had some issues from gameplay control until replay value. For me, Mario & Sonic games were just Mediocre, not really Wow.
@Anti-Matter What? The Shining, Phantasy Star, Shenmue, Jet Set Radio, Panzer Dragoon, NiGHTS, Rez, and Skies of Arcadia IPs are littered with 9/10 games. That's excluding a lot of other games (and arcade ports that I don't care for).
@HappyMaskedGuy Never played it. Combat didn't appeal to me and I've read the story is on the weaker side + the game is too easy. BioWare did develop it, though, so it's a nice item to collect.
Can we please get someone who actually enjoys the boost games to give their take on this game? Seems like you're just favoring Classic games over Modern games.
IMO, the Classics are overrated. They're not bad by any means, but the whole speed as a reward mechanic really sucks away the fun of this series. Requiring skill to experience the game's major mechanic can really turn people off to a game, because then you have to slog through boring, generic platformer gameplay until you get good at the game and that's not really an encouraging gameplay style, especially for a casual audience. The Modern games have a better setup, the speed is all there right from the start, the challenge is in maintaining the speed. That does a much better job of encouraging people to get good at the game. You get a taste of what it's like to zoom through the levels at high speed, it's just a matter of handling it.
Additionally, the Modern levels are much better designed for speed than the Classic levels.
[sighhhh...]
I thought the president of Sega said they were done making bad games. I thought he said he saw the damage bad games had done to the company, and that if they couldn't make a good game going forward, they wouldn't make it.
Enter Valkyria Revolution.... enter Sonic Forces...
What's going on!!!
@JaxonH if you pay attention throughout the article you can tell just how aggressive it is. It's not even trying to understand the game. It's blantantly clouded in Nostalgia and even contradictory. Even the line "I'm not calling him Eggman" is blantant. Even saying that speed is reward (which is something only classic fans say) discarding the fact that modern games are about flowing with speed as a challenge.
If you look around people are actually looking forward to this game. Saying that it's giving them what they want. A "Generations 2" of sorts.
You are all getting so worked up over a stupid ass video game demo
@SamirMalik
All I know is grew up on Sonic on the Genesis. And loved it. And have hated modern Sonic games for the last 10 years. The game was already questionable... but I trust Alex. He's not the type to hate a game for no reason. In fact, he's probably more forgiving than I am when it comes to modern Sonic games.
@JaxonH It's just a demo not the real game, they are still gonna continue making better games, sonic forces isn't even out yet, what is wrong with you?
I am so going to do a verbal assault on this article
@GamermanReviews
whats wrong with you
Sonic fanboys harassing me because I'm not excited for a mediocre looking game, that a reviewer I trust wholeheartedly is flat out confirming sucks from what he's played. That's what's wrong. If you want to get excited for the game by all means knock yourself out. But don't go taking it personal that others don't share your enthusiasm
Sonic needs to stop relying on 2D sections to carry him in his 3D games. Honestly, my biggest complaint with the 3D Modern era Sonic's (Colours, Generations) is that they're supposedly 3D Sonic games except 80% of the time, 3D Sonic is in a 2D section anyway.
This becomes even more apparent in Generations, where Classic Sonic IS the 2D section which is fine, but then 3D Sonic spends half his time in 2D as well. In Sonic Colours, Sonic spends most of his time in 2D and with Sonic Forces having 3 different characters, two of which will focus on 2D and with Modern Sonic having half of his previewed level in 2D, I'm disappointed.
This year, we have a 2D Sonic game (Mania), which will be awesome. I was expecting Sonic Forces to offer a 3D experience but we haven't had a completely 3D experience for a number of years now. The boost formula is fun, my only issues with it so far has been the slightly clunky feel to Sonic when platforming sections show up.
Sonic's 3D career has been a controversial one at that. There are numerous reasons for this but I have to say it is due to the major differences in playstyles between each 3D Sonic game. Some of Sonic's 3D games come across as Sonic Team throwing idea's at the wall and seeing what works.
Look at Mario for example. Since SM64, Mario's had a pretty consistent move set throughout. The only exception has been in SMS where FLUDD was added to the core moveset and despite SMS still being a good game, it did turn some people away. SMG and with SMO, they're all following a similar moveset with an additional element to the gameplay, an extension if you will, not a forced change.
Sonic's 3D career on the other hand, we have the Adventure series which are often criticised due to the other playable characters. Heroes for the slippery controls and bad dialogue and forced team work, 06 for being a trainwreck, Unleashed due to the forced Warehog, Colours due to the Wisps. Even Generations gets criticism for apparently being boost to win. But throughout his career, there's never been a dedicated moveset or consistent playstyle. Adventure style, slippery Heroes style, Boost formula, 3D games with 2D sections etc. Compare this with the Mega Drive games and the only real change that was added is the Spin Dash.
Sonic Team need to just stick to one formula to stop making the experience so jarring. 2D sections in Generations made sense for Classic Sonic but there's no need for it in Forces. Forces' 'gimmick' could have just been the player character whilst Modern Sonic should have had an entirely 3D section (boost formula is fine) with tighter controls for platforming similar to the Adventure series.
Sorry for the long first post.
@JaxonH Alex says that there's nothing to take in or find.
Yet this video right here shows otherwise.
https://youtu.be/5CbRyCGNU3A
If you really like Alex that much you would be a bit harsher on him for glossing over important things.
(He even says that Sonic Colours is the best Sonic game even though that's just a Mario game in disguise with no flow to it.)
Well at least we have Mania next month. I have complete confidence that it will be a fantastic game, and will be cherished for years to come.
I personally have little to no fond connection with Sonic and even I felt this article was just coming across bitter. Like, get over the fact he is called Eggman. That has literally always been his name and this is a news site. It's obvious you have a lot of feelings about the games and about Sonic but you need to articulate it better because everyone is going to call you out especially when you insult something lots of people love.
@SamirMalik
Look, if the game comes out and is great, then I will have reason to question him in the future. But as of now, I don't. And it wasn't looking all that great to begin with. He more confirmed my existing beliefs than persuade me against it.
Honestly, I saw these signs at E3... I just didn't want to believe it.
Also, Green Hill zone and possibly Chemical Plant? Really? I love it when you bring back classic levels, Sega, but at least bring back different levels. I swear if either Mania or Forces has Sky Sanctuary Zone...
@AlexOlney
I had to add one more thing about the opinions that are slipping into your reviews. An article entitled "First Impressions" should contain just that: facts.
Anything else is misleading and you should not be surprised by how displeased and disoriented your readers become.
Sonic games have never been well made, but they can still be quite a lot of fun. This whole article seems needlessly harsh though.
Whilst this article is vague in the worst places, and too subjective, and should've been an opinion piece - this, and other impressions, further cements the fact Sonic Team just cannot get a 3D game right consistently.
Another point worth mentioning is that the level design seems flat for pretty much almost every character type; whilst this impacts Modern Sonic the least it ruins Classic Sonic and Avatar Stages.
Slippery control aside, the whole thing is a shockingly amateur affair, and should be a wake-up call for Sonic fans - 3D games just don't work well. 2D is the way forward for Sonic.
At least Mania looks good - no; amazing - no; outstanding. Honestly, they should give that team a shot at a 3D Sonic game. They'd probably do better. Give them a decent budget and time (something Sega doesn't give enough of) and I'm sure they'd make a decent product..
This is exactly what I was afraid of.
Well, the trailer did look completely incoherent. I wish the series would go back to the Sonic Adventure mold or the Sonic Advance series. Sonic Mania feels like such a regression with those ugly classic designs. Give them eye colors at least!
Sounds like it could be a title to be avoided. Pity, I enjoyed the first two games. All subsequent games I've played have been more miss than hit for me.
Not to sound like a jerk, but this entire article just seems unfair and nostalgia blinded. I've been with the Sonic series for nearly 20 years and even I think you were going a bit overboard. People want to hear fair criticism, not "It's just another bad modern sonic game." with laughable comparisons (OC's weapon = shadows guns? Really?) and rather poor descriptions, like calling the modern sonic level "Cookie Cutter". What exactly defines "Cookie cutter" anyway? Is emerald hill a cookie cutter stage? It could be considered a newer version of Green hill with different Badniks. Both are opening levels with lush greenery. Another point I don't agree with is the whole " and had nothing in terms of secrets or hidden paths that we could find, likely because the game kept encouraging us to speed through without taking the time to absorb anything of any detail." So you mean like generations, colors, adventure, unleashed, 1, 2, 3, Knuckles, Etc. It takes a few playthrough to find those things, and just like in the games I listed, I doubt you were gonna find them in one or two goes at the level. There's also the issue with him complaining that classic Sonic feels "off". Chances are he feels close to what he did in generations, if the footage I've seen is anything to go by, which I mean, yeah, if you've played a lot of 2 recently no duh he feels off. That's like saying Mario feels off in NSMB after playing World for a week straight. Lastly, Sonic 06 isn't a remake, it's an unholy abomination we keep locked in the basement to ensure it doesn't infect the general populous.
Honestly, while some Sonic games are pretty great (Generations, for instance) SEGA can't make very good 3D Sonic games.
Sonic '06 was bad, Sonic Boom was terrible, Sonic Colors is good from what I've heard, and so on.
I don't care if I'm attacked by Sonic fanboys, I'm stating my own opinion.
I'm looking forward to Sonic Mania, though, even though I'm more of a Mario fan.
@JaxonH I'm not harassing you, look if you don't like the game don't buy it simple as that, seriously you all are getting worked up over a stupid ass video game
@Mr_Valonic You sir have earned my respect
I've never liked a 3D Sonic, beat a few but they were all bad, even the DC Duo.
Sonic, Sonic 2, 3 & Knuckles, Advance 1, Advance 2 and Advance 3 are about it for me with good Sonic games.
@Mr_Valonic for someone who has been a fan for around 20 years, why make the outrageous claim that '06 is an abomination?
-Is it the glitches, which is really common on pretty much every Sonic game?
-Is it the questionable story decisions, which also exists in other Sonic games?
-Frustrating game design? Heroes had that, Riders had that, and ShadowTH definitely had that.
Really what makes 06 more of an abomination than all the other 3D Sonics? I'd like to know.
Sonic 06 might be the worst 3D Sonic but it's not so bad that it can be called "abomination", especially when fans -like me- can enjoy said game just fine.
While it's hard for me to trust reviews like this, (according to this site "Balloon Fight" is a bad game, and I love it) I kinda wish 3D Sonic games would go back to the more "Sonic Adventure" style physics personally. I actually enjoyed spindashing, and jumping around Station Square, and such. I prefer the old floaty feel, as it felt more closer to the older games, then the heavier feel in newer ones.
@AlienX I call it an abomination for a number of reasons. The glitches are well beyond what even sonic is used to, the story is garbage, the game, when not playing as sonic, is unfun (Silver I'm looking at you), boss fights are boring, etc. If you like it, then good. It's great you can enjoy a game I can't. You know what they say: "Different strokes for different folks"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BxqTVY8dlyE&t=25s
I'm not gonna stop posting this link until you all get your heads out of your asses
The game hasn't even released yet. There is still more to be done with the game. Sonic Mania seems great, but when it comes to a new modern era game, everyone says it's going to be average or even bad. Even though the game hasn't released yet, I think that it has potential.
This article feels like a troll comment on a Sonic video. :/ It's reminding me of the dark days of when I got news from Wii U Daily...
Demo = Extremely short version of full game.
If you like the game, that's fine.
All Alex is saying is that he didn't like the game very much because of some issues. Some of which most likely can't be changed or fixed before release.
So your saying it's not that good then . You know I still think Sonic Boom: Rise of Lyric was on the right track to what a modern Sonic game should be. Now I know I'm alone on this as everyone hates the game and I admit it was a glichy mess, but they had the right idea. The big problem with modern Sonic games is speed. You just can't have a character move as fast as Sonic does in a 3D platform game. It just doesn't work. As SEGA has proved time and again.
Sonic Boom slowed the action down and focused on the platforming ( while adding some dedicated speed sections), and it worked great outside of all the glichyness.
They either need to slow Sonic down a bit or, I don't know, just make the games more arcade like and put it on rails or something because the formula for 3D Sonic games just isn't working.
i still don't even understand why half the internet thinks adding a character creator is some kind of unspeakable sin
also yeah, probably should've given this preview writeup to someone who actually likes the idea of a 3d sonic game?
I don't have a problem with "slow" levels in 3D Sonic games, but they have to be designed well. In a game like Shadow the Hedgehog, they just weren't (not that they were perfect in Sonic Adventure 2, but the controls and camera for 3D Sonic games somehow took a nosedive after that, all noticeably worse than Sonic Adventure 2).
That said, are the custom Sonic characters regulated to slow levels, or is that just the demo?
I don't understand how Sonic Team haven't learned from their mistakes yet. Here's hoping there's some redeeming qualities in the final game.
I don't know. Maybe I am just not super critical of Sonic games because I was at E3 and played the Sonic Forces modern sonic demo. And I have to say I quite liked it. Yes it does control different to what I expected, but I had fun and that is what counts. I will see if the full game is worth a look though. Another taste of the demo would sell me on the game.
]
@LArachelDisciple People like the Sonic Adventure games because they were high budget games for the era when they were made. After Sega left the hardware market, Sonic games sales went lower and lower and same goes for the budget. The Sonic team survived to these days because Nintendo gave them work with all the Mario and Sonic at the Olympic games.
@itzdanburton I'm so glad someone got it.
People horrified by the tone of the article need to take a chill pill. Not every game is a masterpiece. In fact I find it quite refreshing that a preview is so frank about a future game's misgivings as all too often even bad games are given decent previews, laced with "cautious optimism".
Your Article is too harsch and contains double standard views in my Opinion.
For Example: You said that the Modern Sonic stage feels try and boring and is "forcing you to take no time to appreciate anything".
However, earlier you said that beeing fast IS the reward in Sonic games because you can only be fast without hitting walls if you are good. My question to you is: Then what do you WANT from a sonic game?
I want from a sonic game that it is fast, has an amazing Soundtrack and solid gameplay. To me Sonic forces offers exactly that.
I highly doubt that the game "forces" you to run because then it would be an infinite runner game.
Sorry Alex, I think you messed up.
Outside of the refreshing exception of "Lost World," I've accepted that Sega will just keep using the lame semi on rails, boost to win 3D gameplay system that they've been touting since "Unleashed." It's not that bad (much better than "Secret Rings," at least) but still pretty lousy compared to the Sonic and Shadow levels in the "Adventure" duology, which in my opinion is 3D Sonic done right. If the classic 2D Sonic levels are really good (meaning much better than the imprcise mess in "Colors" or the lousy physics in "Sonic 4"), then this could still be a game worth getting.
It's the complaints about the avatar levels that worry me, though. They could very well drag down the whole game. Hopefully, they'll at least be decent mindless fun like the Werehog levels of "Unleashed" and not a total chore to get through like the Big the Cat fishing levels in "Adventure."
@96OopAmgems The idea is for Sonic gameplay to have high-speed sections as well as slower sections of more precise platforming, as well as the ability to do some minor level exploration rather than being practically on rails the whole time.
Hey look, it's my old friend bias!
@electrolite77 Funny joke.
That was kinda expected.
@Kalmaro
Hahahahahahaha.
Btw his real and Original name is Eggman
@impurekind his real name was always Eggman, read the Jap Sonic 1 manuals
@deucezulu22 that cartoon is noncanon friend
@ShadJV they're weapons powered by the alien wisps from Sonic Colors, called Wispons
https://youtu.be/bw-klI_Na7M
I will also leave this here
@SANICBOOM644 And? That's what I grew up with, that's what I'm sticking too.
I've learned my lesson - I'm staying the heck away from this game. I'll buy Sonic Mania though since Sonic Team is not making it.
@bitleman That budget led to great stories and a variety of fun gameplay modes, so naturally I enjoyed them.
@AlexOlney Seeing the comments on the YouTube video's page just make me sad, so I can only imagine what it's like on your end. It'll never cease to amaze me that the people complaining that you've judged it too harshly too soon are also the same ones who have never played it at all, and therefore base their opinions on nothing. The logic there is hilarious.
I love how people are screaming bais and then say that a modern sonic fan should have reviewed it.
Its not like someone who shares the same opinion than you can have bais too right???!!?!!?
Crazy Talk, I Know
@GamermanReviews Self promotion is against the rules, you should probably take that link down before a mod finds it.
i'm not suprised all new sonic games suck since the ds and wii era.sonic just isnt able to make good games anymore and to be frank or in my case detective dan sonic mania looked like a bland copy of good sonic games with few extra fetures.so its official sonic is dead forevermore
@Kalmaro I'm sorry, but how is a women who deleted her emails worse than an idiotic racist sexist bigoted pig? Please, let's discuss politics on Nintendolife.com
@The8BitLego I don't think a modern sonic fan should have reviewed it, I think someone who has no strong preference either way should have.
when more than half of sonic games are bad, why do people still think it's unlikely that the next one will be bad? what would you expect from mario odyssey if his previous adventures included mario 06, mario rise of lyric and mario and the secret rings?
today's sonic isn't his old good games. he is a delivery system for the grotesque work ethic of a company that has been managed laughably badly for decades and that deserves to die. and i love sonic 2 as much as the next guy.
@Pac-Fan Google "bengazi scandal".
This place is not the best to discuss politics, but know that Clinton did a lot more than delete some emails.
*It may be unfair to judge Sonic Forces harshly considering that the game’s not even finished, *
Sega has a track record of releasing major Sonic games for the holiday season regardless of the state of the game. I'm also perplexed why after struggling to come up with good Sonic gameplay style.
Sonic Team keep putting multiple play styles characters in their games rather than refining 3D Sonic gameplay. We're supposed to expect them to polish 3D Sonic, 2D Sonic and another action orientated 3D Avatar gameplay all in the same game?
I think it's wise to be wary of the quality before the release.
But isn't bad supposed to mean good?!
in all seriousness, this is about what I expected. Sonic Mania is the game to get if you're a Sonic fan.
Going on a rant for a moment, I'm convinced Sonic Team has no idea what to do with Sonic. Every game they've touched has been hot crap. Generations and Colors being good must have been some kind of fluke, cause every game after has certainly not been good. One of the blatant issues facing Sonic games is that Sonic Team as a developer beats anything I have ever seen in my entire gaming life, which is nearing 30 years. Most devs will learn from mistakes and employ new ideas to fix said mistakes. Not Sonic Team! These guys have been making the exact same mistakes since Sonic Heroes. Buggy, borderline unplayable sections, too much emphasis on speed at the expense of level design, horrible gimmicks, and an obsession with putting new characters in the spotlight. Sonic Forces seems to nail all of Sonic Team's usual flaws. You'd think by now they'd come back to Earth, but nope. Sonic Team will continue to make bad games for as long as they continue to ignore their past mistakes.
@Mr_Valonic Thats what I said.
Such a coward...the fact that you unlisted your "video" after many top comments gave you pure constructive criticism shooting all your non-existent "points" which you disabled acting like "nothing happened" show you can't man up to making a pure hate video for clicks and apologizing for spreading hate and not giving no points at all the ratio of the video speaks pure volumes of your entire video in a nutshell.....
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