An area of confusion popped up within the comments section of an article related to The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild a while ago, centred primarily around the use of the GamePad and whether it features a dynamic map as expected. One of our E3 previewers had, in the hubbub of the show floor, thought there was a map, and watching the Treehouse streams it was possible to miss the fact that the map was actually only present in pause menus.
In any case, it was a topic that evidently mattered to plenty of players, and came up in our "Tell Us What to Do" article ahead of our recent trip to try the game once again in the UK. Having played it and asked staff at Nintendo HQ our final impression does tie in with what was being said at E3 - the dynamic map is absent and the touchscreen is redundant. That's certainly the case in this demo, in any case.
The GamePad's screen has two options in the demo - by default it shows a button controls cheat-sheet, which is logical for builds such as this, though we'd be surprised if it's present in its current form in the final game. Alternatively it can be switched to mirror the TV screen - the confusion can arise as it can be instinctive to look to the map when it's on the GamePad screen, not least because of its presence along with the touch-based user interfaces in The Wind Waker HD and Twilight Princess HD; but ultimately the key detail is that, right now, the GamePad does not display a standalone dynamic map.
Notably, not only is the game's map part of the sub-menus, but some other aspects have shifted to a mix of button inputs. In part this can attributed to the new loop of collecting and looting items that include breakable weapons, shields, and so on. But accessing either the full inventory or quick-select on-screen menus is done with a mix of Select, the D-Pad and the right analogue stick, with the D-Pad and right stick combining for on-the-fly switches of weapons and shields. It's a version of a system often seen in adventure and FPS games on PS4 / Xbox One / PC, but may feel unfamiliar for those accustomed to tapping a GamePad screen for the same results. The controls in general, including these item select options, can take some getting used to if you have previous Legend of Zelda control schemes embedded in your mind.
So, ultimately, the various physical inputs of the GamePad are being put to plenty of work, along with Splatoon-style motion-based adjustments while aiming a bow and arrow, for example. It's intriguing to see the touch screen ignored though, and perhaps telling - Paper Mario: Color Splash makes extensive use of the GamePad touchscreen, but that's not a title that's currently pegged for a dual release on NX; as it stands it's an out-and-out Wii U game. We asked Nintendo UK staff about the situation with the GamePad, but they couldn't - or wouldn't, potentially - go beyond saying that the only builds available at present don't include a separate map for the GamePad.
Of course, things can change in final builds so we'll see how it develops. In light of comments from Shigeru Miyamoto and Eiji Aonuma the Wii U and NX versions will be largely the same experience, with Aonuma-san in particular emphasising that he considered a separate GamePad display and related features as a distraction. It raises interesting questions around the format of the NX hardware and its controls - the Wii U iteration, in its current demo guise, points to a single screen approach.
So there you have it. You asked, we checked, and the reality aligns with many of the impressions and developer comments coming out of E3. Perhaps the era of dual-screen gaming and dynamic second-screen maps and inventories is coming to an end. Ultimately we'll need to wait until Nintendo reveals more and / or releases the final game to see the final picture.
So the game needs every ounce of power the Wii U has and the system can't really render anything separate on the game pad is what I'm hearing.
Too bad. I liked the use of the GamePad in the huge open world game that is Xenoblade Chronicles X.
@A01 Not really, it points more towards it has cut the gamepad's use as it'll be inline with the NX version.
Really hope the gamepad works on NX as an extra!!
Or/and you can use a phone or tablet for the maps and menu stuff!!
Really does sound like what @rjejr said, the Wii U version has been nerfed to make the NX seem more appealing.
You assume the NX will not have a screen on its controller.
@A01 I feel like a simple map wouldn't require that much extra processing.
A01, I'm so glad you pointed this out because it seems logical. Up until seeing this comment, I had assumed the only reason would be the NX not having a screen but this actually makes more sense.
@A01 If it did, after the lack of success the Wii U and its GamePad garnered the last 4 years, Nintendo would be shooting themselves in the foot. To, what, appease maybe 11 million fans of the Wii U, tops?
To me this is clearly a sign that the NX controller will have motion controls but not a screen. I'm fine with that. As @A01 suggested, more power can be put toward the game.
@Grumblevolcano From all reports stating that this is both the most ambitious and most beautiful game ever released on Wii U, it is safe to say it is not gimped for the sake of it.
And they still have some frame rate, LOV and pop-in issues to address, so it seems to me that it is clearly a hardware resource problem, making streaming a continuous map to the GamePad a little bit too much for the CPU/GPU.
I think it would be nice to have an option in there for any Wii U owners at least to be able to select to view the map on the GamePad's screen if that's what they'd like. I like that you don't have to, but I don't see any negative in having it as another option. I mean, they basically had it done already, so why not just keep it in there as and option? I'm not particularly bothered that it's not there though, but would be cool if you could drawn on the map and stuff like the one in Phantom Hourglass on DS; I really liked that.
Well it would be awfully difficult for the NX to be a hybrid without a screen as part of the controller. If that hybrid rumour turns out to be true.
There are also a few games that make excellent use of the game pad. I don't know about you, but I'd love another Mario Maker on the NX and I sure as hell don't want to use anything other than a touchscreen to design those levels. They could have a companion app for tablets that does that though I guess. We'll see.
There's also the free-form screen concept that Nintendo have patented. If they have plans to use that technology, it could be for the NX.
@Kirk I will never understand why Nintendo cuts logical options off in their games and just give you what THEY think you would like the best, like if everybody was the same or liked the same things. For instance, Donkey Kong Country Returns (pointless shaking), Super Mario Galaxy (pointless shaking), Star Fox Zero (just one controller for single player with motion controls)... I remember when Nintendo made New Super Mario Bros. U and other Wii U games compatible with the pro controller months after launch, like it was something they had to think much about. What the...?
@ThanosReXXX Ha, so I was right in the end. I want to quote your friend too but I don't remember his name... The one who said I could not say if the GamePad presented or not a "special" use for this game.
@JaxonH was right, too.
I don't think I'll miss having the map on the gamepad. I usually end up pausing the game to look at it anyway. The touch controls I will miss. It's so nice to be able to select something by tapping on the screen rather than have to scroll through a menu. It's certainly not a deal breaker for me though. I won't be upset if there's not map feature in Breath of the Wild. If that's the worst thing about the game then it should be great.
What I hear is we've scrapped any gamepad use because we don't want the NX version to be seen as inferior in any way to the Wii U version. And of course the NX is where we're at now.
@ThomasBW84 Congratulations for being critical when you have to, one of the reasons why this website makes sense (compared to other websites ahem Sammy ahem). That's also why I like PureXbox (which sadly is coming to an end).
Hey guys, please don't forget about Maiden of Black Water when you're talking about the games that made the best use of the Gamepad's features. In Project Zero/Fatal Frame the GamePad becomes a real camera in an almost-virtual world.
No NX GamePad confirmed.
One thing I came to realize, especially in the Wii U Zelda remasters, was the longer I played, the less I would opt for the GamePad and instead just grab a Pro Controller.
For a multitude of reasons too. Battery life (GP all the way across the room on a charging stand all the time), second screen inventory management became too distracting (i like to pause my adventure when managing inventory), controller size and comfort (Pro controller is literally hands down the best controller I've gamed on) and the list goes on and on.
This decision, if it remains final, is a no brainer to me.
The screen really isn't the problem. Long play sessions with such a poor battery life means this game should include an extra, better battery just in case. I can imagine myself constantly plugging the AC charger while trying to complete dungeons before the gamepad dies. Considering the fact we probably won't get a Pro Controller support due to "you have to experience the gamepad functionality" design choices Nintendo loves to make.
Sitting near a wall outlet will be mandatory for Breath of the Wild.
@rushiosan Thing is, Pro controller is very much supported in the new Zelda game.
From the way Link picks up the Sheikah Slate in the beginning sequence, it feels that it originally may have tied into the gamepad.
so it could mean that the NX will not be using a controller with a game pad
not surprising really after all Nintendo has had a different controller for EVERY Home console
We can't even get a map it seems, even though they advertised it 2 years ago. Basically they're taking away anything that could make the Wii U version special, even though those features have been in previous Zelda games!. Well done Aonuma!
@VanillaLake I'm trying to come up with a name, but I can't figure out who you are talking about. You do mean a Nintendo Life member, I suppose?
@rushiosan Use an extension cord.
@VanillaLake P.S. Shocker: agreed with all your "pointless shaking" assessments.
@ThanosReXXX The Nintendo Life user with whom you were discussing with me about Breath of the Wild not using the GamePad in any particular special way, in a way that could not be done otherwise. That was my opinion and his was that I can't say that because I don't know.
I feel like there is an extraordinary amount of speculation over things like GPU and the NX when the map is probably just not ready yet.
@30whodatninja @rushiosan ..or this..
@VanillaLake You mean rjejr?
@VanillaLake The writers here stumble on occasion, but I appreciate that they at least try to maintain a sense of professionalism about the things they're passionate about.
I will actually be really sad if the gamepad map shown in the original footage is gone. It would be a total shame to waste the gamepad screen on a game like this when it worked so great in games like Xenoblade Chronicles X. I'm clinging to hope that the logical explanation is that they simply excluded it from the demo versions because its still in development and they didn't want to distract previewers in specific.
It would be reeeally weird (and lame) if they didn't have any touch screen features for the map and item menus on the Wii U version. I assume it wouldn't be that hard to implement. It could be optional, just like in WW HD/TP HD!
I really enjoyed how the Zelda HD remakes on the Wii U have handled the touch and hope that Breath of the Wild will end up doing something similar. This was only the demo version, so things can change.
Good news for me cause my GamePad's screen is still busted.
When I heard the lack of Wii U specific features, what came into my head were puzzles based around touch screen or dual screen gameplay. If they got rid of an interactive map just to make this more port friendly I will be sorely disappointed.
I hope they build in better dedicated gamepad map support in the final builds!
@VanillaLake I totally hear ya.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE They basically said as much.
@Ralizah Totally agreed.
@Oubie Yeah, the GamePad usage in Xeno X made it incredibly comfy to go around and check whatever you needed to check about the areas around you. I'll miss that here, but, oh well.
@Kirk Yeah. This is super off-topic but I know you like computers and I'm thinking of buying a new laptop (it has to be laptop, not desktop) because mine is from 2012 and it is getting hotter and I'm afraid it will die anytime (it is reaching max temperature when I use programs). I am looking at some intel Core i7 with 2 cores and 4 threads @2.4-3GHz which is not very expensive. Some people are telling me to wait until next year for new technology but I'm afraid technology is not stopping next year and mobile device technology goes behind anyway so I don't know... Would you buy it and at what price? Thanks! :S
Like a few others, I will hold on to the hope that the interactive map and inventory management was just dropped for the demo but will feature in the final release. If not, then BotW is simply not a Wii U game, it'll just be an NX port, and, as good as the game looks, Nintendo really will have let down the Wii U owners looking forward to this game for 3-4 years.
@ThanosReXXX Yeah I mean @rjejr
Back on topic:
I want the Wii U version of Breath of the Wild because I don't know when I'll get an NX if I ever do (it would be the first time in my life without a Nintendo console though). I am quite disappointed about the Wii U version running at 30-20fps like the demo, if the final game does I'm going to be complaining a little while (so be prepared). And yeah I see and feel the difference when the frames drop like that and it's not N64 era any more (1996 console)! Like some people have said, I would prefer more basic visuals, even though I think Breath of the Wild's visuals are quite basic already, if it meant a better frame rate. What I know for certain is that Nintendo won't trick me to buy an NX at launch for a game that was supposed to be Wii U's Zelda. Not a chance. I regret paying full price for Wii U and one of the reasons why I got it was for this game... At this point and seeing how Nintendo struggles to get a decent technical performance I really wish they become third party. The same games but 1080p 60fps.
@gcunit Congratulations to you too for being honest even though you're a staffer.
@ThomasBW84 Super Mario RPG is coming to the NA eshop tomorrow! Super Mario RPG is coming to the NA eshop tomorrow! Praise NOA at last!
Yeah, it's just 11 MILLION PEOPLE!!!
I'm a big fan of the Gamepad, but I think it's safe to say that this hands-on points to a screen-less controller for NX.
I presume that's good news to you?
Well, I think a screen wouldn't necessarily be shooting themselves in the foot, provided it
A) doesn't affect size/form/comfort of controller
B) is only utilized for auxiliary info for convenience
C) messaging is clear that it will not be a focal point
I do actually hope they retain a screen. But, I hope it's as described above. Basically a normal controller (maybe a smidge larger, that'd be ok) but just has a screen for the OS, apps, wireless play on the go and off TV play on a system level, and perhaps optionally has the ability to display menus in games (be it a map or inventory).
But due to the points you listed above, they would need to be very clear and concise about its purpose.
This generation of consoles has made me realise that framerate is everything and I think Nintendo has known that for a long, long time. Resolution is just extra gravy, but a buttery smooth framerate actually changes your experience of a game world. I didn't know that Breath Of The Wild had a questionable framerate but they need to sort that out before launch.
@The_Mysteron Agreed. That is the current performance of the game. Hopefully they fix it but I don't know... I was surprised about those drops as the game resolution is also quite low.
More information about Breath of the Wild performance here: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2016-the-legend-of-zelda-breath-of-the-wild-pushes-wii-u-hardware-to-the-limit
Unfortunately the reality is that easy ports will get the 3rd parties onboard. If the NX doesn't use the same architecture as the next Sony and Microsoft consoles, I think they're making a mistake.
To be a big success, NX needs a bucket load of EA, Rockstar, Blizzard etc games at launch or soon after. I still think Nintendo has some of the best software developers in the world, but they can't support a full console catalogue on their own.
@VanillaLake The FPS is on par with most open world games like Assassins Creed and Witcher 3 and 60 FPS is nowhere near essential in a game experience. Halo 5 had 60 FPS and it made it buttery amooth, but I've also played Halo at 30 my whole life with no problems.
"DKC Returns (pointless shaking), Super Mario Galaxy (pointless shaking), Star Fox Zero (just one controller for single player with motion controls)... I remember when Nintendo made New Super Mario Bros. U and other Wii U games compatible with the pro controller months after launch, like it was something to think about"
Exactly. Nintendo (and not all that long ago) used to pride themselves on multiple control options. Play how YOU want to play. Pro Controller? You got it. Motion? Sure. Dual screen? Not a problem. Simple sideways Wiimote? Can do that too. Heck, toss in the GameCube controller and 3DS just for good measure.
Idk what happened to that line of thinking. I mean, naturally you can adjust to any control method but, if it's not your preferred play style then it's going to damper the experience. I remember rolling in DKC by shaking Nunchuk and ya, it worked but, I didn't prefer it. What happened to choice? What happened to play how you like to play?
Some games, like Pikmin 3, nail it. Analog? Yep. Oh you prefer motion for the precision aiming? That's included. Oh you want off TV play? Let's patch in stylus. Or Smash Bros, which to this day is the most versatile game ever made when it comes to input choice. Yet other games it's like, you MUST play this one way. No choice. No options.
This whole Wii U Zelda thing just aggravates me. Why can't they include the map/inventory as an option for those who so desire? They know its a huge benefit for Zelda games, has been this whole generation both on Wii U and 3DS.
Well, that's disappointing. At least the off-screen play won't feel weird though, like it did with Shantae...
@JaxonH Yeah. Mario Kart 8 also offers a lot of control options and Pikmin 3 as well.
So what can you do with the GamePad on Breath of the Wild? I have both The Wind Waker HD and Twilight Princess HD so you can use them as examples. Do you mean that you can't select items on the GamePad? What is the thing about the map? I'm a bit confused about that...
@MailOrderNinja That doesn't mean that I have to be happy with 30-20 fps in an 2017 adventure game that is subHD.
Don't let it aggravate you. The game isn't even finished yet.
Oh, I was just saying I really enjoyed being able to use the gamepad/second screen for real time inventory management. It worked beautifully in Link Between Worlds, and Windwaker, and also Twilight Princess. I think it's more than proven to be a valuable asset to players. And the map as well. It's quicker and easier to glance at the second screen to see where you're at than to pause.
And this would hold doubly true for BotW because of its open world, you're constantly going to need to be navigating. And we know waypoints are in, as demonstrated by Aonuma. It's really awesome you can set a waypoint just by zooming into the distance, but setting them on the map will surely be needed as well, and it would be so much quicker to just reach over and tap to set a waypoint than pause the game.
@VanillaLake I don't really have any good advice on what computer you should get. I've not bought a new computer in ages and I don't really keep up with the latest systems so couldn't say. Sorry.
@VanillaLake SubHd? What is it running in? Also, you'd be hard pressed for even the PS4 to run a game like that in 1080 with 60 FPS. Mario Kart is one thing, but this is a huge open world with tons of stuff to render. On the Wii U 60 FPS on an open world isn't realistic.
Well, I'm not gonna get bent out of shape over it. Anything can happen between now and release, and nothing I can do about it anyways.
But I'd be lying if I said this doesn't disappoint me.
@Kirk No worries, thanks.
@gcunit: Well said. I'm waiting for the NX to be fully revealed before I preorder BotW and make my decision on which system to get it for. It'll be quite disappointing if the Wii U version doesn't take advantage of all the Gamepad has to offer.
@MailOrderNinja Obviously Wii U can't handle that, I'm just complaining about 20-30fps and poor optimisation!
@JaxonH OK, so you can't have a map on the GamePad screen unless you pause the game. Sad, that's the best advantage a second screen can offer. Pikmin 3 is a great example, you can set way points on the go.
PS: I guess I didn't read that part.
I'm gonna guess that the NX will work like the gcn gba combo, in that the handheld can work like the gamepad and can be connected to the nx. Not a bad idea, and allows for ds and wiiU vc
If they took away all of the Gamepad features in order to make the NX version more appeasing then this not only destroys the WiiU version, but it is also not as promising for the NX version. Surely the NX version should look better by default compared to the WiiU version. It's a 4 years old console after all. XCX was such a treat in terms of open world usage of the Gamepad that going back to a standard controller with an uncomfortable item management would be dissappointing.
meh. I'm going to use my pro controller instead.
@MajinSoul "going back to a standard controller with an uncomfortable item management would be dissappointing." Specially when Wii U's controller is the GamePad...
I was implying port friendly for Nintendo with Zelda: BOTW. Of course 3rd parties will want a huge level of parity at least in architecture. I was talking about how I don't like how Nintendo may be nixing features just so NX players have the same experience.
@VanillaLake "if the final game does I'm going to be complaining a little while (so be prepared)"
Ha, thou dost not worry, my dear fellow, I wash my hands of thee and will leave thee to thine own devices.
(Sorry about that bit, was watching some episodes of Sleepy Hollow to alleviate the mind after our mild altercation earlier... )
But true, the demo/Wii U version of Zelda still needs some serious work, but they still have around 5 more months to fix the most important ones (improve frame rate, LOD and reduce pop-in).
The no GamePad map support is sad, but even though it won't be a continuously visible map, it will still be there if you pause and you can still use the GamePad to manipulate the map and set markers on it.
If that is the trade-off for having a more solid gameplay experience and being able to fix the graphics issues mentioned earlier, then so be it. And the NX will probably use the non-downscaled textures, so that will obviously look even better.
Nintendo going third party? Ouch... oh man, this really both itches and hurts, but as promised, I won't go there with you since I'm the polar opposite of that idea, and for good reason...
Anyway, moving on: I think that looking at a lot of games on the other systems now, there are too many also struggling with 1080p/60fps, or anything solid for that matter, so the game wouldn't necessarily run better on that hardware.
The newer systems however...
I was talking to Captain_Gonru in the VR topic and I laid out an idea that I had in my head, when this video popped up, literally only minutes later:
Interesting video, and like my idea, it comes to the conclusion that the NX will more than likely be quite a capable system. And if there isn't anything really discerning the Wii U version from the NX version of the new Zelda, then I would bet that quite a lot of people would go for the NX version.
Obviously I don't know if any such news might make you reconsider not buying an NX, but it is an interesting theory nonetheless, and if true would at least guarantee a capable system and might calm down a whole lot of people that are now already thinking that the NX will not be a competent system.
I noticed the PC question that you discussed with Kirk and since I'm a sales & marketing professional in the IT branch, I can at least give you my two cents, do with it what you will.
The laptop you described is more than capable for most tasks, but it depends on what you want to do with it. Besides that, there's indeed the matter of cost. If the money isn't an issue and you need the system urgently, then I'd go for it, otherwise, wait for about a half year.
The now almost famous (partially because of NX rumors) Polaris line of cards is coming out, and that will make a VERY competent system for a considerably lower price, so it will be interesting to see what that will do to system prices and if or how they will integrate these into laptops. You might wanna look into that in that case, since it will be a difference of $100/€/£ or more.
Well, that's all from me for now, have a good night.
@gatorboi352 Thanks for clarifying. By the way, nice profile pic. I used to love these movie goombas.
Most games which attempted to make the Wii U GamePad screen a major part of the game play has had it backfire horribly.
The better games have had the Wii U GamePad screen only function as something minor like quicker inventory management.
So it's actually good that the Wii U GamePad screen isn't seriously tied into the game play for Breath of the Wild.
But that only alludes to how poorly thought out the Wii U GamePad was in the first place.
@ThanosReXXX "If that is the trade-off for having a more solid gameplay experience and being able to fix the graphics issues mentioned earlier"
Do you believe that? It sounds like a cheap excuse, more likely they want both versions to play the same...
"Ouch... oh man, this really both itches and hurts, but as promised, I won't go there with you since I'm the polar opposite of that idea, and for good reason..."
I don't understand, you love Nintendo hardware but you didn't buy a Wii U? You praise everything Nintendo but you don't buy their main stuff (Wii U being their main stuff since 2012)... I hope you buy an Xbox Scorpio, Neo or NX "next" generation.
Thank you very much for your advice about IT. I don't know what to do. On the one hand, my laptop was not expensive, it's four years old and it gets hot easily (and the battery is dead). On the other hand, I don't know what's coming next year and if that will be available in affordable laptops anytime soon. I want a laptop because sometimes I have to travel. I'm not rich so what price do you consider to be a good offer for the CPU I mentioned with 8GB and GeForce 920M for a 15.6" laptop?
@gcunit nailed it!
I'm optimistic it will be added later but it would be a crying shame if the Wii u had its best feature missing in its swan song game imo!!
@VanillaLake The reason I have not stepped into the current generation of consoles yet, is because I recently (6 months ago) started my own small company, so all money went there, and then hobbies like gaming and such aren't the highest priority anymore, but I will still be buying a Wii U eventually, and probably also an NX, so I'll have quite a backlog by then, I'd imagine...
As for the laptop, here's an example similar to what you described an the prices it is going for:
So those are the average prices, anything above that is a rip-off, anything below that (say $450-$490) is a good deal.
If that is too rich for your blood, then you might have to look for a more modest model, but again: it depends on what it is to be used for. Simple internet usage, some modest gaming and office capabilities? Then this might also do:
But if you want to do more serious gaming and things like video editing and/or use other kinds of serious graphics or editing programs, then you might still have to set aside a bit more cash/safe up a bit longer and go for the more expensive model.
And as these are prices in dollars, you'd have to look for the British version of Amazon for prices in pounds, but there shouldn't be too much of a difference.
Either way, hope that is of some help. Good luck with it.
Yeah, thanks for that. It would be for working, browsing and casual gaming basically, plus next time I have to travel it would be great not having a dead battery.
PS: I wish you good luck with your company.
Ok, so seems motion controls are still in? That's great as I don't think motion control has quite run its course yet. (Plus I'm building a motion control game and would love to get it on the NX if it at all made sense).
I highly doubt Nintendo are purposely trying to gimp the Wii U version of Zelda. Nor is the GamePad likely to be causing performance issues. Almost certainly it's just a case of too complex to project manage separate builds with different feature sets for different platforms.
Hopefully there'll be something like Smartglass for NX to connect with people's smartphones. If not, whilst a shame, I think Nintendo would be justified in not having a feature that never took off on X1/PS4.
@VanillaLake A slight correction: for the more expensive model, I looked at the "used" prices, and the original price is $799.99. So that's quite a bit more.
But maybe this might be of assistance to you:
There's even more categories on the home page.
Let me know if you succeeded in finding what you need...
is this game going to have off-tv play?
@MisterMan I think it does not but I'm not sure.
@ThanosReXXX So then I think I'll go for a mid-range one if I find a good deal. Thanks again.
@VanillaLake It was my pleasure, so you're welcome.
So there is Off-TV play. Good. No Off-TV play would have been a deal-breaker.
Doesn't really matter to me much. I'm planning on buying the NX version anyway. Sounds like they may be trying to make the newer one the better version. Give people more incentive to buy an NX or something.
HUD Mini maps and gps are a distraction in most games, pad or not. The only time I find it not to be, is when the mini-map is not too precise.
Think, Super Metroid or the strange blank one in Zelda I.
I can understand not having core gameplay mechanics tied to the screen but a map should be a given since it is one the best uses the gamepad has, especially in large open world games like this one. Black Flag and AC3 were far better because of it.
I agree. While Wind Waker HD's map on the gamepad was convenient for a little while, less than halfway into the game I started using the Pro - I was far more used to it than the gamepad. And I prefer managing my inventory while pausing the game.
I'll miss the use the gamepad had on XCX though - having the second screen right beside me for Fast travel was great.
@VanillaLake I'm quite a supporter of the idea that Nintendo's consoles hold their games back, but you're not gonna get 1080p/60fps if the company went 3rd party. That's so rare on Xbox and PS4.
@whodatninja yeah... This is his fault...>>
If you think streaming to a second screen is too demanding then how did they make it work in Xenoblade Chronicles X? Sounds like a fairy-tale to me.
@JamesCoote "Almost certainly it's just a case of too complex to project manage separate builds with different feature sets for different platforms."
You may or may not be right with this, but either way, if the Wii U version of BotW lacks features that have become standard on other Wii U games - even Watch_Dogs on Wii U, the game that everyone loves to hate, managed a dynamic and touch interactive map on the gamepad - then it's been gimped.
How can Watch_Dogs get absolutely slated and sabotaged for being 6 months late and only having an interactive map (and, allowing for art style differences, is just as good looking), but BotW can be 2 years late, without even an interactive map, and it not only be acceptable but be everyone's GotY before it even releases?
It would be shambolic if that were the case. It would mean the Wii U version was effectively abandoned and instead Wii U owners are just handed a very-much gimped version, ported from NX. Which would be very disrespectful to the Wii U faithful if you ask me. This should have been a Wii U game first and foremost. That was the expectation Nintendo gave us from the outset right up until E3 and this demo.
Noooooooooooooo! I don't believe it! It must use the touch screen it's got to! Why go to all the effort in ww and tp!
@gcunit Even a relatively simple game with no unique platform features can be nightmarishly complicated to manage. The two I've done, one ended up with a separate code base in the end, and as a result, will probably never get DLC or features that come after launch (as the code bases would have diverged so much by then, it'd be incredibly difficult to reintegrate). And the other project, it started on PC, ended up being made for Wii U, then ported back to PC.
Nintendo developers are probably tying themselves in knots just trying to make the same version of BotW work on both Wii U and NX. Yes we lose the map, but probably for the benefit of having future DLC and updates work on the Wii U, and the Wii U version not being compromised graphics or performance wise.
@Zeldafanforlife It's not like I think that this is definitely the case, but from all info we can gather, it does seem a likely option.
First of all, they will want parity between the two versions, and the statement on that was that "the experience will be the same both on Wii U and NX". Now obviously, with a negative thinking cap on, that could be read as: well, since the NX isn't going to have a GamePad controller, we are going to remove the function from the Wii U version so they are the same.
I don't think that's it, though. The Wii U is probably considerably weaker than the NX, so it will be quite an effort to get all the stuff in there that they want and still have it look almost the same as the NX version so that there isn't a huge graphical difference, and for Wii U's hardware this is a very big game.
Yes, Xenoblade Chronicles X is also a big game, but it has much simpler graphics. The style of that game might be more realistic looking, but that must not be confused with more advanced or better graphics. Just look at the buildings and cars in the cities: they are very generic and super simple, so displaying these isn't that big a task for the hardware.
The aesthetics of the new Zelda game may also look simple, but from all reports of people that were present at E3 that played the demo, it looks considerably better in real life and is probably both the most beautiful and the most complex/ambitious game ever released on the Wii U, so taking that into consideration and assuming that they might indeed want to have as much parity between the two versions as possible AND giving the Wii U owners the best looking version they possibly can, the continuous map has been taken from the equation.
There is still a map, though, and it is still interactive, so you can still manipulate all kinds of stuff with it, so it's not entirely lost except it is only visible if you pause the game.
I also think that @JamesCoote has a good point, and he is talking from experience, so it's always interesting to hear the opinions of people like him on relevant topics like this.
I just wanted to give my two cents, but I'm no programmer or developer, just a guy that is trying to connect the dots, and this is what it looks like to me. Not like some sort of evil plot from Nintendo to intentionally "gimp" the Wii U version...
@C-Olimar I did not say this generation. I mean "next" generation (or however it is called): Scorpio, Neo, NX...
@Oubie Which reminds me, I need to start playing XCX soon.
@A01 I think the hybrid idea is misunderstood. It could simply be a home console and a hand held console that both utilize the same media format for their games.
So two separate devices you purchase independent of one another but each of them are capable of running the same cartridge games. so you can play your new Zelda in beautiful HD on your TV, or on the go on your shiny new hand held. With this idea there is no reason for the NX console to have a screen, since it will be 2 separate devices. I highly doubt the intention of that concept is for us to take our controller with us everywhere, it would constantly be low battery if you are playing with it at home and taking it with you on the go it will never get any charge time.
Then that's not a hybrid, that's a unified system.
The iPhone and iPad aren't a hybrid because they run the same applications, they're a unified system.
The NX could be either, a hybrid, or two devices with a unified system, or something else entirely.
If it is a unified system the two pieces are going to need to have almost identical input methods. Which still points to a screen in the console controller if the handheld part has a touchscreen.
So yeah, no GamePad/touchscreen for NX is what we take from this. Also, the game is almost too powerful for Wii U I guess? Either way it's disappointing but then it's been a theme throughout the Wii U life cycle with the 2nd screen being largely wasted or not even used in many games including Nintendo AAA titles. Sadly the USP of the system was not only misunderstood by many consumers, but also many developers.
I was thinking about getting this for Wii U, the original system it was intended for, as I got TP for Wii which was more of a GC game with Wii controls tacked on. But knowing that BotW doesn't utilise the GamePad in a useful way, it's clear that the NX version is the one I should buy.
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