Ok now you seem to literally be trolling/talking big negative here. Didn't I just tell you that these games are spin offs?
Ok, let's start from sticker star since that's when the Paper Mario series started to not have RPG elements (well technically Super Paper Mario started it but that game plays miles better than Sticker Star)
A game that didn't have RPG elements and because of that, it didn't have any sense of character progression aka grinding aka leveling up.
Ok so it didn't have it. But that's not the reason why Sticker star is polarizing in the first place. The reason that it was so damn.....i don't want to say bad but rather mediocre is because the overall experience itself felt so repetitive because the only thing you're doing is getting stickers which are absolutely pointless.
Hit blocks and you get stickers, buy nothing else but stickers, find specific stickers inorder to make a better progress, peel out stickers to get to a hidden chest which gives you nothing but stickers, defeat enemies which give you coins which you need inorder to get...guess what? Stickers.....see where I'm getting at? How that one simple mechanic makes the game so dull and extremely repetitive?
Now let's say that this is changed into RPG elements. Let's make it that instead of getting only stickers, you get EXP. You're moves all won't have any limits unlike now and you still get EXP for doing the usual.
All in all, it does like a typical RPG except that the problem here is now the grinding session since you can't beat specific enemies which means that it'll most likely end up something like Phantasy Star 2.
Now answer me this? How is that any better than that lame mechanic Sticker Star has? That's probably what made Nintendo realize this that since grinding doesn't seem to do anything different, it really doesn't matter whether the series is RPG or not.
Frankly, the Paper Mario series is loosely based on the Mario and Luigi series only tweaking it to make it harder than that series. Instead of dodging, you're blocking. Instead of using BP for each Bro, you have an FP which you and your partner can only use. Instead of having the ability to equip at the cost of nothing besides side effects, you now need badge points to equip certain skills. Instead of learning more moves, you need to use the crystal stars/stars that you collect that do wonders and that takes a long time to use them. I can go on here.
Ok, so the interview kinda made us a bit upset that we'll never get something even to the likes of Bowser's Inside Story. But really even if they bring back the RPG stuff, that doesn't matter anymore because the stories that they give for the future games will never reach to the charms of the classics.
Seriously speaking, when you have two rpg series which both star Mario where the gameplay is simplified that doesn't force you to grind often, what's the need of the RPG elements? You are just better off with them doing like Zelda only more simplified and reusing art assets (atleast in Paper Mario).
Its coming to the point that the only reason it exists is just for the sake of it existing and nothing else. You guys need to complain about the lack of fun in the recent games rather than the removal of RPG elements because Sticker Star wasn't fun unlike Dream Team which I had a blast....probably will be better than Paper Jam (from what I've played so far of it.)
i hope i will someday find a copy of thousand year door ... .. i've been playing through the first paper mario on wii virtual console it is pretty great (and i am somebody who didn't hate sticker star but as a paper mario game it's definitely lacking
I don't get why people are shocked by the comment that "if you want a Mario RPG play the Mario and Luigi series". It makes sense. Why would Nintendo have 2 different Mario RPG series when they could have 1 RPG series and 1 action-adventure series?
I personally think this looks like it's going to be a great game. I'm not really to fund of RPGs and all the back and forth, so I appreciate the map. I also don't care much for story. If the gameplay is fun my objective doesn't need to be much more than to reach the goal. If I want an immersive story I watch a play or a movie. Not saying there is anything wrong with RPGs, they just aren't usually my thing.
Anyways, I think it is perfectly reasonable for the developers to keep Paper Mario in the Action-adventure genre instead of having two different Mario RPG series.
@AlliMeadow It would be reasonable if both of these series were pretty much the same, but they're both actually very different from eachother, giving their own different experiences, to the point where the idea that they can't coexist is just ridiculous. They both have their own flavor. Plus it just feels like a slap to the face for people who enjoyed Paper Mario as an rpg, and it comes off as a bit hypocritical when Nintendo has an abundance of platformers.
There is nothing here...except for the stuff I just typed...
To be fair, I'd say we know very little about the story of Paper Mario: Color Splash.
I'm surprised that here too nobody noticed how the beginning of Color Splash is based on the beginning of the first three Paper Mario games, where a message is delivered to Mario in his house.
Surprisingly, this time the initial cutscene is way darker than the ones we are used to see in the other Paper Mario games, as there is a stormy night and the message is a colorless, no longer moving Toad sent by the villain to Mario, who is indeed scared by it.
Actually, the villain itself is not introduced in the starting cutscene (like in Sticker Star) and not even in the beginning of the story, when Mario, Peach and Toad arrive on Prism Island and find Huey.
And, in the map I posted, you can see that even after the beginning Peach is still found in the town square, meaning that she isn't kidnapped immediately after arriving on the island and saving Toad.
I think we are already dismissing a story we simply don't know about.
After seeing the new trailer during E3, I want to play it. I enjoyed Sticker Star for what it was, and Colour Splash seems to take the good parts from SS and improve upon it. SS had some crazy moments that had me laughing, like the Sniffit Quiz or the Boo mansion. This game seems to have way more of that. And from the treehouse gameplay we could see that there was already more lines of dialogue in this part of the game then the entirety of SS. I played the original Paper Mario and Super Paper Mario and enjoyed those as well.
I don't get why people are shocked by the comment that "if you want a Mario RPG play the Mario and Luigi series". It makes sense. Why would Nintendo have 2 different Mario RPG series when they could have 1 RPG series and 1 action-adventure series?
I personally think this looks like it's going to be a great game. I'm not really to fund of RPGs and all the back and forth, so I appreciate the map. I also don't care much for story. If the gameplay is fun my objective doesn't need to be much more than to reach the goal. If I want an immersive story I watch a play or a movie. Not saying there is anything wrong with RPGs, they just aren't usually my thing.
Anyways, I think it is perfectly reasonable for the developers to keep Paper Mario in the Action-adventure genre instead of having two different Mario RPG series.
Yet they have about five different series of 2D platformers?
Besides, the Mario & Luigi and Paper Mario games are very different from one another. Not only are they both designed for different types of consoles (handhelds and home consoles respectively), but they have clear differences in structure and setup too. Former is more action based, with reflexes more important tactics. Latter is more strategy based. Partners are in one, not in another. Badges work one way in one, not in another. One series is more serious, one is generally more light hearted.
They both appeal to different people and can both co-exist just fine.
To be fair, I'd say we know very little about the story of Paper Mario: Color Splash.
I'm surprised that here too nobody noticed how the beginning of Color Splash is based on the beginning of the first three Paper Mario games, where a message is delivered to Mario in his house.
Surprisingly, this time the initial cutscene is way darker than the ones we are used to see in the other Paper Mario games, as there is a stormy night and the message is a colorless, no longer moving Toad sent by the villain to Mario, who is indeed scared by it.
Actually, the villain itself is not introduced in the starting cutscene (like in Sticker Star) and not even in the beginning of the story, when Mario, Peach and Toad arrive on Prism Island and find Huey.
And, in the map I posted, you can see that even after the beginning Peach is still found in the town square, meaning that she isn't kidnapped immediately after arriving on the island and saving Toad.
I think we are already dismissing a story we simply don't know about.
That's a good point, though you'd think if there were more new characters, that Nintendo would actually show them in the trailer or livestream. They know what people want, and showing those characters could please a lot of fans and stop a lot of criticism.
That's a good point, though you'd think if there were more new characters, that Nintendo would actually show them in the trailer or livestream.
Are you new to Nintendo marketing? AFAIK, they never reveal the full scope of a game 4 months before release of the game.
Looking forward to all the complaints about the next 3D Mario game, when it isn't a true sequel to whatever <insert personal favorite 3D Mario game here>.
I'm not saying they should show all the new characters. Or heck, 10% of them.
But all it would have taken to make people think 'not Sticker Star 2' would be a bunch of Toads with different clothing, hair styles, accessories and design changes and a few new characters of other species. You could have done with this with maybe 3 characters, and kept the scope mostly hidden for later.
Yet they didn't. You want to see how to reveal a lot of stuff? Try this:
Or heck, even Breath of the Wild revealed a lot more that people care about. That got a great trailer, far more than 4 months before the release date:
If Color Splash had original characters, they would have shown at least one or two of them other than the paint bucket.
That's a good point, though you'd think if there were more new characters, that Nintendo would actually show them in the trailer or livestream. They know what people want, and showing those characters could please a lot of fans and stop a lot of criticism.
I was thinking, did we know about Bowser Jr. before the release of Super Mario Sunshine, in trailers of said game?
I'm not saying they should show all the new characters. Or heck, 10% of them.
But all it would have taken to make people think 'not Sticker Star 2' would be a bunch of Toads with different clothing, hair styles, accessories and design changes and a few new characters of other species. You could have done with this with maybe 3 characters, and kept the scope mostly hidden for later.
Oh, but they did that, even in the cover of the game:
They only started showing some slightly different or ucnommon characters at the end of the TreeHouse Live. Why? Who knows. The last minutes of footage were interesting, but the beach section was not a very good way to show the game, in my opinion. They didn't even talk about the EXP bar and were "eager" to show that allies cannot be used against Morton, who can pretty much only be defeated with the right Thing card, like in Sticker Star...
@Mister_Wu@jariw Look, I know you're trying to go with "We haven't played the game, yet! Stop judging it!", but...really? The only new character they showed was Huey (Also, that's some quality character design right there, Nintendo! Ya took a paint bucket, and you gave it some eyes!). I mean...really? There's no other potential characters that Nintendo would be okay with showing, assuming that there ARE other original characters? Not one single other character shown? Are you kidding me? Doesn't that seem a bit odd? I mean, this island is supposed to be seperated from the Mushroom Kingdom. Why can't the locals at least be something that isn't a Toad?
Looking forward to all the complaints about the next 3D Mario game, when it isn't a true sequel to whatever <insert personal favorite 3D Mario game here>.
I mean, it's not like there were any actual issues that lied with Sticker Star at it's core, or anything like that! Nope! It's just because it isn't like the first two! Seriously, a serious issue I have with people dismissing people's complaints is them going "Stop whining! You're only whining because you don't like change!" when really, this isn't change. This is just Sticker Star again. And we've already experienced Sticker Star in order to know whether or not we'd like to see it again, and there were quite a few issues with the game that I doubt many people would like to see come back. Further more, how would you like it if a series you really liked got stripped of everything that made you like it in the first place, and replaced with all these stupid decisions that don't even work? And then said stupid decisions ended up becoming the basis for the series from here on out? Wouldn't you be just a LITTLE annoyed? Judging by your avatar, I'd say you're a fan of Pikmin. Okay...imagine if they took away the treasure-hunting, the day-cycle, the way you manage your Pikmin, pretty much everything that made Pikmin Pikmin, and replaced it all with a Tomogachi-like game where all you could do was take care of your Pikmin like a virtual pet. And that all Pikmin games from that point would stay that way, and everything that you liked in the first place was gone for good. Would you be happy?
I mean, it's not like there were any actual issues that lied with Sticker Star at it's core, or anything like that! Nope! It's just because it isn't like the first two! Seriously, a serious issue I have with people dismissing people's complaints is them going "Stop whining! You're only whining because you don't like change!" when really, this isn't change. This is just Sticker Star again. And we've already experienced Sticker Star in order to know whether or not we'd like to see it again, and there were quite a few issues with the game that I doubt many people would like to see come back. Further more, how would you like it if a series you really liked got stripped of everything that made you like it in the first place, and replaced with all these stupid decisions that don't even work? And then said stupid decisions ended up becoming the basis for the series from here on out? Wouldn't you be just a LITTLE annoyed? Judging by your avatar, I'd say you're a fan of Pikmin. Okay...imagine if they took away the treasure-hunting, the day-cycle, the way you manage your Pikmin, pretty much everything that made Pikmin Pikmin, and replaced it all with a Tomogachi-like game where all you could do was take care of your Pikmin like a virtual pet. And that all Pikmin games from that point would stay that way, and everything that you liked in the first place was gone for good. Would you be happy?
If the changes made resulted in a good gaming experience, I would probably enjoy it a lot. But I would not like if every approach to a Pikmin game was the same after that.
I played Mario Galaxy after I had played Mario Galaxy 2, and I didn't enjoy Mario Galaxy. I played Tropical Freeze after playing Donkey Kong Country Returns - I loved Tropical Freeze although I didn't like DKCR. I was bored to death by MK/Wii, but I loved MK8. I really loved Rayman Origins, but for me Rayman Legends was ok but not the same greatness as Origin.
Samey game titles can sometimes result in nice game experiences, even if similar approaches failed before. Or the opposite. A good game is in the end based on more than a check list of features/changes.
I mean, it's not like there were any actual issues that lied with Sticker Star at it's core, or anything like that! Nope! It's just because it isn't like the first two! Seriously, a serious issue I have with people dismissing people's complaints is them going "Stop whining! You're only whining because you don't like change!" when really, this isn't change. This is just Sticker Star again. And we've already experienced Sticker Star in order to know whether or not we'd like to see it again, and there were quite a few issues with the game that I doubt many people would like to see come back. Further more, how would you like it if a series you really liked got stripped of everything that made you like it in the first place, and replaced with all these stupid decisions that don't even work? And then said stupid decisions ended up becoming the basis for the series from here on out? Wouldn't you be just a LITTLE annoyed? Judging by your avatar, I'd say you're a fan of Pikmin. Okay...imagine if they took away the treasure-hunting, the day-cycle, the way you manage your Pikmin, pretty much everything that made Pikmin Pikmin, and replaced it all with a Tomogachi-like game where all you could do was take care of your Pikmin like a virtual pet. And that all Pikmin games from that point would stay that way, and everything that you liked in the first place was gone for good. Would you be happy?
If the changes made resulted in a good gaming experience, I would probably enjoy it a lot. But I would not like if every approach to a Pikmin game was the same after that.
I played Mario Galaxy after I had played Mario Galaxy 2, and I didn't enjoy Mario Galaxy. I played Tropical Freeze after playing Donkey Kong Country Returns - I loved Tropical Freeze although I didn't like DKCR. I was bored to death by MK/Wii, but I loved MK8. I really loved Rayman Origins, but for me Rayman Legends was ok but not the same greatness as Origin.
Samey game titles can sometimes result in nice game experiences, even if similar approaches failed before. Or the opposite. A good game is in the end based on more than a check list of features/changes.
But if there were problems I had with a previous game, why should I not be dissapointed to see them back? Yes, sometimes games that are similar CAN offer different results, but that doesn't guarantee that this can be better. I mean, if I didn't like Sticker Star, why would I buy a game that looks exactly like Sticker Star? And before you go "Just give it a chance", why would I buy something I'd probably dislike? Wouldn't it be better if I spent my money on something I'd have a better chance at enjoying?
Edit: Maybe I'd be more willing if it was a situation where I thought the concept was good, and maybe they could do better. But from what I've seen, some of the concepts that COULD'VE been fixed, aren't. Cards seem to be depletable again. Bosses will need a specific card in order to be beatable. Lack of original characters. World map that makes everything linear and will most likely result in the worlds being disconnected. And chances are the plot isn't gonna be something to write home about. I just don't really see much of a reason to jump in again.
I mean, it's not like there were any actual issues that lied with Sticker Star at it's core, or anything like that! Nope! It's just because it isn't like the first two! Seriously, a serious issue I have with people dismissing people's complaints is them going "Stop whining! You're only whining because you don't like change!" when really, this isn't change. This is just Sticker Star again. And we've already experienced Sticker Star in order to know whether or not we'd like to see it again, and there were quite a few issues with the game that I doubt many people would like to see come back. Further more, how would you like it if a series you really liked got stripped of everything that made you like it in the first place, and replaced with all these stupid decisions that don't even work? And then said stupid decisions ended up becoming the basis for the series from here on out? Wouldn't you be just a LITTLE annoyed? Judging by your avatar, I'd say you're a fan of Pikmin. Okay...imagine if they took away the treasure-hunting, the day-cycle, the way you manage your Pikmin, pretty much everything that made Pikmin Pikmin, and replaced it all with a Tomogachi-like game where all you could do was take care of your Pikmin like a virtual pet. And that all Pikmin games from that point would stay that way, and everything that you liked in the first place was gone for good. Would you be happy?
You also know that they took away what made Fire Emblem challenging which is permadeath. They also took away what made Chibi Robo great in the first place with the last game right?
Let's go further, they also took away the non linearity that the 2D Metroid was known for from fusion onwards. They took away what made Mario Party...well...all about party.
But all of this really doesn't do much because at the end, these games are spin offs( Except Fusion and Zero Mission) and I've told you already, the Mario RPG series are slowly dying off.....like look at the sales of Paper Jam. I'm having a fine time with it so far but the sales are lower than Dream Team.
The only reason they are doing this is because of the series being such a small budget projects and unless they are willing to spend more on better stories and rpg elements like what they used to be, there's really nothing that we/they can do about it.
As for color splash, from what I've seen, it looks like it fixes issues that sticker star had so we don't even know if this is actually going to be another sticker star drama. Just be patient and let some impressions come so that we can see how it compares to sticker star.
@Mister_Wu@jariw Look, I know you're trying to go with "We haven't played the game, yet! Stop judging it!", but...really? The only new character they showed was Huey (Also, that's some quality character design right there, Nintendo! Ya took a paint bucket, and you gave it some eyes!). I mean...really? There's no other potential characters that Nintendo would be okay with showing, assuming that there ARE other original characters? Not one single other character shown? Are you kidding me? Doesn't that seem a bit odd? I mean, this island is supposed to be seperated from the Mushroom Kingdom. Why can't the locals at least be something that isn't a Toad?
My point is not really about the original characters, as the trend is clear: Huey, new outfits for Toads and that's about it. I don't even expect Yoshis...
My point is about the story. That was not revealed at all in the TreeHouse Stream, except in some details of the introduction that are surely interesting and create that odd dark atmosphere with the logo being shown on a stormy sea, but are not vital to the plot.
Reagrding expectations, it's fine to have them as low as possible, as the bosses still are based on specific Things to be solved, no original characters are being shown with the NPCs being mainly Toads and I might even add that the numeric HP meter of the enemies and the sign that said how much damage Mario dealt with his attacks are gone...
You also know that they took away what made Fire Emblem challenging which is permadeath.
After doing some quick research (I'm not really all that knowledgable when it comes to Fire Emblem), I have found out that there is a Classic Mode in Fates that turns permadeath on. This argument is not valid.
Let's go further, they also took away the non linearity that the 2D Metroid was known for from fusion onwards. They took away what made Mario Party...well...all about party.
Not really into Metroid, so I can't say anything about that. But as for Mario Party, people were upset about that, also. What point were you trying to make with that?
But all of this really doesn't do much because at the end, these games are spin offs( Except Fusion and Zero Mission)
And the fact that these are spin-offs is supposed to make me less upset, because...? I'm just saying, if I like a series, why should the fact that it's not part of a main series of games make me less upset when it dissapoints?
and I've told you already, the Mario RPG series are slowly dying off.....like look at the sales of Paper Jam. I'm having a fine time with it so far but the sales are lower than Dream Team.
1. That is one game.
2. Chances are that people were put off because of stuff like them not being fond of the handholding in Dream Team and thinking Paper Jam had more of that, or just thinking that it's a dissapointing cross-over, or just being aware of the lack of characters/story and not purchasing it because of that.
The only reason they are doing this is because of the series being such a small budget projects and unless they are willing to spend more on better stories and rpg elements like what they used to be, there's really nothing that we/they can do about it.
1. Hasn't stopped them before. 2.It's been in development since after Sticker Star finished. They had plenty of time to do something about that.
As for color splash, from what I've seen, it looks like it fixes issues that sticker star had so we don't even know if this is actually going to be another sticker star drama.
How, exactly? I mean, all the problems with Sticker Star appear to be present here. What exactly is different? Levelling up your paint? That still doesn't change the fact that you use up your cards/paint in battle, and can find an abundance of cards/paint on the field, so...
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Topic: Paper Mario: Color Splash - OT
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