Topic: Shin Megami Tensei V Thread

Around 10hrs in and I think the save point system is quite good actually. Even Persona 5 doesn't have save anywhere in Palaces/Mementos and I think that is a good thing for turn based JRPGs. Got the fast travel thing from Goko after the first boss and honestly I kinda miss the thrill of crawling back to a save point especially coming from Nocturne. I do appreciate that everything you need is in the Leyline Founts as opposed to needing to enter different rooms within the town hubs which is quite unnecessary and irritating especially late game.

Died a couple times already being ambushed by a Mitama with some demons as well as going in blind to subquest boss and the first main boss. The difficulty is just right and I like that the Kaja buffs aren't the solution for everything this time. The combat is more varied as a result and it makes Magic + the potential system absolutely essential.

I am happy people are happy with the difficulty pacing, or the grind ratio or the more archaic elements like the save system, but you don’t need to try and convince me to like any of that stuff, just because you like it. I always think arguments like “that is just how the series is” are really naff arguments. People cry if a series doesn’t evolve, but then people defend series from criticism by saying “it has always been the spirit of the franchise”.

I'm really loving the game so far. I'm just after getting to the second Netherworld and the difficulty is keeping steady. Still getting the odd few game overs but it's usually my own error for not switching my team based on the current monsters running around or getting smacked down on my first time seeing a boss.

I think my one big piece of advice for anyone having trouble is to not treat your demons like Pokemon. Be ruthless when fusing them away and if one has a particular soft spot for you, register their levelled up form in the compendium.

I'd also just say keep an eye on your essences to level up your Nahobino's move set. The Aogami essences are particularly great to keep an eye out for

@pizzamorg I don't think anyone is trying to convince you. The thing is that most of the points you are making are just wrong.
1. Difficulty is what makes SMT what it is. It's rarely unfair (bad rng) but it needs the gamer to think strategically and take full advantage of the game mechanics.
2. There is no need to grind. If you have to grind (especially since you are playing on casual), maybe the game just isn't for you. You can't just power through the bosses in smt. Fuse, exploit weaknesses, use items, buffs-debuffs.
3. The saving system is hardly archaic. Old jrpgs had very few saving spots and you could lose hours of progress, especially in dungeons. In smt 5 the safe space is just a button away. The saving spots are numeral and traversing from one to another even on foot takes just a couple of minutes. The game also informs you before you face a boss or a strong demon. SMT 5 respects your time.
The series has evolved. Open space exploration, branching side quests, numeral quality of life enhancements in pretty much every aspect of the gameplay. Why should they change the dna of the franchise and what makes it unique?

I guess I will just agree to disagree with basically everyone in this thread, lol. I was only sharing my experience and my experience is true to myself, I was making no objective statements. I do think the difficulty pacing is poor, I guess you can think that is wrong, but I am not objectively saying it, I just found this to be the case in my experience. And every time people tell me “it is just the spirit of the franchise”, it doesn’t give me any cause to reevaluate my position because that is a meaningless argument.

Thankfully, I can circumvent the poor difficulty pacing and archaic save system, with the safety difficulty so every time the game spikes out of nowhere, I can just drop the difficulty down, clear that boss and move on without having to grind away. Why they couldn’t just even out the difficulty and include modern conveniences like an autosave before a boss fight, rather than just a warning and then you need to manually teleport back to the last save spot you found and then work your way back up to the boss again, I don’t know. You tell me “this is the spirit of the franchise” but I just think this sucks. They are making more work than necessary by using a save system I feel we left behind like two decades ago.

I also think the “maybe this isn’t for you” arguments are so lazy, people use this stuff all the time. I love the game’s music, art direction and I think the core systems are fun. My only gripes are with the difficulty pacing and the archaic save system, if means then that the entire game is “not for me”, then I dunno what to say to you on that.

I don't know what experience you have with smt, but some of the points you make about the difficulty and grinding remind me of myself when I played an smt for the very first time (smt4). I played on easy, used mitama dlc to grind and I powered through the game for the most part. The problem was that I really didn’t understand the mechanics of the games in order to use them efficiently. Smt is niche for a reason. It’s not for everyone and that’s a good thing.

Yeah I wouldn’t play the whole game on safety, it isn’t very fun and you won’t learn the game properly. It is still plenty challenging on the casual difficulty. I just use the safety difficulty to get through the bosses as the difficulty spikes so much each time, then put it back up again after.

I also won’t get into my stance on niche games, as that turned out to be a very unpopular opinion indeed, last time.

Shin Megami Tensei V is likely to come on both PC and PS4 next year

https://screenrant.com/shin-megami-tensei-v-ps4-pc-datamine/

This I 100% agree with. The choice to move to open hub worlds, with collectibles and stuff, rather than making every new location a maze, with some sort of infuriating puzzle to solve, shows SMT can change core parts of it’s formula and be the better for it.

@Shaman_King I always find it a little disappointing when a Switch exclusive goes multiplatform but I'm not surprised. Sega seems to be pushing Atlus to do this more and more.

At least more people will have access to it.

@Kimyonaakuma

This is good for SEGA as it will make even more money if they release the game for other platforms as well

https://www.pcgamer.com/sega-wants-atlus-games-to-release-on-...

Yeah, it is that typical pick and choose gamer moment stuff. People will complain if a sequel is too similar to a previous entry, people will complaint if a sequel is too different to a previous entry, people will say things like “it is how it has always been” like it is some sort of criticism proof shield they can just put around every discussion. Why actually make any actual points to argue these archaic systems are actually better than modern conveniences when I can just make nonsense catch all statements like “it is the spirit of the franchise” that I can just insert anywhere. And they’ll of course flip flop between these stances, as and when it suits the point they are trying to make.

And again, I want to stress, that I am not trying to say you can’t enjoy these things. If you do, then power to you. But every time someone @s me and says “no, your opinion is wrong because insert some sort of catch all phrase here” it is like… get over yourselves.

Especially as the game actually directly contradicts these kind of blanket arguments through it’s very design. Nocturne’s world design? Bad. Completely reworked here for SMT V. So this shows that SMT isn’t this set in concrete design thing, things can be changed and the game will be improved for it. Just leaving things as they always were isn’t an answer.

I just wanna play SMTV.

But I gotta go to work... sigh

@Kimyonaakuma
It's not a guarantee. Platforms listed in buried files could just be generic placeholders. We've seen that before. That said, its not impossible either. As long as they bring Persona to Switch, I say fair play.

@JaxonH It's not a guarantee but it's likely. Since Sega bought Atlus they have been focusing on PC a lot more, and I'm sure the same platforms were referenced in the Nocturne HD remaster.

Persona 5 Royal would be nice but it just seems unlikely to me. However I've waited for SMT V for so long that I'm happy that it's finally here! I'm going to be enjoying it for a few weeks before I get bothered by any game/port news.

@Kimyonaakuma
I don't care if it's Persona 5 or 4. Personally I like Persona 4 more. Either would do.

I think Persona coming to Switch/PC (P4G already came to Steam) is just as likely as SMT leaving Switch. If they're truly making an effort to bring games multiplat, I see no reason they'd only do it one way. With 7 Persona announcements spread over the year, I have to think at least one of them is P5 on Steam or P4G on Switch.

@razorxkenshin I agree with you on the grinding thing 100%. One of the things I love about SMT/Persona is that it doesn't encourage grinding with its weak point system combat. You get little reward to being overpowered and its almost impossible to grind weaker enemies with the very low XP they give off. As an example Final Fantasy is extremely grindy compared to SMT (of the ones I've played at least).

Persona on Switch, SMT on Playstation isn't impossible, but I still just don't think it's going to happen. And, to date, I've been right.

Who knows? Maybe we'll get a remaster of an older game.

All I know is that if SMT 5 goes multiplat, P5 needs to as well.

@Pizzamorg I'm not really trying to change your mind on anything, just sharing my own perspective on the game and series. I'm just happy you gave it another chance with a more modern entry. Even if you don't like everything about the formula, you at least seem to be enjoying it more.

I am honestly, issues already talked about exhaustively aside, really enjoying SMT V. Not to keep ***** on Nocturne, but I think playing a bad SMT (imo of course), really just helps you appreciate how far everything has come in SMT V.

While simplified in V, the catch ‘em all demon hunt, as you negotiate, level up, fuse and form a squad is just so addictive. Especially in a game like SMT V, where seemingly every demon has such a fascinating design and unique personality. I also think the way they made demons more individual was a good move as well, as it makes you think more about things, rather than just using everything as mindless fodder like you did in Nocturne - sans Pixie of course.

I like how they made negotiations much easier and while I am sad you can no longer use demons directly in negotiations (I miss Pixie shaking her stuff, while a demon would say “I love that ass” and other such silliness), I do like it when demons step in to have unique conversations with demons during negotiations as it is an organic surprise rather than something I am controlling.

I think the best thing is that Nocturne’s world design has been fired into the sun, hopefully to be never seen again. Not only in terms of things no longer being this infuriating puzzle maze, but I also just think everything is so much more striking in SMT V. Nocturne was a bunch of choppy, copy pasted, environments whereas there seems so much artistry in almost every pixel of V.

If this does come out on PC, I think I’m gonna have to buy it again, as I really want to see this game running at 4K 60 fps on a big screen.

I don't know if I'm in that group you're talking about, but just so we're clear, when I talked about the series being known for insane difficulty spikes I was not trying to make that sound like a good thing. I like the series despite those crazy boss spikes, not because of them. I do like a challenge, but I play games for fun, not bragging rights. The Matador in Nocturne was absolutely rage-inducing. I'm glad I haven't encountered anything like him so far in SMTV.

It's gonna suck if sales drop off because of rumors about possible ports to other systems. Ugh.

On another note, the giant enemies that dot the maps are heavily reminiscent of the FOEs from the Etrian Odyssey games. Which makes sense, given the guy who led development on this was also the director of that series. Kinda hope EO re-invents itself in the vein of SMT V when the next entry comes out.

@Pizzamorg SMT IV's world design was wildly different from previous games, and SMT V's is wildly different from IV's so far. It feels more like a Xenoblade game in terms of how it integrates gigantic open world areas into a linear JRPG, except much more well-done (there are so many little issues I have with Xenoblade that are done right here: more actively rewarding to explore; sidequests are meaningful instead of being MMO-esque annoyances; giant enemies that can kill you in a few hits have to actually reach you, so it's possible to escape from them if you've attracted their attention, whereas, in Xenoblade games, it feels like they can kill you from a mile away, etc.)

The monster collecting is at its best. All of the little annoyances from previous games are gone, and this aspect works really well with the exploratory gameplay.

Really like how the annoying teleporter maze dungeons are gone. The world itself is like a dungeon, except it's actually fun to explore.

I love this game. It's not perfect, but it's amazingly fun. Atlus did such a good job with this game.