Topic: Nintendo Switch 2

In any established series with a strong identity, you're going to get people making judgments on what it isn't if it makes big enough changes, and I don't think that's unreasonable as long as criticism is also measured with that in mind.

That was also the biggest criticism directed at the new Zelda games by a lot of classic fans, too.

@Buizel The trouble with AC is it went from a life sim/social sim series with some customization elements to a customization game with stripped down social simulation elements. The shift in game design was subtle but pretty profound in terms of how it impacted the longevity (or lack thereof) of the game for me. It's like a funhouse mirror version of New Leaf.

Metroid Prime 4 makes some big changes, but at its core, it still preserves the same gameplay loop.

@JaxonH

So true, so true. There is a ton of clickbait on Youtube and other social-media.

@Lazz

You are also right. And yes, I do read the other takes from time to time. At the same time it annoyed me that this site came so late with their review, one of the last I think. It was immediately clear that it was a polarizing game, and it felt like Nintendolife didn't want to admit that. Also, I visit this site almost every day and I never saw any articles about dissapointing sales. Then again it is clear to me now that it probably isn't all as dramatic as it seems. And yeah, this site gives the higher scores. But sometimes they also pan a game like Zelda: Phantom hourglass Wii u eshop versions (I did love the game on my DS). I admit that I am annoyed by the Switch 2 price and the game prices (and everything price-related as far as Nintendo is concerned), and that they get away with it. I did also buy a Switch 2 though, since I feared even higher prices in my country this year. This site should of course keep the lighthearted/fun vibe it is known for, but if there is something negative regarding Nintendo they should make articles about that too. Keep us informed.

@FishyS

Yeah, I was wrong about the 8. And I agree that if the average was 86% on Metacritic, Nintendolife wasn't far off.

Mariokart world is a polarizing game, but that's also because of the price (I paid less though). People expected 10 out of 10 everywhere because of that price. But it scored lower, and a lot of people are a bit dissapointed with the game (again since they paid that much for it). Personally I still think the game looks cool and I have it in my collection, so one day I'll play it myself.

@Buizel
Ya, I adore Mario Kart 8 Deluxe. But, that game was a cumulative sum of 2 generations worth of Mario Kart development crammed into a single game. That's not an experiment that will be repeated.

When Mario Kart 8 released on Wii U, it was a really great game, but the abysmal, half-baked battle mode held it back significantly. Mario Kart World absolutely smokes Mario Kart 8 on the Wii U.

The only reason Mario Kart 8 Deluxe is still the best, imo, is due to the fact they took the base game, added a real battle mode, added tracks, characters and carts, then doubled the tracks with a booster course expansion. 2 full generations of development packed into a single game.

As good as Mario Kart 8 Deluxe is, though, I too am glad they went the direction they did for World. Getting another Mario Kart in the same old-school structure of MK8D would have been incredibly disappointing. I don't see any possible way a game like that could have excited anyone. People would've said, "why isn't this just DLC for MK8D?" because it would essentially just be more tracks.

Mario Kart World fundamentally changed the formula from the ground up. An interconnected world. Intermissions. New modes like Knockout Tour and Free Roam. Double the racers. New mechanics like charge jumps and wall riding. Challenges and secrets hidden throughout the map.

It really is the Mario Kart I wanted. And I firmly believe if it had been sold for $70 there would have been no controversy, and it would have scored 5 points higher in aggregate.

@Henmii I hear you, and agree that sharing the bad news along with the good is important. I just think that right now, there's not a lot that is negative as the Switch 2 has been incredibly successful, even if it did not dominate the month of November. Maybe the sales of MP4 will be more on the negative side, just seeing where it is coming in on the weekly sales charts...I'm sure we'll hear more about that soon enough.

As for the pricing of Mario Kart World, I personally think that $80 is too high for what we have today, and I would not have bought it at launch had I not bought the bundle. While I think it is a great game, I am disappointed that we don't even have a roadmap (or confirmation that a roadmap even exists - sharing a roadmap could spoil future announcements). I do believe that by the end of the SW2 generation, Mario Kart World will be the best MK game in the series, justifying the price tag.

On pricing as a whole (and we've had this debate many times in these threads, I really shouldn't bring this up again), the SW2 is priced fairly, games at $50-$70 are priced fairly, and Nintendo has not moved forward with a $80 base for new games (and yes, I know that with some SW2 upgrades it moves the price up...just don't buy it if you don't like it). This is my US based perspective, I'm not commenting on any region other than my own. If I think a game is too expensive, I wait for a sale...every game I have ever wanted has seen a sale at least once...

@JaxonH I agree with you - $70 would have seen an entirely different discourse. Like I said in my previous comment, I think we'll eventually see the game as "worth it" at $80. I believe that a lot more is planned...but Nintendo has dropped the ball by not sharing anything on what the future plans are. The September Direct would have been ideal timing, but I think their strategy is this: Push the bundle, sell the game via the bundle, and in this month's direct (we gotta get one, right?) share the future MKW strategy.

I know we're tired of throwing around metacritic scores at this point but since Wii U MK8 was brought up, I was curious:

Mario Kart 8 Wii U: 88
Mario Kart 8D Switch: 92
Mario Kart World: 86

92 is definitely high up in the ranks.

I'm assuming that will happen after they add $30 DLC so the whole thing will cost $110 😆

This would be a smart strategy but Nintendo has stated that production of the Mario Kart Bundle was only intended to continue up through Fall 2025, and has thus ceased production. Also, the future MKW strategy will almost certainly be locked behind a paywall (if we're lucky, it'll be part of NSO+).

@Lazz
Not expecting a direct this month. Historically it's been February, with the rare occasional deviation in January or March.

I get the desire for knowing about future plans, but I think that can just put people off. "I'll wait til it's complete" sort of thing. Plus most of what they're doing is flexibly in response to player feedback, such as redesigning some intermission. So Idk what we'd really gain by a road map. To me, the game is what it is, and it'll get improved over time, and that's enough. For me anyways.

I do think the pricing was to strategically push the bundle. The game uses a $15 64GB cartridge. Like, people complain about wanting games physically even if it costs more, but when a game that uses a $15 cartridge costs $10 more, it's an outrage. Yes, the digital game is the same but anyone who wants the game digitally had the opportunity to buy at $50. That won't hold true moving forward (except holidays- I expect that bundle to return each year), but it's not like the opportunity hasn't been available for the last 7 months.

Tbh, if I were still a physical diehard, I'd be celebrating every game that released on cartridge even if it resulted in a $70 game becoming $80. I'm kinda surprised Nintendo hasn't made all physical games using those expensive carts $80.

@JaxonH Jan is wishful thinking on my part . You are right, sharing is a risk, but I'd like to know that something is planned. Think of the additions in MK8 - I don't think that the regular additions of the tracks caused people to wait to buy, if anything, it got more people playing (at least it got me to boot the game back up). In my own experience with World, I played it quite a bit at launch, but I've not played the game in months. Not that it's bad, or I don't like it - I just have too big a backlog and a desire for new experiences (like Prince of Persia, currently). Plus, Kart racers have never been a favorite genre of mine. With physical - I am okay if it costs more and it makes sense. Let those who value physical have an option with the additional cost. I still buy physical on occasion, but am at about 90% digital.

@UpsideDownRowlet & @FishyS - I REALLY hope that new content is included with NSO. Plus - the strategy that I can see is to get the early adopters to pick up World with the bundle, and now that it's done, share the future roadmap/strategy to attract the late adopters.

The 'usual' time for the direct given the financial report timing would be Feb 4 or 5 so January wouldn't be all that different. Although last week of January seems at least possible.

As a late mario kart adopter, no way will I ever buy the game for more than $50 so they better have good non-bundle sales or I am missing out 😆 Then again, I bought Mario Kart 8 Deluxe for $30.

@Lazz
I'm not opposed to sharing plans if it's an actual expansion like MK8D got, but not for updates and stuff. Keep in mind, Mario Kart 8 Deluxe was out for many years before such plans were shared. Expecting something 6 months after launch seems premature. Check back in 2028-2029, and perhaps then they'll update us with plans for expansion content. That gives the game a few years to sell based on the content it has now, and to get perfected through updates.

I don't binge on cart racers myself, but MKW is a game I hop into from time to time, spend an hour or two playing and then hop off. And that's kinda how I play them, spread over many years.

@FishyS You can also throw in the 82 for Mario Kart Wii and the 85 for Mario Kart 7.

To me, they're all Mario Kart, i.e. fundamentally the same game, even though the tracks differ and the mechanics evolve a bit, and I'd score them far closer together than that.

At least, any other racing game that isn't Mario Kart - even those with a very similar concept - has an uphill battle to get alongside a series where the gameplay has become so entrenched.

@Ralizah
I disagree. When you review a game, you should review that game.

Not how the game “fits” into its franchise.
Not how the game “fits” into its genre.
Not how the game “fits” into the zeitgeist.

Just review the game itself.

This sort of debate happens in all art forms and media, and different people have different takes. But that’s how I feel about video game reviews.

@rallydefault Video games don't exist within a vacuum, and imo should not be reviewed as if they do.

I think one can create a product-focused review that also contextualizes it within its series and genre.

Anyway, I was more responding to the idea of rhetoric about a game more broadly.

@Ralizah @rallydefault
I made a point earlier that it's somewhat like when an follow up to a critically and commercially successful album comes out and takes a left turn. Kid A after OK Computer for example. Doesn't really matter how good the follow up is, in the heat of the release the discourse amongst the public will be dominated by people who were into the previous thing. The new album will be hated, regardless of how good it is

Over time that perception often changes. Either because the people who initially hated it figure it out. Or because the new release builds it's own audience of fans. I don't really put much weight into initial fan whine for "divisive" releases. Sometimes, honestly most of the time, you just need to ignore all that noise and judge it for yourself

In regards to Mario Kart 8. From memory when it launched on the Wii U it seemed a bit half baked, especially in terms of battle mode. But got away with it because of the amazing visuals and flashy anti-grav tracks. I thought 7 was more innovative, especially the WuHu island loop tracks. I don't really see the argument for World being worse than 8 was at launch. Worse than 8 now? Sure. Not as mind blowing as Wii or DS or 7? Yep. But really, overall, it's about in line with where Mario Kart always is. Mid 8s

Honestly I think the hate for Mario Kart World has more to do with the fact that it's THE Switch 2 game. It just becomes the sponge for all of the greivences. The better it does, the more people are going to say it's a failure

@Ralizah
Well that’s what I’m saying is my stance: I think a video game should be reviewed as if it stands in a vacuum. Because it does. As crazy as it seems to us, there are tons of people who haven’t played MK 8 Deluxe. Even people who haven’t played a kart racer at all.

Review the game. Don’t review society.

@rallydefault you know a lot of movies and games are made to directly follow up or tie with previous ones in the franchise, right? are you implying there is absolutely no value in viewing them not just as a standalone product, but also how they succeed as a sequel?

game companies typically take fan feedback into account for sequels. should they just... not do that? because clearly noone should compare previous releases ever.

I don't think it's inappropriate to contextualize a game in a review. On the contrary, I see value in that. But I don't think it's appropriate for that context to affect the actual score. I feel like it's important information to share with the audience, but not a metric by which the game should be judged.