Topic: Nintendo Switch 2

Just watched all 3 trailers for Metroid Prime 4 on the eShop, with Ambeo surround sound (can virtualize 11 channel Atmos even when stereo), and my goodness... I'm starting to wonder if I'll even be able to sleep between now and Dec. 4th.

The music alone is worthy of not only a GotY nomination for soundtrack, but an actual award. I can't imagine any game's OST between now and next November topping it. And gameplay is so smooth. I'm gonna rock that 120fps even if it barely makes a difference, cause how often do you get to play a brand new Metroid Prime in 120 frames (heck, how often do you get to play a new Metroid Prime period?).

This is gonna be historic. I propose the dividing of the keeping of time as BM (Before Metroid Prime 4) and AM (After Metroid Prime 4). Civilization will never be the same. We'll look back and consider ourselves Phillistines and hethens for living in a world without MP4 😀

@FishyS
lol hang on a sec, I need to wrap my brain around what you just did to the conversation...

Ok, so you're willing to consider "goals" that are presented for like 5 seconds at the start of a game as "story"? So like, Wario Land on the GameBoy when Wario chases the little pirate duck across the screen and eventually bashes him, thus establishing the "pirates=bad" goal, that's enough to say the game has "story" for you? Mario Land 2 on the GameBoy showing the castle for a hot second, thus establishing a simple goal?

I mean, talk about moving the goal posts, man! You ripped the uprights out of the ground and moved them to a different city lol There's no way I can make a kick now haha

Clearly I was talking about games with cut scenes and dialogue and stuff as games with "story," but ooooooook....

Sorry, I think the confusion here is that you assumed I was arguing with you 8 posts back but I was actually just noting in response to you that some people complain about unskippable cut scenes in certain games and then I made my own only tangentially related point about a broader topic. Maybe I should have put a line or something to indicate I was no longer responding to you specifically. It can be hard to show that sometimes in these forums but looking back I acknowledge that it wasn't clear. I suppose I should have double posted instead.

But, yeah, when I said 'A bad plot is enough for Mario just to feel like you are doing something for a purpose' I meant that quite literally. No cut scenes needed for most games. Perhaps the occasional quick Toad or castle cut scene or dialogue.

I was not even slightly meaning to point to you, but sometimes people in these forums like to argue that only 'game mechanics' matter, not graphics or story or setting etc. Everyone likes to draw the line differently on what 'counts' versus doesn't. Obviously everything is part of the overall experience, but it's interesting how differently different people care about different aspects or are bothered by different aspects. Personally I think a lot of story can be amazing even with platformers if story and action are meshed correctly ( there are a couple platforming visual novel hybrids I love), but equally an in-depth story can make a game worse if it is disruptive and uninteresting. For Mario I want something but usually am happy with the bare minimum with concrete plot-related goals but not too much talking.

If people are really honest with themselves and are willing to self-reflect and challenge their beliefs upon careful consideration of the evidence, I think they'll realize that even small, seemingly "needless" story elements, such as Bowser kidnapping Peach and airships flying off to another world, really do help engage the player beyond a simple menu with a list of levels to select. Even a world map itself, which really adds nothing gameplay wise, helps engross the player.

It's why Mario Maker 2 single player campaign didnt hook most gamers nearly as much as, say, even New Super Mario Bros U, despite having far more gameplay variety. It's something you don't think about consciously much, if at all, but even tiny nuggets of story and worldbuilding can have a significant impact on your enjoyment.

I think it's why DKC Tropical Freeze is so highly regarded, beyond the impeccable gameplay and level design. The continuity of world design where each sequential level continues telling a story, like a happy savanna, then a storm comes, then everything is on fire, etc, is an element of storytelling most overlook and maybe don't even realize is one of the reasons why the game is so good.

I've long wanted to see a heavier emphasis on story in both Zelda and Metroid. The Switch duology of Zelda games didn't really deliver in the way I'd hoped, but they at least had the bare minimum. Metroid Dread and now, even more so with Prime 4, are delivering that. And I really appreciate it because I know my experience was (and will be in the case of Prime 4) more engaging as a result.

I hope Zelda follows Retro Studios lead and the next Zelda elevates its story focus.

@FishyS @JaxonH
I’m just a fan of simple story elements, even things like facial expressions or quick dialogue bubbles. Basically the old-school stuff in platformers and action games that still managed to communicate a simple plot. It kept most of the playtime grounded in the gameplay while still establishing a basic plot.

OK, look. I want you to close your eyes and envision this...

Nintendo announces a brand new 4k 60fps pinball game with HD Rumble 2... and it's Metroid Prime 4 Spinball. Imagine activating the Psychic Visor to reveal hidden warp portals you can only enter while the Psychic Visor is active, and the Visor can only activate for a few seconds and then has to wait for a cool down period.

You can strategically lay bombs to blast through blocked off areas, some of which require 3 blasts or a single hyperbomb. You can even bomb blast off the paddles if you time it right.

Imagine you can complete certain challenges to unlock a temporary 2nd ball, good until lost, which is one of the 4 Galactic Federation troops from Prime 4.

Imagine every bumper bounce and paddle flip reverberating in your hands with HD Rumble, and impeccable visuals pulling you into the world. And there's a different table for each area in Prime 4, representing new levels you unlock as you progress through a single player pinball campaign.

Why is this not a thing? Do I need to become a developer at Nintendo and pitch these ideas cause come on, this NEEDS to happen.

I'm generally with @rallydefault on this story rant, and again probably why I gravitate to some of Nintendo's releases given they buck the trend. But generally there are two things that irritate me about modern games. The first is the scripted mcguffin where the game forces you into a specific solution to a puzzle. The 2013 Tomb Raider game comes to mind, as good as it was you'd still try ideas to solve puzzles and they had some logic but.... didn't work because they weren't the specific scripted solution. One of the things that was so refreshing about BotW when it launched

The other thing that irritates me is the offloading of exposition. Which irritates me in a movie also, unless it's just a prologue kind of thing where it's ok, but in games it's very often tedious. If it must be done make it optional, make it notes or terminals you can interact with. Make it NPCs you can choose to talk to. Hell, make it a chatty companion or someone on the other side of the radio or something. That's fine. Just don't make me spend 15mins walking slowly from point A to point B for no reason other than to offload the motivations of my character. Find another way to do that

@skywake
NPCs to me are crucial for a deeper examination of a protagonist, especially one that doesn't speak. It's like looking at a diamond from various angles to see how the light reflects off it and through it. So much personality and character that can be revealed through interaction. Subtle body language reactions, how much time is spent paused to think before reacting, how the protagonist responds to them (Do they want to help? Are they indifferent? Etc.).

I'm all in on characters and dialog, exposition. BUT. In one respect I fully agree- I can't stand the 10-15 minute forced slow walking to dialog-dump, or worse yet, to say nothing and just zoom in on the back of the protagonist as if to declare, "Look how good the graphics are, can't you see the detail, now just drool over them walking for the next 10 minutes". That drives me crazy. Constant interruptions of gameplay that takes control away from the player but doesnt clearly demark it as a cutscene, so it tricks you into thinking you still have control of the character but the buttons no longer are working... I've thrown controllers for less.

Those Ambeo sound bars are expensive so most people won't have them but from my experience of sound on Nintendo systems its never been that great. The PS3 used its cell processor to process amazing 7.1 soundtracks and on my Onkyo setup it was amazing and the Yamaha setup I had before almost as good (although that was 5.1). The Xbox 360 5.1 sound was easily inferior. I guess the 360 was constrained by DVD capacity and the Switch due to cartridges and needing to be a small game. The bluray disc of PS3s allowed a huge amount of audio data and the cell processor decompressed easily with its 200 Gflops of performance on its own. I must admit I thought the Switch 2 was like the Switch 1 only supporting basic linear 5.1 via hdmi but has added a 3D effect to its headphone output which some people might like. I'd be surprised if the Switch 2 was up to much for audio as historically Nintendo have not been interested in providing good surround sound. Normally it would be done on the main CPUs and so as cost cutting measure kept the audio specification low. The wii u had a ARM based sub processor that handled its 5.1 sound and decompressing and of course the disc capacity was 25GB so there was space for decent soundtracks although my experience was it was better than 360 but a long way behind PS3. The Switch was probably sub Xbox 360 in my experience. I just think Nintendo didn't bother as much with surround sound on the original Switch, maybe because it was a portable system. So I am curious how much effort Nintendo are putting into surround sound with the Switch 2. I have no idea what the current PS6 or Xbox Series X are like as don't have those consoles but with large capacity discs and more storage on the system itself plus of course a lot more processing power I would expect them to be beyond PS3 performance. Of course PC, PS4 and Xbox One all delivered great surround sound, I personally wouldn't say they were any better than PS3 though but really it depends on how much the developers bothered with sound. Games that were on PS3 with 7.1 sound just seemed to have the same soundtrack on those systems if they had a version of the same game.

However maybe its unfair to criticise the Switch 2 as its primarily components are designed for portable use and reduced power consumption so its all about priorities. You don't get great surround sound from iphones or android phones etc typically. Why bother with amazing surround sound if much of the time the system is used portably and only needs 2 channel output. Many people will be using the Switch 2's built in speakers which I believe are the same used as in the OLED Switch model. Decent enough but not amazing and that is as much about sound as they care about. The OLED model provides better sound than the Switch Lite and original Switch, maybe not as good as the Steam Deck but better than a typical smartphone.

Been playing a little more Mario Kart earlier and... We're still waiting for switch 2's "big" game, huh? World still feels aggressively mediocre in every way but the music (which is stellar, it's a real headscratcher how that soundtrack didn't make it into TGA)
Donkey is HELLA fun, and it doesn't need to be much more but it doesn't feel..."special" in the way some other launch year titles feel on other (Nintendo) consoles.
I seriously doubt they're going to do anything fancy with prime 4 and that series as a whole is already kind of playing it safe /not particularly unique or exciting.

So...what are they cooking up? Maybe "Nintendo fatigue" is finally kicking in for me after..uh, 8 or 9(?) generations of consoles and handhelds but nothing they have lined up right now is super exciting to me, as a fan of a bunch of the series they have new games for. I'm looking forward to fire emblem, of course, but that series lives and dies by its stories and characters for me - I really enjoy three houses and this seems positioned to take after that, but engage was also abysmal, with a dumb story, bad character designs and even worse character writing. But beyond that? I usually appreciate publishers revealing games closer to their releases and Nintendo kind of stepped in it with some of the early reveals they showed for switch but right now I wish we knew ANYTHING about more of their bigger series and studios.

Same for third party announcements. Duskbloods is one I'm more interested in after playing nightreign extensively - although I'm still sort of dreading the pvp aspect because those have always been dogass in their titles, imho - monster hunter stories LOOKS more interesting than the first two in many ways but I also know how hard those games fall off towards the back half of the playthroughs, and 2 was arguably worse with that than the first game.
And.. I don't even know what else is really lined up. And I don't think it's entirely because I'm out of the loop or anything, I follow news around Nintendo, it jsut feels like they're even more tight lipped about stuff than usual.
It's also not like I don't like having the switch 2/regretting buying it. Not at all. Again, I enjoyed donkey Kong, hyrule warriors is not as good as the previous one (still better than the first though, I know I'm the weird one with THAT particular opinion) bloody pokemon dropped their best game in over a decade, and I appreciate the minor and not so minor enhancements for older titles I fired back up on whims lately. But nothing feels truly unique so far. The closest IS Bananza but that whole digging through anything gimmick gets kind of...tiring towards the end of that game. Still engaging enough but the magic fizzled out HARD around the layer with the snakes for me.

I think I just need "that" game to get its hooks REALLY into me. Wilds was that for games in general this year, for me, and so far I've not had that happen with much on Nintendo systems since totk, I think. Or dread, whichever released more recently lol

Kind of got rambly there but playing Mario Kart made me realize that I'm not quite as "enthralled" by switch 2 so far as I'd like to be. But again, I'm not saying that to imply it's a bad system, but it definitely feels more like a switch pro so far.

@Dom_31 2017 was unusually stuffed for a launch year but for me personally it was 2019 when Switch really hit its stride. Although I think Bananza was both great and seriously creative, I expect even more exciting things in future years.

Next year is a question mark — the Splatoon spinoff, the Pokemon spinoff and (presumably) Pokemon gen 10 all have a chance to be amazing but time will tell. And it's likely there is at least one really big first party surprise we don't know about yet.

I had that with wii u, earlier adopter regret. In the end I loved that system as many great first party games came out and because it was a commercial failure many third party games were sold for peanuts. I went from being disappointed to extremely happy with the system. I've noticed that the Switch 2 seems to currently have a very high return rate at least here in the UK so its probably a common issue. As Nintendo consoles are typically more about first party titles rather than third party titles you could say they are better bought later on when more first party games are available. I have to say so many of the Switch 2 titles that have been announced I have absolutely zero interest in. I'm not really into playing older Switch 1 games again or poor multi-platform releases either with no effort put in or sky high prices. So far about 95% of Switch 2 releases I have zero interest in. I buy Nintendo consoles for their first party exclusive titles. I was buying wii u third party multi-platform titles for £2.99 at best. They were rubbish versions but still well worth £2.99. The rubbish versions on Switch 2 are super highly priced. Cyberpunk is an old game to me. I played it like 5 years ago on a i5 PC with a RX 590 GPU. I don't remember it being that expensive back then but now on Switch 2 its super expensive and not even as good plus I didn't like the game that much to be honest. So far there is only one title I want on Switch 2 and that is Mario Kart World. I know some people are negative about it but its the only exclusive title I want so far. I quite like the look of Donkey Kong Bonanza but its simply not worth it to me the price they are charging. It's not something I would want to pay big money for. Also Metroid Prime 4 doesn't seem as good as I hoped and there is a Switch 1 version anyway which I can buy.

I should add I'm mainly a PC gamer but also have a good collection of older consoles so my perspective may not be the same as many. I would say my Switch 1 is my secondary console though because it has so many great exclusives but they took years to come out on the original Switch. I got my first Switch in 2022 I think because I wasn't interested in Switch conversions from wii u. I didn't buy it until I could justify its purchase and had at least half a dozen exclusive games I wanted.

The Switch 2 is sexy hardware and desirable but I just feel like its a long way from being a good console yet. For me a portable gaming system isn't really a portable gaming system unless you can get good battery runtime. I do have a steamdeck but its more something I play in the house rather than put in my backpack. My Switch lite is my main portable gaming system in addition to a phone.

@Dom_31
Uhm... what was "that" game for you on Switch 1?

I didn't have one... I loved most of them lol

I guess most people would say BotW? Which is funny because it's not even an exclusive.

@rallydefault xenoblade 2, I think that was a fairly early one, too. BotW was a Wii U game to me, still kind of is although I gotta say it's night and day playing that game on Wii U or Switch at this point. Korok forest be damned lol

@FishyS like I said, I don't wanna say Donkey Kong isn't a great game, but I also think the whole GOTY shebang (which is a worthless discussion to me... Because none of those uncultured pigs realize how great Monster Hunter 6 actually is cough) is blown way out of proportion. At this point in 2025, with how.. Little I saw in the year's releases, in retrospect - and thinking for most of the year that we have a VERY stacked calendar, ironically - I'm even considering giving prime 4 a shot. And I'm gonna say it... That'd probably be a waste of money because so far I've not truly enjoyed a single one of those games. I recognize what they are, given the context of their original releases, and what Nintendo offer otherwise, but they're SUCH bland games, in my opinion. Prime utterly pales in comparison to the numbered/2D metroids, to me, and even compared to most other metroidvanias. It'd have to be on discount right away like Pokémon was, though. I'm not paying 80€ for that game 🙃

Generally 'that' game has been on Nintendo's console for me, with a couple exceptions.

2017 - Breath of the Wild (NS)
2018 - Valkyria Chronicles 4 (NS)
2019 - Fire Emblem: Three Houses (NS)
2020 - Final Fantasy VII Remake (PS4)
2021 - Monster Hunter Rise (NS)
2022 - Xenoblade Chronicles 3 & Triangle Strategy (NS) (yes, both)
2023 - Fire Emblem Engage (NS)
2024 - Metaphor: ReFantazio (PC)
2025 - Donkey Kong Bananza (NS)

This is why I bought Switch 2 day one. Nintendo delivers for me, quite consistently.

@Dom_31 Compare Wii U to the NS2 Edition of BotW if you really wanna see Night and Day, lol

@Dom_31 Interesting you say Xenoblade 2 was the game for you. That was 9 months in, so for the Switch 2 the equivalent would be March.

@BonzoBanana
Ya, I would say the 5.1 surround is just as good as any because it uses Linear PCM which is raw and uncompressed. How good it sounds really comes down to the implementation on a game by game basis. I play Hogwarts Legacy and get pretty good directional audio- when using Revelio I can easily pinpoint which direction the secret is pinging in. And remember, Ambeo has no satellite speakers. It's all accomplished by bouncing the audio off the walls and ceiling to give the surround. Even watching movies I've never felt a sound was coming from behind me but I definitely have been tricked into thinking it's coming from my side walls which is nuts. But my room isn't really set up properly for it- I've demoed it where it does bounce sound behind you in a symmetrical, sound padded room.

The 3D Audio just sounds richer and fuller. Again, it really comes down to individual implementation. But ya, as for the Ambeo, the "Ambeo Mode" when activated makes everything sound so much richer and fuller. A lot of times it's not even about directional sounds so much as it is about just having a massive sound bubble where the audio isn't one dimensional.

But you sound like you have one yourself, or have had one in the past?

Not at all what you meant, but this made me curious:

There are currently 219 Switch 2 games (counting Switch 2 versions but not miscellaneous DLC). A few of those have multiple versions, so around 200 distinct games give or take. So in 6 months we've already gotten to the point where even if someone disliked 95% of the games, there would still be 10 games of interest.

Personally I have so far bought 1 true Switch 2 exclusive and 4 upgrade packs. And there are... 37 Switch 2 games in my wishlist 😆

OK, this is the craziest deal yet. $100 eShop credit for $80 on Costco website, that's 20% off.

So you can buy $500 in eShop Credit for $400. Which means buying a NSW2 on Nintendo Store for 20% off only costs you $360, and the bundle only costs you $400.

You can literally buy a NSW2 for $10 more than the original price of the NSW OLED, and it's not even 6 months old. I just ordered one myself since I had a scratch on my screen (I removed with Novus 321 scratch remover but you can see the blotch with micro scratches and no shiny finish where I rubbed the scratch out, though it looks flawless when actually playing it, but I figured it's an easy 2nd dock and extra joycon, and ya... can't say no to a $360 NSW2 even if I do already own one)

https://www.costco.com/p/-/nintendo-eshop-four-25-egift-cards...

@JaxonH Plus $65 membership fee. Good deal if you have a Costco membership but worse than the other deal you mentioned if you don't.