Sonic Mania Dev Clarifies Involvement With Sonic Origins, Says It's "Purely A Sega-Developed Product"

Theoretically, whether they were involved or not, it shouldn't change much of anything since fans that like sonic to this day, mostly like it because of the first 4 mainline games. It sounds like they are giving them the royal treatment. Sonic isn't my cup of tea anymore, but I'm glad the fans are excited.

So it sounds like the Mania team just did with Sonic 3 & Knuckles what Whithead had already done with 1, 2, and CD's mobile versions from a few years back, handed that work over to the SEGA team, and then SEGA went and put them all together in a nice little package, added unifying style and flair, as well as the extra modes and features exclusive to this new version. I think I get it lol.

I'm just really excited to play Sonic 3, I've never played it before. When was the last time S3&K was released? Maybe it was the DS collection, but I'm stupid because it wasn't. It has still been a while though.

Does that mean the soundtrack for Sonic 3 (composed by Michael Jackson) has been changed?

That's good to know but then who's working on Sonic Frontiers and that one 2D Sonic game? Surely Sonic Team can't be the only one working on all three games, that would be the biggest crunch ever.

Soooo... Should we be worried?

@Mikmoomamimocki
Wii VC - February 15, 2010
NDS - March 2, 2010
Steam - January 26, 2011

I just find it funny that people say S3&K never gets re-released but Sega released it a bunch of times in such a short span of time. It might also have been on the PS3/360 stores but I don't care enough to look it up.

Except it’s not really “purely Sega Developed”. Sonic 1, 2, & CD were already made by Christian Whitehead & Sonic 3 is being made by Headcanon, leaving the animated cutscenes, missions, music player and museum to be done by Sega.

@AlienX 2011 was 11 years ago though, that period ain't short. That's almost as long as how Final Fantasy Versus XIII got put on hold until it became Final Fantasy XV.

@Axecon
Nobody knows as of now, and Sega probably won’t tell us until the collection is released.

@Serpenterror
Well Sega working on a Sonic game doesn’t equal Sonic Team. Sonic Team is on Sonic Frontiers, so Sega probably got a different team for Sonic Origins. Either way, Sonic Origins is still just a collection including 3 already made projects, 1 new externally made project, and a few new modes based on the 4 projects included, so it doesn’t need too many people from Sega working on it anayway.

Interesting. Though to be fair, I guess there wasn't much work to be done for Sonic 1, 2, & CD. aside from a few touch-ups & QoL improvements.

I figured HeadCannon would be busy with Sonic 3 & Knuckles the most.

@Serpenterror Does time really matter? When the DS game can be played on 3DS which was supported up until recently, the Wii VC version could be bought and played on Wii U also until very recent, and the Steam version is still available to buy for just $5. Game's always been available.

All of this is what I'd assumed, Whitehead's old versions being reused but with the minor tweaks added, and Headcannon updating the engine to work with the unique S3&K gimmicks, powerups and moveset, and making the levels. It was fairly clear that things like the extra challenges, modes, and stuff like menus, dlc etc were decisions made by Sega themselves, as was the confusing marketing that must have been at least slightly embarassing to these guys, who are usually 100% on point with reading the room and nailing the small details.

In theory, none of the informationm in those tweets is concerning in the slightest. In fact its very encouraging to have it confirmed that the excellent mobile versions are being used as the basis and Headcanon made S3&K to the same standard. I always said that if it was just a barebones console port of the Whitehead versions, and a matching S3&K, I'd have happily dropped a full $60. So things like the mirror mode, story mode, animations, challenges etc are a nice bonus for me, assuming the implementation of them doesn't cause problems.

However, the fact that Headcanon are being quite so specific and effusive (all caps?) in distancing themselves from Origins as a package has me worried that they've seen or heard something they don't approve of, or they are concerned Sega's tampering may have somehow damaged their work, lead to glitches, performance problems, etc. I hope that I'm worrying over nothing and they are just being so clear about things because of contractual stuff and some internal programmer at Sega was upset that people were thinking Headcanon did ALL the work or something like that.

@Mikmoomamimocki Yes I think the DS collection is the last official release of S3&K, unless you count accessing the earlier released XBLA on newer hardware. Steam version was 2011 but I think it replaced the previously listed PC/Win port, and the Steam frontend was a port of a previously released collection but with each game split as DLC so may have been a technicality case rather than a genuinely original release from a contract perpsective.

@MeloMan
There’s not really any reasons to worry, since the other 3 games are the already made Whitehead versions. So that leaves Sega to make animated cutscenes, a music player, a museum, then missions, boss rush & mirror mode, which will use mechanics from the 4 externally remastered games.

Oh that's disappointing. I was hoping they'd be involved in some way, so that we might get some neat surprise like Hidden Palace Zone when Sonic 2 IOS came out, but I guess that won't be the case.

It's still nice though that SEGA is finally releasing those on console

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm…

I dunno how I feel about this…

Sega as internal teams have a bit of a mixed track record when it comes to remastering classic sonic.

I wonder which one we will get? A quality product?
Or a sonic genesis for the gba style game…

@AlienX whoops sorry

It has been a while though, is the Steam release the newest one?

@AlienX Well the Steam version doesn't really matter since you could basically just play any of the hundreds of emulated version anyways but the rest are a long time ago. The fact Nintendo already closed shop on the Wii means you can't buy the Wii version anymore and the fact that the DS version is physical only means it won't always be available for purchase. Also this Origin Collection is the first time Sonic 3 and Knuckles will be available in true HD widescreen. Yes both Sonic the Hedgehog 3 and Sonic and Knuckles were available on the Sonic Genesis Ultimate Collection for PS3, Xbox 360, and Atgames mini system but those versions had the games separately and can't be lock-on so to be able to have Sonic 3 and Knuckles in full here with the Origin Collection is a more complete package.

@Mikmoomamimocki The answer is yes but you better act fast cause Sega is going to remove those older Steam versions in favor of the Origin Collection.

@PBandSmelly Widescreen only applies to Anniversary Mode, if you want pixel perfect or 4:3, Original Mode is still in the game. Also all those games you list are already available in other Sega collections for the same platform, those that aren't were garbage anyways like that Sonic arcade game which feature Mighty and Ray.

@Mikmoomamimocki Yeah as others have said, S3&K is still currently available on Steam (only £3.99!) but Sega are planning on delisting it soon, sadly. Its worth buying if you are a PC gamer as you can then legally use the Steam ROM in "Sonic 3 AIR" which is a really well made fan port with Whitehead style improvements, widescreen etc. Thats currently the best way to play that game, though obviously its PC only.

I don't really care which development teams worked on this, so long as it plays well and at feels, more or less, true to the originals.

@Alpha008
Luckily Sega isn’t actually doing much remastering as Sonic Origins is using the already completed Whitehead versions of 1, 2, & CD with slight changes. As I’ve said before, Sega is basically just combining 4 profession fan remasters (plus a new blusphere game) with new animated cutscenes, a music player, and a museum, then creating mirror mode, boss rush mode, and mission mode by slightly editing parts of each game.
I’m sure the final product will be great, definitely way better then Sonic Genesis on GBA.

Oof, this probably means no knux in sonic cd.

@PBandSmelly 3D Blast needs representing. And unrelatedly so does Mega Man & Bass from Capcom

So none of the games are developed by them, except all the bits that they developed? Got it.

@AlienX I think it was but you could only have Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles separately unless the SEGA Vintage version of Sonic & Knuckles had an option to play Sonic 3&K.

@samuelvictor That honestly sucks. Once it's gone, Sonic 3 A.I.R will be unplayable by legal means.

Sounds like they are washing their hands of it, therefore know its going to be buggy as hell

@SmashFan347 see, thats why iran exists
Theres litrally no way to play games legally, so would i bother if its illegal to play sonic 3 air after that? :shrug:

@Bunkerneath
It at least looks like the Sega side of its development is tonedeaf, the out of place character select screens, the bizarre DLC, thinking sound test is a big feature in 2022 and that it includes music from games not included, no Knuckles in CD.
@PBandSmelly
That would require Sega to hire and pay the Headcannon and Evening Star to make a new project which Sega seems utterly unwilling and to do, look at Origins Sega didn’t even publicly announce that they did a bit of the work on It compare this to Sonic Team where Sega will hype their name up despite all the bombs they put out. Mania was the best received Sonic game in a long long time and sold extremely will yet Sega doesn’t want to use the dev’s names to promote Origins?

I hope it's not the same team at Sega who have been looking after the mobile versions. They did a terrible job after they took over from Headcanno;, Sonic 1 was impossible to complete for at least a year as Sonic would warp into the ceiling for the penultimate level cut scene where Robotnik drops him down a pit.

Plus last time I checked the girders in the background in Chemical Zone just pop onto the screen halfway after the new team botched the parallax scrolling for the widescreen update.

Not to mention I paid for those games before they were turned into ad-supported versions as part of Sega Forever. I don't mind them changing the funding method, but at least they could have ensured existing users weren't forced into viewing adverts.

Bad emulation confirmed?

Awww...
So.. um..
..
.. I'll wait for the reviews.

@SmashFan347 Not really. Once it's delisted, you'll no longer be able to buy it on the Steam store, but if you already own a copy of the game on Steam no one is revoking your right or ability to download, play and access your copy of the game. By delisting it, they are only removing its page from the Steam store itself--they aren't touching your library. So as long as you already own a copy, nothing really changes.

People only mentioning Whitehead when regarding to these "old" versions of Sonic 1, 2 & CD but people tend to forget that Simon Thomly AKA Stealth and who's currently leading Headcannon games.

@samuelvictor Yeah, I've heard that SEGA's steam classics are really cool because they basically just give you the rom to play on whatever you want.

Nonetheless, it seems like Stealth and his team really made sure it looked good. Because, Sonic 3 looks amazing in widescreen!

@SmashFan347 @Mikmoomamimocki Yeah its great that Sega allowed Steam to sell legal roms that can be used in any emulators etc, and it really sucks if they go through with delisting them. Thankfully its not exactly hard to get the roms online, so AIR and other excellent fan projects, mods, hacks etc can still exist, its just annoying and confusing as to why Sega would want to remove that revenue stream, knowing people are just going to download them for free without the option, and Sega actively encourage things like romhacks within the fanbase so its unlikely they'll start acting like Nintendo and suing left right and centre. Its like they are refusing money. I'm still hopeful they will leave them on Steam and just remove stuff like older, inferior ports, collections etc.

as funny as this sounds but i wish they remade the sonic the hedgehog master system games versions but longer

@dr_frahnkunsteen Sadly, Sega already confirmed that Knuckles is not playable in CD.

I think they are hyping this way too much, I have a feeling that we're going to be a little bit disappointed I hope not, but I don't really understand why they are saying this is remastered, it sounds like it could contain very good versions of the original games, but I'm worried about the soundtrack, and I'm also worried about end product quality, as Sega has had lots of trouble in the quality area in recent decades.

No offense to Sega but they shouldn't be touching anything Sonic Related they should just leave development of anything Sonic Related up to the Mania Team exclusively this is very concerning especially if there's ever a true Adventure 3 game

@BulkSlash I agree but you have to keep In mind Sega is really not there mentally literally they have flopped the Sonic franchise countless times now all while ignoring the community smh "Mania" was the first success in decades other then the adventure games which I loved growing up and now. But it's shameful tbh literally if money is what they are hurting for listening to exclusively what fans want to a T would ensure a endless flow of money but they are to backwards to ever understand that kinda like Nintendo they all care about us temporarily when they want our money other then that we are all walking paychecks to them it's the hard cold truth we all must accept "Sonic" ended back with mania and adventures etc