
Nintendo's stance on its involvement with events like EVO has been a source of much conversation over the past few months. Most recently, ex-Nintendo employees Kit and Krysta hypothesised about the potential reasons for the company pulling out of EVO 2022.
Now, Super Smash Bros. streamer Hungrybox has called the company out on its stance whilst delivering an acceptance speech on behalf of 'Best Smash Bros. Streamer' winner Mang0.
Hungrybox didn't hold back either, lamenting Nintendo's lack of activity within the eSports space, stating that Mang0 did a lot more for the property than Nintendo itself within the last year:
Similar to every other Smash event this year, Mang0 did not show up. But you know what Mang0 did do this year? He supported Smash Bros., which isn’t the flashiest game, it’s not the biggest game, we don’t have the most money by far, but he did much more than a certain company called Nintendo did.
He went on, however, to express optimism regarding Nintendo's own upcoming championship circuit:
I’m hoping this year with the circuit they’re doing they hopefully finally give us the chance we never had. Even though we’re not at Evo, and even though we’re not at a lot of events, Smash is a beautiful game, it deserves to shine, and Mang0 has shown us this game can be the most beautiful thing you’ve ever seen in eSports.
The circuit in question is in relation to a new partnership between Nintendo and the eSports team 'Panda Global' for the first officially licensed championship circuit for Super Smash Bros.
You can check out the acceptance speech for yourself over on Twitch.
Needless to say it's not particularly good press for Nintendo, but hopefully its official foray into the eSports world will bring back some much needed goodwill in the community.
[source dotesports.com]
Comments 69
If there is Dance Dance Revolution competition from EVO, sign me in.
I thought that was pretty funny that they brought up mangos “biggest rival” to accept his award for him
I get it wholeheartedly but Nintendo chases the dollar. That’s all this move was. Idk if folks out there should really be blindsided.
Sounds like sour grapes from click-starved streamers.
Sony owns EVO, so why would ANYONE think Nintendo would support that?
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I genuinely don't think Nintendo give a flying one here. They are very much from the you give us money to play our games school, not the other way around. Loads around the games industry has changed over the years, doesn't mean everyone has to though. Nintendo won't no matter how much streamers moan.
Bash Nintendo, yet continue to stream Smash to pay his rent.
"Person gets angry cause Nintendo doesn't want to support it's competitor Sony"
@Mattock1987 Just like all those dumb articles about what Sakurai tweeted he had for breakfast, I guess.
Why wouldn't Nintendo want to support EVO or the competitive smash community...Google both oh I see yeah good call Nintendo
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@Link41x
Finally!
Someone else that thinks as I do!
That’s one community I will never understand….
Smash community bad. Give me upvote.
Nintendo don't want anything to do with you, maybe now you understand.
The Smash fanbase doesn't seem to realise this entitled attitude and constant complaining is only driving away the little good will they had left from the wider Nintendo community. The fact they believe there are more integral to the games success than the company making it shows just how deluded and attention desperate they are.
Perhaps the best way to send a message to Nintendo is to simply boycott the Smash tournaments they are working on, do all that hashtag stuff these guys love to do, to show Nintendo we are not interested in enabling this community.
Nintendo had their reasons. Hungrybox is way too vocal about his opinions. Considering he sat there making fake hype videos for that Nickelodeon smash rip off just to get a pay cheque I think he’s the last person who should be handing out criticism.
I don't follow these guys closely but it's a weird contrast here with the best Street Fighter players in the world who are predominantly Japanese, like Daigo Umehara and Tokido, who are almost universally respected by fans, called "gods", and who Sony sponsors countless tournaments for because it's obviously fantastic advertising for them. Ditto for other series and stars like SonicFox and GO1.
Meanwhile you get this comment section making the best Smash Bros players on the planet out to be a bunch of attention-starved streamers and little else. Like yeah, they've spent their lives becoming the best in the world at a competition that millions of people watch and are familiar with, that does free advertising for Nintendo. If all I had to show for that was precarious twitch donations I'd be on edge too.
Every single word in that speech is stupid. What do you mean it’s not “the biggest game”? It’s the Switch’s third bestselling game of all time. Also Nintendo added freaking DLC in the last year. Did Mang0 do that?
Imagine "slamming" and "lamenting" something a company is in no way obliged to do in the first place. Then again, Streamer Awards particularly sounds like First World Awards as well, so I guess it all checks out.😅
Context:
https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2020/07/talking_point_what_do_abuse_scandals_say_about_the_smash_bros_community_and_its_future
"Slammed"? It's literally one obnoxious guy, whining on the internet, as they do, because Nintendo won't do what they want.
What chance? The chance to whine even more?
Hungrybox is acting like a kid who's had his toys taken away!
Plus noone is going to give a damn what this person says. Smash isn't in Evo. Get over it!
Now Sonic Battle on the other hand? 😀
Considering all the abuse scandals in the Smash community, Sony owns EVO and this is more a rant from an attention seeker streamer to try to increase his views, I can say for sure that this will be forgotten tomorrow.
@BabyYoda71 Mang0 created the Melee game, licensed all the characters, and coded the bug fest that allows it to be the strongest competitive Smash game next to ultimate. Oh wait.....
In all seriousness. I like Hboxs content, I think generally his heart is in the right place. But these Smash People need to read the room. MULTIPLE sexual harassment allegations including one (while was shot down for how ridiculous it was) against Hbox himself. You also have top Smash players advocating pirating and hacking the Ultimate game to "Save it's online" ,constantly bashing the developer of the game, and fighting against Nintendos own classification of the game(Party game, not fighter).
You can argue some of these things, like Ultimates lackluster online and netcode. But why would Nintendo want to pour money and support anyone above?
Smash was used to groom underaged kids at their events and they still call them out publicly to demand their support. Good luck, you are going to need it.
Who even is this guy?
People like hungrbox are so ungrateful, maybe esports will never be a main focus for nintendo but man... they still made the game that gave him fame in the first place.
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It seems that there were more problems within EVO, besides the fact that Sony owns the competition now, as pointed out by Kit and Krysta on their podcast. And, who cares what that lifeless guy has to say about anything, only people that "compete" in that scene knows who he is.
I call this sour loser and poor sportsmanship they didn't make or create or make it successful. That comes from game selling. Their streaming of game plays gives Nintendo free advertisements. And for EVO issues they should fix those toxic environments first before talking how righteousness they are.
Well of course the comments are horrible. And lack self awareness.
@Link41x That’s a really low blow. These people work very hard to attain the levels of play we see at the likes of EVO. I don’t think you can even define a “real job.”
@nessisonett People have to dump on others to feel better about themselves.
@FightMikes Ok well, I’ve never heard of any of these people so okay.
It did say in the last year though
I can't imagine getting this mad about games. Nintendo have always had this mentality that games should be fun pastimes. The Smash community, even among FGC, has a hell of a reputation for being difficult (and smelly), I can see why they'd want to create some space between publisher and community.
Wow. As an avid smash player and follower of the community I just can't believe how out of touch a lot of you are. Nintendo has seriously dropped the ball on the competitive smash scene for years. The scene literally has had had to build itself up with no help. Nintendo/real adult organizers not being part of the scene is what contributed to the fact that it became such an unhealthy place where bad things happened. Kids organizing events for kids, what could go wrong?
Many e-sport scenes have had a #metoo happen these past years and that's a good thing. But smash stood out because the developers had absolutely nothing to do with the scene of their own game... like an absent parent.
Nintendo finally getting involved and doing it with already established smash-organization Panda is long overdue.
Even leaving all of the scanals out of the picture: much of the hype around smash actually comes from the fact that melee survived and had an underground scene, both in america and japan. Hungrybox and Mang0 were part of cultivating nintendo's brand. Who knows what that's meant in sales? While every other devolper would be there to do collaborations and encourage that nintendo has, much like an ancient japanese dinosaur, shut down melee from evo (long before any scandals in the scene were known), they've prohibited tweaked versions of the game that works online, they've focused on casual only, almost like they think any competitive showings of the game would hurt the brand.
I think they're just now realizing that any fighting game IS competitive, that casual and comptitive and tournaments and social media... it all goes hand in hand and it all multiplies in the end. And I think the fact that they made an incredibly balanced and yet super fun game in Ultimate shows that they've been thinking this way for at least some years.
Here's to the future of smash
Let's hope the nintendo/panda thing works out great for everybody so i never have to read your cringe automated nintendo fanboy comments again lol...
I think the hardcore Smash community need to understand and accept that Nintendo don't make Smash for them nor care for their side. Its a game designed and intended for kids, family's, casuals and gaming fans not sweaty neckbeards obsessed over Melee and a game not made for them in mind.
I really don't understand the outrage.
Be thankful Nintendo ever participated in EVO because that remains a far bigger shock than them now deciding its not for them.
Why shouldn't Nintendo do their own thing?
Who's to say it won't be better for Smash as a whole?
If eSports is to continue growing, it has to crack the mainstream. EVO is not going to achieve that. Nintendo probably won't either, but off the back of the success of Switch, it has a better chance.
I don't understand the significance of Smash not being at EVO. Smash doesn't need EVO, and despite EVO's viewer numbers taking a hit, EVO will be fine.
Smash was the biggest event at EVO, and is big enough to have it's own event(s).
Hbox says whatever is on his mind regardless if it has any merit or not like in his videos what else is new?
He is a moron if he can’t comprehend the multiple reasons why Nintendo would pull out of Evo at this point. Smash never needed Evo to thrive either. The fact that Nintendo is doing their own circuits shows they are not abandoning the competitive scene like he has been fear mongering in his videos.
I honestly just see this as a publicity stunt of having dumb controversial take in hope of getting more subscribers from the attention it would get like for instance NL making an article about it here.
Fun Fact: He relies on streaming Smash content to pay his bills. Sure he talked big about the Nick Smash clone like every other streamer, but once interest of that died he crawled back to Smash. Very definition of bite the hand that feeds him shamelessly
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Just imagine becoming the best Clue/Cluedo player in the world and demanding that Hasbro supports it's competitive scene
Nintendo makes toys and they don't like depending on anyone but themselves on how to do their work
@swoose if anything, I at least want to hear Daigo speak because he is humble and can spit some deep thoughts on gaming. Hbox is just annoying, it's almost embarrassing agreeing with him cause of how he handles himself. But his skills are top notch
I'm shocked Hungrybox doesn't know that Smash is actually one of the biggest fighting games. Also it did fine before without EVO and also regularly the highest viewing of EVO events. Competitive Smash will be fine.
Hungrybox? Oh he's hungry allright, hungry for attention.
@Sagobok Who’s out of touch? Ultimate became the best-selling fighting game in history, and Nintendo did it without catering to the competitive scene. The idea that Nintendo ‘s lack of involvement caused people to abuse children is silly and insulting.
“It’s not the biggest game”
“It deserves to shine”
Yes, the most successful fighting game of all time is not BIG enough and DESERVES to shine thanks to these glorious streamers..
Screw them! I’m tired of this condescending attitude towards Nintendo from these Hardkuur gamers.
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It's a good thing they have these tournaments, otherwise nobody would ever have picked up a game like Super Smash Bros. Nintendo really needs these guys, otherwise I'm sure they'll get bought up by Sony any day now. /s
I've been at my wit's end with Smash fans for a while. EVO is a mess of sexual harassment allegations, sexism, and even sexual assault allegations. Why would family-friendly Nintendo want to be anywhere close to that level of brand toxicity? Also, Smash Ultimate is the best-selling fighter of all time! It does not need EVO to get more sales it is doing that well enough on its own. It has sold more than Street Fighter II by 10 million units and five times more than Street Fighter V.
I'm not one to get cranky about stuff like this, but the amount of EVO fans ignoring the actual issues around these events is shocking. Absolutely shocking!
Truth be told? I'd want to distance myself from all of these cretins as well.
@BartoxTharglod It goes beyond that. These guys want to be treated like pro-athletes and EVO to be treated like a proper sporting league. The problem is the dirt that is up in their scene would have had their league collapse and be in a PR nightmare. Look at the NHL recently with the situation regarding the Chicago Blackhawks. Men lost their jobs and their reputations were in tatters for even being privy to ***** that was happening in the locker room and not doing anything about it.
The amount of sexist crap that happens at EVO? That would have sunken eSports for a decade if this was mainstream. EVO is a joke to me and should not be taken seriously till they've cleaned up their *****. Do you want to be treated like pro-athletes and organizations? Than act like one and clean up your act.
@Arawn93
yeah while it does seem unfortunate at a glance that smash was pulled from evo i do see how it could very much be more to do with the controversies surrounding EVO itself (and the sony thing) than anything related to abandoning the competitive scene.
Oddly it seems like a large amount of comments that do mention Nintendo "abandoning" the competitive are from people who are those treating it as a positive rather than it being people criticising said move since it feels like some people are doing an odd kind of gatekeeping where they act like a game that is easy to pick up shouldn't have a competitive scene (the whole "this isn't for you" rhetoric)
as you mentioned there is still very much a space for competitive smash (such as the examples you gave) and that there are many reasons why nintendo would distance itself from the evo brand rather than outright dismissing the competitive players.
The underlining thing here is simple: Smash Bros is not a free to play online game, whose success is driven by online community engagement.
Smash success is driven by retail sales, and the broader community that supports it is decentralized. It is, as many people said here, driven by the moms and dads, casual players. That is fine, and Nintendo understands this very well.
I also think Nintendo understands very well the risks of supporting an online community of a game whose base form of play is not online.
The streamers of smash are basically looking at their neighbours League of Legends, Valorant, etc., and demanding equal treatment. They fail to understand that Smash was not made to be driven by online streamer engagement.
"Smash is a beautiful game, it deserves to shine."
It's sold 27 million units! It's practically on fire, judging by how much light it's getting!
The "Nintendo's right to shun competitive Smash" argument sounds about as smart as the "Nintendo's right to ignore online play" argument from about 20 years ago.
The irony, of course, is Nintendo is joining with Panda Global (as Hungrybox mentioned), but reading the article is never a prerequisite for commenting on it.
Yes a guy (Mang0) who spent the last few years playing a game on his mother's basement for the whole world to see is more supportive of Super Smash Bros. Ultimate than Nintendo? This dude must be on drug or something. Making a game like Super Smash Bros. Ultimate is not as easy as playing a game for free in your mother's basement.
Esports players are the influencers of gaming and the voice of gamers. I've been watching smash on evo every year as it is the biggest smash tournament. Remember Microsoft allowed banjo to be in smash Square allowed cloud (100% Sony character) to be in smash but now it does not allow smash to be in evo. And for what? Because now Sony owns it how would that do smash or Nintendo any harm?..
Mang0 has done more for Smash than Nintendo? What are they talking about and who the heck is Mang0?
Sometimes it really comes off like these eSports guys think they're gods among us. I'm sure there are people that admire them, I'm sure they are very good at video games, but in the grand scheme they're small potatoes like the rest of us. We don't all watch eSports or care about them, it's already a subset of a subset. It's a bubble and an echo chamber. Smash doesn't need eSports to thrive like say League of Legends or Starcraft, it's not about hitting that scene and gaining that branding and reputation. If anything it's a potential deterrent to it's more casual and family audiences. But the eSports community cannot see that, or just don't want too.
You know the only times I tend to learn eSporter's names is when they get in trouble or they're moaning that Nintendo wont give them money for playing Smash Bros good. It's making anything remotely eSports feel an instant negative to me, which is unfair on the majority of that community, but it's hard to shake. It feels toxic and entitled.
@Pigeon
Except for the part where Sony has been a bitter rival to Nintendo that Nintendo themselves accidentally "created" whereas Microsoft just jumped in.
I do wish Nintendo would do more to nurture and assist their “pro” communities but I think this is just incessant whining.
Like others have stated, Smash is designed as a casual game first and a pro game second. It’s always been that way. Hell the first three were never intended to be pro games; Melee happened to become one solely by accident.
Nintendo could build a Smash game for pros, but then it would damage its sales potential among casuals. Smash sells primarily to casual fans who because at its core it’s easy to pick up and play.
@Arisen
Cloud is owned by Square-Enix, not Sony.
Just another entitled whining Smash player passing through.
For a franchise that was never intended to be a competitive fighting game by the IP holder, I guess expecting too much is the norm now.
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