Fire Emblem's Two Versions Will Offer Very Different Challenges

Must...Not...Import! Resist...resist!!!

I do hope that the difficulty can be ramped up for the White Kingdom...I like their appearance more. So I'll play that story line first.

I'll probably get the collector's edition if they release that in the US.

Yeah, I'll play the White Kingdom.
I really loved Awakening, but I'm not patient enough to think about strategies.

Gotta get that $$$

Oh, this is just icing on top of the cake for me.

The Nohr side has the best sister, therefore it will get my ₱₱₱₱

I thought when you buy one, you get the other one for free!

I would get the white kingdom version. I had a hard enough time with Awakening.

And to think Awakening was going to be the last FE if it flopped. Now the series is stronger than ever. Personally, I'm not a fan. But I am happy that those who love the series are getting new games.

Official News as to the Download of the Game(s):
– The downloadable version does not contain both sides. It does not lock the other route when you select one. You pay to receive everything up until chapter five, and once you make a decision, you will have to download everything from chapters six, onward, for the respectful route. The second download is free because you have already paid. If you want to try the alternative version, you have to buy DLC in the same way those with physical copies will.

***************
This doesn't seem to be that good...

Now I'm confused! So does that mean that the black kingdom won't have casual mode at all? So I have to be stuck with White Kingdom after playing Awakening which have less appealing characters compared to the Black Kingdom?

As much as I love Awakening being one of my all time favorites, I want to avoid playing Awakening again because of the new game showing up. So does this mean that the Black Kingdom is the more definitive version of the Fire Emblem If?

Pffffffffft like anyone would buy just one version.

I'm going with Hoshido. I play games for fun...

I'll pass. I have Fire Emblem Awakening. I like it, but it's just not my type of game. Seriously, I'm playing on casual mode, and I'm completely stuck. And I only just came to the part where 'Marth' took of 'his' mask!

@Poketendo You're less than two hours in on casual? Ohhhh my. The game does pick up once you can start training your troops and getting married, though.

I'm so busy making everyone super best friends, unlocking the swimsuit area and all of its silly dialog, I often forget there's a war going on in that game.

I know I will end up just buying both, so... well done Nintendo, you get double my money.

Both. Of course both. And all DLC. And any related Amiibos.

I'll play through White first, then move on to Black once I'm back in practice.

I'm definitely playing the Nohr one first. Not only does the purpose behind the fighting appeal to me much more than merely seeking peace for the continent, but ramped up difficulty is always welcome.

In fact I kind of dislike how most Fire Emblem won't just let you first play through them in max difficulty already since I'd love to do that but I don't have the time or energy to invest in several playthroughs to unlock it. I imagine the If games might be the same, but the base difficulty being higher is certainly a plus for me.

But, yeah, I'm totally buying both games and that third DLC route.

Thank goodness for the different victory conditions on the Nohr side. Awakening felt really tedious because it seemed like on every stage, the only thing you had to do was kill everyone you can see and then boom, you won, yay. Whereas in past games, there were things like defend your base, protect this person etc. I also really like the ones where you can kill everyone if you want, or you can just defend for a certain number of turns.

@Yorumi I am happy with this two game choice, with the Nohr game to appease long time FE fans, and the Hoshido for people who only like Awakening. It's not just a difficulty option, it is a gameplay and overall style difference.

@Poketendo Wow... I'm not mad... I'm actually really impressed...

Oh? Surprising they claim to be tailoring the game towards old school fans considering the pre-Awakening games barely sold in comparison. Maybe Black Kingdom might actually be a decent Fire Emblem

@Yorumi - I guess it costs $20 to implement Easy - Normal - Hard into a game.

If Nintendo really cared about it's fans though they would have made 1 on 3DS and 1 on Wii U. Wii U is lacking in the strategy game department. Actually in all game departments besides 2D side scrolling platformers.

Gimme a new Wii U game already!!

Black Edition for me! All the way!

@rjejr There will obviously be difficulty settings for both games. There always have been. The difference is that, to keep it simple, Nohr's easy mode will be on par with Hoshido's hard, and Nohr's hard will be a huge challenge.

Besides, they're completely different games with completely different stages and objectives, so it goes far beyond a simple difficulty adjustment.

@russellohh LMAO best comment ever. Super best friends are important.

Black version seems by countrymile the more interesting of the two, but I will be getting both.

The differences hopefully better be more than just difficulty. For Black, they need to go back to the complexity of the home console games, specifically Radiant Dawn. Bring back AT LEAST S rank weapons, the magic trinity AND the anima trinity, weapon weight, weapon durability, Radiant Dawn-style skills where each skill is passed around rather than EVERYONE being able to learn things, weapon colors when forging, height advantages, and (highly unlikely, but would be amazing) third-tier classes.

They can't claim to be catering to old-time fans if it's just a difficulty difference. The game would still be casual in terms of FE games, just like Awakening and the White version.

we already knew this so nothing new here. It was in the announcement trailer

I'll be playing both versions, without a doubt.

I'll probaly start with the White and then play the Black afterward. I'm no noob when it comes to Fire Emblem, but even I will admit that Awakening could get pretty tough on the harder difficulties, much more so than previous games (except the end game- pairing made the end game easy regardless of difficulty, then again maybe I just leveled up too high, but, Awakening was kind of designed for you to keep leveling as strong as you could get- that last paralogue was brutal).

@rjejr
I think the whole point of this article was to point out that it's not just another difficulty mode, like something you toggle on and off in Awakening. And as much as I'd be in favor of Fire Emblem on Wii U, I really couldn't care less if I had to play it in the microwave. I go where the games go, and Fire Emblem in 3D on a dual screen handheld seems right at home.

@LinkSword - "they're completely different games"

Well, then why not just sell them as different games - FE:A 2 and FE:A 3 and be done w/ all this "half the storyline" nonsene? If " they're completely different games" - your words not mine - then just sell them as such.

@JaxonH - Yeah I know, play as the bad guys in 1 game, play as the good guys in the other game, but there's no fun in mocking that.

See this is why I use so many nobody gets me otherwise.

@rjejr
You haven't even played Awakening yet. I think you should go play that game right now. Definitely, DEFINITELY before this one releases.

All three obviously, basically this rolls 3 games into one @the price of less than 2, not to mention that we are getting A LOT of Fire Emblem in a short window of time, normally that much FE would have probably meant a period of ... like 5 years. I doubt anyone into FE would really complain about this. I certainly don't.

@rjejr I'd buy a console Fire Emblem in a heartbeat. It's really hard to sell me handheld games these days, as I never tend to play them.

"Digital selling method will be different. The digital version will allow you to play until chapter 5, where you will be made to either go the White Kingdom route or the Black Kingdom path. You can purchase the other route via DLC"

WTF !? So the digital version includes both paths and thus locks the path you do not choose and you have to unlock it again by paining for it.

This sucks. Like on Disc DLC but even worse.

Yes! So glad that not all chapters will be kill the general and route the enemy. That was my major complaint with Awakening. Needless to say that I am even more excited now.

@Artwark Someone probably already answered this but both versions will have casual mode.

@rjejr Exactly what they are doing. As far as we've let us know they have created content at least equal to twice the amount of a regular Fire Emblem in two very differentiated stories that also play very differently. One would have to be a jibjabjeb to work twice as hard for the same price, so as long as the games don't turn out to be half as long as regular Fire Emblem games, selling them as they're doing it makes absolute, perfect sense.

It wouldn't make any sense to call them '2' and '3', for example, as they neither precede nor go after the other but happen simultaneously in alternate realities.

"Limit the number of turns you have" ??? I'll try and keep an open mind until I've played it but, intelligent systems, please don't ruin fire emblem.

@AVahne Well at least Black Kingdom will have others objectives than "Rout the Enemy", so there's something.

@luke88 I assume you haven't played much of the franchise if that's shocking to you.

@Yorumi Funny because I don't ever recall these options...much less being "free"

@rjejr Your wording is ironic considering there are far more 3DS fans than Wii U fans.

Well, sounds more different than Pokemon Red and Blue.

I really hope they don't do this in NA, I want the full game, unless they discount the price. I buy 2 versions of Pokémon everytime they've come out but even that is getting old...

@Yorumi: And what if these two both have a difficulty adjuster? You seem to be jumping to conclusions left and right considering we don't know much about these games.

@Yorumi Remember when one FE game had a mode that includes the world map and a mode that doesn't? Oh wait....

Not to mention you can turn down difficulty in the Nohr path if you read translations of the interview. Not to mention we still don't know if the two versions model is coming outside of Japan....

@Ralek85 Fire Emblem is my favourite series and I don't like this practice. I've paid for every single Pokémon game (my #2 series) and frankly, I'm getting tired of that business practice. If the white version and Black version are both full retail price in NA, Nintendo customer service is going to hear an ear full from me.

I want to point out one premature conclusion: the west will get two versions as well. Nintendo never announced that.

Japan is getting two versions because FE fans there will buy both. Nintendo's strategy is brilliant for the Japanese market. The west is not as big on FE, so it may only get one version with both paths with the third possibly being DLC. Don't believe me? Look at Puzzles and Dragons Z/Mario and note how it's $30 and includes both games.

Nohr

Wait a minute my avatar pic has managed to find it self it in the main article

@JeffreyG
I'm the same way. I LOVE Fire Emblem, but I have a short attention span (and little free time since I'm a teacher), so I tend to play games on either easy or normal (depending on the genre) the first time and play at a more challenging difficulty if I love the game enough to warrant a second playthrough.

@JaxonH Radiant Dawn is my favourite FE so I'd really like to see it back on console, doesn't look like that'll happen anytime soon though, if ever.

@Yorumi So are you still not getting the game if the west gets one version?

@Yorumi I couldn't care less about the engine being the same. Historically plenty of games have re-used both assets and engine of older titles and that's with years separating the games, yet curiously enough not nearly as many would bat an eye for paying full price for both of those.

The OST is debatable and pure conjecture at this point. For all we know there could be key themes common to both games and yet plenty of original tracks for each side of the battlefield, or character events, or story progress. As far as battles are concerned I don't even doubt my words because Nohr's side is meant to be far more ruthless, so the music will play according to a very different mood.

I'm glad you brought up the point about the first 5 levels because I've been dying for an excuse to bring it up. The average Fire Emblem game has somewhere between 25-30 chapters in its main story, not counting extra battles and whatnot. Thus, mathematically the ''common path'' is a mere fifth or sixth of the main story content, BUT REALISTICALLY it's even less. Anyone who's played at least one game of the franchise knows the first few chapters are by far the shortest and least complex, because they're meant to ease you into the experience and teach the basics of the gameplay mechanics rather than challenge you. In other words, beating 5 levels towards the end of a FE takes far more time than 5 levels at the beginning.

You are free to think of this as milking the cow dry or exploiting the players or whatever, but there's very little basis for it. I mean, rather than the radically different storylines and widely different battles, the points you've decided to bring to the table are graphics, music and the prologue. That alone should tell you something.

@firstnesfan
Oh I love Radiant Dawn. Absolutely brilliant game. In fact, just talking about it makes me want to go play it! I would love to see this franchise return to consoles, but at the same time they almost feel like they're made for handhelds. Really, either way works for me. As long as they keep giving us more I've got no complaints!

Most of the argument is pure conjecture. They could actually be two different games...

@Yorumi: And you think it's ok to spout out conjecture as fact. Until you play the game or Japan posts videos showing the game, your argument barely holds water.

Decided on getting them all the moment I became aware of them. And people should wait before they judge. It may be 2 entirely new (and different in regards to each other) Fire Emblems. Three if you get the special path, and it will cost $80 for all 3, which is the price for two games.

I hate that they pulled this Pokemon thing on Fire Emblem to make people buy 2 copies! Tingle and Wario must be running Nintendo now.

@Yorumi
I was actually being considerate there, but since you insist, sure, let's go there. By alternate paths in other FE games, I can only assume you mean things such as Eliwood/Hector in Blazing Sword, or Ephraim/Elina in Sacred Stones. Now, anyone could think about it for a second and realize why that's a horrible example to compare it to this, because while the Hoshido/Norh vicissitude presents two completely diverging stories, Hector's path to Eliwood's is pretty much the exact same thing with minor dialogue tweaks and a couple extra chapters/characters here and there, and the same goes for the Sacred Stones equivalent. If you were thinking of a more comparable example by all means bring it up, granted I haven't played every old FE title as much as I'd like to.

And no, it's not a matter of ''it's Nintendo so it's okay''. It's a matter of people jumping to conclusions and senseless skepticism as soon as they're exposed to the idea of paying for more than one game at once, regardless of the specifics. And I sure hope you are not the kind to support Pokemon's double version thing, because THAT is the true scam.

@AVahne
"Casual" or not, Awakening was still every bit as fun as other Fire Emblem games. In fact I don't think hard-core or casual has anything to do with it. The game had difficulty options and lunatic was absurdly difficult. The game was just more noob-friendly (in the same way MH4U is more noob friendly, which IMO is never a bad thing) and cut down on a lot of the unnecessary mechanics the cluttered the game. The magic triangle has not always been present, for example. So it's not like it was a long standing core game mechanic that was removed for the sake of appealing to casuals. And a lot of the mechanics found on the two console entries were not present beforehand.

I just think they like to experiment with each entry and try different things, then cut out what they feel is unnecessary or what doesn't fit. A lot of mechanics introduced in certain titles were later removed, and a lot of mechanics and features in Awakening were introduced before Awakening, like the non-Permadeath in Heroes of Light and Shadow.

@AVahne I actually preferred the much simpler system of Awakening. I thought the Radiant duo had too much going on in their system

That doesn't really sound "different". Sounds more like variations of the same.

If this model come to the west I'll buy both, play as Hoshido in Insane and Nohr on Hard. But I really want a collector's edition.

Have they actually confirmed that they will be selling both versions of the game seperately over here in the West? Are they being scummy, like the Pokémon franchise?

Also, having one half of the game be considerably more different and aimed at a different group of fans basically negates any choice the player might have had. I thought the point of the storyline was to choose a side based on what you personally believed in or preferred, not to have it chosen for you based on how you like to enjoy the Fire Emblem series. Terrible design choice imo.

@Yorumi Interesting you chose to ignore my point.

@Yorumi I love how easily you will attack Nintendo at any opportunity that is presented to you and continually jump to conclusions before all the facts are in front of you. For someone who comes across as an intelligent individual, you really don't convey it very well with the arguments you create.

@Geonjaha No, nothing has been confirmed. People in this entire thread have been jumping to conclusions.

Getting collector's edition cuz nintendo runs my life. White black and grey dlc yes please!

@Yorumi I love it how you call me out on ignoring a point you write, yet you ignore all of mine that you don't find convenient. I'm not sure if it's even worth it to keep this up, but oh well.

Yes, now with Internet trading you can complete your Pokemon game easily without having to get both versions, but back in the day if you happened to live in an area where no other kids were playing it, you were royally screwed. Luckily it was never my situation while I still cared for the franchise, but you can bet many kids had to beg their parents for a second game just to ''catch 'em all'. And here's the thing - if you had to buy the other version, you ended up with exactly the same thing twice. There was no additional appeal to it whatsoever like a completely different story or more difficult battle mechanics. In other words, either a waste of money or the frustration of never completing the game at all, as opposed to getting a complete story or two complete stories.

And yes, sure, many other games may include branching storylines, but it's hard to quantify how any of those games compares in length to one of a different franchise. If you are telling me that Game X with all its branches is potentially as long as both FE Ifs together, then you are telling me that when you buy a regular Fire Emblem game you are paying the same price for a game half as long as you're used to.

Long story short, pricing versus length is very relative in each franchise and there's no use comparing things as widely separated. A Tales of Game can easily take hundreds of hours to achieve full completion, yet a Zelda takes about a tenth of that time to master and still potentially provides a complete gaming experience that'll leave the player satisfied.

If you were in the right here, you'd have no trouble making your point without bringing up other franchises for a precarious comparison. But don't worry, I understand this is all a skirmish in this whole personal war you have against Nintendo's brand, which I don't care enough as a whole to neither defend nor attack.

@JaxonH - I'm waiting to get me a new 3DS XL for my birthday.

Too bad there isn't anything out this summer that's due a bundle.

Really there isn't anything coming out on 3DS I want besides PaD Mario but I doubt that will get a bundle.

so my understanding is that the physical versions have their entire story (not giving the choice of which side to join) with the option of downloading the other versions story as paid DLC (giving you the choice). Where as the digital version has no white or black version once you reach the choice it downloads that version's data (for free) turning the digital edition into that version.

so basically buy pokemon red or blue and then when you finish you can download the other one for less than buying the other version

@Yorumi How the Nohr path is essentially FE7 and Hoshido is The Sacred Stones? The fact that no Western Nintendo Direct has said a single thing about two versions and all of this information we've received is second-hand incomplete, sloppy translations? This article is missing details from the 4gamer interview like how Japanese players can download one path for free.

Actually the path isn't "free". You buy the game and get one path after chapter 6.

– You’ll be able to experience an entire story by only playing one route. The other is a completely different story.

http://nintendoeverything.com/another-round-of-fire-emblem-if-details/

@TingLz is this website spreading misinformation then?
http://www.rpgsite.net/news/4242-fire-emblem-if-multiple-storyline-paths-and-dlc-information

If i buy, it will be the Black because Awakening was too easy and boring in my opinion.

As far as the debate, it depends on how different they are and that we don't know. If they are 90% different with intersecting story lines then you have an option of buying 2 different FE games for less then the price of 2. If they are the same then no reason to buy 2. It's the middle ground that gets muddy but we just dont have the info yet.

@rjejr I really want a FE for the Wii U but I dont see it happening at this point. I'd even take a HD remake of the Radiant series or a compilation of older titles.

I'm hoping Space Hulk is worth a purchase and helps hold me over till a possible FE comes to a home console again

Hopefully preordering the import of both next week. Very excited for this.

White for me.

The last I heard, you were not required to pay double to get both sides of this game. If you want both sides as boxed games, then yes you have to pay full price for each of them. However, you also have the option to buy one game at full price and then the add other side as DLC. I believe the price for the DLC amounted to about $16 US. That assumes that Nintendo will use the same strategy for the game in the US.

As an aside, all big publishers are looking for ways to get more money out of each game these days. Development costs have skyrocketed over the past few years, especially for HD games, and many games struggle to make a profit. That is why so many games now have paid DLC and higher priced special editions at launch. Those of us who love handheld games have benefitted from playing high quality games at fairly low prices in comparison to consoles. If the technology gaps between handhelds and consoles closes in the next generation (which I think it will) then we can expect that the price gap will close as well. Nintendo is not going to sell the exact same game on a handheld for $30 less than it charges on a console. Same game ... same price. That is something that we will all need to get used to when it happens.

@luke88
Not exactly new. Though it was mostly optional before, that kind of thing was in the Elibe games where some gaiden chapters could only be accessed by beating a chapter fast. In the case of FE6, those gaiden chapters were required for unlocking the true final chapters.

@rjejr
You'll like the New3DS. Ya most of the heavy hitters dropped in Feb/March (Majoras Mask, MH4U, Code Name STEAM) but I'm sure we'll get a new lineup come E3.

Guess who just pre ordered Palutena, Ganondorf, Zero Suit Samus and Dark Pit Amiibos and they're from Amazon UK so they'll actually arrive before wave 4 even releases in the US. Also scooped all 3 colors of the Yarn Yoshi Amiibos.

I'll probably play through the White Kingdom first and then play again through the Black Kingdom. And THEN get whatever that 3rd path is going to be and play through that.

The use of the word "choice" is incredibly ironic considering the player is not given any actual choice in the matter. The nohr side has the more interesting story and the difficulty is more appropriate for veteran players. Would prefer it if the choice was a bit more reliant on which characters we choose to support or what ideological motives we have rather than being forced to pick the nohr side because it is the better game.

@Gerbwmu - Yeah, might have to pick up Space Hulk just b/c I can play it on my Wii U. At least only another 3 weeks until Swords & Soldiers 2, a game originally scheduled to release last holiday. I played the first game 3x thru - Easy, normal, hard, and then a lot of hours 2 player w/ my kids. We've all been looking to forward to the sequel for awhile.

@JaxonH - You're a silly silly man. UK amiibo, you're killing me.

You off from work today, you've been on here plenty? I'm in and out mowing the lawn, spring is finally here. Speaking of, lunch break is over.

If we're talking about the FE series as a whole, then I would consider the game to be casual difficulty if it's not at least as difficult as the Jugdral chronology, especially Thracia 776. Insane/hardcore difficulty of Awakening comes pretty close to that, but not quite. Not until you have to deal with 50+ guys in one big labyrinthine map, with infinite respawns from stairs, who can all 2 or 3 shot you if they land good hits.

Of course, if we're willing to shell out $80, we don't have to pick a side... We can just buy the full game on one 8GB card at that price, since Nintendo is not restricted by data limitations... Only by their customers' willingness to shell out more than they have to. Apparently, that restriction has officially been broken.

@AVahne ah I see, how did you find it? Was a generous number of turns usually given? I've only played awakening, sacred stones and the ambassador one.

@AVahne Depends on what you mean by "old time fans". If we're going back to the Super Famicom era, then we're talking about every single map being big enough to take 1-3 hours each to complete; even the early maps.

@rjejr
Eh, car overheated so I couldn't make it in today. Although my boss adamantly texted me offering for others to give me a ride. Um, no. I'm not going to take a ride from somebody I've never met just because you forcibly asked them to. She says, oh, so and so could give you a ride, you live in Johnson Creek right? I said no, I actually live in Watertown. "Oh great that's where he lives". Like, really?

And ya, Amiibo is an Amiibo is an Amiibo, as they say, or as I say... Doesn't matter. Point is they're all the same. And in the US one or more might become exclusive. As we both know, as rare as these things are it's best to jump on them whenever you have the opportunity.

I would refer people to this little tidbit of information: http://serenesforest.net/fire-emblem-if/key-information/

Specifically: "Players going down the digital route won’t have to choose straight away, as only one digital version of the game exists.

Upon reaching Chapter 6–the point at which you must choose sides–after making your choice, the other campaign will be permanently locked (unless you buy it as DLC, like the packaged version).

Finally, if you want the premium route, you can buy the special edition of the game, which includes both campaigns on one game card, plus the “third path” DLC expansion and other trinkets."

This confirms that all three sides can, in fact, fit into a single 8GB card. There is also information on day 1 DLC relating to downloadable characters, including a $50 pack with 16 booster packs of "guest character summoning cards" consisting of 10 random character choices each.

Yeah... this reeks not only of day 1 DLC practices, but shady DRM practices too. I would expect to see this in a free-to-play mobile game, not in Fire Emblem.

I started FE with Awakening, so I will probably get the White version. I don't want hate and be pissed off with the game if I played the Black version. I want to have fun with it.

@Yorumi No kidding, it's also amazing how they designed that turning point to give a completely different impression to someone who buys a physical copy of one side compared to someone who downloads a digital copy (eShop won't let you specifically download the digital version of either side ahead of time). The higher storage physical copy won't have the lock out DRM mechanism of the digital version, nor the predetermined choice included with buying a lower storage physical copy of one side.

This is probably at least partially, if not fully, the result of business structure changes related to the DeNA capital alliance. I don't think it's a mere coincidence that these free-to-play mobile models of DLC and DRM practices started to get going as we approached the start of the current fiscal year (the official signing date of the capital alliance). Now, those practices have gone into full swing.

Getting both regardless especially since it reminds me so much of Pokemon Black & Pokemon White. Love those two games even if it was so hated by many! ^__^

I can't wait!!!!!!! I don't know which version or versions I'll buy but I'll buy one of them at the very least.

I'll I get both but start with White Kingdom.

But... I thought we already knew this?

@JaxonH - "car overheated"

You live in the upper mid-west, how can your car possibly over heat? What was it, like 60' out? I think somebody's playing hooky for MH4, that's what I think. Well either that or Wave 4 amiibo went on sale today.

If you had a Super Kong he could have taken you to work in a rocket barrel.

I'll get both if this is how they package it in Europe,but which to start with.I hope the black version has a way to turn off perma death.

If they do release both in the NA I'd prefer to get them in a limited edition. Though if not then I'll certainly be picking up both.

This is old news, though if we're forced to pick between 2 versions in the west then I'll have to go with Nohr.

I hate to say it, but I probably won't buy this if it doesn't have an awakening-style casual mode. I suck at strategy games, and permadeath honestly makes it very frustrating. Yes, yes, filthy casual, I know.

@Yorumi "Interesting that you choose to ignore the points about other FE games adding alternate paths and such into the main game"

A recent 4gamer interview revealed pegs reveals the chapters both games share, the prologue and 5 chapters account for only 1/6 of each campaign. Or in other words each campaign will have 25-30 unique chapters ontop of the initial 5-6(depending if they count the prologue) for a total of 30-36 chapters for each game.

The longest route split in a previous Fire Emblem game is 6 chapters long in FE:Sacred Stones where the full campaign has only 22 chapters. Both Fire Emblem: Hoshido and Fire Emblem: Nohr are longer games than Fire Emblem Sacred Stones and the route splits even not including the prologue and chapters 1-5 are larger campaigns than the full Sacred Stones campaign.

To say they've included a route split like Fire Emblem If in the past is a false equivalence, a handful of chapters isn't the same as the vast majority of two games.

@PlywoodStick

That's unofficial information(literally a guess) and really bad speculation, why would they have you needlessly have you download a large file of the whole game? What sense would there be in letting you download it all and then lock it with a unlock via the eShop when that would only risk hackers accessing it?

The truth is that the download version has you download only the first 6 chapters, then when you make your choice after the end of the chapter 5 you download that part of the campaign. That way it downloads quicker, hackers can't access it offline, SD card space is saved if a player only wants one route.If you're going through the eShop anyway the campaigns should be downloaded separately for convenience for the player and preventing people illegally accessing content they never paid for,

http://serenesforest.net/fire-emblem-if/4gamer-interview/

" you purchase the download version, you will be asked to choose between the Hoshido and Nohr campaigns during Chapter 6. After that, your choice will be locked, or at least until you buy the other campaign as DLC (just like the packaged version).

Originally, it was assumed that the content for both campaigns was already contained in the download version, since only one download version exists, and that an in-game lock would prevent you from playing the other campaign.

What actually happens is that players who buy the download version can play all the way up to Chapter 5, but after that, they must download the Hoshido or Nohr campaign to continue. Since they’ve already paid for the game, the first campaign can be downloaded for free.

Furthermore, if you buy both campaigns and want to jump from one campaign to another, you don’t necessarily need to start from the beginning. If the game detects a completed Chapter 5 save on your 3DS, you will be given the option to start either campaign from that point instead"

@IceAnt573 No, you just misinterpreted it. You pay full price for the game, but you choose the path in Chapter 6. The path then downloads at no extra cost (hence "free") to your system.

@Dr_Lugae As far as game longevity questions are concerned, I think the real questions here are, "How long will each map take to complete, and will they take progressively longer or be sometimes short or sometimes long?" and "How long is the third path, since it will cost the same amount as the side one doesn't choose (if they don't buy the higher capacity 'premium' physical copy)?"

Each path has 25 chapters (maps), but that doesn't tell us how long each one is. We would need a Japanese voice to answer that. My guess is that some maps are very short, and others are longer. I would also be curious to see if the third path is also 25 chapters (maps). My guess is no, because a third path in this case would be based upon ending the conflict quickly without drawing it out, like the two opposing sides would do.

The problems levied are not based purely upon longevity issues, though, but rather on how the paths are presented and packaged. The way it is being done is more reminiscent of a mobile game than a traditional portable console game.

"Beyond that I also pointed to other tactical games that have about 5 times or more the missions of FE:IF combined and yet were sold as one game."

Can you tell me how many chapters there are in each version? Or is this more conjecture?

On that note, all conjecture and incomplete information can be used to bash a decision that wasn't made yet. Gotcha

I'm not a fan of them releasing 2 versions instead of 1, but I'm glad that they both have big differences in them, unlike Pokemon. I'll probably not get these since I don't enjoy turn based strategy games that much, though I did like playing Fire Emblem Awakening later in the game once the story got interesting.

White Kingdom is most appealing to me since I suck at strategy games and I usually try to choose the 'good' decisions in games.

@PlywoodStick " My guess is that some maps are very short, and others are longer."

Every Fire Emblem game has long and short chapters and ways of turning what would be short chapters with small/medium size maps into long chapters with walls and other obstacles. However almost every game has methods to cut even long chapters down into very short turn counts.

So yeah, unless you also think Fire Emblem in general is literally the mobile model and for example FE: Blazing Sword and Sacred Stones are full price map packs for Binding Blade you should accept each Fire Emblem If entry follows the typical Fire Emblem model separately.

@Yorumi

Nintendo gamers are no different than any other demographic, in terms of wanting the maximum amount of entertainment on the dollar. I think you've gone to an extreme proving your point, which is unfortunate because it distracts heavily from any constructive criticism you might hope to levy.

Sigh Still arguing if the two versions are the same or not...

UHHH...I MEAN:
I-I'll probably side with Hoshido! Yeah! World Map FTW! Hahaha...ha...ha...
... sigh

@Dr_Lugae I never said anything about being forced to download the entire game's files at once, just that they are in fact locking out digital downloaders from the path they don't choose. (If this applied to a physical copy, especially the higher capacity cards, the path not chosen would be the equivalent of on-cart DLC.) There is a big discrepancy between that type of progression versus not giving that choice at all for lower capacity physical copies.

That being said, it's worrying that until Chapter 6, having access to either of the main paths of the product one already paid for would be considered "illegal". By not giving the customer access to the content they did, in fact, already pay for, until they reach a certain point... that is getting into some treacherously shady DRM-laden territory. I admit it would be a convenience to not need the full game to be packaged into one big file for digital copies, but I don't think this is an ethically good way to handle it.

What is going to happen if someone cannot access the eShop at a future point in time, and cannot download the rest of the product they paid for, because of the DRM check involved? This is an anti-consumer business practice, make no mistake.

@PlywoodStick: According to the interview, the game is downloaded in parts. You get Chapters 1-6 first and then the rest of the game downloads for the path you choose. You don't get the other path unless you download it via DLC later.

@Yorumi Have you realized that we still don't know western plans or do I need to point it out again?

@Dr_Lugae No, Blazing Sword is different. It's a sequel/prequel that stands on it's own, it's not a concurrently released first half of the same story of Binding Blade. And of course, Sacred Stones exists on it's own.

FE If does not stand on it's own without all three sides to uphold it, with the main two being the minimum.

My point was that longevity is not the issue here, the way they are being presented and sold is the issue. We need to also remember that the GBA only had enough space to hold one of it's FE titles on a single cart, whereas an 8GB 3DS card can hold the entirety of both FE If campaigns, in addition to the third path.

Just because the two main paths are 25 chapters/maps each, does not put them on equal ground with previous entries, due to the enhanced technology of today. This is the first time a FE title has needed up to an 8GB space enclosure to deliver it's full experience; every previous title used almost half or less of FE If's space. That doesn't mean FE If should cost more, it means FE If is taking advantage of having less space restrictions.

@TingLz Preventing customers from accessing the content they paid for until they pass a checkpoint is a shady DRM-laden practice. What happens if someone is suddenly unable to access the eShop after they already paid for the initial price of the game, for any reason? What if they become unable to access what they paid for at all?

Similar to someone whose download corrupted and they can't access the eShop. With that said, I can't imagine the first few chapters taking that long to complete.

On that note, if we're talking improbable extremes, what if someone loses or breaks their physical copy? They would have to pay for a replacement, whereas download files can be replaced more easily and usually at no extra cost.

@Yorumi You literally don't know EA if you're trying to suggest Nintendo are worse than them. What EA did to Westwood(killed) and Command & Conquer(Ruined and dead). To Bullfrog(killed them) and Dungeon Keeper, Theme Hospital(dead), Theme Park(dead). To Maxis(dead) and Spore(rushed out, limited installs DRM), Sim City("Always online"), The Sims(Rushed out, milked to death with expansations), to Origin(killed) and Ultima(ruined killed) and Dungeon Keeper Mobile(microtransactions out the ass).

Nintendo delivering Fire Emblem in a different way isn't the equivalent, let alone worse than the two time golden poo "worst company in the US" winner who eats up companies, exploits the hell out of their IP, wring them out and toss them away like trash when they stopped making money. Perhaps pay more attention to the companies you're talking about here or take that nonsense elsewhere.

Do you think EA would let their developer allow a series to continue after selling less than several million per entry like Nintendo do? If EA owned Intelligent Systems the company would not be here today to even make Fire Emblem, EA have killed off developers of far more popular series.

@PlywoodStick "Blazing Sword is different. It's a sequel that stands on it's own"

Then why does it use 90% of Binding Blade's assets, classes, weapons, character sprites and animations? Both it and Sacred Stones couldn't exist without Binding Blade because they re-use so much of it. Fire Emblem If uses Awakening's but we've already seen new classes, animations, weapons(even both sides use different ones).

@TingLz It doesn't matter how long it takes to reach the DRM checkpoint- the fact that it exists at all is a problem.

If someone loses or breaks their physical copy, that is the responsibility of the customer. If the merchant is preventing the customer from accessing what they already paid for until they reach an imposed checkpoint, that is the responsibility of the merchant. The two situations are not even remotely similar.

For everyone wanting a home console FE, convince them with your wallet...and your friends' wallets. They've already said that to develop a full console FE game on Wii U, they'd have to sell over 700k copies to justify the costs to develop such a game. Sadly, that probably won't happen, because the install base for FE on Wii U is likely very low.

@Dr_Lugae Reuse of assets is fine, it's a traditional method of cutting down on production costs and time spent. Reusing assets for entirely different sequential titles, then charging for each development cycle, is not equivalent to separately selling two campaigns produced within the same development cycle of the same title. You don't need to play both Blazing Sword and Binding Blade to experience the entirety of one story- they exist independently, they don't rely on each other to gain a full perspective of one story's events. That is not the case for FE If.

I'm also a bit worried about this listing: http://www.amazon.com/New-Nintendo-Only-Emblem-Special-Japan/dp/B00VFT4T5M/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1430343952&sr=8-1&keywords=fire+emblem+if

First, it is the only premium edition import sale available on Amazing... selling for over $230! Secondly... it's listed as "New 3DS only"? Does this mean that only the New 3DS can read 8GB cards, such as the one used for Xenoblade 3DS, even though FE If does not push the hardware as much as Xenoblade? That would be a detail I have not seen reported, as of yet.

I'll start with White and when I think I'm ready I'll download Black (if it's DLC in Europe). I hope for a 2 in 1 package here though.

I dunno about 8 gb cards, but fire emblem if is for all 3ds models.

@PlywoodStick 8GB cards aren't new 3DS exclusive Nintendo isn't that stupid. (surprise, surprise) The games might have new 3DS exclusive features though! Like faster load times, better textures or maybe an extra CPU intensive mode (I doubt its the latter though).

I want both but will focus on black for sure. This may make me start buying physical releases again... Well actually, I'll start with Devil Survivor 2 THEN Fire Emblem. (I want those stickers!)

I'm planning to get Black, but I'm holding off on getting the game until I have confirmation that it's good and that there aren't any terrible DLC practices. I'm extremely concerned about this game and if it's anything near what Awakening was (both gameplay and business model-wise), then Fire Emblem is dead to me.

@Artwark I really hope Black Kingdom does have casual mode in it. The game can still be difficult without having to concern yourself with restarting a battle because you made a mistake and left a unit open to attack.

Casual Mode can still exist alongside other challenges like defending a base, or beating a battle in a certain set of turns.

If they really want to make it more difficult, then why not have a modified casual mode in the sense that you don't lose units for good, but you do lose them for several battles due to injuries.

I have played Fire Emblem games since the GBA and I'll admit, casual mode in Awakening spoiled me. It was nice to play a Fire Emblem game that did not force you to reset a battle because you made a mistake and your cleric got taken out.

@firstnesfan I'm sorry, I'm not only up to speed on Pokemon. I played 'X' for a couple of hours, but it was not my thing anymore. The only ones I played both version of were the originals, Red and Blue. Red and Blue were basically the same game, so .... I see your point.
Nintendo already stated that after the first few intro/tutorial missions (first 6), FE:IF will not be the same games twice, not to mention that the 3rd campaign will probably something else entirely. If all they do is basically offer a couple of different characters in one version vs the other version, than I'm totally with you, but from what I've read, you will actually get to play both sides of the story this time - meaning also the invading forces/ bad guys for the first time. The difficutly will be different, since resources will be more limited with Nohr and so on. Last but not least, I'm not sure about the prices, but I read this on USG:
"The retail and digital versions cost 4,700 ($39.25, probably $39.99 in the US), and the DLC will set you back another 2,000 yen ($16.70, probably $19.99). Then there's the third storyline, which will be the same price as the DLC, but released at a later date. Finally, you can pick up the game's Special Edition, which nets you all three storylines, an art book, and a Fire Emblem 0 sample card for 9,250 yen ($77.26, maybe $79.99?). "
So assuming the third DLC will be as much as the first (two^^), that adds up to a (regular) price of $80. If Nintendo is true to their word, this will net you 3 FE games - 6 Missions, which does not sound so bad. Worst case scenario to me is that I just get this: One original campain, an alternate and more difficult version of that campaign + another original campain for the price of two camapaings ... not to mention all that in an incredibly short window of time by any Fire Emblem metric. To me that has value in itself (assuming the quality doesn't take like a historic dipp for some reason Oo).

I think the most import point though is this, you will get a full game for the full price. All this is, is the option to get another full game at half price and then again. I actually read comments those last weeks that went something like this: "I stopped playing FE:A because the DLC was just to much and to expensive, and this is even worse!" .... To any such notion, all I can say is this (to quote Arche)r: "I have literally no response to that".

@TheWPCTraveler Yep, better imouto=better buy. I'm joining the white people this time...I mean Nohr.

@SomeBitTripFan Paying $40 for a buttload of content while paying extra for extras is terrible business?

Didn't they say the black one was a expensive DLC. Looks like I will just get the white version and get over my self and wait for a review.

If theres not a version with all of them included physically then ill be waiting till they are dirt cheap or worse if I must

@Spectra_Twilight
If people simply "didn't buy" an Xbox One it would still have silly DRM and "always online" features.
Maybe if companies were actually developing content for after the game's release/etc. instead of ripping out things from a completed game to sell later or literally on the first day of release on top of the retail price paid for the game then yeah, sure, the hate would be unwarranted.

On the topic of Fire Emblem "If". I do not play Fire Emblem games and since this is currently confirmed for only Japan right now and we're only getting fed information via sketchy translations (I am aware of the interview but multiple people have posted links from other news websites with conflicting information) I wouldn't really get blue in the face about it. However, I would be concerned about Nintendo getting cuddly with anti-consumer/money grubbing tactics in their games. Pokemon being used as their guinea pig to dip their feet in "Free To Start" garbage is making me wish they simply made a really good trozei/rumble sequel instead...

@Spectra_Twilight "If you want the content, you buy it, if you don't want the content, then you don't buy it, same as with a game. I suppose those who blindly hate it make up those who have failed to adapt to the changing industry..."

That is a market perspective which does not always apply to the world at large. If we look at communities such as GOG.com (and sometimes Desura and Humble Bundle, not as much anymore), there are fine principles behind denying the rise of the current excesses in DLC- and DRM-related business practices. These are not idle worries, nor are they dieing traditions- communities affected by bad business practices are adapting to the modern market, yet they also want a relative safe haven from excessive growth policies.

Ask anyone who has gotten screwed over from anti-consumer business practices, especially those living outside of the big industrial nations. "Voting with your dollar" by itself isn't necessarily a viable option for everyone, unfortunately. There need to be limits and protections in place for those who are not provided the opportunity for a mouthpiece in their decisions.

This is one of the impetus reasons for homebrew, hacking, and modding in the console hemisphere- to create some semblance of an alternative in a place where there usually is none. Or at least, none other than, "you get nothing" or "you contribute towards the product/company going under by not going along with the market line."

I will hands down buy the collectors edition if/when it comes out in America. But if it doesn't, I will definitely buy Black Kingdom. (I'll be honest though, I'll probably buy both games physically if the collectors edition doesn't release in USA)

@Lz: $40 for an abundance of half-baked content and the remaining one third of the content costing $13 more than what you paid for the other two thirds. Drop the total price of the DLC into the ~$20 territory to get it all, and I wouldn't be too bothered by the DLC, excluding the Pay-to-Win content.

@SomeBitTripFan I honestly have no idea what you just said...

@PlywoodStick Alternatively, the publishers could just abandon the DLC model and just increase the price of games instead.

@Spectra_Twilight There'd be less but still some complaining, the new audience userbase who made Awakening popular might not understand why the game is $60 or $80 and completley new people who see it on a shop shelf will be completley bewildered by the price tag and won't want to try the gane.

If they literally can't afford sell both versions in one cart for $40(or £35 here), the two versions separately at $40 w/ the other version and third route as $20 DLC content would be the best bet for everyone regardless of all the complaining.

This is a tad confusing. I was new to the FE series with Awakening like a lot of people. However, I played it using the classic mode, albeit with the normal difficulty and not casual mode. I racked up 45 hours to complete but spend over 80 in total.

So which version should I choose?

@CTs_Lieutenant White Kingdom/Hoshido is going to be like Awakening and easier, while Black Kingdom/Nohr is going to play like the older games and will be harder.
I'd probably try out the older games and see if you like them. If you prefer Awakening then go with White/Hoshido.

Why couldn't they simply provide a download code packed in both versions so you could just download a digital copy of the opposite game? Or even better: why couldn't they just put both stories in a single cartridge?

I tell you: because money.

Definitely White Kingdom for me, but I might get Black Kingdom for my BF as he likes a real challenge. Will only one of them get a physical release?

@TurianAgent

Ha, collector's edition from Nintendo. You're funny.

I don't have a 3DS (yet), so I won't buy this title.
But isn't it highly blazen to split this into two full-priced games?
The could've just made one game with different levels of difficulty...
Just saying, this would be reason enough for me to boycott such a rip-off.

@Spectra_Twilight @TingLz If a higher capacity physical copy were sold with all 3 paths on it and no extras for $60, with DLC being optional extras with no effect on game balance, in addition to having absolutely no DRM or predetermined choices by purchase, I would be completely okay with that. I don't mind spending more up front like that. The average customer can easily understand a bigger product costing more up front.

What I do mind is gating off access to the product the customer already paid for until a certain point is reached in the digital version (which is DRM), and giving a false marketing impression of a choice being made during the $40 physical edition (when the choice is made at purchase). We are the core crowd, so we know what's going on; however, how is the average customer going to easily differentiate between the two?

I would echo the sentiment of others around the web that Nintendo has already made FE If's pricing scheme far too complicated for anyone who is not a core Nintendo and/or Fire Emblem fan, due to how they organized the game. This will probably end up attracting less people than Awakening's simpler proposition. Nintendo may as well cater to their core fans at this point.

@rjejr , @jaxonh , @firstnesfan

It always surprises me when people complain about games being a little more than usual, because games are one of the few things that essentially have never gone up in price. Sure, there were $50 average games that now are $60 average games after 30 years of this industry, but I specifically remember some games costing $10-$20, or even $30, more than others many, many times- particularly back on the N64- And these were back when games cost MUCH less to make.

Unless I'm missing something, Nintendo is releasing the same twice on the same, with different difficulties. And they get away with it. I'm sorry, but this just takes the cake for greed. If anyone else tried this, they would get murdered. Just imagine, Assassin's Creed: normal and hard editions with similar differences. Ubisoft would get slaughtered. I don't know how they get away with stuff like this. This honestly makes me less interested in the new Fire Emblem unless something changes with the localization. I'm hard pressed to think of something worse. This is worse than yearly releases. At least those try to offer something new as a sequel.

@Jaz007 alright buddy, let me clarify it for you then. They are releasing two games, each with their own unique content. They have different stories, missions, characters, possibly weapons, and ends. The only thing that is the same is the first 5 chapters, which are 5/30 chapters, 1/6 of the game, approximately 16.7% of the game. Given that the first few chapters don't account for much of the gameplay action regardless, it is really likely less than 16.7% of the game. The Nohr side of the story is harder, more in the vein of FE games prior to awakening. Hoshido is easier, more for those who enjoyed the easier difficulty of Awakening. One is essentially 85% of the other game, and you're getting it for a half price discount if you have bought the other version.

Personally I am very much okay with this. If this is the way it is, they might as well be 2 different games. It means I'll be getting 2 fire emblem games at the same time, at a discount. More fire emblem == win. Really I don't see why people are getting so upset with it.