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Topic: Disappointed by the lack of new exclusives

Posts 261 to 280 of 441

SKTTR

BlueOcean wrote:

@SKTTR Firstly, you were wrong about everything except Snipperclips that is a mini game. NST is in-house, it's a studio created by Nintendo, it's first party, it's 100% Nintendo. We are also including Monolith as in-house development. You keep projecting your confusion onto me when you are the one that is wrong and confused?

You clearly have your own definition of what's in-house and what's not.

You say Intelligent Systems isn't in-house but then you count WarioWare.
You count Sushi Striker, and then... you don't count Sushi Striker. xD
It's hilarious. Talking to you is a waste of time. Goodbye.

Switch fc: 6705-1518-0990

Banjo-

SKTTR wrote:

You clearly have your own definition of what's in-house and what's not.

You say Intelligent Systems isn't in-house but then you count WarioWare.
You count Sushi Striker, and then... you don't count Sushi Striker. xD
It's hilarious

You are way more confused than I thought. I didn't say that Intelligent System is in-house, some people here have suggested that and counted Fire Emblem as in-house development. I didn't because Intelligent System is an independent company that makes games for Nintendo. Check the thread again and tell me where I have said that Intelligent System is Nintendo. WarioWare was developed by Nintendo and Intelligent System and my exact words are that it's "partly in-house like the 3DS game".

If Nintendo is Nintendo then Wave Race Blue Storm is in-house, if you want to think that part of Nintendo is not Nintendo, then well, go ahead.

I didn't count Sushi Striker from the start, @NEStalgia told me I forgot that game and therefore I included it. It's a mini game, anyway, so it doesn't change anything.

SKTTR wrote:

Talking to you is a waste of time. Goodbye.

So another Ralizah. Goodbye then and keep saying that the others are wrong when you are the one that is wrong and then get mad and be rude. It's the right thing to do in a forum.

Banjo-

SKTTR

@BlueOcean

I would do your homework and show you a list of all in-house games of all Nintendo systems to prove the fact that in-house development output has stayed the same since the SNES and that it hasn't become less on Switch, but since you jump around changing definitions and pov's from one message to the next I'll save myself the time.

Edited on by SKTTR

Switch fc: 6705-1518-0990

Banjo-

@SKTTR I didn't change anything, I added Sushi Striker because it was mentioned and then I removed it, same for Snipperclips. You are utterly confused and don't want to admit it and you are rude on top of that.

Banjo-

Grumblevolcano

@BlueOcean If you're to separate in-house from acquired surely that just fuels the thing about Xbox being nothing more than Halo, Gears and Forza? Xbox currently has 5 in-house studios:

  • 343 Industries (Halo)
  • The Coalition (Gears)
  • Turn 10 (Forza)
  • World's Edge (Age of Empires) [PC only]
  • The Initiative (currently nothing, Perfect Dark reboot is an upcoming game in the far future)

Grumblevolcano

Switch Friend Code: SW-2595-6790-2897 | 3DS Friend Code: 3926-6300-7087 | Nintendo Network ID: GrumbleVolcano

Banjo-

@Grumblevolcano What Xbox have to do with the topic? šŸ˜‚ We are comparing Nintendo with Nintendo.

EDIT: Besides, I added the games that have been developed by studios owned by Nintendo in order to be more generous and the only extra game we get is Xenoblade Chronicles 2 because Nintendo acquired Next Level after Luigi's Mansion 3.

Edited on by Banjo-

Banjo-

Bolt_Strike

@NEStalgia Nothing says Sony has to make "interactive movie games". They decided they wanted that, not the fans. It's up to Sony to adapt to gamers' preferences, not the other way around. So no, it's totally fair to compare the first party outputs, Sony doesn't get a pass on that.

Yes, the criteria shouldn't be absolute because different genres have different needs depending on how they play. For example, you're pushing for a lot of larger/more open game worlds, but for some of the games that have refused to get "bigger", it doesn't really make sense to expand them in that way. Does an open world tennis game make sense? How about an open world party game? That's not the right way to expand on those games because making the worlds bigger wouldn't benefit those genres. Yet here you are complaining about them because they don't compare to open world games.

That being said, I do think there is one criterion that could be applied to just about any game genre unilaterally and that's game hours. If you're spending a longer amount of time on something, particularly if you're spending more time on more original content than another game, then that's a pretty good sign that there's a larger quantity of content in that game. Even that wouldn't be entirely objective (how do you define what's "original" or "repetitive"?), but that would be a much better start. I think for a genre like sports games, party games, social simulation games, basically anything multiplayer, instead of making the game worlds larger many of them should be focusing more on having multiple different game modes to interact with the game in different ways. And we've already seen that from some of their bigger multiplayer games like Mario Kart, Smash, and Splatoon.

Ultimately, I don't think we actually disagree that much here, the main issue is that we disagree on some specific games and criteria (and as a result, we are drawing different conclusions on how we feel about the Switch library). I do think some of the IPs do need to scale up a bit more, especially some of the ones that were previously handheld only or are multiplayer focused and aren't used to working on large scale projects. I also agree that perhaps the pricing should be more dynamic and smaller games like the sports, party games, and the Pokemon remakes should be $40, but everyone else in the industry is unilaterally pricing their retail games at full price, so Nintendo isn't along there. But I do think that they'll eventually get there and we'll see more large scale games like the open world games and some of the more full featured multiplayer games, they seem to understand what the gamers want, but they're not quite used to HD game development so they're probably just taking baby steps and we're just not going to get it as soon as we'd like. Wouldn't be the first time, as we've had several wishes for years and years that are just now coming true this generation (several highly demanded characters like Ridley and K. Rool in Smash, Pokemon releasing on a home console, Metroid 5 releasing, Kirby going full 3D). Nintendo seems to be more than happy to please its fanbase, they just can only do so much and can only improve so quickly.

@BlueOcean You're just going to have to retype what you were going to say because you're not making any sense. How am I "off topic"? The topic of the thread was that there weren't enough exclusives for Nintendo. I posted a list disproving it and basing it in 100% fact as opposed to subjective rankings like Metacritic. What exactly about my list is an "opinion" or "off topic"? You seem to either be very confused or very upset that the data isn't proving what you want to prove.

Edited on by Bolt_Strike

Bolt_Strike

Switch Friend Code: SW-5621-4055-5722 | 3DS Friend Code: 4725-8075-8961 | Nintendo Network ID: Bolt_Strike

Banjo-

@Bolt_Strike I'm not upset, thanks for worrying. I'm trying to write short comments now because this thread proves how much in denial the Nintendo Defence Force are and that they go round and round in circles, inside a loop that they don't want to leave whatever they are told. As others have already said, it's pointless trying to talk with them/with you.

You're clearly off-topic because we were discussing what have Nintendo been doing all these years and you reply with a list full of outsourced games (Mario sports, Yoshi, Mario Party, Kirby, Smash...) trying to make people believe that Nintendo have done a great job these years when they clearly haven't. The only AAA new games developed in-house for Switch are Super Mario Odyssey and Xenoblade Chronicles 2. As a developer, Nintendo have done as little as possible since 2016, just publishing, porting and outsourcing. That's what Nintendo have been doing for 5 years.

Edited on by Banjo-

Banjo-

Eel

If we canā€™t have a discussion without it turning into a childish ā€œno uā€ back and forth, then Iā€™ll have to close the thread.

Bloop.

<My slightly less dead youtube channel>

SMM2 Maker ID: 69R-F81-NLG

My Nintendo: Abgarok | Nintendo Network ID: Abgarok

Bolt_Strike

@BlueOcean The thread specified exclusives. I listed exclusives. Whether or not they were developed in-house or by "second party" studios is irrelevant and including the "second party" stuff is not off-topic. This has nothing to do with defending or criticizing Nintendo, it's because only counting in-house Nintendo games comes off as arbitrary and biased, you're excluding games to make the Switch's lineup look worse than it is when there are many other first party IPs releasing on the Switch, and multiple consoles, both past Nintendo consoles and Nintendo's competitors, rely on second party studios as well.

Bolt_Strike

Switch Friend Code: SW-5621-4055-5722 | 3DS Friend Code: 4725-8075-8961 | Nintendo Network ID: Bolt_Strike

Banjo-

@Bolt_Strike Nintendo was one of the best developers in the world in the 90s and 00s and their output since 2016 (Breath of the Wild was finished in early 2016 and was delayed one year as explained by Nintendo) is lame as many people have already said (not just me). It's comparing Nintendo with Nintendo.

Happy Thanksgiving to readers in USA and have a good evening my pals in UK and Europe!

Edited on by Banjo-

Banjo-

faint

@BlueOcean If we leave all other companies out, then how do we get a good metric for what output should be during a pandemic?

[email protected]
friend code: 0103-9004-2456

Buizel

@BlueOcean where is the comparison though? By your definition, what in-house AAA games was Nintendo developing on the Wii U and Wii (and gamecube even) that they're not giving us on the Switch?

The only thing that comes to mind is Mario Kart.

At least 2'8".

Banjo-

@Buizel On Wii we had 3 Marios, 1 Mario Kart, on Wii U we had 2 Marios and 1 Mario Kart. On Wii we had Skyward Sword, on Wii U we had Breath of the Wild. On Switch, 1 Mario, 0 Mario Kart and 0 Zelda. @faint The pandemic didn't affect developers as much as you think but if I buy your argument, the pandemic was last year, what other pandemics happened in 2016-2020?

I'm not counting the DS and 3DS games!

Edited on by Banjo-

Banjo-

Buizel

@BlueOcean Are you not including Mario Maker? Splatoon? Those would skew the numbers further towards the more recent consoles.

Also I'd argue that whether or not BotW is an exclusive is kinda irrelevant, its very much a reason to own the Switch the same way TP was for the Wii (although that would be +1 for Wii).

We also have the sequel to BotW coming next year.

At least 2'8".

Bolt_Strike

@BlueOcean I'll have to look through the past lineups a bit more in depth to do a full comparison, but I'm pretty sure that the Switch is not the reason for that. As I told @NEStalgia, the Wii U was also lacking similar games, in fact they were lacking even more than the Switch did even when you take into account that they didn't have nearly as many ports as the Switch has. The Wii was also very casual focused and they emphasized smaller scale games so you could also make an argument that that was the beginning as well. Again, it's probably more an issue of Nintendo having to adapt to HD development than Nintendo just getting lazier, HD has been infamous for extending development times and requiring much more manpower and money to get right, so of course you're going to have less games on the Switch than on older, lower definition hardware like the N64, GC, or 3DS. No one who knows anything about how game development works should be expecting Nintendo to recreate those kinds of lineups on an HD console without a massive increase in staff (and again, they can only improve that so quickly, do you really think they'll be able to add hundreds of developers at the snap of a finger?). All things considered, I think they're doing a great job adapting. This feels like the "true" successor to the GC in terms of the quantity and scale of games that a console like that had. Could they be doing better? Of course, you can always do better. But I wouldn't say the lineup is totally unacceptable given the circumstances.

And as far as having X number of games for an IP on a particular console/generation, I would be careful of that. Too many games at once and the developers can run out of ideas and the games feel stale and boring. The early 2010s had a ton of Mario games (SMG2, NSMB2, NSMBU, NSLU if you count that separately from NSMBU, Super Mario 3D World, Super Mario Maker) but many of them felt sort of samey and soulless so you really have to question if it was worth it to have all of those games in such a short period of time. I also have similar questions about Splatoon 3 (although since it's not out yet, we don't know for sure), it just looks like more of the same and hasn't really done much to evolve or shake up the formula so I really have to wonder why they're so insistent on releasing it in 2022 on the Switch instead of waiting until next gen and doing something potentially bigger and better. The lack of multiple entries for an IP you're pointing out seems to be a quantity vs. quality issue.

Edited on by Bolt_Strike

Bolt_Strike

Switch Friend Code: SW-5621-4055-5722 | 3DS Friend Code: 4725-8075-8961 | Nintendo Network ID: Bolt_Strike

Eel

Iā€™d personally say BotW, in the state it was released, was primarily a Switch game.

They completely stripped it off itā€™s WiiU features, itā€™s almost like they only released that version out of courtesy, because they had already announced it.

Bloop.

<My slightly less dead youtube channel>

SMM2 Maker ID: 69R-F81-NLG

My Nintendo: Abgarok | Nintendo Network ID: Abgarok

Bolt_Strike

@Eel I think that's exactly what they did. At that point, they probably decided the Wii U was a lost cause and BotW wouldn't save it, but they didn't want to risk upsetting loyal fans by pulling it and making it a Switch exclusive.

We might see that strategy again with BotW2 and/or Prime 4. Although in this case, the Switch is most certainly NOT a lost cause, but if their release date comes too close to the next gen console's release date it might be better for them to make them cross gen. Then depending on whether the Switch or the next gen console is more successful at that point, they'll get a piece of it no matter what.

Bolt_Strike

Switch Friend Code: SW-5621-4055-5722 | 3DS Friend Code: 4725-8075-8961 | Nintendo Network ID: Bolt_Strike

Banjo-

@Buizel Super Mario Maker 2 is a Wii U expansion, just like Splatoon 2. They are basically expanded Wii U ports. Breath of the Wild is a Wii U game and that matters when analysing the games developed by Nintendo for Switch, yes.

@Bolt_Strike Yes, HD development is more demanding than SD development and UHD is more demanding than HD development but bear in mind that Nintendo's games are cartoony, so it's much simpler to make them HD. It's not Resident Evil VIII that has a ridiculously massive amount or work behind, detailed textures, detailed animation, detailed environments, etc. (I'm avoiding using Xbox and Sony games just in case anyone feels offended).

@Eel Breath of the Wild was finished in early 2016 so it's a Wii U game that was ported to Switch. We are talking about facts, not about feelings. The fact that they removed the GamePad features doesn't change a thing.

Banjo-

Eel

@BlueOcean Iā€™m sorry but people can state their opinion and go on tangents as long as it doesnā€™t derail the entire thread too much.

Please do not try to moderate the thread.

@Bolt_Strike I sure hope they donā€™t move them completely! I like the courtesy pity releases.

Though I do wish for them to release these sooner than laterā€¦

Edited on by Eel

Bloop.

<My slightly less dead youtube channel>

SMM2 Maker ID: 69R-F81-NLG

My Nintendo: Abgarok | Nintendo Network ID: Abgarok

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