Topic: The Nintendo Switch Thread

@GrailUK Or Steam like sales lol

@DefHalan Oh yes...for your micro console theory ^^

@GrailUK Or any fully digital store front.

I'm so going to enjoy reading this thread after we find out what nx actually is.

I remember saying I expected Zelda u to make it in 2015 one month before the epic delay. Talk about predictive powers!

Better than their current position and it will be a situation that would improve over time.

You are asking A LOT, just so you know

Numbering your points because you seem to think that an argument of quantity is better than one of quality. It also makes it easier for people to read than putting your text in italics....

1 & 3. These two points are actually the same point and it's pretty much your only reasonable point so I'll say a lot. For a start they're three years "late to the party" regardless. Would it not be better to be three years late to the party AND be competitive? You're also making a few assumptions here that I don't think are necessarily true.

The first one being that consumers actually care about games that are a few years old. Or at the very least that those are the games that move consoles. But if you look at the top 30 games sold in 2015? Only three of them were not 2015 titles and those were all 2014 releases. If you go through the bigger list you get more games that weren't released in 2015 but the only ones not released the year before? They were Nintendo's games, Minecraft and GTA.

The second assumption you make (and this kinda goes to point 2) is that console generations still mean something. We already know that Sony is releasing a minor GPU revision to the PS4. We know that Microsoft is starting to fold XBox into Windows 10. Why do you assume that this console generation will ever end? You guys are so stuck on the idea that the NX is going to be one piece of hardware that does everything. I think it's far more likely that it's multiple pieces of hardware released over years. Not un-like what Apple does.

2 & 4. I don't think the PS4/XBOne spec is as hard a target to reach as you seem to think it is. You forget that all of these companies buy their components from the same manufacturers. If Sony can make a PS4 at a particular price? So can Nintendo. If Sony and Microsoft can cut the price? So can Nintendo.

5. As I said earlier, Nintendo doesn't really need third party exclusives. They already have the best exclusives on the market because they are Nintendo. You think Titanfall and Street Fighter V are huge losses when Nintendo has Splatoon, Smash Bros and Zelda? No, the problem Nintendo has is that they don't get the third party multi-platform games. The problem with the Wii U was that not only did it not have GTA5 but even if it did have it you'd want to play it on something else.

6. People always rant and rave about online functionality and how far behind Nintendo is. What is it that Nintendo lacks? Are they things that they couldn't easily add? As far as I'm concerned the only thing Nintendo really lacks is the ability to see who's online easily. And then the ability to send them a message. That's something they could fix with a smartphone app.

7. Yes. Without question. The games that really sell other than Nintendo's own content are all multi-platform releases. If Nintendo can get those games on their platform? Then the fact that gamers could have CoD, GTA and Smash would seal the deal.

@Project_Dolphin
Sony isn't worried about anyone this generation. They "won" there is no arguing that. Nintendo needs to look at their game plan further than just the next generation. Getting 3rd Parties back on their side ASAP should be part of their planning

If these companies start going down more of an Apple style hardware model then there is no "winner". Sony has already shown that they want to go down that route. If that's the case then it's more a question of who "wins" each year. That'll be what matters.

Take the last generation so as an example. The Wii "won" overall but on a year-by-year basis they only won from 2007-2010. From 2011-2013 it was basically a two horse race between the PS3 and 360. The thing that has been successful for the last few years isn't necessarily the one that is successful in the next few. If this console generation is indefinite? Then who is winning now probably doesn't matter that much.

It's like iOS vs Android. Apple's head start was huge but that didn't mean that Android couldn't catch up. And the fact that people brought into iOS early on didn't stop some from jumping ship. With the phone market we get to the point where our old handset is starting to look a bit dated. It's at that point we decide what we'll get next.

@skywake I don't think the PS4K is going to be the start of that type of hardware release, but that is just my opinion.

Deleting redundant points and just responding to these. Just so the thread is easier for people to follow

1. As I said, a back-catalogue only matters if people are still wanting those old releases. What matters more is that this years games are coming to the platform. By the time we hit November/December 2017? It won't matter if the NX doesn't have Dark Souls 3, Fallout 4 or Rise of the Tomb Raider. Because the vast majority of people won't care. What'll matter is whether or not it's getting Rockstar's next game.

2. The other advantage it would have is Nintendo's IP. The question you should be asking is that if Nintendo matched the PS4/XBOne spec what reason would you have to buy an XBOne? What advantage does Microsoft have?

3. "Ease of use" is a bit vague. On cross-buy if you've heard people complain about it you've probably seen my posts. If anyone complains about that it would be me. But as an issue it's only a problem if you are buying into multiple platforms from the same company. i.e. it's only a problem for people who are going to buy the NX anyway....

Cross-buy, huge library, better online, better graphics... shouldn't console people be flocking to Steam boxes if those were the biggest things?

Steam boxes have their downsides though, like price, potential complexity of buying/setup, and the old PC bugbear of not really knowing how well a particular game is going to work on your particular machine. None of the 'official' steamboxes have any significant brand recognition outside of maybe PC enthusiasts either. I'm sort of tempted, but it just seems like too much hassle. Plus no splatoon...

I think @skywake makes a fair point in that Nintendo have strength in their IP. Just because some gamers chose the XBOne/PS4 over the Wii U, doesn't mean they have no interest in Nintendo's IP. What about the people who played SNES? N64? Wii? Those that played Mario, Zelda, Pokemon, on Nintendo's popular handheld devices (a market where Nintendo still dominate)? Sure, many may have moved on, but there is definitely a market for Nintendo's IP out there that surpasses the number of Wii U units sold. So, in theory, Nintendo could certainly be more successful with the NX just by doing what the competition does.

However, whereas I think Nintendo can improve on the Wii U, I don't think the strength of their IP and matching the other systems alone can put them above their competition. Remember the Gamecube? More powerful than the PS2 (albeit, lacking DVD playback and using a strange propietary disc format), yet sold maybe 1/6th the number of consoles.

Then again, I think people focus too much about who's on top....Nintendo don't have to be the best seller to be successful and relevant.

@toxibunny Regarding hassle, I bought a new gaming laptop recently, and the setup required before you can play on that is less than the Wii U.

@Buizel
The Gamecube existed in a very different time. For a start the fact that the PS2 had a DVD player included was a seriously big deal. These days those sort of media features don't matter as much. I mean, if your TV doesn't do Netflix you get a Chromecast and call it a day.

There's also the difference in what sort of games sell now vs back then. The best sellers during the Gamecube era were pretty much all exclusives or at least timed exclusives. Today and most of the best selling games are multi-platform. There aren't anywhere as many reasons to own a PS4 rather than an XBOne (or even PC).

the main point of difference for consoles is always going to be what games are coming out. Currently Nintendo relies almost entirely on their exclusive content. Nintendo if anything are still running on the pre-360/PS3 era model. If they modernised their approach and picked up most if not all of the big multi-platform third party releases? With third parties and their exclusives there's no reason why they can't be extremely competitive.

I think the big issue we all have is we see this group differently than each other. Do we mean people that own XB1 and PS4? Do we mean the die-hard fans of PlayStation and Xbox? Do we mean the people that preferred Xbox and PlayStation over Nintendo over these last 2 generations? Each one of these groups is different and looking for different things.

• It would be nearly impossible to convince a die-hard to go to a different company. Just like how I am unlikely to go to Xbox or PlayStation since I own Nintendo systems and a decent PC.
• People that bought a Xb1 and PS4, and if they are happy with their purchase, then something unique from Nintendo might sway them but 3rd party support won't. They are happy with their purchase and don't have a need to upgrade.
• People that have preferred Xbox and Sony over these past two generations but don't have a PS4/XB1 or aren't satisfied with their purchase, will benefit greatly from Nintendo getting more 3rd party support. Nintendo will offer their own software next to 3rd party software, giving people more choices.
• Then we have people that might purchase the PS4K or XB1.5, they could be interested in what Nintendo has to offer. If the XB1 and PS4 haven't sold them, or if they do have them and are thinking of upgrading, something new and different might interest them more. If you have a PS4, why upgrade to PS4K? If you have a XB1, why upgrade to a XB1.5? A new option might actually get these customers to switch over.
• We also have people that just haven't purchased a new system from 360 and PS3. These are the main market for any console manufacture. I would argue Nintendo would have the best product for them. PS4 and XB1 haven't convinced them yet, and that might be from feeling the games are too much the same. A new Nintendo Console that gets the 3rd party series they know and love and has Zelda, might interest them.

-Lastly, we have Wii U owners. All the fail potential, all the delays and "lies" about certain games. Most of them still love Nintendo, the die-hards. Some of them are really tired of Nintendo, this new system with 3rd party support could win them back. They would see a system where they can still get their great Nintendo titles, even if they delay them, and be backed by big 3rd party support.

Of course there is also the possibility that Nintendo can't do enough to satisfy any of these gamers. There is the possibility Nintendo has waited too long to jump back into the game. It is possible the new idea the NX will push will also push customers away faster than the GamePad. We really don't know, but I think getting 3rd party support will be better than not getting it, especially after how the Wii U turned out.

@Project_Dolphin
I don't acknowledge the point because it's not much of a point. It's like most things. There are the people on the edges who fit into whatever stereotypes you want to make. Then there's the vast majority in the middle who don't really fit anywhere. This idea that the people who buy the PS4/XBOne are "Sony and Microsoft gamers" who aren't at all interested in what Nintendo has? It's complete and utter nonsense.

I know of plenty of people who are PC gamers but have a 3DS for games like Pokemon, Smash Bros and Zelda. Or people who only have a PS4 but will go on about how great the Zelda demo looked. Hell, if I had a dollar for every time I read the comments section under a story about the NX and it's just person after person wishing that Nintendo would go third party so that Zelda/Mario/Smash could be on their platform of choice.

There's also the fact that consoles are just as fluid as the gamers who buy them. I might want to buy the NX for just the first party exclusives and nothing else. Someone else might want mostly the third party content but decide to go with Nintendo rather than Sony because they liked the look of Metroid. Or maybe someone wants a box to play the newest CoD and Nintendo is an easier sell because Animal Crossing appeals to their partner.

At the end of the day the PS4 and XBOne sell mostly because of third party content. We know this because those are their best selling games. If Nintendo could have all of those third party games? What is this theoretical "non-Nintendo gamer" missing out on? Not much! So why can't they be competitive if they were to take that approach? Take a decent 1/3rd of the total console sales on a year-by-year basis. Why not?

@DefHalan
The biggest "group" of gamers are probably the people who don't really fit anywhere. People who will go with Nintendo one generation then swap back to Sony or Microsoft. I know people who went from Gamecube to 360 or XBox to PS3. People who were into the PS2 who grabbed the Wii before graduating to the 360 when Kinect came out. PC gamers who will buy whatever Nintendo's current console is whenever a new Zelda comes out. The vast majority of people, the people who don't go on fan forums, aren't loyal to a particular brand in the slightest.

@DefHalan I think Nintendo's only real chance for NX success would be if Microsoft and Sony anger their respective fanbases this year (I'm talking like 2013 XB1 reveal type situation). People may notice the 6 month drought of absolutely no Wii U games (September to March) and think Nintendo's totally going to do the same thing with NX so something very negative on the XB1 and PS4 fronts would be needed for them to budge.

@Grumblevolcano With proper 3rd Party support, there would be no game droughts. Who knows how people are going to react to the PS4K and XB1.5. I do hear of some people being willing to upgrade, to make sure their games run better, but I also hear of people saying their current PS4 and XB1 will be good enough. I don't think those fans need to be angered, but having another option could mean they get the NX over upgrading their current system. Then they could still have their Sony/Microsoft system and a Nintendo system. More options can only improve Nintendo situation, right?