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Topic: Monster Hunter Rise

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JaxonH

@VoidofLight
Iceborne Master Edition included the base game on disc and a download code for the expansion, same as the Rise + Sunbreak Set. We don't have a price yet, but I'm assuming the set will be $60, same as the MH World Iceborne Master Edition was.

As for Citadel size, we don't know for sure. All we know atm is that it has multiple biomes, which would seem to indicate it will be a larger than normal map in order to accommodate the ice area, forest area and ruins area. Or, maybe it's the same size as other maps but just has smart design with gradual transformations. Hard to say, really.

Either way, it's looking boss.

All have sinned and fall short of Gods glory. Wages of sin is death. Romans

God so loved the world He sent His only Son- whoever believes on Him has eternal life. Unless you believe, you will die in your sins. Whoever believes, rivers of living water flow within them. John

iLikeUrAttitude

@JaxonH If the map turns out to be bigger than average I would like for there to be more subcamps then.

Good... good
Now play Dragon Quest

JaxonH

@iLikeUrAttitude
I'm sure there will be if that's the case. Volcano map had 3 camps total, as did the Ice map. Even World maps only had, what... 4 camps total? So if base Rise was already doing 3 I'm quite sure this one will have enough for its size.

All have sinned and fall short of Gods glory. Wages of sin is death. Romans

God so loved the world He sent His only Son- whoever believes on Him has eternal life. Unless you believe, you will die in your sins. Whoever believes, rivers of living water flow within them. John

JaxonH

New footage from Japan showing a brief clip of Astalos and Shogun Ceanataur gameplay

All have sinned and fall short of Gods glory. Wages of sin is death. Romans

God so loved the world He sent His only Son- whoever believes on Him has eternal life. Unless you believe, you will die in your sins. Whoever believes, rivers of living water flow within them. John

JaxonH

Monster Hunter Rise Sunbreak is so hype! That direct was a blowout- everything weve seen so far has been top shelf. A MASSIVE map with different biomes (tundra, lush forest, ancient ruins), amazing new characters and village, and the monster roster? A-list.

Just look at these monsters!

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All have sinned and fall short of Gods glory. Wages of sin is death. Romans

God so loved the world He sent His only Son- whoever believes on Him has eternal life. Unless you believe, you will die in your sins. Whoever believes, rivers of living water flow within them. John

Ulysses

I'm still holding out hopes for a second map, but the more shots we get of the Citadel, the more impressive it appears! Absolutely massive, I mean just look at how steep that crevice drops down in front of the castle walls!

From the armor shown so far, I'm still sensing a sort of post-MHWorld "toned down" sensibility to armor design, unfortunately... Looks like it will be a while longer before we return to 3rd/4th gen's wilder armor design.

But it is what it is.

More importantly, Sunbreak ultimately looks like more incredible game design by Capcom! Monster Hunter truly is one of the best franchises in gaming.

Now all the franchise needs is its Elden Ring moment, a fully open world to complement the already great gameplay. Which I have a feeling Monster Hunter 6 will debut...

Edited on by Ulysses

Ulysses

VoidofLight

Eh, I can't see a fully open world working with the type of game that Monster Hunter is. I feel like it'd just lose too much of it's identity in the process. @Ulysses

"It is fate. Many have tried, yet none have ever managed to escape it's flow."

JaxonH

@Ulysses
I didn't get that impression at all. The amiibo armor for Malzeno looks sick. As does the Deluxe version armor. And Astalos armor. In fact all the armor we've seen have had previous gen designs carried over (except from World monsters, but so far no World monsters shown for Sunbreak).

World armor was definitely toned down, but Rise seemed to take us back to the good armor and weapon designs (that's not to say there wasn't great armor sets in World- to date the Bazel set is still one of my all time faves).

I also agree with @VoidofLight inasmuch that I don't expect one giant World. It just isn't a good fit for the game's structural design. It works for Elden Ring, but I don't think it would work for Monster Hunter. Giant open maps work, because it's a quest based game. And without separating maps you lose the diversity of locations. Yes, you can artificially combine biomes like Guiding Lands, and you can try to include different themes in a single map like The Citadel with ruins, and a forest bordering on rocky tundra, but that can only get you so far. If you want desert and ice, volcano and tropical forest, savannah, etc, you need separate maps.

Anyways, I noticed that crevice also. I wonder whats down there? I'm loving the verticality and I'm especially digging the vibe of The Citadel.

I'm pretty sure we're getting at least one more map since the marketing material mentioned "new areas" even while showing The Citadel. Whether it's another new map or a re-imagining of a previous map (Misty Peaks, anyone?) is anyone's guess.

All have sinned and fall short of Gods glory. Wages of sin is death. Romans

God so loved the world He sent His only Son- whoever believes on Him has eternal life. Unless you believe, you will die in your sins. Whoever believes, rivers of living water flow within them. John

iLikeUrAttitude

Ulysses wrote:

Now all the franchise needs is its Elden Ring moment, a fully open world to complement the already great gameplay. Which I have a feeling Monster Hunter 6 will debut...

Reminder that an open world doesn't automatically make a game good, in fact most of the time it's shoehorned without giving the world any depth.
And furthermore, a fully open Monster Hunter makes no sense whatsoever, its a quest based game with boss arena elements, you'll be fighting the same monster repeatedly, in what sense would that fit in with Monster Hunter?

Good... good
Now play Dragon Quest

Snatcher

@iLikeUrAttitude Tbh, I don’t really want a open world MH, world did a amazing job at it, but I would still feel like it was to big, as I was just running everywhere, and it feels even more so when you have one of those monsters that run all over the place.

Nintendo are like woman, You love them for whats on the inside, not the outside…you know what I mean! Luzlane best girl!

(My friend code is SW-7322-1645-6323, please ask me before you use it)

Sorry for not being active much recently, but I’m very much alive!

Ulysses

Okay but, you guys do realize that an open world Monster Hunter is inevitable, right?

Firstly, the game industry at large heavily pressures developers to go open world. If an open world doesn't happen with Monster Hunter 6, then it definitely will happen with Monster Hunter 7.

But more importantly, seeing you guys argue reasons why an open world Monster Hunter wouldn't work reminds me of all the Zelda fans arguing all of their reasons why an open world Zelda wouldn't work. That is, until we played BOTW for ourselves, and discovered an entirely new concept of what The Legend of Zelda can be. And in fact, BOTW harkened back to some of the oldest ideas from the Zelda franchise.

iLikeUrAttitude wrote:

Reminder that an open world doesn't automatically make a game good, in fact most of the time it's shoehorned without giving the world any depth.

Remember discovering a new village hub in MHWorld, or in MH4U? Instead of watching a load screen take us there, we would have to venture out into the wild frontier, and travel to the new village on foot. That adds depth in my opinion.

iLikeUrAttitude wrote:

A fully open Monster Hunter makes no sense whatsoever, its a quest based game with boss arena elements, you'll be fighting the same monster repeatedly, in what sense would that fit in with Monster Hunter?

We could free roam without any quest structure, encountering procedurally generated monsters, ever since the Deserted Isle in MHTri. Plus, an open world has the potential to add immersion and real-time context to the gameplay events within almost any game franchise, from the Souls series to Zelda, and also Monster Hunter.

JaxonH wrote:

without separating maps you lose the diversity of locations. Yes, you can artificially combine biomes like Guiding Lands, and you can try to include different themes in a single map like The Citadel with ruins, and a forest bordering on rocky tundra, but that can only get you so far. If you want desert and ice, volcano and tropical forest, savannah, etc, you need separate maps.

I really find it wholly ironic how you say maps need to be separated to contain diverse biomes while also mentioning the Citadel in the same breath. The Citadel, the Guiding Lands, the BOTW open world, and almost any fantasy environment in a myriad of franchises help refute the idea that maps must be separated by load screens and entire continents in order to feature diverse biomes.

The Citadel itself will almost certainly measure, yard for yard, smaller than the maps contained in MHWorld, and despite that will transition seamlessly from lush forestry to frigid tundras. Even real life geography proves that places around the world can contain wildly diverse biomes due to unique weather patterns.

Imagine an open world Monster Hunter; just like in older entries, you begin in a small, humble village. Quickly you discover that your hunter character is a big fish in a little pond, and you are promised even more quests and more menacing monsters in the next village. But in order to visit this new village for the first time, you must navigate through dangerous, wild territory as you find your way to this new village. Once there, you discover they have the skills to help you build your own caravan. (which also unlocks fast travel) After taking on a new questline to build your own caravan, an urgent quest appears because a Tigrex has invaded the area and is bothering the caravans in the local area. After that you can fast travel back to your old village, or set out on your caravan in real time and explore the vast realm to find a new village. You end up discovering a third village, and they have a volcano close by, filled with intricate lava caverns. Not only does this third village contain exclusive monsters to hunt, but it also contains the engineering expertise to help you build your own airship! Following a questline exclusive to that village, you successfully build your own airship, when an urgent quest appears: a Seregios is attacking airships in the area, so you take on a siege quest to repel him from the area before you can use your airship. After that, you can take your airship out into the skies, and explore to find a mysterious village rumored to hide high up in the mountains.

I can't wait to play an open world Monster Hunter like that someday.

Think back to the older cutscenes, where your hunter watches a team of Felynes painstakingly transport the captured monster back to the village. Instead of simply watching a load screen take you back to the village, you can choose whether to fast travel back or to escort the captured monster back to the village. Being given that choice is what adds so much immersion into a game.

Edited on by Ulysses

Ulysses

VoidofLight

I just don't think the quest based structure would lend itself well to an open world. They'd have to get rid of the timer entirely, so timed quests would be gone, or else exploration would be ruined as a result. Not every game has to be open world, or will become open world. I can see the maps in the next game probably being bigger, but I can't see them going "Here, have this fully open map to explore, and there goes timed quests, since we can't just whisk you back to the village to prepare for hunts!"

"It is fate. Many have tried, yet none have ever managed to escape it's flow."

Ulysses

@VoidofLight You could still have timed quests. Once signing on to a quest, the timer could indicate how much time you have to hunt the monster before it leaves the territory. This was true even for MHWorld's free roaming; monsters would come and go on their own hidden timers, if you stay long enough to watch.

If you failed the quest, the monster would leave and you would have to fast travel back to the village instead of automatically being taken back. This is the part where a game, like all games, defies logic and resets itself and allows you to take on the quest again, kind of like how a JRPG boss waits to end the world until you finally choose to fight it.

An open world could offer a wide variety of quest structures, both with and without timers. Rare appearances could be on shorter timers, while territorial monsters that never leave the area could have quests without any timer.

Edited on by Ulysses

Ulysses

VoidofLight

@Ulysses The thing is, the free roam timers worked for the free roam section of World. The free roam section didn't just take away one of the crucial points of the game. They'd have to fully abandon the mission quests entirely if they made the game fully open world. Also, I don't know about you, but walking back and forth between the village and an area of the world doesn't really sound.. fun? It sounds incredibly tedious to do.

Also, monsters leaving a zone wouldn't work either, given that in a fully open world game, there are no zones for the monster to run away from. Unless they just make it to where each region functions like a different part of the map, and the monster just up and runs away mid-quest (Which would also be extremely annoying.)

"It is fate. Many have tried, yet none have ever managed to escape it's flow."

Ulysses

@VoidofLight In no way would they be required to abandon mission quests entirely in an open world structure. In fact, initiating a traditional mission quest could generate a monster in a specific area.

And as for walking back and forth... Almost every open world has its version of fast travel? Even Iceborne gives you a taxi mechanic to ferry you more quickly from one area to the next.

MHWorld should have done this already, but monsters can easily be sanctioned into their own territories. An open world can be divided into individual territories, where certain monsters always appear and never stray from. Rathalos for instance would have its own designated territory that it guards and protects, like a lion does in real life.

Edited on by Ulysses

Ulysses

VoidofLight

I just don't see that as a fun concept. I'd much rather them just keep the map structure honestly, given that it's the main thing these games do well. Yes, World had a territory system. I enjoyed that system, but I really wouldn't want it to be "OPEN WORLD, EXPLORE EVERYTHING!", since it'll ruin what makes the series itself unique. I'm tired of everyone thinking every game series needs to be 100% open world, since while it works in the favor of some series, it does ruin the unique aspects that made people enjoy a series in the first place.

For example, BotW. Yes, I know tons of people love it. I thought it was fine personally. However, I'll admit that I kind of wish we could go back to 2D top-down Zelda and traditional 3D Zeldas. BotW was a breath of fresh air, given that Zelda games were getting more and more linear as time went on. Despite this though, the game has glaring issues and it feels like some aspects of what made Zelda "Zelda" was lost. Things like actual dungeons that were themed, or a proper story/narrative that could actually invest you into the world. Things like the lack of enemy variety, with tons of Zelda enemies that people knew and loved being erased from existence. The combat being incredibly watered down to fit a world where you can go absolutely anywhere and do absolutely anything.

If they made Monster Hunter a series that was totally and fully open world, it will probably drop a ton of things that make the series what it was to begin with, or screw with systems that were already good, all so they could make it follow a trend that actively takes away from the unique aspects of the other series that followed said trend.

"It is fate. Many have tried, yet none have ever managed to escape it's flow."

JaxonH

@Ulysses
Ya I'm just not seeing it. MH already did go "open world" to the extent that maps are fully open now without loading screens. That was hype and it added value. Simply merging all maps into a single map doesn't really offer anything of value, in fact it actively devalues the experience by being incompatible with the core structure of the formula.

Even if they made every possible biome into one map, there wouldn't really be any advantage to the current system. Searching for monsters would become impossible as you wander a map the size of Zelda? There is such a thing as too big.

Notwithstanding the fact Zelda was more high fantasy- they could merge multiple biomes by making a really huge map to separate them, and having a day night cycle that made it feel like you traveled for weeks to get to your destination. MH gives you 50 minutes. To go from desert to volcano to icy tundra to tropical rainforest in 50 minutes, and have time to fight the monster? That just doesn't seem compatible. It's one thing to go from a forest's edge to the start of tundra like Citadel, its quite another to do multiple opposing biomes you travel in 50 min. They'd have to drastically alter a formula that's already a golden goose. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. MH is now their highest selling game of all time. I don't see them making drastic alterations to the structure of the core game's identity like that. Even World with it's massive overhaul didn't dare change the 50 minute quest based structure across multiple maps.

There's just no need for it. It's a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. World solved real problems with loading zones and grind gathering. Merging maps doesn't solve any imminent problem.

I mean, nobody knows the future. But if you're asking me, I just don't see it happening. Maybe for a spinoff MMO? I could see that. But for the core series? Nah. I think the core structure will remain in tact indefinitely, until or unless players start losing interest and serious overhaul of the game's blueprint is required.

All have sinned and fall short of Gods glory. Wages of sin is death. Romans

God so loved the world He sent His only Son- whoever believes on Him has eternal life. Unless you believe, you will die in your sins. Whoever believes, rivers of living water flow within them. John

Snatcher

@Ulysses I know a open world MH sounds cool and it could work, its, im not seeing it.

Everything monster hunter does, just works so much better because you can just, go to a quest, and hunt it, and im not to sure what open world would to for the game, as your objective, is to just hunt thing a 100 different times, sure roaming around the world to find stuff like towns are cool, but why not leave that to the other open worlds.

One of the things I love about monster hunter is the quick "go in get it done" aspect, and a open world MH just seems like it would defeat this whole purpose. I will have to roam around this large world just to collect and find items, sure you do that in world, but its simple and easy (Depending on the item), go in, get out.

Again saying a open world monster hunter wont or can't happen, I just see no real reason to do so, since world pretty much gave us a sorta open area, but divided into sections. I just love how smooth it all is. And I keep thinking about it, and I just see no real reason to go open world, even tho we are probably getting it at some point. (Sorry if a lot of this is repeating myself,)

Nintendo are like woman, You love them for whats on the inside, not the outside…you know what I mean! Luzlane best girl!

(My friend code is SW-7322-1645-6323, please ask me before you use it)

Sorry for not being active much recently, but I’m very much alive!

Snatcher

@JaxonH Wow I ended up saying a lot of the same things your saying LOL, I guess im not crazy for thinking there is no need for open world.

Nintendo are like woman, You love them for whats on the inside, not the outside…you know what I mean! Luzlane best girl!

(My friend code is SW-7322-1645-6323, please ask me before you use it)

Sorry for not being active much recently, but I’m very much alive!

Pizzamorg

Honestly - and I know this isn't the most popular opinion - probably the worst mechanic about World was following the scout flies and chasing the monster around the map. I appreciate it gave you more of a role playing sense of hunting a monster or whatever, but I honestly just found it so tedious and so unnecessary.

So again, I know this isn't popular, but the fact that Rise made environments smaller and got you straight into the action, was a quality of life decision (and I fully think it is is QOL) that just made that game such a greater joy to play over the others.

So far that reason, I absolutely do not like the idea of an open world Monster Hunter game, unless like someone said I can have a fast travel point literally directly next to each monster so I can just load in. But then if I am doing that, you may as well just keep the hubs lol.

Life to the living, death to the dead.

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