Topic: Is The Switch 2 Worth It???

I will say it is funny in a way that Switch 2's game pricing, along with the "on the high end of reasonable" console price was a massive controversy when it was announced, and not even a year later it almost feels cute.

I don't think that's a sign of short sighted hyperbole entirely as much as an increasingly bleak state of things that Nintendo won by simply being the least bad.

Helps that in hindsight I do think the real pricing issue is Nintendo's stubborn refusal to have notable price variations among games where it would make sense (the Metroid Prime remaster being 40 bucks really making it clear how nonsensical some of those full priced Switch releases were) or have remotely as good sales as anyone else, something that's been an issue long before now. Will Famicom Detective Club remakes ever be reasonably priced, I really wanted to buy that but digital only + Nintendo mediocre to bad sales + Ace Attorney being a vastly better deal on Switch has always entirely dissuaded me.

@kkslider5552000
Game pricing on Switch 2 is even more of a mess when you consider Switch 2 Editions. Sometimes the upgrade is free, sometimes it's $20AU, sometimes it's a few dollars. Even crazier there seems to very often be cases where the Switch version plus the Switch 2 Edition upgrade costs less than the Switch 2 Edition

I struggle to navigate it, I don't know how the average consumer makes sense of it

@skywake
Yea... I don't know. I never really bought into the "Nintendo doesn't directly compete with Sony/Microsoft" narrative.

I agree with you about Valve, for sure.

But I think the lines are blurring on the console side and are certainly overlapping again, probably since the Switch's launch. During the Gamecube-Wii U years (which was indeed a long time) things were pretty distinct between the three console makers: each console had distinct exclusives, third-party stuff would still have different versions between some of the consoles, it was clear which markets each was trying to corner, etc.

But I think we've been seeing a lot of homogenizing over the last near-decade. The same games across all the consoles. Almost everything third-party these days comes to all three consoles. The overlap is back and only increasing.

The biggest reason prices are increasing, beyond tarrifs, or the RAM squeeze, or the ever decreasing value of the dollar... is inflation of expectations.

What do I mean by that?

Because of diminishing returns with regard to perceived visual fidelity, it takes larger and larger leaps for smaller and smaller improvements. Yet PS and Xbox kinda screwed the industry by making their primary focus power. Because of the massive leap we saw with PS3/360, each generation after they've had to use more expensive kit to maintain an impressive enough visual improvement. And now people expect that.

So with Switch 2, anything less than a "portable PS4" would have been underwhelming, to say the least. But that means the cost has to go up.

Thankfully, we've reached a point with PS5 where, anything beyond is going to feel negligible, meaning the NS3 will likely be a "portable PS5" for $499, and beyond that we won't really need massive leaps. Development costs have already grown out of control. We need a plateau where games can target a shared visual level for 10-20 years. As it is, a game can take 6 years to make. By the time it releases, the next generation has already begun. We need a plateau.

@JaxonH, yeah, I noticed that myself a while back, and I very much agree with your statement. The reason I got a used PS4 Pro for $200 a few months back instead of a PS5 is because all of the Playstation games I wanted to play (specifically the mainline Neptunia games that got their American Switch releases canceled a while back) were available on that as well as the PS5. Frankly, I don't need the most amazing graphics to enjoy a game, as long as it looks nice enough. And HD does look really good still, a lot of the times I can't even tell much difference between HD and 4K, and some games from before the HD era look pretty good as well. I'm not super picky about frame rates either: it can be 30 or 60, and there can even be a bit of fluctuation, as long as it doesn't look like an absolute abomination, which is very rare from what I've seen. The reason I most want a Switch 2 is not because of high-end graphics or whatever, it's to play the next mainline Pokémon, next mainline Zelda, and (assuming it's still happening) next Super Smash Bros.

And I do want to get into PC gaming too at some point, even though that's most likely several years from now. Not because of high-end graphics or whatever, but because of the bigger amount of freedom that it has compared to console gaming, being able to do mods and all that cool stuff.

Again, I'm not saying that people wanting high-end, expensive gaming stuff is a bad thing, I'm just throwing my hat into the ring. And pointing out that every single company creating super high-end, premium devices means that the price goes up too in the process.

@Nep-Nep-Freak
I hear ya.

I will say though, there's a lot of NS1 games that now run great on NS2. Some were unplayable before imo. I dropped Zelda Link's Awakening and Pokemon Scarlet because of framerate issues. Now they run at 60 frames locked. As does Zelda BotW and TotK. Games like MH Stories 2 and Ni No Kuni 2, which constantly stuttered before, now run at a locked 60. Bayonetta 3 runs at a locked 60 and the dynamic resolution doesn't drop below 720p either.

And even though I also don't need higher resolutions, it's nice having them. Playing Fantasy Life i and Trails In The Sky 1st Chapter in higher resolutions at 60 frames is a huge improvement over the 720p max sub-30 fps performance on NS1.

I feel like the PS3/360/WiiU/NS1 level of power just wasn't enough to properly realize the games being made for them. Whereas PS4/X1/NS2 level of power is, by and large, good enough for most games to look and run at a satisfactory level.

I don't mess with mods, at all, and I hate dealing with Windows and needing a KB/M to wake/navigate the OS at times, the constant updates, dealing with all the settings, etc. But I still prefer it over PS/Xbox because Steam allows mapping mouse to gyro via Steam Input. So I can play most games with gyro aiming as desired (like MH Wilds).

I think the average consumer doesn't pay upgrade fees. Like I don't even know how they work, not having the system yet but unless you put in the game and the game then tells you immediately to pay, I'd just assume it is not a known quantity to the families who just wanted the newest Mario Kart. Some of them probably don't even know Switch 2 plays Switch 1 games at all, again unless the system unavoidably tells them. (or the box says it in really, really big letters)

@kkslider5552000
You're probably right there. I guess the oddness of the pricing of Switch 2 Editions and upgrade packs is something only a more engaged end user is going to pick up on. But for me at least it's certainly a point of annoyance. Every time there is a cross-gen release on Switch 2 I want to pick up I end up looking at the price of the Switch version, the Switch 2 Edition and the Upgrade pack. Sometimes there is an upgrade pack, sometimes there isn't, sometimes it's cheaper to get the Switch version and upgrade, sometimes it's not

It's a bit of a mess

@rallydefault
I would argue that the increasing amount of multi-platform titles makes these three (Nintendo, Sony, Valve) look even more monopolistic. Between Sony and Valve it's really just a philosophical divide between them rather than a question of content. If you want a high-spec home console with all that brings your only choice is Sony. If you're ok with tinkering and want to DIY then the Steam storefront is where you go. Doesn't really matter what games you're into, they're generally on both

And then with Nintendo there are two angles. Firstly, and despite what some wish to believe, Nintendo has basically had a continuous monopoly on portable consoles since the launch of the GameBoy. But also they tend to release a very specific "Nintendo" type of software that doesn't really exist elsewhere. If you want either of these things your only option is Nintendo's hardware and also you're probably not as interested in their competitors

In previous generations there was a significant overlap in device types and target demographics with little overlap in software. Now there's a huge overlap in software with little overlap in demographics and device types

@skywake The console market is really a natural oligopoly (if you're not familiar with the term, natural oligopoly means a market that has few competitors because of inherent conditions to the market such as high cost of production and low demand as opposed to intentional malicious actions to eliminate competition such as collusion or price fixing), it's difficult for a competitor to break in because of the high development costs and relatively finite market so we never really have more than 3 consoles on the market at the same time. Really this sort of "monopoly in three different markets" feels less like an attempt to dominate the market because there's little else to expand into and more like an attempt to defend their place in it by doubling down on what they do best and hoping that's enough to keep them afloat.

Now the X factor here is mobile, the mobile market has been expanding. But the thing with mobile is that that industry is about more than just gaming and its audience isn't really looking at their mobile devices as gaming consoles, they're for a variety of things. And the other competitors (particularly from traditional consoles) may have trouble reaching them. Nintendo's tried and largely failed, or at least on the terms they're comfortable with (maybe if Nintendo wanted to make their own phone and lean more into multimedia they'd have more long term success but Nintendo has been mainly focused on gaming). Sony isn't really having success in mobile either. Valve might because Steam is more of a storefront app than hardware, but they'd probably make more money on users with higher end specs.

Anyway, the growth of PC and mobile probably has the Big 3 spooked about their place in the industry. It's showing signs that the number of people willing to buy hardware primarily dedicated to playing video games may be stagnating or even shrinking. I think this "monopolization" of different niches and Xbox's gradual drifting away from the market is a response to that, with Nintendo and Sony trying to keep the audience they have and Xbox trying to expand. So if Nintendo were to fail and exit the market I wouldn't consider Sony to have a true monopoly, PC and mobile are too and I suspect a significant chunk of Nintendo's audience will just leave for those devices rather than Playstation. It's also possible that might open up room for a new competitor, although I think more than likely any kind of new competition would probably want to position themselves as an alternative to PC or mobile gaming.

So, Bolt is actually right about it being an oligopoly. It's not really a monopoly, it's an oligopoly where each of the 3 main players has their defining features and traits which differentiate them from the others. The fall of Xbox is because they failed to carve out their own defining features to differentiate themselves. They ultimately tried with GamePass but it simply wasn't enough. For nearly 15 years they had few compelling exclusives, no gyro or other innovations in their controller, heck not even old innovations that became standard with everyone else, they were creatively bankrupt and ya, there just wasn't room for a platform like that.

In an oligopoly, you either stand out and provide a product/service people want which your competitors cannot, or you fail. Switch 2, PS5 and Steam are all different, unique and have their own markets carved out.

Shawn Layden recently pointed out how the total hardware sold among all platforms has stagnated around 250-300 million units sold for generations. The mix shifts around but the total never really breaks that cap. With the decline of Xbox, half of whom will likely migrate to PC and the other half to PS, I expect around 125 million sold for both Sony and Nintendo moving forward, which still lands around 250m. Dedicated console gaming has capped out.

Also the price, a straight conversion of the recommended/suggested selling price in Japan to UK currency at one point was less than £240 and that's not a discounted price that is the full selling price. I'd be happy with a £299 price in the UK but close to £400 is ridiculous. However we have just seen a huge 20% stock reduction in Nintendo share prices. I don't know if this is just a result of the huge increase in component costs or shareholders have some insight about sales figures over December that haven't reached consumers yet, they pay for such early data. Yes it is struggling in Europe but we were never the best Nintendo market anyway but maybe that in combination with component prices has caused many to devalue Nintendo shares. The average amount of shares a shareholder has in Nintendo is about 6000 which is about $120k so something like $20k they have lost in recent trading. Of course shares went up since Switch 2 launch so in real terms they could have a loss or gain but if they had sold before the crash then they would have been $20K better off before costs/fees.

I think the original T239 Switch Pro model was destined to have 8GB with development kits having 12GB but with the huge delay in its launch of many years the memory was upgraded to 12GB for the consumer model but I've noticed with android tablets the 4GB versions are getting pushed much more now with 8GB models often hugely more expensive it seems especially if they make use of LDDR5 instead of LDDR4. So it feels like many companies are trying to get consumers to accept devices with less memory and less storage. Debloating such android tablets is getting more and more important. So 12GB is actually a significant cost in the Switch 2 compared to 8GB as is the flash storage of 256GB which was probably originally going to be 128GB and much slower technology. So despite the main chipset in the Switch 2 being relatively weak its actually paired with some decent memory and storage chips. Nvidia charge huge prices on their chipsets too. Valve has discontinued the Steam Deck LCD model which has 16GB of LDDR5 and those are sold directly so no retailer/wholesaler margins.

Computers and gaming devices are going through what seems high inflation prices because memory and storage chips are going through a hyper inflation process.

Nintendo are caught in a very difficult situation for Switch 2 where their costs are increasing hugely but if the price goes up for consumers they will really struggle to get high level of sales for the Switch 2 platform. However the very low spec display panel and small capacity battery must help them to a degree. They have obviously gone cheap for some of the Switch 2 components. I can't help thinking if they hadn't priced so ridiculously in Europe they would have benefitted from a better foundation here to work with from launch. Maybe they will have to put more focus back on the Switch 1 and start developing again for that format because of its huge userbase and have the Switch 2 as more of a Switch pro model. I.e. less Switch 2 exclusive games. This is especially true if the Switch 2 rises in price in all markets. Maybe drop the Switch 1 normal models but focus on bringing the Switch Lite model down in price with a revision to add poor hdmi output (up to 720p only). This means a greater gulf between Switch 1 and Switch 2 home performance. I really think at this point they need to bring out a new Switch 1 model in order to show continued support in Switch 1.

Hey all, a new member in Nintendo Life here reporting in, but coming from Push Square.

As a 37-year-old and a father of two kids (8 & 4 years old). Switch 2 was really worth it. I used to have all consoles and play on all of them, but in recent years, I can barely play a couple of hours some evenings, and maybe even less.

So, Switch 2 was actually the best console I could ask for. It has all the great Family games where I can play with them. My older kid can play more complicated games and enjoys Fortnite on it, while I can play Cyberpunk, Star Wars Outlaws, Zelda TOTK, etc.

TBH, I thought the FOMO might catch up to me, and I would miss my PS5, but I haven't felt that so far. I have a lot of games to keep me busy until at least next summer. I just hope that more third parties support the Switch 2 with ports of their future games, not just the old ones.

Additionally, I didn't mention how portability is crucial to my current lifestyle, and I didn't realize its importance until I tried it out myself.

@Khwarezm89
Welcome!

I'm a father just a few years older than you, so I know the feeling.

I grew up on Nintendo but then went Xbox/PS when I was in college and for a bit after. Came back for the Wii U and Switch. Just kind of got burned out on the game design with a lot of the Xbox/Sony exclusives, to be honest, but everyone's mileage varies. I've always been more of an "arcade" gamer, honestly - games that are quick to hop in and out, simple objectives, etc.

But yea, the Switch has also basically allowed me to keep some gaming in my life with the portability. If I was tied to a TV all the time, I'd probably get like an hour a week lol

Have fun!

I'm glad its worked out so well for you. As for ports though I don't think it will be that great in providing ports from other platforms. There are technical limitations and commercial issues too. Many of the ports so far have sold badly, below the publishers worst expectations and the 2 impressive conversions Cyberpunk and Outlaws have been followed by very un-optimised ports from PC. Unfortunately such ports don't sell well on Nintendo consoles. Optimising games for fixed platforms produces great results but also has exceptionally high development costs. I hope to be proven wrong but realistically I feel the Switch 2 will only get ports of the most popular games that are achievable on the Switch 2. The Switch 2 does better with more GPU intensive titles than CPU intensive because its GPU performance level is on a better level than its CPU performance especially if DLSS is used. Many have compared the Switch 2 to a portable PS4 and I think that is a fair summary overall although the Switch 2 is both weaker and stronger than PS4 in many areas but overall its that level of performance in a portable which is still fantastic for a portable.

Dare I say it but the majority of people that buy Switch 2 have other gaming platforms and most people are buying it for first party Nintendo titles mostly. Outlaws sold 600 units at retail for Switch 2 in Spain for the first week. It was number 10 in the UK for its launch week with roughly half the sales Switch 2 and the rest other formats although mainly PS5. Obviously Europe is not a great market for Switch 2 though. USA would be the more important market for sales figures but none came up when I searched. In Japan where the Switch 2 is a huge success Outlaws has sold well I think due to being very well optimised and Star Wars based despite Ubisoft not normally having great success in Japan on average with some games selling tiny numbers. Overall Outlaws the game has been a failure I believe for Ubisoft has not had the success they hoped for on earlier formats with a poor launch and very high licensing costs. I personally think Cyperpunk and Outlaws represent early enthusiasm for the console with a lot of money spent but later games converted to Switch 2 are unlikely to have the same high budget due to more realistic estimated sales figures.

At least in the US, there have been claims/data (not sure how accurate ) saying more than half of Nintendo, PlayStation, and xbox owners all own more than one console. Soo... it wouldn't be surprising if that is also true for Switch 2. And yes, non-shockingly, many people buy consoles for the exclusives, especially in Nintendo's case since it has so many good exclusives.

For people who just want one console (including me)? Switch 2 has Nintendo games, most of the top indies and a decent chunk of the good AAA multi-console games while being relatively affordable and both portable and dockable. As someone who cares about performance but isn't a serious performance snob, I feel like I'm not missing out on much in exchange for the very big positives of hybrid and Nintendo games. In the Switch 1 era I did feel like I was missing out a bit and was very tempted to get a PS5. Now that temptation has left. Obviously not everyone wants Nintendo games and hybrid though so those people would make a different choice.

tbh, there are more games than there is time and money, so the occasional miss-out of a game isn't necessarily bad as long as most of what you want is available and Switch 2 offers me that.

I think there is a good chance @Khwarezm89 will be happy with their choice like I am.

I don’t think it’s fair to use the exchange rate as JPY is currently very weak. Adjusting for PPP the JPN-only version is closer to £355, and the international version around £500. So not all too different from UK’s price of £395.

I'd be happy with a £299 price in the UK but close to £400 is ridiculous.

Didn’t you just say the Switch 2 is being “heavily discounted” in the UK and you saw one for £300?

As for ports though I don't think it will be that great in providing ports from other platforms. There are technical limitations and commercial issues too.

Dare I say it but the majority of people that buy Switch 2 have other gaming platforms and most people are buying it for first party Nintendo titles mostly.

People said this about the Switch, and lo and behold…

@BonzoBanana I think between the potential PS6 delay due to the RAM crisis, the PS6 dockable handheld, a lengthy PS5/PS6 crossgen period already confirmed by Sony and the downfall of the Xbox platform we'll see Switch 2 get a lot of 3rd party support provided people buy them. The biggest thing Nintendo can do to mitigate risk of 3rd party games not selling well is to make 16GB/32GB/128GB carts viable for 3rd parties to use instead of Key Cards.

@Khwarezm89 Welcome!!! Like @rallydefault, I too am a bit older, with 3 kids and the Switch was a perfect introductory console for them. Now my son, 13, has his SW2 and loves it with no desire for any other console. The handheld nature is perfect for around the house (my girls can watch a show while he games next to them. Plus, playing Fortnite together on the couch is a blast.

@BonzoBanana I think (hope) that we're going to see publishers pushing hard to get as many games as possible on the SW2 and not just the biggest releases. Looking at the success of Star Wars Outlaws, I could see good games that didn't perform as well on other systems being brought over in an attempt to recoup their losses. Plus, in the next few years, developers are going to learn how to best optimize their games to perform on the system...we're what, 7 months post launch and we've already seen some pretty impressive ports. Hopefully console sales continue so that we can see a constant stream of games coming. I guess I am one of the outliers, gaming on 1 system, so I have high hopes that we see broad adoption.

@BonzoBanana
I agree with some of your assessment, though I wouldn't make too much of stock price. It goes up and down, is susceptible to external factors such as being overbought, RAM shortages and general stock market trends. It's one thing to dip after annual financial results not meeting targets by a significant amount. Beyond that it's all noise.

Obviously most people buy NS2 for 1st party games. That's one of Nintendo's biggest strengths. Their games are the most in-demand titles in the entire industry. But that doesn't mean 3rd party don't also have their audience. Switch is chock to the hilt with excellent 3rd party ports, and Switch 2 already has more quality 3rd party than NS1 saw its first 2 years on the market.

At the end of the day, doesnt really matter why someone buys a console, as long as they buy it. And we're seeing more 3rd party than ever. Just look at upcoming titles like Final Fantasy VII Remake trilogy, Resident Evil 7, Village and Requiem, Pragmata, MH Stories 3, 007 First Light, now we're hearing Monster Hunter Wilds is coming... Nintendo gamers are feasting with more quality 3rd party games than they've had since the SNES.

Pricing is naturally a bit higher than previously, but then again so is PS and Xbox. It's ridiculous that PS5 Pro is $830 + tax, and XSX is $650 + tax. So $450 may also be ridiculous, but it's less ridiculous than the alternatives, especially given the value of being hybrid handheld with 2 usable controllers out of the box and a dock. Still, I agree that selling for $50 less would be a sweet spot. But they're gonna do what they're gonna do. As will Sony/MS (and Sony also has a PS5 model in Japan that's virtually same as NS2 btw).

You said "many". Do you have a source for that besides the one, single anonymous dev that reported underwhelming sales at launch, one of the worst times to judge viability due to limited taste of early adopters and only a few million to sell to? "Many" implies 3 or more. Can you provide evidence for 3 or more separate games with definitive evidence to back your claim? Can you even provide evidence for 2? Cause 3rd party have been plastered all over the best sellers list the past 6 months. And all evidence suggests they're doing very well as more and more games continue to be announced. That doesn't happen if games are struggling.

3rd party were crazy successful on Switch, and they'll be just as successful on Switch 2. And, almost every game has been released in a perfectly playable state. There's been no disaster releases yet. So that claim of "sloppy ports" also comes into question. Persona 3 Reload got rushed out and even that was just updated to 60fps and flawless frame timing. So... ya. The vast majority of ports have been perfectly serviceable. Well, the Skyrim update was sloppy. But that's not evidence of "most".

@Grumblevolcano
Nah. The key cart thing is textbook bubble. Half of Switch 2 users buy digital anyways, and of the half that still buy physical, most either couldn't care less or are willing to tolerate it because the alternative is simply missing out. The number of consumers who actually aren't buying games as a result is definitely non-zero, but also rather insignificant in the grand scheme of things. It's not like it's Xbox DRM checks every 24 hrs to play. It's simply a one time download, no different than 95% of Switch 1 releases that required day one updates, patches, DLC, expansions, required partial downloads, etc.

@Khwarezm89
Congrats. There's tons of great games on Switch 2 already, and it's getting more 3rd party support than Switch got. It's starting to live up to the all-in-one device its meant to be. Switch never saw so many big massive 3rd party AAA releasing. And if you never owned a Switch, you've got an insane lineup of classics to choose from.