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Topic: Sony Pulls Spider-Man movies from MCU. UPDATE: 3rd MCU Spider-Man movie happening

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jump

iKhan wrote:

jump wrote:

iKhan wrote:

If I were to tell you the superhero movies of the past 5 years that I remember the most that really resonated with me, the only Marvel movies I'd list are Civil War, Infinity War, and Endgame.

Here's the thing, not every film should resonate with you. They are intentionally mixing up the superhero genre with sub-genres so you have the slice of life teen drama of Spider-Man or the family comedy of Ant-Man etc with people naturally gravitating to one or the other based on personal preferences. Also they going after different demographics, it shouldn't shocking female audiences like Captain Marvel more than the males or black audiences like Black Panther more than the white ones.

It's the same thing with the comics themselves, Marvel and DC put out 50ish books a month each. Only the nutters read each and every one for the sake of it, most people stick to the characters they like the most and the big events.

jump

I hear this argument a lot and it kind of drives me crazy. We can sit around and pretend all the Marvel movies feel super distinct and are genuinely parts of different genres, but they just aren't. They do have some slight alterations in style and story, but for the most part they follow a pretty typical formula for their stories and cinematic style. This is likely in part due to they relying on second units so heavily. Stylistically, Black Panther and Guardians stand out decently (though I'm not as crazy for Guardians as most people are), but other movies like Doctor Strange and Ant-Man feel extremely by-the-book.

This really is the main reason I don't find the MCU films particularly memorable, they aren't really a completely distinct cinematic experience. I can like the story, or the characters, but I don't feel completely immersed

We have superhero movies that have genuinely distinct feel to them. The best example of that is probably Logan, but you can also see it in Spider-verse, as well as the older Superhero movies like the Nolan or Raimi films. One of the reasons I'm actually super excited for DC's continued film lineup is because Wonder Woman, Aquaman, and Shazam all feel like completely different film experiences.

Eh? You're complaining about Marvel being samey and by the book but then mention Wonder Woman & Auquaman which are very much straight forward origin superhero movies, Aquaman was literally called a water re-has of Black Panther at the time. Don't get me wrong they are decent enough flicks but you have seemed to have confused the trapping of special effects whizz bang with storytelling, themes and genre.

Nicolai wrote:

Alright, I gotta stop getting into arguments with jump. Someone remind me next time.

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Dezzy

Lol imagine if that had happened between the 2 Avengers films.

It's dangerous to go alone! Stay at home.

iKhan

@jump

Film is a visual medium. It’s a lot more than storytelling, and that’s my whole point. It’s very possible the scripts of the MCU films could easily be placed in different genres, but part of genre is HOW the script is visually portrayed. Every action scene in Logan is brutal, painful, and sad in time in large part due to music and cinematography. Aquaman is built from the ground up to feel corny and over the top. Gareth Edwards has literally made his career out of being able to blow your mind with action scenes.

Don’t get me wrong. Story can do a lot. Winter Soldier is my favorite MCU movie mostly because of story. But it’s telling that the only MCU action scene I remember as well as Spider-Man 2’s train scene or Wonder Woman’s No Man’s Land scene is the Avengers Assemble scene.

Edited on by iKhan

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jump

iKhan wrote:

@jump

Film is a visual medium. It’s a lot more than storytelling, and that’s my whole point. It’s very possible the scripts of the MCU films could easily be placed in different genres, but part of genre is HOW the script is visually portrayed. Every action scene in Logan is brutal, painful, and sad in time in large part due to music and cinematography. Aquaman is built from the ground up to feel corny and over the top. Gareth Edwards has literally made his career out of being able to blow your mind with action scenes.

Don’t get me wrong. Story can do a lot. Winter Soldier is my favorite MCU movie mostly because of story. But it’s telling that the only MCU action scene I remember as well as Spider-Man 2’s train scene or Wonder Woman’s No Man’s Land scene is the Avengers Assemble scene.

You realise actions scenes don't dictate a movies genre right? I'd hate to think what happens when you watch a rom-com there's fight sequences to judge it on.

Nicolai wrote:

Alright, I gotta stop getting into arguments with jump. Someone remind me next time.

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Silly_G

iKhan wrote:

I hear this argument a lot and it kind of drives me crazy. We can sit around and pretend all the Marvel movies feel super distinct and are genuinely parts of different genres, but they just aren't. They do have some slight alterations in style and story, but for the most part they follow a pretty typical formula for their stories and cinematic style.

iKhan wrote:

This really is the main reason I don't find the MCU films particularly memorable, they aren't really a completely distinct cinematic experience. I can like the story, or the characters, but I don't feel completely immersed.

I completely agree with you and I too am constantly dumbfounded by the popularity of these films. I have (reluctantly) been dragged along to see some of the MCU films over the years (I don't follow them, so I had no idea until Endgame that they were all part of a "cinematic universe"), and I find myself bored witless with these films; so much so, that with whichever ones I have seen, I have almost always fallen asleep and conveniently risen to see the final boss battle er the climax.

They are ridiculously popular though, so what would I know? But I am frequently baffled by fan enthusiasm for the next entry when there is so little to distinguish between the two dozen or so films that have been made.

And by extension, most Hollywood films are painfully formulaic. The indie scene, however, continues to produce gems, but they rarely receive broader acclaim.

I look forward to finding out how much the MCU boxsets will cost.

Edited on by Silly_G

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jump

Silly_G wrote:

The indie scene, however, continues to produce gems, but they rarely receive broader acclaim.

Actually the indie scene produces more junk than Hollywood, you just don't get see a lot of it as it's end up in the never viewed section of Netflix. It's not really a true statement either as the Oscars had to introduce a blockbuster award due to independent films regularly taking away attention from the studio system products.

Of course it's silly to compare an action film sub-genre to blanket statement indie films. Indie films includes a lot of rubbish art student films, budget horror movies, the endless stream of teen coming of age stories etc and I normally find its more of a term to sound pretentious.

Nicolai wrote:

Alright, I gotta stop getting into arguments with jump. Someone remind me next time.

3DS Friend Code: 1762-3772-0251

iKhan

jump wrote:

iKhan wrote:

@jump

Film is a visual medium. It’s a lot more than storytelling, and that’s my whole point. It’s very possible the scripts of the MCU films could easily be placed in different genres, but part of genre is HOW the script is visually portrayed. Every action scene in Logan is brutal, painful, and sad in time in large part due to music and cinematography. Aquaman is built from the ground up to feel corny and over the top. Gareth Edwards has literally made his career out of being able to blow your mind with action scenes.

Don’t get me wrong. Story can do a lot. Winter Soldier is my favorite MCU movie mostly because of story. But it’s telling that the only MCU action scene I remember as well as Spider-Man 2’s train scene or Wonder Woman’s No Man’s Land scene is the Avengers Assemble scene.

You realise actions scenes don't dictate a movies genre right? I'd hate to think what happens when you watch a rom-com there's fight sequences to judge it on.

Again, the are part of the overall experience to define genre. The approach to Logan’s action scenes absolutely help define its genre.

What do you think defines an action comedy? It’s not just a funny movie with action scenes. The action scenes designed to complement the humor.

@Silly_G I don’t actually dislike the MCU. It’s really incredible what they’ve been able to pull off over a decade. It’s not easy to create a film series with so many well developed characters and put them into a coherent story.

I just don’t think they meet the bar of the greatest superhero films of all time

Edited on by iKhan

Currently Playing: Steamworld Heist, The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask, Tales of Graces F

jump

iKhan wrote:

jump wrote:

iKhan wrote:

@jump

Film is a visual medium. It’s a lot more than storytelling, and that’s my whole point. It’s very possible the scripts of the MCU films could easily be placed in different genres, but part of genre is HOW the script is visually portrayed. Every action scene in Logan is brutal, painful, and sad in time in large part due to music and cinematography. Aquaman is built from the ground up to feel corny and over the top. Gareth Edwards has literally made his career out of being able to blow your mind with action scenes.

Don’t get me wrong. Story can do a lot. Winter Soldier is my favorite MCU movie mostly because of story. But it’s telling that the only MCU action scene I remember as well as Spider-Man 2’s train scene or Wonder Woman’s No Man’s Land scene is the Avengers Assemble scene.

You realise actions scenes don't dictate a movies genre right? I'd hate to think what happens when you watch a rom-com there's fight sequences to judge it on.

Again, the are part of the overall experience to define genre. The approach to Logan’s action scenes absolutely help define its genre.

What do you think defines an action comedy? It’s not just a funny movie with action scenes. The action scenes designed to complement the humor

Sure it can but you're closing pegging it as all in one because you're only picking up on the bang whizz of the visuals rather than the movie itself.

It's not dependant on the action scenes at all as you seem to think, just look at how Lethal Weapon did action comedy with one liners, hard action and the two leads bouncing off each other. Lets move away from action movies so for example lets take Shaun Of The Dead, Get Out and Scary Movie. All of which are from the comedy horror genre but are all completely different experiences, you could even take Bond films and compare Skyfall with Casino Royale which take different approaches of the same genre. Whilst vice versa Sam Raimi made scenes with his signature style through the use of his shooting and lightning in both Evil Dead and Spider-Man but I wouldn't say they are the same genre.

Edited on by jump

Nicolai wrote:

Alright, I gotta stop getting into arguments with jump. Someone remind me next time.

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Silly_G

@jump : I never suggested for a moment that indie films are generally good overall. Independent film producers who post their work on YouTube are technically "indies". I merely stated that those looking for good American films nowadays are more likely to find them produced in the independent circuit.

And it doesn't surprise me a bit that they're the ones sweeping all of the awards.

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jump

Silly_G wrote:

@jump : I never suggested for a moment that indie films are generally good overall. Independent film producers who post their work on YouTube are technically "indies". I merely stated that those looking for good American films nowadays are more likely to find them produced in the independent circuit.

And it doesn't surprise me a bit that they're the ones sweeping all of the awards.

If you say so but I still find it a silly blanket statement to make. A good movie is a good movie regardless of if a non-major Hollywood studio or minor Hollywood studio made it. I find people putting an emphasis on indie films is just silly as it'd be picked up by a major studio anyway leaving those pretentious folk who claim "indies R da bestest" confused if they should like it or not now. The average film watcher has no idea if something is indie or not because people don't really talk about how a movie was financed as normal people chose to talk about the film itself.

Nicolai wrote:

Alright, I gotta stop getting into arguments with jump. Someone remind me next time.

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jump

jump wrote:

It's a non-story, they are currently negotiating

Told ya all

Nicolai wrote:

Alright, I gotta stop getting into arguments with jump. Someone remind me next time.

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klingki

@jump Yeah, this is just one of those things that made too much sense not to happen.

klingki

Zeldafan79

Spider-man spider-man does whatever a spider can! can he stay in the MCU? No he can't, he's too cool!

Edited on by Zeldafan79

Zeldafan79

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